It's about goddamned farking time we tell them to go fark themselves.

/Just wait till 2014, assholes.
//We'll be out of your backyard, and we'll take our checkbooks with us.
///Then they're India's problem. Again and still.

Taliban 2 - electric boogaloo

I sincerely hope we're losing the "privilege" of giving Pakistan billions each year, while at best, it drags its feet, and at worst, it uses resources to aid terrorists.

Fark Pakistan and the entire region. Let them fend for themselves- no more aid, no more wars. No foreign entanglements.

/RON PAUL

Stabone33: It's about goddamned farking time we tell them to go fark themselves.

/Just wait till 2014, assholes.
//We'll be out of your backyard, and we'll take our checkbooks with us.
///Then they're India's problem. Again and still.

yep.
They can go back to wiping with one hand and eating with the other now.

For a while now Pakistan's role on the world stage has been managing problems created by Pakistan. Its about time we called them on their crap.

Calm Down You Spaz: Taliban 2 - electric boogaloo

I think the Pakistanis are up to at least Taliban X - Taliban in Space by now.

Stabone33: It's about goddamned farking time we tell them to go fark themselves.

/Just wait till 2014, assholes.
//We'll be out of your backyard, and we'll take our checkbooks with us.
///Then they're India's problem. Again and still.

Forgot this:

Stabone33: It's about goddamned farking time we tell them to go fark themselves.

/Just wait till 2014, assholes.
//We'll be out of your backyard, and we'll take our checkbooks with us.
///Then they're India's problem. Again and still.

The article I read sounds like we are getting farked by them still, more to get supplies and less support for troops on the ground over there, unless they pull out completely then our only ally in the area is india.

Which makes sense, all of our jobs are over there.

They hate the jews and they killed Daniel Pearl.

The funny thing is, they are the ones breaking up with us.

The article I read sounds like we are getting farked by them still, more to get supplies and less support for troops on the ground over there, unless they pull out completely then our only ally in the area is india.

Which makes sense, all of our jobs are over there.

They are, but not for long. We're working on this:

Link (new window)

I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

Pakistan is a terrorist nation.

In retaliation, we should nationalize all the US motels that Pakistani citizens own.

matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

I think they are pissed because they pulled the elmer fudd, bugs bunny routine on us with bin laden not being in their country and then we go in and kill him ourself.

matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either

It's actually a result of the CIA contractor shooting the guys who were going to kidnap him, plus the UBL mission, and the border "mishap". Which, by the way, occurred IN THE IMMEDIATE VICINITY of Pakistani military outposts. Kinda like the way the Pakistanis had no idea UBL was right down the road from their own version of West Point.

This is one of those "make her think it was herr idea to dump me" kind of things.

"make her think it was herr idea to dump me" kind of things.

lol

matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

Actually, you have it backwards. Everyone knows that the Pakie Army is aiding Al Qaeda and the Taliban. No surprise if a missile or two happens to hit them.

I know politics is politics, but dealing with Pakistan is more like giving aid & comfort to our very enemies. It makes as much sense as Joe Frasier handing a .357 to his opponent and saying "Here's this gun. Now when the bell rings, I want you to shoot me with it. Okay?".

matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

Shut up! Besides the years of obstruction that led to many of our soldiers dying, they had farkING OSAMA BIN LADEN living right beside their military academy for God knows how long and looked the other way without telling us all while sucking our checkbook.

We should have nuked the place.

Mushahid Hussain Sayed, the secretary general of the Pakistan Muslim League-Q, an opposition political party, summed up the anger that he said many harbored: "We feel like the U.S. treats Pakistan like a rainy-day girlfriend."



More like a f*ck buddy, but it's clearly mutual, so don't get all pissy about it now. You knew the score...it was your idea after 9/11 anyway.

matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

When people shoot at our troops they shoot back. I dont believe this was an accident at all. Obstructionist gives them too much credit. They hid Bin laden and they support the terrorist groups in their country. They are either supporting them or they are very afraid of them. The Pakistanis knew who they started shooting at, we informed them where we were. Either way. Lets leave. We need to really review our foreign policy.

TV's Vinnie: matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

Actually, you have it backwards. Everyone knows that the Pakie Army is aiding Al Qaeda and the Taliban. No surprise if a missile or two happens to hit them.

I know politics is politics, but dealing with Pakistan is more like giving aid & comfort to our very enemies. It makes as much sense as Joe Frasier handing a .357 to his opponent and saying "Here's this gun. Now when the bell rings, I want you to shoot me with it. Okay?".

Rather interesting thing to attempt with boxing gloves on...

It's amazing how everyone denies that Pakistan always gets farked over hard. Their support of the U.S., however you characterize it, has lead to massive instability and violence. We have personnel and drones there, they allow it, but the people are very upset that they are used to blow up Pakistanis. Regardless of how you feel about that, it's not like they volunteered to go with the U.S.; even though they are traditionally an ally that was kicked to the curb after the collapse of the U.S.S.R., we basically told them after 9/11 to agree to everything we tell you to do, or we'll flatten you. That's how this deal started: accept massive aid for letting us use your country, or we send you back to the stone age. To a neutral country that's sort of an ally

Vtimlin: matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

When people shoot at our troops they shoot back. I dont believe this was an accident at all. Obstructionist gives them too much credit. They hid Bin laden and they support the terrorist groups in their country. They are either supporting them or they are very afraid of them. The Pakistanis knew who they started shooting at, we informed them where we were. Either way. Lets leave. We need to really review our foreign policy.

True as far as supporting the Taliban -- the Taliban was a tool of Pakistani intelligence. I'm not sure they see the groups they support as "terrorist."

I'm not trying to be an apologist for the Pakistani government -- I agree that they haven't been a good faith partner in the least and have seen us as an ATM. But I just don't want to operate on the assumption that everything the US does is automatically good and pure. I know that tends to complicate things not to think that way, but I think in the long term not thinking in binaries is the only way we're going to get out of the various messes we're in as a society.

Vtimlin: matrygg: I don't think you guys read the same article as I did. Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike. I'm not going to deny that they have been obstructionist, but we are not purely innocent either.

When people shoot at our troops they shoot back. I dont believe this was an accident at all. Obstructionist gives them too much credit. They hid Bin laden and they support the terrorist groups in their country. They are either supporting them or they are very afraid of them. The Pakistanis knew who they started shooting at, we informed them where we were. Either way. Lets leave. We need to really review our foreign policy.

I suspect we won't ever completely cut the Pakis off. I'm sure they're hoping to make it in somebody's economic interest not to let the place become quite the viper's nest Afghanistan became under the Taliban.

SomeAmerican: The funny thing is, they are the ones breaking up with us.

this. i wonder if any of the derpers in this thread actually RTA

I suspect we won't ever completely cut the Pakis off. I'm sure they're hoping to make it in somebody's economic interest not to let the place become quite the viper's nest Afghanistan became under the Taliban.

No...their only leverage is their nukes. They don't really have much else of interest to us. And that ;everage is balanced by India's nukes. Our biggest concern is a Paki nuke getting "lost" and winding up on top of a missile in Iran, having been trucked through an unstable Afghanistan.

Biological Ali: Vtimlin: When people shoot at our troops they shoot back. I dont believe this was an accident at all.

US admits mistakes over killings of Pakistan troops

Yeah, we would never "my bad, dawg" just to smooth an issue over. The public "apology" is worth more to Pakistan than the fact that both governments already know the score.

TFA says they were going to help arrange peace talks with the Taliban. (and rein in attacks on allied forces) WTF?

Oh, and they will "require increased transit fees for the thousands of trucks that supply NATO troops in Afghanistan".

Magorn: There is a precedent for what happens next. In WWII the troops Germany had on the ground in Italy went from being allied forces to occupiers once Italy decided they didn't want to be friends anymore. If Pakistan doesn't want to be our ally anymore in cleaning up the mess their intelligence service created, then I would advise them not to do things like try to close vital border passes we truck supplies through. That COULD be seen as an act of war if done by a neutral country

Vital border passes in their own country? How would you feel if Mexico or Canada used that logic to require us to keep our borders open to them? Like it or not, Pakistan is a sovereign nation and they have the same rights on their own territory as we have on ours.

Biological Ali: US admits mistakes over killings of Pakistan troops

And of course, if you actually read the article, it's not quite that black and white.

"US and Afghan troops acted in self defence, but conceded there had been a lack of proper co-ordination with Pakistani forces." (the first damn sentence)

"US and Afghan forces had landed in the area to search a village and had been fired upon from a ridge above it."

"He said coalition forces had at first staged a "show of force" to make it clear who they were. When firing continued from the ridge, he said, air strikes were carried out."

Magorn: matrygg: Magorn: There is a precedent for what happens next. In WWII the troops Germany had on the ground in Italy went from being allied forces to occupiers once Italy decided they didn't want to be friends anymore. If Pakistan doesn't want to be our ally anymore in cleaning up the mess their intelligence service created, then I would advise them not to do things like try to close vital border passes we truck supplies through. That COULD be seen as an act of war if done by a neutral country

Vital border passes in their own country? How would you feel if Mexico or Canada used that logic to require us to keep our borders open to them? Like it or not, Pakistan is a sovereign nation and they have the same rights on their own territory as we have on ours.

You may recall Japan took a bit of umbrage whent he US started choking off thier shipping lanes, and the US entered WWI because the US got pissed at Germany for trying to prevent arms and supplies reaching its enemies even if they were being shipped on US flagged vessels

I tell you what...if Pakistan starts shipping material support to the Taliban through international waters I will keep my mouth shut. But trying to control what a sovereign nation does within their own borders is hardly the same thing as what you're suggesting.

Biological Ali: unknown military units stage a "show of force" in front of a manned border post.

Want to know how I know you don't know what you're talking about?

Good. We may not have treated them well immediately following 9/11, but they've managed to utterly out-asshole us over the last few years, and that isn't easy to accomplish.

They promise us their friendship in exchange for billions in aid money, then spit on us when they get it by drowning their citizens in anti-US propaganda and aiding the very enemy they claim they needed the money to fight. It's astonishing they got away with it for as long as they did.

saw this coming after the OBL mission.

we can't just go around stomping on the sovereignty of other nations.

imontheinternet: I sincerely hope we're losing the "privilege" of giving Pakistan billions each year, while at best, it drags its feet, and at worst, it uses resources to aid terrorists.

Fark Pakistan and the entire region. Let them fend for themselves- no more aid, no more wars. No foreign entanglements.

/RON PAUL

because the foreign aid the US has been giving to Pakistan was just free money, it's not like the US was buying cooperation with anti-terror operations, the right to have military bases and spies operate within Pakistan and the right to fly-over/drive-through the country. Nope just free money to a government that's been more or less hostile to the US.

/at least isolationism and zenophobia have never proven to be horrible foreign policy strategies that will inevitably come back to bite us in the ass and cost more in the long run than using aid to buy cooperation and stability of certain countries

/RON PAUL!!1
10/10 btw

Jamrock: It's amazing how everyone denies that Pakistan always gets farked over hard. Their support of the U.S., however you characterize it, has lead to massive instability and violence. We have personnel and drones there, they allow it, but the people are very upset that they are used to blow up Pakistanis. Regardless of how you feel about that, it's not like they volunteered to go with the U.S.; even though they are traditionally an ally that was kicked to the curb after the collapse of the U.S.S.R., we basically told them after 9/11 to agree to everything we tell you to do, or we'll flatten you. That's how this deal started: accept massive aid for letting us use your country, or we send you back to the stone age. To a neutral country that's sort of an ally

Considering they were our enemy and India's before 9/11, they got a pretty good deal. Suffer under persistent US(UN?) embargoes and deal with the Indian military constantly prodding them, plus the risk of nuclear escalation from that, or take a bunch of money from the US and instantly lift the embargoes and nullify any overt hostility from India?

Stabone33: Biological Ali: unknown military units stage a "show of force" in front of a manned border post.

Want to know how I know you don't know what you're talking about?

I'm talking about the article. What are you talking about?

So am I.
1. the only armed force on the Afghanistan side of the border with helos and farking supersonic jets is NATO's ISAF, which includes US forces. The Pakis know this -- so there is no "unknown military unit"
2. A "show of force" is military parlance for loud-ass fighter jets flying very low past an enemy's position at just under the speed of sound. It's farking loud as shiat, and it's low enough that you can see the country markings on the fin flashes. Typically the approach is such that you don't see or hear it coming until it's right on top of you. The natural reaction is to flinch and duck...works every time. What happened next, according to the article, is that the forces on top of the ridgeline kept firing. So it's on like Donkey Kong.

Voiceofreason01: /at least isolationism and zenophobia have never proven to be horrible foreign policy strategies that will inevitably come back to bite us in the ass and cost more in the long run than using aid to buy cooperation and stability of certain countries

Well, technically, isolationism would be a domestic policy. It's a lack of foreign policy

/just sayin

The Wars of Afghanistan by Peter Tomsen. Great book. It also explains how the Taliban were a complete invention by Pakistan's ISI (CIA equivalent).

Pakistan has used the U.S. for years. It's definitely time to sever the relationship. We'll be much better off.

bhcompy: Well, technically, isolationism would be a domestic policy. It's a lack of foreign policy

/just sayin

touche

matrygg: Near as I can tell, this is a result of a number of their soldiers being killed by a drone strike.

It was a regular old air strike, but they wanted the drone program shut down as a result. Also, don't fire on NATO patrols if you don't want to get bombed.