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(NPR)   We know you've been waiting breathlessly for mid-east expert Jimmy Carter to weigh in on the Egypt situation. Well, wait no longer   (npr.org) divider line 190
    More: Interesting, Jimmy Carter, Middle East, Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, Egypt, Six Day War, Ayatollah Khomeini, diplomatic missions of the United States, Islamic Revolution  
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9796 clicks; posted to Main » on 31 Jan 2011 at 8:05 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2011-01-31 08:46:16 PM  
Ronald Reagan cured polio.
 
2011-01-31 08:47:01 PM  

hasty ambush: MaxxLarge: Yeah, you're right, Subby. What the hell would Jimmy Carter know about helping out the peace process in Egypt? It's not like HE ever pitched in, and aided in accomplishing anything of lasting significance over there. He should just shut up, and -

Oh, wait...

About that "peace":


You do know that Sadat was killed by an Egyptian radical opposed to the peace accord with Israel, right?
 
2011-01-31 08:47:19 PM  

MBooda: Lenny_da_Hog: And 8 soldiers giving their lives trying isn't good enough for you, is it. Most people called them heroes; you call them failures.

Actually, I called the Carter Doctrine a failure. The aircrew and marines (NOT soldiers; please, if you must misrepresent, check your facts) were victims of that failure.


And what would you have done?

Seriously? Kill the hostages by invading Iran?

And if invading Iran was the right choice, why do you not hold Reagan up to the same standard?
 
2011-01-31 08:47:36 PM  
I like Carter-basing as much as the next guy (history's greatest monster and all), but this is something he's actually pretty farking qualified to discuss.
 
2011-01-31 08:52:13 PM  

Gulper Eel: Nadie_AZ: I'm trying to understand your point. Do you have one?

Carter's been bum-tonguing dictators, bigots and torturers for 45 years now, kissing up to whatever sonofabiatch could advance his political career, but when the cameras roll he puts on his pious international-Mister-Rogers face and there will always be useful idiots around to eat it up.


And our other ex presidents weren't involved in yapping it up with dictators and bigots and torturers?
 
2011-01-31 08:52:49 PM  
And what do you mean by 'political career'? He hasn't run for office since he lost it. That I know of.
 
2011-01-31 08:53:41 PM  
Regardless of what your opinion of Jimmy Carter is, I found that article rather lacking in substance.
 
2011-01-31 08:54:26 PM  

Lenny_da_Hog: And what would you have done?


For starters,
photos.webridestv.com

Seriously, Reagan came up with a solution that got the hostages home. I suspect it may have involved the threat of something like the above. Worked for me.

Now, what would you have done?
 
2011-01-31 08:55:59 PM  

Gulper Eel: LOVES 'em.


Thank FSM we haven't had any other presidents who might seem chummy with despicable despots to further US interests! Who could ever respect them again!?
www.corbisimages.com
lh6.ggpht.com
i9.photobucket.com
i9.photobucket.com
 
2011-01-31 08:57:26 PM  
i866.photobucket.com

No: I've got your picture lining my toilet and I crap straight down.
 
2011-01-31 08:57:38 PM  
Bagging on Carter is like bagging on California. Just makes you look like a hater.

/also rap music and bicyclists
 
2011-01-31 08:57:47 PM  

I am not a Limivore: Nobody gives a shiat what Jimmy Carter thinks.

/About anything.


Well, few people with IQs below 90 do, but over on the sunny side of the bell curve, the guy is respected. I know you can't see that sunny side from where you are so you'll just have to trust the smarter half.
 
2011-01-31 09:02:24 PM  
Carter love. Explain.

/I may or may not be in the mood for this.
 
2011-01-31 09:05:18 PM  

Gulper Eel: Carter's been bum-tonguing dictators, bigots and torturers for 45 years now, kissing up to whatever sonofabiatch could advance his political career, but when the cameras roll he puts on his pious international-Mister-Rogers face and there will always be useful idiots around to eat it up.


I don't think that's entirely fair. Like any other politician, he meets with these people to talk to them. What they actually talk about, who the hell knows? The fact is that any time two politicians get together, by law, there needs to be a photo-op. That usually means smiling and shaking hands (optionally embracing a lion). I can respect the fact that, regardless of what they talked about, he travels around the world to meet with various world leaders to try and learn what's going on. I wish our more recent presidents were more willing to engage with in-person talks even (especially) with people that they're having problems with. It's a little biatchildish to try and tell them that they can't come in your clubhouse any more.
 
2011-01-31 09:05:37 PM  

MBooda: Lenny_da_Hog: And what would you have done?

For starters,


Seriously, Reagan came up with a solution that got the hostages home. I suspect it may have involved the threat of something like the above. Worked for me.

Now, what would you have done?


Of course anybody who knows anything of recent history knows that they were on the way home and Reagan delayed it. The Iranians hated Carter big time and loved Reagan as he was very happy to sell them weapons as his people made clear early one.
In fiction they have this thing called "willing suspension of disbelieve" but in politics I guess we need to call it something more like "deluded suspension" just for folks like you.
 
2011-01-31 09:06:02 PM  
GRASS PARKING LOT!
bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com
 
2011-01-31 09:06:28 PM  
The easiest ways to determine if someone is an idiot with regards to politics:

1) Has "concerns" about president Obama's country of origin.
2) Believes a flat tax is "fair".
3) Thinks racism is a thing of the past.
4) Repeats the phrase "the government is the problem, not the solution".
5) Hates Jimmy Carter.
 
2011-01-31 09:07:33 PM  

JSTACAT: Anyone! Anywhere, even Ronnie Regan's teddy bear collection,
someone gotta steer the ship of state...
its going onto the rocks!


On what farking planet does anyone besides retards and standup comics miss Bush?
 
2011-01-31 09:08:44 PM  

mccallcl: Bagging on Carter is like bagging on California. Just makes you look like a hater.

/also rap music and bicyclists



I was a teenager and just started driving when Carter was president. Gas prices doubled and there was freaking punk-ass GAS RATIONING here in CA. WTF man? Dude f*cked up the hostage rescue attempt and we bailed out on the Olympics.

Bitter I am.

Worst President EVAR!
 
2011-01-31 09:09:43 PM  

MBooda: Seriously, Reagan came up with a solution that got the hostages home. I suspect it may have involved the threat of something like the above. Worked for me.


The release was agreed to in the Algiers Accords in the final weeks of the Carter administration. The hostages were released minutes after Reagan was inaugurated only to spite Carter.
 
2011-01-31 09:09:48 PM  

eggrolls: hasty ambush: MaxxLarge: Yeah, you're right, Subby. What the hell would Jimmy Carter know about helping out the peace process in Egypt? It's not like HE ever pitched in, and aided in accomplishing anything of lasting significance over there. He should just shut up, and -

Oh, wait...

About that "peace":

You do know that Sadat was killed by an Egyptian radical opposed to the peace accord with Israel, right?


Reality and facts have a liberal bias.
 
2011-01-31 09:10:16 PM  

Nadie_AZ: And our other ex presidents weren't involved in yapping it up with dictators and bigots and torturers?


Carter's the one who gets the fawning treatment for his devotion to "peace" even though his actions have brought every bit as much misery as those who came before and after him.
 
2011-01-31 09:10:20 PM  
Came for the "We the O-botsTM and LibtardsTM are smarter than you and will continue to be smug about it". And now I leave, knowing the wards of the state are still happily hammering out apologist rants from the safety of mumsies basement.
 
2011-01-31 09:15:32 PM  

Gulper Eel: Nadie_AZ: I'm trying to understand your point. Do you have one?

Carter's been bum-tonguing dictators, bigots and torturers for 45 years now, kissing up to whatever sonofabiatch could advance his political career, but when the cameras roll he puts on his pious international-Mister-Rogers face and there will always be useful idiots around to eat it up.


How do you tie your shoes when you see the world through those fun-house distortion glasses? Why did the Iranians refuse to release the hostages while Carter was president but did so as soon as Reagan was inaugurated? Because he promised to sell them weapons when Carter wouldn't. But you believe in Hollywood-hype Rambo-Reagan in defiance of the facts. I wish you joy in your gay cluster-fark as biatch for Sly Stone, Arnie and Chuck N.
 
2011-01-31 09:16:36 PM  

MBooda: Lenny_da_Hog: And what would you have done?

For starters,


Seriously, Reagan came up with a solution that got the hostages home. I suspect it may have involved the threat of something like the above. Worked for me.

Now, what would you have done?


Given that the Iranian hostages were released the day Reagan assumed office, the only way he could have been even partially responsible for their freedom would be if the Reagan campaign had been in secret negotiation with a hostile foreign power, undermining the efforts and policies of the then-president.

That's called treason.
 
2011-01-31 09:18:25 PM  

novusordo: I don't think that's entirely fair. Like any other politician, he meets with these people to talk to them. What they actually talk about, who the hell knows? The fact is that any time two politicians get together, by law, there needs to be a photo-op. That usually means smiling and shaking hands (optionally embracing a lion).


I remember Carter's '76 campaign.

He was going to be above all that. Human rights were going to be the soul of his foreign policy. No longer would we dirty our hands with tyrants and monsters. I daresay hope and change were in the air.

And then he takes office and it's like Henry Kissinger never stopped pulling the strings. Nicolae Ceausescu, you old rascal. C'mon over to DC and let me and Ros show you around.

Repugnant.

George McGovern voted for Gerald Ford over Carter for a damn good reason.
 
2011-01-31 09:20:20 PM  
Don't worry, Jimmy, your protege will fark up the Egyptian Revolution just the way you did the Iranian one. Then, maybe we'll end up with an Islamic republic in charge of the Suez Canal.

Just as Carter and his advisers told the Shah they were behind him 100%, while at the same time encouraging the military to overthrow him, Obama never saw Egypt coming, and maybe still doesn't.

Just a few weeks ago, Joe Biden called Mubarak a great ally, and refused to label him a dictator. This week, Hillary Clinton has already tossed him aside, saying an orderly transition to democracy was Mubarak's responsibilty.

And, just as the Iranian Revolution began as a popular uprising by a confederacy of groups from all socio-economic and political stripes, and was hijacked by the imams after the Shah's deposition, the game in Egypt could turn on a dime. The lessons of 1979 seem to have been lost on the current U.S. administration, but you can rest assured they are remembered by Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood.
 
2011-01-31 09:22:40 PM  

I_Mentioned_The_Bisque: Carter love. Explain.


As someone old enough to have voted for the man...twice, I can give you my perspective.

First of all, I'm confident you're aware that President Carter was not loved during his tenure, and that the voters turned him out in the worst case of buyer's remorse of the past century, maybe ever (in US politics). That said, even in his time he was widely admired for his honesty, candor and humility. He talked the talk, but he also walked the walk...even when it wasn't in our best political interests or in the best interests of our "allies".

His crowning achievement, of course, was the Camp David Accords, for which imo he richly deserved the Nobel. Add to that his legacy of continued public service to humanity in the decades since, and time has only solidified his standing as a towering giant of moral strength, along the lines of Gandhi or Mandela.

When Jimmy Carter says it's time for Mubarak to go, it's time for him to go.
 
2011-01-31 09:23:26 PM  
Jimmy Carter might be a crazy old man, but his heart's in the right place.
 
2011-01-31 09:23:49 PM  
Some of you are so stupid it gave me a yeast infection in my anus.
 
2011-01-31 09:24:48 PM  

eggrolls: MBooda: Lenny_da_Hog: And what would you have done?

For starters,


Seriously, Reagan came up with a solution that got the hostages home. I suspect it may have involved the threat of something like the above. Worked for me.

Now, what would you have done?

Given that the Iranian hostages were released the day Reagan assumed office, the only way he could have been even partially responsible for their freedom would be if the Reagan campaign had been in secret negotiation with a hostile foreign power, undermining the efforts and policies of the then-president.

That's called treason.


Good thing Saint Jimmy Carter never would have done such a foul and underhanded thing. Oh, wait...

In November 1990, two months after Iraq's invasion of Kuwait, Carter wrote a letter to the heads of state of the permanent members of the United Nations Security Council. He urged the countries to drop their support for Bush's proposed military solution. Instead, as Douglas Brinkley outlines in The Unfinished Presidency, his glowing but not uncritical assessment of Carter's post-presidential years, Carter asked the countries to give "unequivocal support to an Arab League effort" for peace. (As Brinkley notes, Carter's anti-war position conflicted with the Carter Doctrine he had outlined as president: Any "attempt by any outside force to gain control of the Persian Gulf region will be regarded as an assault on the vital interests of the United States of America, and such force will be repelled by any means necessary, including military force.") Right up to Bush's Jan. 15 deadline for war, Carter continued his shadow foreign policy campaign.

--

After meeting with Kim Il Sung, Carter went live on CNN International without telling the administration. His motive: Undermine the Clinton administration's efforts to impose U.N. sanctions on North Korea. Carter believed sanctions threatened the agreement he had worked out. By speaking directly to the world about the prospects for peace, he knowingly encouraged countries like Russia and China, which were resisting a sanctions regime. According to Brinkley, a Clinton Cabinet member referred to Carter as a "treasonous prick" for his behavior.
 
2011-01-31 09:25:17 PM  

Babwa Wawa: The Camp David Accords are the very reason there's still a Palestinian "question." Egypt was and is the only middle eastern country that can threaten Israel militarily. By taking that threat off the table, Israel has had no compelling reason to settle the question for over 30 years now*.

Combine that with the complete mishandling of the Iranian revolution (before, during and after), and there is absolutely no reason to give any credit to what Carter says about region.

*Of course, Palestine only really ever mattered to the Palestinians anyway. For all the countries out there, it's just a useful geopolitical pawn.


so if he hadn't helped a peace process, there would have been a war in the middle east to end all problems there? got it.

why did he mishandle it? he learned from his mistake at camp david and decided to leave a military threat in Iran in place. That way, they could start a war that will end all problems there.
 
2011-01-31 09:27:50 PM  

Genevieve Marie: I do.

He's usually right.


if this country had continued his concern for energy efficiency these last 30 years, we wouldn't give a crap what was going on in the middle east right now because we'd have no horse in that race.

/why the fark would you take down solar panels that are functioning? What message does that send?
//knows exactly what message that sent.
 
2011-01-31 09:30:08 PM  

Gulper Eel: Nadie_AZ: I'm trying to understand your point. Do you have one?

Carter's been bum-tonguing dictators, bigots and torturers for 45 years now, kissing up to whatever sonofabiatch could advance his political career, but when the cameras roll he puts on his pious international-Mister-Rogers face and there will always be useful idiots around to eat it up.


3.bp.blogspot.com
lh6.ggpht.com
obama.skipnelson.com
www-personal.umich.edu
Hypocrite much? Politicians always kiss up to bad regimes for political reasons...
 
2011-01-31 09:32:24 PM  

StoneColdAtheist: His crowning achievement, of course, was the Camp David Accords, for which imo he richly deserved the Nobel.


Starting the ball rolling 30 years of spending billions to prop up an Egyptian police state, while simultaneously enabling dictators in Morocco and Rumania to continue squelching human rights because they were the key go-betweens in the Sadat-Begin deal...please explain how all that jibes with peace.
 
2011-01-31 09:34:26 PM  

Obnox: Despite Carter's painting by the GOP as weak, he was as much a practitioner of realpolitik as any other player on the stage at that time. He might not have been as cynical as some other presidents we know and love, but he was anything but a shrinking violet. And he never peered into Brezhnev's soul and gave him a nickname.


I've wondered what it felt like for Putin to meet GW Bush and realize, that the man was completely unimportant as far as Russia was concerned.
 
2011-01-31 09:35:10 PM  

Gleeman: Hypocrite much? Politicians always kiss up to bad regimes for political reasons...


Then it's Nobel Peace Prizes for everybody!
 
2011-01-31 09:38:55 PM  

Gleeman: Gulper Eel: Nadie_AZ: I'm trying to understand your point. Do you have one?

Carter's been bum-tonguing dictators, bigots and torturers for 45 years now, kissing up to whatever sonofabiatch could advance his political career, but when the cameras roll he puts on his pious international-Mister-Rogers face and there will always be useful idiots around to eat it up.

Hypocrite much? Politicians always kiss up to bad regimes for political reasons...


Forgot one, sparky.

i255.photobucket.com
 
2011-01-31 09:41:44 PM  
images.cheezburger.com

//hot like Egypt
 
2011-01-31 09:42:41 PM  
i2.photobucket.com

i2.photobucket.com
 
2011-01-31 09:43:33 PM  
img407.imageshack.us
 
2011-01-31 09:44:18 PM  

Gulper Eel: Obnox: Disappointing that Carter likes Suleiman, America's favorite out-source for torture. But I shouldn't be surprised.

Despite Carter's painting by the GOP as weak, he was as much a practitioner of realpolitik as any other player on the stage at that time.

He was the worst of both: a weak realist.

Not only did he broker the Sadat-Begin deal through sick farks like Ceausescu and King Hassan, what was accomplished was not peace. There was only an absence of official military hostilities, with the underlying hatreds tamped down by our money bankrolling the Sadat/Mubarak police state.

Maybe if we'd simply stayed out of the way and let the two sides fight it out, a guy like Muhammad Atta would've simply joined the Egyptian army and never been heard from.


From Jimmy Carter to Mohammad Atta. I have to hand it to you, that took the kind of reacharound that R. Lee Ermey would approve of.
 
2011-01-31 09:46:20 PM  

mccallcl: Bagging on Carter is like bagging on California. Just makes you look like a hater.

/also rap music and bicyclists


You cannot use the term music to describe rap. It would be like calling what Mapplethorpe does art.
 
2011-01-31 09:50:14 PM  
nice to hear some different voices instead of the usual derp from the usual suspects...
 
2011-01-31 09:50:35 PM  

therealpope: I use to think Jimmy was the worst President ever....but then came Reagan Bush Clinton Bush.


Better
 
2011-01-31 09:50:51 PM  

rga184: Genevieve Marie: I do.

He's usually right.

if this country had continued his concern for energy efficiency these last 30 years, we wouldn't give a crap what was going on in the middle east right now because we'd have no horse in that race.

/why the fark would you take down solar panels that are functioning? What message does that send?
//knows exactly what message that sent.


It sent the message that energy efficiency was for stupid liberals.

I've always hated that particular gesture. The money had already been spent, so the Reagan administration wasn't saving any money by taking them down. It defies all logic.
 
2011-01-31 09:51:32 PM  

Sarcastica75: Some of you are so stupid it gave me a yeast infection in my anus.


That's hot...
 
2011-01-31 10:02:37 PM  

Gulper Eel: StoneColdAtheist: His crowning achievement, of course, was the Camp David Accords, for which imo he richly deserved the Nobel.

Starting the ball rolling 30 years of spending billions to prop up an Egyptian police state, while simultaneously enabling dictators in Morocco and Rumania to continue squelching human rights because they were the key go-betweens in the Sadat-Begin deal...please explain how all that jibes with peace.


I was explaining the love, in case you overlooked that part.
 
2011-01-31 10:06:07 PM  

Sarcastica75: Some of you are so stupid it gave me a yeast infection in my anus.


You know, I wasn't going to be very impressed with you... but then you worked both "yeast infection" and "anus" into one post. One sentence!

Now that's some damn Mensa ninja shiat, right there.
 
2011-01-31 10:15:49 PM  

K.B.O. Winston: Sarcastica75: Some of you are so stupid it gave me a yeast infection in my anus.

You know, I wasn't going to be very impressed with you... but then you worked both "yeast infection" and "anus" into one post. One sentence!

Now that's some damn Mensa ninja shiat, right there.


I'm concise with the badinage.
 
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