It seems pretty simple here - He gave them s specific assignment and they didn't follow it.

Undergrads in the US are some of the whiniest people on the planet. It's a psychology class. There is a lesson he is trying to tech you. It makes sense. Failure has consequences. Live it, learn it, deal with it.

I like that he's called Dr Parrott. If I was called Dr Parrott and I taught psychology, I would bring a real parrot to class and teach it to say "Help, I've been turned into a parrot!"

Harry_Seldon: Undergrads in the US are some of the whiniest people on the planet. It's a psychology class. There is a lesson he is trying to tech you. It makes sense. Failure has consequences. Live it, learn it, deal with it.

Almost as importantly, failure has causes and can sometimes be avoided and sometimes easily-so, but requires actually acting to do so.

The specifics in this case are trivial and perhaps the consequences out-of-proportion, but this is a goddamn important lesson to learn before the consequences for not following instructions are loss of a job, life, or Mars probe. Anyone wanna bet on whether this group of students have learned this lesson?

This impresses me, hope the university backs him up.

Prof. Frink: Harry_Seldon: Undergrads in the US are some of the whiniest people on the planet. It's a psychology class. There is a lesson he is trying to tech you. It makes sense. Failure has consequences. Live it, learn it, deal with it.

Almost as importantly, failure has causes and can sometimes be avoided and sometimes easily-so, but requires actually acting to do so.

The specifics in this case are trivial and perhaps the consequences out-of-proportion, but this is a goddamn important lesson to learn before the consequences for not following instructions are loss of a job, life, or Mars probe. Anyone wanna bet on whether this group of students have learned this lesson?

They already know how to whine about everything, why would they learn anything from this?

Proffy want a cracker.

"Psych 101" ... "one of the most difficult courses in the department."

Oh please. Psych 101 is the class that all the little drunk freshman snowflakes take to pad out their schedules with easy classes.

*puts on Engineer Egotism Brigade helm*
The problem with Psychology profs, and most other Liberal Arts professors is that they feel compelled to teach students "lessons" that would be considered patronizing to a 7 year old. Some are there to learn; Most just want a passing grade. Throwing roadblocks in order to hammer in a lesson they didn't learn 10 years ago (and sure as hell aren't going to learn now) just frustrates everyone and degrades the idea that college is a place of higher learning.

...And no, you don't need to be a jerk about not handing out a study guide. Psychology and such are a big, boring swamp of useless facts and theories that would drive a normal person crazy if they attempted to memorize everything from the book.

Wait - you mean to tell me people who strive to be in a position of authority over others sometime abuse their power to stroke their own fragile ego?

I, for one, am shocked!

The prof is a d-bag. No, I'm not going to bake your fat ass any cookies.

UltimaCS: *puts on Engineer Egotism Brigade helm*
The problem with Psychology profs, and most other Liberal Arts professors is that they feel compelled to teach students "lessons" that would be considered patronizing to a 7 year old. Some are there to learn; Most just want a passing grade. Throwing roadblocks in order to hammer in a lesson they didn't learn 10 years ago (and sure as hell aren't going to learn now) just frustrates everyone and degrades the idea that college is a place of higher learning.

...And no, you don't need to be a jerk about not handing out a study guide. Psychology and such are a big, boring swamp of useless facts and theories that would drive a normal person crazy if they attempted to memorize everything from the book.

Psychology isn't liberal arts.

Harry_Seldon: Psychology isn't liberal arts.

Call it what you want. I avoided the phrase "soft science", since I wanted to be less douchey than pedantic.

narkor: I like that he's called Dr Parrott. If I was called Dr Parrott and I taught psychology, I would bring a real parrot to class and teach it to say "Help, I've been turned into a parrot!"

lol. good one

This sounds like bullshiat. I knew a guy who did standup in his spare time. He started giving out extra points to his math students if they'd come see his shows. Got in a heap of trouble from the University for it.

I wish this Sacramento Fatty would get in as much trouble so his students didn't have to bake him snacks. This just sounds ridiculous.

NicoFinn: This sounds like bullshiat. I knew a guy who did standup in his spare time. He started giving out extra points to his math students if they'd come see his shows. Got in a heap of trouble from the University for it. I wish this Sacramento Fatty would get in as much trouble so his students didn't have to bake him snacks. This just sounds ridiculous.

The University doesn't care because he created a vague, unsupported connection to education in the form of "if you're sharing snacks, you're learning to work as a team." And considering how long he's been doing it, he has tenure and can't be fired with nothing short of peeing on his students and calling it a lesson in humility.

According to Google, he also teaches "Stereotypes and Sex Role Attitudes." I honestly hope he requires the gals in that class to bake for him, too.

You mean The Spousal Unit has been teaching psychology at his university for 10+ years and never demanded food? Do you know how much time and money I could have saved if his students had been feeding him????

If he's been doing it for 39 years and the university hadn't reprimanded him, and he doesn't require them to buy a text book (thus saving them $200), and he's up front about it on the syllabus, then they can shut up and chip in a $1.00 each and bring in a veggie platter and some cookies. Otherwise, you can review the material on your own, which they should have been doing rather than whining to the university about his walking out of the session.

Harry_Seldon: Undergrads in the US are some of the whiniest people on the planet. It's a psychology class. There is a lesson he is trying to tech you. It makes sense. Failure has consequences. Live it, learn it, deal with it.

+1, and a THIS. I read a few lines into the post and realised he had a legit reason for the snacks (to get the students to work together and break the ice). Stop whining and do as your told.

Professor. would you teach if I gave you a Scooby Snack?

UltimaCS: a vague, unsupported connection to education

That's the part I have a problem with. It's bs.

(Yes, the kids can study on their own. Yes, no textbook, blah, blah, blah. Prof is still a d-bag.)

slepygryhnd: In regards to review sheets: I never provide them.

This is one advantage of fraternities. We maintain libraries of tests, quizzes, problem sets, etc. from the past few years.

Now THOSE are review sheets.

Harry_Seldon: UltimaCS: *puts on Engineer Egotism Brigade helm*
The problem with Psychology profs, and most other Liberal Arts professors is that they feel compelled to teach students "lessons" that would be considered patronizing to a 7 year old. Some are there to learn; Most just want a passing grade. Throwing roadblocks in order to hammer in a lesson they didn't learn 10 years ago (and sure as hell aren't going to learn now) just frustrates everyone and degrades the idea that college is a place of higher learning.

...And no, you don't need to be a jerk about not handing out a study guide. Psychology and such are a big, boring swamp of useless facts and theories that would drive a normal person crazy if they attempted to memorize everything from the book.

Psychology isn't liberal arts.


Everything that isn't strictly Engineering is, to an Engineer, "Liberal Arts".

dahmers love zombie: But students are crying foul, saying the teacher left before a review for a midterm to be given Monday. The test accounts for a good portion of their grade.

You want a goddamn review? Start at the first page of the text, and read. Stop when you get to the end of the material covered on the midterm.
Then begin on your class notes. Make note cards with important terms, concepts, dates, etc. Review them with other students in the course.

Every time I get a student insisting that I need to provide a "review sheet" (which is the new code phrase for "tell us exactly what is going to be on the test so we only have to study that") it makes me want to kick babies.

That being said, the snack thing is fairly weird. I can't see myself ever doing it.

The problem, I think, is that students now realize they have some leverage over instructors in the form of evaluations. At many places student evaluations are a significant component of the administration's evaluation of their faculty when considering whether or not to give them a pay raise (or worse: promotion). I don't think every student specifically knows this, but I think they all understand it on some level.

This can get in the way of a teacher doing their job. If they are overly concerned with giving the students what they want so they receive a good evaluation, they can end up doing things for the students that take the place of their learning. I think the whole "review sheet" this is a great example.

That said, this guy's "lesson about teamwork" is a little ridiculous. If I were a student I'd see that rule as an arbitrary one and his reaction to their breaking it excessive. However, being an adult means have to do seemingly arbitrary things you don't want to do to get what you want, so I can see his point. I still think there is probably a better way to teach this particular lesson in the context of the class.

rpu3: You mean The Spousal Unit has been teaching psychology at his university for 10+ years and never demanded food? Do you know how much time and money I could have saved if his students had been feeding him????

If he's been doing it for 39 years and the university hadn't reprimanded him, and he doesn't require them to buy a text book (thus saving them $200), and he's up front about it on the syllabus, then they can shut up and chip in a $1.00 each and bring in a veggie platter and some cookies. Otherwise, you can review the material on your own, which they should have been doing rather than whining to the university about his walking out of the session.

Whether they should or should not study on their own is irrelevant. The Professor intentionally removed class material to 'punish' the students for not meeting his unreasonable demands that have nothing to do with his class or the material expected to be covered in the class.

"If you want to attend the study session you need to come to my wife's bakery/attend my stand up routine/wash my car/show me your tits/bring me food/write me love poetry/cut my grass.....or you cannot attend the study session where I will cover material that other classes/sections/students will have access to. This will directly correlate with higher test scores. And it's okay, because I'm in charge.'

It's only marginally different than simply giving them extra points for doing what he wants. It's completely inappropriate.

Harry_Seldon: UltimaCS: *puts on Engineer Egotism Brigade helm*
The problem with Psychology profs, and most other Liberal Arts professors is that they feel compelled to teach students "lessons" that would be considered patronizing to a 7 year old. Some are there to learn; Most just want a passing grade. Throwing roadblocks in order to hammer in a lesson they didn't learn 10 years ago (and sure as hell aren't going to learn now) just frustrates everyone and degrades the idea that college is a place of higher learning.

...And no, you don't need to be a jerk about not handing out a study guide. Psychology and such are a big, boring swamp of useless facts and theories that would drive a normal person crazy if they attempted to memorize everything from the book.

Psychology isn't liberal arts.

Back in the day, you had "theology" degrees for priests-to-be and everything else was "liberal arts." Today there are very few actual liberal arts programs left, most are arts and sciences. Nonetheless, even in those liberal arts-exclusive programs, the social sciences are part of the liberal arts program.

For example, I point to the Indiana University School of Liberal Arts at Indiana University-Purdue University at Indianapolis, which includes psychology along with the rest of the social sciences. IU Bloomington folds liberal arts into the School of Arts and Sciences like most universities these days so that liberal arts can be partially supported by natural science grants (~50% of grants are taken for the academic unit's administration as a general rule).

A handout from the teacher is clear - "Not having a snack = no Dr. Parrott or TAs. Now you are responsible for your own lab assignment."

What the fark does a psych 101 "lab" entail ?

/Fat prof sounds fat

dahmers love zombie: But students are crying foul, saying the teacher left before a review for a midterm to be given Monday. The test accounts for a good portion of their grade.

You want a goddamn review? Start at the first page of the text, and read. Stop when you get to the end of the material covered on the midterm.
Then begin on your class notes. Make note cards with important terms, concepts, dates, etc. Review them with other students in the course.

Every time I get a student insisting that I need to provide a "review sheet" (which is the new code phrase for "tell us exactly what is going to be on the test so we only have to study that") it makes me want to kick babies.

That being said, the snack thing is fairly weird. I can't see myself ever doing it.

That's B.S.

I've taken a 16-week class that had three required textbooks for a total of over 2,000 pages. The vast majority of that material was not covered by the professor or considered part of the class. It didn't appear on any tests, quizzes or homework assignments. The depth and breadth covered was unbelievably large and it would be completely and utterly unreasonable to expect a person, even working full-time on only this class, to master all of the concepts covered in the books.

This was a C.S course on Operating Systems. One of the books dealt with the specific code-level implementation details of the Linux Kernel. The generic Operating Systems book we had was 800 pages and touched on just about very topic you could imagine relating to computing systems, touching on small specifics of really, really detailed subjects. I don't remember the actual title of the 3rd book, but it was all about programming for Unix in C. Again, that topic alone could span years of academic study.

It's easy to say, 'OMG lazy students! Start at page one and read!' - but the class is not designed that way and there is simply no way to be successful in academia using that approach. You could *LEARN* a lot, but you won't pass the test or finish the class. Not all classes.

UltimaCS: *puts on Engineer Egotism Brigade helm*
The problem with Psychology profs, and most other Liberal Arts professors is that they feel compelled to teach students "lessons" that would be considered patronizing to a 7 year old. Some are there to learn; Most just want a passing grade. Throwing roadblocks in order to hammer in a lesson they didn't learn 10 years ago (and sure as hell aren't going to learn now) just frustrates everyone and degrades the idea that college is a place of higher learning.


I'm with you on this. The article says that it's mostly a commuter campus. As someone who went back to school later in life, spending thousands of dollars for the privilege, driving an hour commute, and working in between....don't make me bake you a farking cake because you think it teaches me a life lesson. Treat your students like adults: "This requires group work, here's the e-mail list, the rest is your responsibility." If they can't handle that, then they shouldn't be in college.

dahmers love zombie: But students are crying foul, saying the teacher left before a review for a midterm to be given Monday. The test accounts for a good portion of their grade.

You want a goddamn review? Start at the first page of the text, and read. Stop when you get to the end of the material covered on the midterm.
Then begin on your class notes. Make note cards with important terms, concepts, dates, etc. Review them with other students in the course.

Every time I get a student insisting that I need to provide a "review sheet" (which is the new code phrase for "tell us exactly what is going to be on the test so we only have to study that") it makes me want to kick babies.

That being said, the snack thing is fairly weird. I can't see myself ever doing it.


Gee, I feel really bad for you there having to field all those questions for what will be on a test.

It's hardly an outrageous request. Students have other classes and most have jobs and there isn't infinite time to study and worry that a professor is going to throw in a question that has little to do with anything other than the exact phrasing in the text.

NicoFinn: UltimaCS: a vague, unsupported connection to education

That's the part I have a problem with. It's bs.

If he thinks his particular psych class benefits when he gives the students a token collective task, I don't think he really needs to produce any research to justify that to anyone else. At best, his professional opinion is correct. At worst, it is a harmless eccentricity. Either way, I don't have much sympathy for students whining that their failure to follow simple directions and solve a trivial problem resulted in reduced handholding just as the prof promised them it would.

"He said the snack obligation is his way of encouraging students to work collectively."

Typical Lib professor. Nothing to see here.

narkor: I like that he's called Dr Parrott. If I was called Dr Parrott and I taught psychology, I would bring a real parrot to class and teach it to say "Help, I've been turned into a parrot!"

I'd dress a midget up as a pirate and carry him around on my shoulder.

Alleyoop: "He said the snack obligation is his way of encouraging students to work collectively."

Typical Lib professor. Nothing to see here.

FTA, the Prof eats, but doesn't contribute (according to the students). If true, that's a pretty sweet gig.

/ "all animals are equal, but some are more equal than others"

Gosh, I don't get to read the story because I will not stand for the ridiculous commercial at the beginning that did not immediately disappear when "Close" was clicked. Way to go, Sacbee - excellent marketing strategy!

Fark_Guy_Rob: Whether they should or should not study on their own is irrelevant. The Professor intentionally removed class material to 'punish' the students for not meeting his unreasonable demands that have nothing to do with his class or the material expected to be covered in the class.

The students didn't need the prof to have the review session. They were all there. Do it already. Have your session without your snacks! You made your choice to not bring the snacks, so deal with it and get busy with the review. The prof wasn't holding any material back (it's a lecture class in which the prof does not require the purchase of a book) that they desperately needed for the exam. It's a collective learning environment that hadn't been challenged in 39 years. It was stated on the syllabus. It's not unreasonable. It's not like he came up with it out of thin air.

I had a solution to classes in which I didn't like the prof or the material or the like - it's called do your research on the prof before you sign up for the class (first choice) or drop it in the first two weeks (second choice). If you don't like the prof's style or "demands" which have been unchallenged, then drop the stupid class already or don't sign up in the first place. Otherwise, follow the syllabus or quit the whining if you don't like the results of NOT following the syllabus!

I'll be interested to read the results of this professor's long-running experiment. It probably won't be peer reviewed because of IRB non-compliance but he's probably got something in the works.

Fark_Guy_Rob: Wait - you mean to tell me people who strive to be in a position of authority over others sometime abuse their power to stroke their own fragile ego?

I, for one, am shocked!

The prof is a d-bag. No, I'm not going to bake your fat ass any cookies.

Fark_Guy_Rob: Whether they should or should not study on their own is irrelevant. The Professor intentionally removed class material to 'punish' the students for not meeting his unreasonable demands that have nothing to do with his class or the material expected to be covered in the class.

"If you want to attend the study session you need to come to my wife's bakery/attend my stand up routine/wash my car/show me your tits/bring me food/write me love poetry/cut my grass.....or you cannot attend the study session where I will cover material that other classes/sections/students will have access to. This will directly correlate with higher test scores. And it's okay, because I'm in charge.'

It's only marginally different than simply giving them extra points for doing what he wants. It's completely inappropriate.

Agreed. This teacher should be reprimanded, then watched carefully. His judgement is obviously off.

As far as studying for tests: One of my teachers had been a student of Stanley Milgram, who is famous for his experiments on whether or not someone would punish a perfect stranger with strong electrical shocks for not foloowing orders (they would).

Anyway, I loved her system - base the test on the workbook that went with the text book. Problem was, that workbook was not part of the required texts for class. Solution? Buy the workbook, of course, and make sure you know the right answers to everything. The answers were in the back.

And I gotta disagree with you, Harry, about psychology. I find every aspect of it, pretty much, fascinating. Thus the nick. (;

AbbeySomeone: It seems pretty simple here - He gave them s specific assignment and they didn't follow it.

Yeah, but being such a rigid hardass about the requirement seems like a case of Freudian anal-insist.

Forbidden Doughnut: Alleyoop: "He said the snack obligation is his way of encouraging students to work collectively."

Typical Lib professor. Nothing to see here.

FTA, the Prof eats, but doesn't contribute (according to the students). If true, that's a pretty sweet gig.

/ "all animals are equal, but some are more equal than others"

If successful, the class will work collectively to thin out the non-performing leeches (the prof and TAs that eat but do not contribute). I'd say something along the lines of a message like "nobody eat the 'special' chocolate cupcakes with sprinkles on them" sent amongst the students only.

Fark_Guy_Rob: dahmers love zombie: But students are crying foul, saying the teacher left before a review for a midterm to be given Monday. The test accounts for a good portion of their grade.

You want a goddamn review? Start at the first page of the text, and read. Stop when you get to the end of the material covered on the midterm.
Then begin on your class notes. Make note cards with important terms, concepts, dates, etc. Review them with other students in the course.

Every time I get a student insisting that I need to provide a "review sheet" (which is the new code phrase for "tell us exactly what is going to be on the test so we only have to study that") it makes me want to kick babies.

That being said, the snack thing is fairly weird. I can't see myself ever doing it.

That's B.S.

I've taken a 16-week class that had three required textbooks for a total of over 2,000 pages. The vast majority of that material was not covered by the professor or considered part of the class. It didn't appear on any tests, quizzes or homework assignments. The depth and breadth covered was unbelievably large and it would be completely and utterly unreasonable to expect a person, even working full-time on only this class, to master all of the concepts covered in the books.

This was a C.S course on Operating Systems. One of the books dealt with the specific code-level implementation details of the Linux Kernel. The generic Operating Systems book we had was 800 pages and touched on just about very topic you could imagine relating to computing systems, touching on small specifics of really, really detailed subjects. I don't remember the actual title of the 3rd book, but it was all about programming for Unix in C. Again, that topic alone could span years of academic study.

It's easy to say, 'OMG lazy students! Start at page one and read!' - but the class is not designed that way and there is simply no way to be successful in academia using that approach. You could *LEARN* a lot, but you won't pass the test or finish the class. Not all classes.

I went to a school where pretty much every course was like that. There was no such thing as "bird courses" every class like Psych 101 was a weeder course where every prof just slung 100 lbs of shiat at you to memorize for the test.

Every test was written in a way to "trick" you if you just did a cursory overview of the material, rather than just present the material and study it.

Answer banks, group study sessions, and adderral were passed around like water. There was no such thing as just "being smart" and that being enough for a good grade.

I ended up with a 3.4, but I seriously think I could have got a 3.7 or 3.8+ If i went to one of the many diploma mills around here like Umass or URI. Matter fact, I had a 4.0 when i transferred from State College.

So yeah, most of these threads talking about entitled snowflakes amuse me.

dahmers love zombie: But students are crying foul, saying the teacher left before a review for a midterm to be given Monday. The test accounts for a good portion of their grade.

You want a goddamn review? Start at the first page of the text, and read. Stop when you get to the end of the material covered on the midterm.
Then begin on your class notes. Make note cards with important terms, concepts, dates, etc. Review them with other students in the course.

Every time I get a student insisting that I need to provide a "review sheet" (which is the new code phrase for "tell us exactly what is going to be on the test so we only have to study that") it makes me want to kick babies.

That being said, the snack thing is fairly weird. I can't see myself ever doing it.

If a review sheet for your class necessarily tells your students "exactly what is going to be on the test", you are either an incompetent/lazy professor, or the subject you teach is so easy its a friggin joke.

Fark_Guy_Rob: It's easy to say, 'OMG lazy students! Start at page one and read!' - but the class is not designed that way and there is simply no way to be successful in academia using that approach. You could *LEARN* a lot, but you won't pass the test or finish the class. Not all classes.

I may not be an engineer. But as someone who graduated from a 4 year less than 2 years ago...

Did you take notes in class? No? Then go fark yourself. I took psych 101. We read 10 out of 21 chapters. Gee, I wonder what 10 chapters might be on the test.

/it sounds like lazy frat boy in here
//or more accurately "I blew off 20 days of class and expect an EZMODE pass"

Is it possible to get less than an A in Psych 101? There were a couple of Japanese kids (from, you know, Japan) who would sit next to me and cage scantrons or blue books. They showed up for the first day, the last day and tests. They got A's.