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(Chicago Sun-Times)   Farrakhan wants proof Bin Laden to blame   (chicagotribune.com) divider line 231
    More: Asinine  
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5155 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Oct 2001 at 2:47 PM (12 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2001-10-17 10:31:21 PM
Christ, you're a goddam idiot!
 
2001-10-17 10:32:35 PM
Simple: Thats bullshiat. No offense, but I don't think anybody here advocates killing innocents, or perpetuating an ideal that we Americans are some kind of master race.

But when you're attacked, and when you're punched hard right in the face like we were, the playing field between peoples is no longer even. We evaluate our moral stance versus the enemy -- and yes we are stronger and better than them. We evaluate our principles, our virtues and our character against the enemy -- and once again we are stronger.

We are forced to prove it now.

If your home was invaded or your family threatened you wouldn't sit aside and get into a morally relativistic trap -- you'd stop the aggressor. Between killing and being killed we choose to kill. Its harsh, but the decision faces everyone in a life-death struggle and the choice has to be made. We've chosen to survive, and to destroy absolutely those responsible.

These are terrorists -- and there can be no political discourse with terrorism. The terrorists are state sponsored by way of funding and havens -- thus the states that support them advocate our destruction and need to be stopped.

The people of Afghanistan are now in the midst of a war with the US because of their ruling power -- they have a choice. They can overthrow the Taliban and renounce terrorism or suffer in the fate of their state. Its farked up and wrong yes, but thats how it is right now -- farked up and wrong. If you live in Afghanistan you should get the fark out of dodge, because the US is ruthless when it comes to war.

When this conflict ends, we'll know the extent of the tragedy (on both sides), and we'll re-examine our foreign policy to keep this from occuring again, whether by installing peaceful regimes, rebuilding, or what have you.

But as far as we're concerned we do represent something special. We do have something to offer the world, and we are important enough as a people that we can justify the actions of our government right now -- however barbaric they might seem.

* woah nelly -- did i just write that? hrmmph. *
 
2001-10-17 10:33:17 PM
Simple - Calm the fuc|AMERICAN GOVERNMENT TO SERVE THE INTERESTS OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. What the he11 is wrong with you!? Given a choice, it's obvious that the life of an American is worth more to the US government than your life. Just as your life is worth more to the Canadian government than mine, you pathetic weak loser.
 
2001-10-17 10:33:19 PM
Dear Simple Jess:

I am sorry if opinions on this site offended you. Please don't run away. Fark welcomes your opinion too. There are a lot of flames that shoot through here, but if you watch for a month you will see the truth rather than the tough veneer of fark.com

Many of the posters here, myself included, are newbies like you. Have no fear or disgust. Except the *really* gross stuff.

Be at peace,
-----------------
Smell my finger?

~ Pinky ~



I'm disgusted. I'm near tears. I think it's pathetic how you Americans think only of your own hides and don't give a damn about anyone except yourselves, that you consider your own lives to be so special and unique that you would be willing to do anything to preserve them, including killing thousands of innocent people in hopes of making a point with someone who may or may not have crashed into one of your big buildings. The world will not stop turning if any of you cease to exist. How can you be so willing to allow the people of Afghanistan to die? Why would you wish the death of Farrakhan? Do any of you have anything that important to contribute to the world that you must ensure your survival at all costs, no matter how ridiculous the meaures you take?

You all act like you're some sort of sacred race that must be preserved. I won't make the obvious analogy to the Nazis and the Aryans. I certainly wouldn't want to see any of you dumb shiats die, but that doesn't mean you're any less expendable than the Afghans.
 
2001-10-17 10:34:09 PM
argh, that should read [Calm the fark down, it is the job of the american government to serve...]
 
2001-10-17 10:35:58 PM
Simple, bin Laden is a murderer. It isn't "may or may not" have crashed, the evidence is overwhelming of his guilt here and it's not crashed into one of our buildings, it's two buildings destroyed that killed 6000 people, and it's not making a point, it's stopping bin Laden. He is a serial killer, he has killed people in the past with his terrorist attacks. If we let him go now, he will kill more people. And while we Americans are the primary targets of his wrath, there are people from around the world who were killed. If he is not stopped, more people from all nations will die.

Is it regrettable that some civilians in Afghanistan are being killed? Yes. That's why the Taliban was given a great deal of time to turn bin Laden over to justice. That's why, when the bombs started falling, they were aimed at military facilities. No, our weapons and our people are not perfect, some civilians have been killed by accident. But again, the Taliban could end it if they wanted to. What does the Taliban contribute to the world that they must ensure their survival while protecting a serial killer?

Simple, if we didn't care about anything but ourselves, there would be a mushroom cloud rising over Afghanistan right about now. That way, we'd get him, and get him now. Another one over Iraq, and even though we'd be hated by more than we are now, we'd be feared. But we do care about more than ourselves, we don't want to kill innocent people. We aren't the ones hijacking planes and flying them into civilian buildings.

As for the comments here...if this is your first encounter with a computer flame fest, well, it's a good idea not to get too hung up on the language used. As a Mac user, I've been told that someone wishes all Mac users would be shot. As a pro-life Republican, I've had similar intemperate language thrown my way. But there has as yet been no jihad launched against pro-life Republican Mac users.

Of course, with Farrakhan--to know him is to hate him.
 
2001-10-17 10:37:03 PM
Simple, Simpleness, Simplicity, Artlessness, Dupe, Veracity, Smallness, Plainness, Imbecility,
Credulity, Remedy, Duty, Poverty

that thesaurus for xmas finally comes in handy
 
2001-10-17 10:37:31 PM
Okay, Minister Farrakhan, you may be right about the governemnt lying to its people in the past, and it probably will lie to its people in the future; you may be right about innocents dying in a war. Unfortunately, that is the price of war, innocents dying. Wake up. Oh, and Simple (I hope that is a Langston Hughes reference..), good points, but you are doing the same thing that we 'Americans' are doing, according to your post: condemning other people based on steroetypical habits and labels.
 
2001-10-17 10:39:51 PM
Mr. Happy, it wasn't so much the picture, as the context. And waiting 5 minutes for a picture to show up might have left me a little on edge too. So, my apologies.

Now, about that "love terrorists" crack--uh, explain?
 
2001-10-17 10:42:38 PM
GadgetDon: Humm, programmer from Iowa. Dude I have no credibility in my profile, but you have credibility.

Just delete your profile and start over because you are now branded a flamer.

*snuff* *snuff*

------------------
Smell my finger?

~ Pinky ~
 
2001-10-17 10:44:47 PM
We should bomb him too !!
 
2001-10-17 10:53:10 PM
Proof? We don't need proof. It's not like we weren't trying to get him before the 11th. Proof. I don't care if it was Colonel Mustard in the library with a candle stick. And if it was Mustard.... we'll get him next!!
 
2001-10-17 10:53:32 PM
GadgetDon you bummed me out....... what can I say? Thats the best rebuttal insult I could come up with at the time. But you know all in all I mean nothing by it. Now I find myself in an awkward position as you have apologised and I'd look like a dick if I didnt. But sincerly yes I do apologise for the lame "you love terrorists" crack.

p.s I did read your reply to my statement in last sundays links - the one where if the argument was to continue do it through email or elsewhere - yeah well I got your email address.... nicely typed up a reply in shiatty hotmail - (and wasnt a short one trust me) hit the fullstop button right at the end and whoa..... yeah you guessed it hotmail shat itself and I lost the whole thing. I'll try and get round to doing it again later.

Sweet as?
 
2001-10-17 10:57:48 PM
And now dear Simple I shall answer your questions:

"that you consider your own lives to be so special and unique that you would be willing to do anything to preserve them"
Actually, we citizens of the US accept danger with brave faces. When opening the mail can endanger the life of your coworkers, your family, and yourself, you face a real risk.

We chose to accept this risk when we chose to retaliate against those who would hold our most dear and sacred thruths as lies. Truths like life is sacred. Truths like "preserve non-combatants", like "Women are worthy of a single shread of respect, or even equality."
Our enemies do not believe these foundations of enlightened thought. They hold quite the contrary in their actions and words. Can anyone here accept that?

"They" do pull us into the mud and filth of war sometimes, but we do not climb into that pit by our own choice. We are dragged in as we try to climb away.

And now we are the terrorists favorite target. I would say that is risking our skins. Just ask Tom Brokaw.

~ Pinky ~
 
2001-10-17 11:02:04 PM
No problems, Mr. Happy. Uh, oh, in the middle of a war thread, it looks like peace may have broken out. Sorry to hear about the hotmail problem. Maybe smaller chunks is better .
 
2001-10-17 11:03:50 PM
Pinky--

"Just delete your profile and start over because you are now branded a flamer."

Just what did you think "Amateur Pundit" meant?
 
2001-10-17 11:10:21 PM
GadgetDon: Okay then go through all the stages of Fark.
Don't delete and start over. Stay who you are.

That makes it easier on me. Thanks.

I am level three. Soon I will learn the secret teachings of level four.

~ Pinky ~
*never uses [/sarcasm] tag.
 
2001-10-17 11:12:38 PM
"Uh, oh, in the middle of a war thread, it looks like peace may have broken out."

lol
 
2001-10-17 11:28:19 PM
So it's been about an hour or so and I came back - "Holy shiat, did I write that?"

While my opinion hasn't changed much, I certainly would have worded it better and more politely if given a second chance. For what it's worth, I'm sorry for flying off the handle. I read every single post starting from the top and I just read so many things that horrified me...so many posts calling for blood and death (that sounds melodramatic, but look - there are lots of posts calling for blood and/or death of someone....at times multiple someones).

I'm young and naive and I think this world is a fantastic place. I still find it awe-inspiring how many amazing things we've created and feats we've accomplished. It's sad that the same species that landed on the moon and creates beautiful works of art like the Sistine Chapel and builds impossibly tall buildings like your World Trade Center has to resort to such things as brutish and ineffective as war.

Stinkypinky, Nordolio and Gagetdon - thanks for being more polite in replying to me than I was in addressing you. I'm sorry for over-generalizing the American population...I recognize that with 300 million of you, there's bound to be some diversity somewhere.
 
2001-10-18 01:16:44 AM
Cheers brutha

No more wars, no more bloodshed. Peace unto you. Shalom, salaam, forever.
On signing the Egyptian-Israeli peace treaty, Washington, D.C. (March 26, 1979)
 
2001-10-18 06:42:42 AM
Here is a message to all you simpletons screaming
"Show me Proof!
Trusting the Leadership is Wrong!
I Have The Right to Know National Security Issues!"
The United states has managed, with proof given to other global leaders, including... MUSLIM, Communist, and Socialist (ALL the harshest critics of American Global Policy), to put together a global coalition of size and scope not seen since WW2.
Just because you didn't get a written farking letter, signed by the leadership, outlining why we, as a nation, are hunting down an AVOWED murderer, based on the currently secret (National and Global security applies) information bearing the proof (As reviewed and agreed by former political and ethical advisary nations, including... IRAN) that Bin Laden is behind the attacks and the Taliban and has chosen to aid and abet the suspect if not actually have partaken in some aspects of the actual attack, boo farking hoo!! Get over it. You are Joe and Jane Citizen.
You don't live in a "Free World". Whether American, British, South African or Martian (Legal Alien). You're on this planet, you are not FREE. God help you if there were a truley free nation. There would be no government, law enforcement, etc. These things are, by their very definition, the antithesis of freedom. They are tools that govern and enforce the laws that are, essentially, the circumvention of your freedoms.
Anyhow, back to the real point. Farah-CON is a Racist, bigoted, race-traitor and hypocrit. He lies, steals and cheats the people he claimes to represent. This man lives under the protection of a nation he reviles (Though refuses to dis-patriate from) and questions the same authority he refuses to answer to.
To even remotely elude to validating his moronic rantings and whinings is ridiculous.
As for knowing the justifications for hunting down Bin Laden bringing to task the Taliban for sheltering, aiding and supporting him, you are NOT in the "Need To Know" faction of governmental affairs so get over it!
Here is all you need to know...
The World leaders have seen the proof - They agree.
The Taliban has "Dictated Terms" - Not acceptable.
Bin Laden RUNS, FINANCES and IS the Taliban Leader- He ain't given himslef up.
The battle we fight is the price they pay for the attack and support of the attackers and the price we pay for trying to regain some sense of security and strength.
To demand the governement justify their actions in this by exposing the Proof would probably breach the security of both thye proof and the sources used to obtain the proof.
National Security is National Security.
Farah-CON is a jack-ass and You, if you don't get it, are stupid.
'Nuff Said. Fark ON!@
 
2001-10-18 06:52:23 AM
PS...
This is not an "Attack on Afghanistan" it is an attack on a militant, Extremist, Terrrorist harboring Regime that has taken the Afghan people Hostage. Osama Bin Laden and his puppet governement, The Taliban.
When we fought in Europe, civilians were killed, by no intent of doing so but because, in war, collateral casualities are a FACT. Sad but true. It isn't as if we could say, "Everyone out of the country but our targets, we have a war to fight and you're in the way."
War is ugly, scary, horrifying and in some cases, NECESSARY. It is the weapon we have to dispatch monsters more horrifying than the war itself.
 
2001-10-18 07:22:56 AM
more comments than a photoshop, yet less satisfying.
 
2001-10-18 07:27:51 AM
**********FUNDIE ALERT --- FUNDIE ALERT***********

Farrakan speaks on race

http://www.finalcall.com/MLFspeaks/race.html

Now if he isnt a fundie i dunno who is. No branch of religion (other than KKK-ism) promotes racial superiourity (sp.).
 
2001-10-18 08:42:12 AM
Simple, ever been to a football game, at least in the states? Ever hear what some of those people are saying about the opposite team? And yet, outside of Texas, football is rarely associated with bloodshed. So, when you hear "kill the Taliban" and "Nuke afghanistan", what you're really hearing is a version of Tom Brokaw saying "I'm so angry I can't express it in socially acceptable terms." Now, it may be telling about who they have chosen for the targets of their anger (bin Laden or Taliban or Afghanistanians or Muslems or Arabs), but for the battle.

There is something more effective and less brutal than war, it's rule of law. If bin Laden had been living in Canada, we wouldn't be going to war with Canada, because Canada would extradite him. If the Taliban respected rule of law, they would have extradited bin Laden, and the war would never have happened. But they don't. And so the options are, force our way in to get him, or leave bin Laden in there untouched ready to prepare his next mass murder. And as brutal as war is, it sometimes is quite effective against those who will respond to nothing less.
 
2001-10-18 10:32:24 AM
Simple - "I'm disgusted. I'm near tears. I think it's pathetic how you Americans think only of your own hides and don't give a damn about anyone except yourselves, that you consider your own lives to be so special and unique that you would be willing to do anything to preserve them, including killing thousands of innocent people in hopes of making a point with someone who may or may not have crashed into one of your big buildings. The world will not stop turning if any of you cease to exist. How can you be so willing to allow the people of Afghanistan to die? Why would you wish the death of Farrakhan? Do any of you have anything that important to contribute to the world that you must ensure your survival at all costs, no matter how ridiculous the meaures you take?

You all act like you're some sort of sacred race that must be preserved. I won't make the obvious analogy to the Nazis and the Aryans. I certainly wouldn't want to see any of you dumb shiats die, but that doesn't mean you're any less expendable than the Afghans."

Exactly, the world will not stop spinning if all of us Americans die tomorrow. It will also continue to spin if all the Afghans die tomorrow. In fact it will keep spinning if everyone in your country dies tomorrow. That does not however negate our right to preserve our own lives. Cry all the tears you want but when it comes down to a choice between defending my homeland and preserving my own life and the lives of my countrymen or rolling over and dieing the choice is obvious. Now you know I'm an American and what we Americans will do to assure our own survival. What is your nationality? Let's examine your countries history and see what they have done in the interest of self-preservation.
 
2001-10-18 02:06:41 PM
damn HBS...how much of what you have is there because of americans? how much of it do u have b/c of americans...more then you might think...not saying america is god supirior but think about the freedom that americans have to invent what they want, do business how the want, give foreign aid to almost every third world country (even the ones we bomb), i think you are just ignorant to the facts. how many countries have given us aid in the past like, during the depression, or any other crisis in america...shiat none that i can think of...maybe you need to read the article that some canadian wrote some years back about americans...
 
maz
2001-10-18 02:28:46 PM
Frksamor: you said it man!
 
2001-10-18 02:38:54 PM
Joesf33-psst-HBS didn't write that part in quotes, he was quoting the comment he was responding to.
 
2001-10-18 03:08:15 PM
damnit...my bad....
 
2001-10-18 05:39:53 PM
Joesf33
damnit...my bad....

No problem dude.
 
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