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I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
bugontherug:For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead. Newt Gingrich. Washington Outsider.
Congratulations, South Carolina. You have just voted for a $1.6 million-dollar Freddie Mac consultant (who says he wasn't a lobbyist) who has been married three times, had (has?) a mistress, and was fined $300k for 84 ethics violations the last time he held political office.
Remember, South Carolinians are "values" voters! Just what those values really are, who knows...
I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
This only tells me that South Carolinans (sp?) would rather have a wealthy, Catholic Republican nominee that has multiple ethics and moral problems than a wealthy, Mormon Republican nominee that has some business ethics problems.
Ha! Enjoy that protracted in-party fight in the primary Romney. I hope the Republicans thoroughly defame him before he ever even reaches the general election.
Ackbarican_Idol:Who cares, how many votes did Herman Cain get?
This is all I want to know.
With 13% percent reporting "Other" has 1.2%
Do the republicans really think they are going to win an election with a disgraced serial adulterer who runs on family values or a Mormon with a quarter billion dollars, who likes to stash it in offshore tax havens? No wonder Obama is going around singing Al Green songs.
stevenr868:and Obama is probably lighting up his victory cigar as we speak
Yep, if Newt gets the nomination Obama wins re-election in a landslide.
Newt may be quick witted and good in debates, but hes an unlikable asshole and will get none of the moderate votes, the candidate who doesnt get those will lose the election.
FlyPanAm:I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
bugontherug:I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
An actual conservative would want to redistribute a portion of the wealthy's income to the poor(to stimulate the economy), encourage alternative sources of energy( to disengage from the middle east), and reign in corporate interests( in order to preserve the middle class).
bugontherug:It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
Conservative on his views of his own vows.... maybe.
FlyPanAm:I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
Cuthbert Allgood:FlyPanAm: I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
There is one screaming, huge story here tonight and that is these Republicans just don't want to vote for Mitt Romney. I mean it's like you're trying to give a dog a pill. They keep spitting it up.
neofonz:FlyPanAm: I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
I just don't.
Highest polling protestant. That's why he won SC.
Oh wait, just found out he isn't a Protestant anymore. Nevermind.
threadjackistan:bugontherug: I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
An actual conservative would want to redistribute a portion of the wealthy's income to the poor(to stimulate the economy), encourage alternative sources of energy( to disengage from the middle east), and reign in corporate interests( in order to preserve the middle class).
I dare say the Republican base would vigorously disagree with you. They're all semi-Randites and neo-confederates now. Welfare is unspeakable tyranny, and CEOs are the most persecuted members of society.
neofonz:FlyPanAm: I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
neofonz:FlyPanAm: I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
bugontherug:For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
The Washington resident from 1979-1999 is an outsider. Welcome to derp world.
I read that news story where a friend of Gingrich at the time of his divorce from his second wife said that Newt had confided in him that she was too ugly to be the wife of a preseident, which is why he divorced her. Anyway, I was curious if she was indeed ugly, and I googled her, and she is indeed.
/isn't 45 minutes after the polls close a little early to call an election? Just askin.
stats and exit poll results have nothing to do with when the polls close. it is possible to skew the results of late voters with really EARLY PREDICTIONS, esp if we are talking east coast versus west coast.
the only cases where the exit polls and the election results have differed is when there was election tampering. hellloooooooooooooo ohio 2004
steamingpile:Newt may be quick witted and good in debates, but hes an unlikable asshole and will get none of the moderate votes, the candidate who doesnt get those will lose the election.
Not to mention the fire a Gingrich nomination will light under the collective asses of all those liberals out there.
bugontherug:I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
The only thing 'Conservative' about Newt is the racist bile that spews from his pie hole.
That makes gim the PERFECT candidate for the party of angry white men.
neofonz:Congratulations, South Carolina. You have just voted for a $1.6 million-dollar Freddie Mac consultant (who says he wasn't a lobbyist) who has been married three times, had (has?) a mistress, and was fined $300k for 84 ethics violations the last time he held political office.
Remember, South Carolinians are "values" voters! Just what those values really are, who knows...
I love it how the Southern Evangelicals, who're obsessed with family values and traditional marriage would choose a serial philanderer who married his mistress over a devoted family man who's been married to the same woman for 42 years.
And yes, the above commenters who attributed Newt's victory to anti-Mormonism are right.
eraser8:neofonz: FlyPanAm: I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
I just don't.
Highest polling protestant. That's why he won SC.
Newt is Roman Catholic.
Corrected myself. Shows how hard it is to keep up with shifty.
eraser8:neofonz: FlyPanAm: I'm not all that into politics and I consider myself a pretty open minded guy. Ok I lean left, but Newt Gingrich? Farking Really? I get Romney, I don't like him but I get it. I don't get this.
I just don't.
Highest polling protestant. That's why he won SC.
Newt is Roman Catholic.
As is Santorum making the highest polling protestant RON PAUL.
nm:bugontherug: For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead. Newt Gingrich. Washington Outsider.
At first I was all yipee, he's a despicable human who is guaranteed to lose in November.
And then I was all meh, the teabaggers have a new favorite candidate every week and they'll vote for Romney in November after FOX shifts to full 24-hour Guns!, God!, Gays, Minorities! Muslims!
As a guy who self-identifies as being to the left of the Democrats... I farking love the Republican Party this year... you're running a guy who cheated on the first wife (when she had cancer), cheated on the second wife (right after she got diagnosed with MS), took millions from fannie and freddie, and got kicked out of the house leadership by your own freakin party! Of course, if they don't pick Newt, the alternative is Romney... sure he hides his millions in tax dodges overseas so he can enjoy a tax rate far lower than normal americans, especially considering his taxes are overwhelmingly investment income, so they aren't subject to that pesky payroll tax (you know, the tax on people who work, the one you keep forgetting about?), the guy who invested millions of dollars in freakin IRAN while Iran was still making IEDs to kill our soldiers across the border in Iraq, add to that the charisma of Al Gore on Xanex, and this is the choice you're presenting your party for nominees... seriously. I love you guys so much right now just because you're giving the country a clear mandate (not these idiots), and I'm sure the upcoming season of SNL will be one of the best ever.
Rug Doctor:clyph: So much for "family values". The hypocrisy of the right never ceases to amaze me.
clyph: So much for "family values". The hypocrisy of the right never ceases to amaze me.
clyph: So much for "family values". The hypocrisy of the right never ceases to amaze me.
Can you IMAGINE the hyperbole from these people if Obama was on wife No. 3?
This. And don't they realize Obama will use this against Newt in the general election? That is, even if Obama bothers campaigning at all if Gingrich gets the nomination...
jaytkay:At first I was all yipee, he's a despicable human who is guaranteed to lose in November.
And then I was all meh, the teabaggers have a new favorite candidate every week and they'll vote for Romney in November after FOX shifts to full 24-hour Guns!, God!, Gays, Minorities! Muslims!
It's different now that voting has started. Romney can't say "I'm clearly the most electable" when he's 1-1-1 in the primaries. It also matters because it means whoever is the nominee is going to have to claw their way up instead of the casual steamrolling Romney envisioned. They are going to spend big bucks and sling mud for a while yet. Which is awesome.
I like Newt, so I'm glad he's going to be sticking around that race for a while. This gives me a happy. Won't vote for him, though: too many policy differences.
Well, historically, the Eastern Orthodox Churches are Catholic too. The Catholic church fragmented in 1054 ("The Schism") over who should lead the church. The Roman Church went one way, the Eastern Orthodox another.
nm:bugontherug: For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead. Newt Gingrich. Washington Outsider.
This, in conjunction with Herman Cain's early surge when he was running, backs my theory that Republican voters want to nominate the candidate most likely to call Obama a ni-*bong* during a debate.
Allright......I've officially switched my hope that "Romney eventually wins the nomination and the social conservatives lose power in the party to 'Let's go for Gingrich' and the magnitude of the loss in november will be so damn stunning as to cause the party to rethink the 24 hour derp cycle its been on.
Yes, there are a number of Eastern Catholic churches. They accept the authority of the Pope but follow separate practices that more closely resemble those of the Orthodox church. In most of them priests can marry. Andy Warhol was a lifelong devout Ruthenian Catholic, oddly enough.
Bucky Katt:Five Tails of Fury: So... basically, South Carolina Republicans have collectively lost their f*cking minds, then?
Good to know.
you can't lose something you never had
With Obama's illegal appointments to the to the NLRB and the upcoming screwing of South Carolinians that want to work at the Boeing plant in Charleston, does anyone actually think Obama has a chance of winning SC anyway? I guess the fact that these people want a job makes them mindless? Anybody that pledges to rebuild the economy will get more votes than Obama in SC.
Mitt and Newt will both say anything they think will get them elected - but while Mitt implements that by flip-flopping whenever he perceives it necessary, Newt carries his drive out by going full Lee Atwater.
This will be an epic trainwreck, a political disaster not seen since Canada's defunct Progressive Conservative party went from a majority government to two seats in Parliament. It may very well split the far right wing.
I'll need more popcorn. This election is Obama's to lose... but the Democratic Party could very well snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, at which point the nukes will be controlled by either an IRC chat bot in a suit or an egomaniacal authoritarian who likes to evoke racial stereotypes and thinks the military should invade another couple countries if it will get him the votes.
/isn't 45 minutes after the polls close a little early to call an election? Just askin.
Not really. If you do your pre-election polling right, a lot of precincts are pretty easy to predict (and you do some exit-polling to make sure you are not caught off-guard). Then you only have to worry about the iffy precincts - exit-poll them as heavy as you can, and you are pretty much golden. You also check in with smaller precincts (which often report earlier) - if those are reasonably close to what you have predicted, then calling a race is easy, even before most of the votes are officially counted (and you don't care if the early precincts break against the guy you think will win - all you are looking at is if they are falling out like pre-election polling said they would, and the exit polls said they would. - if they match expectations, then the rest ought to also). The only things you worry about are contests where there is a very close race, or where you exit polling is way out of kilter from your pre-election poll trends. Also, remember, calling a race just means you are saying who will be the winner; your entire concern is simply picking the guy who gets those votes. If he wins by 1 vote or 100K votes, you are still right. So, as long as you feel secure that the guy you announce will win by more votes than the reasonable margin of error, it won't bite you in the ass.
/isn't 45 minutes after the polls close a little early to call an election? Just askin.
ABC called it before any of the results came in, which is absurd, but apparently this time it won't come back to haunt them.
They do that if the exit polls are significantly favoriting one candidate. Looks like they are. Exit polls almost always match the actual vote count. If they don't, then that's usually a good indicator that votes have been tampered with.
Lots of you guys suck at the Catholic question. Orthodox churches are not Catholic. If you're in communion with the Pope, you're Catholic. Eastern Rite Catholic churches just use different forms of the liturgy than Roman Catholics. Most of them are from countries that are traditionally Orthodox or something else, but ended up with a Catholic ruler at some point and decided to pledge allegiance to the Pope in exchange for not being slain and so forth. They got to keep their old styles of saying Mass, which is what makes them distinctive.
/Syriac Catholic services are hauntingly beautiful //Greek Catholic services take farking forever ///Haven't been to Mass (other than Christmas with the girlfriend's family this year) in five years
MFAWG:bugontherug: I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
The only thing 'Conservative' about Newt is the racist bile that spews from his pie hole.
That makes gim the PERFECT candidate for the party of angry white men.
Newt is widely credited with engineering the 1994 Republican revolution that caused the Democrats to lose the House of Representatives for the first time in 40 years.
Fluxinator:Bucky Katt: Five Tails of Fury: So... basically, South Carolina Republicans have collectively lost their f*cking minds, then?
Good to know.
you can't lose something you never had
With Obama's illegal appointments to the to the NLRB and the upcoming screwing of South Carolinians that want to work at the Boeing plant in Charleston, does anyone actually think Obama has a chance of winning SC anyway? I guess the fact that these people want a job makes them mindless? Anybody that pledges to rebuild the economy will get more votes than Obama in SC.
bugontherug:MFAWG: bugontherug: I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
The only thing 'Conservative' about Newt is the racist bile that spews from his pie hole.
That makes gim the PERFECT candidate for the party of angry white men.
Newt is widely credited with engineering the 1994 Republican revolution that caused the Democrats to lose the House of Representatives for the first time in 40 years.
It's really the Dems fault. We had to have a president with a stupid name like Barak Hussein Obama before it would ever be possible to have a president named Newt Gingrich. So way to go libs.
Maybe we'll get a space program back. Keep going all the way to the White House.
Do you think he s more honest with you than he was with his first two wives, the congressional ethics investigation, or the people to whom he told he did no lobbying whatsoever?
MeinRS6:It's really the Dems fault. We had to have a president with a stupid name like Barak Hussein Obama before it would ever be possible to have a president named Newt Gingrich. So way to go libs.
It's amusing right now to watch this, and I still fully believe that the GOP will come to it's senses and nominate Ronmey.
But dear God, what if they don't? First, we have to go through an absolutely excruciating campaign between Obama and Gingrich. And while there is a snowballs chance in Hell that Gingrich wins, dear God, what if Gingrich wins?
Think about that for a moment. The guy with the means to order nuclear strikes is Newt Gingrich.
Wow, I figured Newt would win in SC but not absolutely grease Romney. Wonders never cease. Guess it will end up going to super Tuesday after all.
Of course, if Gingrich ends up with the nod expect a long, dirty campaign designed to keep as many liberals and moderates home as possible instead of any sort of move to occupy the center.
So it must be OK to have multiple wives as long as you're Protestant and Southern?
Someone please stop that Georgian in his tracks before we get another resurgence of the hypocritical televangelists. That, and he will bring back slavery through the janitor's room.
MFAWG:That makes gim the PERFECT candidate for the party of angry white men.
bugontherug:Newt is widely credited with engineering the 1994 Republican revolution that caused the Democrats to lose the House of Representatives for the first time in 40 years.
Which, at the time, was known as the heyday of the "angry white male".
It was sad at the time. Now it's comedy. GO, NEWT, GO!!
malaktaus:jaytkay: eraser8: Newt is Roman Catholic.
Is there such a thing as a non-Roman Catholic?
Yes, there are a number of Eastern Catholic churches. They accept the authority of the Pope but follow separate practices that more closely resemble those of the Orthodox church. In most of them priests can marry. Andy Warhol was a lifelong devout Ruthenian Catholic, oddly enough.
Right. But they're all devout followers of the teachings of Cathol, and that's the important thing.
eraser8:If they call themselves Catholic, by what standard do you declare them not Catholic?
Keep in mind that when I made my comment, I was NOT judging a church's Catholicism by its communion with the Roman pope.
Eh, I don't know. I know the Church of England likes to call itself Catholic, too. For me, "Catholic" always equaled "good with the Pope." I guess it's all those years of Catholic grade school. As I mentioned above, I'm not even practicing anymore; I think I just find it a lot more interesting seeing the intersection of political history with cultural and spiritual folkways. This, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with the conversation at hand, but whatever.
Hell ya - Giant head baby man for the GOP candidate.
Please, please, Republicans, make the corrupt, petty, greedy, xenophobic, homophobic, misogynistic, chicken hawk, lying, philandering bigot your standard bearer.
that bosnian sniper:Wow, I figured Newt would win in SC but not absolutely grease Romney. Wonders never cease. Guess it will end up going to super Tuesday after all.
Of course, if Gingrich ends up with the nod expect a long, dirty campaign designed to keep as many liberals and moderates home as possible instead of any sort of move to occupy the center.
Sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense. I can't possibly think of a greater motivator to the Democratic base than New Gingrich as the GOP nominee. Even liberals who have no great love for Obama will be begging to vote for him. And Gingrich will turn off far more moderates than he will pick up. They might be the ones to stay home.
bugontherug:MFAWG: bugontherug: I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
The only thing 'Conservative' about Newt is the racist bile that spews from his pie hole.
That makes gim the PERFECT candidate for the party of angry white men.
Newt is widely credited with engineering the 1994 Republican revolution that caused the Democrats to lose the House of Representatives for the first time in 40 years.
Conservatives lost their way when they allowed themselves to be identified exclusively with one party. Now reread what I said and try again.
Romney is still going to be the candidate. Unfortunately for Newt, not every state is South Carolina. I think Romney goes Nuclear Option on Gingrich in Florida and all but buries him. Sure, Newt will stick around but Romney realizes that he needs to win decisively and will pull out the stops and make a stand in Florida. He's got the money to do it.
bugontherug:I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
You were wrong, because conservatives had already had their say by choosing Santorum in Iowa (though it had been called for Mitt at that point).
Also, everyone else was basing their position on facts (i.e. Mitt Romney has won two primaries so far) while you were basing your position on a desire to see not-Mitt chosen as the nominee.
jaytkay:MFAWG: That makes gim the PERFECT candidate for the party of angry white men.
bugontherug: Newt is widely credited with engineering the 1994 Republican revolution that caused the Democrats to lose the House of Representatives for the first time in 40 years.
Which, at the time, was known as the heyday of the "angry white male".
It was sad at the time. Now it's comedy. GO, NEWT, GO!!
Yet another example of comedy = tragedy + 20 years.
The most redneck candidate won in the redneck state. In Iowa (which is half conservative and half liberal) the vote was split down the middle between the most conservative (Santorum) and the most liberal (Romney) In New Hampshire (in liberal New England) the most liberal candidate won.
None of these results should shock anyone. The nominee will end up being Romney. Everyone knows this already.
Maybe we'll get a space program back. Keep going all the way to the White House.
Do you think he s more honest with you than he was with his first two wives, the congressional ethics investigation, or the people to whom he told he did no lobbying whatsoever?
Wait until you have a divorce, and someone asks you that, Mr. Holier than Thou.
Johnny Bananapeel:cryinoutloud: These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West South. You know... morons. Notabunny: What Obama might look like right now: [i.imgur.com image 543x270]
Thank you. I thought of that when I posted it, but I don't have Photoshop.
Maybe we'll get a space program back. Keep going all the way to the White House.
Do you think he s more honest with you than he was with his first two wives, the congressional ethics investigation, or the people to whom he told he did no lobbying whatsoever?
Wait until you have a divorce, and someone asks you that, Mr. Holier than Thou.
I dont have a problem with commitment, chucklef*ck
As an unapologetic conservative I believe that 4 years ago Obama was uready to be President and I still believe that. However I also believe that Gingrich is unfit to be President. If he should become the nominee I would rather stay home and have 4 more years of Obama than have him as President. While I agree philosophicaly with much of what Gingrich says and don't agree with most of what Obama has done I do think that character matters. I have dealt with lots of Gingrich types in my life and consider him to be a sociopath. I hope the rest of the states take a good look at the record of the man and consider the consequences of their votes. I admit to being a Romney supporter as his only character flaw seems to be that he was too good at what he did.
I have a friend who dates Ann Coulter... I hear she's drinking fairly heavily these nights... SHe has four PCs going at the same time to monitor the action...
Only the "Action" Ann, ain't with you....
Sorry, but you hitched your wagon to a loser whom you didn't vette. Newt was right up your alley...
In your heart you know Newt is right...
Sorry, but you're now on the dung heap of has been journalists... commentators...Glenn Beck and Mark Steyn are already in that line to join you...
Sorry, Folks.. but you tried sell us out...YOu knew that these are terrible times... and it needs a junk yard dog... BUt you all chose a poodle...
Newt is far from perfect, but he is the man for the times....Any time he speaks...it's a learning experience...
Go to bed, Ann. Take two aspirin... And write yet another divisive article against Newt...
You are the phony...Plane and simple...
me...
PS-If you want to talk more about it... call me...
Romney is still going to be the candidate. Unfortunately for Newt, not every state is South Carolina. I think Romney goes Nuclear Option on Gingrich in Florida and all but buries him. Sure, Newt will stick around but Romney realizes that he needs to win decisively and will pull out the stops and make a stand in Florida. He's got the money to do it.
$5 of TF says you're wrong (unless two other people have already taken me up on my previous challenge).
Bauer:considering jesus was born in 7b.c. ...i'd say they were wrong.
it is already 2019.
the big problem will be nibiru.
-or the upcoming war in iran, for israel.
Umm, even if you were to adjust the current western calendar changing the year in that method of reckoning the date doesn't add 7 years to the Mayan calendar, which clocks over a digit in 2012 (everyone else) or 2019 (in your calendar).
tcan:As an unapologetic conservative I believe that 4 years ago Obama was uready to be President and I still believe that. However I also believe that Gingrich is unfit to be President. If he should become the nominee I would rather stay home and have 4 more years of Obama than have him as President. While I agree philosophicaly with much of what Gingrich says and don't agree with most of what Obama has done I do think that character matters. I have dealt with lots of Gingrich types in my life and consider him to be a sociopath. I hope the rest of the states take a good look at the record of the man and consider the consequences of their votes. I admit to being a Romney supporter as his only character flaw seems to be that he was too good at what he did.
Well, that and he's completely lying about what conservative actions he will take as president. If personal character, Santorum is better than either. I mean, aside from the homophobic bigotry.
Close2TheEdge:Sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense. I can't possibly think of a greater motivator to the Democratic base than New Gingrich as the GOP nominee. Even liberals who have no great love for Obama will be begging to vote for him. And Gingrich will turn off far more moderates than he will pick up. They might be the ones to stay home.
Yeah, that's exactly why the GOP move will be to get as many people to the left of Genghis Khan to stay home if Gingrich starts looking like he'll get the nomination. Newt's toxic and has zero chance of occupying the center, therefore the response is to counter-balance that with "both sides are bad" rhetoric to dilsillusion moderates and "Obama isn't a real liberal" rhetoric to disillusion as many liberals as possible. That way, the GOP base ends up being the largest voting bloc to turn out.
Look to crap like NDAA and its detainment provision, which was a Republican scare-tactic attached to a must-not-veto bill. Expect more of that type of behavior. Like I said in a thread the other day, the GOP much accomplish two of three things: keep the liberals at home, get the base out, and occupy the center or keep the base home. If Romney gets the nod, look to them trying to get the base out and occupy the center. If Newt gets the nod, look to them keeping the center at home and as many liberals as possible, since he'll energize both bases.
pedobearapproved:DarnoKonrad: Close2TheEdge: dear God, what if Gingrich wins?
global chaos
Mass Fark suicide... at least they'll be in need of some anti depressants
Nah, it would, however, be an orgy Schadenfreude by Fark's resident wingnuts, who've been pretty quiet since Hillary failed to metastasize into the big joke on the Democrats they hoped it would.
But that would wear off pretty quickly as the power of the presidency became an extension of Newts sociopahtic ego.
Romney is still going to be the candidate. Unfortunately for Newt, not every state is South Carolina. I think Romney goes Nuclear Option on Gingrich in Florida and all but buries him. Sure, Newt will stick around but Romney realizes that he needs to win decisively and will pull out the stops and make a stand in Florida. He's got the money to do it.
$5 of TF says you're wrong (unless two other people have already taken me up on my previous challenge).
Altitude5280:Found this over at Freeperville-I have a friend who dates Ann Coulter... I hear she's drinking fairly heavily these nights... SHe has four PCs going at the same time to monitor the action...
Only the "Action" Ann, ain't with you....
Sorry, but you hitched your wagon to a loser whom you didn't vette. Newt was right up your alley...
In your heart you know Newt is right...
Sorry, but you're now on the dung heap of has been journalists... commentators...Glenn Beck and Mark Steyn are already in that line to join you...
Sorry, Folks.. but you tried sell us out...YOu knew that these are terrible times... and it needs a junk yard dog... BUt you all chose a poodle...
Newt is far from perfect, but he is the man for the times....Any time he speaks...it's a learning experience...
Go to bed, Ann. Take two aspirin... And write yet another divisive article against Newt...
You are the phony...Plane and simple...
me...
PS-If you want to talk more about it... call me...
Times like this, I really miss Freep Impact. Fark is a lesser place for making her stop.
According to this WP table, Romney has acquired 33 delegates and Newt Gingrich 2, which tied him with Perry and Huntsman. 25 delegates were in play in South Carolina, so assuming Newt gets them all, its Romny, 33, to Newt Gingrich, 27. If you're wondering about the rest of the delegates and are too lazy to click, they are distributed as follows:
Santorum 13 Paul 4 Perry 2 Huntsman 2
The next state up is Florida.
You didn't really think Santorum or Paul were in the running, did you?
Gingrich converted from Baptist to Conservative Roman Catholic. Santorum is a knight of the reactionary right Church, at least on abortion and gay rights.
I have no idea how they are polling in Florida, but I'm about to find out. Florida is full of old people from New York and New England, so it's possible that Romney has a lot of Blue State Republicans backing him there.
that bosnian sniper:Yeah, that's exactly why the GOP move will be to get as many people to the left of Genghis Khan to stay home if Gingrich starts looking like he'll get the nomination. Newt's toxic and has zero chance of occupying the center, therefore the response is to counter-balance that with "both sides are bad" rhetoric to dilsillusion moderates and "Obama isn't a real liberal" rhetoric to disillusion as many liberals as possible
Ummmm, yeah, preventing liberal Republicans from voting is a genius strategy. Everyone is devoting boatloads of time and money to that.
This is awesome. I hope Mitt has a heart attack, or stroke, or drops out to "spend time with his family", and they're stuck with the cold-blooded swamp dweller.
DSan:I'm going to go out on a limb and say that he stole that. To hell with Gingrich.
His home state isnt above stealing Fortune 500 companies from other states with stimulus cash. A $60 million offer by Georgia's corporate raid-, er, economic development department was enough to relocate 125 years of history to Duluth, GA.
He advocates stealing jobs from janitors to give kids a Victorian introduction to society.
I'm not sure that he stole it, but he sure has a reputation and a following that would explain it.
According to this WP table, Romney has acquired 33 delegates and Newt Gingrich 2, which tied him with Perry and Huntsman. 25 delegates were in play in South Carolina, so assuming Newt gets them all, its Romny, 33, to Newt Gingrich, 27. If you're wondering about the rest of the delegates and are too lazy to click, they are distributed as follows:
Santorum 13 Paul 4 Perry 2 Huntsman 2
The next state up is Florida.
You didn't really think Santorum or Paul were in the running, did you?
Gingrich converted from Baptist to Conservative Roman Catholic. Santorum is a knight of the reactionary right Church, at least on abortion and gay rights.
I have no idea how they are polling in Florida, but I'm about to find out. Florida is full of old people from New York and New England, so it's possible that Romney has a lot of Blue State Republicans backing him there.
Those delegates won by folks dropped out of the race can go wherever they please at the convention, correct? I mean, Perry endorsed Gingrich and Hunstman endorsed Romney, but those delegates only take those endorsements as suggestions.
I would love to know more about the backroom deals those delegates might be cutting already.
Maybe we'll get a space program back. Keep going all the way to the White House.
I guess the deficit and debt will suddenly stop being priorities five minutes after the "food stamp president" leaves the White House, eh?
When we make people work for their supper.
You're saying people on food stamps don't work? Many people who get food stamps have a paycheck, I'm not sure if you are aware of this but minimum wage and low-paying jobs don't necessarily cut it anymore. A lot of the time a man and a woman can't support a car payment, house payment, utilities/bills, and children without a little help. If there were better, higher paying jobs, and more of them, it may not be necessary for so many people to use foodstamps.
The President's solution is to make life easier for the poor and middle class so they'll have disposable income and there can be increased demand, what does Newt say? "You're poor? then you're lazy. Get a a job, there are millions of them that are unfilled. We need more free trade so it's easier to outsource them. We need to cut social programs because you're spoiled on them - You don't need the help. We need to give tax cuts to billionaires because they are the only thing making this economy work, all you poor people are just leeches off their success."
Yeah, keep farkin that chicken. Obama's people will put this much more succinctly and eloquently.
I really have no idea who to look forward to in 2016. I like Elizabeth Warren but she'll be 67 by then. She will only have been an elected official for 4 years if she gets elected this year as well.
Chances are we're barely familiar with who will be the nominee in 2016. Obama was a relative unknown in 2004.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/ele c tion_2012/election_2012_presidential_election/florida/2012_florida_rep ublican_primary
Maybe we'll get a space program back. Keep going all the way to the White House.
Do you think he s more honest with you than he was with his first two wives, the congressional ethics investigation, or the people to whom he told he did no lobbying whatsoever?
Wait until you have a divorce, and someone asks you that, Mr. Holier than Thou.
I dont have a problem with commitment, chucklef*ck
eraser8:Funk Brothers: I have to say, Newt has a good chance at beating Obama.
How do you figure?
Because the voters said so. Even though he's not perfect, he's the best chance to beat Obama and it's going to happen. Remember, the Teabaggers have a right to vote. They live in this country too.
AmorousRedDragon:A lot of the time a man and a woman can't support a car payment, house payment, utilities/bills, and children without a little help.
and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Funk Brothers:eraser8: Funk Brothers: I have to say, Newt has a good chance at beating Obama.
How do you figure?
Because the voters said so. Even though he's not perfect, he's the best chance to beat Obama and it's going to happen. Remember, the Teabaggers have a right to vote. They live in this country too.
the voters from one state, when it becomes a trend in non derp states maybe it will mean something.
AmorousRedDragon:Obama's people will put this much more succinctly and eloquently.
Yeah, with another trillion of working-peoples-tax-money for shovel-ready jobs, oh, there weren't any jobs, oh, that sucks. Don't you DARE ask where the money went!
Chris Farley must be kicking himself, in addition to not being dead for the last 13 years he could suddenly have a recurring gig on SNL doing his Gingrich impression again.
Funk Brothers:Because the voters said so. Even though he's not perfect, he's the best chance to beat Obama and it's going to happen. Remember, the Teabaggers have a right to vote. They live in this country too.
Yeah Obama is at 11 point lead over him in the General. Let's see if your Tea Party Minority™ can change the tide.
IronTom:and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Yeah well food stamps don't buy alcohol, and i'm not sure how you can feed your family lobster and steak for a month on something like $150. I'm not convinced that most people who makes little enough money to even qualify for foodstamps can "get by without it", nor would I call them all drug users. You don't see poor people as human beings you see them as trash.
Farker Soze:This is awesome. I hope Mitt has a heart attack, or stroke, or drops out to "spend time with his family", and they're stuck with the cold-blooded swamp dweller.
Trying to predict the future based on history and current facts:
Romney seems the most sane. But, Romney has Karl Rove on his side. Romney would also draw more moderates which would help him get elected: He'll get the Republican faithful, and the moderates who are frustrated with the Obama they voted for last time.
Gingrich seems to have a better chance at getting elected in that if he gets the nomination he will go full scorched-earth against Obama. His surrogates will drag Obama through the mud. It'll be ugly. Gingrich will draw hardcore conservative voters who might apathetically stay home if Romney gets the nod.
Either way, an Obama win in November is not a slam-dunk.
According to this WP table, Romney has acquired 33 delegates and Newt Gingrich 2, which tied him with Perry and Huntsman. 25 delegates were in play in South Carolina, so assuming Newt gets them all, its Romny, 33, to Newt Gingrich, 27. If you're wondering about the rest of the delegates and are too lazy to click, they are distributed as follows:
Santorum 13 Paul 4 Perry 2 Huntsman 2
The next state up is Florida.
You didn't really think Santorum or Paul were in the running, did you?
Gingrich converted from Baptist to Conservative Roman Catholic. Santorum is a knight of the reactionary right Church, at least on abortion and gay rights.
I have no idea how they are polling in Florida, but I'm about to find out. Florida is full of old people from New York and New England, so it's possible that Romney has a lot of Blue State Republicans backing him there.
If several years of being on Fark have taught me anything, it's that Florida is an unpredictable place. While there are plenty of the transplants you mentioned, I was down there recently and was given fliers by Tea Party activists in full Revolutionary War garb.
/It wasn't a costume or anything, the average Floridian is just that old
IronTom:AmorousRedDragon: Obama's people will put this much more succinctly and eloquently.
Yeah, with another trillion of working-peoples-tax-money for shovel-ready jobs, oh, there weren't any jobs, oh, that sucks. Don't you DARE ask where the money went!
It didn't work as well as it could have because just about half of that stimulus was tax cuts for rich people, the republicans forced that in, and the actually spending half was too small to do what it needed to do. Every economist agreed on this, and I'll take their opinions over yours. As for the current deficit, there's not much different now than what it was under Bush. If it weren't for Bush and republican policies over the 2000 decade we wouldn't HAVE a deficit.
Earguy:Gingrich seems to have a better chance at getting elected in that if he gets the nomination he will go full scorched-earth against Obama. His surrogates will drag Obama through the mud. It'll be ugly.
Okay. What're we going to hear different from last time? He was an Alinsky disciple palling around with terrorists going to church listening to the GOD DAMN AMERICA guy in '08 and he still kicked McCain's ass.
AmorousRedDragon:Funk Brothers: Because the voters said so. Even though he's not perfect, he's the best chance to beat Obama and it's going to happen. Remember, the Teabaggers have a right to vote. They live in this country too.
Yeah Obama is at 11 point lead over him in the General. Let's see if your Tea Party Minority™ can change the tide.
IronTom: and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Yeah well food stamps don't buy alcohol, and i'm not sure how you can feed your family lobster and steak for a month on something like $150. I'm not convinced that most people who makes little enough money to even qualify for foodstamps can "get by without it", nor would I call them all drug users. You don't see poor people as human beings you see them as trash.
You are projecting. (both for your election predictions and what you think I think of people in hard times)
What are the odds of Newt skipping Florida? Isn't it a winner takes all state? Seems like a huge money sink that he could use in other markets to pick up delegates.
AmorousRedDragon:Funk Brothers: Because the voters said so. Even though he's not perfect, he's the best chance to beat Obama and it's going to happen. Remember, the Teabaggers have a right to vote. They live in this country too.
Yeah Obama is at 11 point lead over him in the General. Let's see if your Tea Party Minority™ can change the tide.
I remember that Newt was down and out during the summer and during the Christmas holiday. Newt can basically close the gap over the course of several months or weeks before the election and beat Obama. Don't count him out yet.
Normally, I'm able to make a pretty good guess for how Florida's going to go, but this year I don't have a clue. Most of the people I know are backing Romney, but they're also what I'd consider to be GOP establishment, and we already know the establishment wants Romney. There doesn't seem to be a lot of love for Newt, but then again I don't have a lot of connections to the batshiat insane tea party crowd so I might just be missing that segment of the voters. The religious right keep saying favorable things about Santorum, but when push comes to shove, most of them fall in line behind electability.
I think I'm tentatively going to predict Romney winning Florida, but I feel a heck of a lot less certain about that than I did even a week ago.
My facebook feed is full of people that seriously support this fat load. I'm laughing, because I know most of them are professional derpsters who form the basis of the modern know-nothings. They hate "Barry Sareto" so much that that will support an inept Nazi wannabe.
AmorousRedDragon:IronTom: and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Yeah well food stamps don't buy alcohol, and i'm not sure how you can feed your family lobster and steak for a month on something like $150. I'm not convinced that most people who makes little enough money to even qualify for foodstamps can "get by without it", nor would I call them all drug users. You don't see poor people as human beings you see them as trash.
I miss the glory days of fark, when people realized they were clearly being trolled.
IronTom:You are projecting. (both for your election predictions and what you think I think of people in hard times)
You said most people on foodstamps don't need them ("can get by without it") if they would stop buying lobster/steak/beer/cigarettes/drugs. I'm not projecting sh*t.
Crocodilly_Pontifex:Someone who wasn't 9 when Newt was Speaker, please explain to me why this is such comedy?
Because Newt Gingrich's was exposed as a slime of gargantuan proportions and basically banished from the halls of power BY HIS OWN PARTY decades before the infidelities came to light. The party that is now going to nominate him for POTUS.
rynthetyn:Normally, I'm able to make a pretty good guess for how Florida's going to go, but this year I don't have a clue. Most of the people I know are backing Romney, but they're also what I'd consider to be GOP establishment, and we already know the establishment wants Romney. There doesn't seem to be a lot of love for Newt, but then again I don't have a lot of connections to the batshiat insane tea party crowd so I might just be missing that segment of the voters. The religious right keep saying favorable things about Santorum, but when push comes to shove, most of them fall in line behind electability.
I think I'm tentatively going to predict Romney winning Florida, but I feel a heck of a lot less certain about that than I did even a week ago.
CNN looked at the exit polls, Tea Partiers are responding bigtime to the idea that Romney is a big money capitalist and tax cheat.
I expect Newt positions himself as a populist and keeps going after Bain. He's finally found a really powerful angle against Romney. Newt will sell himself as the man of the people; tonight, he's bashing the elites and the news media as I'm typing. That's going to work for him.
RminusQ:MSNBC just came back from commercial. How long has he been speaking?
It's amazing, really. He's talking a lot, but he's not saying a single damn thing. It's like one bumper sticker babbling to a parking lot full of other bumper stickers.
AmorousRedDragon:IronTom: You are projecting. (both for your election predictions and what you think I think of people in hard times)
You said most people on foodstamps don't need them ("can get by without it") if they would stop buying lobster/steak/beer/cigarettes/drugs. I'm not projecting sh*t.
I miss the glory days of fark, when people realized they were clearly being trolled.
robsul82:Earguy: Gingrich seems to have a better chance at getting elected in that if he gets the nomination he will go full scorched-earth against Obama. His surrogates will drag Obama through the mud. It'll be ugly.
Okay. What're we going to hear different from last time? He was an Alinsky disciple palling around with terrorists going to church listening to the GOD DAMN AMERICA guy in '08 and he still kicked McCain's ass.
Constant reminders of unkept promises.
Lots of sloganeering, zingers about "hope" and "change". Without getting too specific, we will be fed a daily diet of "Obama has been ineffective". Such messages sink in after a while.
And I really don't think Obama will attack Newt in kind.
And where this "America's great because you can come from anywhere to run for president" story leads when it comes to the sitting president, Mr. Gingrich?
Vodka Zombie:RminusQ: MSNBC just came back from commercial. How long has he been speaking?
It's amazing, really. He's talking a lot, but he's not saying a single damn thing. It's like one bumper sticker babbling to a parking lot full of other bumper stickers.
Lots of sloganeering, zingers about "hope" and "change". Without getting too specific, we will be fed a daily diet of "Obama has been ineffective". Such messages sink in after a while.
It's scorched earth to say "he hasn't done this, this, this, and this?" Really? That's tame, to be expected territory against any incumbent. By saying "scorched earth," I think of really deep personal attacks.
jst3p:AmorousRedDragon: IronTom: and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Yeah well food stamps don't buy alcohol, and i'm not sure how you can feed your family lobster and steak for a month on something like $150. I'm not convinced that most people who makes little enough money to even qualify for foodstamps can "get by without it", nor would I call them all drug users. You don't see poor people as human beings you see them as trash.
I miss the glory days of fark, when people realized they were clearly being trolled.
Don't you have any new sauce, this 'troll' thing makes you look juvenile, and I will remove you from my favorites list (I guess that is juvenile too)
jst3p:AmorousRedDragon: IronTom: You are projecting. (both for your election predictions and what you think I think of people in hard times)
You said most people on foodstamps don't need them ("can get by without it") if they would stop buying lobster/steak/beer/cigarettes/drugs. I'm not projecting sh*t.
I miss the glory days of fark, when people realized they were clearly being trolled.
AmorousRedDragon:IronTom: You are projecting. (both for your election predictions and what you think I think of people in hard times)
You said most people on foodstamps don't need them ("can get by without it") if they would stop buying lobster/steak/beer/cigarettes/drugs. I'm not projecting sh*t.
Before you get all excited, keep in mind that many people were thinking about George W. Bush when he started winning primaries that he was the Democrats dream candidate, because he was so dumb he wouldn't have a chance in the general.
If Newt does become the GOP nominee Obama should make John Edwards his running mate. Just because the ensuing logic loop of defending Newt while assailing Edwards would be highly entertaining.
Funk Brothers:eraser8: Funk Brothers: I have to say, Newt has a good chance at beating Obama.
How do you figure?
Because the voters said so. Even though he's not perfect, he's the best chance to beat Obama and it's going to happen. Remember, the Teabaggers have a right to vote. They live in this country too.
Are you completely insane? Have you looked at his negatives? Bashing the media may work with tea partiers but anyone who takes this seriously knows elections are won in the middle ground. They may not like Obamas policies but they hate Gingrich on a personal level.
ooo, he must be trollin! since he likes the other candidate than mine, or disagrees with me in any way, at least AmorousRD is carrying on an intelligent discussion with me.
Anyone claiming that Newt is electable is severely underestimating the amount of opposition research that the Clintons and Pelosi (just to name a few) have on him. Decades of dirt, and the only person deluded enough to genuinely think that he can sidestep it is Newt himself.
IronTom:You said most people on foodstamps don't need them ("can get by without it") if they would stop buying lobster/steak/beer/cigarettes/drugs. I'm not projecting sh*t.
just can't read
IronTom:and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Newt Gingrich tried to raise the prospects of a return to the gold standard on Friday, encroaching on territory firmly held in the Republican presidential campaign by Ron Paul.
Funk Brothers:I remember that Newt was down and out during the summer and during the Christmas holiday. Newt can basically close the gap over the course of several months or weeks before the election and beat Obama. Don't count him out yet.
During the summer, the teabagger candidates were still in the race and the ABM vote was split. Over the holidays, while the teabagger candidates were already long-gone the ABM vote was still split and bouncing between Santorum, Gingrich and Perry. What's going on here is the ABM vote is coalescing around Gingrich, especially in reaction to the (publicized) outcome of Iowa and the actual outcome of New Hampshire, and after Perry dropped out to endorse Gingrich (which I think was the factor in South Carolina to look at).
The short is, that's not Gingrich getting support, or "closing the gap", in any positive sense. That is to say, Gingrich is not necessarily appealing to voters, but rather support for other candidates who have since dropped out migrating to Gingrich.
IronTom:jst3p: AmorousRedDragon: IronTom: and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Yeah well food stamps don't buy alcohol, and i'm not sure how you can feed your family lobster and steak for a month on something like $150. I'm not convinced that most people who makes little enough money to even qualify for foodstamps can "get by without it", nor would I call them all drug users. You don't see poor people as human beings you see them as trash.
I miss the glory days of fark, when people realized they were clearly being trolled.
Don't you have any new sauce, this 'troll' thing makes you look juvenile, and I will remove you from my favorites list (I guess that is juvenile too)
A predictable tact. You went with one of the two most common responses, go on the offensive or completely ignore my comment and continue fishing. Nowadays the pro move is to do something completely different and unexpected. That is what separates the good from the also rans.
trotsky:My facebook feed is full of people that seriously support this fat load. I'm laughing, because I know most of them are professional derpsters who form the basis of the modern know-nothings. They hate "Barry Sareto" so much that that will support an inept Nazi wannabe.
Lovin' it.trotsky:My facebook feed is full of people that seriously support this fat load. I'm laughing, because I know most of them are professional derpsters who form the basis of the modern know-nothings. They hate "Barry Sareto" so much that that will support an inept Nazi wannabe.
Lovin' it.
If they bring up Romney as being a "corporate raider", ask them to explain how Georgia's economic development board isnt the same thing by function.
/Would be sweet irony to have Newt twist himself in a pretzel //Just to explain how his home state did something un-Republican
whooter:Isn't he also the only Speaker in my lifetime to get kicked out?
The House voted overwhelmingly yesterday to reprimand House Speaker Newt Gingrich (R-Ga.) and order him to pay an unprecedented $300,000 penalty, the first time in the House's 208-year history it has disciplined a speaker for ethical wrongdoing.
robsul82:Chris Farley must be kicking himself, in addition to not being dead for the last 13 years he could suddenly have a recurring gig on SNL doing his Gingrich impression again.
The pipeline is SO not going through Vancouver. But I think Stephen Harper will still be cringing at Newt's praise tomorrow, that's like a 10% cut in his polling up here.
By the way, there's lots of Chinese-Canadian partnerships on everything, and there have been for decades! We in Canada love China because we love trade, and money. Go China!
A Republican source familiar with expenditures in the state told CNN that the Romney campaign has spent $1.9 million total on the South Carolina airwaves, while a super PAC backing Romney has spent roughly $2.5 million. "Winning Our Future," a super PAC supporting Gingrich, has spent $1.76 million. Gingrich, meanwhile, spent just $640,000 total.
$2,400,000 spent for Gingrich. 230,000 votes (more or less) $10 per vote. $4,400,000 spent for Romney. 140,000 votes (more or less) $31 per vote.
Romney needs to outspend Gingrich by 3:1. Florida should be interesting.
robsul82:Earguy: Constant reminders of unkept promises.
Lots of sloganeering, zingers about "hope" and "change". Without getting too specific, we will be fed a daily diet of "Obama has been ineffective". Such messages sink in after a while.
It's scorched earth to say "he hasn't done this, this, this, and this?" Really? That's tame, to be expected territory against any incumbent. By saying "scorched earth," I think of really deep personal attacks.
I think we'll see that too. Vilification of his wife. Mocking anything light-hearted he's ever done. Innuendo about Chicago graft. It'll happen. Those scowling, slo-mo, negative ads that don't really say anything, but convey a feeling of "he can't be trusted." And you can bet that they'll use footage that make him look dark. Yes, I mean that exactly that way.
AmorousRedDragon:IronTom: You said most people on foodstamps don't need them ("can get by without it") if they would stop buying lobster/steak/beer/cigarettes/drugs. I'm not projecting sh*t.
just can't read
IronTom: and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Speak for yourself.
Read it again. I don't like the situation, not saying that if they stopped buying vices and expensive food that they would be self sufficient. I just say I don't like to pay for their food stamps if they can afford cigarettes and drugs, or really at all. I detest paying for other people. I do though, and I want them to improve themselves. I detest paying for those of them that are lazy bums who sit their asses on a couch instead of trying to improve themselves, don't you?
jst3p:IronTom: jst3p: AmorousRedDragon: IronTom: and a lot of the time they can get by without being on the dole (welfare). I detest the environment where people can just go on food stamps and I have to pay for your beer lobster steak, so you can spend your real money on cigarettes and drugs.
Yeah well food stamps don't buy alcohol, and i'm not sure how you can feed your family lobster and steak for a month on something like $150. I'm not convinced that most people who makes little enough money to even qualify for foodstamps can "get by without it", nor would I call them all drug users. You don't see poor people as human beings you see them as trash.
I miss the glory days of fark, when people realized they were clearly being trolled.
Don't you have any new sauce, this 'troll' thing makes you look juvenile, and I will remove you from my favorites list (I guess that is juvenile too)
A predictable tact. You went with one of the two most common responses, go on the offensive or completely ignore my comment and continue fishing. Nowadays the pro move is to do something completely different and unexpected. That is what separates the good from the also rans.
Are you trolling me? Have nothing to add to the conversation? Do you know how to say Derp too?
By the way, the really perplexing this is how totally irrelevant Saul Alinksy is to radicals these days. I'm thinking, "Oh, that guy? Um... I see his books all the time being sold at garage sales because nobody reads Saul Alinsky anymore."
If Newt wants to attack radicals he should be bashing Chandra Talpade Mohanty or Audre Lorde or Judith Butler. Today's radicals are obsessed with third world feminist and queer-studies-influenced views on intersections of privilege.
Earguy:I think we'll see that too. Vilification of his wife. Mocking anything light-hearted he's ever done. Innuendo about Chicago graft. It'll happen. Those scowling, slo-mo, negative ads that don't really say anything, but convey a feeling of "he can't be trusted." And you can bet that they'll use footage that make him look dark. Yes, I mean that exactly that way.
Yup, exactly like I mentioned earlier in the thread: anything and everything that can (and will) disillusion liberals and moderates to stay home.
Just to provide a point of contrast to Newts victory speech. Here is a blast from the past (new window) what Obama was saying after losing NH. I still say that might be one of the best campaign speeches ever.
I am not getting how any of these guys are supposed to come back and occupy the center after winning the nomination. Romney was at least in the neighborhood of the American center except for his economic views, but he's keeled right to try and fend of the fascist nutcases to his right.
I feel like Obama already owns the center, especially now that Mitt's moved away from it. I'm not seeing where the votes for any of the remaining Republicans come from in the presidential election.
So I'm watching MSNBC now instead of CNN and the Rev. Al Sharpton is talking about the spirit of Christianity and I'm not sure what the fark this is supposed to be adding to any analysis of the Republican primary, y'all.
Smelly McUgly:Romney was at least in the neighborhood of the American center except for his economic views
That's what I never got about Huntsman, why didn't he just scream his head off about being in the middle? At some point you do have to deal with the guy heckling the crowd. And he's smart enough to deal with it.
bobbette:So I'm watching MSNBC now instead of CNN and the Rev. Al Sharpton is talking about the spirit of Christianity and I'm not sure what the fark this is supposed to be adding to any analysis of the Republican primary, y'all.
I'm not watching, but I'm guessing he's going for the whole "Jesus was nothing like his current followers" idea.
He scares me more than any of them. He is chomping at the bit to go to war with Iran, and wants to eliminate ANYONE he doesn't agree with from the government. If he actually gets the nomination, I'll volunteer for Obama's campaign.
Carth:Just to provide a point of contrast to Newts victory speech. Here is a blast from the past (new window) what Obama was saying after losing NH. I still say that might be one of the best campaign speeches ever.
If Biden were to take an infarct after eating something tasty from the WH garden, and Obama appointed Hillary to serve as VP just how much more incensed would the Rep Base become?
Would make for an interesting 2016 (assuming sufficient froth would be generated this year).
It's this kind of spectacle that makes me realize I might just have to shell out some cash and man some phones for Obama in the fall. Regardless of how remote his chances seem now, we just can't let Newt Gingrich become president with that kind of rhetoric.
Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Weigard:Carth: Just to provide a point of contrast to Newts victory speech. Here is a blast from the past (new window) what Obama was saying after losing NH. I still say that might be one of the best campaign speeches ever.
Wow he really MLK'd that up.
Yeah, "Yes We Can" was the speech given after losing NH. During that campaign, in fact, Obama typically gave better speeches after losing than he did after winning.
theorellior:It's this kind of spectacle that makes me realize I might just have to shell out some cash and man some phones for Obama in the fall. Regardless of how remote his chances seem now, we just can't let Newt Gingrich become president with that kind of rhetoric.
Exactly what I just said/thought. There is no way this man can take control of this country.
Since Gingrich is responsible for leading the Republican party into the sewer that it's currently in, it's fitting that his defeat in the general election would be the final nail in the party's coffin.
The country isn't that far right, and it isn't moving in that direction. The GOP is pandering entirely to a voting block that is literally dying.
theorellior:It's this kind of spectacle that makes me realize I might just have to shell out some cash and man some phones for Obama in the fall. Regardless of how remote his chances seem now, we just can't let Newt Gingrich become president with that kind of rhetoric.
And miss witnessing what the implosion of the Weimar Republic must have looked like?
serpent_sky:Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Gingrich is a good ol' boy from Georgia and Santorum is a nerdy guy from Pennsylvania up in the Union. Santorum's state was on the wrong side of the War of Northern Aggression.
bobbette:My theory is that Lee Atwater faked the change of heart for posterity.
The excellent documentary Boogie Man included at least the possibility of that being true, one guy tells a story about Mary Matalin telling him that a Bible given to the suddenly converted Catholic Atwater was found still in the cellophane at his house after he died.
MFAWG:Crocodilly_Pontifex: Someone who wasn't 9 when Newt was Speaker, please explain to me why this is such comedy?
Because Newt Gingrich's was exposed as a slime of gargantuan proportions and basically banished from the halls of power BY HIS OWN PARTY decades before the infidelities came to light. The party that is now going to nominate him for POTUS.
Thanks for clearing that up. I remember THAT Newt was speaker of the house, and I always thought he had an oddly square head... And I knew that he was a republican, but I wasn't really paying attention when he left power. After Newt left, the last person i remember was Dennis Hastert. I think.
Awesome. So now it's Santorum in Iowa, Romney in New Hampshire, and Gingrich in South Carolina? I can't wait for Florida. By the time they get to the convention someone's mom should be able to figure it all out.
serpent_sky:Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Christian family values only apply to teh gayz. If you're straight, you can do whatever the fark you want.
nm:bugontherug: For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead. Newt Gingrich. Washington Outsider.
serpent_sky:Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Santorum is a religious guy, but he doesn't really pull off the economic populism and the overarching narrative about American exceptionalism and the anti-Obama dogwhistling and barnstorming that we've seen from Newt this week. Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
Wow, the GOP is really in self destruct mode. I wonder what will form from the ashes? Three parties, the wing nut Christian hypocrites and the wing nut Objectivist hypocrites? A party of sanity as well, maybe?
Could the "Grand Coalition" become the death of the two party system?
Stay tuned, same batshiatcrazychannel, different batshiatcrazytime.
robsul82:bobbette: My theory is that Lee Atwater faked the change of heart for posterity.
The excellent documentary Boogie Man included at least the possibility of that being true, one guy tells a story about Mary Matalin telling him that a Bible given to the suddenly converted Catholic Atwater was found still in the cellophane at his house after he died.
I love that movie. REQUIRED WATCHING, Politics Tab.
If you haven't seen that movie, you probably won't understand why Newt Gingrich is so successful right now.
bobbette:rynthetyn: Normally, I'm able to make a pretty good guess for how Florida's going to go, but this year I don't have a clue. Most of the people I know are backing Romney, but they're also what I'd consider to be GOP establishment, and we already know the establishment wants Romney. There doesn't seem to be a lot of love for Newt, but then again I don't have a lot of connections to the batshiat insane tea party crowd so I might just be missing that segment of the voters. The religious right keep saying favorable things about Santorum, but when push comes to shove, most of them fall in line behind electability.
I think I'm tentatively going to predict Romney winning Florida, but I feel a heck of a lot less certain about that than I did even a week ago.
CNN looked at the exit polls, Tea Partiers are responding bigtime to the idea that Romney is a big money capitalist and tax cheat.
I expect Newt positions himself as a populist and keeps going after Bain. He's finally found a really powerful angle against Romney. Newt will sell himself as the man of the people; tonight, he's bashing the elites and the news media as I'm typing. That's going to work for him.
Hmm, if it is the tea party that's falling in line behind Newt, then Florida is probably going to end up a battle of voter turnout. And that comes down to whether the establishment learned their lesson from staying home in the primary for the governor's race, thus letting the tea party pick Voldemort's more evil twin as the nominee.
Maybe we'll get a space program back. Keep going all the way to the White House.
Do you think he s more honest with you than he was with his first two wives, the congressional ethics investigation, or the people to whom he told he did no lobbying whatsoever?
Wait until you have a divorce, and someone asks you that, Mr. Holier than Thou.
I don't think that if I was a serial philanderer and chronically ethically challenged that I'd be dumb enough to run for office.
bobbette:serpent_sky: Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Santorum is a religious guy, but he doesn't really pull off the economic populism and the overarching narrative about American exceptionalism and the anti-Obama dogwhistling and barnstorming that we've seen from Newt this week. Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
serpent_sky:Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Actually it's pretty simple. They hate Romney and need an alternative but they don't think Santorum is electable so by default they voted for Gingrich. It wasn't so much a vote of support as it was voting for what they feel is their best alternative.
juniperwasting:Wow, the GOP is really in self destruct mode. I wonder what will form from the ashes? Three parties, the wing nut Christian hypocrites and the wing nut Objectivist hypocrites? A party of sanity as well, maybe?
Could the "Grand Coalition" become the death of the two party system?
Stay tuned, same batshiatcrazychannel, different batshiatcrazytime.
I think the Republican Party basically has to survive by shunning the evangelicals OR the neo-capitalists, and since money talks, it'll be the evangelicals they run away from. They have to reset back to the left in order to try and maintain viability amongst independents and centrists. Getting rid of the far-right social aspects of their party will help them achieve this. They'll also just continue to marginalize the libertarians if this happens.
Or they could just explode, which would be way more fascinating and a whole lot of fun.
rynthetyn:bobbette: rynthetyn: Normally, I'm able to make a pretty good guess for how Florida's going to go, but this year I don't have a clue. Most of the people I know are backing Romney, but they're also what I'd consider to be GOP establishment, and we already know the establishment wants Romney. There doesn't seem to be a lot of love for Newt, but then again I don't have a lot of connections to the batshiat insane tea party crowd so I might just be missing that segment of the voters. The religious right keep saying favorable things about Santorum, but when push comes to shove, most of them fall in line behind electability.
I think I'm tentatively going to predict Romney winning Florida, but I feel a heck of a lot less certain about that than I did even a week ago.
CNN looked at the exit polls, Tea Partiers are responding bigtime to the idea that Romney is a big money capitalist and tax cheat.
I expect Newt positions himself as a populist and keeps going after Bain. He's finally found a really powerful angle against Romney. Newt will sell himself as the man of the people; tonight, he's bashing the elites and the news media as I'm typing. That's going to work for him.
Hmm, if it is the tea party that's falling in line behind Newt, then Florida is probably going to end up a battle of voter turnout. And that comes down to whether the establishment learned their lesson from staying home in the primary for the governor's race, thus letting the tea party pick Voldemort's more evil twin as the nominee.
In other words, it's still a tossup.
Interesting analysis. If it's turnout you'd think Romney would have an advantage, because he's got the ground organization and more money, but Romney also has negative momentum and I don't think he's a really inspirational figure that people turn out for with great enthusiasm.
juniperwasting:Wow, the GOP is really in self destruct mode. I wonder what will form from the ashes? Three parties, the wing nut Christian hypocrites and the wing nut Objectivist hypocrites? A party of sanity as well, maybe?
Could the "Grand Coalition" become the death of the two party system?
The problem is that the "sanity" group is busy with life, and only peripherally watching right now. They're saying "narrow it down, then I'll start to pay attention."
This is the problem with the entire primary system. Only people that are really into it, the ideologues, bother with it. But it's the motivated fringe that select the candidates for all of us to choose from.
serpent_sky:He scares me more than any of them. He is chomping at the bit to go to war with Iran, and wants to eliminate ANYONE he doesn't agree with from the government. If he actually gets the nomination, I'll volunteer for Obama's campaign.
Our country could NOT survive him.
I think the right may be forgetting that the "Liberals are scared of Newt!" talking point is just a partisan way of saying "Many Americans who lean left would take great pains to keep Gingrich out of office."
Jesus wept, people. There was some doubt as to how Palin would behave on a national stage, but with Newt you don't even have that excuse. No matter how much fun you have when you think you're stickin' it to them dirty libs, you don't want them scared. You want them apathetic and unmotivated. Low overall turnout is usually to your benefit. You're doing it wrong.
bobbette:Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
Were you watching the same coverage and debates I was? After New Hampshire his campaign strategy has been around being a huge sack of shiat. And unsurprisingly, you end up with tonight.
Bucky Katt:bobbette: serpent_sky: Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Santorum is a religious guy, but he doesn't really pull off the economic populism and the overarching narrative about American exceptionalism and the anti-Obama dogwhistling and barnstorming that we've seen from Newt this week. Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
I'm sure he'll do great in the Virginia primary.
Ha, ha. That is a good point though: Newt has a crappy organization working for him, it seems.
I don't know who I preferred to win SC, Stephen Colbert (a la Herman Cain) or Newt. I always expected Colbert to win, he has the state's initials. Colbert may be a comedian, but Gingrich is proving just as funny. I wonder how the elderly in Florida will react to all of the anti-social security crap they support, maybe they will be like NH and vote for Obama...
Wasteland:Jesus wept, people. There was some doubt as to how Palin would behave on a national stage, but with Newt you don't even have that excuse. No matter how much fun you have when you think you're stickin' it to them dirty libs, you don't want them scared. You want them apathetic and unmotivated. Low overall turnout is usually to your benefit. You're doing it wrong.
This election has always been a "fark you America for putting a n****r in the White House" election as far as the GOP is concerned. Their intent is to punish the US with their choice.
I haven't been paying attention, what does Fox News say about this? Are they backing Romney? What about Limbaugh? Several years ago, Rush was a solid supporter of "Mr. Newt." Who's being backed by the Republican shills?
It's always fun to see the shills turn to the nominee after trashing him during the primaries when they want someone else instead.
Wasteland:No matter how much fun you have when you think you're stickin' it to them dirty libs, you don't want them scared. You want them apathetic and unmotivated. Low overall turnout is usually to your benefit. You're doing it wrong.
This is truth. With Newt Gingrich as the nominee you'd see a Democratic groundswell of Biblical proportions. I'm not happy about various things that Obama has done but when it all comes down to it, a giant douche is just a big bag of vinegar and water. Much easier to swallow than a turd sandwich.
bobbette:Bucky Katt: bobbette: serpent_sky: Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Santorum is a religious guy, but he doesn't really pull off the economic populism and the overarching narrative about American exceptionalism and the anti-Obama dogwhistling and barnstorming that we've seen from Newt this week. Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
I'm sure he'll do great in the Virginia primary.
Ha, ha. That is a good point though: Newt has a crappy organization working for him, it seems.
I don't think he really expected to win at first. He was just half-assing it for the publicity. Of course, since the ABM voters are now coalescing around him, NOW he sees a chance to win. Too bad his organization stinks something fierce.
I was starting to panic that the republicans were actually going to choose the best candidate to win, considering romney and obama are essentially tied in polls.
Republican presidential candidate Newt Gingrich says that anyone that uses direct quotes from his Sunday interview about Rep. Paul Ryan's (R-WI) plan to dismantle Medicare is lying.
apoptotic:bobbette: Rachel Maddow just called this "Really awesome to cover!!"
Am I living on the same planet?
I assume she means in terms of ratings for at least the next few weeks. Romney locking up the nom early would be bad news for the media.
It's also awesome in that Newt has no chance of beating Obama. It's going to be a three ring circus, right up to when Obama's second term starts - there isn't enough popcorn in the world for this one...
tom servo bit me:eraser8: If they call themselves Catholic, by what standard do you declare them not Catholic?
Keep in mind that when I made my comment, I was NOT judging a church's Catholicism by its communion with the Roman pope.
Eh, I don't know. I know the Church of England likes to call itself Catholic, too. For me, "Catholic" always equaled "good with the Pope." I guess it's all those years of Catholic grade school. As I mentioned above, I'm not even practicing anymore; I think I just find it a lot more interesting seeing the intersection of political history with cultural and spiritual folkways. This, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with the conversation at hand, but whatever.
Catholic itself just means universal - if a church considers itself that, it can use the term (ain't like it is copyrighted/trademarked). If you are talking of church organization, Catholic (West) and Orthodox (East) can get kinda iffy, since some churches that are theologically similar to one can, in some cases, align with the other - most commonly along the Levant, where some churches who are theologically Orthodox joined with the Catholic Church for various reasons, negotiating to keep their Orthodox theology in exchange for saying the Pope is Da Man. Furthermore, despite both sides acting as if they are as diametrically opposed as matter and antimatter, Protestants and Catholics are so much more theologically similar than either is to the Orthodox or the Oriental Churches, that calling a Protestant church "Catholic" is actually a pretty accurate description of their theological position.
that bosnian sniper:bobbette: Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
Were you watching the same coverage and debates I was? After New Hampshire his campaign strategy has been around being a huge sack of shiat. And unsurprisingly, you end up with tonight.
Well, I meant on a personal level. I would characterize Newt's campaign as more of a pyroclastic sh*tflow emanating from Newt's mouth.
Smelly McUgly:Ha, ha. That is a good point though: Newt has a crappy organization working for him, it seems.
I don't think he really expected to win at first. He was just half-assing it for the publicity. Of course, since the ABM voters are now coalescing around him, NOW he sees a chance to win. Too bad his organization stinks something fierce.
People were writing Newt off months ago when his entire staff walked out on him.
Smelly McUgly:bobbette: Bucky Katt: bobbette: serpent_sky: Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Santorum is a religious guy, but he doesn't really pull off the economic populism and the overarching narrative about American exceptionalism and the anti-Obama dogwhistling and barnstorming that we've seen from Newt this week. Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
I'm sure he'll do great in the Virginia primary.
Ha, ha. That is a good point though: Newt has a crappy organization working for him, it seems.
I don't think he really expected to win at first. He was just half-assing it for the publicity. Of course, since the ABM voters are now coalescing around him, NOW he sees a chance to win. Too bad his organization stinks something fierce.
I think you're powerfully underestimating Newt's ego.
Earguy:Smelly McUgly: Ha, ha. That is a good point though: Newt has a crappy organization working for him, it seems.
I don't think he really expected to win at first. He was just half-assing it for the publicity. Of course, since the ABM voters are now coalescing around him, NOW he sees a chance to win. Too bad his organization stinks something fierce.
People were writing Newt off months ago when his entire staff walked out on him.
I'd just like to state for the record that in December when he dipped in the polls everywhere, I was predicting a Newt comeback.
bobbette:that bosnian sniper: bobbette: Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
Were you watching the same coverage and debates I was? After New Hampshire his campaign strategy has been around being a huge sack of shiat. And unsurprisingly, you end up with tonight.
Well, I meant on a personal level. I would characterize Newt's campaign as more of a pyroclastic sh*tflow emanating from Newt's mouth.
Pyroclastic Sh*tflow is the new name for my Journey cover band.
serpent_sky:He scares me more than any of them. He is chomping at the bit to go to war with Iran, and wants to eliminate ANYONE he doesn't agree with from the government. If he actually gets the nomination, I'll volunteer for Obama's campaign.
Our country could NOT survive him.
I'm not a betting person, but I would put money down that a significant portion of the Republican establishment would work to torpedo their own nominee it came to that. Newt will never be president.
Oh Limbaugh is riding Gingrich straight to victory.
Really? So Rush has been undermining Romney?
Don't believe that hype. Rush will support whoever is running against Obama - even if it is Romney. Of course, he'll complain about it like he did when "supporting" McCain, but still ABO.
bobbette:Rachel Maddow just called this "Really awesome to cover!!"
Am I living on the same planet?
As a die hard democrat, she's eating up this knock-down drag out fight between Republicans... to say nothing of the fact that neither Romney nor Newt stand a snowballs chance in hell against Obama... I mean, Huntsman could have won, but he was pretty much the only sane one of the bunch.
Karma Curmudgeon:serpent_sky: He scares me more than any of them. He is chomping at the bit to go to war with Iran, and wants to eliminate ANYONE he doesn't agree with from the government. If he actually gets the nomination, I'll volunteer for Obama's campaign.
Our country could NOT survive him.
I'm not a betting person, but I would put money down that a significant portion of the Republican establishment would work to torpedo their own nominee it came to that. Newt will never be president.
bobbette:Smelly McUgly: bobbette: Bucky Katt: bobbette: serpent_sky: Also, how the hell did evangelicals (according to CNN) vote for him, overwhelmingly, and not Santorum? Not that I like Santorum in the slightest, but you'd think they would vote for one of their own rather than the open marriage wanting, cheating, on his third marriage Gingrich.... Are they even paying attention?
Santorum is a religious guy, but he doesn't really pull off the economic populism and the overarching narrative about American exceptionalism and the anti-Obama dogwhistling and barnstorming that we've seen from Newt this week. Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
I'm sure he'll do great in the Virginia primary.
Ha, ha. That is a good point though: Newt has a crappy organization working for him, it seems.
I don't think he really expected to win at first. He was just half-assing it for the publicity. Of course, since the ABM voters are now coalescing around him, NOW he sees a chance to win. Too bad his organization stinks something fierce.
I think you're powerfully underestimating Newt's ego.
Well, I hope that I'm notnot. I have seen his little doodles about his vision for himself as a shaper of civilization.
I do think, however, that he really was just in this for the minor ego boost of rattling Romney's chain, and now that he's legitimately (for now) in a position to challenge for the nomination I think that he's now on a major ego trip. This explains why he gets continually more spittle-flecked in each debate/campaign stop.
that bosnian sniper:Delay: Romney needs to outspend Gingrich by 3:1. Florida should be interesting.
Well, last I checked in on the GOP candidates' campaign coffers, Newt was finally running in the black again and Romney had broken $80M.
True, but I don't think he planned on spending so much of it to compete with Gingrich for the primary. Newt's Super Pac still has $3.2 million, at least. Suppose he goes all in for FL, Romney would need to pony up $10 million for parity in the state.
phalamir:tom servo bit me: eraser8: If they call themselves Catholic, by what standard do you declare them not Catholic?
Keep in mind that when I made my comment, I was NOT judging a church's Catholicism by its communion with the Roman pope.
Eh, I don't know. I know the Church of England likes to call itself Catholic, too. For me, "Catholic" always equaled "good with the Pope." I guess it's all those years of Catholic grade school. As I mentioned above, I'm not even practicing anymore; I think I just find it a lot more interesting seeing the intersection of political history with cultural and spiritual folkways. This, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with the conversation at hand, but whatever.
Catholic itself just means universal - if a church considers itself that, it can use the term (ain't like it is copyrighted/trademarked). If you are talking of church organization, Catholic (West) and Orthodox (East) can get kinda iffy, since some churches that are theologically similar to one can, in some cases, align with the other - most commonly along the Levant, where some churches who are theologically Orthodox joined with the Catholic Church for various reasons, negotiating to keep their Orthodox theology in exchange for saying the Pope is Da Man. Furthermore, despite both sides acting as if they are as diametrically opposed as matter and antimatter, Protestants and Catholics are so much more theologically similar than either is to the Orthodox or the Oriental Churches, that calling a Protestant church "Catholic" is actually a pretty accurate description of their theological position.
To be sure, the simplest way to describe "in communion with the Pope" is "Roman Catholic". In fact, the Nicene Creed, where it describes the Church uses small-c catholic: "We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic church" (in the new translation with new punctuation: "I believe in one, holy, catholic and apostolic church", the commas placing strong emphasis on the oneness of the Church).
Earguy:Smelly McUgly: Ha, ha. That is a good point though: Newt has a crappy organization working for him, it seems.
I don't think he really expected to win at first. He was just half-assing it for the publicity. Of course, since the ABM voters are now coalescing around him, NOW he sees a chance to win. Too bad his organization stinks something fierce.
People were writing Newt off months ago when his entire staff walked out on him.
I'm still writing him off. It is going to be Romney it always was going to be Romney.
Karma Curmudgeon:serpent_sky: He scares me more than any of them. He is chomping at the bit to go to war with Iran, and wants to eliminate ANYONE he doesn't agree with from the government. If he actually gets the nomination, I'll volunteer for Obama's campaign.
Our country could NOT survive him.
I'm not a betting person, but I would put money down that a significant portion of the Republican establishment would work to torpedo their own nominee it came to that. Newt will never be president.
YoungSwedishBlonde:bobbette: that bosnian sniper: bobbette: Newt had a really good week, even with the ex-wife thing, and he has done a surprisingly good job of minimizing the fact that he's a huge sack of sh*t.
Were you watching the same coverage and debates I was? After New Hampshire his campaign strategy has been around being a huge sack of shiat. And unsurprisingly, you end up with tonight.
Well, I meant on a personal level. I would characterize Newt's campaign as more of a pyroclastic sh*tflow emanating from Newt's mouth.
Pyroclastic Sh*tflow is the new name for my Journey cover band.
Delay:that bosnian sniper: Delay: Romney needs to outspend Gingrich by 3:1. Florida should be interesting.
Well, last I checked in on the GOP candidates' campaign coffers, Newt was finally running in the black again and Romney had broken $80M.
True, but I don't think he planned on spending so much of it to compete with Gingrich for the primary. Newt's Super Pac still has $3.2 million, at least. Suppose he goes all in for FL, Romney would need to pony up $10 million for parity in the state.
Romney is Meg Whitman all over again.
Even if Romney spent $10 million in FL he'd still have $240 million of his personal money to spend.
bobbette:rynthetyn: bobbette: rynthetyn: Normally, I'm able to make a pretty good guess for how Florida's going to go, but this year I don't have a clue. Most of the people I know are backing Romney, but they're also what I'd consider to be GOP establishment, and we already know the establishment wants Romney. There doesn't seem to be a lot of love for Newt, but then again I don't have a lot of connections to the batshiat insane tea party crowd so I might just be missing that segment of the voters. The religious right keep saying favorable things about Santorum, but when push comes to shove, most of them fall in line behind electability.
I think I'm tentatively going to predict Romney winning Florida, but I feel a heck of a lot less certain about that than I did even a week ago.
CNN looked at the exit polls, Tea Partiers are responding bigtime to the idea that Romney is a big money capitalist and tax cheat.
I expect Newt positions himself as a populist and keeps going after Bain. He's finally found a really powerful angle against Romney. Newt will sell himself as the man of the people; tonight, he's bashing the elites and the news media as I'm typing. That's going to work for him.
Hmm, if it is the tea party that's falling in line behind Newt, then Florida is probably going to end up a battle of voter turnout. And that comes down to whether the establishment learned their lesson from staying home in the primary for the governor's race, thus letting the tea party pick Voldemort's more evil twin as the nominee.
In other words, it's still a tossup.
Interesting analysis. If it's turnout you'd think Romney would have an advantage, because he's got the ground organization and more money, but Romney also has negative momentum and I don't think he's a really inspirational figure that people turn out for with great enthusiasm.
The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it.
Obama and Gingrich have a lot in common. Both had to resign elected office. Obama resigned his Senate seat because he liked the Oval office; Gingrich had to resign as Speaker of the House because he liked the Oral orifice.
/the above joke is Copyright 2012 TheShavingofOccam123. All rights reserved.
DarnoKonrad:Karma Curmudgeon: serpent_sky: He scares me more than any of them. He is chomping at the bit to go to war with Iran, and wants to eliminate ANYONE he doesn't agree with from the government. If he actually gets the nomination, I'll volunteer for Obama's campaign.
Our country could NOT survive him.
I'm not a betting person, but I would put money down that a significant portion of the Republican establishment would work to torpedo their own nominee it came to that. Newt will never be president.
Well they need to work harder.
If this turns out to be an actual fight for the nomination, and thats still a big if given Newts lack of money and organization compared to Romney, we're about 1 minute into the first round. If he's still hanging around in March, that's when the knives will really start coming out.
firefly212:bobbette: Rachel Maddow just called this "Really awesome to cover!!"
Am I living on the same planet?
As a die hard democrat, she's eating up this knock-down drag out fight between Republicans... to say nothing of the fact that neither Romney nor Newt stand a snowballs chance in hell against Obama... I mean, Huntsman could have won, but he was pretty much the only sane one of the bunch.
1. Huntsman was MEDIOCRE. Please stop buying into the Huntsman hype. He's like an even less charismatic Romney with an irrepressible hard-on for China that made proponents of American exceptionalism deeply uncomfortable.
2. I totally understand the idea that the Republicans are destroying each other... unless they don't, which is a possibility. I also don't think Rachel Maddow is a die-hard Democrat, although she does suck up to them more than enough. She belongs to the section of the American left that quickly gets disenchanted with "the system".
3. On a certain level I enjoy any knock-down, drag-out primary fight, but calling them "really awesome!!" is... come on, RM, you're on the TV, don't talk like you're me telling everyone about a band I saw last Thursday. (Love you though, marry me it's legal in Canada)
4. I think it's possible for a Republican to win this thing. Unlikely, but possible. It would be stupid to underestimate what you can do with a well run campaign in a time of economic uncertainty.
I'm calling a sixth district for Gingrich and leaving the seventh one for the pros. Already called CD 3-7.
CD1: 100% reporting, but some margin of error because of county breakdown. Gingrich leads 35.7-35.5. Not calling this one tonight. CD2: 98% reporting. Gingrich wins 40-31.
Delegate count for today: Gingrich 23, 2 left to distribute.
Total committed: Gingrich 23, Romney 7, Paul 3, Huntsman 2 Superdelegates: Superdelegates (according to Frontloading): Romney 15, Gingrich 1, Santorum 1 GRAND TOTAL: Gingrich 24, Romney 22, Paul 3, Santorum 1
The only silver lining for Romney is that this will give him the chance to strengthen his candidacy within a hostile environment, and make the worst attacks against him old news if he becomes the nominee. That's the only silver lining I can think of.
Another great silver lining is that I'm going to enjoy just watching Gingrich implode. He will not be able to contain himself and his sense of history, and it's going to be great political theater. I believed the GOP was desperate enough by way of their tactics against Obama, and with all the advantages he has had going his way, I'm feeling really confident about an Obama re-election, and will gratefully anticipate the karmic justice of it when it happens. I hope the right-wing GOP gets annihilated in the general, and they exorcise their social-conservative demons.
rynthetyn:The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it.
I wouldn't be all that surprised if the GOP establishment starts leaking dirt on Newt if he looks like he might get actually have a chance at the nomination.
abustedwatch:The only silver lining for Romney is that this will give him the chance to strengthen his candidacy within a hostile environment, and make the worst attacks against him old news if he becomes the nominee. That's the only silver lining I can think of.
Another great silver lining is that I'm going to enjoy just watching Gingrich implode. He will not be able to contain himself and his sense of history, and it's going to be great political theater. I believed the GOP was desperate enough by way of their tactics against Obama, and with all the advantages he has had going his way, I'm feeling really confident about an Obama re-election, and will gratefully anticipate the karmic justice of it when it happens. I hope the right-wing GOP gets annihilated in the general, and they exorcise their social-conservative demons.
I think many Republicans just wanted a fat old Southern cracker to put that uppity Negro in his place. Then there's Republicans like me who will vote for Obama after watching comedy gold.
abustedwatch:I hope the right-wing GOP gets annihilated in the general, and they exorcise their social-conservative demons.
That's pretty much what the GOP powers that be are banking on. One final effort to tank themselves in the general so they can foist the blame off on the tea party, get their base back in the cage where they're supposed to be, get the paleocons bankrolling the tea party back in the shadows where they belong, and rebrand themselves for the 21st Century.
rynthetyn: The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it. .
What I think is really interesting is that Gingrich already had that front-runner status, dropped off in the face of Romney's attacks, and came back. I think in South Carolina, he definitely had people wanting to vote for him, who were specifically responding to his charisma and his dead-on populist messaging. So it will be interesting and I think he will be likely to continue to mobilize that constituency. He also made a play for both Rick Santorum and Ron Paul's supporters tonight. But, we shall see. If Mitt can find a better way of defending himself on the Bain issue, a way that makes him look less on the defensive, this race will look very different.
Oh, and by the way, I'm glad you're a Tfette again!
that bosnian sniper:rynthetyn: The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it.
...stop and think about it?
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
...and you expect them to stop and think?
But this is South Carolina, they were never going to vote for a Mormon and Newt was the option that peaked at the right time. Florida voters are a whole different ball of wax with their own mix of crazy.
rynthetyn:I wouldn't be all that surprised if the GOP establishment starts leaking dirt on Newt if he looks like he might get actually have a chance at the nomination.
What dirt could they possibly still be holding back? We know he's a lying scumbag filled with Santorum, kicked out of the house, ethics fine of over 300,000$, cheating on all his wives, slimy dirtball.
This day in history. Newt-style. A redemption song.
1924: Russian revolutionary Vladimir Lenin died at age 53.
1937: Count Basie and his band recorded One O'Clock Jump for Decca Records (on this date in 1942, they re-recorded the song for Okeh Records).
1950: Former State Department official Alger Hiss, accused of being part of a Communist spy ring, was found guilty in New York of lying to a grand jury. (Hiss, who proclaimed his innocence, served less than four years in prison.) George Orwell (Eric Blair), author of "Nineteen Eighty-Four," died in London at age 46.
1954: The first atomic submarine, the USS Nautilus, was launched at Groton, Connecticut. (However, the Nautilus did not make its first nuclear-powered run until nearly a year later.)
1968: The Battle of Khe Sanh began during the Vietnam War as North Vietnamese forces attacked a US Marine base; the Americans were able to hold their position until the siege was lifted. An American B-52 bomber carrying four hydrogen bombs crashed in Greenland, killing one crew member and scattering radioactive material.
1977: President Jimmy Carter pardoned almost all Vietnam War draft evaders.
1982: Convict-turned-author Jack Henry Abbott was found guilty in New York of first-degree manslaughter in the stabbing death of waiter Richard Adan in 1981. (Abbott was later sentenced to 15 years to life in prison; he committed suicide in 2002.)
1997: Speaker Newt Gingrich was reprimanded and fined as the House voted for the first time in history to discipline its leader for ethical misconduct.
RminusQ:I'm calling a sixth district for Gingrich and leaving the seventh one for the pros. Already called CD 3-7.
CD1: 100% reporting, but some margin of error because of county breakdown. Gingrich leads 35.7-35.5. Not calling this one tonight. CD2: 98% reporting. Gingrich wins 40-31.
Delegate count for today: Gingrich 23, 2 left to distribute.
Total committed: Gingrich 23, Romney 7, Paul 3, Huntsman 2 Superdelegates: Superdelegates (according to Frontloading): Romney 15, Gingrich 1, Santorum 1 GRAND TOTAL: Gingrich 24, Romney 22, Paul 3, Santorum 1
Mmm, I'm going to have to start up a spreadsheet for delegates soon.
So sad that 538 is all New York Times-owned now. Nate Silver, you used to save me so much effort. You used to be cool and now I'm going to have to make my own models, jerkass.
turbidum:bugontherug: I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
You were wrong, because conservatives had already had their say by choosing Santorum in Iowa (though it had been called for Mitt at that point).
I was right, because when faced with a truly conservative state, Newt won decisively, and Mittens lost decisively.
Also, everyone else was basing their position on facts (i.e. Mitt Romney has won two primaries so far)
First, Santorum won Iowa, not Mittens. Second, did I mention that when faced with a truly conservative state, Newt decisively won, and Mittens decisively lost?
while you were basing your position on a desire to see not-Mitt chosen as the nominee.
Nuttery. I've all but endorsed Mittens for the Republican nomination. He's the most sane of the Republican field, will likely work with Democratic members of Congress, and will appoint moderate Supreme Court Justices. Generally, he'll probably continue a good portion of Obama's policies.
I can see that when objective reality vindicates someone you disagree with--as it did me tonight--it makes you so irrationally angry that you say indefensible things. But for real, calm down. It's only Fark.
rynthetyn:that bosnian sniper: rynthetyn: The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it.
...stop and think about it?
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
...and you expect them to stop and think?
But this is South Carolina, they were never going to vote for a Mormon and Newt was the option that peaked at the right time. Florida voters are a whole different ball of wax with their own mix of crazy.
bobbette:firefly212: bobbette: Rachel Maddow just called this "Really awesome to cover!!"
Am I living on the same planet?
As a die hard democrat, she's eating up this knock-down drag out fight between Republicans... to say nothing of the fact that neither Romney nor Newt stand a snowballs chance in hell against Obama... I mean, Huntsman could have won, but he was pretty much the only sane one of the bunch.
1. Huntsman was MEDIOCRE. Please stop buying into the Huntsman hype. He's like an even less charismatic Romney with an irrepressible hard-on for China that made proponents of American exceptionalism deeply uncomfortable.
2. I totally understand the idea that the Republicans are destroying each other... unless they don't, which is a possibility. I also don't think Rachel Maddow is a die-hard Democrat, although she does suck up to them more than enough. She belongs to the section of the American left that quickly gets disenchanted with "the system".
3. On a certain level I enjoy any knock-down, drag-out primary fight, but calling them "really awesome!!" is... come on, RM, you're on the TV, don't talk like you're me telling everyone about a band I saw last Thursday. (Love you though, marry me it's legal in Canada)
4. I think it's possible for a Republican to win this thing. Unlikely, but possible. It would be stupid to underestimate what you can do with a well run campaign in a time of economic uncertainty.
1.The thing about exceptionalism is that in the course of things, there aren't exceptions, we aren't the great empire that's not going to fall. I think what you're describing is more about how idiots perceive pragmatism as a lack of ideals.
2. I don't see how they can do anything but destroy eachother, given the tone their ads have taken on... Newt is hammering hard at Romney's make believe job creation record, Romney is (ironically) bashing Newt's inconsistency. The only one that wins in the battle of Newt v. Mitt is the guy not participating.
3. I love Maddow too, but as a news junkie, I'm sure she's excited. I'm also happy she isn't one of the faux-objective journalists who pretends they don't have a horse in the race.
4. I don't rule out the current crop because they're Republicans, I ruled them out because they're idiots. There are plenty of intelligent, common-sense conservatives out there who could really pull a great deal of the middle by focusing on a disciplined economic plan... unfortunately for the Republicans, they aren't running. Seriously, if Newt gets the nod, how many times are we going to have to hear about him leaving congress under a cloud of ethics charges, how many times are we going to play back to back him talking about cleaning up politics and him denying that he did any lobbying for the millions he collected from Fannie/Freddie, how many times are we going to have to hear about him being pissed off to the point of trying to shut down the government because he didn't like his seat on Air Force 1? Getting him elected is about as likely as holding a successful pro-cancer rally. I won't say it's impossible, but I'll say that given his own support of individual mandates and chronic mooching off of the government, combined with philandering, half million dollar credit lines at jewelry places, and all the rest, their odds of winning are such an extreme longshot that they're probably about on par with an asteroid disrupting election day.
bobbette:rynthetyn: that bosnian sniper: rynthetyn: The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it.
...stop and think about it?
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
...and you expect them to stop and think?
But this is South Carolina, they were never going to vote for a Mormon and Newt was the option that peaked at the right time. Florida voters are a whole different ball of wax with their own mix of crazy.
Good point, I'm going to be really interested to see the next polls out of Florida. They all have Mitt in the lead right now, but they're 3-4 days old.
Florida is a lot more urban and politically moderate compared to SC though so it might be a good place for Romney to play catch up.
bobbette:rynthetyn: The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it. .
What I think is really interesting is that Gingrich already had that front-runner status, dropped off in the face of Romney's attacks, and came back. I think in South Carolina, he definitely had people wanting to vote for him, who were specifically responding to his charisma and his dead-on populist messaging. So it will be interesting and I think he will be likely to continue to mobilize that constituency. He also made a play for both Rick Santorum and Ron Paul's supporters tonight. But, we shall see. If Mitt can find a better way of defending himself on the Bain issue, a way that makes him look less on the defensive, this race will look very different.
Oh, and by the way, I'm glad you're a Tfette again!
It looks like I need to sit down and start pouring over the exit polling data then, I was out at a basketball game instead of giving South Carolina my full attention. I'd been writing Newt off because I don't know anyone who actually likes him, but maybe that's been a mistake.
I don't know if having TF again is going to be good for my law school grades...
Seriously, did you think we'd all forget that you admitted you were so sad that Clinton didn't chat with you on the way to a farking funeral that you changed your legislation.
rynthetyn:It looks like I need to sit down and start pouring over the exit polling data then, I was out at a basketball game instead of giving South Carolina my full attention. I'd been writing Newt off because I don't know anyone who actually likes him, but maybe that's been a mistake.
I'm probably in the minority on this right now, but I think Gingrich, unfortunately, will be the GOP nominee. I think a lot of Newt's electability problem was solved tonight. Just by winning by such a decisive margin, he's shown he can connect with voters. He also appeals to conservatives for all the reasons Romney doesn't. Say what you will about the man, but there is no doubt he's a red blooded conservative. If Romney is a conservative at all, he's about as blue blooded as they come.
Mrtraveler01:Florida is a lot more urban and politically moderate compared to SC though so it might be a good place for Romney to play catch up.
I was about to mention the Florida polling results, got caught up trying to find a more recent poll than 1/18 (that wasn't on RCP).
As I've see it right now, you have two groups of GOP voters: the ones with brains, and the ABM crowd. Looks like Gingrich is shoring up the ABM vote, so in Florida it's just a matter of which subgroup turns out in higher numbers. If Gingrich starts eating Santorum's lunch too, or Santorum sucks it up to withdraw and endorse Gingrich, it could be a real race in which RON PAUL just might actually be a spoiler.
As it is, as long as the ABM vote is split between Gingrich and Frothy, Romney's still sucking front teat. Hell, going by that aggregate up there, Gingrich plus Santorum plus Perry is just enough to make it an actual race.
Mrtraveler01:bobbette: rynthetyn: that bosnian sniper: rynthetyn: The lack of enthusiasm really is Romney's major weakness. I think we're going to have to wait and see whether Gingrich gets a nexus of support that's wanting to vote for him or whether he's just the latest not-Romney candidate to peak and that momentum is going to fade when people stop and thing about it.
...stop and think about it?
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
They voted for Newt Gingrich.
...and you expect them to stop and think?
But this is South Carolina, they were never going to vote for a Mormon and Newt was the option that peaked at the right time. Florida voters are a whole different ball of wax with their own mix of crazy.
Good point, I'm going to be really interested to see the next polls out of Florida. They all have Mitt in the lead right now, but they're 3-4 days old.
Florida is a lot more urban and politically moderate compared to SC though so it might be a good place for Romney to play catch up.
Part of Florida is more urban and politically moderate, the other part is just as much part of the South as South Carolina is. It's what makes the state so hard to read because elections in the state turn on which half decides to vote in larger numbers in that particular election.
/Sadly, I'm currently stuck in the half that's part of the South
bobbette:Mmm, I'm going to have to start up a spreadsheet for delegates soon.
I had a really sweet one for 2008. I've sort of adapted it for 2012, but not fully because: (1) Democrats aren't holding a race (2) I have an actual job and thus not nearly as much dick-around-in-Excel time as this time in 2008 (3) Republicans have very loose/shady/unannounced rules for delegation allocation.
I mean, Florida is 4th and it's WTA, and then after that is Nevada on Feb 4. They're awarding 28 delegates statewide proportionally. How do they round? What's the cutoff? Who farking knows! Then there are dog-and-pony shows in Colorado and Minnesota, which hold as much actual weight in delegate allocation as Iowa did, namely ZERO. Dems were nice: exact same cutoff and rounding rules in every state/area, so I could set up my spreadsheet nice and neat. Even when results weren't final, in caucus states like Iowa, I could get a preliminary total, then a total after county conventions, and so on.
BTW, interesting news: since there are pending court challenges over the new South Carolina congressional district map, apparently the delegate count from tonight is even more unofficial. So sayeth my primary (hahaha) source for delegate rules, The Green Papers (new window)
/Note: The guy who writes The Green Papers loves only one more thing than arcane rules about government, and that is the look of his own words on a computer screen. He literally got a letter-to-the-editor asking "Why can't you ever get to the point?" one time, and his response went on for farking pages.
AcneVulgaris:Proof that the republicans prefer backseat biatching to leading. Why else would they choose somebody that will obviously lose?
Obama will wipe the floor with that POS.
Yea but what if he doesn't?
I would rather have Romney with a fair chance of winning than newt with a very small chance. At least Romney wouldn't drive America into another recession. Newt is only interested in bettering himself.
He got a huge boost after the last debate for refusing to answer a question about asking his 2nd wife for an open marriage. Just after she was diagnosed with MS and leaving her for the 3rd when she said no. He was like I'm not even going to justify that question with an answer and acted offended.
IronTom:Read it again. I don't like the situation, not saying that if they stopped buying vices and expensive food that they would be self sufficient. I just say I don't like to pay for their food stamps if they can afford cigarettes and drugs, or really at all.
You seem pretty convinced that most or all of the 30 million Americans getting welfare assistance are drug abusers.
Do you have data to support this, or do you always assume the worst of poor people?
That's not Callista Bisek on the left. That's just some random staffer. It's of course possible that she was working his staff as well, but he didn't marry her.
Lando Lincoln:Don't Troll Me Bro!: Bucky Katt: Rick Perry's endorcement sure paid off!
/isn't 45 minutes after the polls close a little early to call an election? Just askin.
ABC called it before any of the results came in, which is absurd, but apparently this time it won't come back to haunt them.
They do that if the exit polls are significantly favoriting one candidate. Looks like they are. Exit polls almost always match the actual vote count. If they don't, then that's usually a good indicator that votes have been tampered with.
Didn't exit polling show John Kerry the winner in 2004?
Wait, so Santorum got the Iowa delegates after all? I was under the impression (NBC News) that there was no provision for re-counts. They said that Romney would be the winner of Iowa no matter what.
A bit of history so to clear up why the segregationist, bible beating, planter worshiping Southern Dem's of the `60's arrived, at Nixon's insistence, in the early `70's, as stanch Repubs. Slightly reformed, I suppose, but evenings like this I have to wonder:
In February, 1968, Wallace announced his intention of standing as an independent candidate for president. His hostility to civil rights legislation won him support from white voters in the Deep South and won Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama and Georgia. Although he won over 9 million votes he came third to Richard Nixon ( 31,770,237) and Hubert Humphrey (31,270,533).
Nixon was concerned that Wallace would stand as a third party candidate in the next election. Nixon's initial strategy was to destroy Wallace's power base in Alabama. This included providing $400,000 to try and help Albert Brewer defeat Wallace as governor. This strategy failed and in 1970 Wallace won a landslide victory for a second term as governor of Alabama.
This failed and Richard Nixon had to change his strategy to one of blackmail. With the help of Murray Chotiner, Nixon discovered details of Wallace's corrupt activities in Alabama. In July 1969, Nixon pressurized the IRS into forming the Special Services Staff (SSS). The role of the SSS was to target Nixon's political enemies. By 1970 the SSS had compiled a list of 4,000 individuals. Most of this list were on the left. However, Nixon now added Wallace and several of his aides to this list. This included George's brother, Gerald Wallace, who had indeed made a fortune from his business activities. This included a $2.9 million contract for asphalt that went to Gerald's company even though he charged a $2.50 per ton over the going price. By August 1970, the SSS had 75 people working on what was known as the "Alabama Project".
To show that Nixon meant business, one of Wallace's closest aides, Seymore Trammell, was sent to prison for 4 years for corruption. Nixon then used Winston Blount, his Postmaster General, to begin negotiations with Wallace. A deal was eventually struck with Wallace. In return for calling off the SSS Wallace made a statement that he would not become a third party candidate. On 12th January, 1972, Attorney General John N. Mitchell announced he was not going to prosecute Gerald Wallace. The following day Wallace gave a press conference where he announced he would not be a third party candidate.
PsyLord:This only tells me that South Carolinans (sp?) would rather have a wealthy, Catholic Republican nominee that has multiple ethics and moral problems than a wealthy, Mormon Republican nominee that has some business ethics problems.
Thank you for this.
(I thank you (even my cat thanks you (her fleas thank you (even her intestinal parasites (just like Newt!) thank you))))
kimwim:rynthetyn: I wouldn't be all that surprised if the GOP establishment starts leaking dirt on Newt if he looks like he might get actually have a chance at the nomination.
What dirt could they possibly still be holding back? We know he's a lying scumbag filled with Santorum, kicked out of the house, ethics fine of over 300,000$, cheating on all his wives, slimy dirtball.
What could they possibly have on him?
It doesn't even have to be anything new. A constant drumbeat from multiple sources providing refocused reminders of how bad he was for Republicans as speaker, quitting Congress the day after winning an election to it, his role as not -a-lobbyist for Fannie Mae; it's a target rich environment. Essentially the same strategy that brought him down in Iowa.
bobbette:Good point, I'm going to be really interested to see the next polls out of Florida. They all have Mitt in the lead right now, but they're 3-4 days old.
The other thing, I heard this morning, is that 30% of the expected turnout has already voted absentee in FL. That probably benefits Romney, and limits any bounce Newt can get out of SC.
I would still have said that Romney would be the nominee if he had just lost South Carolina, but he got stomped. Absolutely destroyed. There's a difference. Newt could pull this off.
Of course, neither has can beat Obama, so this is all just academic.
Guys, I've been talking about the coming GOP party civil war. What you saw tonight was the crystallization that it has begun.
The DC establishment will not let Gingrich take the nomination. But they don't have the normal "fall" candidates to siphon off votes from the base as they usually do. There is going to be no way for them to say "well, it was a long fair fight, time to coalesce around our nominee." They're going to have to torpedo Gingrich in the open, without the normal curtain to hide behind.
You really think the Teaparty and the religious base is going to allow that to happen and go along with it? Let DC kill their candidate?
get the popcorn, it's looking like a brokered convention and full out civil war!
Freakman:I would still have said that Romney would be the nominee if he had just lost South Carolina, but he got stomped. Absolutely destroyed. There's a difference. Newt could pull this off.
Of course, neither has can beat Obama, so this is all just academic.
I'd prefer he (Newt) be the nominee. It would turn a win into a landslide for Obama.
RminusQ:bobbette: Mmm, I'm going to have to start up a spreadsheet for delegates soon.
I had a really sweet one for 2008. I've sort of adapted it for 2012, but not fully because: (1) Democrats aren't holding a race (2) I have an actual job and thus not nearly as much dick-around-in-Excel time as this time in 2008 (3) Republicans have very loose/shady/unannounced rules for delegation allocation.
I mean, Florida is 4th and it's WTA, and then after that is Nevada on Feb 4. They're awarding 28 delegates statewide proportionally. How do they round? What's the cutoff? Who farking knows! Then there are dog-and-pony shows in Colorado and Minnesota, which hold as much actual weight in delegate allocation as Iowa did, namely ZERO. Dems were nice: exact same cutoff and rounding rules in every state/area, so I could set up my spreadsheet nice and neat. Even when results weren't final, in caucus states like Iowa, I could get a preliminary total, then a total after county conventions, and so on.
BTW, interesting news: since there are pending court challenges over the new South Carolina congressional district map, apparently the delegate count from tonight is even more unofficial. So sayeth my primary (hahaha) source for delegate rules, The Green Papers (new window)
/Note: The guy who writes The Green Papers loves only one more thing than arcane rules about government, and that is the look of his own words on a computer screen. He literally got a letter-to-the-editor asking "Why can't you ever get to the point?" one time, and his response went on for farking pages.
That really is frustrating. I mean certainly it will mess with any predictive potential. However... a crappy spreadsheet is still better than none...
Thanks for the link to The Green Papers, that's wonderful. God I love nerds.
bugontherug:I remember after New Hampshire, I posted to the effect that "conservatives have not yet had their say." And everyone was like "Romney's totally gonna win for sure, you're delusional."
For the first time tonight, conservatives had their say in this nomination process. It's clear they don't like the Republican Washington inside liberal elite's hand picked candidate, and prefer an actual conservative instead.
Romney is still going to be the candidate. Unfortunately for Newt, not every state is South Carolina. I think Romney goes Nuclear Option on Gingrich in Florida and all but buries him. Sure, Newt will stick around but Romney realizes that he needs to win decisively and will pull out the stops and make a stand in Florida. He's got the money to do it.
Romney may be rich but he ain't as rich as Sheldon Adelson or folks like him. With his win in SC I don't think Newt will have anymore financial difficulties going forward in the primaries.
The other thing, I heard this morning, is that 30% of the expected turnout has already voted absentee in FL. That probably benefits Romney, and limits any bounce Newt can get out of SC.
On the other hand though, Newt won SC because he overwhelmingly picked up the people who were still undecided until the last few days. Assuming that the early voters are people who wouldn't have been swayed one way or the other, and that a good percentage of the people who haven't voted yet haven't done so because they're still undecided, if they break as heavily for Newt as they did in SC, Newt could still win it.
What kind of person would take time out of their day to go out and cast a vote for this guy??? or Santorum?? I just don't get it. :( People are messed up.
The electile dysfunction in the republican primary signs a lack of arousal in the electorate stemming from the ongoing identity crisis brought on by a refusal to accept responsibility for the failings of the Bush maladministration and the resultant economic crisis which, for all indicators the sitting president is doing a fine job of repairing.
The GOP can't figure out if its a small tent party, a big tent party, or a three ring circus.
Expect the bootstrappy Ging-GRINCH (its the poors fault that they're poor) to win Florida for his loosened immigration views.
The millionaire cultist has already tough talked his way to defeat in Florida and some Mitt-flopping will be the menu as he tries to salvage his campaign before the second coming of the KNOCKOUT punch in the evangelical stronghold of the deep south.
FTFA: Many Florida residents have already cast their vote in a state where a large percentage of primarygoers either vote early or by absentee ballot. According to the state GOP, about 200,000 votes are already counted and more than 470,000 absentee ballots have been requested overall. Total turnout is expected to crack 2 million. That means it's possible a significant chunk of the electorate cast their vote before Gingrich's out-of-nowhere surge, when Romney was leading the state by a huge margin in polls.
Hickory-smoked:IronTom: Read it again. I don't like the situation, not saying that if they stopped buying vices and expensive food that they would be self sufficient. I just say I don't like to pay for their food stamps if they can afford cigarettes and drugs, or really at all.
You seem pretty convinced that most or all of the 30 million Americans getting welfare assistance are drug abusers.
Do you have data to support this, or do you always assume the worst of poor people?
Romney is still going to be the candidate. Unfortunately for Newt, not every state is South Carolina. I think Romney goes Nuclear Option on Gingrich in Florida and all but buries him. Sure, Newt will stick around but Romney realizes that he needs to win decisively and will pull out the stops and make a stand in Florida. He's got the money to do it.
Romney may be rich but he ain't as rich as Sheldon Adelson or folks like him. With his win in SC I don't think Newt will have anymore financial difficulties going forward in the primaries.
Quite likely, but that doesn't do anything to improve Newt's likability outside of the south. Newt will stick around and fight it out for a time, but my guess is that it's Romney in the end.
TyrantII:Guys, I've been talking about the coming GOP party civil war. What you saw tonight was the crystallization that it has begun.
The DC establishment will not let Gingrich take the nomination. But they don't have the normal "fall" candidates to siphon off votes from the base as they usually do. There is going to be no way for them to say "well, it was a long fair fight, time to coalesce around our nominee." They're going to have to torpedo Gingrich in the open, without the normal curtain to hide behind.
You really think the Teaparty and the religious base is going to allow that to happen and go along with it? Let DC kill their candidate?
get the popcorn, it's looking like a brokered convention and full out civil war!
Democrats better react for maximum advantage. 2012 is sounding good
Vodka Zombie:That's going to drive him batshiat insane.
Well, considering his poll surge after going psychologically Fukushima after Iowa and New Hampshire, that may not be a necessarily bad thing. I fully expect him in the Florida debates to start screaming the N-word on stage while throwing his own feces at the moderator with one hand and Santorum's with the other. And he'll pick up twenty points for it.
Nate Silver is still projecting Romney to take the state by a fairly large margin. However most polls were taken before Thursday's debate and that was a big turning point for Newt. So Newt's going to shoot up in the polls but nobody knows how far. I'm hoping for another Santorum surge to really get the bloodbath started but I know that won't happen.
Nate Silver is still projecting Romney to take the state by a fairly large margin. However most polls were taken before Thursday's debate and that was a big turning point for Newt. So Newt's going to shoot up in the polls but nobody knows how far. I'm hoping for another Santorum surge to really get the bloodbath started but I know that won't happen.
Yeah and someone else mentioned that Florida has early voting.
billwill:AcneVulgaris: Proof that the republicans prefer backseat biatching to leading. Why else would they choose somebody that will obviously lose?
Obama will wipe the floor with that POS.
Yea but what if he doesn't?
I would rather have Romney with a fair chance of winning than newt with a very small chance. At least Romney wouldn't drive America into another recession. Newt is only interested in bettering himself.
He got a huge boost after the last debate for refusing to answer a question about asking his 2nd wife for an open marriage. Just after she was diagnosed with MS and leaving her for the 3rd when she said no. He was like I'm not even going to justify that question with an answer and acted offended.
Newt refuses to answer (new window)
Well, it doesn't appear to be up to us, so we'll just have to see what happens. Yay democracy!
Can someone please explain to me how the last debate benefited Gingrich? Because I gotta say, it was a farking train wreck for all of them, to my mind. Except RON PAUL - he actually came across as being the best informed of the lot. Which was frightening.
Earguy:Wait, so Santorum got the Iowa delegates after all? I was under the impression (NBC News) that there was no provision for re-counts. They said that Romney would be the winner of Iowa no matter what.
No delegates get actually awarded in Iowa until April. That's part of the reason that it didn't matter.