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(C|Net) Sad Remember the Microsoft Courier? It was like the iPad for Productive People ... Here's why Microsoft killed it   (news.cnet.com) divider line 182
More: Sad, messengers, iPads, Microsoft, Boston Consulting Group, tablet computer, senior partner, Ballmer, product development  
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8634 clicks; posted to Geek » on 08 Nov 2011 at 11:58 AM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»   |    Get this fabulous T-Shirt and impress the methane out of your friends! shirt it!



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2011-11-08 10:22:24 AM
presbyplace.files.wordpress.com

Balmer!
 
2011-11-08 12:01:08 PM
I wanted one of those so much.
 
2011-11-08 12:05:34 PM
Considering that the Courier wasn't going to do email (and focus on this nebulous "creative" stuff) it seems like the right call. Look at how the Blackberry tablet bombed. Everyone had a shiat fit when they realized you had to tether it to do anything useful. This looked like it was heading down the same path with the assumption you'd have a computer or phone to actually do shiat.
 
2011-11-08 12:06:22 PM
Because if people could use it for something productive and not just a status symbol then it would lose it's profit margin for apple.
 
2011-11-08 12:07:02 PM
Microsoft had exactly as much faith in tablets as Apple did, riiiiight up until Apple released the iPad.

It's always been amazing watching Jobs gripe about how that next new thing people are clamoring for is nothing but a waste of time...up until the moment they release it.

MS lost a major opportunity to get their player in the game. Now they're left struggling with WP7. Looking at Windows 8 and the hardware we can expect from next cycle, I'm going to bet against MS gaining any serious marketshare in 2012. It's hilarious how often MS is busy innovating in the background, but doesn't bother to release what would be a major tech coup, choosing instead to play catch-up with last-year's fad.
 
2011-11-08 12:09:32 PM
Tablets are toys for children and women.
 
2011-11-08 12:09:45 PM
Shrugging Atlas: I wanted one of those so much.
 
2011-11-08 12:10:23 PM
Shrugging Atlas: I wanted one of those so much.

I still do.
I don't buy that MS has completely killed off the project. You will see a modified version of this running win8 in the next year or so.

It's too good a concept to go away, but does need some improvements to fit the vision. It does need an email client.
Plus IMO better screens, perhaps no bezel on the inside edges.
 
2011-11-08 12:10:41 PM
It never really existed.
 
2011-11-08 12:11:33 PM
Am I missing something? Was there any freaking reason they couldn't simply add email functionality???

/bitter
//I really wanted one of these.
 
2011-11-08 12:12:01 PM
animal900: Tablets are toys for children and women.

oooooooooooooooooooooooo
so tablets are a GIANT market then ???

and MS is ignoring it yet again
 
2011-11-08 12:22:28 PM
namatad: animal900: Tablets are toys for children and women.

oooooooooooooooooooooooo
so tablets are a GIANT market then ???

and MS is ignoring it yet again


Yup, and nothing wrong with that. I'm just tired of people preaching about the iPad for productivity. What percentage of iPads sold do you really think are going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

With that said, even I feel like I want one, but the only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I can't figure out what I'd use it for that I couldn't do with my phone or laptop. I think I'd have buyer's remorse after a week or so, and would leave it in a stack of magazines gathering dust.
 
2011-11-08 12:24:32 PM
JinxofSpades: Am I missing something? Was there any freaking reason they couldn't simply add email functionality???


2 things.
1. The product didn't exist as a whole, so they probably didn't have anybody assigned to write up a client.
2. J's vision was for you not to have that on the product. He assumed that you would use a phone for that. IMO, it was a bad call.
 
2011-11-08 12:25:15 PM
 
2011-11-08 12:27:35 PM
animal900: With that said, even I feel like I want one, but the only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I can't figure out what I'd use it for that I couldn't do with my phone or laptop. I think I'd have buyer's remorse after a week or so, and would leave it in a stack of magazines gathering dust.

E-books. Games. E-mail. Web. While out and about, or on the crapper, or the couch.
 
2011-11-08 12:28:12 PM
animal900: namatad: animal900: Tablets are toys for children and women.

oooooooooooooooooooooooo
so tablets are a GIANT market then ???

and MS is ignoring it yet again

Yup, and nothing wrong with that. I'm just tired of people preaching about the iPad for productivity. What percentage of iPads sold do you really think are going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

With that said, even I feel like I want one, but the only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I can't figure out what I'd use it for that I couldn't do with my phone or laptop. I think I'd have buyer's remorse after a week or so, and would leave it in a stack of magazines gathering dust.


when a friend got an ipad, i figured i'd try it out with a stylus....

no pressure sensitivity or tilt recognition makes me wonder why artists poo-poo this useless gadget. it's nigh useless (to me)
 
2011-11-08 12:28:49 PM
ha-ha-guy 2011-11-08 12:05:34 PM
Considering that the Courier wasn't going to do email (and focus on this nebulous "creative" stuff) it seems like the right call.


I disagree - on reading the article, the Courier was geared for people to replace a notebook. The Courier interface I saw in demo videos showed users writing, sketching, collecting photos, etc for projects and aggregating them in one place. This is not easy/seamless on any tablet that I've seen (on-screen keyboards are an uncomfortable pain), and its impossible on a smartphone.

Since most users have a smartphone, this would duplicate functionality. Gates was just stuck in the mid 1990s mindset.

Example demo: Link (new window)
 
2011-11-08 12:42:36 PM
Kar98: animal900: With that said, even I feel like I want one, but the only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I can't figure out what I'd use it for that I couldn't do with my phone or laptop. I think I'd have buyer's remorse after a week or so, and would leave it in a stack of magazines gathering dust.

E-books. Games. E-mail. Web. While out and about, or on the crapper, or the couch.


I don't read ebooks, and the rest I can do on my phone which is ALWAYS in my pocket. I'm not lugging a tablet into the can at work...
 
2011-11-08 12:45:37 PM
meatofmystery: no pressure sensitivity or tilt recognition makes me wonder why artists poo-poo this useless gadget. it's nigh useless (to me)

Exactly, with a capacitive screen it's useless to people that want to do things like draw or otherwise use freehand
 
2011-11-08 12:51:10 PM
animal900: With that said, even I feel like I want one, but the only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I can't figure out what I'd use it for that I couldn't do with my phone or laptop. I think I'd have buyer's remorse after a week or so, and would leave it in a stack of magazines gathering dust.

electronic book
damn, might need to get one of these before my next plane trip/vacation.
 
2011-11-08 12:54:50 PM
Within a few weeks, Courier was cancelled because the product didn't clearly align with the company's Windows and Office franchises, according to sources.

This reminds me of Sony music killing MP3 on their music players because of piracy. Result: people didn't use ATRAC and Sony players, they just bought someone else's players and continued to use MP3.

Companies are always reluctant to kill their own business, even though it's obvious that it's going to happen, so you might as well be the people doing it. No-one wants Outlook or Exchange except for control freak corporates. Hell, searching mail in Gmail is WAY faster and more reliable than searching on Outlook. I know 2 companies that switched to Google business stuff because they don't have to fark around with servers and licensing bullshiat.
 
2011-11-08 12:58:45 PM
Shrugging Atlas: I wanted one of those so much.

You want a tablet you can't even get email on?

"Courier users wouldn't want or need a feature-rich e-mail application such as Microsoft's Outlook that lets them switch to conversation views in their inbox or support offline e-mail reading and writing."

So the guys making it and pitching it were the dumbest sons of goats ever.
 
2011-11-08 12:59:19 PM
animal900: Yup, and nothing wrong with that. I'm just tired of people preaching about the iPad for productivity. What percentage of iPads sold do you really think are going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

What percentage of PCs sold do you really think of going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

/I'll give you a hint - a very very small percentage of total PCs sold
//stupid analog is stupid
 
2011-11-08 01:00:25 PM
animal900: Kar98: animal900: With that said, even I feel like I want one, but the only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I can't figure out what I'd use it for that I couldn't do with my phone or laptop. I think I'd have buyer's remorse after a week or so, and would leave it in a stack of magazines gathering dust.

E-books. Games. E-mail. Web. While out and about, or on the crapper, or the couch.

I don't read ebooks, and the rest I can do on my phone which is ALWAYS in my pocket. I'm not lugging a tablet into the can at work...


Eh, I honestly don't know then. I used to carry a netbook around for that shiat, but I was given a $599 iPad last week and I'm not entirely sure which niche it fills between the iPhone, the desktop and the Aspire One. Gotta say I do like it though: instant on, unlike the netbook, nice screen, long battery life.
 
2011-11-08 01:02:33 PM
Kuroshin: MS lost a major opportunity to get their player in the game. Now they're left struggling with WP7. Looking at Windows 8 and the hardware we can expect from next cycle, I'm going to bet against MS gaining any serious marketshare in 2012. It's hilarious how often MS is busy innovating in the background, but doesn't bother to release what would be a major tech coup, choosing instead to play catch-up with last-year's fad.

Microsoft creates and developes a lot of kewl things in its labs. What they suck at moving those ideas into a real product. The classic example is that both Apple and Microsoft came up with various touch screen technologies. Apple chose to revolutionize the mobile market. Microsoft chose to revolutionize the table market.
 
2011-11-08 01:04:37 PM
jizzler: ha-ha-guy 2011-11-08 12:05:34 PM
Considering that the Courier wasn't going to do email (and focus on this nebulous "creative" stuff) it seems like the right call.

I disagree - on reading the article, the Courier was geared for people to replace a notebook. The Courier interface I saw in demo videos showed users writing, sketching, collecting photos, etc for projects and aggregating them in one place. This is not easy/seamless on any tablet that I've seen (on-screen keyboards are an uncomfortable pain), and its impossible on a smartphone.

Since most users have a smartphone, this would duplicate functionality. Gates was just stuck in the mid 1990s mindset.

Example demo: Link (new window)


5 paragraphs in:

But the device wasn't intended to be a computer replacement; it was meant to complement PCs. Courier users wouldn't want or need a feature-rich e-mail application such as Microsoft's Outlook that lets them switch to conversation views in their inbox or support offline e-mail reading and writing.
 
2011-11-08 01:04:41 PM
JinxofSpades: Am I missing something? Was there any freaking reason they couldn't simply add email functionality???

Internal conflict at Microsoft.
 
2011-11-08 01:04:45 PM
bravian: animal900: Yup, and nothing wrong with that. I'm just tired of people preaching about the iPad for productivity. What percentage of iPads sold do you really think are going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

What percentage of PCs sold do you really think of going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

/I'll give you a hint - a very very small percentage of total PCs sold
//stupid analog is stupid


As a programmer/writer that's worked on a Microsoft product that, among other things, actually puts PCs into doctor's hands to review MRI results, I'm getting a kick...
 
2011-11-08 01:06:49 PM
JinxofSpades: Am I missing something? Was there any freaking reason they couldn't simply add email functionality???

/bitter
//I really wanted one of these.


Email functionality in this context means direct enterprise exchange functionality. Any web based email would have worked. It's a somewhat valid criticism, given microsofts business. But it's not like microsoft doesn't sell the hell out of embeded windows. It's not like microsoft doesn't have experience folding very different OSs into a core family down the line. Indeed, maybe that what will happen with a lot of the courier ideas, maybe they'll be folded into some sort of super onenote, running on azure, that can be accessable from wherever, including smartphones. but man, that techdemo had a lot of fantastic ideas all in one package.....
 
2011-11-08 01:08:15 PM
bravian: animal900: Yup, and nothing wrong with that. I'm just tired of people preaching about the iPad for productivity. What percentage of iPads sold do you really think are going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

What percentage of PCs sold do you really think of going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

/I'll give you a hint - a very very small percentage of total PCs sold
//stupid analog is stupid


I'd give you a retort if I had any clue what your point was.

My point is, people like to pretend they're buying these things for work. I am suggesting that most of these people are justifying the purchase with something they know is not true - the work thing. It's easier to explain it away as a productivity tool, than what it really is - a toy. I have yet to see anyone, anywhere, using it for serious work that could not be accomplished with something much simpler, less expensive, and likely more efficient.
 
2011-11-08 01:09:54 PM
Kar98: Eh, I honestly don't know then. I used to carry a netbook around for that shiat, but I was given a $599 iPad last week and I'm not entirely sure which niche it fills between the iPhone, the desktop and the Aspire One. Gotta say I do like it though: instant on, unlike the netbook, nice screen, long battery life.

Yep, I'm in the same boat. I have an iPad and a netbook. I like a couple of the games on the iPad (Galaxy on Fire 2 is very impressive, I loved the old Privateer on PC), and the screen looks great for displaying images for clients and watching Netflix in bed.

The downsides are that it takes so damn long to recharge the iPad. I may only get ~5 hours of battery life out of my netbook, but at least it recharges in 90 minutes. I get some 12 hours out of the iPad, but it takes nearly 8 to charge it up again (wall mount charger). And the price for a base iPad was about $200 more than my netbook. If work hadn't gotten for me to test out, I wouldn't shell out $600+ for a media consumption device.

That said, we use tablet PCs at work and would kill to have a complementary Courier. The iPad just doesn't cut it for productivity in design and architecture.

/really wants a drafting table sized Surface device & software.
 
2011-11-08 01:10:10 PM
farkeruk: Within a few weeks, Courier was cancelled because the product didn't clearly align with the company's Windows and Office franchises, according to sources.

This reminds me of Sony music killing MP3 on their music players because of piracy. Result: people didn't use ATRAC and Sony players, they just bought someone else's players and continued to use MP3.

Companies are always reluctant to kill their own business, even though it's obvious that it's going to happen, so you might as well be the people doing it. No-one wants Outlook or Exchange except for control freak corporates. Hell, searching mail in Gmail is WAY faster and more reliable than searching on Outlook. I know 2 companies that switched to Google business stuff because they don't have to fark around with servers and licensing bullshiat.


The deal though is if you want pure creative, MS is likely not the place you're headed first. One reason buy a MS product is it also ties into their big bulky enterprise network. If I bought this product I'd expect all the freedoms they promised me, and the ability to tab over to a very nice mobile office suite and work on a Word document my boss sent me for some last minute changes. I want to do my awesome freehand drawing and then go stick it up on Sharepoint for my coworkers to see.

This is more akin to Apple releasing a product with no iTunes functionality. You buy the product and except it to be a basic feature.
 
2011-11-08 01:13:21 PM
bravian: Kuroshin: MS lost a major opportunity to get their player in the game. Now they're left struggling with WP7. Looking at Windows 8 and the hardware we can expect from next cycle, I'm going to bet against MS gaining any serious marketshare in 2012. It's hilarious how often MS is busy innovating in the background, but doesn't bother to release what would be a major tech coup, choosing instead to play catch-up with last-year's fad.

Microsoft creates and developes a lot of kewl things in its labs. What they suck at moving those ideas into a real product. The classic example is that both Apple and Microsoft came up with various touch screen technologies. Apple chose to revolutionize the mobile market. Microsoft chose to revolutionize the table marketsit on their hands.


FTFY
 
2011-11-08 01:17:03 PM
animal900: Yup, and nothing wrong with that. I'm just tired of people preaching about the iPad for productivity. What percentage of iPads sold do you really think are going into doctor's hands to review MRI results?

Not sure, but I'm starting to see more and more news anchors doing their standups with tablets of one kind or another in their hands instead of sheafs of paper. I've recently seen a press conference of some kind, where the person also had their notes on a tablet. I see a lot of potential for them being productive.

Example: Here at work, I keep in touch with my boss using an in-house IM system. He's in Chicago, I'm in Salt Lake. Im'ing is faster and more efficient then constantly calling or emailing. I work in IT, and often leave my desk to go down on the production floor and work with our printers, our phones,m etc. It's kind of a pain to disconnect my laptop from my keyboard, mouse, monitor and power, just to find a place to put it downstairs, but sometimes I need to RDP into a server, or follow up with my boss on the status of a ticket, ask questions, etc... With a tablet, I can grab it, open a new chat session, carry it down, and be available far more easily than if I were lugging around a laptop. I see a lot of potential in tablets, although right now they're really status symbols. As soon as the cachet of carrying one around to look cool wears off, you'll see them primarily in the hands of people who will actually USE them.

They also come in handy for our sales people when they are on location supervising a setup, once again, much easier than a laptop. I can also see them being used efficiently for a QC person at my company, that would do nothing more than wander the plant all day, following jobs from the beginning until they go out the door, and checking them off in each phase of production.

Of course, I'm also the guy that sees that the Segway actually WAS an innovative product, despite what the haters say, so maybe I just do too much acid?
 
2011-11-08 01:33:28 PM
animal900: Tablets are toys for children and women.

Ironically I've just purchased tablets for my wife and daughter. Hrmm...
 
2011-11-08 01:34:48 PM
Virtual Pariah: JinxofSpades: Am I missing something? Was there any freaking reason they couldn't simply add email functionality???


2 things.
1. The product didn't exist as a whole, so they probably didn't have anybody assigned to write up a client.
2. J's vision was for you not to have that on the product. He assumed that you would use a phone for that. IMO, it was a bad call.


Another interesting part about his vision: "The key to Courier, Allard's team argued, was its focus on content creation. Courier was for the creative set, a gadget on which architects might begin to sketch building plans, or writers might begin to draft documents."

That's the exact opposite of Jobs' model of the iPad, which focuses on content consumption. You can use your iPad to draft documents or sketch plans, but it's not great for that, and you've got a desktop with at least one 27" monitor nearby. Instead, it's better for reading a magazine or blog feed while commuting, watching a movie while stuck on an airplane, etc.
That also syncs more with his other thought - that Courier wasn't supposed to be a computer replacement. If it wasn't, then why have your content creation start there? Just to add an awkward step?
 
2011-11-08 01:35:11 PM
Courier's going to track them down even if he has to walk the Silicon to do it.

/Courier's skilled for melee combat
 
2011-11-08 01:41:43 PM
animal900:
I don't read ebooks,



I was like that until last year. Now the ebook is too convenient for me to not have.
It also gave me a chance to do some serious thinking about what books I wanted to keep.

So I created a rule for myself. If it's a book that I want to read once = ebook.
If it's something I want to keep for a reason = physical copy.

I know me enough that even if I mean well, I'm not going to lug boxes of books to the used store for credits. Got tired of fooling myself.
 
2011-11-08 01:41:45 PM
the_geek: animal900: Tablets are toys for children and women.

Ironically I've just purchased tablets for my wife and daughter. Hrmm...


Is that ironic? I can't tell anymore...
 
2011-11-08 01:42:40 PM
So, basically Ballmer and Gates were too stupid to realize that there was a lot of money to be made there. Amazing how out of touch those two have become.
 
2011-11-08 01:42:40 PM
Microsoft: "Here is a product and this is what you will do with it."

Apple: Here is a new tool. Show us what you can do with it.


//That pretty much sums it up for me.
 
2011-11-08 01:44:58 PM
paulleah: Microsoft: "Here is a product and this is what you will do with it."

Apple: Here is a new tool. Show us what you can do with it.

//That pretty much sums it up for me.


Apple: Here is a new appliance. Tell us what you want to do with it and we'll tell you if we'll let you or not.

Microsoft: Here's a new sandbox. Do whatever you want with it.
 
2011-11-08 01:46:38 PM
paulleah: Microsoft: "Here is a product and this is what you will do with it."

Apple: Here is a new tool. Show us what you can do with it.


//That pretty much sums it up for me.


Except it's wrong.
 
2011-11-08 01:47:36 PM
paulleah: Microsoft: "Here is a product and this is what you will do with it."

Apple: Here is a new tool. Show us what you can do with it.

//That pretty much sums it up for me.


Funny, that's almost word-for-word exactly the opposite of Microsoft's campaign for Kinect. Link (new window)
 
2011-11-08 01:53:33 PM
Microsoft: "Here is a product and this is what you will do with it."

Apple: Here is a new tool. Show us what you can do with it.


Apple: provided what you want to do with it is something we have authorised to have in our app store from a supplier who is willing to accept our take-it-or-leave-it terms of trade. Otherwise let your imagination run wild.
 
2011-11-08 01:56:05 PM
Sorry, you absolutely need an email client on any device nowadays. No matter what you're doing- creating content, consuming content... you're going to want to email people various things instantly. And web email doesn't cut it all the time.

"Here's a draft of my building plans, see attached"

"Here's a link to a funny video of cats on a treadmill"

And so on...
 
2011-11-08 01:57:22 PM
Theaetetus: Virtual Pariah: JinxofSpades: Am I missing something? Was there any freaking reason they couldn't simply add email functionality???


2 things.
1. The product didn't exist as a whole, so they probably didn't have anybody assigned to write up a client.
2. J's vision was for you not to have that on the product. He assumed that you would use a phone for that. IMO, it was a bad call.

Another interesting part about his vision: "The key to Courier, Allard's team argued, was its focus on content creation. Courier was for the creative set, a gadget on which architects might begin to sketch building plans, or writers might begin to draft documents."

That's the exact opposite of Jobs' model of the iPad, which focuses on content consumption. You can use your iPad to draft documents or sketch plans, but it's not great for that, and you've got a desktop with at least one 27" monitor nearby. Instead, it's better for reading a magazine or blog feed while commuting, watching a movie while stuck on an airplane, etc.
That also syncs more with his other thought - that Courier wasn't supposed to be a computer replacement. If it wasn't, then why have your content creation start there? Just to add an awkward step?


I think the email/no email thing was this-- if you're a writer, or an architect, or a designer and you sit down to do some work, you don't want your notepad to start beeping and flashing at you with every immediate distraction. Kind of like how when I really want to buckle down and work, I close my Gmail tab so I'm not distracted. It wasn't going to be a consumer device. Too many devices are trying to be "everything" nowadays.

I think the Gates/Ballmer response to the lack of email client is overblown here. They make tons of products that don't have Office or Email on them-- XBox, Surface, Kinect. I think that the Courier was really cool, but ultimately, it was software. There was nothing about the Courier that required it be a prepackaged hardware/software combo made my MS. It didn't even have to be a dual screen device. Hopefully we'll see some Courier-inspired apps (like OneNote) in Windows 8.

Samsung, HTC, or HP can come up with the hardware.
 
2011-11-08 01:57:40 PM
It had simple e-mail, just not a "feature-rich" bloatware thing like Outlook.
 
2011-11-08 02:02:38 PM
paulleah: Apple: Here is a new tool. Show us what you can do with it.

Sure! I develop in Flash, I assume your new tool supports it?
 
2011-11-08 02:03:57 PM
dustlesswalnut: I think the email/no email thing was this-- if you're a writer, or an architect, or a designer and you sit down to do some work, you don't want your notepad to start beeping and flashing at you with every immediate distraction. Kind of like how when I really want to buckle down and work, I close my Gmail tab so I'm not distracted. It wasn't going to be a consumer device. Too many devices are trying to be "everything" nowadays.

However email would have been integrated, I'm sure there would be a way to turn off notifications. Just like Outlook. I keep it running, and I can choose to have the bubble pop up on new emails or not. Or just friggin' close Outlook.
 
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