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(The New York Times) Interesting That professor who wouldn't let the stutterer ask questions? Ab ab ab bou bou bout tha-tha-tha-tha-that   (nytimes.com) divider line 93
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2011-10-14 08:04:13 PM
"A person with a disability is:
...anyone perceived as having such a disability"

So, prof, you are butt-f*cked.
 
2011-10-14 08:04:29 PM
I am pretty sure that most of the outrage stories we read in the news are much like this one.
 
2011-10-14 08:05:32 PM
www.demotivationalposters.org

/oblig
 
2011-10-14 08:06:28 PM
I've been OFFENDED!
QUICKLY, to the MEDIA!!!!

Even if the stuttering kid was in the right, how about just shutting up and sucking it up.
We've all had teachers who were jerks.
 
2011-10-14 08:06:59 PM
There is another side to this story? Say whaaaaat?

/bet that kid is a stuttering douchebag
 
2011-10-14 08:07:00 PM
From TFA: "nor did I call on anyone else, simply because I had a detailed presentation planned for the class and I wanted to be finished in the prescribed time". This may go a long way toward explaining why she's an adjunct and not in a tenure-track position.

Adjunct= the day-laborers of the academic world.
 
2011-10-14 08:07:53 PM
Re-read article.

Nope. She's still screwed. That was the most insensitive, ill-informed comment I've seen in a while. And not just for the student with the speech impairment: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

The outrage may be overdone, but lady, you needed a good smack to get your priorities straight.
 
2011-10-14 08:10:19 PM
 
2011-10-14 08:11:14 PM
Gyrfalcon: Re-read article.

Nope. She's still screwed. That was the most insensitive, ill-informed comment I've seen in a while. And not just for the student with the speech impairment: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

The outrage may be overdone, but lady, you needed a good smack to get your priorities straight.


Nonsense.
ALL the students paid cash to take the class - not to hear other students ask questions.
Teaching takes priority - questions, especially lengthy ones, are for office hours.
 
2011-10-14 08:11:31 PM
Sounds like the problem was that the kid's a douchebag gunner. His stammering just exacerbated the negative effects of his bad behavior.
 
2011-10-14 08:11:56 PM
So she basically said that she did do what everyone is saying she did. She just is mad that the whole world found out.
 
2011-10-14 08:13:22 PM
Gyrfalcon: Re-read article.

Nope. She's still screwed. That was the most insensitive, ill-informed comment I've seen in a while. And not just for the student with the speech impairment: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

The outrage may be overdone, but lady, you needed a good smack to get your priorities straight.


I've had many, many college and graduate school classes where the instructor, professor or otherwise, had a full-length presentation and if you had questions, you went to see them during their office hours. Hell, I've had entire courses where the instructor spoke from beginning to end without pause.
 
2011-10-14 08:13:27 PM
I hope she has to go to auctioneering class one day and gets cordoned off like this kid for going too slow.
 
2011-10-14 08:13:53 PM
If this kid stutters as bad as I used to, I'm shocked that he even tries to ask questions in class.

/psycotherapy got me past my stuttering for the most part
//still stutters a little
 
2011-10-14 08:15:03 PM
Begoggle: I've been OFFENDED!
QUICKLY, to the MEDIA!!!!

Even if the stuttering kid was in the right, how about just shutting up and sucking it up.
We've all had teachers who were jerks.


tha-tha-tha-tha-sss-sss-sss-sss-e-e-e-e-e-easy fo-fo-fo-fo-for-yo-yo-yo-yo-you-ta-ta-ta-sa-sa-say
 
2011-10-14 08:16:57 PM
southparkstudios-intl.mtvnimages.com
 
2011-10-14 08:17:15 PM
Gyrfalcon: Re-read article.

Nope. She's still screwed. That was the most insensitive, ill-informed comment I've seen in a while. And not just for the student with the speech impairment: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

The outrage may be overdone, but lady, you needed a good smack to get your priorities straight.


No. Professors usually have a set amount of material to cover in each class. If one student monopolizes class time it's not fair to other students. Have you never been in a class where some douchebag feels the need to ask questions ad nauseum? The professor can set aside time outside of class if that student has special needs, but her priorities should be to the class at large.
 
2011-10-14 08:17:59 PM
Pretend this kid didn't have a stutter. He's just some 10th grader who doesn't understand how college lectures work, and asks too many questions and at inappropriate times. Fielding questions is important, but if you need a lot of help, come to class early, stay late, or go to office hours. Don't prevent the other 199 students in class from learning by acting like lecture is a one-on-one tutoring session. It's not.

Everyone who has had a big lecture class knows that kid, and no one likes them. The stutter is a non issue, and is just an excuse for an immature, selfish kid to cry about discrimination.
 
2011-10-14 08:19:26 PM
Gyrfalcon: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

One who is teaching a 100-level class and just wants to trudge through it.
 
2011-10-14 08:20:02 PM
domo_kun_sai: So she basically said that she did do what everyone is saying she did. She just is mad that the whole world found out.

Is everyone saying that she wouldn't give this kid single-handed control over the classroom?
If so, then yes, she's doing what everyone said.
 
2011-10-14 08:22:29 PM
Gyrfalcon: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

Also what do you think happens at the "prescribed time"?
Students have ANOTHER CLASS or they have jobs to go to or lunch. So does the instructor have things to do, like other classes.
They paid for a certain time period, not to stay late so they could indulge someone asking questions taking up all the class time.
Sounds like EVERY PROFESSOR I'VE EVER HAD
 
2011-10-14 08:23:45 PM
It is painfully embarassing to have that problem. It doesn't help when people try to finish your sentences for you when they have no clue what you are going to say.

Hope he gets some help. He'll have a hard time getting a job if he can't talk.
 
2011-10-14 08:24:37 PM
Gyrfalcon: Re-read article.

Nope. She's still screwed. That was the most insensitive, ill-informed comment I've seen in a while. And not just for the student with the speech impairment: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

The outrage may be overdone, but lady, you needed a good smack to get your priorities straight.


images.icanhascheezburger.com

If I'm in a class that I paid good money for I would prefer the teacher do most of the talking, not some know it all student
 
2011-10-14 08:24:58 PM
she's teaching at a county college. kinda tells you her career path didn't live up to her dreams.
 
2011-10-14 08:25:49 PM
Okay, I'm going to go ahead and be insensitive here:

I once had to suffer through a seminar class with, I believe, the world's slowest and most rambling speaker. And because it was a seminar and she wanted a good participation grade, that meant there was a hell of a lot of totally pointless talking that, when it amounted to anything, could've been restated in one quick sentence. As such, particularly in a lecture class, I don't think there's anything wrong with limiting a slow talker to one comment per class, so long as he could still ask anything else afterwards and wasn't humiliated in front of others.
 
2011-10-14 08:26:03 PM
fark that nubianrdly student.

/has a stutter
//ttttttoday, junior!
 
2011-10-14 08:27:00 PM
b0rg9: I hope she has to go to auctioneering class one day and gets cordoned off like this kid for going too slow.

Or, and just hear me out here, perhaps she choose not to engage in activities of self agrandizement and flagelation for which she is ill suited.

I'm willing to bet, if she is a slow speaker, she wouldn't force the rest of the paying auctioneer students to sit through half a class of her eeking out a single sentence or three.

Kid's a self involved little shiat who needs to learn to work with his disability, not force the rest of the world to change. People confined to wheelchairs do not run marathons, unless they adapt themselves.
 
2011-10-14 08:28:53 PM
WTFDYW: It is painfully embarassing to have that problem. It doesn't help when people

interrupt you, I know what you mean.
 
2011-10-14 08:31:26 PM
James Earl Jones was a stutterer. NOW listen to how he sounds. He should be an inspiration for people that stutter.
 
2011-10-14 08:34:35 PM
content9.flixster.com
N-n-n-n-n-n-n-n-not av-av-av-av-av-av-av-av-available for c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-c-comment.
 
2011-10-14 08:37:16 PM
kroonermanblack: b0rg9: I hope she has to go to auctioneering class one day and gets cordoned off like this kid for going too slow.

Or, and just hear me out here, perhaps she choose not to engage in activities of self agrandizement and flagelation for which she is ill suited.

I'm willing to bet, if she is a slow speaker, she wouldn't force the rest of the paying auctioneer students to sit through half a class of her eeking out a single sentence or three.

Kid's a self involved little shiat who needs to learn to work with his disability, not force the rest of the world to change. People confined to wheelchairs do not run marathons, unless they adapt themselves.



Ha...true, true. Your points are where I stand,for the most of it, with this.

I'll reach manufactured-outrage overload eventually and maybe I'll be in a good place to take a nice vacation at that time...
 
2011-10-14 08:39:02 PM
Heist: Pretend this kid didn't have a stutter. He's just some 10th grader who doesn't understand how college lectures work, and asks too many questions and at inappropriate times.

This. People are getting all uppity because he has a disability. If the kid didn't stutter, no one would care. But, the stuttering is the root of the problem because it's possibly quadruples the amount of time he's sucking away from the class to get a question out.

Also, I'd like to hear from the rest of the class on the issue. In the initial article, there were two anonymous students that didn't approve (fishy, fishy) and no comments from anyone that backed her up (fishy, fishy). It was a damn witch hunt and that story was written to smear and incite emotion. If I had paid to be there to learn, I'd want that kid to shut up so we could learn and be out of there on time. I bet at least the majority of the class felt the same (particularly since they're young).

I have an 8 year old autistic son that can't talk at all. I realize he has special needs and appreciate the educators who make exceptions for him, but would never expect that to be at the expense of other students. This is ludicrous. She did what she thought was best to make sure he got the education he was there to obtain without inconveniencing the other students. She did nothing wrong. With such a lengthy and commendable history in her career field, she doesn't deserve this mark on her record.

That little highschool sophomore that knows nothing about how college works has so much learning and growing up to do. Seems he's a selfish, entitled little douchebag, though, so it might be too late.
 
2011-10-14 08:41:00 PM
As a college student, I think classes are cost too much and are generally filled with too many people for people to ask a lot of questions. One of my classes has 195 students in it, if we stopped for every question that was asked then we would never get anything accomplished in a 50 minute lecture period. There's a difference between a teacher asking if anyone has any questions at the end of the lecture or saying something along the lines of, "it is very important for everyone to understand this material so please ask questions" versus someone just trying to poke and prod every little detail of the teachers brain on a subject. Everyone hates that person in a classroom where the teacher is lecturing and the student tries to awkwardly tell the teacher facts and ask her random details about the subject that shouldn't be covered in the course.

Also, this woman is a history teacher. She has to cover and test on a specific time period by the end of the semester. She has to have a specific outline and make it through this each class or else fall behind on the entire semester and not meet the state criteria for the subject.
 
2011-10-14 08:41:11 PM
He thrusts his fists against the posts and still insists he sees the ghosts
 
2011-10-14 08:42:24 PM
He still insists he sees the ghosts???
 
2011-10-14 08:44:52 PM
Wow, the kid refused to accept that his questions need to be deferred to office hours/email? What an entitled little douchenozzle. I tell people to put their questions in e-mail or come by during open-door all the time when I'm lecturing, though usually it has to do with the length of the answer rather than the length of the question. Not being a pack of ravening assholes, most of the students I've had have done their best to avoid wasting their classmates' time.

College ain't high school, munchkin, people are paying for this and their time has value.
 
2011-10-14 08:47:56 PM
I know someone who's going to learn the hard way that the real world is NOTHING like high school.

This ranks up there with kids who refuse to read their textbooks and then wonder why they keep failing exams.
 
2011-10-14 08:47:58 PM
GratuityIncluded: There is another side to this story? Say whaaaaat?
/bet that kid is a stuttering douchebag


I saw him on the news last night. His stutter is very bad. He's also goofy-looking--like, when you look at him, you can tell that something is a little off. I got the impression that he's overcompensating like hell.

blogs.ajc.com

Also he's a hipster
 
2011-10-14 08:49:18 PM
Jim_Callahan: Wow, the kid refused to accept that his questions need to be deferred to office hours/email? What an entitled little douchenozzle. I tell people to put their questions in e-mail or come by during open-door all the time when I'm lecturing, though usually it has to do with the length of the answer rather than the length of the question. Not being a pack of ravening assholes, most of the students I've had have done their best to avoid wasting their classmates' time.

College ain't high school, munchkin, people are paying for this and their time has value.


I've seen it happen many times where some student has a question and the teacher answers, and it evolves (or devolves) into a topic that goes outside the scope of the class, or else it becomes a debate/argument. Usually the teacher stops at some point and says "after class", especially if nobody else in the class seems interested.
 
2011-10-14 08:51:42 PM
The original article was needlessly inflammatory. The reporter even popped into the comments section to say he didn't want to write a one-sided story, but evidently the story of "High school student suffers possible discrimination" just couldn't wait for a reporter to do actual research or uncover facts.
 
2011-10-14 08:55:25 PM
I wonder if this kid realizes there's a very, very, very good chance that most of the future educators he encounters will remember his name from this incident, and he has no shot in hell at every given a fair shake for the rest of his educations career. Right now he's probably thinking he's a badass and teachers will fear and respect him. Just typing that made me LOL. Kids ...
 
2011-10-14 08:57:00 PM
Sounds like the college professor was willing to work with it - as long as working with it didn't inconvenience other students. IE, see my office hours.
 
2011-10-14 09:02:51 PM
Nicholas Urfe: douchebag gunner

That is my new favorite nounverb.
 
2011-10-14 09:04:46 PM
NYT is now misbehaving ... TFA ...


Professor Defends Treatment of Stutterer

By RICHARD PÉREZ-PEÑA

Published: October 13, 2011

Calling herself "the victim of a character assassination," the college professor who asked a student with a severe stutter not to pose questions in class said that her actions were misinterpreted, and that she did not mean to silence him.

In an interview, the professor, Elizabeth Snyder, said Thursday that since the dispute was first reported this week in The New York Times, "I've gotten the most hateful, vile, vicious e-mails," making her fear for her safety.

The student, Philip Garber Jr., is a 10th grader taking courses at the County College of Morris, in Randolph, N.J., but talking for him is slow and difficult. He was enrolled in a history course taught by Ms. Snyder, an adjunct professor. After a few classes, she sent him an e-mail asking that he pose questions after class, "so we do not infringe on other students' time," and that he write answers to her questions rather than try to reply out loud.

She did so, she said, partly to put him at ease, and also because he would have taken up too much class time if she had let him. "He seemed to want to answer every question," she said, adding, "you'd have to take into consideration the amount of time he takes to get the answer out."

But she insisted that her ideas were only suggestions, and that "there was never any intent to stop him from speaking."

In fact, Ms. Snyder said, she told him that she would call on him once per class.

Philip said that one day, he kept his hand raised for most of a class, but she did not call on him.

In a statement she composed before the interview, Ms. Snyder wrote, "I did not call on Philip in this class nor did I call on anyone else, simply because I had a detailed presentation planned for the class and I wanted to be finished in the prescribed time.

"He misinterpreted this and assumed it had something to do with his stuttering; I interpreted his hand up for 75 minutes as someone unfamiliar with a college lecture format and frankly a little rude," she said. "In hindsight, I should have stopped my lecture and called on Philip because he had become so fixated on making a statement that it didn't seem to matter to him that he was interrupting my presentation."

Philip contends Ms. Snyder did, in fact, call on other students that day. She disputed his account, and his assertion that after that class, she told him, "Your speaking is disruptive."

Both say that they had agreed that he would send her an e-mail listing his concerns, but he never did, and that she tried to arrange meetings with him and a college dean, but Philip backed out of them. Ms. Snyder said she also consulted a speech therapist about the situation.

Ms. Snyder declined to comment for the initial article, which was published on the front page of The Times on Tuesday. Instead, she referred questions to the college, which she said the college had advised her to do.

The article elicited hundreds of comments from readers, some of them furious at Ms. Snyder, and others furious that the story was told without comments from her. It also prompted extensive coverage in other news media.

College administrators said Tuesday that she had acted improperly, and that what Philip had experienced was discrimination - a label Ms. Snyder disputes.

Philip said that he felt sympathy for Ms. Snyder for the negative attention she had received and that he had no interest in seeing her penalized. "Most people's mistakes do not become national news," he said.

Ms. Snyder has taught history for 37 years, first in middle school and for the last decade at the county college, and students give her generally positive marks. In May, the college's Educational Opportunity Fund named her educator of the year, for her work with financially and academically challenged students.

"I've been an advocate for kids my entire life," she said. "But people's rush to judgment on this, it feels like it's pretty much destroyed my life."


A version of this article appeared in print on October 14, 2011, on page A24 of the New York edition with the headline: After Public Outrage, Professor Says Handling of Stuttering Student Was Misinterpreted.

Related: Stutterer Speaks Up in Class; His Professor Says Keep Quiet (October 11, 2011)
 
2011-10-14 09:09:04 PM
Okay, how many of you farkers emailed her?
 
2011-10-14 09:12:11 PM
Stuttering Stanley! Stuttering Stanley! Stuttering Stanley!
 
2011-10-14 09:13:13 PM
I bet she's not saying this, but it might also be that the kid asks horrible, off-topic questions, to boot. Some people don't "listen" in lectures; instead, they just hear one thing and want to add their two cents, but it derails the presentation.

She's taken the time to create a presentation, it has a pace and a format, and he's probably totally in the wrong way with his questions, and she has to struggle to address them and then to get back to the class. As a student, I find it hard to keep the trajectory of a class in my mind if there are constant interruptions; I have to go back to my notes to remember the class period's structure, because the presentation, itself, "stuttered" during its presentation owing to constant interruptions.

He's in 10th grade and taking community college courses. I don't trust he has much to say, even if he's a joint-enrolled student. I'm speaking as someone who did the joint-enrollment thing at the age of 15 - I didn't have much worth saying at that age, and even when I did, people rarely cared to hear it. And when I did have something to say, I wouldn't say it in a lecture setting. That's what seminars are for. Many intro courses are 50 minutes long in duration, three days a week, or 75 minutes, two days a week. There just isn't time to waste in a situation like that.

And I doubt his "questions" were related to asking for clarification. I'd be surprised if he was really being "put out" by not being addressed at that very moment. It sounds like he wants to be seen and heard in the course, but the course is not about him. What kind of a jerk raises their hand and leaves it up for 75 minutes, probably angry while doing it, disrupting class? He was probably huffing and puffing, ignoring the content of the course, so distracted that she wouldn't call on him. I know that people may find sympathy, still, with this kid and this story, but I do not.

In the past, it has pained me to be in a class where someone wanted to constantly pretend to "ask" but in truth wanted to just "tell"; and they would consistently do so from a far-out-in-left-field perspective, complete with a non sequitor or urban legendish angle. The "raising of the hand" was a thinly veiled attempt to start a story that they heard that was only barely related to the subject matter, and then they'd leave it at that, forcing the professor to address it. And if the kid did that and at a leisurely pace, then that would certainly be a problem.

If I was in that class, I'd have learned quickly to hate that kid. I'd be rolling my eyes, and fidgeting in my seat. Not that I'm generally a mean person or anything, but there is a sense that one is there and has paid to be there so one has a right to feel put out by such things. It's a rare event that I've valued things that another student has stated in a third tier institution, much less a community college, and I bounced around three colleges and a community college before I settled on a major and finished.

He does sound like a jerk in my book, and he's now trying to back off of the severity of his statements. She's an older adjunct that enjoys teaching. She probably gets paid less than $3000 per class, and yet she's still winning awards for taking the time to help disadvantaged individuals. And now the college has turned against her, now that they're faced with public scrutiny. I feel great pity for her. Truly.
 
2011-10-14 09:14:25 PM
Dr J Zoidberg: Gyrfalcon: Re-read article.

Nope. She's still screwed. That was the most insensitive, ill-informed comment I've seen in a while. And not just for the student with the speech impairment: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

The outrage may be overdone, but lady, you needed a good smack to get your priorities straight.

[images.icanhascheezburger.com image 400x307]

If I'm in a class that I paid good money for I would prefer the teacher do most of the talking, not some know it all student


Maybe so, but I'm not talking about the class, I'm referring to her attitude in the article. She sounds so put-upon, like everyone should have realized her time was precious beyond belief and what was this little punk doing DARING to raise his hand and ask a question?!? And her remark how this has "destroyed her life." Get over yourself, princess. Even the kid doesn't think she did anything that bad, so she sounds like twice a douchebag.

If the kid had his hand raised for 75 minutes in class, the thing to do was not ignore him because her presentation was so goddamn important or that he was "a little rude", this experienced teacher should have just said, "I'm sorry, I'm not taking questions today," so he didn't have to look like a fool and she didn't look like the queen biatch of the universe. How hard is that?

I'm sorry, she was insensitive. The outrage is overdone, as I said, but she needed a wakeup call.
 
2011-10-14 09:14:35 PM
Gyrfalcon: Re-read article.

Nope. She's still screwed. That was the most insensitive, ill-informed comment I've seen in a while. And not just for the student with the speech impairment: What kind of weirdo professor doesn't want to take questions from her students because her lecture is so important she can't go over the prescribed time?

The outrage may be overdone, but lady, you needed a good smack to get your priorities straight.


Gonna pile on. I don't pay good money to hear someone monopolize the lecture time, stutter or not. I don't know what happened here, but there is nothing wrong with asking a student to politely stfu so the material can be covered.

Have you never had one of those students in your class where you want to pimp slap the taste out of their mouth because they won't stfu and just like to hear themselves talk?
 
2011-10-14 09:19:47 PM
Tahllunari: Everyone hates that person in a classroom where the teacher is lecturing and the student tries to awkwardly tell the teacher facts and ask her random details about the subject that shouldn't be covered in the course.

Indeed. My Bio 101 course had a student who would interject the prof's lecture to make a random comment. Several times per class. Most of it was like this: "Watson and Crick first published the double helix in 1953..." "1953? My dad was born that year!"

A different student, in an introductory botany course, would add anecdotes and commentary to every lecture, all in relation to Psilocybe cyanescens. "Psilocybe cyanescens does this, just like that plant you're talking about." "Psilocybe cyanescens also helps with heart disease, just like that plant over there." "There's new evidence that Psilocybe cyanescens does..." Every. single. lecture.

And yes, he did insist on using the scientific name.
 
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