The 10 Commandments have fark all to do with American law. What laws are based on the 10 Commandments? I think George Carlin actually already covered this but the only two Commandments that have anything to do with our laws are "thou shall not steal" and "thou shall not kill". And I think we could have figured those two on our own.

Of course the "thou shall not kill" one is highly open to interpretation and loopholes.

Dadburns: I think "thou shalt not steal" is too

Possibly. But the "thou shalt not kill" one, they really brought in the "that depends on what your definition of 'is' is" lawyers on that one to justify wars and executions and what not.

Mugato: the "thou shall not kill" one is highly open to interpretation and loopholes.

I believe "Thou shalt not kill" is actually a mistranslation. Although I don't read Hebrew, I've been told a more accurate translation is "Thou shalt not murder" which leaves as OK killing in battle and killing in self-defense.

I've had cases in the McCreary County courthouse. The "historical display" they reference is a series of laminated pages with the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence, and a few other documents on them. Standard 8.5" X 11" printer paper, and I think the text is in 12-point Times New Roman. These are posted on the BACK wall of the courtroom.

The Commandments, on the other hand, are posted on the wall BEHIND THE JUDGE and are nicely painted in six inch script on a 3' X 4' wooden plaque.

give me doughnuts: The Commandments, on the other hand, are posted on the wall

...but apparently not for much longer.

BurnShrike: Ah, the lesser known 11th commandment:

Thou shalt STFU

Too bad more Christians haven't heard about it.

The King James version of it was more specific: "Thou shalt not be a jackass in My Name.

jvl: But thanks to this Supreme Court choice, we know that "posting the Ten Commandments as part of a history lesson in order to pretend you aren't promoting your religion" is not a valid use of the Commandments in secular society.

Nor is placing it someplace you don't own (new window), the grand irony being coveting the use of someone else's space to display a commandment about not coveting things.

DigitalCoffee:
Moses is just one of 18 of historical law givers (both real and fictitious) displayed on the frieze in the Supreme Court: Menes, Hammurabi, Moses, Solomon, Lycurgus, Solon, Draco, Confucius and Octavian (south wall); Justinian, Mohammed, Charlemagne, King John, Louis IX, Hugo Grotius, Sir William Blackstone, John Marshall and Napoleon (north wall). Just adding a little perspective because we all know how those people love to take things out of context... and then severely twist them.



Amen, brother.

Deuteronomy 23:10-13

GWSuperfan: Mugato: the "thou shall not kill" one is highly open to interpretation and loopholes.

I believe "Thou shalt not kill" is actually a mistranslation. Although I don't read Hebrew, I've been told a more accurate translation is "Thou shalt not murder" which leaves as OK killing in battle and killing in self-defense.

Yeah, that's one of the loopholes, "thou shalt not murder". Well what is the death penalty then? What is lobbing a dozen missiles into a foreign country knowing that they'll be killing innocent civilians? how is that not murder?

As for the rest, there aren't any laws against committing adultery. There are no laws against bearing false witness unless you actually swear in front of a judge. There's no law that says you have to take a day off and coveting they neighbor's goods is what our economy is based on.

Cloudchaser Sakonige the Red Wolf: So what's wrong with posting them?

They're being used to express favor to one form of religion over another (particularly in the unequal nature of the display), and causing an unnecessary entanglement of government therewith to no secular purpose.

Cloudchaser Sakonige the Red Wolf: Ah, OK, so in other words, the problem isn't the commandments themselves, is the intent with which they're displayed.

Oversimplifying a bit, yes; that the intentional agent behind the display is of government origin is also a factor.

It's possible to have a 10 Commandments display in a courthouse without gross violation of church-state separation. The SCOTUS building, for example, includes an frieze showing Moses with the two stone tablets -- but while he is central in the display, he is only one figure among perhaps a dozen roughly equal sized law-themed figures; the frieze is at the back side of the court building, well above pedestrian level; and that display apparently does not have the actual text of the commandments, or at least not visible in the pictures I could find with a few minutes Google Image search.

Similarly, it's also possible if the government creates a public forum... if the display is then paid for by private parties (say, the local Knights of Columbus chapter), and if any secularist who wants to put up a display on the legal and political history of church-state separation is also allowed.

Those pushing Ten Commandments and Christmas displays mostly do not seem willing to accept the constraints inherent to either approach.