topcon: Joe USer: topcon: I'm going to guess the owner of the property is going to get tired of it sooner or later, and they CAN make them leave. Or maybe they won't. I don't care either way.

Most of those parks downtown were a requirement of letting the developer build there. You want to put up a 50 story skyscraper, fine, you can, but you have to provide an open park that you maintain.

The developers are about to find out that when you create a public park, you've created a public park.

Mark it down: They're not going to be allowed to stay there indefinitely. They won't be there a year from now. They might not even be there three months from now.

If a judge says they can be, then why would they leave?

moonscatter: OWS is extended street theatre. Enjoy it.

Street theater that will go on indefinitely until something happens. Behold, the awesome power of not going away. It will surely change the world.

Joe USer: topcon: I'm going to guess the owner of the property is going to get tired of it sooner or later, and they CAN make them leave. Or maybe they won't. I don't care either way.

Most of those parks downtown were a requirement of letting the developer build there. You want to put up a 50 story skyscraper, fine, you can, but you have to provide an open park that you maintain.

The developers are about to find out that when you create a public park, you've created a public park.

So I can legally live in a public park? fark property taxes, I'm building a cabin in the middle of my local park.

FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The constitution might yet prevail. Hurrah!

vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

Technically, the best kind of right, Zuccotti park is a "privately owned public space". Too bad. It's still a public space.

IamKaiserSoze!!!: There is no camp ground or other housing concept in the US that would allow the living standards that OWS has adopted. Even refugee camps in Africa have safer and more sanitary facilities.


Like you'd know anything about either Burning Man or refugee camps in Africa you asshole.

HoboCop: "Last night on Fox news they showed a number representing how much in taxes the OWS protest in Philly has cost the city. "

If a city chooses to spend its taxes on paramilitary suppression of the freedom to speak and assemble, that's hardly the fault of the citizenship.
The only implicit costs associated with these occupations are a side effect of many people gathering -- something that's reasonable to believe is covered by the taxes they pay. If cleaning up after concerts, festivals and parades is covered, this doesn't seem like a stretch. (Why, if sanitation is the primary concern, have they not approached one of these occupations and asked them to rotate out of sections of the space so that it can be cleaned?)

The rest of the costs reflect a *choice* made by those in power to confront and illegally combat their own citizens.

Joe USer: topcon: I'm going to guess the owner of the property is going to get tired of it sooner or later, and they CAN make them leave. Or maybe they won't. I don't care either way.

Most of those parks downtown were a requirement of letting the developer build there. You want to put up a 50 story skyscraper, fine, you can, but you have to provide an open park that you maintain.

The developers are about to find out that when you create a public park, you've created a public park.

Got to beautify one part of town before they let you uglify another.

CPennypacker: The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

You got your facts in a Fark thread! 10 yard penalty, repeat of down.

CPennypacker: vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

Link to laws regarding privately owned land being regarded as "public" by your definition.

badhatharry: Mrbogey: Americans have the right to break any laws thy don't like. It's right there in the Constitution. I'm glad a judge somewhere read the thing.

I'm happy that OWS taught you something.

I'm going to protest economic inequality tonight by j-walking, littering, getting drunk in public, and pissing on the side of buildings!

USA! USA! WHOSE STREET?!?! MY STREET BITATCHES!

Don't like it? F*** YOU BUDDY! It's in the constitution!

I have constitutional immunity from the law as long as I keep on protesting!

Complete List of OWS Achievements:

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HoboCop: Last night on Fox news they showed a number representing how much in taxes the OWS protest in Philly has cost the city. Thanks, Fox news!

I'd rather my tax money go to support the right to protest than to bail out more banks.

topcon: CPennypacker: vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

Link to laws regarding privately owned land being regarded as "public" by your definition.

Just go to the wikipedia page for the park. The park was a concession US Steel had to provide the city on its land in order to get by zoning laws and make 1 Liberty Plaza Higher.

Whar is ur law god now, "They broke the law, too bad for them" proponents?

indarwinsshadow: Damn that democratic system. Just when you think you can shove it aside and act like a brown shirt club swinging fascist along comes a bunch of people who understand the basics rights of a constitution who actually protect the rights and property of the people who empower the system. Now, I ask you. How crazy is that?

Can't wait for the individual civil suits.
Don't have money? Well, you will soon.
Should be able to sue the cops in a civil suit directly as well instead of through the union. BUT THAT'S NOT AMERICA!

NY city gets another judge to block first judges order in

3...

2...

1...

//disapproves of you bulldozing the encampment.

//and he's all out of bubblegum

Milo1974: Gestapo=KGB=Syrian Regime=Chinese PLA=NYPD

Police everywhere are nothing more than the security class for the capitalists or bureaucrats who steal and deny the wealth to those below them.
"Capitalism" and the state go hand in hand, are inseparable. Most corporations are nothing but private tyrannies run top down like a Soviet or fascist state.
Tyranny is tyranny, public or private.

It's not really much of a movement when your biggest accomplishment is just sitting around.

topcon: CPennypacker: vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

Link to laws regarding privately owned land being regarded as "public" by your definition.

Oh for fark's sake, it's at the *bottom* of the Wikipedia article linked to like 4 times already:

http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/html/pops/pops.shtml

badhatharry:
Apparently, most people are ok with cops tear gassing them, beating them, and destroying their property. They don't consider that it might be them protesting the next time. Americans had a right to complain. It kept us free.

People on the right who cheer this on, yet are mad as hell at the government, really need to be paying attention to all this, in case they get mad enough to actually do something other than hold up badly-spelled protest signs. This is how the police state will treat you, too.

/and if you're cheering this on, you deserve it.
//yes, I went there.

I actually used to like Bloomberg, but he's been pretty much a dick in this whole thing, finding protesting a waste of time. Sure, the OWS is close to being a waste of time, but he's demonstrated his complete lack of moral leadership.

urger: WTFDYW: Oh and YES. The park is private property.

This eviction was on behalf of the private owner. However since the rule against camping in the park was created after the protest started it ran afoul of the constitution's prohibition against post ipso facto laws.

... you mean post-hoc?

Regardless, all that means is they couldn't be charged for occupation prior to the camping rule. It says nothing about after.

CPennypacker: topcon: CPennypacker: vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

Link to laws regarding privately owned land being regarded as "public" by your definition.

Just go to the wikipedia page for the park. The park was a concession US Steel had to provide the city on its land in order to get by zoning laws and make 1 Liberty Plaza Higher.

Yeah, sorry, no, that doesn't really cut it.

The park is still privately owned and maintained.

As I work for a civil engineering and land surveying company, I'm somewhat familiar with how these things work. If it were a truly "public" space by your definition, it would have been deeded over to the local government. This happens fairly frequently, either with a donation of land or payment.

The entity who owns this land, Brookfield Properties, clearly has some reason for not wanting to completely hand it over to the government and let them deal with maintaining it.

Rage Against the Machine - "...A line of cops outside the mill, there is a right to obey and a right to kill"

Utter Genius: Complete List of OWS Achievements:

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Starting a national dialogue on income inequality. Having the phrase "the 1%" enter our lexicon.

Nothing concrete, true, but it's a start.

So the police destroy everything but now the police have to let the protesters come back? I really can't see that as much of a win for the protesters.

This text is now purple: urger: WTFDYW: Oh and YES. The park is private property.

This eviction was on behalf of the private owner. However since the rule against camping in the park was created after the protest started it ran afoul of the constitution's prohibition against post ipso facto laws.

... you mean post-hoc?

Regardless, all that means is they couldn't be charged for occupation prior to the camping rule. It says nothing about after.

It's a grey area, and the owners probably need New York's approval for their rule change.

badhatharry: moonscatter: As distasteful as many people find it, protesting is one of the most important rights we have. Let them do their thing.

Frankly, I find them cute and amusing. I really liked it when they marched on my building in Houston. This scraggly guy carried a old, manual typewriter to our building, sat down and typed something, tied it to balloons and yelled "I hope this gets to the top!"

OWS is extended street theatre. Enjoy it.

Apparently, most people are ok with cops tear gassing them, beating them, and destroying their property. They don't consider that it might be them protesting the next time. Americans had a right to complain. It kept us free.

The hippies in Zuccotti park have done more to protect your freedoms than the troops in Afghanistan and Iraq ever could.

Strange and perhaps unsettling, but true.

badhatharry: moonscatter: As distasteful as many people find it, protesting is one of the most important rights we have. Let them do their thing.

Frankly, I find them cute and amusing. I really liked it when they marched on my building in Houston. This scraggly guy carried a old, manual typewriter to our building, sat down and typed something, tied it to balloons and yelled "I hope this gets to the top!"

OWS is extended street theatre. Enjoy it.

Apparently, most people are ok with cops tear gassing them, beating them, and destroying their property. They don't consider that it might be them protesting the next time. Americans had a right to complain. It kept us free.

We also have a right to shoot back at the government that keeps us free. The fiery end of the siege of the Branch Dividian compound in Waco TX and the Oklahoma City bombing calmed Janet Reno and her jack booted thugs right the fark down. Timmothy McVeigh is a patriot, as are the OWS people.

CPennypacker: vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

You know that, I know that, and Brookfield Properties knows that, but I think we'd both wager a depressingly large amount that our protester friends don't.

/also apparently it's "Zuccotti" park. whoopsy.

...ahem.
ex post facto

That being said, in other words, Bloomberg would be okay with this if it just wasn't so intents?

But the brats came back, the very next day
The brats came back
The city thought they were all goners
But the brats came back the very next day
They just wouldn't stay away....

/i don't think they are all brats, but this song came into my head. Great cartoon.

Bloomberg would be first to sign up to be a Kapo in occupied Poland.

topcon: CPennypacker: topcon: CPennypacker: vexle: FTFA: "The protesters were defiant at first, chanting: "Whose park? Our park!"

No it's not, you dirty farking hippie. Zucotti Park is privately owned. It literally says this in the first sentence of the park's Wikipedia page.

The land is owned. The park is a public space and governed by law.

Link to laws regarding privately owned land being regarded as "public" by your definition.

Just go to the wikipedia page for the park. The park was a concession US Steel had to provide the city on its land in order to get by zoning laws and make 1 Liberty Plaza Higher.

Yeah, sorry, no, that doesn't really cut it.

The park is still privately owned and maintained.

As I work for a civil engineering and land surveying company, I'm somewhat familiar with how these things work. If it were a truly "public" space by your definition, it would have been deeded over to the local government. This happens fairly frequently, either with a donation of land or payment.

The entity who owns this land, Brookfield Properties, clearly has some reason for not wanting to completely hand it over to the government and let them deal with maintaining it.

It doesn't really matter if it "cuts it" for you or not, we have a lot of POPS in New York. They are subject to laws that govern these types of spaces and are created by developers, on their land, as concessions to the city for exceeding building restrictions.

ThisNameSux: "Mom, can I borrow some money for a new tent?"

We need a government tent loan program.

DAMN!!! Karen Allen still looks good!