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(Some Guy)   Twenty-three percent of HS students who try to join the military fail its entrance exam, which is a real sad statement about our education system. At least the military still has standards   (app.com) divider line 304
    More: Sad, U.S. Education Secretary Arne Duncan, educational attainments, educations, standardized tests, basic training, exams, standards  
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7547 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Dec 2010 at 5:28 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-12-21 01:57:49 PM
This is clearly Obama's fault.
 
2010-12-21 02:05:14 PM
If you ever want to see heartbreaking, watch a kid barely making it through high school who desperately wants to join the military find out he/she failed the ASVAB.
 
2010-12-21 02:15:41 PM
When you see the grammatical error in the headline, subby, will you have to resign your commission?
 
2010-12-21 02:16:00 PM
How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?
 
2010-12-21 02:16:27 PM
My 12 year old did well enough on an ASVAB practice test to get into any branch, and she's getting a C in science (and getting her ass kicked for it)
 
2010-12-21 02:17:39 PM
Nabb1: If you ever want to see heartbreaking, watch a kid barely making it through high school who desperately wants to join the military find out he/she failed the ASVAB.

Or failing the MEPs standards suck too.
 
wee [TotalFark]
2010-12-21 02:18:53 PM
Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB?

It isn't. It's brutally easy. Like on a "Which shape is a square?" and "How many fingers am I holding up?" level.
 
2010-12-21 02:19:04 PM
Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

The ASVAB is so painfully easy that I wouldn't trust an ASVAB wash-out to bag my groceries.

/USN vet.
 
2010-12-21 02:19:05 PM
Wrong_Intentions: Nabb1: If you ever want to see heartbreaking, watch a kid barely making it through high school who desperately wants to join the military find out he/she failed the ASVAB.

Or failing the MEPs standards suck too.


4 chin-ups in 45 minutes? How the HELL do you fail that? I don't remember all the stuff we did 25 years ago, but it was EASY.
 
2010-12-21 02:19:22 PM
Nabb1: If you ever want to see heartbreaking, watch a kid barely making it through high school who desperately wants to join the military find out he/she failed the ASVAB.

Yeah, well, maybe the kid should have paid more attention in class.
 
2010-12-21 02:21:10 PM
Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

Here's a sample (new window)
 
2010-12-21 02:23:24 PM
R.A.Danny: Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

Here's a sample (new window)


OK, wow.
 
2010-12-21 02:23:26 PM
R.A.Danny: Wrong_Intentions: Nabb1: If you ever want to see heartbreaking, watch a kid barely making it through high school who desperately wants to join the military find out he/she failed the ASVAB.

Or failing the MEPs standards suck too.

4 chin-ups in 45 minutes? How the HELL do you fail that? I don't remember all the stuff we did 25 years ago, but it was EASY.


In the paperwork, my medical history precluded me indefinitely and unrevokably.
 
2010-12-21 02:25:27 PM
I refuse to believe that anyone can fail the ASVAB. I just refuse.
 
2010-12-21 02:26:34 PM
R.A.Danny: Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

Here's a sample (new window)


I got all of those except for the auto shop question, because I know dick-all about cars.
 
2010-12-21 02:28:46 PM
Holy shiat. When I took the ASVAB 30+ years ago I was stoned out of my gourd and still did well enough to have recruiters camped out on my porch. I took the test because they said we could have the rest of the day off from school and had no intention of enlisting. After months of pestering I signed up just to get out of the crappy little town I lived in.
 
2010-12-21 02:28:46 PM
Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: Nabb1: If you ever want to see heartbreaking, watch a kid barely making it through high school who desperately wants to join the military find out he/she failed the ASVAB.

Yeah, well, maybe the kid should have paid more attention in class.


Some of them did, but still struggled. They are aware of their own limitations and see the military as a chance for a steady, respectable future. The ones that don't pay attention generally don't give a shiat one way or the other.
 
wee [TotalFark]
2010-12-21 02:30:10 PM
Pocket Ninja: OK, wow.

Yeah, like that. It makes Celebrity Jeopardy look positively cerebral.

Wrong_Intentions: In the paperwork, my medical history precluded me indefinitely and unrevokably.

Mine as well. Asthma, plus a pre-cancerous skin disorder.
 
2010-12-21 02:30:13 PM
Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB?

You remember how difficult it was to submit that post? It's a little less demanding than that.
 
2010-12-21 02:31:53 PM
Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

The other recruits at MEPS were stunned with my 98. They were bragging about their 60s.

Granted I am a college graduate, and they were fresh out of high school, but still.
 
2010-12-21 02:32:55 PM
UberDave: Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB?

You remember how difficult it was to submit that post? It's a little less demanding than that.


No, you don't need to tell anyone which direction the gear on the left will spin when you spin the gear on the right counter-clockwise before submitting.
 
2010-12-21 02:34:06 PM
FTA: "Pentagon data that shows 75 percent of those aged 17 to 24 don't qualify for the military because they are physically unfit, have a criminal record or didn't graduate high school."

Once the fact that many kids in this country can't climb a flight of stairs without running out of breath becomes a national security issue and not just a health issue, I wonder if Republicans will take back all the nasty things they've said about our first lady's efforts at tackling childhood obesity.
 
2010-12-21 02:36:23 PM
I suspect that 23% of high school students who TRY to join the military fail the entrance exams is fairly accurate. But, this point is not a statistically accurate measure of American education at all. Not all high school students try to join the military. Many find jobs, go to tech school or college, hang around Fark threads.

Even with two wars going on, military standards are still quite high. One didn't have to have graduate from high school back at the beginning of the All-Volunteer Armed Forces in the 70s. And, I remember the Army not too worried about past criminal behavior for certain MOSs in those days either. One doesn't need rocket scientists in the Marines and Army Infantry; just guys who can shoot straight.

Just remember, people, that the available manpower pool of young people is shrinking. Should be very interesting in the near future, particularly concerning immigrants into the US.
 
2010-12-21 02:38:37 PM
AirForceVet: I suspect that 23% of high school students who TRY to join the military fail the entrance exams is fairly accurate. But, this point is not a statistically accurate measure of American education at all. Not all high school students try to join the military. Many find jobs, go to tech school or college, hang around Fark threads.

Maybe all HS students should be made to take the ASVAB before graduating.

/ducks
 
2010-12-21 02:38:49 PM
R.A.Danny: Wrong_Intentions: Nabb1: If you ever want to see heartbreaking, watch a kid barely making it through high school who desperately wants to join the military find out he/she failed the ASVAB.

Or failing the MEPs standards suck too.

4 chin-ups in 45 minutes? How the HELL do you fail that? I don't remember all the stuff we did 25 years ago, but it was EASY.



I'll never forget going through MEPs processing. This one guy was farking with everyone because he could get away with it. He had people doing stupid human tricks during the course of their physical evaluation. When he got to me, he tried to make me do something stupid like squat down and hop around the room or something. I looked at him and said that I'm not doing that and I know it is not part of the evaluation. He looked surprised as if no one had challenged him on it all day...then sent me on my way. I often wondered how many people followed his dumb ass instructions without question.

/Cool story bro
 
wee [TotalFark]
2010-12-21 02:39:36 PM
AirForceVet: I suspect that 23% of high school students who TRY to join the military fail the entrance exams is fairly accurate.

They were giving out t-shirts and hats and socks to people who took a prequalification test. I know a lot of guys went in just for the stuff with no intention of joining.
 
2010-12-21 02:43:43 PM
cdn1.newsone.com

/ still getting over the fact that one of the local public high schools provides free day care for female students with kids
 
2010-12-21 02:44:36 PM
Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: FTA: "Pentagon data that shows 75 percent of those aged 17 to 24 don't qualify for the military because they are physically unfit, have a criminal record or didn't graduate high school."

Once the fact that many kids in this country can't climb a flight of stairs without running out of breath becomes a national security issue and not just a health issue, I wonder if Republicans will take back all the nasty things they've said about our first lady's efforts at tackling childhood obesity.


Meh, if you think today's kids are not up to joining the military, look up what FDR had to work with after what the Great Depression did to Americans overall. They were lucky to find recruits with all their teeth!

Some claim young Americans joined the military back in the early 40s out of patriotism after Pearl Harbor. Many joined to serve their country, yes, but many joined because they would get regular pay, food, clothing, shelter in the military. My mom always said America's rich owed an awful lot to poor, farm boys from Tennessee and elsewhere in WWII.
 
2010-12-21 02:45:28 PM
wee: They were giving out t-shirts and hats and socks to people who took a prequalification test. I know a lot of guys went in just for the stuff with no intention of joining.

I totally concur there.
 
2010-12-21 02:46:05 PM
BigTuna: I refuse to believe that anyone can fail the ASVAB. I just refuse.

Have you taken a good hard look at the United States lately? There are some frighteningly stupid people in the country.
 
2010-12-21 02:46:19 PM
How difficult is the ASVAB?


www.newgeography.com

/hot
 
2010-12-21 02:47:39 PM
UberDave: R.A.Danny: Wrong_Intentions: Nabb1:
4 chin-ups in 45 minutes? How the HELL do you fail that? I don't remember all the stuff we did 25 years ago, but it was EASY.


I'll never forget going through MEPs processing. This one guy was farking with everyone because he could get away with it. He had people doing stupid human tricks during the course of their physical evaluation. When he got to me, he tried to make me do something stupid like squat down and hop around the room or something.

/Cool story bro


Do you mean the duck walk? That is pretty standard.

I was 23 when I went through, so I was years older and wiser than the others there, many of them were pretty nervous. So I started farking with them, telling them the doctor would stick things in their ass and some of them kinda started to freak out.

I was picked first for the 1 on 1 with the doctor, and everyone was laughing, so when I came out, I waddled and held onto my ass like I was in pain.

You could hear some of their assholes pucker.
 
2010-12-21 02:48:40 PM
UberDave: I'll never forget going through MEPs processing. This one guy was farking with everyone because he could get away with it. He had people doing stupid human tricks during the course of their physical evaluation. When he got to me, he tried to make me do something stupid like squat down and hop around the room or something. I looked at him and said that I'm not doing that and I know it is not part of the evaluation. He looked surprised as if no one had challenged him on it all day...then sent me on my way. I often wondered how many people followed his dumb ass instructions without question.

I don't buy it. I assume you're talking about the duck walk and that's an ankle-flexibility test. It's to see if you can move forward in a squat position over varied terrain (pretty important when it comes to staying in cover while advancing). If you can't do that, you fail Station 4. I think you did the test, walked out of there thinking 'I feel stupid. That probably wasn't even part of the real exam' and then just modified the tale a little before you posted it today.
 
2010-12-21 02:54:24 PM
B..b...b...b....GAYS!
 
2010-12-21 02:55:05 PM
Meh, they should have watched more Dora, less Sponge Bob.
 
2010-12-21 02:55:10 PM
Pocket Ninja: R.A.Danny: Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

Here's a sample (new window)

OK, wow.


The ASVAB is configured to a one-year buffer of an 8th grade education. The minimum score is a 40. That's 4-0. Out of 100. As in 21 points under the lowest possible passing score among school grading systems.

Worst part, I believe this article. I saw two guys fail it out of 20 that were in the testing room that day. Here's an exact conversation from one of them. I am not making this up:

"So you got a 93?"
"Yeah"
"I got a 36. That's funny. I wonder how they do the numbers."
"...yeah I hear it's weird..."
"So which branch are you going?"
"I don't know yet"
"I'm gonna be Army. I wanna be an MP"
"Why is that?"
"Are you kidding? You carry a gun!"
"... it's the military. I'm sure you'll end up with a gun at some point no matter the job."
"Yeah but this one's like... every day!"

He's looking at me like he can't possibly understand why everyone isn't trying to be an MP... because you carry a gun... every day.
 
2010-12-21 02:57:54 PM
Aptitude is the key word in the title. Sure, as shown above there are some pretty basic questions, but as stated above, getting a 98 or better gets one quite a bit further in options (that sample is more of a bait and switch). Then of course one has to pass the other tests and ultimately the schools. Try passing the DLAB after that. Or other similar tests. It is pretty sad when kids can't pass the ASVAB tho.
 
2010-12-21 02:58:22 PM
BigTuna: I refuse to believe that anyone can fail the ASVAB. I just refuse.

I never took it, but as I understand it it's NOT a pass/fail type of test. It tests what jobs you would be good at and you do need certain scores to get certain jobs. So just because you'd be good at sweeping the floors and not a nuke, you didn't necessarily fail.
 
2010-12-21 02:59:29 PM
Ahh thanks for the clarification Razorwolf
 
2010-12-21 02:59:41 PM
AirForceVet: wee: They were giving out t-shirts and hats and socks to people who took a prequalification test. I know a lot of guys went in just for the stuff with no intention of joining.

I totally concur there.


And then wear them around town with a handful of tales about how they are a "sniper in special forces"?
 
2010-12-21 03:01:18 PM
 
2010-12-21 03:01:56 PM
The Stupidificaltion of America continues.. and their evil plan is working.

emergentnovels.com
 
2010-12-21 03:04:30 PM
Razorwolf: "I'm gonna be Army. I wanna be an MP"

Don't tell me you know he got it:

MP qualification is determined by the 'ST' sub score in the ASVAB, not the GT. MOS requirements are listed in DA Pam 611-21.
For 31B (Military Police)
...Military police must possess the following qualifications:
(1) A physical demands rating of moderately heavy.
(2) A physical profile of 222221.
(3) Red/green color discrimination.
(4) Qualifying scores.
(a) A minimum score of 95 in aptitude area ST in Armed Services Vocational aptitude Battery (ASVAB) tests administered prior to 2 January 2002.
(b) A minimum score of 92 in aptitude area ST on ASVAB tests administered on and after 2 January 2002 and prior to 1 July 2004.
(c) A minimum score of 91 in aptitude area ST on ASVAB tests administered on and after 1 Jul 2004.
(5) A security eligibility of CONFIDENTIAL.
(6) Meets all requirements for Personnel Reliability Program (PRP) qualifications.
(7) Must possess a valid state motor vehicle operator license.
(8) No objection to performing security duties in the vicinity of nuclear or chemical munitions stored or staged for military use.
(9) No record of more than 15 days lost under section 972-10-USC.
(10) No information in Provost Marshal Office, Intelligence Office, Military Personnel Record Jacket (MPRJ) or medical records which would prevent the granting of a security clearance under AR 380-67.
(11) No record of pre-trial intervention or conviction by military or civil court of the following:
(a) Any offense involving force or violence.
(b) Any offense listed under AR 601-210, para 4-22 (misdemeanor), or similar offense not listed for which the maximum possible sentence exceeds 4 months of confinement.
(c) Two or more offenses within 5 years prior to the date of enlistment listed under AR 601-210, para 4-21 (minor non-traffic), or similar offense not listed for which the maximum possible sentence is less than 4 months confinement.
(d) Three or more minor traffic offenses as listed under AR 601-210, para 4-20 (minor traffic) during the 12 months period prior to entry on active duty (does not include traffic violations considered misdemeanor or felony by virtue of fine amount per AR 601-210.
(e) No pattern of behavior or actions that is reasonably indicative of a contemptuous attitude toward the law or other duly constituted authority.
(12) Minimum age of 18 at time of entrance on active duty.
(13) No record of possession or use of any narcotic or non-narcotic drug as defined by Article 134, UCMJ and AR 600-50. (Personnel entering active duty may be granted waiver at Military Entrance Processing Station by the AHRC Security Interviewer DoD policy on cannabis use.)
(14) No record of conviction by special or general courts-martial or civilian courts of offenses listed in AR 27-10 (Military Justice), chapter 24 or otherwise required to register as a sexual offender under AR 27-10, chapter 24.
(15) Formal training (completion of MOS 31B course conducted under the auspices of the U.S. Army Military Police School) mandatory.
(16) All applicants for MOS 31B must be interviewed by AHRC Security Interviewer. Waivers will only be granted by DA G-1 (DAPE-MPA-RP). All Active Component service members reclassifying for MOS 31B must be interviewed by local Provost NCO (SFC or above) or Provost Marshal (CPT or above). PMO required to do local record check (NCIC or COPS (Centralized Operations Police Suite)) to ensure no disqualifying offenses as indicated above. All Reserve Component service members reclassifying for MOS 31B must be interviewed by a senior MP NCO (SFC or above) or MP officer (CPT or above) in the gaining MP unit as well as a local records check. In either case, written endorsement must accompany re-enlistment contract.

(although when I went in there was a minimum GT score and a Secret clearance was required.)
 
2010-12-21 03:07:10 PM
t2.gstatic.com
"It's because they're obese"
 
2010-12-21 03:08:02 PM
Shostie: R.A.Danny: Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

Here's a sample (new window)

I got all of those except for the auto shop question, because I know dick-all about cars.


I didn't know the first science question, I could see it's easy to not remember which one it is, since it's basically remembering a definition in that instance and not knowledge of a concept or logical reasoning skill.
 
wee [TotalFark]
2010-12-21 03:12:23 PM
Razorwolf: And then wear them around town with a handful of tales about how they are a "sniper in special forces"?

No, mostly just a bunch of punk high school kids who wanted free stuff. I guess back in the 80's a purple mohawk and an Army ringer t-shirt was a fashion statement.

I personally liked my socks.
 
2010-12-21 03:13:15 PM
R.A.Danny: Pocket Ninja: How difficult is the ASVAB? Like, compared to the SATs? Is it calibrated to a certain grade level of achievement?

Here's a sample (new window)


I couldn't have answered 7, and I really wouldn't hold it against anyone who said "iron" instead of "silver" on 6. Still, if passing is 40%...
 
wee [TotalFark]
2010-12-21 03:22:23 PM
AuntNotAnt: Still, if passing is 40%

Passing score for the Army is scoring above the 31st percentile, meaning you had to score better than 31 percent of a sample of people who took the test. In other words, you only have to be well below average mentally in order to pass.
 
2010-12-21 03:28:23 PM
Teknowaffle: UberDave: R.A.Danny: Wrong_Intentions: Nabb1:
4 chin-ups in 45 minutes? How the HELL do you fail that? I don't remember all the stuff we did 25 years ago, but it was EASY.


I'll never forget going through MEPs processing. This one guy was farking with everyone because he could get away with it. He had people doing stupid human tricks during the course of their physical evaluation. When he got to me, he tried to make me do something stupid like squat down and hop around the room or something.

/Cool story bro

Do you mean the duck walk? That is pretty standard.



I thought I should have clarified. No, it was not the duck-walk. They had two guys administering the various tests. They would take entire groups when they could and put them through the duck-walk. Yes, it looks pretty ridiculous. And I think there would have been more to it had a refused to do the duck walk. I know the difference between "squat down and waddle 10 feet" and "squat down and jump up then back down and do it out to the hall and back" (and I don't remember what it was exactly but it was worse than that). No, the guy was obviously taking the opportunity to fark with people. He wasn't the only one but at least the others had a sense of humor about it.
 
2010-12-21 03:53:04 PM
23%? That's almost half!
 
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