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(WMAL Washington)   GOP Florida Rep. Allen West hates President Obama's plan to cut military spending and that Speaker Boehner is leading an effective "kabuki dance" in Congress. Now there's a horrifying image you can never take back   (wmal.com) divider line 53
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524 clicks; posted to Politics » on 06 Jan 2012 at 11:34 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2012-01-06 10:58:03 AM
wow, what a surprise from a teabagger.
 
2012-01-06 11:06:05 AM
Yeah... Klown Kollege Kabuki?
 
2012-01-06 11:10:21 AM
To be fair to Rep. West, how could anyone commit war crimes like he did and get away with it if the military isn't a bloated morass of bureaucratic sludge? Sure there is no need to retain a large, conventional fighting force in the era of discreet interventions and drone strikes, but then how will the tax payer money he champions for ever get into the hands of multinational corporations and warlords? It's almost like they are organized together to collectively protect their jobs from their employer. What else do they want? They already have single-payer healthcare and a great pension plan.
 
2012-01-06 11:15:32 AM
images.wikia.com

Rep John Boehner (R- Ohio)
 
2012-01-06 11:28:05 AM
Does this harm the troops more or less than a Lt. Col committing war crimes?
 
2012-01-06 11:33:56 AM
FTFA: "When you look at battlefield calculus, you want to have a 3-to-1 advantage over the adversary in order to be able to have a successful campaign," said West. "So when we sit back and say we're going to try to do things just with drones or just with special forces... We're just violating every single principle of war."

You could cut the US military in half and still have a 3-1 advantage over any adversary. So really, West is agreeing with Obama.
 
2012-01-06 11:39:39 AM
West was a small man with a big gun, so he can go fark himself.
 
2012-01-06 11:39:47 AM
Republicans in the House voted 174-66, and Republicans in the Senate voted 28-19, for the Budget Control Act of 2011, which founded the supercommittee and created the threat of automatic defense cuts.

Oh look, guess what Representative voted for it?

So stop laying it all on Obama.
 
2012-01-06 11:40:21 AM
If America spends even a dollar less on our Military, we'll be at risk from madmen like Ahmhawannajihad.

Can we really afford to be so callous about the possibility of Iran destroying America, especially when it's so simple to just cut taxes a little bit and maintain the military budget?
 
2012-01-06 11:40:39 AM
Cut the Deficit! Not Defense! Why can't Slowbama understand this very simple demand!
 
2012-01-06 11:43:41 AM
Is there a term for redirecting the inquiry from something that's harmful to you (deliberate abandonment of American military supremacy and capability) to something that you perceive to be positive for you (unflattering mental images of Congressmen, charges of war crimes by your political oppoents)? Because, boy, if there were such a term, it would have a lot of uses around here.
 
2012-01-06 11:44:19 AM
I saw the pentagon news packages this morning. This war criminal just got trolled.
 
2012-01-06 11:47:04 AM

unyon: FTFA: "When you look at battlefield calculus, you want to have a 3-to-1 advantage over the adversary in order to be able to have a successful campaign," said West. "So when we sit back and say we're going to try to do things just with drones or just with special forces... We're just violating every single principle of war."

You could cut the US military in half and still have a 3-1 advantage over any adversary. So really, West is agreeing with Obama.


Yah, it's too bad this guy didn't keep reading down the page to the point where they discuss force multipliers.
 
2012-01-06 11:47:38 AM

Death to New Rome: war criminal


I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?
 
2012-01-06 11:48:34 AM
A bukkake dance?
 
2012-01-06 11:48:45 AM

unyon: FTFA: "When you look at battlefield calculus, you want to have a 3-to-1 advantage over the adversary in order to be able to have a successful campaign," said West. "So when we sit back and say we're going to try to do things just with drones or just with special forces... We're just violating every single principle of war."

You could cut the US military in half and still have a 3-1 advantage over any adversary. So really, West is agreeing with Obama.


Not only that, but the 3-1 principle applies to offensive warfare, fighting on an enemy's home turf. So I take it that Rep. West wants to continue the Bush doctrine policy of invading countries for no apparent reason.

Besides that, the 3-1 principle is also made less relevant by the technological advantage we have against an organized opponent. And if we're not fighting against an organized opponent, see point #1 - why are we fighting them in the first place?
 
2012-01-06 11:50:37 AM

Garet Garrett: Death to New Rome: war criminal

I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?


How so?
 
2012-01-06 11:50:43 AM
A Republican member of the House from Florida said a lot of stupid things on a talk radio show. Imagine my surprise.
 
2012-01-06 11:52:10 AM
Don't kabuki dancers usually paint their faces white rather than orange?
 
2012-01-06 11:53:08 AM

Garet Garrett: I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?


I dunno, did he murder someone? Allen West participated in the Iraq war crime, that's why I call him a war criminal. No games being played.
 
2012-01-06 11:54:13 AM

unyon: FTFA: "When you look at battlefield calculus, you want to have a 3-to-1 advantage over the adversary in order to be able to have a successful campaign," said West. "So when we sit back and say we're going to try to do things just with drones or just with special forces... We're just violating every single principle of war."

You could cut the US military in half and still have a 3-1 advantage over any adversary. So really, West is agreeing with Obama.


That and when planners are doing these calculations they take into account things called "force multipliers." You know all those high priced gadgets we have? AWACS, Special Forces, etc? They enable you to do more with less. Whenever you heard some press officer in a briefing fling that term around it DOES actually have real meaning. Apparently that little tidbit flew over our Lt Col's head.

That and, the US military is still enormous so...... West is wrong...on all counts.
 
2012-01-06 12:00:00 PM

Death to New Rome: Garet Garrett: I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?

I dunno, did he murder someone? Allen West participated in the Iraq war crime, that's why I call him a war criminal. No games being played.


Well, in West's defense, it was a pretty awesome attempt at a Jack Bauer impersonation, minus the fact that he obtained no useful intel.
 
2012-01-06 12:00:02 PM

Garet Garrett: Is there a term for redirecting the inquiry from something that's harmful to you (deliberate abandonment of American military supremacy and capability) to something that you perceive to be positive for you (unflattering mental images of Congressmen, charges of war crimes by your political oppoents)? Because, boy, if there were such a term, it would have a lot of uses around here.


Ok, let's say this wasn't a claim by someone who was forced to resign to stop an investigation into his conduct of handling a detainee:

This:

www.rickety.us
Is a problem. We are fighting an arms race against ourselves, and we cant' afford it.

But please- keep white knighting the man who had a prisoner beaten, held by four solders, and then fired his gun next to his head, all to find out that the guy was innocent of any wrong doing.

That's a great idea.
 
2012-01-06 12:05:26 PM

Death to New Rome: Garet Garrett: I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?

I dunno, did he murder someone? Allen West participated in the Iraq war crime, that's why I call him a war criminal. No games being played.


Eric Holder presided over a program that deliberately put guns into the hands of people bent on killing Americans, who did just that with those very same guns. Now, no one's formally charged him with actually murdering any border agents (yet), but LTC West wasn't charged with war crimes either.* So if we get to overlook the legal niceties of charges and convictions, we get to call people by their supposed felonious conduct. West is a war criminal, Holder is a murderer. Like I said, sounds great!

*I suppose you could be using "war ciminal" to mean someone who commits a crime during a war, which would make a shoplifter at the local PX a "war criminal." But somehow I doubt that's what you're saying.
 
2012-01-06 12:08:38 PM
I have to believe we could easily defend this place with far less than what we currently have. Look at the hell the insurgents in Iraq brought on our military; it was far worse than what the Iraq military did when we invaded. The population of the U.S. is about 10X bigger, our land area is about 22X bigger, our population has had easy access to guns/ammo forever, we have a far more diverse climate and terrain, etc.

Any military people care to correct me? I just can't believe that we need to keep this Cold-War Era behemoth alive.
 
2012-01-06 12:09:19 PM

what_now: Is a problem.


I agree. Let's impose a one-child, males-preferred policy and generate hundreds of thousands of unmarried, and unmarriable, young men, and draft them into a mandatory army. We wouldn't have to pay them squat, let alone spend all that money on "dependents." Problem solved!

Realizing that the relationship betwen military might and military spending is not linear across nations is a key step towards not relying on such simplistic charts to the point of appearing foolish.
 
2012-01-06 12:09:23 PM

Garet Garrett: Death to New Rome: Garet Garrett: I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?

I dunno, did he murder someone? Allen West participated in the Iraq war crime, that's why I call him a war criminal. No games being played.

Eric Holder presided over a program that deliberately put guns into the hands of people bent on killing Americans, who did just that with those very same guns. Now, no one's formally charged him with actually murdering any border agents (yet), but LTC West wasn't charged with war crimes either.* So if we get to overlook the legal niceties of charges and convictions, we get to call people by their supposed felonious conduct. West is a war criminal, Holder is a murderer. Like I said, sounds great!

*I suppose you could be using "war ciminal" to mean someone who commits a crime during a war, which would make a shoplifter at the local PX a "war criminal." But somehow I doubt that's what you're saying.


West was charged and fined.
 
2012-01-06 12:09:41 PM
kabuki != bukkake

only way this headline makes any sense to me is if subby confused the two
 
2012-01-06 12:11:02 PM

Garet Garrett: (deliberate abandonment of American military supremacy and capability)


I think the term for that would be "overwrought hyperbole" but I could be wrong.

1.bp.blogspot.com

/hawt.
 
2012-01-06 12:11:22 PM

Don't Troll Me Bro!: Look at the hell the insurgents in Iraq brought on our military


Wolverines!
 
2012-01-06 12:11:44 PM

Garet Garrett: Death to New Rome: Garet Garrett: I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?

I dunno, did he murder someone? Allen West participated in the Iraq war crime, that's why I call him a war criminal. No games being played.

Eric Holder presided over a program that deliberately put guns into the hands of people bent on killing Americans, who did just that with those very same guns. Now, no one's formally charged him with actually murdering any border agents (yet), but LTC West wasn't charged with war crimes either.* So if we get to overlook the legal niceties of charges and convictions, we get to call people by their supposed felonious conduct. West is a war criminal, Holder is a murderer. Like I said, sounds great!

*I suppose you could be using "war ciminal" to mean someone who commits a crime during a war, which would make a shoplifter at the local PX a "war criminal." But somehow I doubt that's what you're saying.


Did Eric Holder physically hand a guy a weapon to go kill Americans? No he did not.

As for the rules regarding detainees, West willingly broke the law so he could feel like a big tough guy.
 
2012-01-06 12:12:15 PM

Philip Francis Queeg: Garet Garrett: Death to New Rome: Garet Garrett: I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?

I dunno, did he murder someone? Allen West participated in the Iraq war crime, that's why I call him a war criminal. No games being played.

Eric Holder presided over a program that deliberately put guns into the hands of people bent on killing Americans, who did just that with those very same guns. Now, no one's formally charged him with actually murdering any border agents (yet), but LTC West wasn't charged with war crimes either.* So if we get to overlook the legal niceties of charges and convictions, we get to call people by their supposed felonious conduct. West is a war criminal, Holder is a murderer. Like I said, sounds great!

*I suppose you could be using "war ciminal" to mean someone who commits a crime during a war, which would make a shoplifter at the local PX a "war criminal." But somehow I doubt that's what you're saying.

West was charged and fined.


Charged with....

Oh, come on. Play along! Finish the sentence! Hint: It doesn't include the words "war crime."
 
2012-01-06 12:13:15 PM

Jake Havechek: Did Eric Holder physically hand a guy a weapon to go kill Americans? No he did not.


Is that the legal standard that has to be fulfilled to be responsible for murder? No it is not.
 
2012-01-06 12:14:57 PM

Garet Garrett: Eric Holder presided over a program that deliberately put guns into the hands of people bent on killing Americans, who did just that with those very same guns. Now, no one's formally charged him with actually murdering any border agents (yet), but LTC West wasn't charged with war crimes either.* So if we get to overlook the legal niceties of charges and convictions, we get to call people by their supposed felonious conduct. West is a war criminal, Holder is a murderer. Like I said, sounds great!


Oh yea I heard about that, but still he didn't murder any one, but Allen West did participate in a war crime. The undeclared war of aggression on Iraq that followed the 9/11 false flag. I think "gun runner" would more accurately describe what Holder did.
 
2012-01-06 12:17:20 PM

Death to New Rome: The undeclared war of aggression on Iraq that followed the 9/11 false flag.


Got it. So all of our Iraq War veterans are war criminals. Nice to hear from you, Sen. Kerry.
 
2012-01-06 12:17:52 PM

Garet Garrett: deliberate abandonment of American military supremacy and capability


What a ridiculous statement. I have no idea why people take you seriously.
 
2012-01-06 12:18:15 PM

Garet Garrett: Jake Havechek: Did Eric Holder physically hand a guy a weapon to go kill Americans? No he did not.

Is that the legal standard that has to be fulfilled to be responsible for murder? No it is not.


For your poorly thought out comparison example I think it is.
 
2012-01-06 12:18:24 PM

Garet Garrett: I agree. Let's impose a one-child, males-preferred policy and generate hundreds of thousands of unmarried, and unmarriable, young men, and draft them into a mandatory army. We wouldn't have to pay them squat, let alone spend all that money on "dependents." Problem solved!


Or, we could cut the defense budget and increase the education budget, and use the rest of the money to rebuild our crumbling infrastructure.


Stop getting your policy positions from movies.
 
2012-01-06 12:18:51 PM

Garet Garrett: Nice to hear from you, Sen. Kerry.


Yeah, I'm out. Have a good day.
 
2012-01-06 12:20:54 PM

Garet Garrett: Got it. So all of our Iraq War veterans are war criminals.


Yep.
 
2012-01-06 12:22:12 PM

skullkrusher: kabuki != bukkake

only way this headline makes any sense to me is if subby confused the two


I dunno, imagining Boehner with white skin is pretty horrifying.
 
2012-01-06 12:25:16 PM

sprawl15: skullkrusher: kabuki != bukkake

only way this headline makes any sense to me is if subby confused the two

I dunno, imagining Boehner with white skin is pretty horrifying.


especially if it is white from baby batter
 
2012-01-06 12:25:52 PM

Garet Garrett: West was charged and fined.

Charged with....

Oh, come on. Play along! Finish the sentence! Hint: It doesn't include the words "war crime."


Buzzzz! Time's up. The correct question was "What is assault under Articles 128 and 134, UCMJ?"
 
2012-01-06 12:31:21 PM
Boehner would look good in white. Better than his current orange color.
 
2012-01-06 12:34:23 PM

Garet Garrett: what_now: Is a problem.

I agree. Let's impose a one-child, males-preferred policy and generate hundreds of thousands of unmarried, and unmarriable, young men, and draft them into a mandatory army. We wouldn't have to pay them squat, let alone spend all that money on "dependents." Problem solved!

Realizing that the relationship betwen military might and military spending is not linear across nations is a key step towards not relying on such simplistic charts to the point of appearing foolish.


It's a long goddamned walk to East LA from China.
 
2012-01-06 12:42:44 PM

bighasbeen: It's a long goddamned walk to East LA from China.


A long march, if you will.
 
2012-01-06 12:46:29 PM

Garet Garrett: Garet Garrett: West was charged and fined.

Charged with....

Oh, come on. Play along! Finish the sentence! Hint: It doesn't include the words "war crime."

Buzzzz! Time's up. The correct question was "What is assault under Articles 128 and 134, UCMJ?"


Yep He assaulted a prisoner in a war zone.

I'm pretty sure you'd consider the assault of an American prisoner in a war zone by a foreign military officer a war crime wouldn't you?

BTW "War crimes" not are a specific charge under the UCMJ.
 
2012-01-06 12:52:49 PM

Garet Garrett: Death to New Rome: war criminal

I like this game. Does this mean I get to call Eric Holder a murderer, now?


No, because unlike Rep. West, holder has never been convicted of murder. You cannot say the same of West and war crimes:

"West was charged with violating articles 128 (assault) and 134 (general article) of the Uniform Code of Military Justice. During a hearing held as part of an Article 32 investigation in November 2003, West stated, "I know the method I used was not right, but I wanted to take care of my soldiers."[11] The charges were ultimately referred to an Article 15 proceeding rather than court-martial, at which West was fined $5,000"
 
2012-01-06 12:58:04 PM
i219.photobucket.com
 
2012-01-06 12:58:57 PM

Garet Garrett: Garet Garrett: West was charged and fined.

Charged with....

Oh, come on. Play along! Finish the sentence! Hint: It doesn't include the words "war crime."

Buzzzz! Time's up. The correct question was "What is assault under Articles 128 and 134, UCMJ?"


Both Crimes committed under the UCMJ in a war zone, ergo "war crimes" and BTW for the record it wasn't a prisoner he had beaten and then fired his gun at threatening to execute him on the spot.. it was an Iraqi VOLUNTEER who was serving as interpreter for the unit. Col west's command had lost several vehicles and soldiers to roadside bombs and decided it MUST be because someone on the inside was feeding info to the insurgents. So he, almost at random, decided it had to be this interpreter and decided to beat a confession out of him:

Despite West's claims to the contrary (aka self-aggrandizing lies) the beating of this interpreter yeilded no useful information, nor did the roadside attacks lessen at all.
 
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