And if you live in a northern climate stop paying your utilities. Most state laws state that a utility cannot shut you off when the temp gets low.

You have three options if you lose your house and find yourself without a home.

1. Get a job and buy a new one

2. Die out in the cold

3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

Republicans are okay with 1 and 2. Democrats are okay with 1 and 3. The difference with the first option is that democrats understand that has become almost impossible for the current and next generation of the middle class and lower.

So if just fix the system so option 1 is viable again and we're okay. If not, everyone will just have to live with the remaining options.

Saiga410: And if you live in a northern climate stop paying your utilities. Most state laws state that a utility cannot shut you off when the temp gets low.

Not just up north Georgia has the same law, unless your power company is an EMC.

/leaned this when I was a brokeass college student.

This has all been well-documented. They are calling it a sort of second stimulus package. All the billions of dollars that would have been spent on morgages that have instead been spent on ipads, iphones, HTDVs and, gasp, food and healthcare.

2 or 3 years of free rent is a pretty good incentive to default on your loan, even if you aren't underwater yet.

Paying the mortgage is just flushing money down the toilet.

AcneVulgaris: 2 or 3 years of free rent is a pretty good incentive to default on your loan, even if you aren't underwater yet.

Paying the mortgage is just flushing money down the toilet.

Millions of Americans agree with you, but still cry when the banks foreclose.

Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: 3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

So, it's OK to steal, depriving someone else of their fundamental rights?

Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: You have three options if you lose your house and find yourself without a home.

1. Get a job and buy a new one

2. Die out in the cold

3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

Republicans are okay with 1 and 2. Democrats are okay with 1 and 3. The difference with the first option is that democrats understand that has become almost impossible for the current and next generation of the middle class and lower.

So if just fix the system so option 1 is viable again and we're okay. If not, everyone will just have to live with the remaining options.

Unless it's #2. Get it?

dittybopper: Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: 3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

So, it's OK to steal, depriving someone else of their fundamental rights?

A person's basic rights to shelter overrides a bank's right to profit, yes. You didn't really assume I meant taking away someone's home, their own shelter, by force just so you could have one. We have an eight million house surplus in the United States, we have no reason to make more people homeless just because things have gone to shiat.

The best Christmas gift you could give your kids is a paying job.

Set Our Children Free!

LL316: Unless it's #2. Get it?

Ha

Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: dittybopper: Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: 3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

So, it's OK to steal, depriving someone else of their fundamental rights?

A person's basic rights to shelter overrides a bank's right to profit, yes. You didn't really assume I meant taking away someone's home, their own shelter, by force just so you could have one. We have an eight million house surplus in the United States, we have no reason to make more people homeless just because things have gone to shiat.

Actually what should happen is both of these rights should enter a steel cage and battle it out to decide which one is more fundamentalerest.

Step 1: Charge lots more for everything, including food, heat and mortgages. Put ramen on the futures market.

Step 2: Stagnate wages and lay off as many people as possible.

Step 3: Hire trolls on fark to make up the lie that "bootstraps" are the key

Step 4: Profit?

Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: You have three options if you lose your house and find yourself without a home.

1. Get a job and buy a new one

2. Die out in the cold

3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

Republicans are okay with 1 and 2. Democrats are okay with 1 and 3. The difference with the first option is that democrats understand that has become almost impossible for the current and next generation of the middle class and lower.

So if just fix the system so option 1 is viable again and we're okay. If not, everyone will just have to live with the remaining options.

I hate when people equate owning a 'house' to a basic human right. Or when people complain that poor people can't afford to BUY houses.

I'm poor now. I don't have a house. I have a crappy apartment. I grew up in a crappy townhouse.

Personally, I think goes.....

Shared living spaces
Renting an Apartment
Renting a townhouse
Owning a condo/apartment
Owning a townhouse
Renting a house
Owning a house

When my parents were poor we rented a townhouse. When I was poor I lived in an old lady's bedroom. When I had more money, I got an apartment. Then, eventually, I bought a condo. Then, I bought a house (but a complete piece of crap house). After that I was poor again and my wife and I ended up renting a bedroom from a creepy old guy. Then we got a crappy apartment.

Owning a home is pretty much at the top of a pretty tall spectrum. I'm tired of people acting like it's some god-given right....or that getting tossed out of their house (after not paying for months) is some horrible violation of human rights. Then you've got people like yourself who talk about 'rising up' and taking things by force.....and I'm kinda like....wtf, really?

I get that people need to eat. But this is a lot like people flipping out because they can't afford to go to a decent sit-down restaurant each week and claiming that they should because they have a basic right to food. I'm not saying people don't need to eat, but there is a LOT of food that is a LOT cheaper than sit-down restaurants. I get that people need a place to live; but owning a home is not the only solution.

Fark_Guy_Rob: Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: You have three options if you lose your house and find yourself without a home.

1. Get a job and buy a new one

2. Die out in the cold

3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

Republicans are okay with 1 and 2. Democrats are okay with 1 and 3. The difference with the first option is that democrats understand that has become almost impossible for the current and next generation of the middle class and lower.

So if just fix the system so option 1 is viable again and we're okay. If not, everyone will just have to live with the remaining options.

I hate when people equate owning a 'house' to a basic human right. Or when people complain that poor people can't afford to BUY houses.

I'm poor now. I don't have a house. I have a crappy apartment. I grew up in a crappy townhouse.

Personally, I think goes.....

Shared living spaces
Renting an Apartment
Renting a townhouse
Owning a condo/apartment
Owning a townhouse
Renting a house
Owning a house

When my parents were poor we rented a townhouse. When I was poor I lived in an old lady's bedroom. When I had more money, I got an apartment. Then, eventually, I bought a condo. Then, I bought a house (but a complete piece of crap house). After that I was poor again and my wife and I ended up renting a bedroom from a creepy old guy. Then we got a crappy apartment.

Owning a home is pretty much at the top of a pretty tall spectrum. I'm tired of people acting like it's some god-given right....or that getting tossed out of their house (after not paying for months) is some horrible violation of human rights. Then you've got people like yourself who talk about 'rising up' and taking things by force.....and I'm kinda like....wtf, really?

I get that people need to eat. But this is a lot like people flipping out because they can't afford to go to a decent sit-down restaurant each week and claiming that they should because they have a basic right to food. I'm not saying people don't need to eat, but there is a LOT of food that is a LOT cheaper than sit-down restaurants. I get that people need a place to live; but owning a home is not the only solution.

Thank you for bringing some sense into this discussion. Sometimes when I read Fark threads, I start to think everyone in the world has gone mad.

Fark_Guy_Rob: I get that people need a place to live; but owning a home is not the only solution.

good post. the problem is people don't rent out rooms much anymore. you can't go to the YMCA or rent a single room on the cheap, so your only two options are homelessness or an apartment, if you can afford it.

dittybopper: So, it's OK to steal, depriving someone else of their fundamental rights?

If you're a Republican, you can always steal from the poor and/or a minority group who doesn't have any rights.

Lost Thought 00: The best Christmas gift you could give your kids is a paying job.

Set Our Children Free!

This guy thinks that you have the right idea:

Man On Fire: good post. the problem is people don't rent out rooms much anymore.

Have you checked Craigslist? I don't know about where you live, but around here there are lots of listings for rooms or basement suites for rent.

Man On Fire: Fark_Guy_Rob: I get that people need a place to live; but owning a home is not the only solution.

good post. the problem is people don't rent out rooms much anymore. you can't go to the YMCA or rent a single room on the cheap, so your only two options are homelessness or an apartment, if you can afford it.

I actually lived in a YMCA for a couple months back in the 1990s. $110 per week IIRC. I think you can still do it.

Fark_Guy_Rob: Owning a home is pretty much at the top of a pretty tall spectrum. I'm tired of people acting like it's some god-given right....or that getting tossed out of their house (after not paying for months) is some horrible violation of human rights. Then you've got people like yourself who talk about 'rising up' and taking things by force.....and I'm kinda like....wtf, really?

Yes really. I'm poor and I pay rent for a cheap ass apartment. But I'm a minimalist and I don't care to own many things. I do however see the need to not be throwing people out of their homes because the current state of things. Owning a house is not a basic human right, but proper shelter is. Read back what option 1 was. Then read it again. Now what did I say we needed to do? That's right, we need to make that a VIABLE option again. It use to be you could work towards that goal. You said it was "at the top of a pretty tall spectrum". Which was true and always had been. But now renting a house is about the best many can hope for. The BEST. And if you get thrown out of you home because you lost your job or got hurt and some other countless bullshiat that happens to everyone you sure as hell are not going to the next best option. You get to start all over again, but now with lots of debt.

Fark_Guy_Rob: When my parents were poor we rented a townhouse. When I was poor I lived in an old lady's bedroom. When I had more money, I got an apartment. Then, eventually, I bought a condo. Then, I bought a house (but a complete piece of crap house). After that I was poor again and my wife and I ended up renting a bedroom from a creepy old guy. Then we got a crappy apartment.

Great, were you over 50? Did you have kids? Could both of you work? Does your situation apply for everyone?

Debeo Summa Credo: I actually lived in a YMCA for a couple months back in the 1990s. $110 per week IIRC. I think you can still do it.

Every YMCA I know of is just a gym now.

Saiga410: And if you live in a northern climate stop paying your utilities. Most state laws state that a utility cannot shut you off when the temp gets low.

I lived in Ohio through two brutal winters and I can tell you, at least in Ohio, that they will in fact cut you off no matter what the weather is like.

Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: Fark_Guy_Rob: Owning a home is pretty much at the top of a pretty tall spectrum. I'm tired of people acting like it's some god-given right....or that getting tossed out of their house (after not paying for months) is some horrible violation of human rights. Then you've got people like yourself who talk about 'rising up' and taking things by force.....and I'm kinda like....wtf, really?

Yes really. I'm poor and I pay rent for a cheap ass apartment. But I'm a minimalist and I don't care to own many things. I do however see the need to not be throwing people out of their homes because the current state of things. Owning a house is not a basic human right, but proper shelter is. Read back what option 1 was. Then read it again. Now what did I say we needed to do? That's right, we need to make that a VIABLE option again. It use to be you could work towards that goal. You said it was "at the top of a pretty tall spectrum". Which was true and always had been. But now renting a house is about the best many can hope for. The BEST. And if you get thrown out of you home because you lost your job or got hurt and some other countless bullshiat that happens to everyone you sure as hell are not going to the next best option. You get to start all over again, but now with lots of debt.

Fark_Guy_Rob: When my parents were poor we rented a townhouse. When I was poor I lived in an old lady's bedroom. When I had more money, I got an apartment. Then, eventually, I bought a condo. Then, I bought a house (but a complete piece of crap house). After that I was poor again and my wife and I ended up renting a bedroom from a creepy old guy. Then we got a crappy apartment.

Great, were you over 50? Did you have kids? Could both of you work? Does your situation apply for everyone?

I am not poor and rent because I had a house got divorced and even though I could afford it by myself I decided I liked food more than a 3 bedroom house just for me. Could not sell it and it needed work so I got an apartment. I don't need much so I am happy as a clam saving $500 a month and not having to do maint.

winterwhile: lets Occupy the Farm

they are rich now

can we all say... animal farm??????/

you forgot to change alts there, nyzooman.

also, you get a score of 2, for the obvious reason.

It's the New American Moral Code.

"If I steal this much, what are they going to do?"

"Really? That all?"

"How about if I steal that much?"

"Alright. I can deal with that. Let's paarrrrttttyyyy...."

highwayrun: Saiga410: And if you live in a northern climate stop paying your utilities. Most state laws state that a utility cannot shut you off when the temp gets low.

I lived in Ohio through two brutal winters and I can tell you, at least in Ohio, that they will in fact cut you off no matter what the weather is like.

Same for Michigan. Two comforters and a fleece blanket don't do a whole lot against bitter cold; well, mid-40s indoors at any rate. Managed to keep bills paid up since, however. Lesson learned, I guess.

meat0918: Those days are gone now, aren't they? The whole saving throughout the year or a parent picking up an extra shift. Any extra money goes to credit card and mortgage and car payments, assuming you are lucky enough to get an extra shift.

Yep. The bootstrappers will tell you you're financially irresponsible for having any of those things, but ignore that our parents did it all and still had wages left over to live a good life. Don't let'em fool you.

FiL: I graduated college debt free in 1976 and had a house bought and paid for by 1978. If you bothered to work hard, you could do the same thing. Why don't I have any grandchildren yet?
Me: Your parents paid your $2000 tuition, minimum wage was the equivalent of $15/hr in today's dollars, and your house cost 40K, a slight hair above what your first out of college job paid.
My college education cost 40K, I spent two years just looking for a good job, and once I got it, it paid $15/hr. A house like yours costs $230,000, or about 7x what I make per year. Assuming grandchildren, just popping one out at the hospital would cost me $15K., let alone what other medically necessary procedures to ensure your grandchildren has all his fingers and toes. Just die already and leave me your house.

meat0918: Growing up, my mom and dad saved all year for Christmas gifts, with Dad volunteering extra hours at the plant getting time and a half for extra money throughout the year, and if he worked the Thanksgiving evening shift, triple time.

Those days are gone now, aren't they? The whole saving throughout the year or a parent picking up an extra shift. Any extra money goes to credit card and mortgage and car payments, assuming you are lucky enough to get an extra shift.

My wife and I save for holiday gifts all year and make a lot of things from scratch for people (preserves, soaps and lotions, hot sauces, kids hats, etc.). It's nice to emerge from the holidays without any extra debt.

My hours got cut going into the holidays, and they will be reduced "until further notice". I made up for it last week with some overtime, but there is never a guarantee of overtime where I work. If there is no overtime available, then I am farked. Well and truly farked. I've only had this job since October, so it will look pretty bad to try to find a new job now. It's not even in a field I'd like to work in. I take orders and sell cell phones and service. About 50% of my job relies on my ability to bullshiat someone into buying something. I want to work in IT, but that's not possible because I don't have certification or a degree, and I can't afford to pursue either.

So, yes, "those days" are done. Stick a fork in them.

One of my favorite stories from when I was a collector: A fellow collector was talking to a woman who told him she couldn't pay her mortgage because she spent the money on presents for her kids.

"I hope you bought them tents"

dittybopper: Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: 3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

So, it's OK to steal, depriving someone else of their fundamental rights?

Hey it worked for Israel. ;)

My mortgage is $250 a month. That is why I own a house. And that
is why I'm not on the streets right now, or at mom's, which would be worse--the monthly propane bill is probably $250.

/It's pretty cozy too. I'm not sneering.
//Too bad there's no farking jobs around here.

Sergeant Grumbles: Yep. The bootstrappers will tell you you're financially irresponsible for having any of those things, but ignore that our parents did it all and still had wages left over to live a good life. Don't let'em fool you.

I'm almost that old myself (graduated college the first time in '84) and don't let them bullshiat you. It's much harder to get by today. Sure, people have a lot more shiat, but that's not all of it. My dad supported our entire family of five without a college degree, had a prestigious job, had insurance, we had two cars (he traveled a lot), we had a nice middle-class living. My mom scraped a little (she was cheap, and thank god I inherited it), but we had plenty of everything. She worked a little when we kids were in high school. And two of us went to college without loans.

Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: ain and we're

Evil Kirk vs Bad Ash: You have three options if you lose your house and find yourself without a home.

1. Get a job and buy a new one

2. Die out in the cold

3. Rise up and take one of the most fundamentally basic human rights of shelter by force if necessary.

Republicans are okay with 1 and 2. Democrats are okay with 1 and 3. The difference with the first option is that democrats understand that has become almost impossible for the current and next generation of the middle class and lower.

So if just fix the system so option 1 is viable again and we're okay. If not, everyone will just have to live with the remaining options.

You forgot the fourth option: Rent
You forgot the fifth option: public housing

dosboot: You forgot the fourth option: Rent
You forgot the fifth option: public housing

You act like that shiat isn't being priced out of peoples' reaches.
My rent is going to rise from 825 to 875 next year, and the only reason I can surmise is that the property owner doesn't think he makes enough money. And fark, ten years ago this place would have been 4-500, easily. Back then, I lived in a Studio for $300/month plus utilities, and the same damn thing will cost you $600 these days.

Sergeant Grumbles: dosboot: You forgot the fourth option: Rent
You forgot the fifth option: public housing

You act like that shiat isn't being priced out of peoples' reaches.
My rent is going to rise from 825 to 875 next year, and the only reason I can surmise is that the property owner doesn't think he makes enough money. And fark, ten years ago this place would have been 4-500, easily. Back then, I lived in a Studio for $300/month plus utilities, and the same damn thing will cost you $600 these days.

Plus, this time of year is really bad to be out looking for an apartment. There aren't many for rent because no one is really moving until the spring.

As for public housing, it's very hard to qualify if you're anything but destitute.

MrEricSir: dittybopper: So, it's OK to steal, depriving someone else of their fundamental rights?

If you're a Republican, you can always steal from the poor and/or a minority group who doesn't have any rights.

I know that it's cool to bash the Repubs, but have you seen some of the stuff that goes on in (what are normally) Democrat-controlled areas?

Give you a hint - they don't call it the "People's Republic of New Jersey" for nothing, nor do they do so because of it's right-leaning tendencies.

Give me a person with the power to take something away from someone, and odds are you'll find that that person will do so readily. It's a societal issue, not merely a political one.

Of course they won't foreclose. Bank employees and sheriffs need vacation too

On January 2nd, however, everyone is fair game. No more house for you.