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(Washington Post)   D.C. officially opens yet another museum to depress the hell out of you   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 46
    More: Sad, District of Columbia, Laogai Museum, labor camps, communist state, laogai, forced labour  
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16064 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Jun 2011 at 1:10 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
 
2011-06-28 09:35:35 AM
We're good at that. My Dad is in town working on the Armenian Genocide Museum, so that should be uplifting.
 
2011-06-28 11:12:17 AM
farm6.static.flickr.com
I don't know, it doesn't look too bad.
 
2011-06-28 11:45:15 AM
Is it located anywhere near this exhibit?
www.garywinberg.com
 
2011-06-28 01:10:22 PM

Schmoppo: Is it located anywhere near this exhibit?


Is that from The Body? If so I believe that is a traveling exhibit; and it was utterly fascinating/creepy.
 
2011-06-28 01:15:51 PM
In b4 the "There are human rights abuses in the USA, ergo we are exactly as bad as China in exactly the same ways LOL QED" crowd.
 
2011-06-28 01:16:36 PM
A) Oh, China's gonna pitch an absolute shiat hemmorhage over this.
B) Tough noogies.
 
2011-06-28 01:19:27 PM
Actually we in the U.S.A., are on the whole, abused much less than in most of the world's countries, especially Third World ones.

Perhaps I was wrong all those years I argued against exporting democracy.
 
2011-06-28 01:20:11 PM

Schmoppo: Is it located anywhere near this exhibit?


God, those things disgust me. I refuse to enter a museum when those are in display
 
2011-06-28 01:22:18 PM
I remember that episode of Avatar, the one where Zuko set Appa free.
 
2011-06-28 01:22:42 PM
Another contestant for DC's "Culturally important but depressing as hell." museum title.
 
2011-06-28 01:23:52 PM
I'll skip this one. It's not that I don't care. It's that I already know that the Chinese abuse human rights and there's nothing I can do about it. The Chinese government doesn't solicit my opinion very often.
 
2011-06-28 01:24:14 PM
Meh. I'll stick with the National Air and Space Museum...much less depressing, and all the Chinese stuff is in the gift shops.
 
2011-06-28 01:27:06 PM

Gosling: A) Oh, China's gonna pitch an absolute shiat hemmorhage over this.
B) Tough noogies.


Yeah, oh well, we offended China.

Okay, so what are they going to do about it?

While they have a lot of economic leverage on us, it works both ways. All those Chinese millionaires and economic growth are built on trade. Do anything to impair that and we both suffer.

We don't like their human rights record. The very concept of "human rights" is not exactly well rooted in Chinese culture and tradition, they are usually more on the idea of a harmonious society instead of individuals demanding rights. Just because they are different doesn't mean they are right though.
 
2011-06-28 01:27:11 PM

vartian: Schmoppo: Is it located anywhere near this exhibit?

Is that from The Body? If so I believe that is a traveling exhibit; and it was utterly fascinating/creepy.


That's from Bodies: The Exhibition. I assume that he is making a reference to the controversy over the origin of the bodies used in the exhibit, namely the ones that were donated by the Chinese government police (some of which may or may not be the remains of political prisoners).
 
2011-06-28 01:27:13 PM

vartian: Is that from The Body? If so I believe that is a traveling exhibit; and it was utterly fascinating/creepy.


When it hit Chicago we visited. We had 3 people out of our group of 20 pass out. I damn near threw up. But it was cool.
 
2011-06-28 01:28:03 PM
Good. There is no such thing as too many reminders about the evils that come out of statism and totalitarianism.
 
2011-06-28 01:31:48 PM
Is this going to be right next to the Guantanamo Abu Ghraib museum?

/I keed
//sorta
///China is way worse than us in human rights violations, IMO.
////slashies
 
2011-06-28 01:34:25 PM

Silverstaff: Just because they are different doesn't mean they are right though.


Yes, but it doesn't mean that they are wrong either. The Chinese people don't focus on the individual as Westerners, but that's not what the human rights abuses in China is about. It's about the fact that the slightest dissension can get you spirited way to who knows where to become a political prisoner.
 
2011-06-28 01:35:35 PM
Is it going to be directed by Joel Schumacher?
 
2011-06-28 01:36:41 PM

david1963: Actually we in the U.S.A., are on the whole, abused much less than in most of the world's countries, especially Third World ones.

Perhaps I was wrong all those years I argued against exporting democracy.


democracy
a : government by the people; especially : rule of the majority b : a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections


By its nature democracy can't be exported. You need the population to seize it. The United States got aid from France, but France didn't come in and "liberate" us.

Also the US lacks the moral standing for that. Some of the worst offenders of human rights (Pinochet, Iran) came because the US usurped democracy in those countries.
 
2011-06-28 01:38:04 PM
I toured the Museum of American War Atrocities in Saigon a few years back (recently renamed the Vietnam War Remnants Museum). Political spin aside, the US could really use a museum that is R-Rated when it comes to war. Saw things there that would never make it into the Smithsonian. Horrible stuff, but I think important stuff to consider, especially now that we're in the US's first era of "continual war". I post in this thread because I think the US is too quick to throw stones on human rights, especially when collateral damage and CIA interference with domestic politics comes into play.

blog.lib.umn.edu
 
2011-06-28 01:42:38 PM
D.C. officially opens yet another museum to depress the hell out of you

It's actually a museum that existed before, but was retconned out of existence by Crisis, then brought back into continuity during Final Crisis.
 
2011-06-28 01:44:38 PM

Schmoppo: Is it located anywhere near this exhibit?


It is also made up of mostly non-volenteer chinese people who were executed.
 
2011-06-28 01:47:06 PM
Silverstaff

While they have a lot of economic leverage on us, it works both ways.


Really?
China commits Tiananmen square massacre - bush (first and worst) grants MFN
Further abuses come to light / threatens nuclear strike on US - clinton renews (twice) china's MFN status
China downs and confiscates US military plane - bush (the second) renews MFN status

Consequences are where?
 
2011-06-28 01:55:22 PM
It isn't like that museum would ever open in China.
 
2011-06-28 02:28:42 PM
FTFA :"I'm not aware of those numbers," said Wang Baodong, spokesman of the Embassy of China in Washington. "This museum is politically motivated. It's against China and the Chinese government. He hates the Chinese government."

Ya THINK?
 
2011-06-28 02:30:28 PM
I'm holding out for the Puppies and Kittens that were Maimed or Killed in Traffic museum.
 
2011-06-28 02:31:27 PM

MonkeyAngst: D.C. officially opens yet another museum to depress the hell out of you

It's actually a museum that existed before, but was retconned out of existence by Crisis, then brought back into continuity during Final Crisis.


Came for the comic reference. Leaving satisfied.
 
2011-06-28 02:47:52 PM

ArkAngel: Schmoppo: Is it located anywhere near this exhibit?

God, those things disgust me. I refuse to enter a museum when those are in display


Pansy. It's not meant to be a display of blood and gore, but to each his own. I found it fascinating when it was in Durham, NC a few years ago.

WHY DO YOU HATE YOUR GUTS???
 
2011-06-28 03:00:18 PM
Opened.
 
2011-06-28 03:02:07 PM

fanbladesaresharp: Pansy. It's not meant to be a display of blood and gore, but to each his own. I found it fascinating when it was in Durham, NC a few years ago.


The original poster is correct -- BodyWorlds (and similar exhibitions) are an affront to the dignity we have traditionally afforded dead bodies. It's voyeurism dressed up as scientific research. Note that von Hagens has started showing bodies in sexual poses; how could he be any more transparent in pandering to the basest instincts of his audience?
 
2011-06-28 03:17:53 PM
Sponsored by the Yahoo! "we handed over emails and personal info on journalists and dissenters to the Chinese government so they could be sent to exactly these kinds of places so we had to make a 'human rights fund' to fix our PR image" Fund.
 
2011-06-28 03:32:15 PM

Silverstaff: Gosling: A) Oh, China's gonna pitch an absolute shiat hemmorhage over this.
B) Tough noogies.

Yeah, oh well, we offended China.

Okay, so what are they going to do about it?

While they have a lot of economic leverage on us, it works both ways. All those Chinese millionaires and economic growth are built on trade. Do anything to impair that and we both suffer.

We don't like their human rights record. The very concept of "human rights" is not exactly well rooted in Chinese culture and tradition, they are usually more on the idea of a harmonious society instead of individuals demanding rights. Just because they are different doesn't mean they are right though.


It would be a shame for all those jobs to come back to the USA. The Unions would come back strong and and return the raping the rich have recently given the working class.
 
2011-06-28 03:38:54 PM

alltandubh: fanbladesaresharp: Pansy. It's not meant to be a display of blood and gore, but to each his own. I found it fascinating when it was in Durham, NC a few years ago.

The original poster is correct -- BodyWorlds (and similar exhibitions) are an affront to the dignity we have traditionally afforded dead bodies. It's voyeurism dressed up as scientific research. Note that von Hagens has started showing bodies in sexual poses; how could he be any more transparent in pandering to the basest instincts of his audience?


6/10.

We will have to agree to diagree then on what you and I glean from the exhibits. If you feel offended by it, don't go then. Technically, ANY museum is voyeurism-people come to look at things on display. It can be for gold mining, the Pharoahs, corn, the catacombs, Jimmi Hendrix, model railroads, body art....or just bodies. Someone, for whatever reason, put together an exhibit, and people showed up.
 
2011-06-28 03:51:39 PM
I walk by this museum every day -- nobody is ever going to visit I'm afraid. It is also the site of the DC Real World house. They'd have gotten way more visitors with a Real World museum, sadly.
 
2011-06-28 04:19:55 PM

fanbladesaresharp: alltandubh: fanbladesaresharp: Pansy. It's not meant to be a display of blood and gore, but to each his own. I found it fascinating when it was in Durham, NC a few years ago.

The original poster is correct -- BodyWorlds (and similar exhibitions) are an affront to the dignity we have traditionally afforded dead bodies. It's voyeurism dressed up as scientific research. Note that von Hagens has started showing bodies in sexual poses; how could he be any more transparent in pandering to the basest instincts of his audience?

6/10.

We will have to agree to diagree then on what you and I glean from the exhibits. If you feel offended by it, don't go then. Technically, ANY museum is voyeurism-people come to look at things on display. It can be for gold mining, the Pharoahs, corn, the catacombs, Jimmi Hendrix, model railroads, body art....or just bodies. Someone, for whatever reason, put together an exhibit, and people showed up.


You know what a good one would be? Freaks of nature. Like Siamese twins and shiat. Maybe a bearded lady.
 
2011-06-28 04:46:14 PM

Molavian: You know what a good one would be? Freaks of nature. Like Siamese twins and shiat. Maybe a bearded lady.


I don't believe it.
 
2011-06-28 05:13:31 PM
What about the unofficial ones?
 
2011-06-28 05:34:50 PM
Oh please, tell me why we still have a trade embargo on Cuba?
 
2011-06-28 06:01:06 PM

caddisfly: I toured the Museum of American War Atrocities in Saigon a few years back (recently renamed the Vietnam War Remnants Museum). Political spin aside, the US could really use a museum that is R-Rated when it comes to war. Saw things there that would never make it into the Smithsonian. Horrible stuff, but I think important stuff to consider, especially now that we're in the US's first era of "continual war". I post in this thread because I think the US is too quick to throw stones on human rights, especially when collateral damage and CIA interference with domestic politics comes into play.


yeinjee.com
Whatcha up to, bro?
Sawing this Democratic People's Republic of Korea's dude's brain out!
Cool, bro! I always wanted to do that!

yeinjee.com
Look, the Father and Herr Doktor went through a lot to invent the Baby Stepladder, but we've finally DONE IT! Yes, we have invented baby stepladder! Yeeeessss!!!!

www.boingboing.net
These teeth shall fetch a fine price back in the States! Yes, our economy's hunger for foreign teeth shall never be sated!

Ah yes, politically motivated museums really know how to tell it like it was.
 
2011-06-28 06:19:24 PM

Ed Willy: david1963: Actually we in the U.S.A., are on the whole, abused much less than in most of the world's countries, especially Third World ones.

Perhaps I was wrong all those years I argued against exporting democracy.

democracy
a : government by the people; especially : rule of the majority b : a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections


By its nature democracy can't be exported. You need the population to seize it. The United States got aid from France, but France didn't come in and "liberate" us.

Also the US lacks the moral standing for that. Some of the worst offenders of human rights (Pinochet, Iran) came because the US usurped democracy in those countries.


Fun fact: the leader of Iran that was toppled was basically setting himself up as dictator, ignoring the Iranian democratic institutions. So it's not like the US knocked over a functioning democracy to put in the Shah. One unfriendly dictator was knocked over for another one that was friendly to the US. Not ideal, but also doesn't fit the general America-as-hypocrites theme the Left loves so well.
 
2011-06-28 06:48:42 PM

JohnAnnArbor: Ed Willy: david1963: Actually we in the U.S.A., are on the whole, abused much less than in most of the world's countries, especially Third World ones.

Perhaps I was wrong all those years I argued against exporting democracy.

democracy
a : government by the people; especially : rule of the majority b : a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections


By its nature democracy can't be exported. You need the population to seize it. The United States got aid from France, but France didn't come in and "liberate" us.

Also the US lacks the moral standing for that. Some of the worst offenders of human rights (Pinochet, Iran) came because the US usurped democracy in those countries.

Fun fact: the leader of Iran that was toppled was basically setting himself up as dictator, ignoring the Iranian democratic institutions. So it's not like the US knocked over a functioning democracy to put in the Shah. One unfriendly dictator was knocked over for another one that was friendly to the US. Not ideal, but also doesn't fit the general America-as-hypocrites theme the Left loves so well.


{citation needed}

And the US would still be a hypocrites under your dissertation.
 
2011-06-28 06:54:53 PM
I took a vacation at Lake Laogai once. It was very relaxing.
 
2011-06-28 08:22:22 PM

Molavian: I remember that episode of Avatar, the one where Zuko set Appa free.


That was exactly what I was thinking of. Clearly, I do not know Chinese or Chinese Labor Camp history, as I did not get the reference when I watched that.

/I got the Japanese references in that show though, so that should count for something!
 
2011-06-28 09:23:38 PM

Oznog: caddisfly: I toured the Museum of American War Atrocities in Saigon a few years back (recently renamed the Vietnam War Remnants Museum). Political spin aside, the US could really use a museum that is R-Rated when it comes to war. Saw things there that would never make it into the Smithsonian. Horrible stuff, but I think important stuff to consider, especially now that we're in the US's first era of "continual war". I post in this thread because I think the US is too quick to throw stones on human rights, especially when collateral damage and CIA interference with domestic politics comes into play.

Ah yes, politically motivated museums really know how to tell it like it was.


thelandryhat.com
 
2011-06-29 02:39:52 AM
As bad as China is, they've kept their abuses internal.

The United States has a habit of sharing the wealth.
 
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