nekom: Cameron Todd Willingham was as white and non-hispanic as I am, and he got farked over

Willingham didnt get farked over. That man roasted his own three children alive and danced on their ashes. Yeah, a quack scientists (hired by the innocence project) looked at evidence photos a decade later and said there "could have been" possible alternative explanation. Thats it. No conclusive scientific finding of innocence. The quack didnt even say it wasn't arson. He said some of the many clues of arson might have been caused by something else. He didnt commenbt on the three bottles of empty charcoal lighter fluid outside the front door. He didnt comment on the confession. He didnt even bother to interview the firemen and fire investigators that sifted through the ashes. He looked at some old photos.

Don't believe everything you read in the New Yorker. It is a good magazine but sometimes it passes off half-baked advocacy as "news."

I'm liberal, was an Obama delegate, and wouldn't vote for Perry for Dog Catcher ... but I have to back him up on this one. Willingham was a monster who deserved to be burned at the stake. Lethal injection was too good for him.

gunsmack: Did he let the the 16yo girl he raped and murdered seek legal counsel first?

/well then, fark him

And thanks to laws we let morons voice their opinions. Do you honestly think the more intelligent folk would appreciate it if there were laws that kept morons from opening their traps? Seriously, think about it, you would never be able to talk again.

Point is. I think you are dumb. I don't like listening to dumb people. But I agree with blanket laws that protect people in a positive way. Texas just skipped right by one of those blanket laws. No one is debating this guy is guilty. People against capital punishment may debate that he shouldn't be killed but I personally think he needed killin'. Texas is not above the law and should have followed the rules.

Someone in Texas needs to go to federal prison. The US government needs to show who is actually in power.

So everyone saying that he should not have been executed because Texas did not advise him of his rights. How exactly is a law enforcement office supposed to know when someone is a Mexican National when no one can "check his papers"?

And say they did say ok, we didn't advise you of your rights...do over...and try him again. I guess you would want any statements he has made in the past inadmissible in court too right?

Dear Mexico: When you can keep your precious citizens on your side of the border, you can have a say in the matter. Until then, the quicker we put your rats down, the less plague they can spread.

Dear UN: See this? Feel free to suck it.

This bastard deserved far worse than the US justice system permits, and no doubt had a good daily laugh that we let him live an extra 16 years before putting him down painlessly. Yeah, we should have given him "back" - To Jordan. He could have "lived" through the summer while the diplomats piss and moan about releasing a poor defenseless murdering rapist, enjoying his daily genital electrocution.

Avery614: Bossk'sSegway: cig-mkr: I always thought that people have to obey the laws of the country they are in. Like the kid that got flogged in Singapore, when in Rome. Therefore if you commit a murder in America you get a trial and pay your dues.

The kid in singapore had his sentence reduced because of intervention by Bill Clinton who asked for clemency.

Looks like we won't be getting any reduced sentences from Mexico anytime soon.

For this Mexico should just say "fark it! I'm not being apart of your war on drugs."

OgreMagi: When have they been a part of it? They've been a part of the "take money from stupid gringos" club for decades, though.

Which is why the U.S. should just be done with Mexico and annex all territory between Texas and the Panama Canal. Solves two problems, first, no more boarder issues, the canal should be much easier to defend than that long border we have now. Second, after we use an insurgency from the cartels as a reason to bomb the hell out of the country for a few years, the bang we get a large third world work force we can exploit for cheaper mfg. goods, farm labor and natural resources like oil, coal etc.

I mean really as long as we are violating our own treaties and international law and protocol, we may as well make sure manifest destiny spreads from north (looking at you next Canada) to south. Viva la United States of the Western Hemisphere.

I am ok with this...I really do not care what the U.N. thinks it is an origination that only exist because the United States allows it to. Despite it being a joke. US Supreme Court is the arbiter of the law for Americans....fark off and be glad we are not thinking about nuking you.

Bossk'sSegway
For this Mexico should just say "fark it! I'm not being apart of your war on drugs."

ROFLMAO

Texas doesn't have to obey any law with regard to Mexico.
Texas already beat in a war.
Mexico knows better than to try again.

Transubstantive: CanisNoir: So does this mean that cops *have* to ask for citizenship proof now when arresting people for other crimes or is that still profiling brown people and akin to Hitler?

You miss the point (how shocking). If you are charging someone with a crime, THEN you inquire about citizenship status, so you can notify the proper officials as is FARKING required under international treaties we expect everyone else to follow!

/but the US is so great they don't have to
//next American to get charged with a serious crime in Mexico is farked because of a right that Texas refused to give even though it would have probably made no difference in this case

the sick bastard lived here since he was 2. the asshole probably didn't even consider his own mexican citizenship and did not bring this up until long after he was convicted. he wasn't denied anything because he never asked for it (until years after he was convicted of raping a murdering a 16 year old girl). they pulled this out of their ass as a last ditch effort to squeeze a few more months into an already worthless life.

For 16 years, Leal has exercised his right to file appeals and motions so extensively, one judge in federal district court called his case "one of the most procedurally convoluted and complex habeas corpus proceedings" he ever reviewed.

Ain't No Party Like A Tea Party: Since they've already UN-nazied the world, maybe they can UN-stupid Texas too.

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The UN was formed after WWII, not during it.

gwydion56: As usual, no one seems to have actually read the article.

Under International Law, he had the right to have LEGAL ADVICE from the Mexican consulate, NOT a free trip back to Mexico. If Texas had complied with International Law, he would still have been tried, convicted, and put to death.

So, why should I care that Texas ignored International Law, when the result would have been the same either way?

FTFA: Neuland said the case underscores the importance of the act's passage. "If we don't protect the rights of non-Americans in the United States, we seriously risk reciprocal lack of access to our own citizens overseas," she said.

There is the point. We should comply with International Law so that you and I will have the same access to American Consulates when we are arrested in another country. A country which, hard as it is to believe, might have a worse judicial system than Texas.



Well, when you travel abroad don't rape and murder any 16 year olds and you'll be all set, right?

Thoguh: jj325: It's all fun and games breaking treaties until some rich and spoiled US kid gets busted for drugs in Mexico and they don't let him contact the consulate.\

This times 1,000,000. We seem to have forgot that "treat others how you expect to be treated" isn't just a sunday school lesson. That's why stuff like following treaties and not torturing is so important.

If the rich spoiled kid had lived in Mexico since he was two years old, then maybe the situations would be equivalent.

Leal, who was convicted for the 1994 rape and murder of a 16-year-old girl, was executed Thursday evening by lethal injection in Texas.

Sounds like he got what he deserved.

The derp in this thread is off the charts. Even for fark, there is some grade A stupid in this thread. Who needs logic, context, or the rule of law when you can get emotional and lynch mob-y?

Transubstantive: CanisNoir: So does this mean that cops *have* to ask for citizenship proof now when arresting people for other crimes or is that still profiling brown people and akin to Hitler?

You miss the point (how shocking). If you are charging someone with a crime, THEN you inquire about citizenship status, so you can notify the proper officials as is FARKING required under international treaties we expect everyone else to follow!

Actually, you just re-stated his point exactly. In this case, nobody knew the guy was a Mexican national since he had been living in the US since he was an infant. Why would the police assume that he wasn't a citizen? Because he's brown? What kind of a racist are you?

Loadmaster: Leal, who was convicted for the 1994 rape and murder of a 16-year-old girl, was executed Thursday evening by lethal injection in Texas. Sounds like he got what he deserved.

If he did it.

MeinRS6: If we did something that the UN doesn't like, then that means we did the right thing.

This. About that "never again" thing... Never mind *insert sub-Saharan country here*.

Screw them.

FloydA: MeinRS6: If we did something that the UN doesn't like, then that means we did the right thing.

Yeah, human rights are bad!

Ah yes... The UN. Stalwart defenders of human rights.

This actually seems like a kind of pussy move by the SCOTUS. They didn't just rule on this particular case, they set precedent that foreign nationals cannot petition federal courts without congress enacting a law allowing them to.

Hmmmm, where do we have a bunch of foreign nationals with no rights and no ability to get a fair hearing (or any hearing at all)?

SDRR: gwydion56: As usual, no one seems to have actually read the article.

Under International Law, he had the right to have LEGAL ADVICE from the Mexican consulate, NOT a free trip back to Mexico. If Texas had complied with International Law, he would still have been tried, convicted, and put to death.

So, why should I care that Texas ignored International Law, when the result would have been the same either way?

FTFA: Neuland said the case underscores the importance of the act's passage. "If we don't protect the rights of non-Americans in the United States, we seriously risk reciprocal lack of access to our own citizens overseas," she said.

There is the point. We should comply with International Law so that you and I will have the same access to American Consulates when we are arrested in another country. A country which, hard as it is to believe, might have a worse judicial system than Texas.



Well, when you travel abroad don't rape and murder any 16 year olds and you'll be all set, right?

It really doesn't matter if you do it or not, just don't be accused and you're golden.

Jesus. It's not like the villagers threw a rope over a tree limb the day after he was arrested. He was represented by lawyers in a legal process that lasted 17 years, and was reviewed at every appellate level, to include the US Supreme Court.

You might argue that a technical detail of a UN rule was violated, but what you can NOT say is that this admitted murderer was treated unfairly! And isn't that really the point of any judicial system?

FloydA: jehovahs witness protection: FloydA: MeinRS6: If we did something that the UN doesn't like, then that means we did the right thing.

Yeah, human rights are bad!

Yeah, like the rights of the girl he raped and murdered.


No, Garcia deserved the punishment he got. He won't be missed.

The point I was making is that the UN supports human rights. MeinRS6 says he disapproves of everything the UN does. Therefore MeinRS6 disapproves of human rights.

I like the color red. That makes me a nazi.

misanthropic1: The derp in this thread is off the charts. Even for fark, there is some grade A stupid in this thread. Who needs logic, context, or the rule of law when you can get emotional and lynch mob-y?

lynch mob-y?

"For 16 years, Leal has exercised his right to file appeals and motions so extensively, one judge in federal district court called his case "one of the most procedurally convoluted and complex habeas corpus proceedings" he ever reviewed."

He simple got what he deserved, finally. he admitted the crimes so all the arguing can stop now...

JerkStore: This actually seems like a kind of pussy move by the SCOTUS. They didn't just rule on this particular case, they set precedent that foreign nationals cannot petition federal courts without congress enacting a law allowing them to.

Hmmmm, where do we have a bunch of foreign nationals with no rights and no ability to get a fair hearing (or any hearing at all)?

Oh shiat... I hadn't even thought about that...

Raped and murdered a girl in the 90's?

Glenn Beck?

The Bestest: The First Four Katy Perry Albums: Before I came into this thread, I knew there would be a lot of people here who cared more about this piece of shiat's worthless life than the life he stole from that teenage girl.

I care about due process and abiding by treaties. I haven't seen a SINGLE post defending HIM. Neither he, nor what he did, (nor the victim for that matter) is the issue here.

No, the victem and the criminal are exactly the issue here. He murdered an innocent child (after raping her) and some douchebag lawyers and politicians are trying to make an issue out of bullshiat. fark him they should dig him up and execute him again.

Poor decision. It's likely going to end up causing significant harm to an innocent party down the line. Not that Texas or the right wings on the Supreme Court care; so long as they got to kill someone they're happy. Got to sate their bloodlust.

Meh Texas has this special circular filing cabinet for complaints from non Texans. It has a bottom that opens to a pool of lava for non American complaints.

Reality is though this shouldn't be happening. Its a treaty that is supposed to be a Federal level issue. However apparently the system has a hole in it that lets it become a state's choice if the country meets its treaty obligations. Congress needs to stop kicking the can and deal with it but they're too busy playing chicken with the economy and trying to enact social changes than deal with actual legal issues that don't make for good oneliners.

bigdavediode: Loadmaster: Leal, who was convicted for the 1994 rape and murder of a 16-year-old girl, was executed Thursday evening by lethal injection in Texas. Sounds like he got what he deserved.

If he did it.

"I have hurt a lot of people. ... I take full blame for everything. I am sorry for what I did," he said in the death chamber.

jehovahs witness protection: FloydA: MeinRS6: If we did something that the UN doesn't like, then that means we did the right thing.

Yeah, human rights are bad!

Yeah, like the rights of the girl he raped and murdered.

In 1990?
/Sorry had to

FloydA: jehovahs witness protection: FloydA: MeinRS6: If we did something that the UN doesn't like, then that means we did the right thing.

Yeah, human rights are bad!

Yeah, like the rights of the girl he raped and murdered.


No, Garcia deserved the punishment he got. He won't be missed.

The point I was making is that the UN supports human rights. MeinRS6 says he disapproves of everything the UN does. Therefore MeinRS6 disapproves of human rights.

They especially love the Palestinian human right of shooting rockets at evil joos.

I am sending a strong letter back to them.

G.

Take that!

If you've got the brain power to rape and murder a child, you've got the brain power to sit in the chair. Do the crime, do the time. "Ignorance of the law is not a defence."

I see your argument, and raise this complimentary argument for your consideration:

In order to be a homo sapiens, one must merely be the offspring of two homo sapiens parents. There is a critical yet important distinction that must be made between calling someone a "human being" and calling a creature a homo sapiens. To be a human being, one must have the capacity to behave as a member of a society, as we humans are social animals and take great pride in the accomplishments of our societies. We must also be capable of, if not regularly display, rational thinking. Rational thinking is what has brought us the skills and knowledge that we have used to build the physical and logical constructs that power our world. One must also be able to have empathy for other humans and other creatures. We value compassion and we care for our fellow humans, as we understand that at some point, we too, may be subject to the hazards that have befallen our neighbors.
All three of these are necessary conditions to be human. A homo sapiens that lacks one of these is not a human being, but a dangerous animal that occupies a human body. The act of rape is an overt display of the lack of empathy for fellow humans, and further displays that the animal lacks the capacity for empathy for a human, as it is a deliberate, violent act upon a person's dignity. It provides no rational benefit for the perpetrator, and therefore is merely the display of violent and dangerous compulsions within one creature. The perpetrator is not a human being, but merely a dangerous homo sapiens animal.
We allow many animals to exist with us. We keep pets in our homes for companionship and entertainment, we domesticate animals for food and entertainment, and we encourage the growth of populations of wild decorative species--we are, after all, empathetic towards other creatures. We do not, however, allow dangerous animals to exist in our society. We kill them and dispose of the remains. It is therefore both rational and in the best interest of our society that animals such as this rapist and murderer be killed using whatever convenient means is available, and their carcasses discarded in the refuse.

Transubstantive: To all the "legal scholars" who are saying "he never asked for the consulate so tough shiat," as part of the treaty that was signed and ratified by the United States, we have a duty to tell foreign nationals that they have a right to talk with their consulate. It would be like saying nobody asked about their Miranda rights so they have no right to have an attorney present. In short, you are stupid.

Except that it seems that he told the police he was a US citizen when he was arrested. Once they were told that, why would they make sure that he's got consular rights? If I'm Mirandized and tell the cops my brother is a lawyer, can I have my conviction thrown out because he's actually a roofer with a nice suit, so they didn't give me access to a lawyer?

That's the one bit of information that I'd be interested in: When did anyone know that he wasn't a US citizen? Did the cops know when they arrested him or did it come out weeks later when he already had a lawyer? If he lied to the cops, then this whole argument seem moot to me.

The conservative Supreme Court is a joke.

I will go even further than the UN and argue that Leal should have had his death sentence commuted to life imprisonment without parole and that he should have been released into the general prison population.

Of course, a rapist-murderer of a sixteen year old kid might not be particularly *popular* with the general prison population.

People who are worried this will cause problems for Americans in Mexico need to get out more. If you have dealings with the Mexican police, it is almost always something to do with bribes. That has long been the accepted "justice" as practiced by the Mexican police. Nothing will change.

JerkStore: This actually seems like a kind of pussy move by the SCOTUS. They didn't just rule on this particular case, they set precedent that foreign nationals cannot petition federal courts without congress enacting a law allowing them to.

No, they set precedent that they can petition all they like, but federal courts don't have jurisdiction over violations of state laws which are complicit with federal law.

MeinRS6: If we did something that the UN doesn't like, then that means we did the right thing.

I'm pretty sure there are members of the UN that are eating, sleeping, and breathing right now. Maybe you should get on that.

Cyclometh: This text is now purple: There's no Constitutional issue here. SCOTUS ruled it was Constitutional. End of story. Under the Constitution, the legislative had to enact laws to enforce the treaty. They neglected to do so. That's an issue for treaty compliance, but the Constitution and the agreement between the several states doesn't give two shiats what treaty you signed or whether you're following it.

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding.

Let me break it down for you.

Supreme Law of Land, by priority:
This Constitution,
and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof;
and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States
State constitutions
State laws

Constitution>Federal>Treaty>State

Federal did not pass law requiring state crimes to consult consulates. Federal>Treaty. There was no Authority of the United States which implemented that law. It's been rattling around Congress for a couple of years now. SCOTUS can't suspend a sentence based on what Congress *might* do. No one can predict that kind of stupidity.

This text is now purple: Ain't No Party Like A Tea Party: Since they've already UN-nazied the world, maybe they can UN-stupid Texas too.

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The UN was formed after WWII, not during it.



/I'm not as stupid as one might think.
//Maybe I am.
///Watch the movie sometime, it's prophetic.