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(The Ledger)   Brothers file suit because tollbooth workers "detain" them while checking large bills   (theledger.com) divider line 70
    More: Florida  
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6359 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Apr 2011 at 10:56 AM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
 
2011-04-15 11:00:04 AM  
they're still doing this?
 
2011-04-15 11:00:34 AM  
Florida Farkers: Are their really toll-booths between grocery stores and residential neighborhoods?
 
2011-04-15 11:01:05 AM  
Good for them. The cock-sockets who work for the Florida DOT detained them when they had done nothing illegal. No probable cause. Not even reasonable suspicion. It was just "policy".

I hope the lawsuit costs the State a shiat-ton of money and loses the bright boy who thought it up his job.
 
2011-04-15 11:01:28 AM  
The brothers in question:

Link
 
2011-04-15 11:01:37 AM  
Warrantless detention is permissible when there is reasonable suspicion that a crime has been, or is about to be committed.

/GED in law
 
2011-04-15 11:04:14 AM  

GoodyearPimp: Florida Farkers: Are their really toll-booths between grocery stores and residential neighborhoods?


In this area, yes. The Polk Parkway is also the easiest route to take between a couple of cities in Polk County, so it's not unreasonable to think he stopped at a grocery store on his way home or something.

Good for him for suing. That policy is bullshiat.
 
2011-04-15 11:04:35 AM  
I like it, they're just trying to make the government be less sketchy, nothing wrong with that.
 
2011-04-15 11:04:40 AM  
Detention does not require an actual arrest by a peace officer. They were "detained" if an ordinary reasonable person would not feel free to leave under the same circumstances.

/GED in law
 
2011-04-15 11:05:24 AM  
what kind of asshole tries to pay a toll with anything larger than a $20 bill?

what cash machines are these people going to that give out larger denominations?
 
2011-04-15 11:06:34 AM  
Follw-up from last month. This is not new.

Original article.
 
2011-04-15 11:06:41 AM  
Dude, just buy a Sunpass. If you cross a tollbooth more than once or twice a year, it's the only way to go.
 
2011-04-15 11:07:17 AM  

junglegoddess: Good for him for suing. That policy is bullshiat.


How long was this "detention"? If no one cares about counterfeit money, then it's unreasonable.

/Get a farking EZPass, Mr. My Time Is So farking Valuable.
 
2011-04-15 11:07:23 AM  
FTFA:

In 2008, he successfully sued the Polk County School District for access to names, phone numbers, addresses and dependents' names of an estimated 13,000 school employees who receive health care.

That guy sounds like a douche.
 
2011-04-15 11:07:44 AM  
Hrm. Are we sure that they're not running an actual counterfeiting operation? They seem awfully nervous about people looking at their money. I can think of worse ways to dispose of fake currency than a toll booth-- get real change, then drive off. By the time they realize they have fake money, they'll have no idea where it came from.
 
2011-04-15 11:07:46 AM  
They're just assholes for not having a Sunpass.

And it's perfectly legal to collect information on who's paying you. Even when it's cash. This one will get thrown out.

And fark these guys, they're assholes.
 
2011-04-15 11:08:48 AM  

All things being equal these brothers were lucky. Some toll collectors REALLY HATE large bills.

i236.photobucket.com
 
2011-04-15 11:12:09 AM  
I saw a video report on this a month or so ago. The more chilling part was footage of the Excel spreadsheet that they consolidated all the info they collected.

One of the columns of the spreadsheet captured the reason a given car was considered "suspicious". The large majority of the ones shown contained something to the effect of "young, black male" or "young, Hispanic male".

That alone could make this an expensive case for FL.
 
2011-04-15 11:13:43 AM  
So the toll booth operators don't like having to make change so they make it a pain in the ass to pay with paper money.

1. They are ass holes
2. So are you, carry some change. You knew there was going to be a toll
 
2011-04-15 11:15:38 AM  
If you read the damn article you see these guys have a valid point. Its not the requirement to pay a toll,or being held up to pay a toll they're arguing. Its the fact the toll booth workers are demanding all sorts of personal information about drivers without letting them pass, for bills as small as $5. Yet they don't have any authority to demand this information. Nor do they explain where this information is housed, how its used, etc.

Its bad enough when a store asks me for my zipcode, phone number and address for marketing purposes. I can say "no" or just leave. But imagine you're not allowed to get out of line at Sears unless you provide that information.
 
2011-04-15 11:19:47 AM  

Inibrius: They're just assholes for not having a Sunpass.



Exactly. If you've lived in an area of Florida with a lot of toll booths for more than a couple months and you don't have a sunpass, you're a farking idiot. You don't even have to shell out the $25 for a transponder anymore. They're $5 at Publix. And you'll make that back with the reduced toll rate after a few weeks or so, depending on how many tolls you go through every day.

These guys are just tea party assholes with an ax to grind.
 
2011-04-15 11:20:16 AM  

lajimi: All things being equal these brothers were lucky. Some toll collectors REALLY HATE large bills.


Came for the Godfather tollbooth, leaving full of bullet holes.
 
2011-04-15 11:21:40 AM  

junglegoddess: Good for him for suing. That policy is bullshiat.


You know what else is bullshiat? Paying a $3 (or less) toll with a $20 bill. You were just out shopping, knew you were going to have to pay a toll on your way home, and you couldn't ask the cashier to break that Jackson? In other words:

Welfare Xmas: 2. So are you, carry some change. You knew there was going to be a toll


That.

This dipshiat probably wrote a check for his groceries, too.
=Smidge=
 
2011-04-15 11:23:45 AM  

Theaetetus: Tell you what - drop the whole "waaaa, I was unconstitutionally detained" and focus on the personal information that they gathered without probable cause. Fourth amendment, slappy, not the fifth.


If you read the article you'd know that this is not what the lawsuit is about. It's about toll booth operators detaining people AFTER they paid their toll, which is the only step that needs to be fulfilled.
 
2011-04-15 11:24:00 AM  
Tangential, but always wondered if Federal bills are printed with "This note is legal tender for all debts public and private," why is it common to refuse some denominations. If I buy a $2 taco and try to pay with a $100, which you refuse, why isn't it taken as you refusing payment and giving me a free taco. What's the precedent for "we'll take $20, but not $100"

Anyone with a GED in law want to take this one?
 
2011-04-15 11:25:08 AM  

GoodyearPimp: junglegoddess: Good for him for suing. That policy is bullshiat.

How long was this "detention"? If no one cares about counterfeit money, then it's unreasonable.

/Get a farking EZPass, Mr. My Time Is So farking Valuable.


He wouldn't slow down the cars behind him if the FDOT weren't being dicks about collecting all this personal information from someone paying for his toll with LEGAL tender. They make highlighters that detect fake cash now, so this is really over-the-top by the FDOT. And it's not just make, model and tag number. RTFA -- when they finally handed over the public records, he found out in some instances the FDOT was demanding social security numbers, cell phone numbers -- again, from people paying with legal goddamn money.

If they don't want anything over $5, then they need to implement a widely-publicized policy that says don't get on our damn toll roads without proper farking change.

None of this will be an issue very soon anyway -- Florida's adopting a new "we don't take cash or plastic" policy, and are instead forcing everyone to either buy a Sunpass or they get sent a bill for the toll after the state records your tag number....along with an "administrative fee" of course.

They've already started with the Turnpike. (new window)
 
2011-04-15 11:28:46 AM  
I don't get it. I think both sides are being lame.

1) I don't think there is a guarantee that the toll procedure is that you give them the cash, they hand you any change and anything else in their process is 'detainment.'

The scenario that came to mind was: "Can I get a receipt?" "Sure, I have to change the paper real quick, it just ran out." "Illegal detainment!!!"

2) There's cameras right there. Have a button right by the register that flags the photo being snapped that the driver paid with a "large" bill. (Since when is a $20 a large bill?)
 
2011-04-15 11:28:48 AM  
solterra-community.com

You're slow today, fark.
 
2011-04-15 11:29:05 AM  

Smidge204: You know what else is bullshiat? Paying a $3 (or less) toll with a $20 bill.


You know what else is bullshiat? You saying it's bullshiat to use a certain denomination bill to pay a toll.

It's currency. Check the bill with your little marker, give me my change, and STFU.
 
2011-04-15 11:29:12 AM  

Inibrius: They're just assholes for not having a Sunpass.

And it's perfectly legal to collect information on who's paying you. Even when it's cash. This one will get thrown out.

And fark these guys, they're assholes.


You sound like the kind of person who would not complain if you woke up with grass stains on your knees and a sore asshole.

// Wanna go camping ?
 
2011-04-15 11:30:04 AM  
This isn't like a fast food drive-through window where you have not actually incurred the debt until they give you the food. Also, it isn't a crime to decide "nevermind" and leave the fast food joint without taking the food or giving the money. Around here the toll booths charge you when you EXIT the tollway so it is a debt you have already incurred. If you drive away without paying the toll you are skipping out on your debt.

A $100 bill is legal tender for all debts, public and private. The toll worker has no authority to detain a person who has paid the toll. The driver may be an asswipe but he is correct.
 
2011-04-15 11:34:53 AM  

Smidge204: This dipshiat probably wrote a check for his groceries, too.


And didn't start filling it out until after the cashier had rung up the final total. Come on people you know the date, the name of the store and how to sign your name WAY before that. Fill the damn check in while the cashier scans your groceries or while waiting in line.

//sorry but you got me started
 
2011-04-15 11:36:56 AM  

Smidge204: This dipshiat probably wrote a check for his groceries, too.


TOTALLY sounds like someone that does not carry large notes
Your assumption is perfect, carry on your attack.
 
2011-04-15 11:37:28 AM  

Smidge204: junglegoddess: Good for him for suing. That policy is bullshiat.

You know what else is bullshiat? Paying a $3 (or less) toll with a $20 bill. You were just out shopping, knew you were going to have to pay a toll on your way home, and you couldn't ask the cashier to break that Jackson?


So stay in the Sunpass-only lane. I don't live in Florida anymore, but I visit friends every few months. And sorry, but when I've been on the road for eight hours I'm not going out of my way to ask the guy at the gas station to give me exact toll change when the toll people will take that $5, $10 or $20 -- especially when I don't always remember how many toll booths I'll end up passing through.

Complain to the FDOT if you don't like their policy of accepting larger denominations.
 
2011-04-15 11:38:02 AM  

junglegoddess: None of this will be an issue very soon anyway -- Florida's adopting a new "we don't take cash or plastic" policy,


They will just amend the suit to start crying about "the ebul gubmint knowing where I am whut wit dere fancy electronic gizmos n whutnot".
 
2011-04-15 11:39:38 AM  
Who stops at tollbooths?

www.mdx-way.com
 
2011-04-15 11:42:07 AM  
Complain to the FDOT if you don't like their policy of accepting larger denominations.

If you are lucky then the complaints might actually get the attention of some beurocrat with the authority to actually change the policy but your chances are better with a lawsuit.

If hundreds of people all filed separate lawsuits you can bet they would change the policy, even if they won the lawsuits they wouldn't want to keep figthing them.
 
2011-04-15 11:42:36 AM  
"Unconstitutional"? Aren't your detention laws absolutely nothing to do with your constitution, but part of the body of common law?
 
2011-04-15 11:42:39 AM  

stiletto_the_wise: Theaetetus: Tell you what - drop the whole "waaaa, I was unconstitutionally detained" and focus on the personal information that they gathered without probable cause. Fourth amendment, slappy, not the fifth.

If you read the article you'd know that this is not what the lawsuit is about. It's about toll booth operators detaining people AFTER they claim they paid their toll, which is the only step that needs to be fulfilled.


FTFY. And no, actually paying the toll must be fulfilled, too, according to the Florida statutes.
 
2011-04-15 11:42:59 AM  

GoodyearPimp: junglegoddess: None of this will be an issue very soon anyway -- Florida's adopting a new "we don't take cash or plastic" policy,

They will just amend the suit to start crying about "the ebul gubmint knowing where I am whut wit dere fancy electronic gizmos n whutnot".


Well, my tin foil hat tells me the more sinister reason behind this new "toll-by-plate" system is so that the state can lay off toll booth workers while racking up extra money in those "administrative fees."
 
2011-04-15 11:44:10 AM  

TheWhoppah: A $100 bill is legal tender for all debts, public and private. The toll worker has no authority to detain a person who has paid the toll. The driver may be an asswipe but he is correct.


A picture of a $100 bill is also legal tender?
Nope.
The toll worker has authority - and possibly the duty - to verify the bill prior to accepting it.
 
2011-04-15 11:48:41 AM  

ProfessorOhki: Tangential, but always wondered if Federal bills are printed with "This note is legal tender for all debts public and private," why is it common to refuse some denominations. If I buy a $2 taco and try to pay with a $100, which you refuse, why isn't it taken as you refusing payment and giving me a free taco. What's the precedent for "we'll take $20, but not $100"

Anyone with a GED in law want to take this one?



In the UK, coins are only legal tender up to set amounts:

£5 (Crown) - for any amount

£2 - for any amount

£1 - for any amount

50p - for any amount not exceeding £10

25p (Crown) - for any amount not exceeding £10

20p - for any amount not exceeding £10

10p - for any amount not exceeding £5

5p - for any amount not exceeding £5

2p - for any amount not exceeding 20p

1p - for any amount not exceeding 20p


Given a lot of US law is based of English common law, perhaps there's a similar rule buried somewhere in your statues?
 
2011-04-15 11:53:14 AM  

Theaetetus: The toll worker has authority - and possibly the duty - to verify the bill prior to accepting it.


and that's fine. use one of these and let the driver go on their way. You DON'T need any additional info (nor are you entitled to any) from the driver if the bill checks out.
 
2011-04-15 11:55:49 AM  
There's a video with a guy trying to pay for his impounded car with 8,800 pennies. Cops get involved. He's in the right. Look it up because I'm too lazy to do it for you.
 
2011-04-15 12:01:29 PM  
Um, correct me if I'm wrong, but they aren't being detained, just not allowed to pass through the toll booth right? If they wanted to turn around and go take another route, nothing would be stopping them?
 
2011-04-15 12:04:01 PM  

mwburden: Um, correct me if I'm wrong, but they aren't being detained, just not allowed to pass through the toll booth right? If they wanted to turn around and go take another route, nothing would be stopping them?


You can't just up and turn around at a tool booth. Even if there was no car behind you it would require backing up on the road which isn't exactly allowed under the law. Unless they lifted the bar and let you through...kind of defeats the whole thing that way though.
 
2011-04-15 12:07:09 PM  

Smidge204: You know what else is bullshiat? Paying a $3 (or less) toll with a $20 bill. You were just out shopping, knew you were going to have to pay a toll on your way home, and you couldn't ask the cashier to break that Jackson?


"THIS NOTE IS LEGAL TENDER FOR ALL DEBTS, PUBLIC AND PRIVATE"

Sorry change monkey -- paying a toll with a $20 is perfectly kosher. The $20 and the $100 are the bills in widest circulation anyway. It's hard to argue they are uncommon. Indeed, many ATMs only dispense $20s.
 
2011-04-15 12:08:27 PM  

Theaetetus: The toll worker has authority - and possibly the duty - to verify the bill prior to accepting it.


This is not a situation where the toll worker has reasonable suspicion that the crime of counterfitting has been, or is about to be committed. Unless paying with $100 bill is, in and of itself, suspicious.

A court in Texas held that driving around with $8000 cash is suspicious.
 
2011-04-15 12:08:37 PM  

ProfessorOhki: Tangential, but always wondered if Federal bills are printed with "This note is legal tender for all debts public and private," why is it common to refuse some denominations. If I buy a $2 taco and try to pay with a $100, which you refuse, why isn't it taken as you refusing payment and giving me a free taco. What's the precedent for "we'll take $20, but not $100"

Anyone with a GED in law want to take this one?


They won't refuse to take the $100 bill unless they're ultra-retarded. They'll call a manager who will examine the bill before accepting it for payment.
 
2011-04-15 12:09:24 PM  

ProfessorOhki: Tangential, but always wondered if Federal bills are printed with "This note is legal tender for all debts public and private," why is it common to refuse some denominations. If I buy a $2 taco and try to pay with a $100, which you refuse, why isn't it taken as you refusing payment and giving me a free taco. What's the precedent for "we'll take $20, but not $100"

Anyone with a GED in law want to take this one?


Until the transaction is completed, there is no debt.

Now, if you've already eaten the taco, they have to take your $100. Whether they can make change on it, though, is a crap-shoot. (As will be your taco in 5 hours or so)
 
2011-04-15 12:12:52 PM  

Bungles: "Unconstitutional"? Aren't your detention laws absolutely nothing to do with your constitution, but part of the body of common law?


4th and 8th.
 
2011-04-15 12:15:53 PM  
Nothing wrong with checking large bills for counterfeit, but why does it require filling out forms and collecting information on the persons car on every $20 or larger bill? Just get one of those special pens that every gas station & party store uses. within 1 second you know if it's a real bill.
 
2011-04-15 12:17:27 PM  

Theaetetus: The toll worker has authority - and possibly the duty - to verify the bill prior to accepting it.


Which does not require questioning the driver whatsoever..... Question the currency sure,
 
2011-04-15 12:27:21 PM  

TheWhoppah: Detention does not require an actual arrest by a peace officer. They were "detained" if an ordinary reasonable person would not feel free to leave under the same circumstances.

/GED in law


Yes, they were detained by the fact that the toll-worker held their property(change) until he could record personal information. One quick check with an ammonia pen would have eliminated this requirement. Or, three cameras, one on the face one on the tag and another on bill placed on the counter, push one button and done.
 
2011-04-15 12:32:07 PM  
"I had a car full of groceries and wanted to get home," he said. "Every time, I would pull out after one of these detentions, I would think there's something not right about that. But I was in a hurry."

So you know you're going to go through a tollbooth you go through all the time (but you can't be bothered to just get a pass), know it takes longer when you give them big bills, just came from the grocery store, and didn't farking get change?

And you've done this multiple times?

So you're suing?
 
2011-04-15 12:50:37 PM  
There are almost 19 million citizens in Florida.
Suppose 10 million drive cars.
Suppose 2 million have a Sun Pass with an average annual riding balance of $25.
That is makes $50 million on deposit.
At 5% annual interest that is an extra $2,500,000 income for the state government before any tolls are collected.
Also, paying toll workers is an expensive compared to operating the Sun Pass scanners.

The government has an obvious motive to harass and intimidate anyone who uses cash.

The drivers they antagonize won't stop driving; they'll stop paying cash, which will increase government profit.

Some people like to obey their master so they bend over and take it in the ass because it makes them feel safe. Our forefathers called them "Tories" but now we call them "the Republican base."
 
2011-04-15 12:56:46 PM  

Bungles: ProfessorOhki: Tangential, but always wondered if Federal bills are printed with "This note is legal tender for all debts public and private," why is it common to refuse some denominations. If I buy a $2 taco and try to pay with a $100, which you refuse, why isn't it taken as you refusing payment and giving me a free taco. What's the precedent for "we'll take $20, but not $100"

Anyone with a GED in law want to take this one?


In the UK, coins are only legal tender up to set amounts:

£5 (Crown) - for any amount

£2 - for any amount

£1 - for any amount

50p - for any amount not exceeding £10

25p (Crown) - for any amount not exceeding £10

20p - for any amount not exceeding £10

10p - for any amount not exceeding £5

5p - for any amount not exceeding £5

2p - for any amount not exceeding 20p

1p - for any amount not exceeding 20p


Given a lot of US law is based of English common law, perhaps there's a similar rule buried somewhere in your statues?


No, legal tender is legal tender. Some while back a guy made a video where he got his car out of impound after being towed by paying with all pennies. The woman at the office told him no, he called the cops and they told the woman either except his cash or give him his car back free. They took the pennies.
 
2011-04-15 01:09:38 PM  

TheWhoppah: Warrantless detention is permissible when there is reasonable suspicion that a crime has been, or is about to be committed.

/GED in law


I'm pretty sure that using a $20 bill doesn't constitute reasonable suspicion that a crime is being committed to anyone who isn't some dipshiat trying to do something like this.
 
2011-04-15 01:13:19 PM  
What a bunch of worthless dicks.

How hard is it to keep change in your car, especially if you use the tollway frequently? All this lawsuit is going to do if make the State of Florida deny the use of any bill over $1, or $5..

"Illegal detention?" Seriously? And there is some dickbag lawyer who was willing to file this flamind bag of dog-crap suit was well, hope all of them die in a firey car accident.
 
2011-04-15 01:16:01 PM  

jpo2269: What a bunch of worthless dicks.

hope all of them die in a firey car accident.


It never ceases to amaze me the number of people who get upset when you stand up for your rights. And I don't just mean "I disagree with you" I mean "die in a firey(sic) car accident".

I wonder if the Founding Fathers had to deal with idiots like that.
 
2011-04-15 01:17:07 PM  

BurnShrike: I wonder if the Founding Fathers had to deal with idiots like that.


You mean like the redcoats? The King of England?
 
2011-04-15 01:23:10 PM  

Dictatorial_Flair: BurnShrike: I wonder if the Founding Fathers had to deal with idiots like that.

You mean like the redcoats? The King of England?


Well they were on the opposite side of the conflict, so of course they disagreed.
I mean actual people living in the US at the time going "Taxes? Representation? Seriously? I hope you die in a fiery wagon wreck."
 
2011-04-15 01:24:34 PM  

BurnShrike: Dictatorial_Flair: BurnShrike: I wonder if the Founding Fathers had to deal with idiots like that.

You mean like the redcoats? The King of England?

Well they were on the opposite side of the conflict, so of course they disagreed.
I mean actual people living in the US at the time going "Taxes? Representation? Seriously? I hope you die in a fiery wagon wreck."


Oh, so the Royalists then.
 
2011-04-15 01:36:57 PM  
Next up: Lawsuit claiming that having to wait more than five minutes at the DMV constitutes unlawful detention.
 
2011-04-15 01:37:33 PM  

Dictatorial_Flair: BurnShrike: Dictatorial_Flair: BurnShrike: I wonder if the Founding Fathers had to deal with idiots like that.

You mean like the redcoats? The King of England?

Well they were on the opposite side of the conflict, so of course they disagreed.
I mean actual people living in the US at the time going "Taxes? Representation? Seriously? I hope you die in a fiery wagon wreck."

Oh, so the Royalists then.


Not really, because they too aligned themselves against the revolution.

It's the same as the people in the Walmart receipt check thread down below. There are people, who are completely unaffected by the outcome, that get angry when someone else tries to stand up for themselves. I don't understand it.

I know that the school system teaches us to "fall in to line" and respect authority and do as you're told, but it seems that many people absorb that idea so much so that they get angry when they see someone thinking for themselves.
 
2011-04-15 01:41:50 PM  

BurnShrike: I know that the school system teaches us to "fall in to line" and respect authority and do as you're told, but it seems that many people absorb that idea so much so that they get angry when they see someone thinking for themselves.


Oh fine. There were probably some folks like that around, but history forgot about them because their position was meaningless in the end.

And I agree with you on that part. Our school system is over a decade of being hazed into The Group. If you don't join, the hazing never stops.
 
2011-04-15 01:44:01 PM  

jpo2269: "Illegal detention?" Seriously? And there is some dickbag lawyer who was willing to file this flamind bag of dog-crap suit was well, hope all of them die in a firey car accident.


Wanna know how I know you are not a US citizen?

Real Americans understand that our Constitutional protection against UNREASONABLE SEARCH AND SEIZURE protects, first and foremost, against the seizure of our physical bodies!

Do you really believe this nation's government was designed by a bunch of religious refugees and farmers?

Real Americans also understand it was Lawyers that led the revolution and who crafted our Constitution in a way that protects the people FROM the government.

Real Americans understand that lawyers protect our sorry asses even today. Lawyers are the reason your food isn't contaminated with Chinese industrial waste. Lawyers are the reason your children are not retarded from eating lead paint. So quit your biatching about lawyers and show some respect and gratitude.
 
2011-04-15 03:12:36 PM  
If you are detained and it isn't by a law enforcement officer then it is unlawful imprisonment.

They should pursue criminal and civil restitution.
 
2011-04-15 04:17:56 PM  

Ashlea: FTFA:

In 2008, he successfully sued the Polk County School District for access to names, phone numbers, addresses and dependents' names of an estimated 13,000 school employees who receive health care.

That guy sounds like a douche.


How can he get addresses and dependent's names? that sounds like a violation of the privacy act, and if I worked for the school district, I'd sue him back.
 
2011-04-15 06:03:28 PM  
TheWhoppah 2011-04-15 01:44:01 PM
jpo2269: "Illegal detention?" Seriously? And there is some dickbag lawyer who was willing to file this flamind bag of dog-crap suit was well, hope all of them die in a firey car accident.

Wanna know how I know you are not a US citizen?

Real Americans understand that our Constitutional protection against UNREASONABLE SEARCH AND SEIZURE protects, first and foremost, against the seizure of our physical bodies!

Do you really believe this nation's government was designed by a bunch of religious refugees and farmers?
Real Americans also understand it was Lawyers that led the revolution and who crafted our Constitution in a way that protects the people FROM the government.

Real Americans understand that lawyers protect our sorry asses even today. Lawyers are the reason your food isn't contaminated with Chinese industrial waste. Lawyers are the reason your children are not retarded from eating lead paint. So quit your biatching about lawyers and show some respect and gratitude.


This country was not founded by religious refugees, the Pilgrims were a little late to the show, by Jamestown standards.

Lawyers serve a purpose in our society, but stupid ass lawyers who file dumb ass lawsuits deserve all the scorn and mockery they can get. Thankfully this suit was witdrawn, or the taxpayers of Florida would have been needlessly on the hook for the cost of the trial.
 
2011-04-15 06:09:43 PM  
Then make a reasonable compromise.

No detaining the people, but NO CHANGE GIVEN. That would cut out the "large bills" crap real fast.
 
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