CtrlAltDestroy: Kar98: strife: I'm dropping Verizon for T-Mobile or Virgin Mobile next month anyway. I want a smartphone, but I'm sure as shiat not going to pay an extra $30 per month for what used to be unlimited data and be locked into another contract (which early termination fees are higher for smartphones).

Unlimited 4G data, unlimited text messaging, and a 100 minutes a month, no contract and $30 a month, you say?

Link (new window)

Isn't T-Mobile owned by AT&T now? Doesn't AT&T throttle the shiat out of their "unlimited" customers' data speeds after they get over (something like) 2gb/month?

No, AT&T is trying to buy T-Mobile, but they haven't succeeded so far. In fact, several lawsuits have been filed to stop them from buying T-Mobile.

HeartBurnKid: Bathia_Mapes: CtrlAltDestroy: Kar98: strife: I'm dropping Verizon for T-Mobile or Virgin Mobile next month anyway. I want a smartphone, but I'm sure as shiat not going to pay an extra $30 per month for what used to be unlimited data and be locked into another contract (which early termination fees are higher for smartphones).

Unlimited 4G data, unlimited text messaging, and a 100 minutes a month, no contract and $30 a month, you say?

Link (new window)

Isn't T-Mobile owned by AT&T now? Doesn't AT&T throttle the shiat out of their "unlimited" customers' data speeds after they get over (something like) 2gb/month?

No, AT&T is trying to buy T-Mobile, but they haven't succeeded so far. In fact, several lawsuits have been filed to stop them from buying T-Mobile.

But you are right, T-Mobile does throttle you if you go over 2GB now (if you have one of the older plans, it'll be 5GB). They're pretty up-front about it though, and it's better than charging ridiculous overages like Verizon and AT&T do.

Its not so bad with AT&T, its $10 per GB IIRC, which is about what you pay for data anyway. Me and my fiancee both have iphones, we pay $140 a month for 550 minutes (which between free nights and weekends and free mobile to mobile weve use maybe 100 of a month, but it was the lowest plan available...), unlimited texting, unlimited data on mine (grandfathered) and 2GB on hers.

I love that the few kilobites of text data we send costs as much as our multi GB internet usage though; somebody needs to come up with an SMSoIP thing for smartphones, charging for text is the biggest ripoff ever.


It would be awesome if one of the companies decided to offer free texting on all their plans and run a commercial educating people about the size of an sms in data compared to an average data plan, and the relative costs.

[spokesperson on plain white set at medium closeup]

"Heres a text message."

[holds up little 1" box]

"Our competitors charge you $.20 for it, doesnt sound like much, but..."

"Heres your average 2GB data plan."

[track back to reveal a 20' cube]**

[distant shouting] "If you were charged the same rate as texts, it would cost $2,684,355." **

[logo]

[voiceover] "Text messages dont cost us anything, so we dont think they should cost you anything either."

Competitors:"FFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU"

Nice to dream, but It'd never happen, its their cash cow, and probably the biggest markup on anything ever.

/**did the math, all these numbers are real

Torok: I think that level of regulation would be appropriate.

I'm a VERY anti-regulation type of person who is VERY against additional laws and unnecessary regulation enacted simply because of emotions, knee jerking, or rare/singular occurrences. As in VERY against it and I'm against it now too but, if you will, I'm all for it.

I'd say that it should be a government by and for the people. If enough people understood and agreed (one of those strange vote things ought to do the trick) and voted to allow that restriction or one similar then I'd be all for it. I will go further and say that I'd be all for a government that would do it without needing us to vote on it but such isn't going to happen. I would be for nationalization of the public airwaves and having the government provide a standard service for a fee and/or subsidized by those who can afford the fee for those who can't. Sort of like the post office. I would also agree for a basic broadband internet, say 512kB/sec or some other number. Again, I'd be happy to have the government impose those regulations and plans if it were by the people and for the people.

Unfortunately... What we have here is nothing of the sort, we are not a government for or by the people. At best we're a government by and for the monied interests. Additionally, the barrier to entry into that market is HUGE. VERY huge. There should be some changes there. I live in Maine... I can name the one regional carrier. I can then name a handful of other companies and maybe a fistful of regional carriers. There is no reason nor justification in allowing the recreation of Ma Bell. They were curb stomped once. Obviously enough is not enough - we need to put a stop to that.

If the folks at OWS want to effect change I would add that to the list of things that can easily be explained (though explaining some of the benefits of those services being subsidized directly and nationalized may be tough) and thrown on a bumper sticker. The abuses we stand for are insane. There is NO reason for the expense.

How can I say those things (including nationalization) while being a fairly fiscal conservative? Well... It'd be cheaper all around. As for the subsidies? We already subsidize it. We even give free phones to the poor here in Maine. I know they do it in other states. The outlay may be more expensive, I doubt it. We're the government. They've been busy rebuilding Ma Bell since we tore 'em down the last time. This time we're just going to take their crap from them and run it ourselves. Those are OUR airwaves and pretty much OUR lines that run the last miles. We'll keep the employees though, thanks.

Does that go against the framers? No. Not really. By the people, for the people. If you can get enough people to go along with it then go for it. However, I don't think you can get enough people to go for it in this system. It simply will not be allowed. Even if it is allowed it will have no effect.

Note: I don't blame a particular party. I blame the people in office. Their party doesn't matter. To be fair, I also blame the people who voted them into office. Keep in mind that I'm pretty sure that very few of the people I've voted for are the ones that have screwed it up, they're not usually the ones that win the elections. To be fair, they'd probably have screwed it up too. One can resist the siren's money call for only so long before the lure is too strong.

/we will not go out with a bang
//we will go out with a wimper
/buried inside our planet, huddled to the last few embers of the Earth

tgambitg: This is more true than you realize. SMS is limited to a set number of characters for a reason. The SMS packet is the same size as the "Hello, Tower, I exist" packet that the phone sends. Part of the Signaling protocol that all mobile phones use. The phone sends these packets anyway. Usually the packet data is empty except for the "Hello, Tower" part, but the payload can include the SMS. So.. literally it is built into the phone to not send any more traffic. MMS messages, now those are different and follow a different sending scheme... but SMS? You send a blank one every time your phone talks to the tower. Texting just queues up data in the next packet sent.

No, its exactly as true as i realize, i already knew all that (good info for those who dont) which is why ive said it twice in the thread. It was part of the GSM spec (carriers not using GSM, technically use a standard besides SMS) that nobody used for anything for about 15 years, then teenage girls started using it and they started charging for it...

Got tied up with some other things yesterday & couldn't comment as much on this thread as I wanted to. As a little background, I worked for about 4 years in the retail side of cellular sales, dealing with all four of the major U.S. contract providers as well as most of the pre-paid companies. A few tips on some of the issues I've seen:

1) If you ever do get a monster bill and/or extra charges that you don't understand or don't believe are legitimate, your first step should be to get in contact with the person who sold you your current phone (unless it was bought from a 3rd party online company, then you're probably screwed on this angle). Explain the situation to them, have them look at the bill if necessary, and let them deal with the cell company. As I always used to tell people, cell salespeople have this magical thing called a "dealer code", which in most cases enables them to call direct to a CSR and get bumped up to whatever level is needed much faster than you can. Additionally, some carriers give a higher "discretionary" sum which can be credited to an account w/o supervisor approval when dealing with a retailer vs. directly with the customer (T-Mobile in particular).

B) Do not go to the corporate store to purchase your phone/sign your contract. The major third party retailers almost always have better deals on the equipment and often have additional bill credits available (free activation, etc.). They also typically have more than one carrier available, and if they're good, should spend time going over all of your available options & what they'll end up costing you per month after all is said & done (taxes, etc.). If you walk into one of these stores & are immediately offered a particular phone on a particular carrier, walk right back out--the first thing that should happen after initial hellos is a series of questions aimed at getting you the right recommendation...even if you walk in already "knowing what you want". Finally, these people do not work for the carrier, so their primary goal will not be to sign you up for the most expensive plan possible.

3) I saw a lot of love for pre-paid services in the U.S., and in many cases they are great. Just know a few things about your carrier...for example, know that Virgin Mobile USA is owned and operated by Sprint, that you are on Sprint's network only (no roaming), and that if you ever do have a problem which requires calling customer service, you're screwed. Virgin is among the worst companies I ever had to deal with, first getting through an annoying automated response system to get an actual human, then discovering that actual human was based somewhere far away & reading off a cue card, then having to start over when that actual human hung up on me while trying to transfer the call to another department. In almost every case I experienced (AT&T pre-paid being a notable exception), the customer service level was pathetic with no contract providers, bordering on non-existent. And of course no contract plans do not include roaming capability, do not have free "in-network" calling, most of the time do not include free nights & weekends, and do not offer you the option of going above/beyond your plan in a pinch like contract providers do. And of course the equipment being offered is usually a generation old & often weren't the best handsets even when they were new. Oh, and while pre-paid is often cheaper for one or two people, by the time you get up to a family of four it's usually less expensive to go with a share plan on a contract.

D) The levels of customer service change over time. T-Mobile was ranked #1 in this regard every single time for years straight before dropping off a bit over the past year or two. Sprint has traditionally been god-awful for CS over the years, but has improved dramatically in the last couple years. I left the industry about 3 months ago, but at that time I would have ranked AT&T #1. Plan-wise it's tough to beat Sprint's simply everything plans, but make sure that you read the fine print regarding off-network roaming & get a realistic idea of coverage before signing up. Oh, and of course ask yourself realistically if you would truly benefit from having smartphones, or if you'd be better off sticking to something more "basic" on a minutes-only plan.

5) Didn't see this come up often, but know that you have a set "trial period" whenever you sign (or re-sign) a contract--14 days with T-Mobile & Verizon, 30 days with AT&T and Sprint. Be sure to really put your phone to the test during this time, and to ensure that you take your phone with you to all of the places you'll often go in the next couple years to check for signal there. Your ETF is waived (in Sprint's case, all charges are waived) if you cancel within that grace period. If you listened to me on point B, you can switch directly to another carrier while returning your initial handset(s) (don't throw away the box!!!!). Do try to do this quickly, though, as most carriers have a much smaller return window during which your activation fee will be waived. Another potential sticking point is that if you had to pay a deposit on your service, that has to be refunded directly from the carrier, and will take several weeks to get back to you.

Hope this helps!