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(Fox News)   New Hampshire high school assigned personal finance reading refers to Jesus as a "wine-guzzling vagrant." Surprisingly, someone has a problem with this   (foxnews.com ) divider line
    More: Asinine, New Hampshire, income inequality, Barbara Ehrenreich, working poor, high schools, request for comments, wines, socialists  
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10716 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Dec 2010 at 7:01 PM (5 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-12-07 02:41:31 PM  
The comments on this are epicly stupid. Wow.
 
2010-12-07 03:06:13 PM  
Bad call on the school's part assigning it, but seriously, pulling your kid from class "in protest"? Man if I had known butthurt was a valid excuse for truancy back when I was in HS, I'd have never gone.
 
2010-12-07 03:18:51 PM  
The passage, in context, is actually presented in the article, which is nice.

It would be nice if someone would read this sad-eyed crowd the Sermon on the Mount, accompanied by a rousing commentary on income inequality and the need for a hike in the minimum wage. But Jesus makes his appearance here only as a corpse; the living man, the wine-guzzling vagrant and precocious socialist, is never once mentioned, nor anything he ever had to say. Christ crucified rules, and it may be that the true business of modern Christianity is to crucify him again and again so that he can never get a word out of his mouth.

By the way, I absolutely applaud this paragraph, and those parents are ridiculously stupid.
 
2010-12-07 03:19:20 PM  
In the context of the chapter, the passage makes sense. The chapter is describing the way that some denominations of Christianity concentrate exclusively on the "dead by torture" Jesus and ignore his teachings and his humanity. Doing so absolves them of the responsibility for treating other humans (who actually are homeless winos) decently.

I suppose one could argue that this is too subtle a concept for high school students, as apparently it was for this one kid. But IMO, that's doing a disservice to the average student who would be able to understand the passage.

Unfortunately, the school will probably cave in for this below average student and his mouth-breathing parents, and the school will take one more step towards bland mediocrity.
 
2010-12-07 03:20:48 PM  
Oh, and by the way?

"...These words are illegal to say on national TV and radio in this country and yet here they are in this book."

They... absolutely aren't. Thanks, Fox, for pointing that out.

No, wait, you just let the quote stand.
 
2010-12-07 03:24:49 PM  
The stupid, it burns.
 
2010-12-07 03:32:08 PM  

FloydA: I suppose one could argue that this is too subtle a concept for high school students, as apparently it was for this one kid


And the parents.
 
2010-12-07 03:39:49 PM  
Awww, did someone get their precious beliefs questioned?
 
2010-12-07 03:40:06 PM  

tallguywithglasseson: FloydA: I suppose one could argue that this is too subtle a concept for high school students, as apparently it was for this one kid

And the parents.


That goes without saying. Any time a school assigns a book, some of the kids are going to complain because they are lazy.

Any parent who sides with the kid and complains that the kid shouldn't be required to read "controversial" material is, by definition, an idiot.
 
2010-12-07 03:41:35 PM  
That's not an inaccurate description of the guy.
 
2010-12-07 03:41:38 PM  
I read the book for a college course on the history of American poverty. The sections on Maine and Florida were complete bullshiat. She attempted to make a living in vacation towns during the off-season. Not exactly the most likely success story.
 
2010-12-07 03:45:20 PM  

ArkAngel: I read the book for a college course on the history of American poverty. The sections on Maine and Florida were complete bullshiat. She attempted to make a living in vacation towns during the off-season. Not exactly the most likely success story.


Does that matter? Does everyone in the service industry leave when the season ends?
 
2010-12-07 03:48:32 PM  

ArkAngel: I read the book for a college course on the history of American poverty. The sections on Maine and Florida were complete bullshiat. She attempted to make a living in vacation towns during the off-season. Not exactly the most likely success story.


What do the people who work in the service industry and live in those towns do in the off-season? Hibernate? Move to their vacation homes?
 
2010-12-07 03:49:09 PM  

ArkAngel: I read the book for a college course on the history of American poverty. The sections on Maine and Florida were complete bullshiat. She attempted to make a living in vacation towns during the off-season. Not exactly the most likely success story.


Which could be argued as proving just how hard it is to get by as a minimum wage worker in those towns.
 
2010-12-07 03:52:01 PM  

ArkAngel: I read the book for a college course on the history of American poverty. The sections on Maine and Florida were complete bullshiat. She attempted to make a living in vacation towns during the off-season. Not exactly the most likely success story.


There are many legitimate criticisms of that book. I can't believe that's the one you chose to make.
 
2010-12-07 03:56:47 PM  

John Paul Jones: Does that matter? Does everyone in the service industry leave when the season ends?


FloydA: What do the people who work in the service industry and live in those towns do in the off-season? Hibernate? Move to their vacation homes?


GAT_00: Which could be argued as proving just how hard it is to get by as a minimum wage worker in those towns.


I think the point is that trying to get by only during the off-season of a vacation town is flirting with disaster. The people that live there year round make more money during vacation season, then have the money saved up for the off-season.

/didn't read the book
 
2010-12-07 03:59:20 PM  
Didn't he also associate with whores?

This also reminds me of someone I know who is very uptight about the whole Jesus thing. She had a hole in her fence and some varmints had taken up residence in her back yard. A mutual friend offered to fix her fence & relocate the fuzzy squatters for a fee of a six pack of beer. She refused due to religious convictions. Except that Jesus was clearly a fan of the wine, considering water wasn't good enough for him at his big fish fry.

It's been my experience that Christians HATE being confronted with challenges to their beliefs, even if those challenges are rooted in what was written in the Bible. It's so strange to me.
 
2010-12-07 03:59:35 PM  
"Nickel and Dimed?"

Wouldn't it be "Nickled and Dimed?" Or maybe it should be hyphenated, like "Nickel-and-Dimed?" I'm not a big enough grammar Nazi to put that one together, but "Nickel and Dimed" just seems incorrect to me. Maybe it's just fine, and I'm reading too much into things.

Or...
Maybe it's a story about two cops. Frank Nickel is a straight-laced detective who does everything by the book. Henry Dimed is a cop from the wrong side of the tracks, coming off a two-week suspension for crashing his totally sweet motorcycle into a purse-snatcher. But when both of their partners are killed by renegade cilantro smugglers, the two of them must join forces to get to the bottom of things.
 
2010-12-07 03:59:42 PM  

kingoomieiii: The passage, in context, is actually presented in the article, which is nice.

It would be nice if someone would read this sad-eyed crowd the Sermon on the Mount, accompanied by a rousing commentary on income inequality and the need for a hike in the minimum wage. But Jesus makes his appearance here only as a corpse; the living man, the wine-guzzling vagrant and precocious socialist, is never once mentioned, nor anything he ever had to say. Christ crucified rules, and it may be that the true business of modern Christianity is to crucify him again and again so that he can never get a word out of his mouth.

By the way, I absolutely applaud this paragraph, and those parents are ridiculously stupid.


I am surprised it was presented, it being fox and all. And yes, that is an awesome paragraph, and the point it makes is awesome, if not unfortunately obvious to nearly everyone who doesn't immediately go into hysterics upon reading it.
 
wee
2010-12-07 04:04:36 PM  

Aarontology: That's not an inaccurate description of the guy.


I was going to say, that's actually fairly accurate. He apparently moved around a lot and drank wine.

Which is apparently too much for these uptight people.
 
2010-12-07 04:06:09 PM  
I wonder if that book would have been assigned if it had a similar description of Muhammad. Probably not, but if it had I bet the parents level of butthurt would have been different.
 
2010-12-07 04:12:45 PM  

jaylectricity: I think the point is that trying to get by only during the off-season of a vacation town is flirting with disaster. The people that live there year round make more money during vacation season, then have the money saved up for the off-season.

/didn't read the book


Which is of course the legitimate counter point, and I would point out that there are all kinds of things that can happen during the offseason that will destroy even the most careful finances and a bad season means you are SOL. Hell, I can attest to the random shiat that happens with cars, since I just had some of that random shiat happen to me.
 
2010-12-07 04:13:28 PM  

wee: Aarontology: That's not an inaccurate description of the guy.

I was going to say, that's actually fairly accurate. He apparently moved around a lot and drank wine.

Which is apparently too much for these uptight people.


Hell, that's how he got most of his followers. If he hadn't been moseying about with skins of wine, there might not be a Christianity at all.
 
2010-12-07 04:13:46 PM  

BumpyMcNipples: I am surprised it was presented, it being fox and all. And yes, that is an awesome paragraph, and the point it makes is awesome, if not unfortunately obvious to nearly everyone who doesn't immediately go into hysterics upon reading it.


The tendency for it to send certain people into hysterics is exactly why it was published verbatim.
 
2010-12-07 04:18:33 PM  

jaylectricity: John Paul Jones: Does that matter? Does everyone in the service industry leave when the season ends?

FloydA: What do the people who work in the service industry and live in those towns do in the off-season? Hibernate? Move to their vacation homes?

GAT_00: Which could be argued as proving just how hard it is to get by as a minimum wage worker in those towns.

I think the point is that trying to get by only during the off-season of a vacation town is flirting with disaster. The people that live there year round make more money during vacation season, then have the money saved up for the off-season.

/didn't read the book


Exactly. Think like the mayor in Jaws. He didn't want to close the beaches because he knew an interrupted beach season would mean most people fail for the rest of the year. It's very difficult to live in a seasonal town. If you fail during the season, the rest of the year is destroyed for you.

Simply showing up in a vacation town outside of season and expecting to thrive is disingenuous and a poor research method showing signs of confirmation bias.

Try this book. Link (new window) It's a refutation by a college student who started with a sleeping bag and $25 and managed to have a job, a car, a furnished apartment, and $5000 after 10 months
 
2010-12-07 04:31:35 PM  

GAT_00: BumpyMcNipples: I am surprised it was presented, it being fox and all. And yes, that is an awesome paragraph, and the point it makes is awesome, if not unfortunately obvious to nearly everyone who doesn't immediately go into hysterics upon reading it.

The tendency for it to send certain people into hysterics is exactly why it was published verbatim.


Which I get, I'm just surprised as I'm used to fox cherry picking the exact phrase that causes hysterics, rather than providing the entire quote for viewers to make up their own mind.

I would have expected the quote to approximately be: But Jesus [...] the wine-guzzling vagrant and precocious socialist, is never once mentioned

I assume either fox has assumed it's viewers are too dumb to get the entire thing in context, or they do not understand it themselves.

/I am even more surprised they presented the quote in full, given it's rather difficult sentence structure. And by that, I mostly mean it includes a semi-colon.
 
2010-12-07 04:34:51 PM  

ArkAngel:

Try this book. Link (new window) It's a refutation by a college student who started with a sleeping bag and $25 and managed to have a job, a car, a furnished apartment, and $5000 after 10 months


Shepard misunderstood the premise of Nickle and Dimed. It's not that "it's impossible to make it." That's a straw man he set up solely because it's easy to knock down.

Ehrenreich's point was that the rhetorical claims that "poverty is the result of laziness" are not accurate and are based on selective ignorance of the experiences of the working poor.
 
2010-12-07 04:41:36 PM  

ArkAngel: Try this book. Link (new window) It's a refutation by a college student who started with a sleeping bag and $25 and managed to have a job, a car, a furnished apartment, and $5000 after 10 months


This completely misses the point of the book. It's sort of the difference between microeconomics and macroeconomics. Of course someone who is bright and has education (even if he only relies on it indirectly) can succeed. The point of the book is that there is no way for everyone to succeed because we will still need fry cooks and cashiers. Even if any individual person can get ahead, there is literally no mechanism in our society for everyone to get ahead.
 
2010-12-07 04:45:14 PM  

jaylectricity: I think the point is that trying to get by only during the off-season of a vacation town is flirting with disaster. The people that live there year round make more money during vacation season, then have the money saved up for the off-season.


The book isn't really about *her* though, it's about the people she encounters while working, which is why she didn't just sit at home, pay herself minimum wage and see if she could get by. And the people she encountered were living in tiny apartments with five other people, cars, vans, and, in one case, a boat. They weren't saving up money on the on-season to live in the off-season: they were living month-to-month.
 
2010-12-07 04:50:30 PM  
I applaud this kid for leaving the school.

If you have reached the age of 16 and still don't have the critical thinking skills to cope with reading a book you disagree with, then you should absolutely stop taking up valuable classroom space and get started at your life-long Wal-Mart job post-haste.

Good on him for recognizing his place early on and giving someone who might actually value an education a chance at it. Bravo!
 
2010-12-07 04:54:34 PM  
If I had to read Wuthering Monkeyf*cking Heights, this little shiathead can read something that he disagrees with.
 
2010-12-07 04:56:46 PM  

kronicfeld: If I had to read Wuthering Monkeyf*cking Heights, this little shiathead can read something that he disagrees with.


Truth, the man speaks it.
 
2010-12-07 05:00:28 PM  
From the comments: "The Truth I guess is not allowed on this sight, since my blog is under review. Beware of the Radical Progressive Left."

Ah, yes. FoxNews.com comment forums, those uncompromising bastions of the Progressive Left.
 
2010-12-07 05:15:25 PM  

kronicfeld: Wuthering Monkeyf*cking Heights



That sounds better than the original.


"Kiss me again, but don't let me see your eyes! I forgive what you have done to me. I love my murderer--but yours! How can I?"

"EEEEEeee-ee-ee-ee-ee-oo-ooo-oook"

"But there's this difference: one is gold put to the use of paving-stones, and the other is tin polished to ape a service of silver."

"Speaking of apes, EEEEEeee-ee-ee-ee-ee-oo-ooo-oook"


"He wanted all to lie in an ecstasy of peace; I wanted a banana. I said his heaven would be only half alive; and he said mine would be nothing but climbing trees and screeching: I said I should fall asleep in his; and he said he could fling poop in mine..."
 
2010-12-07 05:38:44 PM  

FloydA: "Speaking of apes, EEEEEeee-ee-ee-ee-ee-oo-ooo-oook"


This. This was beautiful.
 
2010-12-07 05:47:57 PM  
I would bet that if Jesus were alive today, He would be described by the Right as a "vagrant wine guzzling Socialist"
 
2010-12-07 06:10:48 PM  

Calmamity: I applaud this kid for leaving the school.

If you have reached the age of 16 and still don't have the critical thinking skills to cope with reading a book you disagree with, then you should absolutely stop taking up valuable classroom space and get started at your life-long Wal-Mart job post-haste.

Good on him for recognizing his place early on and giving someone who might actually value an education a chance at it. Bravo!


But only if he works at the Manchester Walmart, it's much crappier than the Bedford one. Not to mention the people working in Manch are just plain weird.

\yes, people in the area actually make that distinction
\\best friend lives up there
 
2010-12-07 07:05:37 PM  
Say what you want about Jesus, but that farker RODE DINOSAURS!!!
 
2010-12-07 07:06:40 PM  
Jesus was LITERALLY a wine guzzling vagrant. Probably gay too, he hung out with sailors all day and night.
 
2010-12-07 07:07:08 PM  
Cited passage is angsty and self-important.

So is the kid and his family, though, so it should be right up their alley.

WTF is with pulling your kid out in protest? What do the parents think, that their little snowflake is such a shining delight that the school will have no choice but to change their minds to get him back? Change schools.
 
2010-12-07 07:07:28 PM  
vernonFL: I would bet that if Jesus were alive today, He would be described by the Right as a "vagrant wine guzzling Socialist"

More accurately he was a communist Jew.
 
2010-12-07 07:09:41 PM  
I read the passage. It seemed an accurate assessment, though I suppose it could be offensive if taken out of proper context.

The parents sound far too sensitive, and possibly ignorant of their own faith.
 
2010-12-07 07:10:22 PM  
t0.gstatic.com

For the parents and the kid.

/someone should find them and send them a link to this thread BTW...
 
2010-12-07 07:12:56 PM  
lh4.ggpht.com
 
2010-12-07 07:13:06 PM  

John Paul Jones: Does that matter? Does everyone in the service industry leave when the season ends?


A fair number do. There are businesses in the area which will bring people in, provide room and board, and then when the season is over everyone goes back to their various places and sources of employment.
 
2010-12-07 07:13:18 PM  
this book should not belong in the classroom, it's really inappropriate for their age,'

They're 16, damn it.

But Taylor says that's not enough.

"We've eliminated Christmas, we've eliminated all these things because we don't want to step on anyone's toes but here we're going to hand out this book? ... This is anti-God, anti-religion, it's racial, I mean it crosses a wide spectrum of very touchy and very insulting issues to most human beings and I think that even with a parental consent it's not enough. They need to boot that book out of there," Taylor said.


FFS...life must suck when you're constantly a victim. Get over it.
 
2010-12-07 07:13:46 PM  
Whenever I go home for the holidays, it's really fun to suggest to my fundie parents that Jesus wouldn't agree with republican ideas. It's really really fun because that's absolutely true.

It's also really fun to point out that the modern church is nothing like what Jesus intended (if you actually read the bible, which, protip, most fundamentalist christians don't do).

My dad sees my point and kind of agrees, which is why I get along just fine with my dad.

My mom, however...I'm really thinking about getting one of those TV channel blocker thingies and preventing her from watching Glenn Beck so I don't have to hear his bullshiat whenever I call home.

It's that bad.

And these parents are complete shiatheads...just make the kid read the book and have a civil discussion to find a more suitable book, if it exists. I guarantee this little shiat isn't offended at all, he just didn't want to do his homework like every other kid in america.
 
2010-12-07 07:13:48 PM  
It's only hate speech when it's anti Muslim
 
2010-12-07 07:13:53 PM  
My Political Lit teacher assigned this book for me senior year of high school. We had at least one die hard catholic in the class but I don't recall this phrase being the least bit problematic nor even mentioned.

However we were pretty pissed as a class at Wal-Mart and how crappy people get treated as a whole.

/sounds like the parents missed the whole point
 
2010-12-07 07:13:54 PM  
s-ak.buzzfed.com
 
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