If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(The Raw Story)   State Department wants passport applicants to reveal lifetime employment history   (rawstory.com) divider line 203
    More: Asinine, State Department, U.S. passport, statutory authority, come into force, pass, State Department wants  
•       •       •

10743 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Apr 2011 at 4:33 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



203 Comments   (+0 »)
   

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | » | Last | Show all
 
2011-04-25 06:11:39 PM

Kar98: Ha, ha! I've got this:


Me too, and a US one to boot! Makes travel really easy...
 
2011-04-25 06:12:18 PM
Alien Robot 2011-04-25 05:45:56 PM
Make your comments here:

OK, smartypants, is that 60 calendar days, or 60 business days til comments close?

Because if it's 60 calendar days, you get this.

ihatepeacocks.com
 
2011-04-25 06:14:15 PM

MattMpls: Kar98: Ha, ha! I've got this:

Me too, and a US one to boot! Makes travel really easy...


Ditto! I plan to use mine shortly. :)
 
2011-04-25 06:23:46 PM
Sometimes I find it annoying that I have acute technofail and a fear of flying. Then I read gunge like this and realize how much easier it makes my life having a built in weasel excuse.

Of course, I also live in Maine. If I was really determined to leave the country, I could do so completely undetected. Not all of our borders are psychotically guarded yet, and the only way to do that is to turn several towns/villages into min-Berlins. Seriously- in some places the border is Main Street.
 
2011-04-25 06:26:42 PM

markie_farkie: It takes less info to get a Secret clearance to do gubmint work.

Insane..


that was my thought. there is no way i can remember all the places i lived in the year and a half after active duty. nor the multiple jobs i went through.
 
2011-04-25 06:33:10 PM
Non-conspiracist websites discussing the matter:

FlyerTalk
Travel Safety/Security - new passport forms


Fodors - Asia
Time for a new passport?

BoardingArea
Is getting a US passport about to become a LOT harder?

MilePoint
New proposed passport rules - last day to object is TODAY!
 
2011-04-25 06:50:03 PM

DavidVincent: Just keep it up.


Is that directed toward the democrats and Obama, or the republicans who now control the lower house of congress?

Or all of them?

/french revolution:
//best. revolution. ever.
///okay maybe second best but it's up there, irrespective
 
2011-04-25 06:54:10 PM

ourbigdumbmouth: Sounds like they dont want anyone to leave.


You don't need a passport to leave the country, you use it to get back in.
 
2011-04-25 06:55:26 PM
Kumana Wanalaia [recently expired TotalFark] Quote 2011-04-25 06:50:03 PM

Or all of them?


Knowing him, he means the Jews.
 
2011-04-25 07:00:25 PM
U.S. Department of State Passport application information using primary forms of identification

U.S. Department of State Passport application information using secondary forms of identification

Submit a Photocopy of the Identification Document(s) Presented (Step 4)

Bring a photocopy of the front and back of each ID document that you will present when you apply.

* Photocopy must be on plain white, 8 1/2 x 11" standard paper stock, showing the front and the back of your ID
* Photocopy must contain images on only one-side of each page submitted.
o If copies cannot be made on the same side of one page, you may present two separate pages; one displaying the front of the ID and the second displaying the back of the ID.
* The paper should be free of other images and/or markings.
* The 8 1/2 x 11" paper size cannot be substituted with a larger or smaller size paper, even if the alternative folds down to the 8 1/2 x 11" size.
* You may enlarge the image of your ID on the 8 1/2 x 11" page, but you may not decrease the size of the image.

---------


YES, GOD DAMN IT, THE STATE DEPARTMENT ABSOLUTELY WILL ACCEPT PHOTOCOPIES AND MINE WERE IN FULL COLOR TOO, B*TCHES!!
 
2011-04-25 07:00:52 PM
we are the government. we're here to help.
 
2011-04-25 07:01:52 PM
The juiciest part of TFA:

"The State Department estimated that the average respondent would be able to compile all this information in just 45 minutes, which is obviously absurd given the amount of research that is likely to be required to even attempt to complete the form."

"Choosing to require an applicant for a passport to complete the proposed Form DS-5513, which few if any applicants could complete, would amount to a de facto decision to deny that applicant a passport. And that decision would be standardless, arbitrary, and illegal."
 
2011-04-25 07:02:26 PM
The best part is that if you make a mistake on the application, they can send you to jail for up to 5 years.

Won't that be nice?
 
2011-04-25 07:10:34 PM
http://www.regulations.gov/#!submitComment;D=DOS-2011-0055-0001

(copy/paste)

Here is the quick link for the feedback form, and hurry it up.
 
2011-04-25 07:13:36 PM

dofus: jaylectricity: The passport is just further proof that we have no rights and we're not actually free. We are only afforded privileges by those in power.

I'm guessing you don't get out of the basement much.

As the name implies, the document allows you to go almost anywhere in the world. And a US passport carries a lot more weight than those from a lot of other countries.

There are people in this world who would kill to get a real US passport. There a *lot* of people who would make up any sort of cock and bull story to get one.

"No. Really. I was born in a tent in a Kansas corn field in the winter of '68. My Ma didn't get into town until '70 and she didn't write so good. She died when I was 6. I never knew my Dad. No, I don't know why I speak with an English accent. Can I have my Mother Of All Identity cards now?"


Not that there's anything wrong with a tent in a Kansas corn field I guess, but the passport is not meant to be a security clearance. We're talking about basic return privileges, nothing to do with other intel that might be taking place on a person. A person wishing to travel and return to the US is not making an application for a DOE job. It's not the "mother of all identity cards" for anything sensitive, it's not tantamount to a security clearance, it's not a job history and residence history, just basic in/out. The new form is significantly unreasonable.
 
2011-04-25 07:14:32 PM
Never had a passport, never will.
 
2011-04-25 07:17:33 PM
The Biographical Questionnaire for a U.S. Passport, form DS-5513, is used to supplement an application for a U.S. passport when the applicant submits citizenship or identity evidence that is insufficient or of questionable authenticity," according to a supporting statement (PDF) issued along with the request for comment.

Well, I'm outraged. Clearly another example of government gone mad with power. It's Sharia law! Save us, The Donald!
 
2011-04-25 07:19:09 PM

SurfaceTension: "The Biographical Questionnaire for a U.S. Passport, form DS-5513, is used to supplement an application for a U.S. passport when the applicant submits citizenship or identity evidence that is insufficient or of questionable authenticity," according to a supporting statement (PDF) issued along with the request for comment.

Ok, the article isn't clear on this, but this makes it sound like this form would only be required in certain instances. Also, the form sounds like a typical background check form needed for many government and contractor jobs. Your typical Joe the Plumber isn't going to have to fill out any of this if his birth certificate and driver's license check out.


Wrong. I am a typical Joe-the-Plumber (god I hated that guy) and I had to fill one of these out, and my BC and DL were fine. Apparently, because I had never left the US before (I am 43) and I am not married and do not own a home, I fit the profile of a home-grown Terrorist!

It was a pain in the ass, and I wondered what would happen if I didn't have enough info to satisfy them? Who can remember the name of there supervisor from a job I had 20 something years ago? Luckily, it went through....but it sucked not knowing if I was going to be recognized as a "legal person" in my own country!

Not a fun process.

/They don't seem to have a problem with my ID when I am paying taxes!
 
2011-04-25 07:20:05 PM
Kumana Wanalaia 2011-04-25 07:17:33 PM


Well, I'm outraged. Clearly another example of government gone mad with power. It's Sharia law! Save us, The Donald!

Dude, I like you.

Don't be a penis.
 
2011-04-25 07:20:58 PM

generallyso: Flab:
These are only required if your birth was not recorded by the country/hospital at the time of your birth. No reason to have a heart attack over it.

Flab:
Unless your short form BC is written in crayon, you wouldn't need to fill this additional form.


You have done an excellent job of missing the point:

How would one obtain this information if required to do so?


I don,t think I am missing the point. However, I realise I may be wrong about this, please provide me with a scenario where someone who has been able to go to school, get a driver's license and social security number, would have to go through this process.

Under what circumstances would your current papers not be sufficient enough for you to get a passport?

This additional form is only if you have no proof of your identity, or if the govt. has reason to believe the papers you do have are forged.

As I, and Duke_Leto_Atreides mentioned, this would only apply if you were born in a manger on a farm in the backwoods of Montana -AND- did your sovereign citizen parents did not record your birth with the county at the time of your birth. In all other cases, your regular birth certitficate will suffice.
 
2011-04-25 07:22:55 PM
Kittypie070:

that was sarcasm

*brofist*
 
2011-04-25 07:23:01 PM

limboslam: I recall another country that made it extremely difficult for it's citizens to travel abroad.


What are you talking about? They gave the little girl a plane and everything.
 
2011-04-25 07:30:04 PM
Active introvert: I can almost understand the questions about where the mother was living but why do they need to know if she had pre-natal care?

And how would one describe the circumstances of their birth?

It was a cold and rain night. Mom had just drank 5 Jagerbombs with a trucker down at the local watering hole. He was driving a red Peterbilt hauling hogs. She said it was love at first sight. That Peterbilt rocked for a whole half an hour. He paid her the 20 bucks plus a tip.

That would be the circumstances of your conception, not your birth.

Unless that trucker was into the realllly kinky stuff.


Ok.
It was a cold and rain night. Mom had just drank 5 Jagerbombs when she started having labor pains. She only left when they bartender got pissed her water broke all over the pole dancing stage. She started to hitch hike the 20 miles back to town and was picked up by a trucker hauling hogs. Though her hands were shaking from the cold, she still managed to light her cigerette. "damn" she said " 12 kids is enough". I was born in the cab of that Peterbilt.
 
2011-04-25 07:31:02 PM
Kumana Wanalaia 2011-04-25 07:22:55 PM
Kittypie070:

that was sarcasm

*brofist*


I know, I know, it was just a little too cheese-whizzy :P

*bropaw*
 
2011-04-25 07:31:31 PM

Flab: generallyso: Flab:
These are only required if your birth was not recorded by the country/hospital at the time of your birth. No reason to have a heart attack over it.

Flab:
Unless your short form BC is written in crayon, you wouldn't need to fill this additional form.


You have done an excellent job of missing the point:

How would one obtain this information if required to do so?

I don,t think I am missing the point. However, I realise I may be wrong about this, please provide me with a scenario where someone who has been able to go to school, get a driver's license and social security number, would have to go through this process.

Under what circumstances would your current papers not be sufficient enough for you to get a passport?

This additional form is only if you have no proof of your identity, or if the govt. has reason to believe the papers you do have are forged.

As I, and Duke_Leto_Atreides mentioned, this would only apply if you were born in a manger on a farm in the backwoods of Montana -AND- did your sovereign citizen parents did not record your birth with the county at the time of your birth. In all other cases, your regular birth certitficate will suffice.


You are wrong, as I stated in my post above. I have a SS card, DL, BC, numerous CC's and I have bank accounts and have paid taxes for 20 + years. I have a Bachelors degree and am a Licensed NY State Teacher. Yet, I was required to fill out this form to get my passport. You know nothing about what you are talking, so please be quite.
 
2011-04-25 07:34:52 PM

Duke_leto_Atredes: Flab: RobertBruce: The document also requires some applicaticants to submit information about the mother's pre-natal and post-natal care, the mother's residence one year before and after the birth, the persons in attendance at the birth and religious or institutional recordings of the birth.

WHAT?


Section C: Information for Non-Institutional Births or Delayed Birth Filings
If you were not born in the United States skip Items 5-12 and continue to Section D. If you were born in the United States,
you must complete Items 5-12 if you answer "No" to either of the questions below.

Was your birth recorded within one year of the date your birth occurred? [Yes] [No]
Were you born in a medical facility? [Yes] [No]

5. List your mother's residence one year before your birth:
6. List your mother's residence at the time of your birth:
7. List your mother's residence one year after your birth:
8. Mother's place of employment at the time of your birth:
Dates of employment:_____________ Name of employer: _____________
Address of employer:_____________
9. Did your mother receive pre-natal or post-natal medical care? [Yes] [No]
Hospital or other facility:
Address:
Name of Doctor:
Dates of appointments:
10. What type of document, if any, did your mother use to enter into the United States before your birth?
11. Please describe the circumstances of your birth including the names (as well as address and phone number, if available)
of persons present or in attendance at your birth:
12. Was there any religious or institutional recording of your birth or event occuring around the time of your birth?



These are only required if your birth was not recorded by the country/hospital at the time of your birth. No reason to have a heart attack over it.

only peoeple that need this today are FLDS amish and gypsies
/no neck backwoods inbred hillbillies as well

Give the G nothing


You don't even know about your own son's Harkonnen ancestry. Are you sure you're in a position to talk?
 
2011-04-25 07:36:01 PM
Summa cum loudly 2011-04-25 07:31:31 PM


Yet, I was required to fill out this form to get my passport.

The form hasn't been made official yet, the State Department was taking comments from the public on it.

Unless you got your passport just today, something smells off with your story.
 
2011-04-25 07:38:25 PM
Kittypie070:

oh okay :)
 
2011-04-25 07:42:14 PM

Kittypie070: Summa cum loudly 2011-04-25 07:31:31 PM


Yet, I was required to fill out this form to get my passport.

The form hasn't been made official yet, the State Department was taking comments from the public on it.

Unless you got your passport just today, something smells off with your story.


Your nose is apparently not very sensitive, I applied for a passport right before the price went up last year (July?) My trip abroad was in October. I had to fill out this form, or one that is for all intents and purposes the same. Are you telling me I am making this up?
 
2011-04-25 07:46:49 PM
Anyhow I hope all my link-crapping helped.

One more note.

Deadline is midnight, Eastern Time.

That'll be 9 PM Pacific, for all you folks in Fruit & Nut Land.
 
2011-04-25 07:48:11 PM
If you apply for a part time clerk job at a local mini-mart you have to fill out a DHS form.

So glad when I buy my coffee on the way to work that I'm not buying it from a terrorist.
 
2011-04-25 07:48:27 PM

SurfaceTension: "The Biographical Questionnaire for a U.S. Passport, form DS-5513, is used to supplement an application for a U.S. passport when the applicant submits citizenship or identity evidence that is insufficient or of questionable authenticity," according to a supporting statement (PDF) issued along with the request for comment.

Ok, the article isn't clear on this, but this makes it sound like this form would only be required in certain instances. Also, the form sounds like a typical background check form needed for many government and contractor jobs. Your typical Joe the Plumber isn't going to have to fill out any of this if his birth certificate and driver's license check out.

/still think this is a bit of overreach
//what are the guidelines on what constitutes questionable authenticity?


In my wife's case, a birth certificate from the US Army 3rd General Hospital on the US Army Base in Stuttgart was NOT considered adequate. The government doesn't even believe the government....
 
2011-04-25 07:56:55 PM
I'm pretty sure this is all targeted at "Anchor Baby" citizens.


you have to produce this info if you were born here in questionable circumstances.

the whole pre and post natal questions is the telling part. right-wingers think that will be the big gotcha for those jumping into the US to dump a baby and get all that great welfare here.
 
2011-04-25 07:58:33 PM
You have an inalienable natural right to travel regardless of whether you can comply with this bullshiat or not.
 
2011-04-25 07:59:08 PM

5. List your mother's residence one year before your birth:
6. List your mother's residence at the time of your birth:



yup, anti-anchor baby wharbgarble.


Tea Party whack-jobs all over this one.
 
2011-04-25 07:59:47 PM

dbaggins: I'm pretty sure this is all targeted at "Anchor Baby" citizens.


you have to produce this info if you were born here in questionable circumstances.

the whole pre and post natal questions is the telling part. right-wingers think that will be the big gotcha for those jumping into the US to dump a baby and get all that great welfare here.


Regardless of anyone's personal feelings on the subject, that anchor babby is still a citizen of the US, and entitled to all rights and privileges thereof. Including a passport.
 
2011-04-25 08:01:10 PM
Summa cum loudly 2011-04-25 07:42:14 PM
Kittypie070: Summa cum loudly 2011-04-25 07:31:31 PM


Yet, I was required to fill out this form to get my passport.


Unless you got your passport just today, something smells off with your story.

Your nose is apparently not very sensitive, I applied for a passport right before the price went up last year (July?) My trip abroad was in October. I had to fill out this form, or one that is for all intents and purposes the same. Are you telling me I am making this up?


The form DS-5513, Biographical Questionnaire for U.S. Passport has not been made official at this time, it was announced on February 24th of this year by the State Department (that's 2011, BTW), and the 60 day comment period for the public ends tonight at Midnight Eastern Time.
 
2011-04-25 08:02:38 PM
(rubs nose carefully in fine-grained sand to increase sensitivity)
 
2011-04-25 08:07:12 PM

Kittypie070: Summa cum loudly 2011-04-25 07:42:14 PM
Kittypie070: Summa cum loudly 2011-04-25 07:31:31 PM


Yet, I was required to fill out this form to get my passport.


Unless you got your passport just today, something smells off with your story.

Your nose is apparently not very sensitive, I applied for a passport right before the price went up last year (July?) My trip abroad was in October. I had to fill out this form, or one that is for all intents and purposes the same. Are you telling me I am making this up?

The form DS-5513, Biographical Questionnaire for U.S. Passport has not been made official at this time, it was announced on February 24th of this year by the State Department (that's 2011, BTW), and the 60 day comment period for the public ends tonight at Midnight Eastern Time.


You know nothing about what you are talking, so please be quite.

/I quiet like this quote.
 
2011-04-25 08:07:19 PM

mbillips: To apply for a military security clearance, you have to list your residences and jobs for only the past 10 years. For criyi.


To work at a pharmaceutical company, you have to do that, undergo a drug test, submit to a background investigation, and interview with at least 6 people.

Which is harder, getting a job at a Fortune 500, or getting a Secret clearance?
 
2011-04-25 08:09:18 PM
Summa cum loudly, I do not doubt that you got stuck filling out some sort of stupid form, it's just that I'm saying "not this one".

You did say "I had to fill out this form, or one that is for all intents and purposes the same."

I wasn't ignoring that.

Sorry about coming off all hard-nosed at you.
 
2011-04-25 08:10:14 PM
I'm a 25 year old male and couldn't answer that.

I only started keeping that sort of documentation when I was 21-22. I can now tell you, down to the month, where I lived and worked, and for how long.

Anything between 18 and 20 years old is sketchy at best.
Anything before 18 years old has been long forgotten.
 
2011-04-25 08:10:58 PM
Summa Cum Loudly, did they tell you why they didn't like your current birth certificate or driver's licence?
 
2011-04-25 08:16:00 PM
EVERY SINGLE GOD DAMNED MENTION OF THIS ON THE WWW LEADS BACK TO PAPERSPLEASE.ORG AND I MEAN EVERY MOTHERfarkING LINK GOOGLE GIVES ME CAN SOMEONE GIVE ANY farkING INDICATION WHETHER PAPERSPLEASE.ORG IS ACCURATELY QUOTING THE PROPOSED FORM?

Thank you for your consideration
 
2011-04-25 08:26:00 PM
Clete Orris

RIGHT ON!
 
2011-04-25 08:46:53 PM

Kittypie070: Summa cum loudly, I do not doubt that you got stuck filling out some sort of stupid form, it's just that I'm saying "not this one".

You did say "I had to fill out this form, or one that is for all intents and purposes the same."

I wasn't ignoring that.

Sorry about coming off all hard-nosed at you.


Yes, unless I had both forms in front of me I couldn't tell you exactly what the minor differences were...but they are probably 95% identical. Believe me, I do NOT want to Ever have to look at those forms again!

Thank you for your apology. And I was just about to lose my faith in FARK.......

/Oh, who Am I kidding....What Faith?!
 
2011-04-25 08:52:28 PM
Do what you are told!
 
2011-04-25 08:52:44 PM

Flab: Summa Cum Loudly, did they tell you why they didn't like your current birth certificate or driver's licence?


No...they give you no information whatsoever except "the identification you provided is insufficient". Good luck getting any help from the State Department.

Damned Scary, if you ask me. I would love to hear from someone who had to take this BEYOND what I had to....I dread even thinking about the legal costs involved, all to prove you are who you say you are!
 
2011-04-25 09:12:43 PM

Summa cum loudly: Flab: Summa Cum Loudly, did they tell you why they didn't like your current birth certificate or driver's licence?

No...they give you no information whatsoever except "the identification you provided is insufficient". Good luck getting any help from the State Department.


Funny, the current requirements do not match your story.
 
2011-04-25 09:15:30 PM

namegoeshere: Regardless of anyone's personal feelings on the subject, that anchor babby is still a citizen of the US, and entitled to all rights and privileges thereof. Including a passport.



There are many people in this country that want to chip away at this right. Something can remain in the Constitution as a right, and yet be so hard to achieve in practice that you essentially have outlawed it.

for reference, right-winger attacks on voter rights, and abortion rights.


They don't change the law, they just keep piling red-tape and onerous bullcrap on it to get the end they want:

Fewer rights for the "wrong" people.
 
Displayed 50 of 203 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | » | Last | Show all



This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report