Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

Irvine has to be one of the most boring places in the entire world. You need to be high 24-7 just to deal with it

Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

I've lived in both. Irvine wins no contest.

The only reason I would ever live in Irvine would be because I'd be working at Blizzard Entertainment playing Diablo all day long.

List is a sham, Birmingham AL is not number 1.

SoCalSurfer: Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

Irvine has to be one of the most boring places in the entire world. You need to be high 24-7 just to deal with it

You've never lived in Palm Springs I take it.

The nice thing about Irvine is it's close to everything else.

Income inequality =! poorly run.

Detroit isn't number one, but they are pretty close. Though when you have a quarterback who throws for over 5000 yards, running isn't quite as important.

I'm not sure "poor beyond belief" = "worst run." Who could possibly turn Stockton or San Bernardino around?

Things sure went downhill after Crockett and Tubbs retired. Seriously, Miami can't be that bad, can it?

Flint, Michigan should be near the top of the worst run list. We're on our second State appointed emergency manager in 4 years. Plus, HUD & the Dept. of Energy rescinding grants due to financial mismanagement and misfeasance, numerous lawsuits for whistle blower violations, sexual harassment, hostile work environment, etc. Not to mention police response measured in days, due to laying off 3/4 of the officers so assorted cronies could continue getting paid.

Income inequality? So, Miami got the #1 slot because they failed to drive the wealthy people away like Detroit did?

There hasn't been enough money left in Detroit to attract and retain top-flight grifters for *years*.
How can you hope to be the best if you can't compete for the best talent?

Michael: [V.O.] When you're burned, you've got nothing. No cash, no credit, no job history. You're stuck in whatever city they decide to dump you in.
Michael: Where am I?
Fiona: Miami.

Michael: [V.O.] You do whatever work comes your way. You rely on anyone who's still talking to you. A trigger-happy ex-girlfriend...
Fiona: Shall we shoot them?

Michael: [V.O.] An old friend who used to inform on you to the FBI...
Sam Axe: You know spies. Bunch of biatchy little girls.
Michael: [V.O.] Family too...
Sam: Hey, is that your mom again?

Michael: [V.O.] ...if you're desperate.
Madeline Westen: Someone needs your help, Michael.

Michael: [V.O.] Bottom line is: as long as you're burned, you're not going anywhere.

Sybarite: So the rule seems to be if you don't want to end up on the worst run cities list, don't have a bunch of poor people.

Obviously not true, Detroit being a counter argument. Because they have no rich people and a lot of poor people. They sited the income GAP which is stupid.

Fart_Machine: Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

I've lived in both. Irvine wins no contest.

I don't see how. One is a city by the beach. One is a suburb. If you like suburbs then I guess it's awesome. Me, I'll take crackheads, gun violence, and corruption over having to pretend that Applebee's isn't the worst food known to man.

they are not amused

I didn't read too closely, but there must be a minimum size of at least 250k people for this list.

I can think of two perfectly run suburbs of Dallas, better run than Plano. But smaller. One suburb is so well run that nobody wanted to challenge the incumbents on the council so they canceled the election. Of course it's going to turn out like Hot Fuzz when the council has been killing off any annoyance for the past 40 years.

Sybarite: So the rule seems to be if you don't want to end up on the worst run cities list, don't have a bunch of poor people.

Do mismanaged cities lead to lots of poor people or do lots of poor people lead to mismanaged cities?

Either way, stay the hell away from Detroit.

2. Detroit, Mich.

Violent crime per 1,000 people: 18.87 (the highest)
Poverty rate: 37.6 percent (the highest)
Adult population graduated from high school: 77.4 percent (18th lowest)
Credit rating: Ba3 (on review)
Population: 711,910

1. Miami, Fla.

Violent crime per 1,000 people: 11.08 (13th highest)
Poverty rate: 32.4 percent (5th highest)
Adult population graduated from high school: 68.2 percent (4th lowest)
Credit rating: A2 (stable outlook)
Population: 400,892

So Detroit has the highest violent crime and poverty rate and a worse credit rating, but they don't rate the number 1 position? The author have a soft spot for Detroit? Tired of seeing people pick on poor ole detroit?

Detroit #1 and Newark #2 = too obvious

Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

Irvine is a very clean and well ordered City, how they do it is just a little creepy.

Detroit has bottomed out in terms of sucking.

Some basic understandings have been reached with the local criminal element. Namely:

The city likes its tourism dollars. Leave the white folk who come to town for football, hockey, the autoshow, and the casinos alone. If you mess with the suburban folk, the police will hunt you down.

If the white folk are dumb enough to come really deep into the bad section (the area surrounded by freeways+Belle Isle is the "Green Zone" and actually has a fair police presence, this is the area contains 95% of what you want to do in Detroit ) then you can carjack them or mug them. Don't be raping the white women or anything though, because then the State Police will show up and someone is getting shot.

If you shoot a rival crack dealer in some drug turf war, we don't give a fark. We'll cart the body off, eventually, and that is that.

As a note on the above, kindly keep your gang killings on the down low. If there are too many drive by shootings or the like, we have to look like we're doing something and we'll arrest some low level gang members so the media gets off our ass.

Oh and keep your ass out of Grosse Isle/Pointe/etc. They have their own police officers and they are actually good at their jobs.

Basically that is left for Detroit is for it to kind of wither back inside the natural beltway formed by the freeways and move forward. As of now most of the problems with Detroit come from it being too far spread out for emergency services to cover given the tax base. The massive waves of violence are over and gone with. Now it is just petty bullshiat and the occasional gang dispute. In 20 years or so the city will wither back inside that beltway and the gentrification process will have made some noticeable strides.

watson.t.hamster: Sybarite: So the rule seems to be if you don't want to end up on the worst run cities list, don't have a bunch of poor people.

Do mismanaged cities lead to lots of poor people or do lots of poor people lead to mismanaged cities?

Either way, stay the hell away from Detroit.

Unless you want to punish people

like he does

Duke_leto_Atredes: Irvine is a very clean and well ordered City, how they do it is just a little creepy.

They actually RAISED the speed limits on two streets recently. Who does that? Portola right in front of a high school, 25 mph during school, 60 mph otherwise? How are they going to screw people with these reasonable speed limits?

Rapmaster2000: Fart_Machine: Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

I've lived in both. Irvine wins no contest.

I don't see how. One is a city by the beach. One is a suburb. If you like suburbs then I guess it's awesome. Me, I'll take crackheads, gun violence, and corruption over having to pretend that Applebee's isn't the worst food known to man.

It takes me 15-20 minutes to get to the beach when there isn't traffic. If I don't want to go to the beach I can hit the cycle trails or go hiking up in the hills which are 5 minutes away. Yeah, it's a planned community and I used to make fun of them back before I lived here. But it's close to everything else and is a pretty nice place to live without having to worry about having my car broken into once a month.

Also I've never been to an Applebees in Irvine. Spectrum has a California Pizza Kitchen, PF Changs, Ruby's, and a Yard House though. My favorite Thai restaurant is in Laguna just a short drive away.

Spartan_Manhandler: I'm not sure "poor beyond belief" = "worst run." Who could possibly turn Stockton or San Bernardino around?

Admittedly, the government in San Bernardino is amazingly corrupt. Although that's mainly the county, not the city itself.

/I live in it's larger cousin to the south, Riverside
//I actually think the city government here is pretty damned good

baldrik78: 2. Detroit, Mich.

Violent crime per 1,000 people: 18.87 (the highest)
Poverty rate: 37.6 percent (the highest)
Adult population graduated from high school: 77.4 percent (18th lowest)
Credit rating: Ba3 (on review)
Population: 711,910

1. Miami, Fla.

Violent crime per 1,000 people: 11.08 (13th highest)
Poverty rate: 32.4 percent (5th highest)
Adult population graduated from high school: 68.2 percent (4th lowest)
Credit rating: A2 (stable outlook)
Population: 400,892

So Detroit has the highest violent crime and poverty rate and a worse credit rating, but they don't rate the number 1 position? The author have a soft spot for Detroit? Tired of seeing people pick on poor ole detroit?

I have a soft spot for Detroit, but for god's sake, they're about to be taken over by the state because they can't figure out that if they don't have enough to pay their bills and can't borrow any money and have no one left to tax that they're going to have to cut their expenses.

Was that a list of the best and worst places for white people to live?

baldrik78: So Detroit has the highest violent crime and poverty rate and a worse credit rating, but they don't rate the number 1 position? The author have a soft spot for Detroit? Tired of seeing people pick on poor ole detroit?


well, it HAS become a little cliche.

Yeah, Madison is pretty awesome. Hometown represent!

Fart_Machine: Rapmaster2000: Fart_Machine: Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

I've lived in both. Irvine wins no contest.

I don't see how. One is a city by the beach. One is a suburb. If you like suburbs then I guess it's awesome. Me, I'll take crackheads, gun violence, and corruption over having to pretend that Applebee's isn't the worst food known to man.

It takes me 15-20 minutes to get to the beach when there isn't traffic. If I don't want to go to the beach I can hit the cycle trails or go hiking up in the hills which are 5 minutes away. Yeah, it's a planned community and I used to make fun of them back before I lived here. But it's close to everything else and is a pretty nice place to live without having to worry about having my car broken into once a month.

Also I've never been to an Applebees in Irvine. Spectrum has a California Pizza Kitchen, PF Changs, Ruby's, and a Yard House though. My favorite Thai restaurant is in Laguna just a short drive away.

Sounds OK I guess though I am confused by seeing "isn't traffic" in the context of Southern California.

LegacyDL: The only reason I would ever live in Irvine would be because I'd be working at Blizzard Entertainment playing Diablo all day long.

This is my brother-in-law's actual job. All that slacking really paid off.

baldrik78: 2. Detroit, Mich.

Violent crime per 1,000 people: 18.87 (the highest)
Poverty rate: 37.6 percent (the highest)
Adult population graduated from high school: 77.4 percent (18th lowest)
Credit rating: Ba3 (on review)
Population: 711,910

1. Miami, Fla.

Violent crime per 1,000 people: 11.08 (13th highest)
Poverty rate: 32.4 percent (5th highest)
Adult population graduated from high school: 68.2 percent (4th lowest)
Credit rating: A2 (stable outlook)
Population: 400,892

So Detroit has the highest violent crime and poverty rate and a worse credit rating, but they don't rate the number 1 position? The author have a soft spot for Detroit? Tired of seeing people pick on poor ole detroit?

Probably he just really hates Miami. The people of Michigan, while perpetually down on their luck, tend to be pretty nice (obviously there are a few jerks). The people of South Florida tend to not be very nice.

Rapmaster2000: Fart_Machine: Rapmaster2000: Meh. I'd still rather live in Miami than Irvine - an office park run by an HOA.

I've lived in both. Irvine wins no contest.

I don't see how. One is a city by the beach. One is a suburb. If you like suburbs then I guess it's awesome. Me, I'll take crackheads, gun violence, and corruption over having to pretend that Applebee's isn't the worst food known to man.

One is in Orange county, CA. One is in Florida. There is no winner here.

So this article is essentially geared towards slamming poor people and fellating "job creators".

Rapmaster2000: Sounds OK I guess though I am confused by seeing "isn't traffic" in the context of Southern California.

Depends on what time of day you go and where you're going. Also for the weekends I've been taking the metrolink into Oceanside to beat the traffic. It's only $10 for a round trip. :)

I am really surprised to see Virginia Beach number 1. Last time I visited, around 1999, it was nothing but crappy tourist traps, Navy base leftovers, and Levittown houses.

What, no Vallejo, CA? Not only is it a high crime shiat hole, but it went bankrupt a couple of years ago and now cannot even afford meter maids. You can park nearly anywhere in Vallejo without fear of getting a ticket (O.K., that part's a plus, but it's not a sign of a well-run city).

It's official tourist motto is "Close to Everything"--essentially admitting that there's no reason you'd ever want to go there for it's own sake. It's a depressing wasteland of liquor stores, run-down churches, and check cashing outlets.

\wife works in Vallejo, with mental health clients.
\\oddly, they are some of the least scary people in town

3. Dallas

• Got a soft machine

2. Houston

• too close to New Orleans

1. New York

• got the ways and means

• just wont let you be


/what a long strange trip it's been

Obviously this list is skewed because of income inequality being so weighted because MSNBC tells it "like it is". Miami is a very nice place, just not the part that is actually legally "Miami" just go near the beach anywhere north of Miami proper.

Beerguy: Spartan_Manhandler: I'm not sure "poor beyond belief" = "worst run." Who could possibly turn Stockton or San Bernardino around?

I have been to most of the cities on the list. From just an aesthetics perspective, Stockton is the most miserable looking city I have ever been to.

I wouldn't go back to Stockton if they were giving away free beer and that is saying something.

Yeah, Stockton's pretty awful, too. It's like Oakland, only without any redeeming qualities. Oakland at least is fairly interesting.

Sometimes I miss living in Virginia Beach. But then I remember it's still in Virginia.

/got the hell out of VA when I was 21
//making 3x what I was making there doesn't hurt