Yea...

You know, it's not like there isn't anything we could do. We could easily threaten to tariff them. Lets see if he actually follows through...

The U.S. contends China's currency is kept artificially low, putting American businesses at a disadvantage and driving up Chinese trade surpluses.

Obvious tag asplode.

That's called getting Sanduskyed.

china laughs at your "hero".

GAT_00: Nuclear Pancake: We could easily threaten to tariff them.

He already did. The Republican Congress, caring more about Big Business than their constituents, made sure to kill it immediately.

Why am I not shocked?

velvet_fog: That's called getting Sanduskyed.

I am trying so hard not to laugh at this...too soon?

colon_pow: china laughs at your "hero".

It's like you don't even try anymore. Is this still fun for you?

Okay, so here's what I don't get: Say that China un-pegs their currency from the dollar & it shoots up. What do we still make here that they would want to import? Food and weapons, right? Is that going to be enough to make difference in our economy?

GAT_00: Nuclear Pancake: We could easily threaten to tariff them.

He already did. The Republican Congress, caring more about Big Business than their constituents, made sure to kill it immediately.

And for some reason all of these right wing shills and Tea Party people continue to label Obama or anybody on the Left as a socialist and a commie. If they want to go after somebody that supports communism they need to look in their own party.

Anti_illuminati: colon_pow: china laughs at your "hero".

It's like you don't even try anymore. Is this still fun for you?

the hero tag feels ridiculous sitting there next to that headline.

So fark conservatives I have a question for you: Is China superior because they have no bothersome regulations (new window) or because their government meddles so much with currency manipulation that the free market doesn't exist? You choose.

Bonus round: Or are they superior only because we have a D president and not an R president. If we had an R president doing everything our current one does that would be okay, right?

For China to let the RMB appreciate, it would have to stop buying Treasuries and offload some of its current stock.

Actions have consequences, etc.

Every country that has control over its currency....we (the U.S.) do it all the time. No use getting your panties in a bunch just because another country is doing it as well...

Its_A_Tarp: For China to let the RMB appreciate, it would have to stop buying Treasuries and offload some of its current stock.

Actions have consequences, etc.

Every country that has control over its currency....we (the U.S.) do it all the time. No use getting your panties in a bunch just because another country is doing it as well...

Every country that has control over its currency manipulates its currency*

FTFM

fringedmyotis: Okay, so here's what I don't get: Say that China un-pegs their currency from the dollar & it shoots up. What do we still make here that they would want to import? Food and weapons, right? Is that going to be enough to make difference in our economy?

And just about everything we can buy (electronics, most useless plastic Pieces Of Shiat) shoots up in price because it's all Made In China.

With no ability to manufacture it here.

BillCo: FTFA: "As he seeks to reassert U.S. interests in Asia, Obama is using increasingly strong language"

And if that doesn't work, I'm sure he will send them a strongly worded letter.

Yeah, he should start a war. Brilliant idea.

wooden_badger: fringedmyotis: Okay, so here's what I don't get: Say that China un-pegs their currency from the dollar & it shoots up. What do we still make here that they would want to import? Food and weapons, right? Is that going to be enough to make difference in our economy?

And just about everything we can buy (electronics, most useless plastic Pieces Of Shiat) shoots up in price because it's all Made In China.

With no ability to manufacture it here. We make more than everyone else still.

GAT_00:
He already did. The Republican Congress, caring more about Big Business than their constituents, made sure to kill it immediately.

Country first.

BloodySaxon: wooden_badger: fringedmyotis: Okay, so here's what I don't get: Say that China un-pegs their currency from the dollar & it shoots up. What do we still make here that they would want to import? Food and weapons, right? Is that going to be enough to make difference in our economy?

And just about everything we can buy (electronics, most useless plastic Pieces Of Shiat) shoots up in price because it's all Made In China.

With no ability DESIRE to manufacture it here. We make more than everyone else still.

Thar we go.

Tear down their shiatty yuan.

If they appreciate the currency, the factories will just move to other countries. Too costly in China? Ok, we'll just move to Laos, or Cambodia, or Bangladesh.

Herman Cain is the kindest, warmest, most wonderful person I've ever met.

colon_pow: Anti_illuminati: colon_pow: china laughs at your "hero".

It's like you don't even try anymore. Is this still fun for you?

the hero tag feels ridiculous sitting there next to that headline.

that's exactly what I was getting at.

/jesus christ.

BillCo: FTFA: "As he seeks to reassert U.S. interests in Asia, Obama is using increasingly strong language"

And if that doesn't work, I'm sure he will send them a strongly worded letter.

You're right. We should bomb them.

There is enough pressure from inside China to stop artificially keeping their currency down. The emerging middle class would like access to imported luxury goods (the real ones--not the cheap knock-offs they make in abundance).

If they want to continue undervaluing their manpower and raw goods, I say let them. It is not indefinitely sustainable so you might as well enjoy it while you can. If we still had domestic manufacturing jobs to protect, I would sing a different song, but that ship set sail over a decade ago.

BillCo: FTFA: "As he seeks to reassert U.S. interests in Asia, Obama is using increasingly strong language"

And if that doesn't work, I'm sure he will send them a strongly worded letter.

For real! We should just go ahead and go to war with them damn Chi-coms, amirite?

Yes, but what is he going to do about the threat of pee pee in our coke?

AntiNerd: So fark conservatives I have a question for you: Is China superior because they have no bothersome regulations (new window) or because their government meddles so much with currency manipulation that the free market doesn't exist? You choose.

Bonus round: Or are they superior only because we have a D president and not an R president. If we had an R president doing everything our current one does that would be okay, right?

I think China is superior because they have masses of low pay peons who know their place, don't cry much about having rights and don't demand stupid safety regulations. Hardly anybody there gets upset about the gap between the very rich and the very poor and they won't demonstrate about income equality or social justice.

fringedmyotis: Okay, so here's what I don't get: Say that China un-pegs their currency from the dollar & it shoots up. What do we still make here that they would want to import? Food and weapons, right? Is that going to be enough to make difference in our economy?

The US manufactures many things the Chinese would want, from cars to CPUs, but it's also the low wages (again, due to the low currency) that is moving manufacturers over to China. Low end stuff like cheap toys won't come back to the US, but stuff like smartphones and tablets certainly could.

AntiNerd: So fark conservatives I have a question for you: Is China superior because they have no bothersome regulations (new window) or because their government meddles so much with currency manipulation that the free market doesn't exist?

Or because their government is investing massive amounts of money into their economy and pushing inflationary policies...

/But that couldn't possibly work because Keynesianism is discredited.

Because People in power are Stupid: Now with corporate personhood, even the Chinese can own a US politician.

Uh, they contributed heavily to Clinton's campaign. It was one of the minor scandals of his presidency.

historycat: TheGreatGazoo: If they appreciate the currency, the factories will just move to other countries. Too costly in China? Ok, we'll just move to Laos, or Cambodia, or Bangladesh.

Ya, free trade is just like all the other right-libertarian fantasies. Great in theory, sucks for us in practice.

You need a level playing field, and as long as shipping is cheap and labor is expensive you need tariffs to encourage home nation manufacturing jobs.

I'm a big advocate of a human rights tariff -- specifically, a large tariff imposed on countries that exploit workers and the environment, to bring the costs of doing business with them in line with the costs of doing business with a country that acts responsibly.

Please stop selling us repackaged piss and calling it Coke

Well, I was waiting for all the protectionists to hop in with their snap judgements.

Say you further raise steel tariffs or have the "buy american" clause in the stimulus...sounds great huh? But what happens if there is retaliation by other countries with their own tariffs or "buy_______" in their stimulus packages. We tried to keep the price of steel higher here to protect our steel industry from dumping by the Chinese and alike (so we thought) but a lot of that domestic steel production goes to build things for Caterpillar, John Deere, and GE products that we traditionally export (admittedly, that has changed quite a bit for some product lines, globalization is a biatch). What happens when less countries buy our exports due to trade barriers of their own they make in response to ours? Those big traditionally U.S. export companies would consequently buy less American steel...the steel industry really would not be much better off after all.

Unintended Consequences...

China: Take this currency policy, but beware it carries a terrible curse!
US: Ooh, that's bad.
China: But it comes with cheap imports!
US: That's good.
China: The the imports are also cursed.
US: That's bad.
China: But we will finance your deficit spending.
US: That's good!
China: The deficit spending will prevent capital formation and can lead to inflation.
[US looks puzzled]
China: ...That's bad.
US: Can I go now?

It seems incredibly hypocritical to put blame on China for currency manipulation. Ridiculously hypocritical; that's like Bush criticizing another country for invading Iraq. If we want to make our pointing-fingers-from-the-podium act look genuine, I suggest Obama and co. stop overspending and have Bernanke stop his "quantitative easing" sprees, although something tells me that ain't gonna happen anytime soon.

Flargan: China: Take this currency policy, but beware it carries a terrible curse!
US: Ooh, that's bad.
China: But it comes with cheap imports!
US: That's good.
China: The the imports are also cursed.
US: That's bad.
China: But we will finance your deficit spending.
US: That's good!
China: The deficit spending will prevent capital formation and can lead to inflation.
[US looks puzzled]
China: ...That's bad.
US: Can I go now?

BillCo: FTFA: "As he seeks to reassert U.S. interests in Asia, Obama is using increasingly strong language"

And if that doesn't work, I'm sure he will send them a strongly worded letter.

How to effectively threadshiat in four easy steps:
1. Obtain TF subscription
2. Submit article whose editorial slant counters your dipshiat opinion
3. Make idiotic supposition
4. Run

AntiNerd: So fark conservatives I have a question for you: Is China superior because they have no bothersome regulations (new window) or because their government meddles so much with currency manipulation that the free market doesn't exist? You choose.

Answer: China's not superior. Their economy is a facade.

I keep reading this headline as China pegging Obama.

metametameta: I keep reading this headline as China pegging Obama.

Chia Petting Obama!

Guntram Shatterhand

GAT_00: Nuclear Pancake: We could easily threaten to tariff them.

He already did. The Republican Congress, caring more about Big Business than their constituents, made sure to kill it immediately.

Why am I not shocked?

I'd be shocked if GAT_00's posts had anything to do with reality.

As described by this in fact the Republicans joined the Democrats in passing the bill to give Obama enhanced tariff powers. And in fact, Obama imposed a higher tariff on tires in 2009 that in the real world was not killed by the Republicans or anyone else. As the link describes, it was Obama's appointee Geithner who opposed the bill, and both the Treasury and Commerce depts, both in the executive branch, haven't taken action. FTA:

So far the administration has been reluctant to pursue retaliation against China. The Treasury Department has repeatedly declined to formally declare China a currency manipulator. And last month, the Commerce Department decided not to investigate allegations that China's currency practices amounted to an improper export subsidy.

Problem is that too many people in Obama's own party support Free Trade with Communist China. They would not support a much needed tariff

Although, a threat to tariff Communist China will sure make Free Trade Commies like Rush Limbaugh and other GOPer talkers look incredibly foolish...and anti-American. In reality......a tariff on Communist China would get a lot of GOP and Democrat rank-and-file support

Obama actually would win easily in 2012 if he slapped a huge tariff on the Communist Chinese. He would actually get back the independent and GOP voter support he had in 2008. Unfortunately, he lacks the sack to do so

And, if you still support Free Trade with Communist China.....you are a Communist

UCFRoadWarrior: Problem is that too many people in Obama's own party support Free Trade with Communist China.

I hate to break it to you but China has shifted to a largely capitalist economic model and are currently kicking our asses with it. I know the cold war was a comforting time with well defined enemies but you need to stop living in the past.

So, I am woefully undereducated on a lot of economics issues and policies. I've always been under the impression that a strong dollar against another currency is good. Is the issue that China's currency, manipulated by the government to be very low versus the US dollar, makes US goods exported to China both too expensive for the average yuan-holder and too expensive in relation to domestic Chinese goods? US exporters must then either lower their price and cut profits to the bone or risk losing a substantial amount of business to domestic Chinese products? If so, is this a case of agri exporters unable to sell grain or chicken or whatever at a reasonable price in China, high tech goods like planes and cars and ipods or (I guess along the lines as high tech goods) commercial products like engines?

I'm trying to avoid the partisan rhetoric, and with all the talk about exchange rates during the recent talks, I wanted to get a better sense of what the problem is, beyond the headlines and maybe dumbed down a tad for the economics-impaired.