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(UPI)   Research indicates generosity is built into human nature, and only through determined effort do most of us successfully overcome it   (upi.com) divider line 73
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2700 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Jul 2011 at 11:56 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2011-07-26 11:43:49 PM  
i586.photobucket.com

The usual bet?
 
2011-07-26 11:57:40 PM  
Like those hard-working Republicans!
 
2011-07-26 11:59:06 PM  
I`d give you a +1 subby, but I`m too cheap
 
2011-07-26 11:59:37 PM  
You too can have an empathy-ectomy if you read the works of Ayn Rand. Works best when applied at age 14.
 
2011-07-27 12:00:09 AM  
Its the truly selfish people who ruin our good will by taking advantage of us.
 
2011-07-27 12:01:11 AM  
This is a total crock a shiat... give me a moment when I stop laughing,.
 
2011-07-27 12:01:48 AM  
It's a finely honed system that insures that we peons are just broke enough to tread water long enough to have the privilege to transfer money from one millionaire to another via our paychecks. Who can afford generosity when the system's not built for it?
 
2011-07-27 12:03:45 AM  
Yeah, altruism is built into us, for our in groups.

Fark the out groups though.
 
2011-07-27 12:04:54 AM  
I never heard an economist say generosity was irrational.
 
2011-07-27 12:08:27 AM  
FTFA:
"When past researchers carefully measured people's choices, they found that people all over the world were more generous than the reigning theories of economics and biology predicted they should be," Krasnow says in a statement. "Even when people believe the interaction to be one-time only, they are often generous to the person they are interacting with."

It makes all kinds of sense when you realize that there's more than just the two primary parties involved. Humans are social animals, and we watch the other ones in our group. If you dick over a visitor while your fellow tribe members are watching, they'll remember you being a dick.

If they know you're a dick, they might just kick your grasping ass out of the group.

And a human alone in the wilderness is absolutely farked. Leopards come to eat you when you live alone.
 
2011-07-27 12:09:38 AM  
I give about half of my take-home salary to charity, so I'm getting a kick out of this thread.
 
2011-07-27 12:09:48 AM  
Generosity just enables the weak to remain weak. It's immoral.

/so I hear
 
2011-07-27 12:10:32 AM  
Can't they just study babies who haven't been socialized yet to figure this stuff out?

They always want to share their yucky mushy food with you.
 
2011-07-27 12:11:28 AM  
TFH:Research indicates generosity is built into human nature, and only through determined effort do most of us Republicans successfully overcome it

FTFY, subby.
 
2011-07-27 12:11:40 AM  

twfeline: I give about half of my take-home salary to charity, so I'm getting a kick out of this thread.


Good for you.

/seriously, gfy
//hope i can afford to do that soon
 
2011-07-27 12:12:39 AM  

Pinksprite: Can't they just study babies who haven't been socialized yet to figure this stuff out?

They always want to share their yucky mushy food with you.


But not their pacifier.
 
2011-07-27 12:13:32 AM  
Sgygus 2011-07-27 12:09:48 AM
Generosity just enables the weak to remain weak. It's immoral.

/so I hear


Dude....don't be a "dentist".

/better not be obscure
 
2011-07-27 12:13:39 AM  
I"m currently embezzling a quarter of a million dollars from a charity, so I'm getting a kick out of this tread.
 
2011-07-27 12:16:43 AM  

Rhino_man: TFH:Research indicates generosity is built into human nature, and only through determined effort do most of us Republicans politicians successfully overcome it

FTFY, subby.

Ditto.

img232.imageshack.us
 
2011-07-27 12:19:09 AM  
How are they controlling for "societal pressures" or nurture? I imagine there's plenty of research showing biological and evolutionary evidence of instinctual greed and acquisition as well.
 
2011-07-27 12:19:22 AM  
But the Republicans told me "I got mine, fark you" was the one true path in life. Now I'm confused. Someone help me out here.
 
2011-07-27 12:19:46 AM  

meat0918: Yeah, altruism is built into us, for our in groups.

Fark the out groups though.



^This is man is a genius.^

Unless he's an outsider. Then he's just some asshat that's been copying my work.
 
2011-07-27 12:23:03 AM  
".....generosity is built into human nature....."

Christians: NOOOOO!! It is thanks to Jeeeeeesuuuus!!!!!
 
2011-07-27 12:24:44 AM  
Generosity is built into human nature, up until the point where we think we are being taken advantage of. Nothing will cause a person to clam up faster than being convinced that he's being played for a sucker.
 
2011-07-27 12:33:31 AM  

twfeline: I give about half of my take-home salary to charity, so I'm getting a kick out of this thread.


About half my income goes toward nature via ammo and fishing equipment
 
2011-07-27 12:36:08 AM  

relcec: I never heard an economist say generosity was irrational.


Not that generosity in general is irrational, but that generosity when you have no expectation of any return is irrational.

The rational agent in an economic situation will act in a method that will provide the biggest return (considering both the short and long-term). If you have absolutely no reason to believe you will EVER see a specific individual again, as a rational agent you should make choices that benefit yourself over them... and yet we don't. That sort of generosity is economically irrational.
 
2011-07-27 12:36:32 AM  
I think we're just super adaptive. Anyone who has raised kids know they all try everything. Every kid will try lying and stealing. Every kid will try being kind and generous. Every kid will try shoving the other kids out of the way to get ahead.

The things that work are the things that stick. If you don't pick up on your kids' lies, and they generally get away with them, the kid will be a liar. Most people reward their kids for doing the right thing, and punish them for being overly selfish, because we're social creatures and we think those are positive traits, so most people learn at least some amount of good social behavior.

But there are an awful lot of clueless or neglectful parents, who don't discipline their kids' bad behavior, so we also have a lot of jerks who don't see anything wrong with screwing the rest of us to get what they want.

I don't think much is "built in," other than the tendency to try out different behaviors.
 
2011-07-27 12:43:02 AM  

Talon: relcec: I never heard an economist say generosity was irrational.

Not that generosity in general is irrational, but that generosity when you have no expectation of any return is irrational.

The rational agent in an economic situation will act in a method that will provide the biggest return (considering both the short and long-term). If you have absolutely no reason to believe you will EVER see a specific individual again, as a rational agent actor you should make choices that benefit yourself over them... and yet we don't. That sort of generosity is economically irrational.


Agency has an entirely different set of issues attached to it.

/Not actually important to understanding your point, but actually correct.
 
2011-07-27 12:44:35 AM  
Also, it's just a goddamn piece of paper!
 
2011-07-27 12:48:49 AM  
Talon
generosity is economically irrational.

It's self evident, humans don't always behave rationally nor do they behave within the confines of economic philosophy

/that's my 40 oz...errr 750ml wine philosphy for the night..yeah I'm drunk and bored
//got nutin'
 
2011-07-27 12:51:02 AM  
Get taken advantage of often enough, and you're generosity dies.
 
2011-07-27 12:55:21 AM  
Come to think of it, this happens to me every time a chunky chick walks up to me at the bar. I'm always like, "Hey, nice hair!"
I thought I was nice, but now they tell me it's just my monkey fore fathers picking fleas off other monkey's heads.
 
2011-07-27 12:56:10 AM  
That's kind of a short article and I'd love to see the extensive research the author uses to make his point; given the reams of studies that pretty conclusively show that altruism (as opposed to generosity) towards one's own group--defined as blood relations and relations by marriage, and then more remotely to outsiders accepted into one's society--may be ingrained; but actual GENEROSITY is not.

Chimpanzees are certainly altruistic, insofar as they'll share food with their troop-mates, but they're not particularly generous in giving their troop-mates EXTRA food in return for nothing.
 
2011-07-27 01:02:40 AM  
Compassion is what separates us between every other creature on the planet.

/DNRTFA
 
2011-07-27 01:02:49 AM  

Gyrfalcon: That's kind of a short article and I'd love to see the extensive research the author uses to make his point; given the reams of studies that pretty conclusively show that altruism (as opposed to generosity) towards one's own group--defined as blood relations and relations by marriage, and then more remotely to outsiders accepted into one's society--may be ingrained; but actual GENEROSITY is not.

Chimpanzees are certainly altruistic, insofar as they'll share food with their troop-mates, but they're not particularly generous in giving their troop-mates EXTRA food in return for nothing.



In-group altruism - also known as nationalism, racism, etc.

It served us well as a species through most of our history, and now is widely condemned as "evil".
 
2011-07-27 01:03:44 AM  

Amdam: Compassion is what separates us between every other creature on the planet.

/DNRTFA



Also never owned a dog, apparently.
 
2011-07-27 01:05:04 AM  
Amos Quito: racism

Interestingly enough the concept of race is rather recent. Also it's a completely arbitrary construct. Nationalism as we think of it is also fairly recent.
 
2011-07-27 01:05:22 AM  
There's no such thing as irrational in economics. The only time I see anyone talk about irrational behavior in economics is when it's some non-economist talking about it.

All behavior is rational. What differs from person to person is how they weigh the costs and benefits; if they all get identical information - and if they do, do they all interpret it the same way; does everyone take into account secondary/long-term effects, etc. No behavior is irrational. That doesn't mean that the person can't be insane or stupid, or that they can't make bad decisions, just that their behavior makes sense to them (at the time).

In this case, maybe the personal benefit provides value outweighs the cost - even if you never see the person again, you still feel good about helping them.

But plenty of animals display generous behavior as well when taken out of survival situations - especially apes. So I don't see why generosity can't be instinctual?
 
2011-07-27 01:06:24 AM  

Talon: relcec: I never heard an economist say generosity was irrational.

Not that generosity in general is irrational, but that generosity when you have no expectation of any return is irrational.

The rational agent in an economic situation will act in a method that will provide the biggest return (considering both the short and long-term). If you have absolutely no reason to believe you will EVER see a specific individual again, as a rational agent you should make choices that benefit yourself over them... and yet we don't. That sort of generosity is economically irrational.


If you tie generosity into compassion, then I would say that it is perfectly rational to act generously regardless of tangible returns.
 
2011-07-27 01:07:38 AM  

AcneVulgaris: Get taken advantage of often enough, and you're generosity dies.


What happens when you misspell "your" often enough?
 
2011-07-27 01:12:37 AM  
Atheist_Republican: All behavior is rational.

There's a lot of economists who would take issue with that.
 
2011-07-27 01:16:07 AM  
Stupidity and the Derp are inherited, just like obscene wealth. In many cases, at the same time.
 
2011-07-27 01:16:18 AM  
Unless you're an atheist in which case you can't be that part of the human race that is blessed with compassion.

God blesses my religion
 
2011-07-27 01:20:46 AM  

meat0918: Yeah, altruism is built into us, for our in groups.

Fark the out groups though.


Which out groups - utlanning, framling, ramen or varelse?

/not obscure here, too many nerds
 
2011-07-27 01:29:24 AM  

AcneVulgaris: Get taken advantage of often enough, and you're generosity dies.


This.

Generosity is serving someone else's goals or needs.
Being taken advantage of is when your own goals or needs are unfulfilled, whilst being unappreciated by the person you are showing care toward..

Lord how many women I have know who don't seem to have a single moral thread to desire to learn this simple lesson in life.

Scratch that.
They know it well, especially amongst their own gender. They just play people on it. Especially us guys. Toward us men, we're seen nothing more as an expectation for servicing their needs. A tool.

And the moment you'd applicate a little gratitude or care, they drop you like a lead weight. To much drama.

When it is they who weave the web of drama and deceit.

Man I have been with some cold biatches. In complex situations.
Believe me, after much time, I tried to explain it to them, I really did.
Logic, feeling, process and all.

Now only to be an echo here on Fark.

/Not saying men are great for bouncing from one lady to another for sex, its pathetic.

//However, when are we going to start putting a check on these free spirited ladies who just breeze through men all at once for MUCH MUCH more than sex, FOR YEARS ON END!

///Who achieves their goals through more dubious means? It is not hard to keep score.

*male gender is weak, wish you dimwits would get your heads straight, start believing in dignity and honor once again.
 
2011-07-27 01:41:49 AM  

WhyteRaven74: Amos Quito: racism

Interestingly enough the concept of race is rather recent. Also it's a completely arbitrary construct. Nationalism as we think of it is also fairly recent.



That we call these things "racism" and "nationalism" may be fairly recent, but both are extensions of tribalism and extended family which are as old as our ability to differentiate "like us" from "not like us". As social animals, we have lived in groups - families, tribes, villages, cities, "nations" - usually comprised of fairly closely related genetic brethren (and sisteren) throughout most of our history as mankind.

Groups interacted and competed with other groups, and where in-group altruism tended to benefit the group (and by extension, the individual), generosity toward out-group members tended not to benefit the group (and by extension, the individual). The closer the relationship to the beneficiary, greater the likelihood that the "altruistic" act would in turn benefit the individual and/or their offspring - the "warp drive" of evolution and life itself.

Through most of human history, the races were largely separated by geography, and most groups were relatively small. As humanity advanced technologically, the lines of geographic separation blurred, and tribes evolved into cities, states and nations - but we have largely retained those instinctive traits of differentiating "like me" from "not like me" to this day.

Whether this natural discrimination serves us given our current technologically driven state of social evolution is another matter.
 
2011-07-27 01:42:15 AM  
Can't afford to be generous, some black guy is hell bent on taking that portion of my budget.
 
2011-07-27 01:44:31 AM  
But capitalism is still the only economic system even worthy of consideration. Infa 100%
 
2011-07-27 01:50:34 AM  

Amos Quito: WhyteRaven74: Amos Quito: racism

Interestingly enough the concept of race is rather recent. Also it's a completely arbitrary construct. Nationalism as we think of it is also fairly recent.


That we call these things "racism" and "nationalism" may be fairly recent, but both are extensions of tribalism and extended family which are as old as our ability to differentiate "like us" from "not like us". As social animals, we have lived in groups - families, tribes, villages, cities, "nations" - usually comprised of fairly closely related genetic brethren (and sisteren) throughout most of our history as mankind.

Groups interacted and competed with other groups, and where in-group altruism tended to benefit the group (and by extension, the individual), generosity toward out-group members tended not to benefit the group (and by extension, the individual). The closer the relationship to the beneficiary, greater the likelihood that the "altruistic" act would in turn benefit the individual and/or their offspring - the "warp drive" of evolution and life itself.

Through most of human history, the races were largely separated by geography, and most groups were relatively small. As humanity advanced technologically, the lines of geographic separation blurred, and tribes evolved into cities, states and nations - but we have largely retained those instinctive traits of differentiating "like me" from "not like me" to this day.

Whether this natural discrimination serves us given our current technologically driven state of social evolution is another matter.


Ah, a fellow anthropologist here, I see. ;)
 
2011-07-27 02:05:24 AM  
Amos Quito: Through most of human history, the races were largely separated by geography, a

Asians, Africans and Europeans haven't been separate for quite a long time. The Romans were familiar with both sub-Saharan Africans as well as Asians from eastern Asia. Two thousand years ago you could easily travel from Damascus to modern day India thanks to the trade routes that existed. Also what constitutes an outsider hasn't necessarily been very much to overcome. Any free man who could converse in the local dialect of Greek spoken in a Greek state was considered Greek, regardless of where he came from.
 
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