I wonder how many underlying personality disorders get misdiagnosed as PTSD when an already unstable person has an event happen that most normal people can handle.

I also wonder how much litigation plays into this.

Some of the customers at Circuit City acted like I murdered their dog when I told them there were no iPod minis in stock.

It HAS to be the violent computer games - there is no other explanation!

And unprotected sex

/Even though they are mutually exclusive

Nut this shiat again.

Britney Spear's Speculum: I wonder how many underlying personality disorders get misdiagnosed as PTSD when an already unstable person has an event happen that most normal people can handle.

I also wonder how much litigation plays into this.

Some of the customers at Circuit City acted like I murdered their dog when I told them there were no iPod minis in stock.

In fairness, PTSD is associated with unusual and traumatic experiences, like finding oneself in Circuit City.

American troops coming back from combat? 45 - 50 percent ptsd. British commonwealth troops coming back from combat? 5 percent ptsd. Welcome to america running for the shelter of its mothers little helper.

I had a crazy biatch tell me 2 years ago

"I discovered this week at my therapy session that I have PTSD."
Ok?
"Yes, I found out I was molested when I was little and have PTSD."
Uhh, ok?


She goes in and out of psych wards and group homes. Everyone needs an excuse I guess.

aearra: American troops coming back from combat? 45 - 50 percent ptsd. British commonwealth troops coming back from combat? 5 percent ptsd. Welcome to america running for the shelter of its mothers little helper.

No, I'd say the brits were generally a little looser to begin with so, not much change.
Based entirely upon my close association with numerous maniac brits and dead GI's.
Seriously

Here's my piece on Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder, from an Army veteran. I'm no doctor, this is just the conclusion that I have drawn.

Post traumatic stress disorder is, in its simplest form, memories that your mind can't handle. Your brain has a compulsive need to make sense of what it experiences, and when it has something it can't properly file away it starts comparing it to everything similar in an attempt to find a 'close enough' folder to stick it in. This is why PTSD sufferers have flashbacks, their brain is trying to apply the un-filed memories into where the current memories are going. Everyone accumulates some of these memories in the course of their lifetime, but it gets particularly bad in the military for a specific reason.
What did you have for dinner a month ago? Can't remember? That's because you've had thirty dinners since then with a variety of meals. If you ask someone in the military they can tell you exactly what they had for dinner a month ago based on what day of the week it was. Civilian life is full of new experiences and these new memories diminish old memories, while military life is the same thing day in and day out. Even when a soldier is sent for "PTSD treatment" it just becomes one more bullet point in the weekly schedule.
There is no 'cure' for PTSD. Therapy and counseling help to take the initial edge off the memories, creating the recognition of how and why the PTSD reactions occur. The most effective 'fix' for PTSD is new experiences. The difficulty in the military is that most soldiers are successfully indoctrinated to be comfortable in their daily/weekly/monthly routine, and it takes a lot of effort to get them to leave their comfort zone.

aearra: American troops coming back from combat? 45 - 50 percent ptsd. British commonwealth troops coming back from combat? 5 percent ptsd. Welcome to america running for the shelter of its mothers little helper.

Yeah, how about no. It's more along the lines of 18% for American combat soldiers (Hoge et al., 2004; Tanelian and Jaycox, 2008). Some of the other things you aren't taking into account are the severity of the trauma, and the types of trauma. Have a nice day.

So we all have PTtinfoil-hat maggie: aearra: American troops coming back from combat? 45 - 50 percent ptsd. British commonwealth troops coming back from combat? 5 percent ptsd. Welcome to america running for the shelter of its mothers little helper.

You do realize a lot of PTSD can be treated without med right?I' mean I was diagnosed with PTSD after a mugging, some therapy and I can function granted I carry my keys so I can use them as a weapon when I'm in a parking lot but ....
Well anyway, every country has its own criteria, but if you read about it you might not be so judgmental.

I'm sorry, but your treatment regime is no longer recognized as the proper course for traumatic events. The pharmaceutical and physiological communities now agree that an extensive intervention of therapy and medication is required. Proper treatment may take years. Of course a traumatic event like a mugging, a death of a family member or pet, the breakup of a long term (or short term) relationship, or even the ending of a favorite TV series can cause PTSD. In all cases an evaluation should take place so that the proper diagnosis and aggressive treatment can commence.

Of course if your poor and don't have good insurance the answer is: "Your fine, get over it"

I'd been given to understand that PTSD (real cases, not psych flavor of the month) is a question of brain chemistry, too. Something about when and how specific neurotransmitters work. I'll fire off an email and hope that it gets answered sometime within business hours. I don't have access to journals from here.

If that's the case, it might be worth understanding the science, too. While we Americans are over-diagnosed and over-medicated, generally, I'd hate to propagate a meme that throws the baby out with the bathwater.

As a Marine combat vet with 3 tours in Iraq I have come to the conclusion that the best treatment for PTSD is preventative treatment. As people's lives growing up have become easy and basic training for all the services gets easier people are becoming woefully unprepared mentally for the rigors of combat. If you have never run a mile in your life and you get up one day and run a marathon it will be terribly traumatic to your body, possibly even fatal. If you train regularly and prepare for the marathon you will be sore for a few days, but you will bounce back fairly quickly. Your brain is no different. You can strengthen its ability to deal with stressors or you can let atrophy like a muscle would. There has been a ton of focus on how to treat PTSD, but we need to focus on how to prevent it. Vets I know who had it harder growing up seem to deal with the stress of combat better. People who never worked, were a part of the "everybody gets a trophy" society, and were never yelled at by parents or teachers have the hardest time.
WWII vets (some of whom were in combat for years straight) felt pain, had stress, and had issues after they returned. They, however were able to deal with it better and did not have issues (joblessness, murdering girlfriends, etc...) at the same rate they are now. They had it harder growing up and prior to combat. I don't think it is any coincidence.

Xaneidolon: I'd been given to understand that PTSD (real cases, not psych flavor of the month) is a question of brain chemistry, too. Something about when and how specific neurotransmitters work. I'll fire off an email and hope that it gets answered sometime within business hours. I don't have access to journals from here.

If that's the case, it might be worth understanding the science, too. While we Americans are over-diagnosed and over-medicated, generally, I'd hate to propagate a meme that throws the baby out with the bathwater.

While I'm not so clear on the actual chemical transmission aspects, there is a neural correlate of PTSD in extreme over-excitation of certain regions of the hippocampus, while the hippocampus itself shrinks.

tinfoil-hat maggie: Ha ha
/ Really hope that was sarcasm, oh well.

Since the passing of the mental health parity law diagnoses of formerly rare disorders have sky rocketed. In other words, since insurance companies can't cap the amount of mental health treatment, suddenly the psychiatric industry have discovered a huge new need for treatment.

In the past few years the rate of Autism, PTSD, Alcoholism, ADHD, etc. etc. have all exploded. And those increases happen to coincide with the removal of most of the limits on mental health spending on health insurance plans. Hmmm, funny how that correlates.

The risk of course is a backlash that will hurt those who truly need services.

Here in Marine World, it has become an excuse for Marines to act like douchebags. Sit in court: Every single Marine who is charged with a crime will argue that he has PTSD, even the REMF's.

I think it's the definition issue mentioned in TFA.

I've been diagnosed with PTSD by someone using the manual, who's a mental health professional, but the shrink who actually writes my scripts discounted that specific a diagnosis and went with "anxiety disorder."

Either way, certain situations, certain circumstances still make my chest tight and my mind go places that aren't mentally helpful.

I specifically asked for meds that won't make my junk stop working, and got the generic Welbutrin. Works pretty well, and I can tell if/when I forget it for a couple days. It may not be as comprehensive as something a little stronger, but at least I can still get it done with the old lady. Oh, right... I also get to keep my job.

If the definition were more specific, then there'd have to be a "civilian/generalized" version that's less "loaded" a term, but still helps people get the help they need. I'm not opposed to that.

"General anxiety disorder" may not be specific enough to get the help I (and others) might need if/when I (they) have to switch docs.

tinfoil-hat maggie: Whats even funnier is I was uninsured when diagnosed with PTSD. I mean I'm sure you're right but right about what? That insurance is being made to pay for something people go though everyday?
There's a book you should read (and I know idiots will say I Godwined the thread) it's called" The Men Behind Hitler" It's all about the shrinks and their ways of going with the flow.
Then read the book "Unbroken" And then tell me all the BS you already said

I'm sorry you had a traumatic event, and I'm glad you got the help that you needed to help you cope.

The sad truth is that the odds of someone getting treated largely depends on their ability to pay. The other sad truth is that the chance of someone being told they need help, and intensity of the treatment they receive also largely depends on their ability to pay.

God help you if your truly mentally ill and have no insurance and no way to pay for the treatment you need. In most cases you may get some help from the state, but no where near what you need. On the other hand, those with deep pockets and good insurance are over diagnosed, over medicated, and over treated.

I have "PTSD-like symptoms, not PTSD," according to my therapist. She insists actual PTSD must involve a life-threatening event. Since mine was a breakup, it don't qualify. But then, I attempted suicide, so...

Can someone tell me if this is true or just a myth?

I remember being told that a big factor in war-related PTSD is that speed at which we travel. Something about returning from war on a boat for weeks gave a mental buffer between 'home' and 'war'. But now we jump on a plane and we've home a day or two after whatever we've seen.

CitizenjaQ: I have "PTSD-like symptoms, not PTSD," according to my therapist. She insists actual PTSD must involve a life-threatening event. Since mine was a breakup, it don't qualify. But then, I attempted suicide, so...

That's scary. The research has pointed for a long time that brain changes associated with PTSD in combat is identical to any extreme negative life-changing event. Your therapist needs to do a little better research.

Reminds me of my uncle. He was diagnosed with shell-shock, but could not get PTSD therapy because he did not have every single symptom.

Also, one does not have to be in combat to be in combat-like situations.

Being in the midst of an urban drive-by shooting is quite an experience.

Time just slows down, things become a hell of a lot more vivid, while your brain is about the only thing that hasn't stopped working at full-speed.

Don't admit these yellow bastards. Nothing wrong with them.

This book (new window) has a very interesting chapter on PTSD in abused children, and how easy it is to misdiagnose as ADHD. These children exist in a permanent state of fight-or-flight reaction. They are constantly scanning the environment for the next threat. Which looks exactly like hyper innatention. They are flooded with adrenaline, and so are in constant motion. If they dissociate (a coping mechanism for serious trauma - they go away in their heads for a while) this looks exactly like uncontrolled daydreaming.

The author doesn't estimate how many kids are misdiagnosed and mistreated in this way, but it makes sense that it would be a goodish number.

I know several people who got PTSD from serving overseas, in varying degrees. I'd much rather have it be over diagnosed than under diagnosed.

Fark_Guy_Rob: Can someone tell me if this is true or just a myth?

I remember being told that a big factor in war-related PTSD is that speed at which we travel. Something about returning from war on a boat for weeks gave a mental buffer between 'home' and 'war'. But now we jump on a plane and we've home a day or two after whatever we've seen.

Makes some sense to me. Years ago, in a training class for dealing with kids of trauma, we were told to remember something from our childhood. Most of us struggled and the leader pointed out the amount of time and the thousands of bits of info our brains had stored since childhood. And if the kid is not constantly reminded of the trauma, time can heal. But, if the kid stays exposed to trauma, or is constantly reminded of it, the healing can't take placed, or is limited. Coming out of a war zone and being home in hours seems like emotional whiplash to me.

CitizenjaQ: I have "PTSD-like symptoms, not PTSD," according to my therapist. She insists actual PTSD must involve a life-threatening event. Since mine was a breakup, it don't qualify. But then, I attempted suicide, so...

DSM IV criteria state it has to be an event which threatened injury or death to yourself or others. Attempting suicide is a possible result of PTSD but Clinical Depression sounds more likely in a very general sense.

Critera for things like PTSD tend to be very specific to avoid things like TFA. Lots of things can cause the symptoms but you have to draw the line somewhere to meaningfully distinguish one disorder from another and a disorder from ordinary but unfortunate feelings.
/Not an abnormal psych person so I don't know too much beyond that

aearra: American troops coming back from combat? 45 - 50 percent ptsd. British commonwealth troops coming back from combat? 5 percent ptsd. Welcome to america running for the shelter of its mothers little helper.

QFT

aearra: American troops coming back from combat? 45 - 50 percent ptsd

[citation needed]

cherryl taggart: Years ago, in a training class for dealing with kids of trauma, we were told to remember something from our childhood. Most of us struggled and the leader pointed out the amount of time and the thousands of bits of info our brains had stored since childhood. And if the kid is not constantly reminded of the trauma, time can heal. But, if the kid stays exposed to trauma, or is constantly reminded of it, the healing can't take placed, or is limited. Coming out of a war zone and being home in hours seems like emotional whiplash to me.

I'm not entirely sure about this. Really good memory and certain types of OCSD have similarities, so I would imagine it is possible that some people might just have different levels of memory due to predisposition more than the actual extreme events themselves. I think brain chemistry may have more to do with it than experience.

pkellmey: OCSD OCD

Morning typing issues.

I'm an Egyptian!: Yeah, how about no. It's more along the lines of 18% for American combat soldiers (Hoge et al., 2004; Tanelian and Jaycox, 2008). Some of the other things you aren't taking into account are the severity of the trauma, and the types of trauma. Have a nice day.

Ah there they are. And that 4% rate in the UK, that's is you trust Simon Wessely and his ilk, who work for the military.
Oh and the Brits, btw, are drinking themselves into the ground. (Fear et al. 2010).

LegacyDL: [www.projectorcentral.com image 480x219]

Don't admit these yellow bastards. Nothing wrong with them.

you magnificent bastard you.

Everyone is different and handles different stressors differently. BUT, some people are simply born with the strength to endure true hardships while others are not.

My wife is one of those people. By every right she should be a highly damaged person. But she's not, and I admire the hell out of her for it.

Close but not quite the same is my father, who's favorite past-time in this world is biatching, but slap some real shiat down in front of him and he handles his business with nary a thought afterward. From what I've seen i handle stress much like he does, but I've never been truly tested with anything life or death.

But TFA's issue boils down to what it always comes down to in these situations: More people than ever + more accurate psychological analysis = more diagnoses.

Beauf: They, however were able to deal with it better and did not have issues (joblessness, murdering girlfriends, etc...) at the same rate they are now. They had it harder growing up and prior to combat. I don't think it is any coincidence.

[Citation Needed]

They just didnt keep such rigorous records back then. Modern studies suggest that WWII vets had an extremely high rate of PTSD, as high as 40-50%, and led to a tremendous amount of drunkards after the war. We just shine up the image of WWII and that time period in our history books... the same problems existed then, they just werent in the public light.

Alonjar: They just didnt keep such rigorous records back then. Modern studies suggest that WWII vets had an extremely high rate of PTSD, as high as 40-50%, and led to a tremendous amount of drunkards after the war. We just shine up the image of WWII and that time period in our history books... the same problems existed then, they just werent in the public light.

I also feel it important to add that we are now fighting an extremely different war as well. In a war like WWII, you knew who your enemies were. They were clearly designated, and you had a reason to fight them. Now we stick kids in a humvee, send them to some place no one even cares about to fight people that they cant tell apart from civilians. My infantry buddies missions over their tours in iraq consisted mainly of "Go into hostile area, walk/drive around untill someone attempts to kill you, then kill them. Rinse, repeat."

Imagine the mentality of your job, every day, being to purposely drive into ambushes and get hit by IEDs. Sure, your personal goal is to not get hit... but thats not the mission statement.

Thats got to have a severely negative impact on your stress levels. The main cause of PTSD in the world wars war artillery, for the same reason. It was just random death from the sky, no way to have any control over your fate or not.

/It was called "shellshock" back then.

TFA irritates me, because what the author is describing is misdiagnosis and poor psychotherapy. Any psychologist or psychiatrist worth the name knows that a diagnosis of PTSD only applies after prolonged and unusual inability to deal with a traumatic event, whatever it's nature. It specifically does not apply when the person in question is able to work through their issues using the normal psychological processes. Nor does it apply to people who have a grab-bag of other issues in play.

In short, the problem isn't the diagnosis, but rather the idjits who are misusing it because it is trendy, and they aren't applying proper standards of professional rigour. They're using the availability and recency heuristics to grab the first thing that vaguely kinda-sorta seems like it might fit rather than actually take the time to figure out if someone needs help, or even if that help extends beyond basic support while they work through things on their own. Sometimes all someone really needs is someone willing to listen.

On Balance: I'm an Egyptian!: Yeah, how about no. It's more along the lines of 18% for American combat soldiers (Hoge et al., 2004; Tanelian and Jaycox, 2008). Some of the other things you aren't taking into account are the severity of the trauma, and the types of trauma. Have a nice day.

Ah there they are. And that 4% rate in the UK, that's is you trust Simon Wessely and his ilk, who work for the military.
Oh and the Brits, btw, are drinking themselves into the ground. (Fear et al. 2010).

I'll have to check that article out. Did they address baseline rates of abuse in not just the general populace, but in the military as well?