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(BBC)   Scientists to go on trial for not predicting the power of God   (news.bbc.co.uk ) divider line
    More: Scary, civil protection, 1703 Apennine earthquakes, seismology, god, earthquakes  
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19966 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Sep 2011 at 4:00 PM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2011-09-17 05:06:52 PM  

Summercat: Did... anyone else notice that they're more being put on trial for saying everything is fine, don't worry, based apparently on only an hour looking at things?


Yeah, but don't interrupt the derpers with the facts.
 
2011-09-17 05:09:00 PM  
Did anybody even read the article?

This actually seems somewhat reasonable to me.

There were several tremors. These scientists told everybody there wouldn't be an earthquake. They weren't like, "Well, we're not 100% sure, but we don't think there will be one". They flat out said there was nothing to worry about. The people trusted the scientists, and stopped preparing, and a lot of people died because of it.

They should have made it really clear that earthquake forecasting was inexact BEFORE they told everybody there wouldn't be an earthquake. Not after they got it wrong and a bunch of people died.

People were trusting them because they were scientists. They knew they couldn't predict earthquakes, but they misled people to think they could.
 
2011-09-17 05:09:33 PM  

Procedural Texture: Meanwhile, the local guy who claims to be is God's messenger remains at large.

[www.abbaswatchman.com image 401x292]


ftfy
 
2011-09-17 05:10:52 PM  

scanman61: Summercat: Did... anyone else notice that they're more being put on trial for saying everything is fine, don't worry, based apparently on only an hour looking at things?

Yeah, but don't interrupt the derpers with the facts.


Dude this is why it's called Fark, not Fact.
 
2011-09-17 05:12:54 PM  
FTA: The signatories to the letter say the authorities should focus on earthquake protection, instead of pursuing scientists in what some feel is a Galileo-style inquisition.

I didn't expect some kind of Spanish Inquisition.
 
2011-09-17 05:18:28 PM  

Ringo48: People were trusting them because they were scientists. They knew they couldn't predict earthquakes, but they misled people to think they could.


where was u from, again? focus fundie springs?
 
2011-09-17 05:21:04 PM  
dude, it's italy. there's what the church says and then there's witchcraft/scientists.

this is more like, get those devils outta them pigs or Pharisees asking questions, then it is rational, thinking people and a functional government.
 
2011-09-17 05:25:16 PM  
Using the same reasoning, shouldn't Bush be prosecuted for the whole "Mission Accomplished" thing?
 
2011-09-17 05:31:34 PM  
Oh man, how retarded are the Italian courts? If I were the "Italian - Unknown Title" * that decided on what cases were to actually go to trial I would have laughed whomever brought this before me straight out of my office while doing copious amounts of ridiculing and cursing them for fools.

Yeah, I always get pissed at everyone for not predicting the future so I can be totally safe and completely protected as I live my life on this planet filled with naturally occuring events that we have no control over. I should also be exempt from any and all manmade incidents such as auto accidents or catching any communicable germ or virus from the common cold to the worst pandemic threat. Because I'm super special and totally unique and the world needs me so EVERYONE on the planet should be watching out for me so NOTHING bad EVER happens to me!!!

WTF Italy, we live in a world with inherent dangers. Don't want your double wide destroyed by an F3? Don't set it in 'Tornado Alley'. Don't want your home burned by lava? Don't build it at the base of an active volcano. Don't want your house to fall down on you and your family? Don't live in an area that is earthquake prone or make sure that it is structually sound to take the shake, or bug out if you feel one.

Is there no common sense on this planet any more?!?

*I know less than nothing of the Italian justice system...
 
2011-09-17 05:36:10 PM  
Farking Italy, the only thing it's good for is to keep Spain from being the laughingstock of Western Europe.

The only possible results from a successful prosecution can be either nobody wanting to do the job any longer or that those who do simply issue a nationwide warning every morning.

This is nothing more than the govt having to appease an unbelievably ignorant populace.

1.bp.blogspot.com

Now, what's Spain's excuse? The Moors never conquered Spain, did they?
 
2011-09-17 05:36:53 PM  

namatad: can someone please kill the judge and prosecution already?
seriously

if you are too dumb to understand that we can not predict earthquakes, you are a danger to society.

/shudder


They saw it coming and didn't warn anyone, is what the prosecution says.

They thought it was an erroneous blip is what they are saying.

Do not compartmentalize something with more than two outcomes.
 
2011-09-17 05:40:56 PM  

namatad: [The Pope] is God's messenger


Oh wait, you're serious. Bwahahahahaha!
 
2011-09-17 05:40:59 PM  
Get used to it. We've already been sending people to jail for years for failing to read minds, might as well send them to jail for failing to predict earthquakes.
 
2011-09-17 05:43:46 PM  
It's the scientist's own fault. If they had followed the lead of their colleagues in the Climate Change community they would have predicted a 12.0 quake, scared the holy crap out of everyone, and gotten a government grant.
 
2011-09-17 05:52:14 PM  
i757.photobucket.com
 
2011-09-17 05:52:30 PM  
Isn't this the same science respecting culture which labeled Galileo a heretic and took 300 years to apologize?
 
2011-09-17 05:55:11 PM  
And the war on science continues.

Why do people see Idiocracy as a desirable future?
 
2011-09-17 05:55:33 PM  

www.egypt-travel-guide.com

Set/Seth/Sutekh.

One horse power.

 
2011-09-17 05:59:57 PM  

lohphat: Isn't this the same science respecting culture which labeled Galileo a heretic and took 300 years to apologize?



And harbors a dark empire of child molestation, aka The Vatican.
 
2011-09-17 06:02:28 PM  
28.media.tumblr.com

Yeah it's smoking.. Uh-huh..oh really? Really? Oh my God... a volcano!
 
2011-09-17 06:03:33 PM  
I've read articles about the stupidity of the Italian legal and Political system for quite some time and came to the conclusion that, compared to them, our lawmakers and elected officials are armatures.

I also though that Americans were about the most litigious people on the planet, suing for anything at the drop of a pin.

I was wrong. Other nations are not only catching up but surpassing us in stupid lawsuits. (Remember that. Litigation has become an expensive problem now. Consider what's going to happen 20 years down the road unless folks grow up.)

Anyone who has access to a TV or radio should, by now, know that scientists can't accurately predict when an earthquake will happen or exactly where. Folks living in Earthquake zones also should know by now that traditional building methods do not hold up during quakes. (However, the alternative is quite expensive. Naturally.)

That's like trying to predict where lightening will strike during a thunder storm. They can give out a large, general area, but can't pinpoint exactly down to the square foot.
 
2011-09-17 06:03:57 PM  
Well, then the money is a complete waste unless they can show and repeat some results. Without that maybe they should shut them down.
 
2011-09-17 06:04:53 PM  
FTFA:

The prosecution team said...that they know it is not possible to predict an earthquake.

What they are questioning is whether the six scientists and the official on trial, who together constitute Italy's Commission of Grand Risks, did their jobs properly.

...

The local investigator, Inspector Lorenzo Cavallo, said: "The Commission calmed the local population down following a number of earth tremors. After the quake, we heard people's accounts and they told us they changed their behaviour following the advice of the commission.



Sounds like a non-issue to me. They are prosecuting them for calming the population down after some minor tremors instead of fear-mongering and getting the population all worked up and worried about a larger quake that they had no way of knowing would arrive. That's bound to set a bad precedent of scientists crying wolf over every little thing to cover their asses should something come to fruition... ultimately resulting in the population ignoring them when something serious is actually about to happen because they cried wolf so many times before.
 
2011-09-17 06:06:06 PM  
Sorry!! I meant AMATURES!
 
2011-09-17 06:11:39 PM  

Rik01: Sorry!! I meant AMATURES!


Sorry, your Boobies was already leveraged.

/boobies
 
2011-09-17 06:15:13 PM  

Procedural Texture: namatad: [The Pope] is God's messenger

Oh wait, you're serious. Bwahahahahaha!


well THAT is what they are indoctrinated to believe ...
 
2011-09-17 06:18:36 PM  
I guess this means that Rick Perry could get elected in Italy
 
2011-09-17 06:20:30 PM  

scanman61: Summercat: Did... anyone else notice that they're more being put on trial for saying everything is fine, don't worry, based apparently on only an hour looking at things?

Yeah, but don't interrupt the derpers with the facts.


Sorry derper but here are some facts:

They didn't go 'to look at things' they were sent in order to prevent a widespread panic similar to what had occurred in the city of Sulmona two days earlier, a panic caused in large part by the incorrect predictions of a nuclear scientist named Giampaolo Giuliani. The meeting and subsequent press conference was to tell the locals that the recent smaller earthquakes didn't necessarily mean a big one was about to hit and that they shouldn't be overly concerned, regardless of what Giuliani was saying. It's those claims that they're going to trial over, not the fact that it only took them an hour to express them.
 
2011-09-17 06:21:48 PM  

Rik01: I've read articles about the stupidity of the Italian legal and Political system for quite some time and came to the conclusion that, compared to them, our lawmakers and elected officials are armatures.

I also though that Americans were about the most litigious people on the planet, suing for anything at the drop of a pin.

I was wrong. Other nations are not only catching up but surpassing us in stupid lawsuits. (Remember that. Litigation has become an expensive problem now. Consider what's going to happen 20 years down the road unless folks grow up.)

Anyone who has access to a TV or radio should, by now, know that scientists can't accurately predict when an earthquake will happen or exactly where. Folks living in Earthquake zones also should know by now that traditional building methods do not hold up during quakes. (However, the alternative is quite expensive. Naturally.)

That's like trying to predict where lightening will strike during a thunder storm. They can give out a large, general area, but can't pinpoint exactly down to the square foot.


What an Italian poltician may look like:

t1.gstatic.com
 
2011-09-17 06:23:07 PM  
Seems to me the safest position for the "Commission of Grand Risks" to take is a "panic if you want" attitude. Honestly, the only two positions anyone in the commission should give are 'maybe' and 'probably'. That's the only way to cover your arse.
 
2011-09-17 06:29:46 PM  

bookman: It's the scientist's own fault. If they had followed the lead of their colleagues in the Climate Change community they would have predicted a 12.0 quake, scared the holy crap out of everyone, and gotten a government grant.


I live with my mom
Obvious troll is obvious.
 
2011-09-17 06:35:55 PM  
Why not try some religious leaders and "psychics"?
 
2011-09-17 06:43:27 PM  

Talon: FTFA:

The prosecution team said...that they know it is not possible to predict an earthquake.

What they are questioning is whether the six scientists and the official on trial, who together constitute Italy's Commission of Grand Risks, did their jobs properly.

...

The local investigator, Inspector Lorenzo Cavallo, said: "The Commission calmed the local population down following a number of earth tremors. After the quake, we heard people's accounts and they told us they changed their behaviour following the advice of the commission.


Sounds like a non-issue to me. They are prosecuting them for calming the population down after some minor tremors instead of fear-mongering and getting the population all worked up and worried about a larger quake that they had no way of knowing would arrive. That's bound to set a bad precedent of scientists crying wolf over every little thing to cover their asses should something come to fruition... ultimately resulting in the population ignoring them when something serious is actually about to happen because they cried wolf so many times before.


Just to reiterate this:


The prosecution team said they never intended to put science on trial, that they know it is not possible to predict an earthquake.

What they are questioning is whether the six scientists and the official on trial, who together constitute Italy's Commission of Grand Risks, did their jobs properly.

That is, did they weigh up all the risks, and communicate these clearly to the authorities seeking their advice?

The local investigator, Inspector Lorenzo Cavallo, said: "The Commission calmed the local population down following a number of earth tremors. After the quake, we heard people's accounts and they told us they changed their behaviour following the advice of the commission.

"It is our duty to investigate what has been said in each case and pass it on to the legal authority."


So, yeah.
 
2011-09-17 06:51:32 PM  

Rik01: I've read articles about the stupidity of the Italian legal and Political system for quite some time and came to the conclusion that, compared to them, our lawmakers and elected officials are armatures.



geolit.org

Our poor politicians definitely need fleshed out with lots of dollars.
 
2011-09-17 06:51:48 PM  

Captain_Ballbeard: Farking Italy, the only thing it's good for is to keep Spain from being the laughingstock of Western Europe.

The only possible results from a successful prosecution can be either nobody wanting to do the job any longer or that those who do simply issue a nationwide warning every morning.

This is nothing more than the govt having to appease an unbelievably ignorant populace.

[1.bp.blogspot.com image 250x125]

Now, what's Spain's excuse? The Moors never conquered Spain, did they?


Moors conquered most of Spain by 790....slowly losing control over the next few centuries....
 
2011-09-17 06:53:29 PM  

Aarontology: Are you f*cking kidding me?


From what little I've seen of Italian politics, it seems normal to posture like this.

When a Formula One driver died in a crash at an Italian course, manslaughter charges were filed against the track.

Basically, "THIS IS SOMEBODY'S FAULT AND I'M GONNA PROSECUTE TILL I FIND 'EM"
 
2011-09-17 06:56:38 PM  

namatad: Procedural Texture: namatad: [The Pope] is God's messenger

Oh wait, you're serious. Bwahahahahaha!

well THAT is what they are indoctrinated to believe ...


so, it's not your opinion? Cos, I believe that ProTex's mirth was gained from that supposition...

/kittens love equally
 
2011-09-17 06:58:07 PM  
In other news: Scientists try to serve a subpoena to God for causing the EarthQuake and therefor murdering hundreds of God fearing peoples.

Subpoena could not be served, due to God being a figment of crazy peoples imaginations(Science has proven it).

The peoples family's, prior to the attack by God, also tried to serve God with a restraining order. But again the document was returned un-served.
 
2011-09-17 07:04:35 PM  

Rik01: Sorry!! I meant AMATURES!


Amateurs.
 
2011-09-17 07:09:17 PM  
i.imgur.com

Which god is the REAL god?
 
2011-09-17 07:18:14 PM  

Mister Peejay: Aarontology: Are you f*cking kidding me?

From what little I've seen of Italian politics, it seems normal to posture like this.

When a Formula One driver died in a crash at an Italian course, manslaughter charges were filed against the track.

Basically, "THIS IS SOMEBODY'S FAULT AND I'M GONNA PROSECUTE TILL I FIND 'EM"


You're thinking of the deaths of Roland Ratzenberger and Ayrton Senna at the 1994 San Marino GP.

IIRC from that incident, it isn't politics, it's simply the way that the Italian legal system works when it comes to inquests. Regardless of likelihood, they file a pro forma charge of manslaughter against the nearest plausible person who might arguably have some responsibility, before gathering and reviewing evidence. In the case of Senna's death, they charged the Williams team and Frank Williams personally.

It seems like this "prosecution" fulfills the role that e.g. a UK Public Inquiry might (recommending ways to make it safer next time) and that the goal is not simply to prosecute someone.
 
2011-09-17 07:21:24 PM  
Ah lawyers. Such a noble profession. Let me just say thanks for everything. Keep up the good work.
 
2011-09-17 07:24:15 PM  

iron de havilland: FTA: The signatories to the letter say the authorities should focus on earthquake protection, instead of pursuing scientists in what some feel is a Galileo-style inquisition.

I didn't expect some kind of Spanish Inquisition.


No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!
 
2011-09-17 07:34:52 PM  
"Let's go burn down the observatory so this never happens again!"
 
2011-09-17 07:51:22 PM  
When I read articles like this I am reminded that the whole world is going to hell. The USA is right along with it but at least were moving a little bit slower than the rest.
 
2011-09-17 08:04:37 PM  
Sigh...the stupid, it infects EVERYTHING!!!!
 
2011-09-17 08:14:54 PM  

namatad: can someone please kill the judge and prosecution already?
seriously

if you are too dumb to understand that we can not predict earthquakes, you are a danger to society.

/shudder


If you read the article, they are claiming the scientist said there was nothing to worry about. Failing to predict an earthquake is not a crime, but claiming to know that their won't be one, that could be a crime.
 
2011-09-17 08:25:30 PM  

bookman: It's the scientist's own fault. If they had followed the lead of their colleagues in the Climate Change community they would have predicted a 12.0 quake, scared the holy crap out of everyone, and gotten a government grant.


nice.
 
2011-09-17 08:32:42 PM  
it is italy. most of the gifted people are working for ferrarri. or making wine.and then just like america some of the retarded end up in politics.
 
2011-09-17 08:37:22 PM  
Cardinal Fang, read the charges!
 
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