Blackberry is the new AOL. When I see someone with a Blackberry or an AOL address, I think "out of touch."

As i have been saying for the last few years, RIMM is the new Nortel.

/blackberry contract ended earlier this year. Got a Samsung Galaxy S2. 50000 times better than anything BB has.

kronicfeld: jgi: Blackberry is the new AOL. When I see someone with a Blackberry or an AOL address, I think "out of touch."

I continue to use my Blackberry precisely because of its simple functionality. A keyboard that gives me tactile feedback and that I can use both hands to type on is important to me. I don't need it for complex internet or app activity; I have my iPad for that. And I don't have to snyc and re-snyc and update firmware all the time. And it has good battery life, and I have the option of swapping in an already-charged spare battery if I don't have the ability to charge it. I don't have to go through the monstrosity that is iTunes if I want to move files back and forth; I can simply access the SD card and use it like a hard drive. Just because the commercials tell you that you need a Droid or an IPhone to play Angry Birds or Words with Friends with your hipster friends (note: this is a direct reference to the blatant, over-the-top, hipster-targeting ipod touch commercial that is playing every ten minutes on every tv channel), that's not the same thing as having a phone that gives you the functionality you want for the context in which you use it.

And it has Texas Hold 'Em and Pandora and President Obama uses one and I can buy a 10-pack of them on eBay for $20 and it's cool and you're stupid heads if you don't think so so there!

kronicfeld: jgi: Blackberry is the new AOL. When I see someone with a Blackberry or an AOL address, I think "out of touch."

I continue to use my Blackberry precisely because of its simple functionality. A keyboard that gives me tactile feedback and that I can use both hands to type on is important to me. I don't need it for complex internet or app activity; I have my iPad for that. And I don't have to snyc and re-snyc and update firmware all the time. And it has good battery life, and I have the option of swapping in an already-charged spare battery if I don't have the ability to charge it. I don't have to go through the monstrosity that is iTunes if I want to move files back and forth; I can simply access the SD card and use it like a hard drive. Just because the commercials tell you that you need a Droid or an IPhone to play Angry Birds or Words with Friends with your hipster friends (note: this is a direct reference to the blatant, over-the-top, hipster-targeting ipod touch commercial that is playing every ten minutes on every tv channel), that's not the same thing as having a phone that gives you the functionality you want for the context in which you use it.

So in other words, you're a dinosaur.

poisonedpawn78: As i have been saying for the last few years, RIMM is the new Nortel.

/blackberry contract ended earlier this year. Got a Samsung Galaxy S2. 50000 times better than anything BB has.

I worked for Nortel in the late 90's, specifically when they had this choice:

a) split investment/partnership with Cisco
b) buy Bay

I facepalmed so hard when they went with B. Left for a new job, too. I knew they were doomed from that point on.

/Sadly, I was right

kronicfeld: I continue to use my Blackberry precisely because of its simple functionality. A keyboard that gives me tactile feedback and that I can use both hands to type on is important to me. I don't need it for complex internet or app activity; I have my iPad for that. And I don't have to snyc and re-snyc and update firmware all the time. And it has good battery life, and I have the option of swapping in an already-charged spare battery if I don't have the ability to charge it. I don't have to go through the monstrosity that is iTunes if I want to move files back and forth; I can simply access the SD card and use it like a hard drive. Just because the commercials tell you that you need a Droid or an IPhone to play Angry Birds or Words with Friends with your hipster friends (note: this is a direct reference to the blatant, over-the-top, hipster-targeting ipod touch commercial that is playing every ten minutes on every tv channel), that's not the same thing as having a phone that gives you the functionality you want for the context in which you use it.

Well, I still need my AOL account because when I log in my home screen is familiar to me. My stocks and email all in one place!

If you like your BB, fine, but they're a pain in the ass to support in a corporate environment -- in my experience, BBs have to be wiped a couple times per year because of some Exchange/BES sync screw up. Also, relying on BES and the device's integration with RIM adds another level of failure to operation (as we've seen recently with RIM outages). Ultimately, if you don't use your BB in an Enterprise fashion, if you use it simply as a phone, calendar, and a place to read your AOL email, then you're probably okay. A BB will get the job done. But let's not pretend that the UI is intuitive or enjoyable to use or that the devices themselves are high end technology.

RIM is toast.

They're still in business? Haven't seen one of their phones in years.

/Last one I saw was a Storm, my co-worker bought it and returned it within the week.

Have the other OS installed the security that Blackberry has? I was under the impression that the only thing that kept them going was they had better security for mobile e-mail and Blackberry Messenger. Is that still true?

kronicfeld: jgi: Blackberry is the new AOL. When I see someone with a Blackberry or an AOL address, I think "out of touch."

I continue to use my Blackberry precisely because of its simple functionality. A keyboard that gives me tactile feedback and that I can use both hands to type on is important to me. I don't need it for complex internet or app activity; I have my iPad for that. And I don't have to snyc and re-snyc and update firmware all the time. And it has good battery life, and I have the option of swapping in an already-charged spare battery if I don't have the ability to charge it. I don't have to go through the monstrosity that is iTunes if I want to move files back and forth; I can simply access the SD card and use it like a hard drive. Just because the commercials tell you that you need a Droid or an IPhone to play Angry Birds or Words with Friends with your hipster friends (note: this is a direct reference to the blatant, over-the-top, hipster-targeting ipod touch commercial that is playing every ten minutes on every tv channel), that's not the same thing as having a phone that gives you the functionality you want for the context in which you use it.


The problem is that phones aren't just about performance and specs or what it can do...it's about style. Apple isn't selling you a phone, it's selling an image....it's selling a $200+ make-you-cool-device.

Right now, blackberry is still associated with big business, corporate America, greedy, republican conservative, old fart who wear suits. On top of that, they're trying to beat apple at their own game and take on motorolla, htc, samsung, google, LG, who are all making droid phones...it's a virtually unwinable fight against a series of giant corporations equally good at their job of making phones...

As I see it, their best option is to switch to the android operating system. Admit defeat (a la Toshiba and the HD DVD format??) of their OS and join the ranks of Motorola, HTC, Samsung, LG, etc...

Then make a great phone...come out with some new (touchscreen) phone that is using a faster processor, more ram, is light, thin, has 4G, long battery life (it's a tall order, I know), etc...AND no bloatware. Personally, I think it would at least give them a fighting chance to stay in the game and turn their company around.

/I'd give an android BB phone a look

carnifex2005: kronicfeld: jgi: Blackberry is the new AOL. When I see someone with a Blackberry or an AOL address, I think "out of touch."

I continue to use my Blackberry precisely because of its simple functionality. A keyboard that gives me tactile feedback and that I can use both hands to type on is important to me. I don't need it for complex internet or app activity; I have my iPad for that. And I don't have to snyc and re-snyc and update firmware all the time. And it has good battery life, and I have the option of swapping in an already-charged spare battery if I don't have the ability to charge it. I don't have to go through the monstrosity that is iTunes if I want to move files back and forth; I can simply access the SD card and use it like a hard drive. Just because the commercials tell you that you need a Droid or an IPhone to play Angry Birds or Words with Friends with your hipster friends (note: this is a direct reference to the blatant, over-the-top, hipster-targeting ipod touch commercial that is playing every ten minutes on every tv channel), that's not the same thing as having a phone that gives you the functionality you want for the context in which you use it.

So in other words, you're a dinosaur.

If he's a dinosaur I must be at least 6001 years old.

/regular old flip phone

mrtoadswildride: As I see it, their best option is to switch to the android operating system.

They wouldn't have any better luck doing that then they are having trying to get their QNX-based OS out the door. Their biggest problem is that they don't just sell phones - they have an entire back end infrastructure that is specifically set up to support their phones. It's their biggest asset AND their biggest weakness. All blackberry traffic, worldwide, travels through one of their data centers. Data to and from your phone is encrypted and compressed end-to-end, so Blackberries use comparatively less bandwidth per user (a plus) but Blackberries also have extra single points of failure in the chain (minus). The encryption of the data makes them extremely secure from a smart phone perspective (a plus) but it also requires overhead on the phone which slows down performance (minus).

The problem they are having with their own new OS at this point is that they can't seem to integrate it quickly into their existing back end, so they're probably building a whole new one. If they had managed to do that this year, then it would have made sense - imagine a phone as snappy as the iPhone or an Android but with real, quantifiable extra security built-in. Instead, they seem so incredibly incompetent that by the time they do get the new OS out the door they won't matter anymore.

I had high hopes for them - they gave me a Playbook for free and if they could have just duplicated THAT experience on a phone they would have been fine. Sadly, they couldn't manage that, so they are flailing.

Also mark my words - if they can't deliver a QNX based phone until late 2012, then they can't get a native email client on the Playbook, either. All of it is dependent on them upgrading their back end to accept more than one PIN (unique identifier) per user, which was a stupid restriction they should have been working to resolve four years ago.

mrtoadswildride: The problem is that phones aren't just about performance and specs or what it can do...it's about style. Apple isn't selling you a phone, it's selling an image....it's selling a $200+ make-you-cool-device.

Yep. Millions of suckers are throwing metric crap-tons of money at Apple for a phone that only makes them look good. You bet.

Please... despite all the losses swirling around every business that has so much as touched Android, despite all the malware, despite the Carrier IQ scandal, despite Google making more money of search from iPhone than the entire Android ecosphere, despite iOS apps earning 300% more revenue, despite all that sucks in real, measurable data about Android... tell us how Android is "winning". I keep forgetting.

The problem with your analysis - besides, you know, EVERYTHING, is there is nowhere for BB to turn. Not one Android handset manufacturer has filed a 10-Q showing a profit in, oh, forever. The service providers are just starting to bleed money from the support costs of Android. The entire Android ecosphere is teetering on the edge of collapse because there just isn't any money in it.

But here come people like you, pretending they are Moses coming down off the mountain with the one, the single, the only business idea to save a beleaguered company. The only problem is it cannot work. Here in a little place I like to call 'reality', Apple is beating the holy living fark out of everyone else in the game with logistics.

See, when you don't have ideological blinders on, you can read things like Apple's 10-Q report. It will show you little things like Apple buying up - and already paying for - a majority of the flash memory production on the planet.

Until 2026.

That means Apple sets the price of flash memory on this planet. That means nobody will sell anything that has flash memory in it for a lower price than Apple. That means Apple can sell an iPhone for $299 (under contract, of course) and make a farking metric crap-ton of money while everyone else sucks wind in a failed effort to match Apple's pricing.

The problem is simply this : even if Apple grows at 0.0% until Q4 2015 it will still accumulate in excess of $300 billion dollars in the bank. That's what it has yet to realize in profits on sales it cannot book because of accounting rules and what-not. That is just coasting on what it has already done in the last couple of years.

Aside from your delusions, exactly where is any company in the Android universe going to come up with $300 billion dollars to counter Apple? Are you going to loan them the money?

The simple reality found in any recent 10-Q is that at least two handset manufacturers not named Apple are going to go out of business in the next couple of years. It is inevitable as Apple is sucking all the oxygen out of the room, the house, and greater metropolitan area. The only slim chance of this not happening is if Apple would suddenly and for no reason abandon the cell phone market.

So - with all that to take into account, tell us exactly what BB is supposed to do to stop the inevitable : Have a bake sale?

jgi: kronicfeld: I continue to use my Blackberry precisely because of its simple functionality. A keyboard that gives me tactile feedback and that I can use both hands to type on is important to me. I don't need it for complex internet or app activity; I have my iPad for that. And I don't have to snyc and re-snyc and update firmware all the time. And it has good battery life, and I have the option of swapping in an already-charged spare battery if I don't have the ability to charge it. I don't have to go through the monstrosity that is iTunes if I want to move files back and forth; I can simply access the SD card and use it like a hard drive. Just because the commercials tell you that you need a Droid or an IPhone to play Angry Birds or Words with Friends with your hipster friends (note: this is a direct reference to the blatant, over-the-top, hipster-targeting ipod touch commercial that is playing every ten minutes on every tv channel), that's not the same thing as having a phone that gives you the functionality you want for the context in which you use it.

Well, I still need my AOL account because when I log in my home screen is familiar to me. My stocks and email all in one place!

If you like your BB, fine, but they're a pain in the ass to support in a corporate environment -- in my experience, BBs have to be wiped a couple times per year because of some Exchange/BES sync screw up. Also, relying on BES and the device's integration with RIM adds another level of failure to operation (as we've seen recently with RIM outages). Ultimately, if you don't use your BB in an Enterprise fashion, if you use it simply as a phone, calendar, and a place to read your AOL email, then you're probably okay. A BB will get the job done. But let's not pretend that the UI is intuitive or enjoyable to use or that the devices themselves are high end technology.

RIM is toast.

I fully appreciate that this applies to 6.0 and especially 5.0 -- 7.0 is great and 7.1 will be better.

beta_plus: Have the other OS installed the security that Blackberry has? I was under the impression that the only thing that kept them going was they had better security for mobile e-mail and Blackberry Messenger. Is that still true?

I think so. A lot of work and a lot of certification goes in to that area, and it is taken quite seriously.RTOGUY: I bought a new Bold 9900 on Wednesday and I love it. I know that there are plenty of phones out there that do more but I just love the Blackberry layout and it works perfectly for me and I can actually send a text or email with the keyboard. I've tried the touchscreen typing on other phones and I can't do it the whole process feels wrong to me. The guy at the cellphone store was trying to talk me out of the Blackberry and into an Android phone or iPhone and he couldn't comprehend that I didn't want a phone to watch movies or play games on.

Even then - your phone supports OpenGL 2 ES and I watch lots of YouTube videos, TED videos, etc.

I have my e-mail/PIM data synced enterprise, I have Social Feeds set up to several RSS sites - everything I care about. I have filters and custom views for the social networking content I care about. I'm excited about NFC coming. Browsing has a few glitches that need to be worked out, but it's decent. What's wrong? What don't you like?

1macgeek: The only slim chance of this not happening is if Apple would suddenly and for no reason abandon the cell phone market.

Well that, or someone invents a better replacement for flash memory. That would kind of screw Apple if the replacement is cheaper and better performing. Granted, it's a slim-to-none chance, but it's possible.

1macgeek: mrtoadswildride: The problem is that phones aren't just about performance and specs or what it can do...it's about style. Apple isn't selling you a phone, it's selling an image....it's selling a $200+ make-you-cool-device.

Yep. Millions of suckers are throwing metric crap-tons of money at Apple for a phone that only makes them look good. You bet.

Please... despite all the losses swirling around every business that has so much as touched Android, despite all the malware, despite the Carrier IQ scandal, despite Google making more money of search from iPhone than the entire Android ecosphere, despite iOS apps earning 300% more revenue, despite all that sucks in real, measurable data about Android... tell us how Android is "winning". I keep forgetting.

The problem with your analysis - besides, you know, EVERYTHING, is there is nowhere for BB to turn. Not one Android handset manufacturer has filed a 10-Q showing a profit in, oh, forever. The service providers are just starting to bleed money from the support costs of Android. The entire Android ecosphere is teetering on the edge of collapse because there just isn't any money in it.

But here come people like you, pretending they are Moses coming down off the mountain with the one, the single, the only business idea to save a beleaguered company. The only problem is it cannot work. Here in a little place I like to call 'reality', Apple is beating the holy living fark out of everyone else in the game with logistics.

See, when you don't have ideological blinders on, you can read things like Apple's 10-Q report. It will show you little things like Apple buying up - and already paying for - a majority of the flash memory production on the planet.

Until 2026.

That means Apple sets the price of flash memory on this planet. That means nobody will sell anything that has flash memory in it for a lower price than Apple. That means Apple can sell an iPhone for $299 (under contract, of course) and make a farking m ...



Do you feel better now that you got that out of your system? man, how long have you been holding that in? it feels like weeks? Or did you just in on your first stock conferee call and now you feel all smarter than thou???

Do you really suck this bad at reading comprehension...

First, I didn't say the only reason people iphone is because it makes them look cooler...but let's face it, style, coolness, being hip...has been apple's main selling point since they launched the ipod. They don't out right say it, but they ooze it out of every frame of every ad. that having a mac/apple product is cool and everythign else is lame. their entire ad was "If you don't have an iphone, then you don't have an iphone"...so, actually, I stand by my previous statement.

Second, I thought this went without saying, but I assumed that apple would not let RIM put IOS on a BB phone. Instead of trying to beat apple and droid, which probably can't be done, ....join droid (hey good news, android is open source)....I admit, I don't know alot about what goes on behind the scenes at apple, the droid makers, or RIM....but whatever RIm is doing...it isn't working at all.

Third, I'm not here to get into a financial debate over apple vs. every android phone maker and whether the android ecosphere is on teetering on collapse....Becuase that has absolutely no relevance RIM or their future, also becuase you seem annoying...really, really annoying.

That and RIM has already gone over the edge...they aren't teetering on it anymore...they fell off, are in the raging river and are heading toward the huge waterfall with spikey rocks at the bottom...If they don't do something, they going to just continue to die a slow AOL-esque death as more people and companies move towards apple/droid.

/Sorry...what's your proposal again? Oh, that's right...it's to suck up steve jobs' ghost...yeah that makes sense. The best solution is for RIM to gush about how insanely awesome apple is just admit they are the greatest company to ever sell anything in the history of the world....that will fix their market share.

My 2 cents:

RIM needs to become a "Communication Solutions" company in the same way that IBM got out of PCs and became a "Technology Solutions" company.

/I see Nokia making a push with the Windows OS into the higher-end smartphone market ( I think they're still the #1 manufacturer in terms of units sold, but that's with their more basic offerings being available on the cheap and being of solid build quality. Used to have a Nokia that I ran over with my car and it still worked.)

mrtoadswildride: Do you really suck this bad at reading comprehension...

Ouch. It may take me... mere seconds to get over that deliciously ironic, yet sophomoric rebuttal. Ask your Mommy what that means, she will explain the big words to you.

Let's try it again with smaller words : There. Is. No. Place. For. BlackBerry. To. Turn.

There is Apple on one side, with enough money to fill a Dyson sphere. On the other side is the black hole of bankruptcy called Android, devouring all money in its path except when it is customer money. Android seems to repel that. Everyone having anything to do with Android is losing money with the exception of Google. Even then, Google is taking a year to accumulate what Apple is making in about two weeks.

There is no way in hell Apple is going to license iOS. BB can't compete against Apple. Everything Android is flushing down the toilet because there is no money to be made. Yet you say of BB : "If they don't do something"...

So tell us, oh magical business oracle : what is that something? Bottle and sell leprechaun farts? Harvest pixie dust? Sell unicorn rides?

Consider one more thing before you answer. Consider the former CEO of Nokia and how he warned that embracing Android was like pissing your pants to stay warm in winter.

Ok. You may answer now, o wizard, o wise one...

I had Bluckberry, until I got an iPhone. All the apps I used, like Salesforce and mapmyrun on iPhone were 1000% better. Then I compared it to the Android, and it's now officilally 100000% percent better.

kronicfeld: jgi: Blackberry is the new AOL. When I see someone with a Blackberry or an AOL address, I think "out of touch."

I continue to use my Blackberry precisely because of its simple functionality. A keyboard that gives me tactile feedback and that I can use both hands to type on is important to me. I don't need it for complex internet or app activity; I have my iPad for that. And I don't have to snyc and re-snyc and update firmware all the time. And it has good battery life, and I have the option of swapping in an already-charged spare battery if I don't have the ability to charge it. I don't have to go through the monstrosity that is iTunes if I want to move files back and forth; I can simply access the SD card and use it like a hard drive. Just because the commercials tell you that you need a Droid or an IPhone to play Angry Birds or Words with Friends with your hipster friends (note: this is a direct reference to the blatant, over-the-top, hipster-targeting ipod touch commercial that is playing every ten minutes on every tv channel), that's not the same thing as having a phone that gives you the functionality you want for the context in which you use it.

Blackberry is ok if you don't use it much, want to feign the ability to look up things on the web through your phone and tether.

If you use your phone with any regularity and actually want to use anything _not_ simply placing a phone call, it sucks donkey dick.

Fortunately my black berry eventually died (and I got 20 bucks credit for recycling it) and I'm much happier with my rooted HTC Thunderbolt with a grandfathered in unlimited data plan.

Treygreen13: So it's a $1 RIM job.

One
One dollar
One dollar RIM job

1macgeek: mrtoadswildride: Do you really suck this bad at reading comprehension...

Ouch. It may take me... mere seconds to get over that deliciously ironic, yet sophomoric rebuttal. Ask your Mommy what that means, she will explain the big words to you.

Let's try it again with smaller words : There. Is. No. Place. For. BlackBerry. To. Turn.

There is Apple on one side, with enough money to fill a Dyson sphere. On the other side is the black hole of bankruptcy called Android, devouring all money in its path except when it is customer money. Android seems to repel that. Everyone having anything to do with Android is losing money with the exception of Google. Even then, Google is taking a year to accumulate what Apple is making in about two weeks.

There is no way in hell Apple is going to license iOS. BB can't compete against Apple. Everything Android is flushing down the toilet because there is no money to be made. Yet you say of BB : "If they don't do something"...

So tell us, oh magical business oracle : what is that something? Bottle and sell leprechaun farts? Harvest pixie dust? Sell unicorn rides?

Consider one more thing before you answer. Consider the former CEO of Nokia and how he warned that embracing Android was like pissing your pants to stay warm in winter.

Ok. You may answer now, o wizard, o wise one...

Maybe... I know this is a wild thought out of left field, so stay with me here... Maybe the former CEO of Nokia said that because NOKIA SMARTPHONES WERE EXCLUSIVELY RUNNING SYMBIAN, A PROPRIETARY OS THAT NOKIA OWNS, WHEN HE SAID THAT!

Dude, I get that you like Apple. Great. I like HTC, and I (mostly) like Google. Here's a news flash: Despite what you may think, Steve Jobs was probably not the Maitreya Buddha.

Android as a platform is pretty popular. The device manufacturers for Android don't make as much money as Apple because they don't control the entire Android ecosystem. If I am dissatisfied with Samsung, but still want an Android phone, I can go to HTC (which is exactly what I did. fark Samsung and their wonky GPS antennae). If I want an iOS device, I'm stuck with the iPhone. I pay what Apple wants. There is no competition within the ecosystem. I can also buy monthly insurance for my HTC phone for $8/month, and that insurance is good for as long as I have my device. How much is Apple Care, and how long does it last? Does the carrier get that money, or does Apple?

Dude, give the Apple blowjobs a rest. iOS has its good points. Android has its good points. Both platforms appeal to different groups of users. My mom uses an iPhone. She loves it. She probably has no use for an Android phone because she doesn't do anything that would require one (like viewing Flash content, or running a terminal emulator, or using an app like Locale). I do a lot with my phone. It is my primary media/computing device at this point. I need something with more capabilities than an iPhone. Also, I like being able to customize my phone.

/fanbois are irritating.

I hate apple with a passion. Have ever since the I dragged the CD-ROM to the trash can 10 years ago and it didn't eject but the OS thought it had ejected. Who the hell doesn't have an eject button on the hardware? Anyone who owns any apple product is my mortal enemy.

Oh yeah RIM though. The only reason they are still around is the reluctance of organizations to support something new. Like someone else said, stop being a phone manufacturer and start selling communications services.

/Wife owns an iphone.
//Never trust a phone with 1 button.

imasig: I hate apple with a passion. Have ever since the I dragged the CD-ROM to the trash can 10 years ago and it didn't eject but the OS thought it had ejected. Who the hell doesn't have an eject button on the hardware? Anyone who owns any apple product is my mortal enemy.

Oh yeah RIM though. The only reason they are still around is the reluctance of organizations to support something new. Like someone else said, stop being a phone manufacturer and start selling communications services.

/Wife owns an iphone.
//Never trust a phone with 1 button.

My phone has a power button and a volume rocker. The Home, Menu, Back and Search keys are all soft keys. It works pretty well. I can navigate through the bootloader and recovery menu with the volume rocker and use the power button to make my selections.I have yet to have a problem with the HTC EVO 4G that wasn't my own doing and couldn't be fixed within 20 minutes.

/never trust a phone with no removable battery or storage

jgi: Blackberry is the new AOL. When I see someone with a Blackberry or an AOL address, I think "out of touch."

I still use my AOL address because I used to work there.

/shrug

imasig: I hate apple with a passion. Have ever since the I dragged the CD-ROM to the trash can 10 years ago and it didn't eject but the OS thought it had ejected. Who the hell doesn't have an eject button on the hardware? Anyone who owns any apple product is my mortal enemy.

They do have an eject button -- you just need a paperclip to poke it. Steve Jobs wasn't big on buttons, clearly.

I thought they already split up

beta_plus: Have the other OS installed the security that Blackberry has? I was under the impression that the only thing that kept them going was they had better security for mobile e-mail and Blackberry Messenger. Is that still true?

They have the advantage of full device encryption so all the data on a lost or stolen device is safe, which is a requirement for jobs where data is required to be secured (government, health, finance). As far as email security goes, though, modern Exchange servers and compatible devices use the same AES encryption BB uses, so if the servers are configured with the same key strength they should be equally resistant to decryption. Exchange also supports remote device management (such as disabling cameras on the device or forcing alphanumeric lock codes) and remote locking and wiping. I've been using Exchange on mobile devices for years and have never felt like I was missing anything compared to BB.

As for Blackberry Messenger, Lync or a unified communications solution from Cisco or Avaya is much superior for business, while Facebook messenging is probably your best personal IM option right now, since EVERYONE you know is probably going to have a Facebook account and a phone that is compatible with Facebook messenger (hell, Windows Phone even has Facebook Messaging baked into the OS so it is like sending a text).

Also, the data compression was quite useful back in EDGE days of data speeds that were half that of a dial up modem, but in today's world of 30-odd Mbps LTE data networks being able to compress an email a little bit isn't really all that big a selling point.

Mad_Radhu: Also, the data compression was quite useful back in EDGE days of data speeds that were half that of a dial up modem, but in today's world of 30-odd Mbps LTE data networks being able to compress an email a little bit isn't really all that big a selling point.

Even though they aren't selling it - it is a big deal in the US if your smartphone contract has an xGB limit per month. You'll get more data with a Blackberry - always.

Unfortunately, they aren't selling that.

/ Ouch
// Got nothin' on AAPL and GOOG

Lsherm: Mad_Radhu: Also, the data compression was quite useful back in EDGE days of data speeds that were half that of a dial up modem, but in today's world of 30-odd Mbps LTE data networks being able to compress an email a little bit isn't really all that big a selling point.

Even though they aren't selling it - it is a big deal in the US if your smartphone contract has an xGB limit per month. You'll get more data with a Blackberry - always.

Unfortunately, they aren't selling that.

Most data limits are 2GB per month. You'd have to be pushing a hell of a lot of email for that to be a significant part of your data consumption, since the actual message part of the email is a matter of kilobytes. Attachments are what is really going to eat up your data, but every push email solution Ive seen downloads those on demand, so even though your email may be getting hundreds of MB of mail, your phone will only see a fraction of that data usage since it only downloading the body of the message.

At the end of the day, I think the way BB truly saves you from data overages is by not having any apps available that would actually use any data, like Netflix.

twat_waffle: Android as a platform is pretty popular. The device manufacturers for Android don't make as much money as Apple because they don't control the entire Android ecosystem.

One more time, again with smaller words :

Google (who does control the entire Android ecosystem). Makes. As. Much. Off. Android. In. A. Year. As. Apple. Makes. In. Two. Weeks.

This isn't about liking Apple, this is about pulling your head out of your ass and reading the farking 10-Q's the companies are filing. Every company embracing Android is losing money except Google. Even Google isn't making a lot of money off Android. Ergo, the ecosystem will necessarily collapse for a lack of profit.

One doesn't even have to like Apple to see the handwriting on the wall. Word on the street is Apple is about to report yet another record quarter with profits some 80% above last quarter, or some such truck. If that does hold true Apple will post a profit around $13 billion dollars for Q4 '11. That's not sales, that profit.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see who is 'winning', just someone to pull their head out of their ass and read the financial pages. The entire Android ecosystem is losing money because of their cheap-assed customers, and Apple has a license to print money because its customers will spend money. All other things being equal, one doesn't need a Harvard MBA to see who is going to 'win' this battle.

That I like Apple, or not, has absolutely no effect on any of the above. It's going to happen no matter what I say or do. I just find it sad and pathetic that people like you stick their fingers in their ears, hum really loud and try to pretend Android is 'winning'.

My prediction : Android is completely dead in under five years, and WebOS will be the new Android. It will also die within five years. It's not about freedom, it's not about who is 'open', it's about generating enough profit to sustain the ecosystem. Until everyone pushing Android learns they have the most broke-ass, cheap SOB's for customers, we will play this out again, and again, and again. Different name, different OS's... same results.

1macgeek: twat_waffle: Android as a platform is pretty popular. The device manufacturers for Android don't make as much money as Apple because they don't control the entire Android ecosystem.

One more time, again with smaller words :

Google (who does control the entire Android ecosystem). Makes. As. Much. Off. Android. In. A. Year. As. Apple. Makes. In. Two. Weeks.

This isn't about liking Apple, this is about pulling your head out of your ass and reading the farking 10-Q's the companies are filing. Every company embracing Android is losing money except Google. Even Google isn't making a lot of money off Android. Ergo, the ecosystem will necessarily collapse for a lack of profit.

One doesn't even have to like Apple to see the handwriting on the wall. Word on the street is Apple is about to report yet another record quarter with profits some 80% above last quarter, or some such truck. If that does hold true Apple will post a profit around $13 billion dollars for Q4 '11. That's not sales, that profit.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see who is 'winning', just someone to pull their head out of their ass and read the financial pages. The entire Android ecosystem is losing money because of their cheap-assed customers, and Apple has a license to print money because its customers will spend money. All other things being equal, one doesn't need a Harvard MBA to see who is going to 'win' this battle.

That I like Apple, or not, has absolutely no effect on any of the above. It's going to happen no matter what I say or do. I just find it sad and pathetic that people like you stick their fingers in their ears, hum really loud and try to pretend Android is 'winning'.

My prediction : Android is completely dead in under five years, and WebOS will be the new Android. It will also die within five years. It's not about freedom, it's not about who is 'open', it's about generating enough profit to sustain the ecosystem. Until everyone pushing Android learns they have the most broke-as ...

Is Google a handset maker as well? Is Android a proprietary system? Apple will make more money off of iOS devices because they manufacture and sell them. Google puts out one Nexus device a year, and those are manufactured by third parties like Samsung and HTC.

If the device manufacturers were losing money on Android, they wouldn't be selling Android devices, would they? They must know something that you don't...

Here's the thing: When your only competition on your platform is your old devices, you have a license to print money. When you have to compete with companies like ZTE and Sanyo for customers, you won't be making as much. Android users are willing to spend the $200 on a new device every four years, just like the non-retarded iPhone users (read: the ones who don't feel the need to early adopt every single iProduct as soon as it is released).

Like I alluded to before, it's not a farking zero sum game. Both platforms have their strengths and weaknesses. Both appeal to different core groups of users. There is room for both in the marketplace. Apple's very existence as a company is proof of that in the PC market. You're trying to compare apples to a tropical fruit salad.

I'm not jumping in to a flame war... But if you look at the marketshare that RIMM (that is what the thread is about right?) lost to in the last 3Qs, it's been android.
Especially globally.

I use my BB to email for work, update my outlook calendar, stream pandora at home and text. It's great for those purposes.

twat_waffle: You're trying to compare apples to a tropical fruit salad.

No, I am trying to educate someone who is dumber than a bag of hammers as to what reality is.

Ask Mommy for help if you have to, but try to understand this concept :

1. Google is making money off Android BECAUSE they do not manufacture the hardware.

2. Even that amount of money is paltry compared to Apple. One more time : It takes Google one year to rack up the same amount of profits as it takes Apple two weeks to make.

3. Every single manufacturer of Android handsets has reported a loss this year.

4. In the coming year the cell phone service providers are going to start reporting losses because the support costs of Android are starting to eat them alive.

5. Developers report they make 300% more income from iOS than Android.

What do they know that I do not? Not a damned thing judging by reality. No, I take that back, they do know how to flush billions of dollars down a rathole and bankrupt companies while they are doing it.
Exactly where do you think this magical pile of money exists in the Android universe? To believe you we would have to believe every single CFO and CEO suddenly lost their minds and thought it a brilliant idea to perpetrate a fraud and report they were losing money instead of making it. To believe you there would have to be a massive, international conspiracy to craft the illusion the Android ecosystem is teetering on the verge of collapse.

All of reality, the Wall Street Journal, and the SEC point to a simple and believable reality : you are just dumber than a stump. You have yet to offer up one single shred of proof to back up anything you say, while everything I say can be, and is backed up with financial reporting, 10-Qs, and just the ability to read a newspaper.

Sadly, these requirements appear completely beyond your grasp.

So you can keep being an idiot, and I will be more than happy to keep hammering away until your stupidity is destroyed. The choice is completely yours, so choose wisely.

jlawn001: But if you look at the marketshare that RIMM (that is what the thread is about right?) lost to in the last 3Qs, it's been android.

Market share doesn't matter. Profit does.

Apple is currently 15% of the market, but is devouring 65% of the total industry profit. If market share mattered at all, Android and RIM would be profitable but they are provably not.

Look, people - this is not a tough concept to comprehend. He who makes the most profit wins, with all other things being equal. If it takes you all year to craft a single bullet, and I make 26 bullets in that same timeframe, then when the shoot-out comes it doesn't take a genius to see who is going to win. Your single bullet may score a lucky shot, but I may pull off 26 lucky shots, or maybe 12 lucky shots, and 14 near-misses. The point is the odds say you are going to be dead, deader, deadest while I should walk away without a scratch.

Show me who is making more money than Apple, and I will show you who will survive the iPhone onslaught. If you can't, then I will show you companies which will - at best - be minor players and at worst bankrupt and forgotten.

1macgeek: jlawn001: But if you look at the marketshare that RIMM (that is what the thread is about right?) lost to in the last 3Qs, it's been android.

Market share doesn't matter. Profit does.

Apple is currently 15% of the market, but is devouring 65% of the total industry profit. If market share mattered at all, Android and RIM would be profitable but they are provably not.

Look, people - this is not a tough concept to comprehend. He who makes the most profit wins, with all other things being equal. If it takes you all year to craft a single bullet, and I make 26 bullets in that same timeframe, then when the shoot-out comes it doesn't take a genius to see who is going to win. Your single bullet may score a lucky shot, but I may pull off 26 lucky shots, or maybe 12 lucky shots, and 14 near-misses. The point is the odds say you are going to be dead, deader, deadest while I should walk away without a scratch.

Show me who is making more money than Apple, and I will show you who will survive the iPhone onslaught. If you can't, then I will show you companies which will - at best - be minor players and at worst bankrupt and forgotten.

Sir -- in all due respect, you have no fraking idea what Google has unleashed. Apple will only go down from here.... as a private company will never be able to compete with the ingenuity and speed of change that will pour out of an open source movement on this scale. Google will be making money (on android) in ways that we can't even comprehend right now.

A technology company is just like biological organism. The quicker it evolves, the more likely it is to stay healthy. A private company has to pay for its evolution. Android evolves for free.

The next time you feel like underestimating open source's ability to profit.... you might want to check into what Apple's OS X GUI has running under its hood.

1macgeek: mrtoadswildride: Do you really suck this bad at reading comprehension...

Ouch. It may take me... mere seconds to get over that deliciously ironic, yet sophomoric rebuttal. Ask your Mommy what that means, she will explain the big words to you.

I talked to my mom....she said you're a raging fanboy douche-bag...whatever that means.

Let's try it again with smaller words : There. Is. No. Place. For. BlackBerry. To. Turn.


Well, then they are screwed....might as well throw i the towel, have a bbq and enjoy the last years until bankruptcy....Oh, wait...they are already headed down that road. Huh, maybe, just maybe, they should try something new instead of continuing down the path of failure...sort of like if a flailing, (distant) second place computer company, which had maybe 2% of the market, decide to go in a new direction, and focus less on making computers no one wanted and got in took the business in another path....(but yeah, that would never work....Microsoft already already has the PC sowed up)...do you get the analogy yet? Do I need to give more hints? We're talking about apple. And how if they had tried to Microsoft at their own game they would loose...but they invented a new game...and now are winning....the ipod/iphone market.....See change is sometimes good.

There is Apple on one side, with enough money to fill a Dyson sphere. On the other side is the black hole of bankruptcy called Android, devouring all money in its path except when it is customer money. Android seems to repel that. Everyone having anything to do with Android is losing money with the exception of Google. Even then, Google is taking a year to accumulate what Apple is making in about two weeks.

Just curios.... What is apple's share of the search engine/ad revenue market (I'm guessing right around zero). Yes, apple is making a lot of money in iphones...but Google is making a lot of money in searches/ads. So what's your point again? Ah, yes...android is doomed and apple is the greatest company in the history of companies...

You understand that google is an information company? And that information has to come from somewhere...That google is the #1 search engine for a reason? and that smartphones are a way to collect information....for example, that nice,neat up-to-the-second traffic data comes from somewhere....(hint: it's your phone and the fact that it's not moving)...Maybe google isn't making loads of money in the phone game....but they don't have to becuase the phone game is simply to supplement their information business.
See that's the whole point. You don't try to beat someone at their own game...you invent your own versin of calvin ball and win that game.


There is no way in hell Apple is going to license iOS. BB can't compete against Apple. Everything Android is flushing down the toilet because there is no money to be made. Yet you say of BB : "If they don't do something"...

So tell us, oh magical business oracle : what is that something? Bottle and sell leprechaun farts? Harvest pixie dust? Sell unicorn rides?

I thought I made my idea pretty clear. MY idea is to jump on board with android. (You really do suck at comprehension). Though I do like the unicorns ride idea and the leprechaun fart business.

Or I guess they can keep their current business model and hope to keep the company alive with corporate accounts. Their current business model is failing. their stock price is tumbling...and their market share is in a distant third (4th if you go worldwie and count symbian) and they are losing share every day.

Your plan seems to be "lick apple's taint"...My plan is jump on board with android.

Here's why.

1. BB is pretty much screwed....(maybe they aren't, but they look like it), no one really likes them. They tolerate them...but no one is getting excited for BB newest phone release.
2. Apple isn't going to let anyone touch their ios.
3. Android is an open source OS...so BB could put it on their phones.
4. According to your completely unbiased, and un-cited internet rant every.....every android maker is screwed beyond belief too.

5. Let's assume for a second statement #4 is correct.

6. Even if android is screwed, BB is screwed way worse...at least give yourself a chance with android...and maybe Android turns it around in the long run and (oh, I don't know...becomes the #1 OS in world...hey it could happen.)

/Or just beg to his holiness, steve jobs, for forgives....maybe that will work.

1macgeek: twat_waffle: You're trying to compare apples to a tropical fruit salad.

No, I am trying to educate someone who is dumber than a bag of hammers as to what reality is.

Ask Mommy for help if you have to, but try to understand this concept :

1. Google is making money off Android BECAUSE they do not manufacture the hardware.

2. Even that amount of money is paltry compared to Apple. One more time : It takes Google one year to rack up the same amount of profits as it takes Apple two weeks to make.

3. Every single manufacturer of Android handsets has reported a loss this year.

4. In the coming year the cell phone service providers are going to start reporting losses because the support costs of Android are starting to eat them alive.

5. Developers report they make 300% more income from iOS than Android.

What do they know that I do not? Not a damned thing judging by reality. No, I take that back, they do know how to flush billions of dollars down a rathole and bankrupt companies while they are doing it.
Exactly where do you think this magical pile of money exists in the Android universe? To believe you we would have to believe every single CFO and CEO suddenly lost their minds and thought it a brilliant idea to perpetrate a fraud and report they were losing money instead of making it. To believe you there would have to be a massive, international conspiracy to craft the illusion the Android ecosystem is teetering on the verge of collapse.

All of reality, the Wall Street Journal, and the SEC point to a simple and believable reality : you are just dumber than a stump. You have yet to offer up one single shred of proof to back up anything you say, while everything I say can be, and is backed up with financial reporting, 10-Qs, and just the ability to read a newspaper.

Sadly, these requirements appear completely beyond your grasp.

So you can keep being an idiot, and I will be more than happy to keep hammering away until your stupidity is destroyed. The choice is comp ...

You are a raging fanboi. Your blind devotion to all things Apple clouds your mind. I'm done with you.

/kill file engage!
//*plonk*

So, let me see if I have this straight...

Release a shiatty product (Blackberry Playbook), have global outtages, and essentially drive a company into the ground = get full salary.
Doing nothing until the company is taken off life support = get $1.00 salary.

Still sounds like they're getting paid a dollar too much.

mrtoadswildride: I thought I made my idea pretty clear. MY idea is to jump on board with android.

That is your brilliant idea? To jump out of the frying pan and into the fire?

Android is losing money hand-over-fist for everyone except Google. That is an inarguable fact. Even what Google makes is but a two-week effort for Apple. So your idea to save RIM is for them to not only stay in the burning building, but to rush down the stairs and jump into the fire?

Now you know why you are stuck in Mommy's basement and not running a Fortune 500 company.

twat_waffle: You are a raging fanboi. Your blind devotion to all things Apple clouds your mind. I'm done with you.

Yeah, because I can read the Wall Street Journal, Financial Times and Forbes I am a fanboi. Even if I started hating Apple tomorrow everything I wrote is still true. Pick up the 10-Qs and R-E-A-D. The only company making money off Android is Google, and even that isn't so hot. $800 million dollars for the year. Apple is about to announce profits for the quarter where they are going to make that in two weeks.

My God, you have to be stupid to not see that Google is making more money off search from the iOS than they are making with all of Android. Swing of the cluebat : 300% more.

These are hard numbers being reported in the financial press. You just have to look at the articles and cross reference the 10-Qs to see they are factual and accurately reported. This isn't some wish of mine, this is reality and history that is unfolding before our very eyes. Sticking your fingers in your ears and humming very loudly isn't going to stop that reality from happening.