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(The Daily Caller)   Darrell Issa says Eric Holder needs to apologize for Operation Fast and Furious. And yet, Vin Diesel is considered blameless   (dailycaller.com) divider line 52
    More: Dumbass, Darrell Issa, Attorney General Eric Holder, Furious, house oversight committee, Vin Diesel, Politics of Mexico, Janet Napolitano, TheDC  
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302 clicks; posted to Politics » on 26 Jan 2012 at 12:42 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-01-26 12:45:27 PM
"security over liberty, every time" - Abe Lincoln
 
2012-01-26 12:46:29 PM
Yeah Issa your witch hunt didn't pan out so try to keep manufacturing enough BS to keep this in the news to the election.
 
2012-01-26 12:48:36 PM
Sure, it doesn't hurt and it'll get him to shut up.
 
2012-01-26 12:48:39 PM
As soon as Issa apologizes for the California gubernatorial recall.
 
2012-01-26 12:51:20 PM
Would it make a damn bit of difference? Brian Terry would still be dead, federally approved guns would still be in the hands of drug-running criminals, the ATF would still only be handing out wrist slaps for this debacle, and Holder would still be AG.

This is a pervasive problem that requires more than a scripted I'm-sorry-we-were-caught apology.
 
2012-01-26 12:51:44 PM
If by "apologize" he means "commit seppuku", I agree.
 
2012-01-26 12:52:01 PM

EyeballKid: As soon as Issa apologizes for the California gubernatorial recall.


I did enjoy his tearful press conference when he said he wouldn't run because he wanted peace in the middle east.
 
2012-01-26 12:55:26 PM
[VIPER CAR ALARM VOICE]

Please step away from the car, Darrell, and go f*ck yourself.

[/VIPER CAR ALARM VOICE]
 
2012-01-26 12:56:29 PM
Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time, maybe some policy changes could have been put in place to avoid everything from Fast and Furious from happening. Was there anything that would have impeded nomination and confirmation for an Obama appointee in a cabinet position?

www.dangerousminds.net

Right, how could I forget?
 
2012-01-26 01:04:40 PM

EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time, maybe some policy changes could have been put in place to avoid everything from Fast and Furious from happening. Was there anything that would have impeded nomination and confirmation for an Obama appointee in a cabinet position?

[www.dangerousminds.net image 465x356]

Right, how could I forget?


If Obama hadn't appointed gun control advocates to be the head of the ATF, that probably wouldn't have happened. The new guy has only been around 4 months or so
 
2012-01-26 01:05:49 PM

JudgeSmails: EyeballKid: As soon as Issa apologizes for the California gubernatorial recall.

I did enjoy his tearful press conference when he said he wouldn't run because he wanted peace in the middle east.


reason.com

But I wanna be governor! Why don't you like me?
 
2012-01-26 01:05:57 PM
I live my life a quarter mile at a time.
 
2012-01-26 01:06:41 PM

redmid17: If Obama hadn't appointed gun control advocates to be the head of the ATF, that probably wouldn't have happened.


LOL!
 
2012-01-26 01:09:13 PM

redmid17: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time, maybe some policy changes could have been put in place to avoid everything from Fast and Furious from happening. Was there anything that would have impeded nomination and confirmation for an Obama appointee in a cabinet position?

[www.dangerousminds.net image 465x356]

Right, how could I forget?

If Obama hadn't appointed gun control advocates to be the head of the ATF, that probably wouldn't have happened. The new guy has only been around 4 months or so


So in your mind having a guy who wants gun control is worse than unchecked selling of firearms to Mexican drug cartels?
 
2012-01-26 01:14:15 PM
I think Issa needs to apologize for "Step away from the vehicle! WHOOP! WHOOP! WHOOP!"
 
2012-01-26 01:14:39 PM
As long as he apologizes from a jail cell.

/hell he wouldn't even have to apologize at that point.
 
2012-01-26 01:16:33 PM
Issa needs to apologize for using his position in the oversight committee to waste time with wild goose chases combined with dog and pony shows.
 
2012-01-26 01:18:20 PM

watson.t.hamster: As long as he apologizes from a jail cell.

/hell he wouldn't even have to apologize at that point.


What would the charges be?
 
2012-01-26 01:19:24 PM

James!: redmid17: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time, maybe some policy changes could have been put in place to avoid everything from Fast and Furious from happening. Was there anything that would have impeded nomination and confirmation for an Obama appointee in a cabinet position?

[www.dangerousminds.net image 465x356]

Right, how could I forget?

If Obama hadn't appointed gun control advocates to be the head of the ATF, that probably wouldn't have happened. The new guy has only been around 4 months or so

So in your mind having a guy who wants gun control is worse than unchecked selling of firearms to Mexican drug cartels?


No nominating someone who wouldn't do either would have been easier and better.
 
2012-01-26 01:24:39 PM

redmid17: James!: redmid17: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time, maybe some policy changes could have been put in place to avoid everything from Fast and Furious from happening. Was there anything that would have impeded nomination and confirmation for an Obama appointee in a cabinet position?

[www.dangerousminds.net image 465x356]

Right, how could I forget?

If Obama hadn't appointed gun control advocates to be the head of the ATF, that probably wouldn't have happened. The new guy has only been around 4 months or so

So in your mind having a guy who wants gun control is worse than unchecked selling of firearms to Mexican drug cartels?

No nominating someone who wouldn't do either would have been easier and better.


Because having a person who could be responsible is less important than having a person who believes a certain way on a particular issue.
 
2012-01-26 01:25:54 PM

James!: watson.t.hamster: As long as he apologizes from a jail cell.

/hell he wouldn't even have to apologize at that point.

What would the charges be?


Attorney Generaling While Black?

just kidding...for not prosecuting the Bush war criminals
 
2012-01-26 01:27:46 PM

James!: redmid17: James!: redmid17: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time, maybe some policy changes could have been put in place to avoid everything from Fast and Furious from happening. Was there anything that would have impeded nomination and confirmation for an Obama appointee in a cabinet position?

[www.dangerousminds.net image 465x356]

Right, how could I forget?

If Obama hadn't appointed gun control advocates to be the head of the ATF, that probably wouldn't have happened. The new guy has only been around 4 months or so

So in your mind having a guy who wants gun control is worse than unchecked selling of firearms to Mexican drug cartels?

No nominating someone who wouldn't do either would have been easier and better.

Because having a person who could be responsible is less important than having a person who believes a certain way on a particular issue.


They aren't mutually exclusive. No one thought someone could actually be dumb enough to greenlight that shiatty of a project, given all its design flaws. That is beyond retarded.
 
2012-01-26 01:31:52 PM

redmid17: James!: redmid17: James!: redmid17: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time, maybe some policy changes could have been put in place to avoid everything from Fast and Furious from happening. Was there anything that would have impeded nomination and confirmation for an Obama appointee in a cabinet position?

[www.dangerousminds.net image 465x356]

Right, how could I forget?

If Obama hadn't appointed gun control advocates to be the head of the ATF, that probably wouldn't have happened. The new guy has only been around 4 months or so

So in your mind having a guy who wants gun control is worse than unchecked selling of firearms to Mexican drug cartels?

No nominating someone who wouldn't do either would have been easier and better.

Because having a person who could be responsible is less important than having a person who believes a certain way on a particular issue.

They aren't mutually exclusive. No one thought someone could actually be dumb enough to greenlight that shiatty of a project, given all its design flaws. That is beyond retarded.


Well, we agree that it was retarded at least.
 
2012-01-26 01:33:49 PM

redmid17: They aren't mutually exclusive. No one thought someone could actually be dumb enough to greenlight that shiatty of a project, given all its design flaws. That is beyond retarded.


Law enforcement has a long history of boneheaded operations.
 
2012-01-26 01:35:17 PM

James!: watson.t.hamster: As long as he apologizes from a jail cell.

/hell he wouldn't even have to apologize at that point.

What would the charges be?


Oh there has to be something that covers government officials using their authority to kill American citizens.


What does gross negligence leading to death get you? Homicide? Involuntary manslaughter? Something like that.
 
2012-01-26 01:41:35 PM

watson.t.hamster: James!: watson.t.hamster: As long as he apologizes from a jail cell.

/hell he wouldn't even have to apologize at that point.

What would the charges be?

Oh there has to be something that covers government officials using their authority to kill American citizens.


What does gross negligence leading to death get you? Homicide? Involuntary manslaughter? Something like that.


What authority did he use? Did he lawyer that guy to death?
 
2012-01-26 01:42:00 PM

watson.t.hamster: What does gross negligence leading to death get you? Homicide? Involuntary manslaughter? Something like that.


www.alan.com
A pretty good pension, Secret Service protection, a king's ransom in speaking fees...
 
2012-01-26 01:53:18 PM

Corvus: Yeah Issa your witch hunt didn't pan out so try to keep manufacturing enough BS to keep this in the news to the election.


You know, Holder should have stepped down when he cited these very guns as the reason we need more gun control.
 
2012-01-26 01:54:18 PM

EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time


Kenneth Melson was appointed Director of the ATF on April 8, 2009 by Eric Holder.
 
2012-01-26 02:06:10 PM

jbuist: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time

Kenneth Melson was appointed Director of the ATF on April 8, 2009 by Eric Holder.


Melson was a Bush appointee prior to that.
 
2012-01-26 02:09:40 PM
This scandal won't be properly investigated until the next administration, by which time most people won't care. Most of this and the previous administrations' scandals (from Bush 2 going back well beyond Clinton) have been really nothing but tempests in a teapot, but this one seems really serious. Dept of Justice reps shouldn't need to be taking the 5th.

On a side note, what you may not realize is that the Department of State has a program (predating this administration) that has shipped really substantial numbers of military weapons to Mexico, far in excess of what's involved in Fast and Furious, which by and large have been stolen and diverted to the cartels.
 
2012-01-26 02:09:45 PM

Fart_Machine: jbuist: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time

Kenneth Melson was appointed Director of the ATF on April 8, 2009 by Eric Holder.

Melson was a Bush appointee prior to that.


If by Bush appointee you mean "wasn't a bush appointee to the ATF" then you would be correct.
 
2012-01-26 02:11:50 PM

Fart_Machine: Melson was a Bush appointee prior to that.


Yeah, but not to the ATF. Dude had been working in the DOJ during the Obama, Bush 43, Clinton, Bush41, and Reagan years.

My only point was that the acting director of the ATF during Fast & Furious was an Obama appointee. Mike Sullivan (spit!) was the acting director during the Bush years.
 
2012-01-26 02:13:24 PM

redmid17: Fart_Machine: jbuist: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time

Kenneth Melson was appointed Director of the ATF on April 8, 2009 by Eric Holder.

Melson was a Bush appointee prior to that.

If by Bush appointee you mean "wasn't a bush appointee to the ATF" then you would be correct.


He was a Bush's appointee to Director of the US Attorneys Office so that must mean Bush was a sekret gun control advocate.
 
2012-01-26 02:14:51 PM

jbuist: Yeah, but not to the ATF. Dude had been working in the DOJ during the Obama, Bush 43, Clinton, Bush41, and Reagan years.


So it could be assumed that he wasn't some huge gun control advocate back when he served under GOP Presidents.
 
2012-01-26 02:17:16 PM

Fart_Machine: redmid17: Fart_Machine: jbuist: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time

Kenneth Melson was appointed Director of the ATF on April 8, 2009 by Eric Holder.

Melson was a Bush appointee prior to that.

If by Bush appointee you mean "wasn't a bush appointee to the ATF" then you would be correct.

He was a Bush's appointee to Director of the US Attorneys Office so that must mean Bush was a sekret gun control advocate.


Yes someone who had only had a tangential connection to gun law enforcement means that someone with a two-time NRA endorsement for president is a gun control advocate. I realize you're trying to be trolly but you're just tailing hard.
 
2012-01-26 02:22:18 PM

Fart_Machine: So it could be assumed that he wasn't some huge gun control advocate back when he served under GOP Presidents.


Never said Melson was a gun control advocate. Sullivan was.
 
2012-01-26 02:23:03 PM

redmid17: Fart_Machine: redmid17: Fart_Machine: jbuist: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time

Kenneth Melson was appointed Director of the ATF on April 8, 2009 by Eric Holder.

Melson was a Bush appointee prior to that.

If by Bush appointee you mean "wasn't a bush appointee to the ATF" then you would be correct.

He was a Bush's appointee to Director of the US Attorneys Office so that must mean Bush was a sekret gun control advocate.

Yes someone who had only had a tangential connection to gun law enforcement means that someone with a two-time NRA endorsement for president is a gun control advocate. I realize you're trying to be trolly but you're just tailing hard.


You missed the point completely which is that the guy had no prior record of being an advocate for gun control.
 
2012-01-26 02:28:12 PM

Fart_Machine: redmid17: Fart_Machine: redmid17: Fart_Machine: jbuist: EyeballKid: Hey, if the president could have replaced the ATF head at the time

Kenneth Melson was appointed Director of the ATF on April 8, 2009 by Eric Holder.

Melson was a Bush appointee prior to that.

If by Bush appointee you mean "wasn't a bush appointee to the ATF" then you would be correct.

He was a Bush's appointee to Director of the US Attorneys Office so that must mean Bush was a sekret gun control advocate.

Yes someone who had only had a tangential connection to gun law enforcement means that someone with a two-time NRA endorsement for president is a gun control advocate. I realize you're trying to be trolly but you're just tailing hard.

You missed the point completely which is that the guy had no prior record of being an advocate for gun control.


He was a political yes man through 5 administrations. He was going to do what Holder wanted him to the same way he did what Bush/Gonzales& Ashcroft told him to do.
 
2012-01-26 02:30:04 PM

jbuist: Fart_Machine: So it could be assumed that he wasn't some huge gun control advocate back when he served under GOP Presidents.

Never said Melson was a gun control advocate. Sullivan was.


Interestingly enough Sullivan was Bush's nominee for the head of the ATF in 2007.
 
2012-01-26 02:31:19 PM

Fart_Machine: Interestingly enough Sullivan was Bush's nominee for the head of the ATF in 2007.


Yep. Blocked by Senators Craig and Crapo (R-ID, both of them). Bush had to do a recess appointment to get him in.
 
2012-01-26 02:38:56 PM

jbuist: Fart_Machine: Interestingly enough Sullivan was Bush's nominee for the head of the ATF in 2007.

Yep. Blocked by Senators Craig and Crapo (R-ID, both of them). Bush had to do a recess appointment to get him in.


I seem to remember that, because Republicans immediately afterward called it the most unconstitutional thing ever since the unconstitution unconstitutionned an unconstitution.
 
2012-01-26 02:40:22 PM

redmid17: He was a political yes man through 5 administrations. He was going to do what Holder wanted him to the same way he did what Bush/Gonzales& Ashcroft told him to do.


Or it could be that he was a very good CYA man for several Administrations and ascended the ranks under the Peter Principle.

Regardless this whole fiasco looks more like another bungled law enforcement operation rather than the sinister Gun Control agenda some critics are attributing to it.
 
2012-01-26 02:46:36 PM

James!: What authority did he use? Did he lawyer that guy to death?



He's the attorney general that signed off on this program.

You do know that you can be responsible for things carried out by others on your orders right?

/consider all the people calling for Bush's trial as a war criminal: who did he kill with his own hands?
 
2012-01-26 03:05:00 PM

watson.t.hamster: James!: What authority did he use? Did he lawyer that guy to death?


He's the attorney general that signed off on this program.

You do know that you can be responsible for things carried out by others on your orders right?

/consider all the people calling for Bush's trial as a war criminal: who did he kill with his own hands?


And I'm sure you perused that just as thoroughly as you're pursuing this.
 
2012-01-26 03:40:28 PM

James!: And I'm sure you perused that just as thoroughly as you're pursuing this.


Yes I read over the entire thing with thoroughness and care.

However I do see a difference between a president declaring a war and an attorney general using his power to kill Americans for really no purpose. I was merely using an example you might understand.

Also the effectiveness of "buh buh BUSH!" as a legal defense hasn't really been tested at this time. May not want to base your entire strategy around that.
 
2012-01-26 03:46:47 PM
I thought America was never supposed to apologize for past mistakes.
 
2012-01-26 03:47:19 PM

watson.t.hamster: James!: And I'm sure you perused that just as thoroughly as you're pursuing this.

Yes I read over the entire thing with thoroughness and care.

However I do see a difference between a president declaring a war and an attorney general using his power to kill Americans for really no purpose. I was merely using an example you might understand.

Also the effectiveness of "buh buh BUSH!" as a legal defense hasn't really been tested at this time. May not want to base your entire strategy around that.


You brought Bush into this.
 
2012-01-26 04:00:30 PM

EyeballKid: jbuist: Fart_Machine: Interestingly enough Sullivan was Bush's nominee for the head of the ATF in 2007.

Yep. Blocked by Senators Craig and Crapo (R-ID, both of them). Bush had to do a recess appointment to get him in.

I seem to remember that, because Republicans immediately afterward called it the most unconstitutional thing ever since the unconstitution unconstitutionned an unconstitution.


And Bush would have signed the Assault Weapon Ban if it had came up. Bush was no friend of Gun Owners.

Link (new window)
 
2012-01-26 04:10:27 PM

globalwarmingpraiser: EyeballKid: jbuist: Fart_Machine: Interestingly enough Sullivan was Bush's nominee for the head of the ATF in 2007.

Yep. Blocked by Senators Craig and Crapo (R-ID, both of them). Bush had to do a recess appointment to get him in.

I seem to remember that, because Republicans immediately afterward called it the most unconstitutional thing ever since the unconstitution unconstitutionned an unconstitution.

And Bush would have signed the Assault Weapon Ban if it had came up. Bush was no friend of Gun Owners.

Link (new window)


He said he would and then left it dead in the water with no support. If he had actually said *anything* in support of it, it would not have been voted down 8-90.
 
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