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(Vancouver Sun)   Gay marriage is legal. Marijuana is decriminalized. Health care is free. But apparently, polygamy is illegal. Well, no country is 100% perfect, right?   ( vancouversun.com) divider line
    More: Interesting  
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19669 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Nov 2011 at 9:10 AM (5 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2011-11-26 08:08:38 AM  
Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults. My only concern would be how freaking complicated that gets legally. I suppose lawyers would figure it all out though eventually.
 
2011-11-26 08:48:49 AM  

nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults.


Requiring sterilization as a precondition for all said adults in the marriage seem the only way to insure the main means non-adults get involved.
 
2011-11-26 08:55:46 AM  

abb3w: nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults.

Requiring sterilization as a precondition for all said adults in the marriage seem the only way to insure the main means non-adults get involved.


This, more or less. The consenting adults often have or eventually produce children that can be affected by their parents choices.
 
2011-11-26 08:56:26 AM  

nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults. My only concern would be how freaking complicated that gets legally. I suppose lawyers would figure it all out though eventually.


done in one.

personally, i don't care what you do sexually or maritally, so long as it is between consenting adults and doesn't contravene other laws (murder, for instance).
 
2011-11-26 09:01:44 AM  

FlashHarry: nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults. My only concern would be how freaking complicated that gets legally. I suppose lawyers would figure it all out though eventually.

done in one.

personally, i don't care what you do sexually or maritally, so long as it is between consenting adults and doesn't contravene other laws (murder, for instance).


A lot of times polygamous families supplement their income through the welfare systems since only one wife is legally married to the husband so the others show up on paper as single moms. What's your take on that?
 
2011-11-26 09:09:19 AM  
I don't care what consenting adults do amongst consenting adults.

I do think that if there are legal protections for all parties, then you aren't going to see a lot of wealthy cats going for a lot of brides--equality under the law, and you will see a spike in gals taking a few fellas to the cleaners, and then you are going to see the wealthiest protecting themselves with ironclad pre-nups, and limiting their "exposure" by only taking a bride at a time. Which, to be fair, I think is just fine.

Consenting adults. Equality under the law. The biggest problem with polygamy in the model currently practiced in the US is that not all parties have equal protection under the law. Everyone has equal protection, and I don't care. The complexity of multiple partner contracts isn't that hard, as we already have multiple partner contracts for property law as it is. Consider each marriage a buy in, and call it good. Let folks make their damn mistakes, and protect children, and be done with it.
 
2011-11-26 09:13:22 AM  
Canada is pretty awesome, though.
 
2011-11-26 09:14:50 AM  
So i can live with, and have children with multiple women, I just can't marry them.

Ok.
 
2011-11-26 09:16:16 AM  
Who the hell wants more than one person biatching at them and blaming them for everything non-stop for the rest of their lives?
 
2011-11-26 09:16:17 AM  
He concluded that while the law does infringe freedom of religion, the infringement is justified

Meh.
 
2011-11-26 09:16:37 AM  
If all of the people are adults and no one is being coerced why is polygamy or polyandry our business.

As long as they are teen girls like that freak preacher, not our business.

As far as it complicating legal issues,they said the same thing about gay marriage. It looks like those things are being worked.

Personally, not for me. One wife is good enough for me. Can you imagine the internal politics with 2+ wives?
 
2011-11-26 09:16:59 AM  

SundaesChild: Requiring sterilization as a precondition for all said adults in the marriage seem the only way to insure the main means non-adults get involved.

This, more or less. The consenting adults often have or eventually produce children that can be affected by their parents choices.


True, that's a concern. But that's where child abuse laws kick in. All I'm saying is that polygamy in and of itself is just fine by me. I'm not really offended by it. Start taking child brides though, well yeah now we've got a problem here.

pornmonger: Canada is pretty awesome, though.


I've only seen parts of Ontario and Quebec, but I'm inclined to agree. If they could just do something about that winter weather there though. I've been to Niagara Falls in February, and keep in mind that's SOUTHERN Canada. Not pleasant.
 
2011-11-26 09:17:21 AM  

pornmonger: Canada is pretty awesome, though.


Until Harper turns it into a Republican version of Canada.
 
2011-11-26 09:17:53 AM  

jaymanchu: Who the hell wants more than one person biatching at them and blaming them for everything non-stop for the rest of their lives?


THIS (he said after checking to be sure the missus was at yoga class).
 
2011-11-26 09:18:11 AM  
Health Care is free in Canada? So, not a single person pays higher taxes to pay for it? Hmmmm....wonder how that works?
 
2011-11-26 09:19:12 AM  

SundaesChild: abb3w: nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults.

Requiring sterilization as a precondition for all said adults in the marriage seem the only way to insure the main means non-adults get involved.

This, more or less. The consenting adults often have or eventually produce children that can be affected by their parents choices.


Then I wonder if it's cool to stop the gay-ly married from adopting.

/what happens between consenting adults being cool and all, so long as it doesn't affect the children.
/punish a polygamist? Hasn't he had enough already?!
 
2011-11-26 09:20:04 AM  

Elephantman: Health Care is free in Canada? So, not a single person pays higher taxes to pay for it? Hmmmm....wonder how that works?


Oh that's easy. See they don't have 2 simultaneous large scale military invasions underway. The money that would have gone to killing brown people instead goes to health care. Interesting concept, no?
 
2011-11-26 09:20:50 AM  

Elephantman: Health Care is free in Canada? So, not a single person pays higher taxes to pay for it? Hmmmm....wonder how that works?


It's free there like the police and fire department is free here. You don't pay for service. You pay taxes.
 
2011-11-26 09:20:51 AM  
Seems to me, if it's a "crime" at all, it's a self-punishing one.
 
2011-11-26 09:22:56 AM  

abb3w: nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults.

Requiring sterilization as a precondition for all said adults in the marriage seem the only way to insure the main means non-adults get involved.


Huh?

I am sorry, but I don't understand. Do you fear that the parents would for some reason start molesting their children or something? Do you think that children growing up in families with more than two parent will somehow get damaged just from having more than two parents (Because children of divorced couples who remarried seem to be coping reasonably well).

I honestly can't see a single reason against polygamous groups raising children that could not be said against gay or interracial couples raising children.

My main problem with polygamy as it was practised in the past was that it was most often no a union of consenting adults. If people think they can get it to work I see no reason to stop them from trying.
 
2011-11-26 09:25:26 AM  

hubiestubert: I do think that if there are legal protections for all parties, then you aren't going to see a lot of wealthy cats going for a lot of brides--equality under the law, and you will see a spike in gals taking a few fellas to the cleaners, and then you are going to see the wealthiest protecting themselves with ironclad pre-nups, and limiting their "exposure" by only taking a bride at a time. Which, to be fair, I think is just fine.


This is the free market libertarian view of polygamy, that the invisible hand will naturally guide the savvy investor into monogamy? Interesting argument, but I wouldn't want to marry it.
 
2011-11-26 09:26:08 AM  
i119.photobucket.comView Full Size



BOOOOOOOOOOOO!
 
2011-11-26 09:26:15 AM  

SundaesChild: A lot of times polygamous families supplement their income through the welfare systems since only one wife is legally married to the husband so the others show up on paper as single moms. What's your take on that?


Sounds like another bit in the bucket for "legally recognize it to close that loophole."
 
2011-11-26 09:27:15 AM  
Polygamy, at least in the usual patriarchal form, is inherently inequitable. He's everything to you, you're just another to him. In the more equitable sci-fi, BSG/Caprica form, polygamy leads to religious extremism with killer robots.
 
2011-11-26 09:27:35 AM  
By the same argument we should outlaw divorce, re-marrying, traveling for business when your offspring is under the age of 15, having kids who are more than 10 years apart, and so on...
And what if a woman wants to marry two men?
/and yes, that happens too
 
2011-11-26 09:27:52 AM  

Terrified Asexual Forcemeat: free market libertarian view of polygamy


...is actually that government need not be involved in marriage and should allow people to form their own contracts. Problem solved.
 
2011-11-26 09:30:02 AM  

Nem Wan: Polygamy, at least in the usual patriarchal form, is inherently inequitable. He's everything to you, you're just another to him. In the more equitable sci-fi, BSG/Caprica form, polygamy leads to religious extremism with killer robots.


Well that sort of religious polygamy is the same situation that leads to child brides, which I think we can all agree is absolutely unacceptable. But it doesn't have to be that way. What if a man loves two women, they love each other (maybe? i don't know how that's supposed to work to be honest) and they're perfectly happy? What if a woman wants 3 husbands? I really fail to see any problem with it.

Hell sometimes I think I'd like an extra wife. Chop chop, dig dig.
 
2011-11-26 09:30:47 AM  
liesyoungwomenbelieve.comView Full Size


This will be me, no doubt, as I monitor this thread. Except for the being black part.

/And also the popcorn part. I hate popcorn.
 
2011-11-26 09:31:39 AM  
Universal health care would solve one of the problems with polygamy, which is health insurance and whom should be covered under a policy.

But the issues aren't that complex. Look at the U.S. tax code, that's complex. It might be a bit unromantic to sit down with your wives and say "Let's draft a marriage contract, and determine who gets what in the event of someone's death..."
 
2011-11-26 09:32:16 AM  

nekom: Hell sometimes I think I'd like an extra wife. Chop chop, dig dig.


Oh, what a relief it is!
 
2011-11-26 09:33:06 AM  
Women in plural marriages tend to suffer from higher rates of depression and other mental health problems, and are also at greater risk of physical abuse than women in monogamous relationships.

Children of plural marriages experience higher rates of abuse and neglect, higher rates of emotional and behaviour problems, and lower rates of educational success.


Is the cause plural marriages? What about the fact that most of those people are fundamentalists? Are people in non fundamentalist plural families at risk too?
 
2011-11-26 09:33:14 AM  

BloodySaxon: Terrified Asexual Forcemeat: free market libertarian view of polygamy

...is actually that government need not be involved in marriage and should allow people to form their own contracts. Problem solved.


What about the child rearing aspect? Tax breaks for new parents, land and grants for public schooling, etc?
 
2011-11-26 09:34:19 AM  
I'm pro gay marriage (yay Canada) but I justify my opposition to polygamy based on a slippery slope argument. We know that marriage between two people provides them with many social and economic benefits and if we were to allow these benefits to be transferred across multiple partners, at what point does it stop? How many marriages are too many? What's to stop me from marrying all of my friends (besides having to consummate all the unions), or from an entire town from marrying each other to gain access to those types of benefits? How can the government say "Ok, polygamy is ok now...but no more than four people can marry each other, kthx" and not be discriminating against those groups who want to marry six people and so forth?

There's also the fact that most polygamous relationships consist of one man and multiple women which, besides the subservient roles many women play in these marriages, could cause a very disproportionate ratio of single men to single women in the future. But that's assuming polygamy becomes popular over an extended period of time.

Pretty weak arguments, feel free to demolish them, but they're good enough for me to not consider myself a hypocrite on the whole gay marriage/polygamy debate.
 
2011-11-26 09:35:26 AM  

milkyshirt: [www.liesyoungwomenbelieve.com image 425x282]

This will be me, no doubt, as I monitor this thread. Except for the being black part.

/And also the popcorn part. I hate popcorn.


Dont like popcorn?!

img.photobucket.comView Full Size
 
2011-11-26 09:35:33 AM  
So long as everyone involved is game I see no problem with it. I think it would be significantly harder to write up a standard multi party polygimist marriage contract though. So I can see the legal process taking a lot longer and being more expensive.But if everyone involved is willing to sit down with a laywer and agree to terms and then go before a judge, go for it.
 
2011-11-26 09:36:24 AM  

nekom: Elephantman: Health Care is free in Canada? So, not a single person pays higher taxes to pay for it? Hmmmm....wonder how that works?

Oh that's easy. See they don't have 2 simultaneous large scale military invasions underway. The money that would have gone to killing brown people instead goes to health care. Interesting concept, no?


Oh...ok...so it's free even though it cost money to run and they take money that would kill brown people and put towards free health care even though technically it's not free and somebody pays for it, but they call it free because the Govt. gives them the money they take by force from taxpayers...Hmmmmm,wonder what they would do if they wanted to kill brown people?
 
2011-11-26 09:37:31 AM  

CruJones: So i can live with, and have children with multiple women, I just can't marry them.

Ok.


Good luck with that. In my experience, living with two women got sketchy because they fought on occasion - and when they did - things were said that neither of them could get over. No amount of intervention, or mediation on my part could save it.

Lesson from that is to maintain separate domiciles. Everybody seems happier that way. The moral seems to be that cohabitation is a real buzz-kill.... or as it's best said here on Fark, don't stick your dick in crazy.
 
2011-11-26 09:37:58 AM  
Geeze, just go into the back yard, look up into the sky and say "God, I take her as my (fill in the number) wife. Go to a lawyer and add her to the will so if you die she gets some of your shait and give her power of attorney over your ass. Want her to have your name, go to court and have it changed. There is nothing magic about a marriage lic.

torinelson.files.wordpress.comView Full Size
 
2011-11-26 09:38:14 AM  

Mrtraveler01: pornmonger: Canada is pretty awesome, though.

Until Harper turns it into a Republican version of Canada.


Well, he's already banned corporate and union donations/loans to political parties and individual candidates. That big-business, corporate whore Republican bastard! How dare he sell out our democracy to the corporations!
 
2011-11-26 09:38:54 AM  

SundaesChild: abb3w: nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults.

Requiring sterilization as a precondition for all said adults in the marriage seem the only way to insure the main means non-adults get involved.

This, more or less. The consenting adults often have or eventually produce children that can be affected by their parents choices.


Influencing the values of offspring is one of the sacred 'rights' in all cultures. That's why there is an 'Adolf Hitler Campbell' in New Jersey and half the boys in Mexico are named 'Jesus' and half the girls 'Maria'. I don't like that mindset, but it's all fun and games until there is a 14-year old 'bride'?
 
2011-11-26 09:40:43 AM  
Also, marijuana is not decriminalized. Medical marijuana is legal and in fact, the Supreme Court - including many Harper-appointed justices - orders that the government make access to medical pot even easier.

If you have weed for fun and you're caught, most cops will let you go as long as you're honest about it, you're not a dick, and it's not so much that you're obviously trafficking.
 
2011-11-26 09:42:51 AM  

nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults. My only concern would be how freaking complicated that gets legally. I suppose lawyers would figure it all out though eventually.


Other than the fact I'd want the guy to have a psych exam. I love my wife, but I can't imagine having two more wives under the same roof and not going insane.

/I'm sure I drive my wife batty too every so often
 
2011-11-26 09:43:19 AM  

"What do you mean, POLYGAMY IS ILLEGAL?!?!?!?"


angryasianman.comView Full Size

 
2011-11-26 09:44:44 AM  
What's next?

GAY POLYGAMY?!
 
2011-11-26 09:44:54 AM  

nekom: My only concern would be how freaking complicated that gets legally. I suppose lawyers would figure it all out though eventually.


Perhaps they could form a corporation and divide up their collective assets like you would stock options.

Whatever floats your boat, though, as long as you're properly responsible for it.
=Smidge=
 
2011-11-26 09:44:55 AM  

Elephantman: Health Care is free in Canada? So, not a single person pays higher taxes to pay for it? Hmmmm....wonder how that works?


Gross over simplification. Health care isn't free anywhere on Earth. One either pays some extra tax or pays for private insurance or a combination of both.
 
2011-11-26 09:46:34 AM  
Like others, I have no problem with it if it's between consenting adults. However I have two major problems with it --
(1) Humankind is inherently jealous. I can pretend to be as high-minded as I'd like and say "Of course, honey, you can sleep with her," but deep down I'd always be wondering which one he liked better.
(2) It's sexist. You hardly ever hear about a woman with more than one husband. Damn it, I want my extra husband!

STD concerns aside, for it to work at all and be any way fair, they need to legalize something like the Heinleinian family clusters where there are several husbands and wives and they all just kind of share. Personally, though, the least complicated way to do it would just be to have one official spouse and then they each have a collection of concubines. Because everyone loves concubines.
 
2011-11-26 09:46:40 AM  

TheOther: but it's all fun and games until there is a 14-year old 'bride'?


Old enough to bleed? Old enough to breed.

That menstrual period and those perky little mounds are nature's way of telling you that for shiat's sake you had goddamn well better ignore them.
 
2011-11-26 09:47:33 AM  

Smidge204: nekom: My only concern would be how freaking complicated that gets legally. I suppose lawyers would figure it all out though eventually.

Perhaps they could form a corporation and divide up their collective assets like you would stock options.

Whatever floats your boat, though, as long as you're properly responsible for it.
=Smidge=


Well sure if they have the presence of mind to enter into a full out contract with everything spelled out, that can be managed. But what's the `default' situation in polygamy? Let's say you marry two women. Are those women married to each other as well? What if you get divorced from one, is she still married to the other? I can foresee a clusterfark in situations like that. That's my only concern.
 
2011-11-26 09:47:56 AM  

TheOther: SundaesChild: abb3w: nekom: Honestly, I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as all involved are consenting adults.

Requiring sterilization as a precondition for all said adults in the marriage seem the only way to insure the main means non-adults get involved.

This, more or less. The consenting adults often have or eventually produce children that can be affected by their parents choices.

Influencing the values of offspring is one of the sacred 'rights' in all cultures. That's why there is an 'Adolf Hitler Campbell' in New Jersey and half the boys in Mexico are named 'Jesus' and half the girls 'Maria'. I don't like that mindset, but it's all fun and games until there is a 14-year old 'bride'?


Actually I believe Adolf Hitler and his 2 (?) siblings are in foster care right now. At least that's what I read last week.
 
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