And what has the real killer been doing for six years? Sitting on his hands? The detectives handling this case should be treated like the killer's accomplices if he's ever caught.

It's easy... They just keep telling the kid that they have all the evidence they need to convict him, and he's going to get the death penalty if he keeps pleading innocent, but if he pleads guilty or confesses, they'll talk to the DA and make a deal. Of course, they can't make a deal, and wouldn't anyway. But when you're being told that you're going to die, you start grasping at straws.

Coelacanth: And what has the real killer been doing for six years? Sitting on his hands? The detectives handling this case should be treated like the killer's accomplices if he's ever caught.

He may have moved.
To PA, or NH, or any other state with an unsolved dead 10-13 year old girl.

Hey, it could happen! Cameras are complicated little electrophotonbuggers with switches and dials and gizm



SEE!!

Let's keep this thing in perspective. They obviously had some reason to believe he did it--it's not like they'd be questioning him for no reason. And he CONFESSED to it. Why would he confess to a crime he didn't commit? Sheesh, all you wannabe lawyers get really annoying.

namatad: /arent there farking LAWS about not being able to question children without a parent/lawyer being present??

It sounds like his mother waived that right for him:
"Thomas' paternal grandfather, Stephen Harris, with whom he lives, said Thomas' mother should have been considered a suspect and, therefore, not given the authority to allow police to interrogate the boy alone."

GAT_00: Sounds like an episode of Law and Order.

Already a movie about a similar true story.

Jesus saw you do it. And he saw what you do in the bathroom too.

Easy way to fix camera, automatically toss case if it shuts off.
Surprising how those things stop happening.

I'll say it again. Cops should always be recorded while on duty.

12349876: GAT_00: Sounds like an episode of Law and Order.

Already a movie about a similar true story.

[ecx.images-amazon.com image 300x300]

I am taking a forensic psych class and we just covered a unit on interrogations and we discussed these kind of crappy interrogation techniques. Prof showed the real footage of Michael Crowe. It made me tear up and very angry.

My favorite movie when comes to interrogation is the end of Four Brothers. "I don't know what happen to him, I was busy banging your wife."

Police can interrogate a 12 year old for hours on end without a parent or a lawyer involved?

imprimere: I'll say it again. Cops should always be recorded while on duty.

^ THIS. If a cop issues so much as a speeding ticket without a camera on, it should be invalid. And it goes without saying that the footage should be as tamper-proof as possible.

/Probably should have an exception for certain types of undercover work.

Sim Tree: Police will commonly tell suspects that DNA evidence, etc. will find them innocent later. Most people believe in the idea of justice, so they fall for it, since 'justice' will let them free if they are innocent.

Example: "We have the security video from the crime scene. If you confess and plead guilty, you'll look as if you're cooperating and you'll get better treatment while you're here, and a shorter sentence if you're guilty. If the camera shows you are innocent, hey, then you'll get off at trial, and no harm done. And you'll still have gotten the better treatment here, so, bonus!

To many people that sounds win/ win, so they confess.

Of course, at trial, the confession is submitted as factual evidence and 'What security camera footage?'

^ This. My sister's fiancee got caught in that kind of crap on a false rape charge. Bam, sex offender for life.

stuffy: Easy way to fix camera, automatically toss case if it shuts off.

This. Not just for interrogations - it should apply to dash cams and arrests, too.

Shostie: SilentStrider: Love the speed of our justice system. let me tell you.

I'd much rather have a justice system that moves ponderously slow to one that makes snap, knee-jerk decisions.

"OMG, Your right! He was innocent."

*sound of a backhoe*

"Ok boys, dig him up!"

I still wonder about these people who say people wont confess to crimes they dont commit, well keep a person up for 36 hours or just limited sleep and they will say anything just to make it stop.

Its also interesting that now the prosecutors are telling people they have to plead to lesser charges to get out rather than just dropping the charges, no doubt to save them the embarrassment from getting sued. The cops and DAs are pathetic, an asst DA here in the south is a family friend but biatched at me when I said I would never convict anyone of pot possession or intent to distribute, this went on for hours of her telling me how wrong that was, she completely missed the irony that we had gotten stoned in our car before going in to see the band.

Get a conviction thats all that matters, fairness or guilt be damned!

West Memphis 3 redux

steamingpile:
Get a conviction thats all that matters, fairness or guilt be damned!

There isn't a prosecutor in this country that puts justice above convictions. You show me one and I'll show you someone who's lying to you to get re-elected.

namatad: am I under arrest?
am I free to go?
bring me my lawyer

You hear Internet Lawyers with their GED's in Law saying that crap all the time.

In the real world, on the streets, taking that act with a cop will cause a lot more trouble than it's worth.

In the US, there is something called a "Terry Stop", from the SCOTUS case Terry v. Ohio, 392 U.S. 1 (1968) (Link (new window))

In a Terry stop, No you are NOT free to go, you are NOT under arrest, and you do NOT have the right to an attorney. You are only briefly detained, but if the police have "reasonable suspicion" that you are up to something illegal, they can detain you long enough to ask you what is going on and give you a chance to explain yourself. You can be frisked for presence of weapons, and any contraband that is plainly obvious on even a superficial frisk, in a traffic stop this can include glove compartments being searched. Traffic stops are considered a type of "Terry Stop".

That was expanded in the SCOTUS case Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada, 542 U.S. 177 (2004) Link (new window) Where the Supreme Court ruled that if you are subjected to a Terry Stop, you must identify yourself to the Police if they ask for your identification. Clamming up and repeating that little speech will just make trouble, possibly resulting in an arrest.

Suddenly refusing to talk to a cop when he comes up to you and starts asking questions is a quick way to make things go from bad to worse. Yeah, if you're subjected to a Terry Stop, a cop has at least some suspicion that you've done something illegal, and acting very evasive and agitated is a way to make those suspicions get very big very quickly. Calmly explaining what you're doing instead of something illegal makes the problem go away.

You get the right to an attorney when you are actually accused of a crime, which is typically upon arrest, not the moment a police officer tries to ask you questions because he's trying to see if a crime has happened, is happening or is about to happen.

/Law Enforcement Officer

How do you know when a cop is lying?

LordJiro: Sim Tree: Police will commonly tell suspects that DNA evidence, etc. will find them innocent later. Most people believe in the idea of justice, so they fall for it, since 'justice' will let them free if they are innocent.

Example: "We have the security video from the crime scene. If you confess and plead guilty, you'll look as if you're cooperating and you'll get better treatment while you're here, and a shorter sentence if you're guilty. If the camera shows you are innocent, hey, then you'll get off at trial, and no harm done. And you'll still have gotten the better treatment here, so, bonus!

To many people that sounds win/ win, so they confess.

Of course, at trial, the confession is submitted as factual evidence and 'What security camera footage?'

^ This. My sister's fiancee got caught in that kind of crap on a false rape charge. Bam, sex offender for life.

Don't plead guilty if you didn't do it.

A guilty plea is a confession, end of story. Anybody who enters a guilty plea and doesn't know they are de jure confessing to the crime in question, well, either had a total idiot for an attorney, or was a total idiot themselves.

The "Alford Plea", a.k.a. No Contest is what you would use to plead what is guilty without a confession. You'll still get the punishment for the crime, but you are not confessing, just admitting they have enough evidence to convict you without admitting you did it.

Silverstaff:

Suddenly refusing to talk to a cop when he comes up to you and starts asking questions is a quick way to make things go from bad to worse. Yeah, if you're subjected to a Terry Stop, a cop has at least some suspicion that you've done something illegal, and acting very evasive and agitated is a way to make those suspicions get very big very quickly. Calmly explaining what you're doing instead of something illegal makes the problem go away.

/Law Enforcement Officer

You use this to go on fishing expeditions a lot. You'll say you don't, but we both know you're lying.