This can all be fixed with the return of Zombie Reagan.

The Onion is prophetic: Same with southern Arizona... sunny most of the year here, too. And yet, when I went to Germany last year (where it was cloudy and rainy the entire 3 weeks I was there), they have solar panels up the wazoo.

The Germans are always putting SOMETHING up their wazoo...

ArkAngel: Sin_City_Superhero: I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why houses here in Vegas don't have solar panels. With as much sunshine as we get here, they should be everywhere, but you hardly ever see them. And when you do, they're not on houses. They're on shiat like billboards and stuff.

Because the housing market in Vegas is in worse shape than Detroit.

Woah, let's not jump the gun here. Nothing can be worse than Detroit.

AdolfOliverPanties: Need to break up the monopoly that electric utilities have. Let companies come forward that can compete for contracts to supply energy created through solar.

This.

There's something horribly wrong if electric companies are Raising rates when demand drops. That's not Capitalism in any way, shape, or form. It's a monopoly.

And I quote: "It can also cause solar systems to switch off." HOLY FREAKIN CRAP!

Glad I don't pay it because I make my electricity.

[still however pay nuclear decommission "tax" even though I don't use any electric and so will all of America when they start taking all other nuclear plants that are old off line.]

AdolfOliverPanties: How come there are several different phone companies?

There WAS one phone company, they were assholes, the government broke them up, and they've been trying to re-assemble terminator 1000 style ever since.

The Onion is prophetic: Sin_City_Superhero: I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why houses here in Vegas don't have solar panels. With as much sunshine as we get here, they should be everywhere, but you hardly ever see them. And when you do, they're not on houses. They're on shiat like billboards and stuff.

Same with southern Arizona... sunny most of the year here, too. And yet, when I went to Germany last year (where it was cloudy and rainy the entire 3 weeks I was there), they have solar panels up the wazoo.

Up the wazoo? You mean, where the sun don't shine? I thought German engineers were better than that.

so, too much electrizzy? I guess the Aussie electrical engineers are now in a tizzie

Loses?

You loose.

Sounds like they're taking a page out of the Big Oil playbook:

"We have to raise prices because people are buying too much gas!"
"We have to raise prices because people aren't buying enough gas!"
"We have to raise prices to maintain our oil surplus!"
"We have to raise our prices because our oil reserves are in short supply!"

I've heard stories of electric companies keeping the SAME (or close to the same) rates for buisiness that converted to solar and produced almost all their own power under the rational that they "had to pay for the infrastructure costs" associated with stringing the power lines.

Lines which were strung 50 years prior.

With LENR just around the corner look for other energy companies to start jacking their rates up in advance when we're almost on the cusp of people having cold-fusion devices about as large as two "tall boy" beer cans being able to power and heat homes, cars, etc, for months at a time for next to no cost.

FTA: It can also cause solar systems to switch off.

That's a bit alarmist isn't it?

brerrabbit: This would result in startup companies buying and selling electricity but also paying a reasonable fee for the upkeep of the lines. If managed correctly, this would result in a more robust grid and cheaper power.

We have this shining example.

AdolfOliverPanties: How come there are several different phone companies? Can a similar thing not be done with electrical? License them out to electricity suppliers? I admit a fair amount of ignorance on this subject.

They tried it when I lived in Atlanta. It got so bad that they reinstalled the monopoly. The thing was that several companies provided power, but still had to rent the lines of delivery from the city, who charged them for upkeep, etc. So they delivered the extra cost (as always) to the consumer. Wattage prices increased dramatically, and public outcry forced the hand of local government to change back. The price didn't go down, of course.

That's how I remember it happening, anyway...

/thank you, thcana!

It costs a surprising amount of money initially to go green for a whole buildings electrical needs, and the panels have to be replaced about every 10 years. Over the shelf life of the panel itself, the tax write off hardly touches the cost of the original equipment purchase and installation. Too many folks just cant afford the initial cost to lower their carbon footprint for the greater good.

Aarontology: Power companies are afraid of competition.

I live in Hawaii, and our Hawaiian Electric encourages people to put solar panels on their houses. I think they're required for new construction.

Of course Hawii is somewhat unique, we're obviously not on the national grid and most power plants are run on oil which needs to be shipped in.

To be fair, the article said that the power companies would need to upgrade the grid in rural areas in order to deal with the increased volatility of the voltage that solar causes. In order to do those upgrades, they need money, which they'll get from raising rates. This makes sense. Grids in the US and Australia were planned and built long before people were putting up solar panels on their homes, so it's a fair assumption that some upgrades may be required.

Sin_City_Superhero: I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why houses here in Vegas don't have solar panels. With as much sunshine as we get here, they should be everywhere, but you hardly ever see them. And when you do, they're not on houses. They're on shiat like billboards and stuff.

Vegas housing was build mostly by developers looking to cash in quick. They dont typically care about long term viability of their construction.


On an even bigger picture, what is needed is a new way we address ownership. Mainly, we need to get rid of the "developer".

When someone is building the house/office/etc that they intend to live in, that strucuture is typically to a higher quality, and has long-range accountability. With developers (from houses to office towers) they only care about the first few months its in their name. Once its sold and they dont have to live/work there, they are gone, and thus, simply do not care.

Thats what made buildings better in the old days. When people built homes on a house by house basis as needed, and to their particular desires, and when the company that occupied a building owned it. There was pride in ownership.

People talk about solar reaching grid parity, but not much is being said about what happens when it significantly surpasses current costs. We're nearing a tipping point where electricity is going to keep getting cheaper and cheaper instead of more expensive.

AdolfOliverPanties: How come there are several different phone companies? Can a similar thing not be done with electrical? License them out to electricity suppliers? I admit a fair amount of ignorance on this subject.

Given the rock solid service and performance of AT&T, I can see why you'd want that same level of quality from your electrical provider.

Oh_Enough_Already: I've heard stories of electric companies keeping the SAME (or close to the same) rates for buisiness that converted to solar and produced almost all their own power under the rational that they "had to pay for the infrastructure costs" associated with stringing the power lines.

Lines which were strung 50 years prior.

With LENR just around the corner look for other energy companies to start jacking their rates up in advance when we're almost on the cusp of people having cold-fusion devices about as large as two "tall boy" beer cans being able to power and heat homes, cars, etc, for months at a time for next to no cost.

*raised eye-brow* Oh really? Citation please. And not that crappy car Chevy used to make. Nor a 1990's geo-cities page with dazzling animated gifs.

FishyFred: THE runaway take-up of rooftop solar panels is undermining the quality of electricity supplies, feeding so much power back into the network that it is stressing the system and causing voltage rises that could damage household devices such as computers and televisions.

Next week's press release from a utility industry group: Solar panels will fry your Macbook!

Is that how inverters work now? Wow, I missed that part in class.

AdolfOliverPanties: SchlingFocker: AdolfOliverPanties: Need to break up the monopoly that electric utilities have. Let companies come forward that can compete for contracts to supply energy created through solar.

That would require all the power lines and infrastructure to be made public property, owned by the government.

Da tovarich, that'll go over well here in the U.S.

How come there are several different phone companies? Can a similar thing not be done with electrical? License them out to electricity suppliers? I admit a fair amount of ignorance on this subject.

New York state already has this. Every year, you select what electric company you want to supply you in an open enrollment type deal like health insurance.

The Onion is prophetic: Sin_City_Superhero: I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why houses here in Vegas don't have solar panels. With as much sunshine as we get here, they should be everywhere, but you hardly ever see them. And when you do, they're not on houses. They're on shiat like billboards and stuff.

Same with southern Arizona... sunny most of the year here, too. And yet, when I went to Germany last year (where it was cloudy and rainy the entire 3 weeks I was there), they have solar panels up the wazoo.

Solar panels do not increase the value of the homes, unlike putting in stainless steel appliances* (and most residents are underwater in those places home equity loans are a thing of the past).

*according to HGTV

ICU812: Over the shelf life of the panel itself, the tax write off hardly touches the cost of the original equipment purchase and installation. Too many folks just cant afford the initial cost to lower their carbon footprint for the greater good.

There are companies that provide loans exclusively for this purpose. For most people, the loan payment is less than the cost of electricity from your local power company.

LemSkroob: Sin_City_Superhero: I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why houses here in Vegas don't have solar panels. With as much sunshine as we get here, they should be everywhere, but you hardly ever see them. And when you do, they're not on houses. They're on shiat like billboards and stuff.

Vegas housing was build mostly by developers looking to cash in quick. They dont typically care about long term viability of their construction.


On an even bigger picture, what is needed is a new way we address ownership. Mainly, we need to get rid of the "developer".

When someone is building the house/office/etc that they intend to live in, that strucuture is typically to a higher quality, and has long-range accountability. With developers (from houses to office towers) they only care about the first few months its in their name. Once its sold and they dont have to live/work there, they are gone, and thus, simply do not care.

Thats what made buildings better in the old days. When people built homes on a house by house basis as needed, and to their particular desires, and when the company that occupied a building owned it. There was pride in ownership.

Amen. I live in Phoenix and the housing tracts done by developers always deteriorate quickly, but old homes in some of the historic neighborhoods manage to hold on even when unoccupied for a while.

Sin_City_Superhero: I cannot, for the life of me, figure out why houses here in Vegas don't have solar panels. With as much sunshine as we get here, they should be everywhere, but you hardly ever see them. And when you do, they're not on houses. They're on shiat like billboards and stuff.

Homeowner associations mostly. My brother and I have looked into getting either solar cells and/or windmills to power his house, and his HOA won't allow it.

This is what happens when you create a profit incentive for shiat you actually want to have less of. Energy conservation will never be anything more than an empty PR stunt as long as companies are selling and profiting from selling electricity. What other business would willing try to sell less of its product?

I know all the Tea Party assholes will scream "Communism!" but utility companies really show be run by either local or state governments, with incentives to reduce consumption as much as possible.

The same argument applies to private prisons. As long as someone is making money from locking people up, they're going to pay lawmakers to create more reasons to lock people up and for longer periods of time.

ICU812: and the panels have to be replaced about every 10 years.

Panels need to be replaced every ten years? Really? Where do people come up with bullshiat like this? That's just ridiculously false.

It appears that most of the people commenting either didn't actually read the article, or they failed to understand what they were reading.

Sounds like a great idea to get a bit more solar cells and then cut off the outside power feed. That way the power company won't have to worry about my overloading their system.

and why does the guy on the roof in the article look like red green?

wow, i'm sorry (did't read the whole article either...) but it doesn't take a genius to realize power lines are not one way...