This is a surprise to no one.

Side effects may include outlandish health care prices, arrogant pricks with medical licenses driving 560 SELs, twitching, kidney failure, seizures, bank account failure, ass leakage, suicide, and repeated, unnecessary prescriptions.

I know my doctor has a relationship with the company that makes one of my prescriptions. The company also pays most of the co-pay for it, so I'm okay with it.

I'm amazed at that market concentration number, which I'd have guessed to be much higher after all the mergers. I'll bet that makes pharma among the least concentrated large industries in the country.

I would only take a prescription drug if it were a life or death proposition. For the rest, I rely on living a healthy lifestyle and eating high quality foods. The pharmaceutical industry is absolutely farked and if you are currently taking some drug without an end in sight, I urge you to start researching an alternative solution. It's one thing if you were born a certain way and must take a drug to live -- it's far more disconcerting if your ailment could be solved with a tweak in lifestyle. The pharmaceutical industry is one of the scariest industries in this countries and my trust in the medical profession has decreased immensely because of it.

hurdboy: Marcus Aurelius: Does anyone here have a doctor that hasn't pushed the latest pills at them for no apparent reason whatsoever?

Yes. My PCP. "I'm gonna prescribe you both of these. They work about the same. Get whichever one is cheaper. There's an OTC version of one, but it'll probably be cheaper for you prescription."

/Med school resident
//One of the perks.....you always get a second (or third) opinion, there, too

Are you a medical student or a resident? Never heard of a med school resident.

I wonder if private corporations trying to maximize profits has anything to do with health care in the US being the most expensive in the world.

You live in f*ck'n Merikkka, WTF do you expect?

I've had a few drug rep lunches over the past year.

Pretty good, can't tell you what they were selling though.

The female reps were hot!

jgi: I would only take a prescription drug if it were a life or death proposition. For the rest, I rely on living a healthy lifestyle and eating high quality foods. The pharmaceutical industry is absolutely farked and if you are currently taking some drug without an end in sight, I urge you to start researching an alternative solution. It's one thing if you were born a certain way and must take a drug to live -- it's far more disconcerting if your ailment could be solved with a tweak in lifestyle. The pharmaceutical industry is one of the scariest industries in this countries and my trust in the medical profession has decreased immensely because of it.

I agree. I was very, very concerned when I started taking antidepressants; but that was after doing everything I could think of to improve the problem. As a whole, I think our society is medicated to the max though, and more people need to follow what you're saying. Cut the salt, quit taking blood pressure meds. Start exercising, quit taking weight loss drugs. The industry is no different than the tobacco industry, getting you primed and then keeping you there.

my sister was one of those drug reps that drove around to different doctor's offices and sold them shiat and gave out free samples from P&G. she lasted about a month before it hit her what it exactly was that she was doing. she said that even though the pay was good she couldn't go on doing it for "moral reasons."

I know Flonase...she works the corner down from my place.

phedex: jgi: I would only take a prescription drug if it were a life or death proposition. For the rest, I rely on living a healthy lifestyle and eating high quality foods. The pharmaceutical industry is absolutely farked and if you are currently taking some drug without an end in sight, I urge you to start researching an alternative solution. It's one thing if you were born a certain way and must take a drug to live -- it's far more disconcerting if your ailment could be solved with a tweak in lifestyle. The pharmaceutical industry is one of the scariest industries in this countries and my trust in the medical profession has decreased immensely because of it.

I agree. I was very, very concerned when I started taking antidepressants; but that was after doing everything I could think of to improve the problem. As a whole, I think our society is medicated to the max though, and more people need to follow what you're saying. Cut the salt, quit taking blood pressure meds. Start exercising, quit taking weight loss drugs. The industry is no different than the tobacco industry, getting you primed and then keeping you there.

Those class action ads are already here, though they're still drowned out by the constant ads for new drugs. Seriously saw one sandwiched between ads for two prescription drugs. How the fark is advertising something that requires a prescription even legal? They banned cigarette ads, they could just as easily ban big pharma (and should).
I too was overmedicated on the antidepressant BS for a while. It was just round after round of 'try this pill for a month or two' then try a new one, all of them worthless, one caused me to wake up screaming in the middle of the night - which I thought was hilarious actually.
Eventually found an honest doc who diagnosed me properly, took a lithium variant for a little under a year, haven't needed any medication since (5 years). Sometimes the old meds are the best, but there's no money (or patent) in curing anything.

AbbeySomeone: This is a surprise to no one.

But but but, they need to recoop all those trillions they spent developing a cure for restless leg syndrome!

entitygm: phedex: jgi: I would only take a prescription drug if it were a life or death proposition. For the rest, I rely on living a healthy lifestyle and eating high quality foods. The pharmaceutical industry is absolutely farked and if you are currently taking some drug without an end in sight, I urge you to start researching an alternative solution. It's one thing if you were born a certain way and must take a drug to live -- it's far more disconcerting if your ailment could be solved with a tweak in lifestyle. The pharmaceutical industry is one of the scariest industries in this countries and my trust in the medical profession has decreased immensely because of it.

I agree. I was very, very concerned when I started taking antidepressants; but that was after doing everything I could think of to improve the problem. As a whole, I think our society is medicated to the max though, and more people need to follow what you're saying. Cut the salt, quit taking blood pressure meds. Start exercising, quit taking weight loss drugs. The industry is no different than the tobacco industry, getting you primed and then keeping you there.

Those class action ads are already here, though they're still drowned out by the constant ads for new drugs. Seriously saw one sandwiched between ads for two prescription drugs. How the fark is advertising something that requires a prescription even legal? They banned cigarette ads, they could just as easily ban big pharma (and should).
I too was overmedicated on the antidepressant BS for a while. It was just round after round of 'try this pill for a month or two' then try a new one, all of them worthless, one caused me to wake up screaming in the middle of the night - which I thought was hilarious actually.
Eventually found an honest doc who diagnosed me properly, took a lithium variant for a little under a year, haven't needed any medication since (5 years). Sometimes the old meds are the best, but there's no money (or patent) in curing anything.

There is for the doctor, as long as you do your part. For all the money, for all the promotional material, the hot chicks visiting the office, the "conferences" in Barbados, the best advertising for anything remains word of mouth.

Now, of course you don't know about the efficacy of lithium for all purposes of course. But you do know of a doctor who set as a goal getting you off meds and who succeeded in that goal. It's your turn to help your doctor, your fellow man and the government as payor in one fell swoop. When you meet someone on meds or who is considering treatment, recommend your doctor. If they can't or won't see that same doctor, tell them how good it is to be free of the grip of medicines and insist that they at least quiz the doctor they do see about the pathway s/he has in mind to get the patient free.

Even some of the newer, more radical drugs can be of help on treating mental illness - they really can - but only if the doctor and patient have a path set to independence from them. Way too many doctors consider a lifelong addiction a good outcome and way too many patients are OK with that. Help them out from your own experience.

This is how I know Big Pharma is running an expensive scam behind our backs.
Perhaps someone from the advertising business can help me here, but isn't it rather odd that drug companies spend money making so many expensive commercials that run so frequently on TV for pills that might be useful for only a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of the population??
And even then, you can only get The Product from your doctor.
I mean, isn't a mass medium such as TV supposed to be the place to advertise products and services of a more-or-less general usefulness - cars, soft drinks, restaurants, clothes?
When I see a drug being advertised that has only a marginal market, that tells me Follow the Money, cuz something ain't makin' sense!

Britney Spear's Speculum: The female reps were hot!

That's their only qualification.

They're models who sell.

/we get a few here, and they're crazy-hot, but trying to talk to one is like trying to talk to a magazine. It only knows what's put there by someone else.

I wonder how much they gave to the Obama administration to start cracking down on the Med Marijuana operations

Another sign? Free drug samples. "People think a free sample is a good thing," Santa observes. "Well, the expensive prescription that follows it, if it works, is not a good thing. It can be, again, a much more expensive drug than you may need."

...except that the "free drug samples" programs tend to be "free drugs for poor people" programs, not just samples.

When you look at the Pro Publica database, you also notice that a big chunk of that money going to doctors includes paying doctors for participating in training sessions on how to prescribe drugs and use new medical equipment. This isn't just "let's but them dinner so they prescribe our drugs," it's "let's set up a session so they know why our drug is better, along with extended training on how to prescribe it correctly."

No, you can't just say "take two pills a day" and hope for a good result. A lot of the more effective drugs take careful monitoring, which means checking in with the patient to see what sort of adverse effects might be happening, and whether or not to discontinue therapy.

The lion's share of the "payments" also includes things like research consulting fees, which are for those doctors who are taking part in actual clinical trials - and that's a lot of doctors.

There is nothing wrong with the system citizen .... move along ..... just move along.

If you're a drug company and you spend more on marketing than R&D, you're doing it wrong. And if you let shareholders dictate how much of an R&D budget you have, you are also doing wrong. Oh so very wrong.

Luthien's Tempest: As someone who is currently making a living calling doctors offices to offer them samples, I... I'll slink out of here before I somehow get myself into trouble. :(

Pharma sales girl! Everyone pounce!

Yes, but, where did the $760mln come from in the first place?

beer4breakfast: I wonder if private corporations trying to maximize profits has anything to do with health care in the US being the most expensive in the world.

No way. The real reason health care is so expensive is Mexicans and blacks keep showing up to ERs! And malpractice suits! It has nothing to do with the idea that monetizing human life has entirely predictable consequences. You are stupid for even daring to ask this question. Please dutifully return to your favorite Fox or AM radio pundit if you don't want to take my word for it.

My brother works for Merck and is thus supportive of them. A few years ago I mentioned that it would be better if Merck didn't spend twice as much on marketing as it does on R&D.

Him, trying to be a smartass, just happened to have their annual report with him and pulled it out to prove me wrong.

Marketing: $8 billion
R&D: $5 billion

Not so cool story for my Bro

I used to love when my old Dr. would try to pass free drugs to me in his office... Cause then was the sales pitch and prescription.

oh, and taking those, you'll need to take these for the liver issues, then take these for the headaches.... then take these for those side effects of bleeding from the eyes.

skinink: On top of "Love and Other Drugs" explicitly showing this very thing going on, you get to see Anne Hathaway naked a number of times.
And anyone who says Hathaway has an just average body and average looks really needs to see this movie.
[img32.imageshack.us image 600x330]

indeed. good fap time was had

Twelve companies and only forty percent?

Shiat, then they're not getting their money's worth.

One of the few bits of good news in the healthcare finance arena is the amount of drugs that are now or are becoming generic in the next 18 months

ARBs (a very good, low side effect, blood pressure medication) becoming generic
Lipitor becoming generic..

But I'm sure the drug companies and their spokesbimbos are coming up with reasons to tell your doctor why these drugs will magically stop working next year.

Marcus Aurelius: Does anyone here have a doctor that hasn't pushed the latest pills at them for no apparent reason whatsoever?

None of my doctors do. They always push for "reliable old generics", if they have to prescribe anything at all. It's that damn socilized medicine the military seems to love.


Of course, most other countries have severe restrictions on advertising prescription drugs.

Luthien's Tempest: Lupine Chemist: Luthien's Tempest: As someone who is currently making a living calling doctors offices to offer them samples, I... I'll slink out of here before I somehow get myself into trouble. :(

Pharma sales girl! Everyone pounce!

Please don't kill me! ;)

I hate the job, but there's not too many other places around here that I can get $11 an hour with the understanding that I am going to leave in less than a year to go to graduate school. Personally, I don't give a damn whether or not the doctors take the samples. I prefer, actually, that they say no and hang up, because then I don't have to go through the whole list of side effects and contraindications, and I still don't have to call them back a week later and I get the 20 cents for a yes or no answer. I'm just glad the pay is enough that I can still pay all of my bills even when I have to take a couple days for being sick.

/Student loan debt sucks
//Without it, I would have stayed unemployed longer and found a job I actually like
/I'd rather be volunteering down at the Franklin Institute, to be honest.

Hey, more power to you. I work in oil and I'm a pretty big environ type. It seems that contradictions like that are fairly common as I, along with most people, seem to have misplace my scruples. I'm just happy I got the exchange rate helping me on my loan payments.

Luthien's Tempest: Student loan debt sucks
//Without it, I would have stayed unemployed longer and found a job I actually like
/I'd rather be volunteering down at the Franklin Institute, to be honest.

Lupine Chemist: It seems that contradictions like that are fairly common as I, along with most people, seem to have misplace my scruples. I'm just happy I got the exchange rate helping me on my loan payments.

Well, the great thing about America is that slavery is illegal and you can be who you want to be.

Vertdang: /we get a few here, and they're crazy-hot, but trying to talk to one is like trying to talk to a magazine. It only knows what's put there by someone else.

bingo

$760M ? Damn that's a lot of pizzas and catered lunches for the office!

My first rule is, "start off with the generic or least expensive drug in its class." If that doesn't work or produces side affects, then move on to something newer/more expensive. If your physician isn't doing that, run, do not walk, to someone else.

Luthien's Tempest: I just wish I was actually doing something with my degree... I had intended to go straight to grad school, but, obviously, that didn't quite work out, so now I have a degree in something I love and I am doing a job I hate. And I'm paying $520 a month just in private student loan debt for said degree. The only use my degree gets is in sharing my knowledge with coworkers - in the lead up to Hurricane Irene, I could get away with just sitting around chatting about the weather, because my supervisors all wanted to hear what I had to say; my supervisors' supervisor interrupted a meeting we were having just to ask me what the latest forecasts said and how she should be preparing. Well that and irritating people when all they want is small talk and think the weather is a safe subject.

Don't beat yourself up over it. I couldn't get any job the US despite a good degree. Honestly, I'm happy to be treading water right now.