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(CNN) Interesting Second. Best. Quarter. Ever   (money.cnn.com) divider line 81
More: Interesting, calendar year, low-end market, last quarter, iPhones  
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6357 clicks; posted to Business » on 25 Jan 2012 at 1:30 AM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»   |    Get this fabulous T-Shirt and impress the methane out of your friends! shirt it!



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2012-01-24 11:40:22 PM
Or: A fool and his money are soon parted.
 
2012-01-24 11:42:47 PM
Apple is sitting on most of those profits. It now has $97.6 billion in cash.

That's a lot of fools.
 
2012-01-24 11:57:02 PM
Marcus Aurelius: Apple is sitting on most of those profits. It now has $97.6 billion in cash.

That's a lot of fools.


that would hire a lot of Chinese at 31 cents an hour
 
2012-01-25 01:59:24 AM
OK apple I was wrong when I thought that the 4s sales would not be as strong as before. You can gloat on your billions of profit.
 
2012-01-25 02:01:52 AM
I think I'm going to abandon iOS. I only have about $50 in apps, but android devices are cheaper and more varied. I just have to get something my work related device is compatible with.

There's a line that should be right here, but I just realized it's a billion dollar idea that I'm going to explore for myself.
 
2012-01-25 02:06:39 AM
This proves Steve Jobs is controlling the company from beyond the grave, just as investors demanded.
 
2012-01-25 03:09:39 AM
MrEricSir: This proves Steve Jobs is controlling the company from beyond the grave, just as investors demanded.

I'm sure Satan lets him out on a day pass for contractual obligations like meetings.
 
2012-01-25 03:31:44 AM
Shame they can't find a way to afford bringing some jobs to the US. I mean, what if they only earned $30 billion, or $20 billion? Their stockholders might starve!
 
2012-01-25 03:38:56 AM
Peter Oppenheimer, Apple's chief financial officer told analysts on a conference call that Apple is discussing what to do with that cash

But using it to pay for some non sweatshop labor is out of the question.
 
2012-01-25 04:05:04 AM

Playing with the Apple numbers can be fun. At their current size and growth rate Apple's calendar year 2012 revenues will exceed the 2012 Gross Domestic Product of Pakistan (~$177B) - the world's 6th most populous country, 47th on the WMF 2010 GDP list ahead of 137 other listed nations. Yes, this year one US-based international company with under 62,000 employees might sell more products and services than an entire nation with over 177 million citizens and almost 800,000 square kilometers of natural resources to exploit.

The amazing Apple growth figures for the last two years if you'll remember also happened while the entire world was crying in their beer about how the economy was wrecked and nothing could be done because people didn't have money. And yet Apple found a way to not only grow their worldwide operations and sell ever more premium products - but to increase their margins as well and introduce even more lines of business and disrupt more industries. Imagine what they can do when the economy is on the upswing.

Personally I don't care for Apple products - the whole Cathedral thing just isn't me. The whole Jobs/Android grudge thing just seems spiteful and mean. And I do like my Flash content, sideloaded apps, and SD cards. But man, can they run a business. I can't imagine what kind of disruption they could achieve with a hundred billion dollars in cash, but it's a lot seeing what value they have been getting for their money.

The times, they are a-changing. Microsoft can keep HP and Dell in line, prevent them from implementing new technologies that delight and amaze - both by playing them against each other to keep them on 5% margins in a good year and by marketing subsidies that could take away even that. But there's nothing Microsoft can do about Apple. Apple doesn't owe Microsoft diddly-squat, and that's the powerful thing that enables Apple's growth and profits because they can innovate when HP and Dell can't. Apple now could buy both HP and Dell - for cash - tomorrow morning if they cared to, and have lots of money left over - but they don't care for that low-margin business and the choker that comes with it. Samsung, HTC and all the consumer electronics players smell blood in the PC waters though and the sharks are circling because in CE their margins are even worse. HP and Dell are in trouble anyway, because Microsoft looks to be ready to throw them under a Nokia bus when Windows 8 comes along.

Now that the Wintel thing is on the rocks it looks like Intel's coming around. They're late to the party but I hope they get some traction on their Android/Medfield thing. That looks pretty cool. But it looks like they're shopping it around to the same old crew that builds a proof of concept and then hides it on a shelf, which ain't gonna get 'er done. I'd like Intel to come with us into the mobile future because they do have some really great stuff. But they don't seem on track to do that.

 
2012-01-25 06:13:42 AM
RoxtarRyan: Shame they can't find a way to afford bringing some jobs to the US. I mean, what if they only earned $30 billion, or $20 billion? Their stockholders might starve!

I have a friend who is a stockholder and he complains Apple never pays any significant dividends. He says at the end of the day, the "profit" is turned into "R&D" money, so the net profits for stockholders to be divided are actually much stingier than they should be.

I have no idea how true this is, but he's strongly considering selling his shares for this reason.
 
2012-01-25 06:22:12 AM
hypocaffeinemia: RoxtarRyan: Shame they can't find a way to afford bringing some jobs to the US. I mean, what if they only earned $30 billion, or $20 billion? Their stockholders might starve!

I have a friend who is a stockholder and he complains Apple never pays any significant dividends. He says at the end of the day, the "profit" is turned into "R&D" money, so the net profits for stockholders to be divided are actually much stingier than they should be.

I have no idea how true this is, but he's strongly considering selling his shares for this reason.


Apple's profit of $13.1 billion was equal to their revenue in Q4 2010, as Jordan Golson notes. To be clear, that was just a year and a quarter ago. That's how quickly Apple is growing.

Selling the stock of a company while it is growing this fast would be a sign that your friend is not competent to manage his own affairs. His family should seek to have him committed.
 
2012-01-25 06:34:44 AM
I get along just fine without Flash. And those pesky SD cards are too easy to loose, and some are ruined after going through the washing machine. Who needs 'em?
 
2012-01-25 06:54:14 AM
hypocaffeinemia: RoxtarRyan: Shame they can't find a way to afford bringing some jobs to the US. I mean, what if they only earned $30 billion, or $20 billion? Their stockholders might starve!

I have a friend who is a stockholder and he complains Apple never pays any significant dividends. He says at the end of the day, the "profit" is turned into "R&D" money, so the net profits for stockholders to be divided are actually much stingier than they should be.

I have no idea how true this is, but he's strongly considering selling his shares for this reason.


Apple has not paid a dividend in 17 years. R&D is considered before net profit, so is already paid for.

Also, Apple has (or maybe had) a surprisingly small R&D budget. The information I saw on this may have been before the iOS devices came along, but I believe the limited product line allows for very efficient used of R&D dollars.
 
2012-01-25 07:17:43 AM
28.media.tumblr.com

/most amazing 15 years in corporate history
 
2012-01-25 07:23:34 AM
hypocaffeinemia: RoxtarRyan: Shame they can't find a way to afford bringing some jobs to the US. I mean, what if they only earned $30 billion, or $20 billion? Their stockholders might starve!

I have a friend who is a stockholder and he complains Apple never pays any significant dividends. He says at the end of the day, the "profit" is turned into "R&D" money, so the net profits for stockholders to be divided are actually much stingier than they should be.

I have no idea how true this is, but he's strongly considering selling his shares for this reason.


If he's thinking of dropping it because the company doesn't pay dividends despite the fact that it's only trading at 15x earnings while growing almost 100% YoY, he's incompetent.

If you want dividends, buy a company like Exxon where the market has matured and the dividends are high.
 
2012-01-25 07:24:14 AM
So this officially means people have to stop saying things like, "In tough economic times like this..." right?

/"Now, more than ever..."
 
2012-01-25 07:37:05 AM
Buh..bb..but but marketing.
 
2012-01-25 07:38:04 AM
BOO MICROSOFT !!!!!

www.geekologie.com
 
2012-01-25 08:05:29 AM
Yeah, it *sounds* like good news, until you dig a little deeper:

i2.cdn.turner.com

Notice how sales outpace profit, and the gap is getting wider. At this rate, the two will never be equal. Further, Apple's profits have never exceeded their net revenue. Words of caution to any potential investor.
 
2012-01-25 08:08:42 AM
RickyWilliams'sBong: If he's thinking of dropping it because the company doesn't pay dividends despite the fact that it's only trading at 15x earnings while growing almost 100% YoY, he's incompetent.

15x last year's earnings. Averaging over the last several years the PE gets higher.

And the fact that they're sitting on this much cash raises corporate governance issues. They have no plans for it (or at least, aren't sharing them with shareholders). It doesn't appear to be needed to maintain their growth rate. It's far in excess of what's needed to maintain Apple as a going concern in the event of quite a few rainy years.

The guy's not unreasonable for complaining about the lack of a dividend.
 
2012-01-25 08:26:20 AM
It's a shame the economy is so bad. Otherwise, Apple might have actually made money.
 
2012-01-25 08:29:09 AM
Guilty on this one. Bought my wife a new MBP over the summer, and myself a new iPhone after Thanksgiving. Yes, they're expensive. They're also largely trouble-free.

bigpeeler: Or: A fool and his money are soon parted.

You sound like you're enjoying your new Android on T-Mobile.
 
2012-01-25 09:17:58 AM
wildcardjack: I think I'm going to abandon iOS. I only have about $50 in apps, but android devices are cheaper and more varied. I just have to get something my work related device is compatible with.

How is an Android device cheaper than free (i.e. iPhone 3GS) or 99 bucks (i.e. iPhone 4)?

/the real cost is not in the device - its your data and phone plan. And they all suck regardless of device you buy
 
2012-01-25 09:20:01 AM
hurdboy: Guilty on this one. Bought my wife a new MBP over the summer, and myself a new iPhone after Thanksgiving. Yes, they're expensive. They're also largely trouble-free.

Expensive compared to what exactly? The competition is either the exact same cost or more.

/the "Apple tax" hasn't been true in about 6 years
 
2012-01-25 09:26:46 AM
Christian Bale: Yeah, it *sounds* like good news, until you dig a little deeper:

[i2.cdn.turner.com image 475x320]

Notice how sales outpace profit, and the gap is getting wider. At this rate, the two will never be equal. Further, Apple's profits have never exceeded their net revenue. Words of caution to any potential investor.


You are aware that Apple has ZERO long term debt on their balance sheet.....right? You are aware of this?
 
2012-01-25 09:29:30 AM
bravian: Expensive compared to what exactly? The competition is either the exact same cost or more.

/the "Apple tax" hasn't been true in about 6 years


They still can charge an arm and a leg if you get something that's not a standard configuration. If you're looking for a notebook with 4GB of RAM, buying one with 4GB in it by default is barely more expensive than bumping the next model down up to that. And they've made them a royal PITA to work on......

So what does Apple not sell? A 17" with a Core i3, a 320GB drive ,and fifteen SD card slots.
 
2012-01-25 09:30:35 AM
Christian Bale: Notice how sales outpace profit, and the gap is getting wider. At this rate, the two will never be equal. Further, Apple's profits have never exceeded their net revenue. Words of caution to any potential investor.

Just out of curiosity, unless they were making serious investment income from their cash reserves, how exactly would their profits ever exceed their revenue? Products cost money to produce.

In addition, each sale they make is insuring future profitability in terms of app store, iTunes, etc. Plus, it brings another device into the iOS fold, which encourages yet more development in iOS. Each sale to an exiting user encourages hand-me-downs to parents, kids, and friends, which further increases the user base. Increased sales numbers aren't a bad thing unless they lose money on their products, which they don't.
 
2012-01-25 09:31:40 AM
it's only trading at 15x earnings while growing almost 100% YoY,

growth like that just isn't sustainable.

/Already sold my shares
//Don't care that I missed the top
 
2012-01-25 09:38:30 AM
reverend maynard: it's only trading at 15x earnings while growing almost 100% YoY,

growth like that just isn't sustainable.

/Already sold my shares
//Don't care that I missed the top


It's always a prudent move to exercise caution.....it is also wise to consider new markets, such as China and India.
 
2012-01-25 09:44:27 AM
bravian: wildcardjack: I think I'm going to abandon iOS. I only have about $50 in apps, but android devices are cheaper and more varied. I just have to get something my work related device is compatible with.

How is an Android device cheaper than free (i.e. iPhone 3GS) or 99 bucks (i.e. iPhone 4)?

/the real cost is not in the device - its your data and phone plan. And they all suck regardless of device you buy


You do know that the processing power and memory speed of same priced Android devices (HTC EVO 4G is free for new or 2year replacement through Sprint for example) is about 50% faster than the 3GS. I am talking raw computer speed here. Experienced speed will be about the same or favor the iPhone because of piled on crap that the carriers and phone makers put on the Androids that Apple would never let them bog down their devices with. This should be fixed with ICS, but there might still be the need to root and put on a custom ROM for full performance.

\no Sprint, I don't follow Nascar and I don't want an app that auto-reloads and eats up a fith of my memory and your weather app sucks, I'll get one off the market
 
2012-01-25 09:44:43 AM
kingflower: reverend maynard: it's only trading at 15x earnings while growing almost 100% YoY,

growth like that just isn't sustainable.

/Already sold my shares
//Don't care that I missed the top

It's always a prudent move to exercise caution.....it is also wise to consider new markets, such as China and India.


Surprisingly to your point Blackberry is still the handheld of choice in India.
Despite that potential I feel very comfortable going on the record and saying that Apple is not far off from being the next Microsoft.
They will be a huge cash cow, but with little growth and innovation.
 
2012-01-25 10:00:38 AM
reverend maynard: Surprisingly to your point Blackberry is still the handheld of choice in India.

I think a lot of that popularity built up because BBM allowed people on a limited budget to avoid paying extra to send SMS style messages.

Blackberry no longer has that advantage over other platforms.
 
2012-01-25 10:11:32 AM
They make too much money, better start taxing them to make it fair!
 
2012-01-25 10:19:39 AM
Christian Bale: Further, Apple's profits have never exceeded their net revenue.

25.media.tumblr.com
 
2012-01-25 10:20:54 AM
Christian Bale: Yeah, it *sounds* like good news, until you dig a little deeper:

[i2.cdn.turner.com image 475x320]

Notice how sales outpace profit, and the gap is getting wider. At this rate, the two will never be equal. Further, Apple's profits have never exceeded their net revenue. Words of caution to any potential investor.


How did you get bites on this? I thought it was very funny, but I never thought anyone would think you were serious.
 
2012-01-25 10:21:55 AM
It's amazing what paying someone $17/day can do for the bottom line.
 
2012-01-25 10:26:00 AM
majestic: It's amazing what paying someone $17/day can do for the bottom line.

If that was the only thing going on, all of the electronics companies would be doing just as well.
 
2012-01-25 10:38:08 AM
GameSprocket: majestic: It's amazing what paying someone $17/day can do for the bottom line.

If that was the only thing going on, all of the electronics companies would be doing just as well.


Well, they did sacrifice their leader and souls to an eldrich power, so they have that going for them. This explains the whole Apple cult thing and the excessive amounts of cash.
 
kab
2012-01-25 10:46:02 AM
bravian: /the "Apple tax" hasn't been true in about 6 years

Go shopping for PCs and laptops. The tax is still in full effect.
 
2012-01-25 10:48:05 AM
gozar_the_destroyer: GameSprocket: majestic: It's amazing what paying someone $17/day can do for the bottom line.

If that was the only thing going on, all of the electronics companies would be doing just as well.

Well, they did sacrifice their leader and souls to an eldrich power, so they have that going for them. This explains the whole Apple cult thing and the excessive amounts of cash.


I thought that the "apple" in question was the same one from Assassin's Creed.
 
2012-01-25 10:55:16 AM
kab: bravian: /the "Apple tax" hasn't been true in about 6 years

Go shopping for PCs and laptops. The tax is still in full effect.


Yeah, it is sort of like the "BMW tax". You can get a Hyundai for a lot less.
 
2012-01-25 11:42:22 AM
I am surprised Apple hasn't tried to patent P&L statements.

God I hate that farking company.
 
2012-01-25 11:48:23 AM
Christian Bale: Yeah, it *sounds* like good news, until you dig a little deeper:

[i2.cdn.turner.com image 475x320]

Notice how sales outpace profit, and the gap is getting wider. At this rate, the two will never be equal. Further, Apple's profits have never exceeded their net revenue. Words of caution to any potential investor.


SELL MORTIMER SELL!
 
kab
2012-01-25 11:52:12 AM
GameSprocket: kab: bravian: /the "Apple tax" hasn't been true in about 6 years

Go shopping for PCs and laptops. The tax is still in full effect.

Yeah, it is sort of like the "BMW tax". You can get a Hyundai for a lot less.


I lol'ed.

Still buying that whole "gets actual work done faster" schtick?
 
2012-01-25 12:10:44 PM
RoxtarRyan: Shame they can't find a way to afford bringing some jobs to the US.

Apple management has stated that it goes beyond higher labor and facilities costs in the US. In China, workers reside in dormitories adjacent to factories and are not restricted by conventional work hours. If a last minute change is required, foremen can wake workers early and workers can be on the line within the hour. Seven days of 12-hour shifts are not uncommon. You cannot get that sort of workforce enslavement flexibility in the United States or Canada.

Furthermore, Apple management has stated that they have no interest in aiding the American economy. Their primary directive is to make the best product possible at the lowest cost possible. Having the highest wages possible does not come into play.

IMHO, I believe that Apple's current philosophy is a direct result of the kind of man Steve Jobs was. The same Steve Jobs who merrily screwed over his high school friend Steve Wozniak in early business deals, who refused to acknowledge his daughter, and who has almost no history of philanthropy. The same obsessive-compulsive narcissistic Steve Jobs who thought that Android must be destroyed at all costs because Apple products were on a mission to change the way that humanity lives.

They can afford to bring jobs back to North America. They just choose not to. It isn't their problem. And they told the POTUS to kindly STFU and GTFO when he even brought the subject up.
 
2012-01-25 12:19:13 PM
hypocaffeinemia: RoxtarRyan: Shame they can't find a way to afford bringing some jobs to the US. I mean, what if they only earned $30 billion, or $20 billion? Their stockholders might starve!

I have a friend who is a stockholder and he complains Apple never pays any significant dividends. He says at the end of the day, the "profit" is turned into "R&D" money, so the net profits for stockholders to be divided are actually much stingier than they should be.

I have no idea how true this is, but he's strongly considering selling his shares for this reason.


Apple fanboys: why you hate the middle class?

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/22/business/apple-america-and-a-squeeze d-middle-class.html?pagewanted=all
 
2012-01-25 12:27:15 PM
hypocaffeinemia: I have a friend who is a stockholder and he complains Apple never pays any significant dividends. He says at the end of the day, the "profit" is turned into "R&D" money, so the net profits for stockholders to be divided are actually much stingier than they should be.

Apple hasn't paid a dividend since the 90s. To be fair any share holder since then has been rewarded many, many times over with the rise in price. At some point their share price will have to plateau and I imagine they will reinstate a dividend.
 
2012-01-25 01:32:47 PM
BullBearMS:
Blackberry no longer has that advantage over other platforms.


That's not necessarily true. BBs use a fraction of the data to do the same things that iOS and Androids devices do. Here, it doesn't matter to most people, but in a lot of countries it is a factor.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-20071941-93/nielsen-smartphone-data- u sage-soars-89-percent/
 
jvl
2012-01-25 01:42:37 PM
bigpeeler: Or: A fool and his money are soon parted.

Fandroids getting all whiny in an Apple thread. That never gets old.
 
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