Who in the name of fark would continue to pay a mortgage on a house that wasn't there? Did they not require insurance to have mortagage?

Uh, yeah, when is Bank of Rapemerica going to be held accountable for this fraud. Robo foreclosures is fraud.

Bigdogdaddy: Who in the name of fark would continue to pay a mortgage on a house that wasn't there? Did they not require insurance to have mortagage?

A guy who was overseas when his house was destroyed and wanted to keep the lot so he could rebuild when he got back?

/article doesn't say he wasn't insured in the first place, just that his idiot bank tried to take out a policy on the house after it was already gone
/stealing his personal property is incredible, moustache-twirling stuff

Can we just let them go into Chapter 7 and get it over with?

Warring: CSB rant

My BOA experiences. My first notice that I was even dealing with BOA was a letter stating that if I did not provide proof of insurance, they would buy it at great expense to me. The date I had to provide this information by was before the post mark date of the letter. Several days latter, I received the notice that they had bought my 2nd mortgage.

Fast forward a couple years, and I had a large insurance claim. At this time my first mortgage was owned by Washington Mutual and they were in the middle of collapsing. I had to have WaMu and BOA sign off on the insurance check, and I didn't want to send a $30,000 check off in the mail in the middle of a banking collapse. I called and was told by both banks that they would sign off if I brought the check to their regional branches which were in Chicago. After a two hour one way drive, WaMu looked at my documentation, and signed off; took all of five minutes. Of course BOA told me to fark off, I had to send the check to their Texas processing center. The information they gave me over the phone was wrong of course. Shortly after that, I refinanced with a local bank.

Fast forward two more years, interest rates fall again, and we want to refinance again. Turns out BOA never took the lean off our house. I have the documentation that they've been paid, and I have the lean release from BOA, but they never filed it (yes their responsibility in WI). After numerous phone calls and E-mails, I started getting seriously ticked off when it looked like we were going to lose our 60 day rate lock. At about day 50, I finally got up the ladder enough to talk to an actual decision maker. It turns out my county updates liens electronically, and all BOA had to do was to e-mail the proper form. The BOA rep did it while we were on the phone.

I suppose I should just feel lucky that BOA didn't try to foreclose on our house for not making payments on the loan we paid off.

:CSB rant off

BolloxReader: Can we just let them go into Chapter 7 and get it over with?

The systemic risk to our financial system is too great to let them go chapter 7. We need to have legislation that allows the too big to fail institutions to be wound down and broken up in logical way. I'm normally a free market capitalist kind of guy, but in this case, I'm in favor of a government takeover.

The execs AND the politicians that created this monstrosity on the other hand should be stripped of all wealth and possessions. Then after lengthy prison sentences, they should be dumped on the street and forced to live in cardboard boxes.

One step away from calling for them to be burned at the stake.

/the guillotine is too quick

How does something like this happen? I thought if your house is totaled, you get a check from your insurance for the full cost of rebuilding. You use it to pay off the balance of the mortgage, and can keep whatever is left over as equity to use as a down payment on another house.

Tommy Moo: How does something like this happen? I thought if your house is totaled, you get a check from your insurance for the full cost of rebuilding. You use it to pay off the balance of the mortgage, and can keep whatever is left over as equity to use as a down payment on another house.

You don't always get a check for the full amount, just FYI. This is especially true if you were upside-down on your mortgage. That doesn't mean BofA didn't screw this guy over, but there are plenty of cases in which it could happen sanely.

Wouldn't taking insurance out on a property that doesn't exist constitute fraud on the part of BoA?

Katolu: Wouldn't taking insurance out on a property that doesn't exist constitute fraud on the part of BoA?

Probably not, mostly just lack of due diligence and poor institutional control. I was going to offer a stronger defense of how this kind of thing can happen, but after reading the article, BofA just farked this one up (surprise!) and the guy deserves to sue them for all they're worth. Of course, I'm highly doubting he gets the personal effects they stole back.

The indignation is hilarious.

Yet nobody seems to have the imagination to realize that the only way to stop the banks is to: STOP PLAYING their game.

Unbank. Drop your bank like a herpes chicken. Opt out of banking transactions whenever possible. Use cash.
And this whole rent-to-own scam where you make payments while paying all the taxes and upkeep on a house/car/property as if you are the owner is a sucker's game. Stop it. Just. Stop. Doing. It.

FitzShivering: Katolu: Wouldn't taking insurance out on a property that doesn't exist constitute fraud on the part of BoA?

Probably not, mostly just lack of due diligence and poor institutional control. I was going to offer a stronger defense of how this kind of thing can happen, but after reading the article, BofA just farked this one up (surprise!) and the guy deserves to sue them for all they're worth. Of course, I'm highly doubting he gets the personal effects they stole back.

They are a corporation, nobody ever bothers to prosecute corporations, with one caveat*. Their legal team has 1 million times the resources of a prosecutor's office. He with the most cash wins in legal situations so it is a waste of money for the prosecutor.

* unless he is running for office and can be sure of affording the cost

Tommy Moo: How does something like this happen? I thought if your house is totaled, you get a check from your insurance for the full cost of rebuilding. You use it to pay off the balance of the mortgage, and can keep whatever is left over as equity to use as a down payment on another house.

It depends on the insurance. Often times if you don't rebuild, you only get the actual cash value of the house. The other part of this is that this is an ocean front lot. So the land is far more valuable than the shack on it. Even if the bank makes you insure to the total value of the property, the insurance won't pay out that amount.

So it's quite likely that the mortgage was more on the land, not on the house.

I don't think everyone is inept at BOA, it's just that they're trying to get ten peoples work out of each employee. I've been in that situation, and after awhile you just don't give a shait any more. That and those that try to do the right thing are slapped down. These types of massively bureaucratic organizations are all about rules. And if anyone so much as sticks they're heads up to say "hey somethings not right here" they are punished. If they don't get with the program, they are fired.

/worked for the phone company
//lost a good part of my soul there

This shouldn't come as a surprise. If you use a bank, you forfeit all your rights. They have the money so they make the laws

Katolu: Wouldn't taking insurance out on a property that doesn't exist constitute fraud on the part of BoA?

It's against the law to charge banks with a crime.

FlashHarry: remember, folks - november 5th is bank transfer day. transfer your money from a giant bank to a credit union.

Which is a Saturday, so good luck with that.

Why would people think that because the house is gone you no longer owe the mortgage?

BOA loaned you money. You're under contract to pay it back. They already paid the money.

Tax Boy: FlashHarry: remember, folks - november 5th is bank transfer day. transfer your money from a giant bank to a credit union.

Which is a Saturday, so good luck with that.

Yah, because online banking is closed on the weekends.

/eyeroll.jpg

HotIgneous Intruder: And this whole rent-to-own scam where you make payments while paying all the taxes and upkeep on a house/car/property as if you are the owner is a sucker's game. Stop it. Just. Stop. Doing. It.

Quoted to ensure people read it twice.

If you have to wait 30 years before you're done paying the bank rent, all while being 100% responsible for upkeep, to discover an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

BigBooper: BolloxReader: Can we just let them go into Chapter 7 and get it over with?

The systemic risk to our financial system is too great to let them go chapter 7. We need to have legislation that allows the too big to fail institutions to be wound down and broken up in logical way. I'm normally a free market capitalist kind of guy, but in this case, I'm in favor of a government takeover.

The execs AND the politicians that created this monstrosity on the other hand should be stripped of all wealth and possessions. Then after lengthy prison sentences, they should be dumped on the street and forced to live in cardboard boxes.

One step away from calling for them to be burned at the stake.

/the guillotine is too quick

You mean like the anti-trust laws are supposed to do, well at least until the Republiturds gutted the enforcement of them.

Tax Boy: FlashHarry: remember, folks - november 5th is bank transfer day. transfer your money from a giant bank to a credit union.

Which is a Saturday, so good luck with that.

Uh the local bank I'm switching to is open 0830 to 1200 on Saturdays.

Which is why I'm switching to them. Because none of the local Wells Fargo/Wachovia banks feel the need to be open on Saturdays.

xanadian: And I wonder how many people here will do just that. ...Nah, takes too much time and effort. I have to make sure I make it home in time to watch tonight's relevant sporting event on the idiot box.

Already done. Still have a line of credit through Chase that I'm looking into closing and moving though. If you want to have an interesting phone call, talk to Charles Schwab investment adviser about the best way to remove your 401K and brokerage account from under their banner without harming your retirement plan.

Evil Twin Skippy: Also, keep in mind that the bank takes it's money out first. I just sold an albatross about my neck of a property we had bought as "OUR FIRST HOUSE!" After 6 years of payments at $650/month, we still owed 68k on and 80k loan. That $36k that didn't pay for repairs, and didn't keep the lights on, it was oure lining the pockets of the bank.

That's why you bite the bullet and make one or two extra payments on the principle a year. You end up shaving about a decade off a 30 year. Also, the other side of that coin is that you'd be paying rent somewhere else anyway so you were at least picking up a tax write off on the interest and some equity.

BigBooper: My BOA experiences. My first notice that I was even dealing with BOA was a letter stating that if I did not provide proof of insurance, they would buy it at great expense to me. The date I had to provide this information by was before the post mark date of the letter. Several days latter, I received the notice that they had bought my 2nd mortgage.

It's not just the mortgage folks that screw up royally and cause stuff like that. Might have been the insurance morons.

One day, I get a letter from the servicer, dated in the future, saying my home insurance had lapsed at the end of last month. So I call the insurance company. They swore up and down they'd sent me notice of what, why, and when. But they couldn't actually tell me any of that on the phone, so they offered to send another copy. What do I receive in the mailbox the next morning? The notice from the insurer. Dated 41 days ago. With a postmark three days old.

Attached to the notice is a sizable laundry list of 'problems' that make my house uninsurable, with photos. Most of which are 100% wrong, and the ones that are partially right are an order of magnitude off. And they expect me to fix this in 12 business days?

Again with the insurance company. I'm told "Hey, he might have gotten it wrong. Just email pictures showing he was wrong, and the repairs that actually need to be made have been made by the 15th." On the 11th I finish the list, and email off the pictures. What's this in my mail on the 14th? A check for the pre-paid balance of my policy, and my cancellation notice, dated on the 10th.

Thankfully, my bank didn't kill me. They treated it as if the insurance company had supplied them bad information, and just made me get new insurance that started before the first of the month.

jgi: [...] an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

What? Ownership entails both rights and obligations? I imagine this would be terribly shocking if I had never before interacted with humans.

HakunaMatata: MugzyBrown: Why would people think that because the house is gone you no longer owe the mortgage?

BOA loaned you money. You're under contract to pay it back. They already paid the money.

You mean a debt was created.
No actual money changed hands, except from the buyer to all the fee-takers, bank, realtors, agents, lawyers. The buyer paid for it all with money brought to the closing. But the mortgage was never real money. Nevertheless, the poor sucker who signed the note is on the hook, effectively forever. Plus, in many cases, the government is guaranteeing this bank that it will get its money, no matter what.

This scam needs to be understood for what it is...
Massive failure across the system.

Evil Twin Skippy: At least with rent, the landlord is obligated to keep the place up. If not by law then by market demands.

You kinda need market equilibrium to get that "market demand" factor in there, though. Stupidly high housing prices and subsequent crash led to a crush in renting, and now landlords can basically neglect the property and who's going to dare complain? The law might force them to make the place liveable, but certainly not comfortable.

HotIgneous Intruder is right in that housing is NOT an investment (unless you pay cash), but that's not the only reason to buy a house. I finally bought and I'd say the timing was right; I was getting tired of hearing neighbors' parties through flimsy walls and not being able to even put up a damn poster without risking a chunk of my security deposit due to bullshiat claims of paint damage. I could get away with a lot more in the crappier places but I'm rather tired of cockroach infestations as well. Landlords are shameless about cutting corners so a lot of the equipment is shiat. They use the shiat until it dies, take forever replacing it, there's no incentive to upgrade it with your own money and even if you did, some landlords might even be shameless enough to charge you a fee for doing them the favor. "Unauthorized improvements" clauses are written into many leases I've signed. I've also seldom met a property manager who wasn't cross-eyed retarded.

By the way, property taxes are not a sham. They suck, but society isn't free, and your claim on the property is honored and defended by the government. OK the honoring part is done mafia-style, but you know that hypothetical Galt's Gulch where you pay no property taxes on land you own? Yeah, there's nothing stopping your neighbor from tearing up your yard and building on it by simply making a competing claim. For most of history, private ownership of land was enforced only by driving off anyone who trespassed -- until you were eventually killed by someone with more firepower. I know everyone's an ITG but even if you were such a badass from your Xbox training, life really isn't that fun when you're in siege mode 24/7. It's kind of a PITA when you have shiat to do.

Monkeyfark Ridiculous: jgi: [...] an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

What? Ownership entails both rights and obligations? I imagine this would be terribly shocking if I had never before interacted with humans.

I never said paying property taxes was bad -- I think taxes are necessary to a functioning society. My argument is that you're never really in the clear with home ownership and that the entire institution is a moneygrab. The only reasons I can see for home ownership are 1) you're wealthy and can buy the house/property outright or 2) you're not wealthy but you've been brainwashed into thinking that you must purchase a home to be a real adult. Investment property, such as buying a house (or any building) with the purpose of renting it out, really only makes sense if you're wealthy.

But yes, go ahead and pay double your mortgage over the life of the loan only to find you're paying property taxes assessed from a higher value than what your property is actually worth.

Monkeyfark Ridiculous: jgi: [...] an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

What? Ownership entails both rights and obligations? I imagine this would be terribly shocking if I had never before interacted with humans.

Ownership of real property (ie., land) is the only one that comes with an ongoing obligation to pay taxes in perpetuity. If you buy a car, yes, you pay sales taxes on it, but it can sit in your garage or out on your farm with no registration, and no ongoing taxes due. It's the same with any other personal property OTHER THAN LAND.

From a practical standpoint, you don't actually own your land. You have a very liberal long-term lease from the local government on your property, and if you don't pay your "rent" (ie., your taxes), they will kick you off of "your" property, and they have the legal right to do so.

Now, I "own" a house, but I'm under no illusion as to who actually owns it: Yes, I have a deed to the land, but the actual truth of the matter is that deed is a lease agreement: I get to keep the land, and sell it or give it to whoever I want, with the only stipulation being that whoever is named on the deed keeps paying the "rent".

NormallyTechnos: BigBooper: My BOA experiences. My first notice that I was even dealing with BOA was a letter stating that if I did not provide proof of insurance, they would buy it at great expense to me. The date I had to provide this information by was before the post mark date of the letter. Several days latter, I received the notice that they had bought my 2nd mortgage.

It's not just the mortgage folks that screw up royally and cause stuff like that. Might have been the insurance morons.

One day, I get a letter from the servicer, dated in the future, saying my home insurance had lapsed at the end of last month. So I call the insurance company. They swore up and down they'd sent me notice of what, why, and when. But they couldn't actually tell me any of that on the phone, so they offered to send another copy. What do I receive in the mailbox the next morning? The notice from the insurer. Dated 41 days ago. With a postmark three days old.

Attached to the notice is a sizable laundry list of 'problems' that make my house uninsurable, with photos. Most of which are 100% wrong, and the ones that are partially right are an order of magnitude off. And they expect me to fix this in 12 business days?

Again with the insurance company. I'm told "Hey, he might have gotten it wrong. Just email pictures showing he was wrong, and the repairs that actually need to be made have been made by the 15th." On the 11th I finish the list, and email off the pictures. What's this in my mail on the 14th? A check for the pre-paid balance of my policy, and my cancellation notice, dated on the 10th.

Thankfully, my bank didn't kill me. They treated it as if the insurance company had supplied them bad information, and just made me get new insurance that started before the first of the month.

Actually my Insurance was great about it. I got my agent a copy of the letter, and they immediately faxed proof of insurance to BOA. They even commented that they had seen this thing before from BOA.
I'm an independent insurance agent now, but I don't have anything bad to say about American Family Insurance. They always provided great service, and didn't blink when I had two major hail claims in two years.

dittybopper: Monkeyfark Ridiculous: jgi: [...] an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

What? Ownership entails both rights and obligations? I imagine this would be terribly shocking if I had never before interacted with humans.

Ownership of real property (ie., land) is the only one that comes with an ongoing obligation to pay taxes in perpetuity. If you buy a car, yes, you pay sales taxes on it, but it can sit in your garage or out on your farm with no registration, and no ongoing taxes due. It's the same with any other personal property OTHER THAN LAND.

From a practical standpoint, you don't actually own your land. You have a very liberal long-term lease from the local government on your property, and if you don't pay your "rent" (ie., your taxes), they will kick you off of "your" property, and they have the legal right to do so.

Now, I "own" a house, but I'm under no illusion as to who actually owns it: Yes, I have a deed to the land, but the actual truth of the matter is that deed is a lease agreement: I get to keep the land, and sell it or give it to whoever I want, with the only stipulation being that whoever is named on the deed keeps paying the "rent".

That's interesting when you put it under a microscope. The modern taxing government has merely replaced the role of the king insofar as the taxes constitute rent required to keep a piece of land.

As for the holding deed and having to pay the taxes on it in order to keep it, that's a kind of sharecropping, except where the deed holder provides the industry of his choice to earn the money to pay the master (government).

Things haven't changed much in 500 years, have they? We have the best of both worlds, serfdom and share cropping, plus we get to pay the banks forever.

/Pretty expensive "dream" we've had foisted upon us.

Slaves2Darkness: BigBooper: BolloxReader: Can we just let them go into Chapter 7 and get it over with?

The systemic risk to our financial system is too great to let them go chapter 7. We need to have legislation that allows the too big to fail institutions to be wound down and broken up in logical way. I'm normally a free market capitalist kind of guy, but in this case, I'm in favor of a government takeover.

The execs AND the politicians that created this monstrosity on the other hand should be stripped of all wealth and possessions. Then after lengthy prison sentences, they should be dumped on the street and forced to live in cardboard boxes.

One step away from calling for them to be burned at the stake.

/the guillotine is too quick

You mean like the anti-trust laws are supposed to do, well at least until the Republiturds gutted the enforcement of them.

Oh, I think there's plenty of blame to go around. Only a hyper-partisan tool thinks that our financial situation is solely the fault of one party. The whole damn system needs an enema. Allot of Republicans, Democrats, and most of the players in the financial world need to be flushed down the drain before we can fix the system. As it stands, many of the same people in power that helped create this mess are the ones making the rules that are supposed to fix it.
A good investigation of countrywide for example would probably end MANY political careers, and hopefully put many politicians in jail. Of course that's why it won't happen.

/Personally, I solely blame George W. Bush
//still the source of, and cause of, all evil in this world

dittybopper: Monkeyfark Ridiculous: jgi: [...] an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

What? Ownership entails both rights and obligations? I imagine this would be terribly shocking if I had never before interacted with humans.

Ownership of real property (ie., land) is the only one that comes with an ongoing obligation to pay taxes in perpetuity. If you buy a car, yes, you pay sales taxes on it, but it can sit in your garage or out on your farm with no registration, and no ongoing taxes due. It's the same with any other personal property OTHER THAN LAND.

Not in Virginia. >:|

We pay personal property tax on our cars here. God forbid a lower income person save up and buy a car they really want.

This guy was obviously derelict in his duty to make all necessary payments (he was underpaying due to insurance going up) to the bank, and also in providing a forwarding address.

BoA should work with him now that he's woken up, but it isn't the banks responsibility to be a farking babysitter - fulfill your obligations and you'll have no worries.

Tax Boy: FlashHarry: remember, folks - november 5th is bank transfer day. transfer your money from a giant bank to a credit union.

Which is a Saturday, so good luck with that.

Picked my bank specifically because it is open every night until 8, Monday through Saturday and open Sunday until 4.

jgi: Monkeyfark Ridiculous: jgi: [...] an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

What? Ownership entails both rights and obligations? I imagine this would be terribly shocking if I had never before interacted with humans.

I never said paying property taxes was bad -- I think taxes are necessary to a functioning society. My argument is that you're never really in the clear with home ownership and that the entire institution is a moneygrab. The only reasons I can see for home ownership are 1) you're wealthy and can buy the house/property outright or 2) you're not wealthy but you've been brainwashed into thinking that you must purchase a home to be a real adult. Investment property, such as buying a house (or any building) with the purpose of renting it out, really only makes sense if you're wealthy.

But yes, go ahead and pay double your mortgage over the life of the loan only to find you're paying property taxes assessed from a higher value than what your property is actually worth.

I agree that home ownership isn't for everyone, and shouldn't be seen as a prerequisite for adulthood. Owning a home has benefits and drawbacks, financial and otherwise. So does taking on a mortgage in lieu of saving for a cash purchase. But the fact that some people weigh their options differently than you do does not make them brainwashed.

/you're never "really in the clear" as a renter either

dittybopper: Now, I "own" a house, but I'm under no illusion as to who actually owns it: Yes, I have a deed to the land, but the actual truth of the matter is that deed is a lease agreement: I get to keep the land, and sell it or give it to whoever I want, with the only stipulation being that whoever is named on the deed keeps paying the "rent".

Is this a clarification or biatching?

Yes, the government is really the power behind your deed and thus you're really just a tenant who pays "protection money" -- though depending on where you live, most of that revenue gets re-invested into the local infrastructure. But without that arrangement, your claim to the property is open to being contested by anyone and anyhow. Without the government, your deed is just a piece of paper. Anyone -- ANYONE -- can spit on your deed, laugh, say "bullshiat" and drive a bulldozer into your house. They don't care if your family's lived there a thousand years -- did WE when we first got here? OK OK we get it, even a "homeowner" is just a tenant of the government. So? All anyone can do sans a government is stake a claim and enforce it, praying no one comes along with enough might to drive them off. If your land is valuable enough someone will bring a private army to your door; they're not going to be intimidated by your armory. If you're a history nut you should know this stuff.

If you're not going to mention the benefits of this deal you're just derping up the thread with all the other teabaggers. For all the flaws in the system, the government's honoring of your deed provides sufficient deterrent to prevent people from contesting your claim to ownership, and anyone from a broken nation will tell you that's a very sweet deal. People who've known worse genuinely appreciate that the government is actually in control. Think about that for a moment. The teabaggers would have you believe that this is the worst thing to happen evar, and we should all go back to the times when people defended their property with their honor and a gun. Don't misinterpret that into some argument for authoritarianism, but know that the strength of our state is what allows you to go to work or shop for supplies without the fear that you'll be attacked by bandits or wind up in a war zone. We don't have swaths of the country being torn up by civil war, overrun by marauders or under local autonomous control by warlords*. Hell, starting today you can plan a road trip from Seattle to Miami and the only risk would be the statistically unlikely accident or random crime. And when you get back, odds are your house will still be there, and it won't be because people are scared of you.

*Offer not valid in Detroit

Evil Twin Skippy: jgi: HotIgneous Intruder: And this whole rent-to-own scam where you make payments while paying all the taxes and upkeep on a house/car/property as if you are the owner is a sucker's game. Stop it. Just. Stop. Doing. It.

Quoted to ensure people read it twice.

If you have to wait 30 years before you're done paying the bank rent, all while being 100% responsible for upkeep, to discover an end in which you still must pay property taxes until you die... you don't own it. Stop paying your property taxes and see how long the government agrees with your "ownership."

Also, keep in mind that the bank takes it's money out first. I just sold an albatross about my neck of a property we had bought as "OUR FIRST HOUSE!" After 6 years of payments at $650/month, we still owed 68k on and 80k loan. That $36k that didn't pay for repairs, and didn't keep the lights on, it was oure lining the pockets of the bank.

Over the life of a loan, you pay (in interest alone) well over twice, and if you have a sucky interest rate, three times the principle. Think about that. On a 450k loan you'll be paying back well over a million dollars.

At least with rent, the landlord is obligated to keep the place up. If not by law then by market demands.

A home loan does generate a ton of interest, but in the same time period you're still saving money, as a 30 year fixed rate loan is one of the most secure hedges against inevitable inflation(on the dollar, on rent, on taxes[in CA, where taxes are locked in based on the price you paid on the home], etc) there is. Don't buy a house with a mortgage as a means of investment. Buy it as a hedge against inflation.

HakunaMatata: Wow. Second graders have better reading comprehension skills. Try s l o w l y re-reading the very first sentence of TFA. It's 23 words, so give yourself 30 minutes to parse it, and then re-read your comment.

For being named HakunaMatata, you're a little high-strung.

bhcompy: A home loan does generate a ton of interest, but in the same time period you're still saving money, as a 30 year fixed rate loan is one of the most secure hedges against inevitable inflation

Not when you factor in maintenance, depending on where you live. In areas like the Northeast, you have two choices: Upkeep your house at considerable personal cost, or let it deteriorate which basically makes it a depreciating asset. In extreme cases, neglected houses are eventually condemned. About the only financial benefit is that you get some equity to borrow off of during emergencies for about the same cost as rent. If you're not buying rental property with cash, I'd say buying a house is on par with a money market fund. You can store your wealth safely, but that's about it.

No, the reason to buy a house for us peons is because any investments in the structure are tied to the deed you hold. For example, if you install a spiffy home theater system in your living room at considerable personal expense, you get to both enjoy the benefits as long as you own the house, and sell them with the deed. Do the same to an apartment and the landlord can just jack up your rent as a "thank you" for increasing the value of his/her property. There's no incentive, so you don't do it.

The house you live in isn't a store of wealth; it's a use of wealth. For all the derping about how you don't really "own" property, you can smear the walls with raspberry jam if that's what excites you and no one will stop you. If you only look at your house as a way of making you money, you're doing it wrong.