I like how they gloss over the fact that he never even had the job.

Civil rights aside, it's interesting the number of religions that have decided that "god" likes facial hair.

A supposedly all-knowing, all-powerful, all-compassionate being hung up on such fashion minutiae.

Really.

It's obviously a Muslim conspiracy to try to establish Sharia law. First a good Christian jail has to allow their extremist beards. Next it'll be prayer breaks six times a day, Halal food, and then it'll slide straight into building a mosque. Oh, hang on, did someone say Sikh? Is that a kind of extremist fundamentalist Muslim?

msnbc really doesn't know how to build a website.

He does seem kind of old to be starting his zookeeper gig.



What a real prison guard should look like.


works at Angola Prison now

Step 1: Research jobs with restrictions that would disqualify you from working in that capacity.

Step 2: Apply for job.

Step 3: Get disqualified because of the restriction you researched.

Step 4: Sue / profit.

pieterh: It's obviously a Muslim conspiracy to try to establish Sharia law. First a good Christian jail has to allow their extremist beards. Next it'll be prayer breaks six times a day, Halal food, and then it'll slide straight into building a mosque. Oh, hang on, did someone say Sikh? Is that a kind of extremist fundamentalist Muslim?

THIS

"Why should those who cannot shave for religious reasons be treated differently from those who cannot shave for medical reasons?"

He's not. One of the requirements is be able to wear a gas mask. This applies to everyone equally.

I can see the respirator requirement, in fact I'm stuck with it because my job requires frequent respirator use, too.

How about a beard-friendly respirator to solve this problem for all the bearded men of the world? Rather than pandering to just one invisible friend support group it would pander to beards across the globe.

Guess he'll need to Sikh out a different job...

/sorry.

Tatsuma: As a man very likely to have the longest beard of all posters in this thread

I once won a beard growing contest in college, but I am not ashamed to say you probably have me beat.

Probably.

pieterh: It's obviously a Muslim conspiracy to try to establish Sharia law. First a good Christian jail has to allow their extremist beards. Next it'll be prayer breaks six times a day, Halal food, and then it'll slide straight into building a mosque. Oh, hang on, did someone say Sikh? Is that a kind of extremist fundamentalist Muslim?


It has nothing to do with religion, as a firefighter I was not allowed to have facial hair. The air masks you had to wear would not work if you did.

If I had a beard and went in for a job and got it without shaving it off, he would have a case.
.
He will probably win this case though and get the job, then we will see another law suit from him in two years when he gets hurt because his gas mask fails.


I think I am going to change my name to mohammed_psycho and get started on suing someone. Seems like a sweet gig.

"FRANCIS: Why are you always on about women, Stan?

STAN: I want to be one.

REG: What?

STAN: I want to be a woman. From now on, I want you all to call me 'Loretta'.

REG: What?!

LORETTA: It's my right as a man.

JUDITH: Well, why do you want to be Loretta, Stan?

LORETTA: I want to have babies.

REG: You want to have babies?!

LORETTA: It's every man's right to have babies if he wants them.

REG: But... you can't have babies.

LORETTA: Don't you oppress me.

REG: I'm not oppressing you, Stan. You haven't got a womb! Where's the foetus going to gestate?! You going to keep it in a box?!

LORETTA: crying

JUDITH: Here! I-- I've got an idea. Suppose you agree that he can't actually have babies, not having a womb, which is nobody's fault, not even the Romans', but that he can have the right to have babies.

FRANCIS: Good idea, Judith. We shall fight the oppressors for your right to have babies, brother. Sister. Sorry.

REG: What's the point?

FRANCIS: What?

REG: What's the point of fighting for his right to have babies when he can't have babies?!

FRANCIS: It is symbolic of our struggle against oppression.

REG: Symbolic of his struggle against reality..."

beards mess up gas-tight so no gasmask for you. if no gasmask, no job as guard. seems simple until `rights` or `religion` get in the way of common sense...

I'm pretty sure the road is supposed to be a metaphor.

LOGICAL_PSYCHO: I think I am going to change my name to mohammed_psycho and get started on suing someone. Seems like a sweet gig.

FYI: Sikhism has nothing to do with Mohammed or Islam. I know you were making a joke. But just wanted to clarify.

bigfatdave: I can see the respirator requirement, in fact I'm stuck with it because my job requires frequent respirator use, too.

How about a beard-friendly respirator to solve this problem for all the bearded men of the world? Rather than pandering to just one invisible friend support group it would pander to beards across the globe.

The biggest problem with that becomes the airtight seal required for gasmask use. You have to get the seal somewhere, and allowing for beards means the mask itself starts to get larger and bulkier to be able to reach somewhere where a seal can be made.

/so glad I don't have to shave my beard anymore.
//also glad I don't have to do the gas chamber yearly anymore.

shivashakti: LOGICAL_PSYCHO: I think I am going to change my name to mohammed_psycho and get started on suing someone. Seems like a sweet gig.

FYI: Sikhism has nothing to do with Mohammed or Islam. I know you were making a joke. But just wanted to clarify.

Point taken......Guru_psycho?


/joke

Well if things don't work in Cali he can always come to NY and sue. Guards are not allowed to have beards here either.

Places of employment have dress/appearance codes. If you don't agree with it, find a different farking job. I'm tired of these brown people expecting everyone to change the rules just for them.

I imagine him standing outside the prison shower, and as the cons file out he says to each one in Apu Nahasapemapetalan's accent, "Thank you, rape again."

I'm all for freedom of religion but I also think the idea that your deity cares whether you shave or not is pretty silly. The fact is if you have a beard your protective mask cannot seal and how are you going to beat prisoners after tossing a few cans of CS cans into the yard if you can't get a seal?

"Why should those who cannot shave for religious reasons be treated differently from those who cannot shave for medical reasons?"

Because one of those is something you want to do, and one of those is something you have to do.

The solution, though, is simple. The guy should just claim it's for medical reasons. When they ask him what the medical reason is, just say...

..."I'm Sikh."

Fine, don't have a policy that says you can't have a beard. Just have one that says you have to pass a gas mask test. If the guy wants to put a mask over his beard and get a face full of tear gas, it will be a win/win. Either he passes, or you get several moments of amusement watching his reaction.

CraicBaby: That sucks. Up here, we have Sikh police officers and they're allowed to have beards and turbans.

There is a REASON.

They need to (sometimes) wear gas masks.

The guards need to be able to count on each other to operate even after teargas is deployed. This is a valid concern.

I have a beard, and when I try to use a respirator for spraying finishes there is always leakage and I end up shaving for the day.

It would be different if it were an aesthetic thing, but it is a job function thing.

Sorry if your invisible sky wizard hosed you, but it ain't the prison's fault.

"Why should those who cannot shave for religious reasons be treated differently from those who cannot shave for medical reasons?" reads the letter

They aren't. While the law technically allows exceptions in the case of medical necessity, the official has clearly stated on the record that the policy is to allow no exceptions whatsoever.

So someone who can't shave for medical reasons won't be hired either.

Hilary T. N. Seuss: Fine, don't have a policy that says you can't have a beard. Just have one that says you have to pass a gas mask test. If the guy wants to put a mask over his beard and get a face full of tear gas, it will be a win/win. Either he passes, or you get several moments of amusement watching his reaction.

Gas mask tests don't work that way. You wear the mask and are exposed to either a machine-detectable gas or (more commonly) something that smells really strongly.

Khalsa Sikhs are required to:

Maintain 5 K's:

* Kara - Steel Bracelet - ???
* Kesh - Long, uncut & well maintained hair
* Kanga- Wooden Comb - Harder to find than you would think
* Kacheras - Underwear
* Kirpan - Sacred Weapon - Wait, what?

Profit?

Even John Travolta had to shave his beard to get the refinery job.

abhorrent1: Places of employment have dress/appearance codes. If you don't agree with it, find a different farking job. I'm tired of these brown people expecting everyone to change the rules just for them.

Except, he is not asking them to change the rules 'just for him'. Because
"...department policy is to allow beards up to an inch long if a doctor verifies that a guard has a skin disorder or irritation"
and (from another article)
"Oberoi wore gas masks for a Nuclear Biological Chemical Damage Control course in the Indian navy without incident."

So
*Despite the beard he can still use a gas mask.
*Other people with beards work as prison guards.

Jim_Callahan: You wear the mask and are exposed to...something that smells really strongly.

This?


Ewwwwwwww.

Prank Call of Cthulhu: Jim_Callahan: You wear the mask and are exposed to...something that smells really strongly.

This?

Ewwwwwwww.

I'd hit it.

/amirite???

jedihirsch: There was a case in Penn. where a Sikh sued to be on the FD. He won when hos lawyers found a company in Israel that makes Fire equipment and gas masks for people with beards. The judge ordered the department to accommodate him by buying the Israeli equipment. SO why not here, If they make the equipment for people with beards, why not buy it? In other states that is what they have done.
This court ruling is not rational, judge is probably bigoted. If they make equipment for the beard, then buy it. By ignoring this the judge shows irrationality.


Yes, because every company/employer should have to cater to each applicants needs or wishes.
/moron

Sure, you can have the job.

Just sign this saying that you and your family waive any and all rights to sue us in the event you require use of a gas mask and it fails.

And this piece of paper here saying that you waive company life insurance and long and short term disability.

Oh, and should one of your co-workers die or get injured due to your inability to act because of gas mask failure, we reserve the right to take appropriate compensation from you or your estate.

Welcome to the team!

"Why should those who cannot shave for religious reasons...."

Nice try. Do not, not cannot

Is California an at-will state?

Case closed. Go pump gas Hadji.

Seems a few people are missing the point.

He did not lose his job, they simply told him they do not hire anyone with a beard so he sued.

And yet, Sikhs can pass the gas mask test to join the US Army now.

Link (new window)

During training, Rattan wore a helmet over the small turban, which he doesn't remove, and was able to successfully create a seal with his gas mask despite the beard, resolving the Army's safety concerns, said Harsimran Kaur, the Sikh Coalition's legal director.

Jim_Callahan: "Why should those who cannot shave for religious reasons be treated differently from those who cannot shave for medical reasons?" reads the letter

They aren't. While the law technically allows exceptions in the case of medical necessity, the official has clearly stated on the record that the policy is to allow no exceptions whatsoever.

So someone who can't shave for medical reasons won't be hired either.

Hilary T. N. Seuss: Fine, don't have a policy that says you can't have a beard. Just have one that says you have to pass a gas mask test. If the guy wants to put a mask over his beard and get a face full of tear gas, it will be a win/win. Either he passes, or you get several moments of amusement watching his reaction.

Gas mask tests don't work that way. You wear the mask and are exposed to either a machine-detectable gas or (more commonly) something that smells really strongly.

You know how I know you were never in the military?

As someone who believes that people who are dumb enough to believe that their deity insists they wear a certain type of hat deserve punishment for their contribution to the worlds' ignorance, I fully support this.

Sorry Mr Sikh. If only you'd have worn the correct hat, God would have blessed you with a job in prison security.