Yup

If the Torygraph says so, it must be true.

"The Department for Education (DFE) also said thousands of schools had been unaffected with around 13 per cent operating as normal, and a further 13 per cent partially open."

Yup, no effect at all.

As a non-union government worker, I'm certainly not surprised.

We've all gone mad.

Unions are no longer needed. This isn't the 1920's when there were no labor laws.

It's just greed is all workers unions stand for anymore.

Trolling headline. Trolling article.

Seth'n'Spectrum: If the Torygraph says so, it must be true.

I'll bet you don't believe Fox Snooze either. You have all the markings of a libtard that relies on things as flimsy as facts.

MasterChief-M4: Unions are no longer needed.

Thats the ticket

Oh wait ...

Steep, Lasting Drop in Wages

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405270230424870457557421389777 0 830.html

Hell, the government can't even agree with itself on this. That's usually a sign they're floundering

Education Secretary Michael Gove says the industrial action "has had a severe impact on schools across the country and has caused disruption to children's schooling and to parents and employers".

David Cameron has said the strike by public sector workers is proving "a damp squib" with many key services continuing to operate. (Both quotes from the BBC)

What does the public think about a bunch of public sector workers demanding their support (and tax money) in maintaining union member benefits and lifestyles? "You owe me!" isn't much of a rallying cry.

MasterChief-M4: Unions are no longer needed. This isn't the 1920's when there were no labor laws.

It's just greed is all workers unions stand for anymore.

I see. "Greed" is when people want to earn decent middle-class wages to support their families, but not when the employer wants to suck every last drop of productivity out of its workers and pay the absolute minimum possible for that productivity. Gotcha.

ThunderChild: Hell, the government can't even agree with itself on this. That's usually a sign they're floundering

Education Secretary Michael Gove says the industrial action "has had a severe impact on schools across the country and has caused disruption to children's schooling and to parents and employers".

David Cameron has said the strike by public sector workers is proving "a damp squib" with many key services continuing to operate. (Both quotes from the BBC)

Not really, it's just a minor application of doublethink.

The strikes are having no effect (ha ha, the strikers have no influence) but by their actions they are hurting children (boo, evil strikers).

MasterChief-M4: Unions are no longer needed. This isn't the 1920's when there were no labor laws.

It's just greed is all workers unions stand for anymore.

Labor laws aren't enforced unless the workers make them so by direct action. This is the same idiocy that would say "Oh 8 hour day law is passed, so they must have it. There was no need for strikes the year later.:
Greed is all the employer stands for, the stealing of other people's paychecks even after they charge a use fee in profits just so they can work what they need to make a living.
Greed is the essence of capitalism.

jjorsett: What does the public think about a bunch of public sector workers demanding their support (and tax money) in maintaining union member benefits and lifestyles? "You owe me!" isn't much of a rallying cry.

It is when they do.
You're complaining that the victim is taking action against the armed robber.

The Dog Ate My Homework: MasterChief-M4: Unions are no longer needed. This isn't the 1920's when there were no labor laws.

It's just greed is all workers unions stand for anymore.

I see. "Greed" is when people want to earn decent middle-class wages to support their families, but not when the employer wants to suck every last drop of productivity out of its workers and pay the absolute minimum possible for that productivity. Gotcha.

I earn decent middle-class wages and I'm not in a union. However did I accomplish such a feat??

You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

The Dog Ate My Homework: MasterChief-M4: Unions are no longer needed. This isn't the 1920's when there were no labor laws.

It's just greed is all workers unions stand for anymore.

I see. "Greed" is when people want to earn decent middle-class wages to support their families, but not when the employer wants to suck every last drop of productivity out of its workers and pay the absolute minimum possible for that productivity. Gotcha.

If what you do does not dictate a good living wage then learn a new skill.
This is why I'm against illegal immigration because they take the low wage jobs from American low skilled workers putting them on welfare.
Now they have moved to taking good paying jobs like meat packing where unions have gone to far and the meat packing plants have given them the finger.
Now we are seeing city workers who speak little English fixing lights and stuff because the unions have again gone too far and the cities can't keep up.
Wake up!

LL316: I earn decent middle-class wages and I'm not in a union. However did I accomplish such a feat??

You must be a greedy capitalist, or a Koch bootlicker or something along those lines.

we'refromthesamestory: And how are worker unions greedy? My daddy is union, he works 40 hours a week, if not more. He's at work most morning before most people are even awake. But yeah, totally greed.

My "daddy" is up before most people are awake, and works over 40 hours a week as well...and he isn't union.

I bet he works harder then your daddy any day of the week as well.

/he is self employed
//farmer

KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Except you can get that everywhere in the private sector, all the time. It's not rare. Seeing it only in government employees is a perfect example of confirmation bias.

Burr: /he is self employed
//farmer

Of course he's not union then.
Self-employment outside the capitalist system without an economic boss using him as a wage slave must be doing wonders.

Burr: I bet he works harder then your daddy any day of the week as well.

/he is self employed
//farmer

Subsidized?

we'refromthesamestory: KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Glad you know what the union is.
Workers with a desk job aren't in any union, they're just government employees. Union people are usually laborers. You wouldn't be asking them a question, they would be too busy working.

Huh?? Many are desk jobs including the front desk of a school, teachers, toll booth, Etc

someonelse: KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Except you can get that everywhere in the private sector, all the time. It's not rare. Seeing it only in government employees is a perfect example of confirmation bias.

Yes but in the private sector I can complain and or go somewhere else. Stuck dealing with the other.

we'refromthesamestory: Workers with a desk job aren't in any union, they're just government employees. Union people are usually laborers. You wouldn't be asking them a question, they would be too busy working.

You are sadly misinformed. Anyone with a professional education requirement can be unionized (Accountants, patent examiners, etc.). Also, a bunch of others, like clerks, etc. are unionized. Wander over to the websites for the big unions and they'll tell you all about it.

KimNorth: someonelse: KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Except you can get that everywhere in the private sector, all the time. It's not rare. Seeing it only in government employees is a perfect example of confirmation bias.

Yes but in the private sector I can complain and or go somewhere else. Stuck dealing with the other.

OK, but now you've moved the goalposts. And you seem to be lumping government employees in with all unionized labor for some reason. Yes, you pretty much have to deal with the DMV when you need to renew your drivers license. But your complaints to the supervisor of a rude Walgreens clerk won't necessarily be treated any better or worse than your complaints to the supervisor of a rude DMV employee. And if you're mistreated by someone in the course of their military duty, you certainly won't have an easy time making a complaint.

Education
Some 58% of England's 21,700 state schools are shut with 76% affected by strike action. In Wales around 80% were believed shut and in Northern Ireland more than 50% of 1,200 schools were closed.

Industrial action by about 300,000 workers in Scotland has seen most schools close. Only 33 of the 2,700 council-run schools stayed open today as a result of action by education workers.

Civil service and local government
135,000 civil servants went on strike, representing just over a quarter of the civil service. Mark Serwotka, the leader of the Public and Commercial Services union (PCS), said reports from picket lines showed a huge turnout, with up to 90% of staff in some government departments on strike.

In Northern Ireland, more than 200,000 workers went on strike across the area. The Northern Ireland Public Service Alliance (NIPSA) - representing members across the civil service - will alone have more than 45,000 workers on strike and stage 160 pickets.

Health
7,000 routine operations across the UK have been cancelled, as well as tens of thousands of appointments.

London Ambulance Service told BBC London it was struggling and people not in a life-threatening condition might not get an ambulance.

Demonstrations
Up to 1,000 marches and rallies were due to take place across the UK.

An estimated 7,000 striking public sector workers have marched outside the Scottish Parliament, in protest at UK government pension changes.

Total farking bullshiat, submittard.

/senses this was probably covered above
//really quite cross

KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Hmm. Well, you can tell that you're dealing with my public sector union because your house is not on fire anymore and your loved one arrived at the hospital alive.

As far as helping you, I'm more than happy to give you directions if you're lost in my city. I'm more than happy to let you use the public restroom if you're walking by. It's not my job to change your flat tire. It's not my job to supply you with a new, free CO detector because the one you bought 15 years ago has failed. It's not my job to pump the water out of your basement.

There should be no such thing as a "public sector pension". If the government operates a pension scheme, it should be open to everybody equally, not just some legally privileged class of workers.

If the public sector were really concerned with "fairness", they would be campaigning to open up public sector pension benefits to everybody equally. Everybody would be able to open a pension account and make contributions to it.

They don't do this because they know that public sector pensions are a disproportionate legally-guaranteed privilege with the burden falling primarily on private sector taxpayers who don't enjoy nearly the same retirement security. The unions don't seem to recognize that not every private sector worker is a banking executive and the vast majority of the private sector taxpayers whose taxes they are relying on for their pension benefits will not be getting a bonus this year.

Fark the unions.

someonelse: KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Except you can get that everywhere in the private sector, all the time. It's not rare. Seeing it only in government employees is a perfect example of confirmation bias.

Government employees at least in theory work for us.

That's a pretty important distinction.

m2313: Education
Some 58% of England's 21,700 state schools are shut with 76% affected by strike action. In Wales around 80% were believed shut and in Northern Ireland more than 50% of 1,200 schools were closed.

Industrial action by about 300,000 workers in Scotland has seen most schools close. Only 33 of the 2,700 council-run schools stayed open today as a result of action by education workers.

Civil service and local government
135,000 civil servants went on strike, representing just over a quarter of the civil service. Mark Serwotka, the leader of the Public and Commercial Services union (PCS), said reports from picket lines showed a huge turnout, with up to 90% of staff in some government departments on strike.

In Northern Ireland, more than 200,000 workers went on strike across the area. The Northern Ireland Public Service Alliance (NIPSA) - representing members across the civil service - will alone have more than 45,000 workers on strike and stage 160 pickets.

Health
7,000 routine operations across the UK have been cancelled, as well as tens of thousands of appointments.

London Ambulance Service told BBC London it was struggling and people not in a life-threatening condition might not get an ambulance.

Demonstrations
Up to 1,000 marches and rallies were due to take place across the UK.

An estimated 7,000 striking public sector workers have marched outside the Scottish Parliament, in protest at UK government pension changes.

The turn out does seem to be along the lines of the most effected or millitant. For example the County Council i work for didn't seem to be hit very hard at all apart from the schools.

The pension issue is far more complex than both sides have been screaming about. Each different group of workers has a different pension scheme with its own problems. For example the NHS pension and local government schemes are in very good health and the changes might be going to far.

Then you have for example the Teachers scheme that was set up as little better than a pyramid scheme and it needs constant government cash on top of the employees and employers contributions to stop it from being bankrupt.

watson.t.hamster: someonelse: KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Except you can get that everywhere in the private sector, all the time. It's not rare. Seeing it only in government employees is a perfect example of confirmation bias.

Government employees at least in theory work for us.

That's a pretty important distinction.

True, but the original poster didn't really address that. And if you work in customer service, you kind of work "for us" no matter whether you are paid with taxpayer funds or not.

The Dog Ate My Homework: "Greed" is when people want to earn decent middle-class wages to support their families,

No, "greed" is when people want to earn middle-class wages for doing lower-class jobs.

Sorry, "middle-class" is not for construction work, customer service, maintenance/janitorial, or low-level clerical work/mail room, etc

since this article is from UK, here is what wiki says:


Similarly, in the United Kingdom, the term "working class" can be seen as carrying its own cultural status. Here the term middle class implies those people who typically have had a good education, own a family house, and hold a managerial or professional post.

and for reference, the old standard for the USA:

In the United States and Canada many families where the primary income-earner is employed in a white collar job are considered part of the middle class.


The problem is that for decades, union works have been told (big shocker: by their union reps!) that their working class jobs should get middle-class pay.

someonelse: watson.t.hamster: someonelse: KimNorth: You can tell when your dealing with a gov/union employee because when you ask for help you get the eye roll and look like how dare you interrupt their conversation with another employee about their date last night.

Except you can get that everywhere in the private sector, all the time. It's not rare. Seeing it only in government employees is a perfect example of confirmation bias.

Government employees at least in theory work for us.

That's a pretty important distinction.

True, but the original poster didn't really address that. And if you work in customer service, you kind of work "for us" no matter whether you are paid with taxpayer funds or not.

Only if that person chooses to buy some product or service from that company. A Walmart checkout person doesn't owe me anything if I never shop there. I can't call up AT&T and yell at them for poor service if I haven't first voluntarily chosen to sign a contract with them.

With a government employee it's less voluntary. I guess you could renounce your citizenship and flee if things get too bad, but that's a bit more drastic than simply choosing to shop at some different retailer.

The problem we have here is that we have one group of people who have already been screwed and another group of people who are about to get screwed and they're arguing about who should get screwed the worst.

The majority of the private sector never had proper pensions, those parts that did - the white collar/managerial parts - are going to lose them as a result of the financial crisis. The public sector, because it remained organised longer, has kept some of the benefits that their private colleagues lost a long time ago. So, the private sector is thinking "I don't have a pension plan, I haven't had a raise for years, I might get laid off at any moment, why should government workers, whose wages I'm paying through my taxes have it better than me?" Meanwhile the public sector workers are fighting a fight that was lost 30 years ago. They want to maintain the benefits that were built up during the prosperous-post war era, but which disappeared from the private sector when neo-liberal ideology came to power.

While the peons fight amongst themselves, "the 1%" keep raking it in. Nobody's cutting their wages, or benefits.

Hmm, I honestly think that unions in the UK must be *very* different from the ones in the US.

The US ones seem to have a reputation of being little more than protection rackets, "Nice building you got here, be a shame if you didn't hire union labour and something happened to it..."

Wheras in the UK, there isn't really such a thing as a union that threatens an employer for hiring non-union labour. People join unions because they want the unions backing if something goes wrong, not because they have no choice.

lizyrd: Hmm. Well, you can tell that you're dealing with my public sector union ...

As far as helping you ... It's not my job ... It's not my job ... It's not my job ...

I think I see the problem.

The Dog Ate My Homework: MasterChief-M4: Unions are no longer needed. This isn't the 1920's when there were no labor laws.

It's just greed is all workers unions stand for anymore.

I see. "Greed" is when people want to earn decent middle-class wages to support their families, but not when the employer wants to suck every last drop of productivity out of its workers and pay the absolute minimum possible for that productivity. Gotcha.

By employer, in this case, you mean the taxpayers/voters

Yep, everything has ground to a halt practically, sure sounds like things have improved w/the workers on strike....

derp-dede-herp

jjorsett: What does the public think about a bunch of public sector workers demanding their support (and tax money) in maintaining union member benefits and lifestyles? "You owe me!" isn't much of a rallying cry.

This proving you know less than nothing about this action. So shut it.