So, he spins up a flywheel? It's not self-sustaining. =/

It's not (just) a flywheel, with a 900 watt load you'd hear it spinning down. Those capacitors weren't enough to sustain the power level either. Either it's fraud or... magic? (I'm betting on fraud.)

So he charges a FAT bank of capacitors with a generator and maybe spins up a fly wheel at the same time. Then shuts off the generator and runs everything off the capacitors... At least that's what it looks like to me.

My guess is those capacitors, fully charged, could probably run those lights and that fly wheel for a little while. If dumbass didn't let it run down, I can see how a moron might think that the fly wheel was powering itself and the lights.

Mac Beer: There's nothing really crazy about this. He used an outside power source to get it started.

Well, if what he was saying were true (self-sustaining indefinitely), it would violate the 2nd law even if it started with outside power. Of course, that's not the case. Discharging capacitors can power light bulbs for quite a while. Either this guy is an idiot never thought to run his "generator" for more than a few minutes, or he's intentionally trolling people for some reason. This is all assuming that there isn't just another electrical cord in the back connecting him to power, which there very easily could be.

I was under the impression that the Amish were not allowed to use technology. Or wear blue denim.

Does not approve:

Meh, he stored up enough potential energy to power 900 watts for a minute, or 54 KJ or 13 Calories. or about 5% of the energy in a doughnut. He wanted to claim some self-sustaining perpetual motion machine, he would have to run it much longer than that even if such an idea didn't violate our fundamental understanding of physics.

If someone had a self-contained device which generated a net surplus of power, why would anyone ever power it down without a good reason like maintenance?

These things always turn out to be shenanigans (aka fraud).

Zombalupagus: I was under the impression that the Amish were not allowed to use technology. Or wear blue denim.

Came here to say basically this.

What does the Amish need with a generator?

Not impressed.

Professor Horatio Hufnagel: [www.forevergeek.com image 485x273]

Not impressed.

That movie hurts my head.

Why do people try to pull stuff like this? I have to assume that anyone savvy enough to put a contraption like that together knows enough to know that it is bullshiat, and then by extension that other people will know it is a con as well. Who does he really think he is going to fool?

Keyser_Soze_Death: Zombalupagus: I was under the impression that the Amish were not allowed to use technology. Or wear blue denim.

Came here to say basically this.

What does the Amish need with a generator?

What does God need with a starship?

StrangeQ: Why do people try to pull stuff like this? I have to assume that anyone savvy enough to put a contraption like that together knows enough to know that it is bullshiat, and then by extension that other people will know it is a con as well. Who does he really think he is going to fool?

There are always people willing to believe in miracles. Especially if there are experts telling them it's impossible.

hawcian: Professor Horatio Hufnagel: [www.forevergeek.com image 485x273]

Not impressed.

That movie hurts my head.

Which movie was that?

What does God need period.
Begs the question of omnipresence/omnipotence

The laws of thermodynamic do not exist on my stove. It takes me 5 minutes to cook my grits, while it takes the rest of the whole grit-eating south 20 minutes.

Elfich: hawcian: Professor Horatio Hufnagel: [www.forevergeek.com image 485x273]

Not impressed.

That movie hurts my head.

Which movie was that?

Primer (new window)

Elfich: hawcian: Professor Horatio Hufnagel: [www.forevergeek.com image 485x273]

Not impressed.

That movie hurts my head.

Which movie was that?

Primer

Follow the money. I'm sure he has many "investors".

I'm not real clear about what this video shows me besides some guy with a funny beard talking about his charged up bank of capacitors. Were they trying to convince the viewer that the whole contraption was perpetual energy? Or was it, "Hey look I built myself a loud UPS for my house!"

Either way, perhaps he should go back to driving buggies and raising barns for a living.

markie_farkie: knbwhite: The laws of thermodynamic do not exist on my stove. It takes me 5 minutes to cook my grits, while it takes the rest of the whole grit-eating south 20 minutes.

Did some yutes switch them for instand grits?

Only if it was a northerner or a non self respecting southerner.

//Here's some punctuation marks, put 'em where you want. , - !

Morons. I can go into space, start something spinning by giving it just the right push and then call it a perpetual motion machine.

But as soon as I try to use it to extract energy by putting some sort of load on it, it will stop.

Just because something has energy... i.e. it is moving... does not mean it is a "perpetual motion machine."

/engineer

The All-Powerful Atheismo: Morons. I can go into space, start something spinning by giving it just the right push and then call it a perpetual motion machine.

But as soon as I try to use it to extract energy by putting some sort of load on it, it will stop.

Just because something has energy... i.e. it is moving... does not mean it is a "perpetual motion machine."

/engineer

Perpetual Motion does not have to provide excess work. Only useful work.

a machine that can continue to do work indefinitely without drawing energy from some external source; impossible under the law of conservation of energy

wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Perpetual motion describes hypothetical machines that operate or produce useful work indefinitely and, more generally, hypothetical machines that produce more work or energy than they consume, whether they might operate indefinitely or not.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion_machine

/not an engineer
//The slashies ate my baby

This just goes to show ya, if you need someone who knows a thing or two about electricity, get an Amish dude. They make all kinds of shiat from scratch.

I can't tell from the video just what this guy is trying to do. But I will mention there's been a device out there for about 30 years in which the magnetic field in an inductor is collapsed extremely rapidly, and the successive collapses supposedly create enough energy to basically act like it's a perpetual motion machine. The name of the device escapes me.

Sounds like complete BS, like cold fusion, but the guy who invented it has never tried to make any money off of it. The physics of the rapid collapse of a magnetic field aren't well understood. If you removed the earth, for instance, just zapped it out of existence, it's magnetic field would persist for about a thousand years. There's no doubt, experiments have proved this sort of magnetic field persistence.I have admit I don't understand how that could be and I have a PhD in physics.

I can't help but be intrigued by the idea that given that a magnetic field will persist when the electric field driving it has disappeared, perhaps zapping a magnetic field out of existence might give rise to an electric field that persists.

Mythbusters made one such device and of course it didn't work, but they also made a few shortcuts that I think would have resulted on the project being DOA. It seems to be one of those things that you really have to tweak, but enough guys tinkering in garages have made it work that you sort of wonder. I don't know of any serious researchers who have looked into it. Probably because it does seem to be pretty crackpot stuff.

But I still can't help wondering.

/Theorist

I'm convinced.

When he said "that electrical thing", he had me sold.

never mind the whole explanation ha gave was about standard electrical pieces and not his device.

enemy of the state: I can't tell from the video just what this guy is trying to do. But I will mention there's been a device out there for about 30 years in which the magnetic field in an inductor is collapsed extremely rapidly, and the successive collapses supposedly create enough energy to basically act like it's a perpetual motion machine. The name of the device escapes me.

Sounds like complete BS, like cold fusion, but the guy who invented it has never tried to make any money off of it. The physics of the rapid collapse of a magnetic field aren't well understood. If you removed the earth, for instance, just zapped it out of existence, it's magnetic field would persist for about a thousand years. There's no doubt, experiments have proved this sort of magnetic field persistence.I have admit I don't understand how that could be and I have a PhD in physics.

I can't help but be intrigued by the idea that given that a magnetic field will persist when the electric field driving it has disappeared, perhaps zapping a magnetic field out of existence might give rise to an electric field that persists.

Mythbusters made one such device and of course it didn't work, but they also made a few shortcuts that I think would have resulted on the project being DOA. It seems to be one of those things that you really have to tweak, but enough guys tinkering in garages have made it work that you sort of wonder. I don't know of any serious researchers who have looked into it. Probably because it does seem to be pretty crackpot stuff.

But I still can't help wondering.

/Theorist

Yes, and if you made an infinitely rigid material you could transmit information faster than the speed of light. Too bad no such material exists in our universe.

Gwyrddu: Meh, he stored up enough potential energy to power 900 watts for a minute, or 54 KJ or 13 Calories. or about 5% of the energy in a doughnut. He wanted to claim some self-sustaining perpetual motion machine, he would have to run it much longer than that even if such an idea didn't violate our fundamental understanding of physics.

You can tell from the blue flame that this was a particularly sweet doughnut..,

enemy of the state: If you removed the earth, for instance, just zapped it out of existence, it's magnetic field would persist for about a thousand years.

No it wouldn't. That's like saying, "If I have a magnet, and then the magnet isn't there anymore, there's still a magnetic field." Electromagnets persist for some time due to electrical induction.

Now, if you were to magically vanish the Earth, there would be a retained magnetic field, after a fashion- since the Earth's magnetic field extends through the Universe, it will always be out there, someplace, at least until the speed of light catches up with it.


enemy of the state: I don't know of any serious researchers who have looked into it. Probably because it does seem to be pretty crackpot stuff.

Probably because it's complete bullshiat, more likely. The first warning sign of crackpot, fringe science is that the primary driver of the phenomenon is "farkin' magnets."

StrangeQ: Why do people try to pull stuff like this? I have to assume that anyone savvy enough to put a contraption like that together knows enough to know that it is bullshiat, and then by extension that other people will know it is a con as well. Who does he really think he is going to fool?

You must not be familiar with the perpetual motion, zero point energy conspiracy people. I'm sure it takes a lot of forms, but the one I heard was it's a govt. conspiracy (big surprise there) to keep free energy to themselves. It exists, *they* just don't want us to have it.

Pics or it didnt...

... Well, I'm sold.

SwingDancer: The All-Powerful Atheismo: Morons. I can go into space, start something spinning by giving it just the right push and then call it a perpetual motion machine.

But as soon as I try to use it to extract energy by putting some sort of load on it, it will stop.

Just because something has energy... i.e. it is moving... does not mean it is a "perpetual motion machine."

/engineer

Perpetual Motion does not have to provide excess work. Only useful work.

a machine that can continue to do work indefinitely without drawing energy from some external source; impossible under the law of conservation of energy

wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Perpetual motion describes hypothetical machines that operate or produce useful work indefinitely and, more generally, hypothetical machines that produce more work or energy than they consume, whether they might operate indefinitely or not.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion_machine

/not an engineer
//The slashies ate my baby


A distinction without a difference.

So an Amish guy figured out an electric generator that has powers itself...color me convinced. =/

So the Amish are making home science videos and posting them to YouTube.

Good for them?

OK, so I have counted at least four engineers that have responded to this thread. Where have you guys been? Why didn't you figure this out, instead of some hillbillyt with a beard that has to manually screw in the light bulbs?!?

Sheesh, no wonder people don't feel the need to go to college!

/has a Masters Degree
// just not in anything useful...

mongbiohazard: SwingDancer: The All-Powerful Atheismo: Morons. I can go into space, start something spinning by giving it just the right push and then call it a perpetual motion machine.

But as soon as I try to use it to extract energy by putting some sort of load on it, it will stop.

Just because something has energy... i.e. it is moving... does not mean it is a "perpetual motion machine."

/engineer

Perpetual Motion does not have to provide excess work. Only useful work.

a machine that can continue to do work indefinitely without drawing energy from some external source; impossible under the law of conservation of energy

wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Perpetual motion describes hypothetical machines that operate or produce useful work indefinitely and, more generally, hypothetical machines that produce more work or energy than they consume, whether they might operate indefinitely or not.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion_machine

/not an engineer
//The slashies ate my baby


A distinction without a difference.


No, One provides enough energy to sustain itself only. The other does that, plus an excess for something else. The difference is EXTREMELY important. Both impossible as we understand them, but one can be theorized in a perfect situation to come close to existing, the other not so much.

Anyone mention Primer yet?


/good movie to check your brain at the door
//or else it hurts

Keyser_Soze_Death: Zombalupagus: I was under the impression that the Amish were not allowed to use technology. Or wear blue denim.

Came here to say basically this.

What does the Amish need with a generator?

Cash registers aren't hand-cranked anymore?

Chevello: Keyser_Soze_Death: Zombalupagus: I was under the impression that the Amish were not allowed to use technology. Or wear blue denim.

Came here to say basically this.

What does the Amish need with a generator?

Cash registers aren't hand-cranked anymore?

Interestingly enough, they ARE allowed to use some electricity as long as it is provided by their own generators. They usually use it for stuff like washing machines.

SwingDancer: One provides enough energy to sustain itself only
That's permitted by the First Law of Motion, otherwise known as "inertia". The "external force" is friction.

SwingDancer: The other does that, plus an excess for something else. THAT is EXPRESSLY forbidden by the Second Law of Thermodynamics.

HUGE difference.

StrangeQ: Chevello: Keyser_Soze_Death: Zombalupagus: I was under the impression that the Amish were not allowed to use technology. Or wear blue denim.

Came here to say basically this.

What does the Amish need with a generator?

Cash registers aren't hand-cranked anymore?

Interestingly enough, they ARE allowed to use some electricity as long as it is provided by their own generators. They usually use it for stuff like washing machines.

The Amish church allows for a lot of local autonomy. There's at least one district that allows automobiles as long as they're a dark color with all the chrome stripped off - nothing flashy, you know. Another district will permit you to use internal combustion engines but not rubber tires, so they have tractors with steel tires, horse-drawn engines with the PTO shaft driving a hay baler, things like that and such as.