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(asahi.com) Obvious Japan's sovereign debt balloons past 1 quadrillion yen barrier, thanks to currency market interventions and disaster reconstruction. Time to go back to the rice standard   (ajw.asahi.com) divider line 30
More: Obvious, sovereign debt, Japan, balloons, Tokyo Electric Power Company, yen, currency market interventions, issuance, disasters  
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1027 clicks; posted to Business » on 06 Nov 2011 at 1:33 PM   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»   |    Get this fabulous T-Shirt and impress the methane out of your friends! shirt it!



30 Comments   (+0 »)
   
 
2011-11-06 01:26:35 PM
interesting problem
they have high debt, but an EXTREMELY strong currency. zero inflation.
 
2011-11-06 01:36:09 PM
namatad: interesting problem
they have high debt, but an EXTREMELY strong currency. zero inflation.


The extremely strong currency IS the problem. Japan lives or dies by her export volume. With the yen way up the stratosphere, Japanese goods are ever more unaffordable in a global market struggling with a deep recession. The Japanese government is vividly aware of the problem but all they've done is hold summit after toothless summit while the yen trades higher and higher. They had better intervene and soon. If they thought the last earthquake was bad, the new earthquake building up on the fault line of debt will make Fukushima look like a fart in a blizzard.
 
2011-11-06 01:38:43 PM
*yawn*
Let me know when they reach a number we will have to make up a word for.
 
2011-11-06 01:40:54 PM
How do you say "This clearly shows the need for a TAX CUT" in Japanese?
 
2011-11-06 01:43:01 PM
You fools. All you really need to do is build up your terraced farming and make sure the metsuke are guarding your big cities.

blog.direct2drive.com
 
2011-11-06 02:00:35 PM
CitizenTed: namatad: interesting problem
they have high debt, but an EXTREMELY strong currency. zero inflation.

The extremely strong currency IS the problem. Japan lives or dies by her export volume. With the yen way up the stratosphere, Japanese goods are ever more unaffordable in a global market struggling with a deep recession. The Japanese government is vividly aware of the problem but all they've done is hold summit after toothless summit while the yen trades higher and higher. They had better intervene and soon. If they thought the last earthquake was bad, the new earthquake building up on the fault line of debt will make Fukushima look like a fart in a blizzard.


but this is an "easy fix"
print more farking money.
raise your inflation to 1-2%, slowly devalue your currency. my guess is that the 12 trillion yen that they are planning to use for this wont be enough. japan is way to conservative/risk adverse to risk pushing too hard and upsetting citizens.
 
2011-11-06 02:35:53 PM
a quadrillion yen?

What is that, like $1,500 ?
 
2011-11-06 03:07:13 PM
namatad: but this is an "easy fix"
print more farking money.


Please don't make me go get the Zimbabwe dollar.
 
2011-11-06 03:26:15 PM
namatad: CitizenTed: namatad: interesting problem
they have high debt, but an EXTREMELY strong currency. zero inflation.

The extremely strong currency IS the problem. Japan lives or dies by her export volume. With the yen way up the stratosphere, Japanese goods are ever more unaffordable in a global market struggling with a deep recession. The Japanese government is vividly aware of the problem but all they've done is hold summit after toothless summit while the yen trades higher and higher. They had better intervene and soon. If they thought the last earthquake was bad, the new earthquake building up on the fault line of debt will make Fukushima look like a fart in a blizzard.

but this is an "easy fix"
print more farking money.
raise your inflation to 1-2%, slowly devalue your currency. my guess is that the 12 trillion yen that they are planning to use for this wont be enough. japan is way to conservative/risk adverse to risk pushing too hard and upsetting citizens.


Errr.. they've been at near-zero or negative interest rates for what, a decade? The only thing past that is just to do massive amounts of deficit spending for the sake of doing it
 
2011-11-06 03:33:31 PM
How many grains of rice to the Yen?

Also, if you put one grain of rice on the first square of a chess board, two on the next, three on the next and so forth, how many squares you you need for a quadrillion grains of rice? And what's the rice worth?
 
2011-11-06 03:42:32 PM
MurphyMurphy: a quadrillion yen?

What is that, like $1,500 ?


Nahhh, a six pack of skinny cokes.
 
2011-11-06 04:10:53 PM
Dooom. DOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMM!
 
2011-11-06 04:17:52 PM
Gosling: namatad: but this is an "easy fix"
print more farking money.

Please don't make me go get the Zimbabwe dollar.


LOL
there is a LONG stretch between 1-3% inflation and hyperinflation.
But man, japan has been stuck for quite awhile now. which I guess is better than crashing and burning.

the spending on rebuilding will probably help increase inflation and provide some short term growth.

hmmmmmmm maybe we need a global war to rebuild from. or a meteor strike.
 
2011-11-06 05:25:22 PM
namatad: hmmmmmmm maybe we need a global war to rebuild from. or a meteor strike.

Let's go break some windows and see how much more prosperous that makes us.
 
2011-11-06 05:37:02 PM
Errr.. they've been at near-zero or negative interest rates for what, a decade? The only thing past that is just to do massive amounts of deficit spending for the sake of doing it

How do you think they got all that debt in the first place? They've been putting off serious structural reform and banking reform for twenty years with various stimulus packages, with nothing to show for it and no realistic plan for paying it back. They can't even stick the bill to their grandchildren---most Japanese don't have any---and acquiescing to anything resembling a rational immigration policy that would help correct Japan's dire demographic situation is unthinkable for the Japanese man in the street, who by Western standards is already jaw-droppingly and incorrigibly racist and xenophobic, and will only get more so as he ages. Meanwhile, those among the few younger Japanese who can leave will leave rather than pay their grandparent's debts.

So yeah, Japan has no options for repaying more than a fraction of its debt. As that debt is the chief saving tool for the average Japanese pensioner, the average Japanese will die in poverty, his life savings defaulted on or hyper-inflated away. Neither of these strike me as a "cure" for Japan's problems as much as their coming home to roost.
 
2011-11-06 06:00:39 PM
And yet, Japanese 10-year government bonds are yielding under 1% (nominal). WHY WON'T PEOPLE PANIC??
 
2011-11-06 06:30:05 PM
Clearly they need to stop spending, look at all the other nations that have austerity'ed themselves out of a catastrophe ...

like ummm ... that one in Africa. There's one there that did that, right?
Or that one in South America? no?
 
2011-11-06 06:33:23 PM
Arkanaut: WHY WON'T PEOPLE PANIC??

Because unlike the U.S. national debt (which is owned mostly by the likes of China, Japan, Saudi Arabia) almost all of Japan's debt is internal. It's owed to Japanese creditors and bond holders.
 
2011-11-06 06:48:05 PM
devioustrevor: Arkanaut: WHY WON'T PEOPLE PANIC??

Because unlike the U.S. national debt (which is owned mostly by the likes of China, Japan, Saudi Arabia) almost all of Japan's debt is internal. It's owed to Japanese creditors and bond holders.


Think of US debt owned by China as a security policy against them taking any action on Taiwan.

"What's that? You're invading Taiwan? I guess you don't want your trillions back, then."
 
2011-11-06 08:02:30 PM
zarberg: devioustrevor: Arkanaut: WHY WON'T PEOPLE PANIC??

Because unlike the U.S. national debt (which is owned mostly by the likes of China, Japan, Saudi Arabia) almost all of Japan's debt is internal. It's owed to Japanese creditors and bond holders.

Think of US debt owned by China as a security policy against them taking any action on Taiwan.

"What's that? You're invading Taiwan? I guess you don't want your trillions back, then."


oh bullcrap.

China can't do anything like that without destroying their own economy. any threat like that would be like your mortal enemy threating to kill himself in front of you.
 
2011-11-06 09:38:56 PM
Unemployment is also up - there's no big desire to import people.

/hate the high yen
//makes my books expensive
 
2011-11-07 12:52:01 AM
MurphyMurphy: a quadrillion yen?

What is that, like $1,500 ?


$12.8 trillion, give or take a couple billion, based on current exchange rates.
 
2011-11-07 02:42:43 AM
Arkanaut: And yet, Japanese 10-year government bonds are yielding under 1% (nominal). WHY WON'T PEOPLE PANIC??

That is why they have been buying US securities.
 
2011-11-07 04:35:56 AM
So that's like what, $100,000?
 
2011-11-07 05:43:33 AM
itazurakko: Unemployment is also up - there's no big desire to import people.

/hate the high yen
//makes my books expensive


yup. young japanese have a lifetime of low benefit, temporary work contracts to look forward to.

gosh I hate baby boomers (globally, not just the US ones)
 
2011-11-07 07:39:31 AM
zarberg: Because unlike the U.S. national debt (which is owned mostly by the likes of China, Japan, Saudi Arabia) almost all of Japan's debt is internal.

Actually, most US debt is internal as well.
 
2011-11-07 08:10:28 AM
impaler: zarberg: Because unlike the U.S. national debt (which is owned mostly by the likes of China, Japan, Saudi Arabia) almost all of Japan's debt is internal.

Actually, most US debt is internal as well.


Just so we're talking apples to apples, does the Japanese debt ownership include intragovernmental debt or is it primarily private bond ownership?
 
2011-11-07 11:25:10 AM
Larofeticus: namatad: hmmmmmmm maybe we need a global war to rebuild from. or a meteor strike.

Let's go break some windows and see how much more prosperous that makes us.


yes no maybe

a global war or giant meteor strike would also KILL millions of people. Let's go crazy and kill a billion people. this has benefits ignored in the broken window fallacy. nor was I implying that the NET would be positive.

the war itself would employ tons of people. the reduction in population would also help reduce population. wars tend to accelerate research and development. If we assume a really good war with lots of destruction, there would be a great need for reconstruction. tons of new jobs. wars distract populations from local problems.

so you have assumed that I cared about a net gain for society. I was implying only that a large war would change everything, including the calculation of net benefits.

the effect on the global economy alone is incalculable. Countries would begin producing things locally which they previously bought globally.

the broken window fallacy ignores a huge number of externalities.
increase in police, courts and prisons to deal with increased crime.
possible decrease in overall crimes because of increased police and prisons.
(would CA have LESS crime if they built enough prisons to avoid having to have early release?)
replacing the window would employ the glaiser, glass maker. these people now have money that they can use to expand their businesses.

economies are strange. see the man in the white suit
 
2011-11-07 01:11:43 PM
namatad:
replacing the window would employ the glaiser, glass maker. these people now have money that they can use to expand their businesses.


The whole reason that that fallacy is a fallacy is because of this (fallacious) line of reasoning, which neglects to observe that, in paying the glass maker, the window owner now has less free money to spend, so, in addition to the glass maker getting MORE money, the, say, baker, gets less.

The stimulative effects stem from whether or not the window owner has the ability and incentive to spend money, the broken window simply dictates WHAT he'll spend it on.
 
2011-11-07 01:18:33 PM
namatad:
economies are strange. see the man in the white suit


I just looked this up. Looks like a good movie.

But, as an economic lesson it's terrible. The internal combustion engine killed the booming "horse manure removal" business without destroying the economy.
 
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