Yes Microsoft did mobile OSes for a long time, tablet OSes for a long time, so on and so forth.

Their problem is that all of these products are incomplete when they come to market. Incomplete doesn't necessarily mean unusable or unreliable, but it feels that way.

Say what you will about Apple, but there are very few products they have that feel incomplete.

TimeWaste: What ever happened to Microsoft Surface, the huge touch-table? Is that still around or has it been shelved?

v2 just shipped

MightyPez: Under his leadership things are stagnating.

server and tools has experienced 7 straight quarters of double digit percentage revenue growth


we just don't do well with the flashy consumer things.

Galvatron Zero: I'm not sure if I'd really call them innovators though

look closer.

Galvatron Zero:
As for Ballmer -- I've never really been a fan of the guy.

hint: neither do must of us


/microsoft employee
//Windows Server group

MightyPez: And with [blank] as a service becoming more prevalent and virtualization going gangbusters, I get the feeling back end services will be more vendor neutral

you have seen the public announcements for Windows Server 8, right?


63 node [quorum disk counts as a node in the data structures] failover clusters sporting 4000 vms


and that's the official support statement, if you catch my meaning.

MightyPez: Kazan: you have seen the public announcements for Windows Server 8, right?


63 node [quorum disk counts as a node in the data structures] failover clusters sporting 4000 vms


and that's the official support statement, if you catch my meaning.



I actually haven't kept up on that at all. Too busy shoehorning 2008 R2 boxes into our existing 2003 infrastructure (Not no longer 2000!)

ouch. that's painful. i suggest you look into the announced windows 8 features. you'll like them.

MightyPez:

The storage controller crapping out in our new Exchange 2010 box with the 350gb of mail databases, however...

ouch.


is there where i pitch Outlook.com hosted mail to you? :P

MightyPez: Ha ha, man I wish. Unfortunately we report to Homeland Security and the Transportation Authority, so my handlers want to keep all of our mail on hand in case we're required to produce documentation for the last 5 years as is legally required.

our hosted exchange system can do retention I think.

i was more joking anyway. my product rests under each Exchange365 deployment. they're an interesting scenario for clustering.

MightyPez: I figured it was tongue in cheek. I don't believe it's an issue with hosted services being unable to provide that sort of retention, it's just our higher ups being paranoid about their data. IT is so damn fun

understandably.

Surool: meyerkev: //And where'd $250 come from? My box with 7 copies of Win7 Pro and 4 copies of Office was like $400.

Buy it without a computer (new window)

Can you say mark-up? There's no difference betwen this and the OEM (new window) edition. You can buy this without buying a computer, to put on a computer. Also, if you're upgrading a PC, from XP or Vista, shiat is usually cheaper. I got my copy of the Pro upgrade for 40 bucks via Microsoft themselves, by using a university e-mail address. You can also use that "upgrade" copy to install on a blank system, as that's exactly what I did when I built my desktop. I was able to pre-order 7 Home Premium (before I found out about the student deal) for 65 bucks when it was first announced. You just have to shop around and watch for deals. There are also other ways to get a perfectly working copy of Windows that's all kosher like, with no illegal keys or anything, and you can still do your updates, for a lot less than 250. I'm running Home Premium on my Netbook, and I'm running my 40.00 copy of Pro between 3 laptops and a desktop. I've only paid for it once, and I've never pirated a copy. All 4 computers are constantly on and receive their upgrades.

MightyPez: BohemianGraham: Surool: meyerkev: //And where'd $250 come from? My box with 7 copies of Win7 Pro and 4 copies of Office was like $400.

Buy it without a computer (new window)

Can you say mark-up? There's no difference betwen this and the OEM (new window) edition. You can buy this without buying a computer, to put on a computer. Also, if you're upgrading a PC, from XP or Vista, shiat is usually cheaper. I got my copy of the Pro upgrade for 40 bucks via Microsoft themselves, by using a university e-mail address. You can also use that "upgrade" copy to install on a blank system, as that's exactly what I did when I built my desktop. I was able to pre-order 7 Home Premium (before I found out about the student deal) for 65 bucks when it was first announced. You just have to shop around and watch for deals. There are also other ways to get a perfectly working copy of Windows that's all kosher like, with no illegal keys or anything, and you can still do your updates, for a lot less than 250. I'm running Home Premium on my Netbook, and I'm running my 40.00 copy of Pro between 3 laptops and a desktop. I've only paid for it once, and I've never pirated a copy. All 4 computers are constantly on and receive their upgrades.

There is actually quite a big difference. An OEM license is cheaper because the terms of the license you agree to limit you to installing it on a single PC, forever. It's not transferable and can not legally be used if you replace the desktop, even if it's the same hardware configuration.

Use of this OEM System Builder Channel software is subject to the terms of the Microsoft OEM System Builder License. This software is intended for pre-installation on a new personal computer for resale. This OEM System Builder Channel software requires the assembler to provide end user support for the Windows software and cannot be transferred to another computer once it is installed. To acquire Windows software with support provided by Microsoft please see our full packag ...

I readily admit I'm falling in a grey, trending towards black area, but at the same time, with the OEM edition, how often does Microsoft police that when people have found ways around the OEM key lock?

What I mean by "difference" is that there is no difference between how the OS operates, as I know quite a few people who believe OEM editions are somehow totally different from the Windows they buy in a store to install on their machines, and it won't have all the software features. I know OEM's limitations as far as keys are concerned, but it's not like half of Windows is missing because it's an OEM edition.

MightyPez: BohemianGraham: I readily admit I'm falling in a grey, trending towards black area, but at the same time, with the OEM edition, how often does Microsoft police that when people have found ways around the OEM key lock?

Probably not at all, as far as I am aware. For personal use I readily admit to reusing OEM software all the time. It's just folks that want to use Pro often do so for business purposes and businesses don't want that liability of dealing with legal grey areas.

Gotcha. I agree 100% with you there. If you're a business, I wouldn't do what I do with my copies if I'm in a business setting. But for the home user, while still not technically ethical, you're not going to have as many issues as if you were a business. All of my machines are my own, with the exception of one, which was my brother's.

I bought the Pro, because Microsoft gave it to "students" for 40 bucks, and have essentially turned it into an OEM installer after using the initial key on one of my machines. Once I get my new laptop next Monday, I probably won't bother updating it from Home Premium to Pro, as I honestly don't need Pro. It was cheap, so I bought it. Technically I wasn't eligable for the deal, but Microsoft never bothered to confirm that while I still had a university e-mail address, that I was indeed still enrolled in that university (I had graduated 2 years prior, but it's an e-mail address for life).