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(Law.com)   Judge: "You want how much from LimeWire?" Records Execs: "75 trillion dollars." Judge: "You do know that's five times the national debt, right?" Record Execs: "Potato"   (law.com) divider line 288
    More: Dumbass  
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36928 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Mar 2011 at 2:30 PM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2011-03-22 12:46:55 PM  
See, if people just bought their music legally, record companies would be tens of trillions of dollars richer. These are reasonable damages that are calculated from the actual destructive effect of downloading of music.

Music pirates are the greatest threat to America that has ever been conceived of.

/potato
 
2011-03-22 12:47:08 PM  
Actually, it's a reasonable issue, believe it or not...

The statute is 15 USC 504(c)(1):
"... the copyright owner may elect...to recover, instead of actual damages and profits, an award of statutory damages for all infringements involved in the action, with respect to any one work, for which any one infringer is liable individually, or for which any two or more infringers are liable jointly and severally, in a sum of not less than $750 or more than $30,000 as the court considers just."

The statute allows for statutory damages of between $750-$30k (or up to $150k for willful infringement in 504(c)(2)) per work, "for all infringements involved in the action."
The RIAA's position is that Limewire-UserA is one infringement, Limewire-UserB is another infringement, Limewire-UserC is another infringement, etc. Limewire's position is that if all of those copies are with respect to one work, that they should all be aggregated.

Here, I think the judge is right - it's aggregated by work, which was an explicit change from the old "per page copied" standard back in the mid 1800s.

Now, this doesn't actually help Limewire much. There are over 10,000 works alleged to be infringed here, so they're still looking at between $7.5m and $1.5b in statutory damages.
 
2011-03-22 12:50:43 PM  

SphericalTime: These are reasonable damages that are calculated from the actual destructive effect of downloading of music.


No, they aren't, because they don't have to be: as the statute says, they don't have to calculate. Instead, they can just take the statutory damages set by Congress.

Now, on the other hand, if Limewire claims that the actual damages are $1 per work (as Tenenbaum and Thomas-Rasset have repeatedly, and futilely, claimed), they can provide evidence proving that and the statutory damages can be reduced by the judge. But according to the statute, the burden is on the defense to show the actual damages are so low, not the plaintiff. Blame Congress, not the courts or the RIAA (who should be properly blamed for many other things).
 
2011-03-22 12:57:26 PM  
farm3.static.flickr.com

I will not buy this record, it is crap.
 
2011-03-22 01:02:10 PM  

Theaetetus: SphericalTime: These are reasonable damages that are calculated from the actual destructive effect of downloading of music.

No, they aren't


Satire.

/potato!
 
2011-03-22 01:03:08 PM  
who the hell still uses limewire!?
 
2011-03-22 01:08:41 PM  
give them 100$ each and tell them they won their case!
/dont give them lawyer fees, because that would cost over 9000 trillion dollars.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2011-03-22 01:20:43 PM  
My understanding of U.S. copyright law says the plaintiff can always elect at least the statutory minimum per work copied, even if the evidence proves there was only one copy made at a fair market value of $1.

In reality lawsuits where there was really only one copy made are rare. The statutory award is designed to compensate for a pattern of violations.
 
2011-03-22 01:26:35 PM  

ZAZ: My understanding of U.S. copyright law says the plaintiff can always elect at least the statutory minimum per work copied, even if the evidence proves there was only one copy made at a fair market value of $1.


Pretty much. The plaintiff can elect the statutory damages, at which point they don't have to provide any evidence of fair market value or damages. The defendant can affect the range, by providing the evidence, but yeah, the minimum is going to be $750 unless they can establish that they were innocent infringers and get to the $200 level.

In reality lawsuits where there was really only one copy made are rare. The statutory award is designed to compensate for a pattern of violations.

Yep. Similarly, that $200 level for innocent infringement has never been applied. Bringing the suit costs several thousand, so you aren't going to bother doing so unless the award outweighs that.
 
2011-03-22 01:41:38 PM  
All of the music recorded since Edison's wax cylinders isn't worth $75T in the aggregate. Well, except for Radiohead maybe; they're awesome. And that one Zepplin album with the symbols. But all the rest of it is crap.
 
2011-03-22 01:49:54 PM  

Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?


I know, right? *fires up kazaa*
 
2011-03-22 02:14:52 PM  

Theaetetus: Blame Congress


This is Fark. We don't blame the government for anything it does. It's all the corporations' fault.
 
2011-03-22 02:33:19 PM  
Limewire is one of the finest virus delivery programs out there. If you can't get your hands on the newest version of Bonzi Buddy then it is your go-to source for all the keyloggers and autodialers you'll ever need.
 
2011-03-22 02:33:24 PM  
who the hell still uses limewire!?

It's been years, but I used to. I'm on a mac (not trolling) and it seemed to be the only outlet for all the old, obscure stuff I want on my ipod.

/gonna have to find another outlet
 
2011-03-22 02:34:40 PM  

ZAZ: In reality lawsuits where there was really only one copy made are rare. The statutory award is designed to compensate for a pattern of violations.


which doesn't make sense when you are suing the distribution service, because the calculation already contains every violation on that network, not just representative patterns of violations.
 
2011-03-22 02:34:58 PM  

yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*


you both suck

/opens napster
 
2011-03-22 02:35:03 PM  

Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?


Watch out they are coming for Hotline next!
 
2011-03-22 02:36:42 PM  
Supply and demand. When supply becomes infinite, your business model is shot.
 
2011-03-22 02:38:00 PM  

Andrew Wiggin: yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*

you both suck

/opens napster


pffft

/connect irc.undernet.org
/j #mp3passion
@find *my*song*
/ctcp fserv_bot_name my_song
 
2011-03-22 02:38:31 PM  
images.whatport80.com

Seems fitting, because it's exactly how I feel. This is a Dr. Evil level demand
 
2011-03-22 02:38:35 PM  
I'm curious as to how much money Limewire actually has.... seems like kind of a moot point since they're just going to declare bankruptcy anyway.
 
2011-03-22 02:38:42 PM  
Theaetetus 2011-03-22 12:50:43 PM SphericalTime: These are reasonable damages that are calculated from the actual destructive effect of downloading of music.

No, they aren't, because they don't have to be: as the statute says, they don't have to calculate. Instead, they can just take the statutory damages set by Congress.
================================================================

You are really REALLY bad at detecting sarcasm.

He even did a /potato, and you didn't get it.

You need help, pronto.
 
2011-03-22 02:38:52 PM  
data is cheap, data storage is relatively cheap, internet distribution is relatively cheap... (as in downloading, cds and material is comparatively expensive)

copy right infinitely expensive apparently...
 
2011-03-22 02:39:13 PM  

ne2d: Theaetetus: Blame Congress

This is Fark. We don't blame the government for anything it does. It's all the corporations' fault.


Dude, you can white knight those corporations all you want, they're still not going to sleep with you
 
2011-03-22 02:39:26 PM  

Genju: Andrew Wiggin: yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*

you both suck

/opens napster

pffft

/connect irc.undernet.org
/j #mp3passion
@find *my*song*
/ctcp fserv_bot_name my_song


ppfffft

/kidnaps Crystal Waters
//keeps her in his basement
///feeds her only if she performs "100% pure love"
 
2011-03-22 02:39:38 PM  

Andrew Wiggin: yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*

you both suck

/opens napster


Hai guize!

/starts NNTP client
 
2011-03-22 02:39:39 PM  
i say the judge allows the award, requires the record companies to recognize the gain right away rather than if they ever actually collect, and then tax them on the income. then when they can't pay, we transfer our national debt to the record industry. ta-da, debt-free USA.
 
2011-03-22 02:39:44 PM  
Shareaza FTW.

Limewire? That was cutting edge in the 90's.
 
2011-03-22 02:40:11 PM  

Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?


DJs on Second Life. You know, morons.
 
2011-03-22 02:40:27 PM  
So we are saying that the copyright laws, which are supported by the music lobby and the money the music industry pays to politicians and lawmakers, are inadequate and decisively pro-music industry especially when it comes to defining punitive damage guidelines?

Quite frankly, with the whole "distribution" problem solved by the internet, I do not see why the music "industry" exists anymore? What, to sponsor potential talent for recording studio time? fark that. If an artist is good, they will be able to sell live music until they can afford a few hours in a studio.

I am pro-artist, but anti-industry.
 
2011-03-22 02:42:23 PM  
i get a good bit of my music from bearshare... shiats tight
 
2011-03-22 02:42:30 PM  
People still use LimeWire?

/I stick with mediafire and torrents
//I buy albums from bands I like
 
2011-03-22 02:42:45 PM  
GWSuperfan
Andrew Wiggin: yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*

you both suck

/opens napster

Hai guize!

/starts NNTP client


LOL! Who needs an IP address when the library lets you rip CDs & DVDs for free onto your laptop!
 
2011-03-22 02:42:45 PM  
the only companies i can think of that would have that much money are umbrella corp and north central positronics.
 
2011-03-22 02:43:07 PM  

Andrew Wiggin: yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*

you both suck

/opens napster


Pfeh.
Downloading one file at a time is lame.

*opens μtorrent*
 
kab
2011-03-22 02:43:16 PM  

DarnoKonrad: Supply and demand. When supply becomes infinite, your business model is shot.


Clearly the record industry needs to consult Monsanto on ways to get around this.
 
2011-03-22 02:44:07 PM  

Genju: Andrew Wiggin: yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*

you both suck

/opens napster

pffft

/connect irc.undernet.org
/j #mp3passion
@find *my*song*
/ctcp fserv_bot_name my_song


Might want to also use: //mode $me +x

You're welcome

/fires up thepiratebay.org
 
2011-03-22 02:44:14 PM  

OneTimed: ne2d: Theaetetus: Blame Congress

This is Fark. We don't blame the government for anything it does. It's all the corporations' fault.

Dude, you can white knight those corporations all you want, they're still not going to sleep with you


What if I white knight the government?
 
2011-03-22 02:44:22 PM  

bump: who the hell still uses limewire!?

It's been years, but I used to. I'm on a mac (not trolling) and it seemed to be the only outlet for all the old, obscure stuff I want on my ipod.

/gonna have to find another outlet


[*cough*]piratebay[*cough*]

/ just sayin'
 
kab
2011-03-22 02:44:36 PM  

OneTimed: People still use LimeWire?

/I stick with mediafire and torrents
//I buy albums from bands I like


So you download stuff you dislike?

Interesting hobby.
 
2011-03-22 02:44:41 PM  

yogaFLAME: Weaver95: who the hell still uses limewire!?

I know, right? *fires up kazaa*


Kazaa. Pfft

/fires up eMule
//and a spliff
 
2011-03-22 02:44:50 PM  
Interesting fact: Not every song downloaded = 1 lost sale. People actually download music they wouldn't have purchased, simply because they can!!!

I know a guy...who downloaded the song Mr. Roboto because he wanted to hear it once. he actually hated the song, but he wanted to hear it at that moment. Now if he had the choice of paying two dollars for the song, or not hearing the song at all, he would've chosen the latter, but since he was able to DL it for free, he did.
 
2011-03-22 02:45:43 PM  
Im on 2400 baud dial-up, so I am getting a kick out of these replies.......sssssllllllllllooooooooooowwwwwwwwwwwllllllllllllyyyyyy
 
2011-03-22 02:45:58 PM  

kab: OneTimed: People still use LimeWire?

/I stick with mediafire and torrents
//I buy albums from bands I like

So you download stuff you dislike?

Interesting hobby.


I download to sample. If I like it, I buy it. If I don't...BALEETED
 
2011-03-22 02:46:04 PM  
lol, record companies. Within my lifetime I expect them to die a slow, agonizing death and I will be glad to watch them wither.
 
2011-03-22 02:46:14 PM  

SuburbanCowboy: Interesting fact: Not every song downloaded = 1 lost sale.


That's why courts don't determine damages based on the number of times the file was downloaded.
 
2011-03-22 02:46:16 PM  

ne2d: Theaetetus: Blame Congress

This is Fark. We don't blame the government for anything it does. It's all the corporations' fault.


*sprays water bottle*

Get back into the politics tab, troll.
 
2011-03-22 02:46:44 PM  
The thing is is that they didn't lose that much money. People mostly downloaded it because it cost them nothing. If they were forced to spend money to download it, the number of downloads would be significantly reduced. They areusing flawed logic for their equation.
 
2011-03-22 02:46:53 PM  
Golden years of music piracy, in order of importance:

1.Napster
2.Scour
3.Kazaa
4.Everything else

I mean, I never used limewire back in the day.
 
2011-03-22 02:47:18 PM  
static.zooomr.com
 
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