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(Yahoo)   The latest trigger for runaway global warming is Alaskan wildfires   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 99
    More: Asinine, runaway climate change, Nature Geoscience, University of Guelph, Alaska, wildfires, lights, LiveScience Store, biomass  
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2248 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Dec 2010 at 7:59 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-12-06 07:03:20 PM  
bring on some global warming - it's fricking COLD out there tonight!!!
 
2010-12-06 08:02:27 PM  
youbecha
 
2010-12-06 08:03:25 PM  
ironic - the latest trigger for runaway global stupid-ing is Alaskan...

/anyone?
 
2010-12-06 08:04:05 PM  
Nah I like the cold. Moar snow plz. Or just snow period. But I thought it was blamed last week on increasing illegal Russian logging?
 
2010-12-06 08:04:16 PM  
Actually the only img1.fark.net thing I'm seeing (other than Weaver's comment ;-p) is subby's arrogantly idiotic dismissal of any scientific concern suggested in TFA.

In other words, the usual trollish DERP as seen in these climate change threads.
 
2010-12-06 08:07:36 PM  
Warmers will believe anything
 
2010-12-06 08:08:30 PM  
These fires wood really spruce things up.
 
2010-12-06 08:09:32 PM  
stirfrybry: Warmers will believe anything

implying that there is a minority who "believes" in climate change as opposed to overwhelming scientific agreement.

Derp harder.
 
2010-12-06 08:11:57 PM  
I thought when things got hot it means things get cold.

/wait, what?
 
2010-12-06 08:12:31 PM  
Read this whibdey, if you can comprehend it

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/12/01/skeptic-paper-accepted-on-antarctica-rebu t s-steig-et-al/

learn some stats so you can understand how you warmers are being duped by faulty methods.

/peer reviewed, so STFU and read it
 
2010-12-06 08:20:13 PM  
stirfrybry: /peer reviewed, so STFU and read it

Citations needed.

Also: Sorry, but one vague paper doesn't discount the easily available science which clearly shows that Antarctica is gaining sea ice but losing land ice at an accelerating rate which has implications for sea level rise.
 
2010-12-06 08:20:52 PM  
There have always been wild fires up there. It makes for a healthy forest.
 
2010-12-06 08:22:38 PM  
If Global Warming turns out to be another hoax like Y2K, SARS, or the others, I'll never trust a scientist again.
 
2010-12-06 08:23:17 PM  
dead_dangler: If Global Warming turns out to be another hoax like Y2K, SARS, or the others, I'll never trust a scientist again.

None of those examples were hoaxes.
 
2010-12-06 08:25:06 PM  
it's not global warming it's climate change disruption.

Unless it's getting warmer I mean.
 
2010-12-06 08:25:58 PM  
whidbey: dead_dangler: If Global Warming turns out to be another hoax like Y2K, SARS, or the others, I'll never trust a scientist again.

None of those examples were hoaxes.


Now who's being naive?
 
2010-12-06 08:26:50 PM  
dead_dangler: whidbey: dead_dangler: If Global Warming turns out to be another hoax like Y2K, SARS, or the others, I'll never trust a scientist again.

None of those examples were hoaxes.

Now who's being naive?


Just pointing your mistake. You're welcome to keep believing something that isn't.
 
2010-12-06 08:28:40 PM  
whidbey: stirfrybry: /peer reviewed, so STFU and read it

Citations needed.

Also: Sorry, but one vague paper doesn't discount the easily available science which clearly shows that Antarctica is gaining sea ice but losing land ice at an accelerating rate which has implications for sea level rise.


Are you not able to follow links? I can't read it for you. Sorry you have to be bother to comprehend something for yourself, poor little warmer
 
2010-12-06 08:30:36 PM  
I read your link. It's vague and uninteresting, and I provided a link that more than addresses the point.

Also, pro-tip: using the term "warmer" in a climate change discussion doesn't bode much for your credibility, it just outs you as a troll.
 
2010-12-06 08:32:09 PM  
whidbey: I read your link. It's vague and uninteresting, and I provided a link that more than addresses the point.

Also, pro-tip: using the term "warmer" in a climate change discussion doesn't bode much for your credibility, it just outs you as a troll.


How much is Gore paying you, man?
 
2010-12-06 08:34:07 PM  
dead_dangler: How much is Gore paying you, man?

Another indication that you're probably a troll and not a skeptic.

Al Gore has exactly jack sh*t to do with whether climate change is a real concern.
 
2010-12-06 08:39:15 PM  
whidbey: Al Gore has exactly jack sh*t to do with whether climate change is a real concern.

It's not like he's won an Oscar or Nobel prize or anything
 
2010-12-06 08:40:14 PM  
DesertDemonWY: whidbey: Al Gore has exactly jack sh*t to do with whether climate change is a real concern.

It's not like he's won an Oscar or Nobel prize or anything


Yeah, I'm sure that pisses you off too.

*takes a look around the thread*

Well, I can see it's going to be a VERY LONG NIGHT HERE.
 
2010-12-06 08:40:14 PM  
whidbey: stirfrybry: /peer reviewed, so STFU and read it

Citations needed.

Also: Sorry, but one vague paper doesn't discount the easily available science which clearly shows that Antarctica is gaining sea ice but losing land ice at an accelerating rate which has implications for sea level rise.


I don't see how the link you provided does anything to rebut the abstract posted by stirfrybry. IIRC, much of the ice loss from Antarctica is concentrated in the Antarctic Peninsula (AP) and West Antarctic Ice Sheet (WAIS), which is consistent with increased warming there. On the other hand, despite stirfrybry's ignorant crowing, the paper he provides is not a refutation of the original paper, but rather an improvement, that still shows a statistically significant warming trend in AP/WAIS.
 
2010-12-06 08:42:10 PM  
Like I said, with warmers, they'll keep on believing yesterday's science when today's science shows they are wrong.
 
2010-12-06 08:43:13 PM  
iamdonovan: I don't see how the link you provided does anything to rebut the abstract posted by stirfrybry.

Just figured I'd pass along what the bulk of science basically already agrees with, and it does counter the contention that was made, which is why I posted it.

On the other hand, despite stirfrybry's ignorant crowing, the paper he provides is not a refutation of the original paper, but rather an improvement, that still shows a statistically significant warming trend in AP/WAIS.

Surprise, surprise...
 
2010-12-06 08:44:12 PM  
Hogwash as usual.

Our forest management programs prevent fires to the best possible extent, so when they finally do hit in
the end, there is much more dry wood to burn.

Simple.
 
2010-12-06 08:45:08 PM  
stirfrybry: Like I said, with warmers, they'll keep on believing yesterday's science when today's science shows they are wrong.

You proved nothing, and you provided no citations as asked.

You are trolling.
 
2010-12-06 08:48:31 PM  
So global warming is Sarah Palin's fault?

/DNRTFA
 
2010-12-06 08:49:12 PM  
what part of a peer reviewed refutation of Steig 2009 do you not get?
 
2010-12-06 08:52:03 PM  
 
2010-12-06 08:52:12 PM  
stirfrybry: what part of a peer reviewed refutation of Steig 2009 do you not get?

I successfully countered it. Not my problem you didn't read my link.

You, on the other hand, insist on using asinine terminology like "warmers" to describe people who understand the available science.

Basically, you're just pathetic.
 
2010-12-06 08:52:37 PM  
stirfrybry: what part of a peer reviewed refutation of Steig 2009 do you not get?

The part where you didn't read it. From the author's own comments:

"The results in the paper are generally similar to the in-process analysis that was posted at CA and here prior to the submission. Overall, we find that the Steig reconstruction overestimated the continental trends and underestimated the Peninsula - though our analysis found that the trend in West Antarctica was, indeed, statistically significant. I would hope that our paper is not seen as a repudiation of Steig's results, but rather as an improvement."
 
2010-12-06 08:53:22 PM  
iamdonovan: I would hope that our paper is not seen as a repudiation of Steig's results, but rather as an improvement.

Oh....*SNAP*
 
2010-12-06 08:54:04 PM  
Look here's Steig explaining how scientists thought the warming on the artic penisula was localaized and there was cooling at the interior, but his wonderful method showed how the warming was continent-wide.
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v457/n7228/full/7228356a.html
Well, his methods created artifacts which he didn't understand but which are well known to statisticians.

Climate scientists need statistics lessons
 
2010-12-06 08:55:34 PM  
stirfrybry: Climate scientists need statistics lessons

Sorry, but it's a little late after your "warmer" quip, troll.

Get lost.
 
2010-12-06 08:56:53 PM  
Burning forests and tundra are natural feedback expected as temperatures rise (as they have done in Canada, Australia and the Western US at twice the global rate, and in the North at four or more times the global rate) but there is unlikely to be a "runaway greenhouse effect" since there is only a few years worth of carbon locked up in the tundra and forest. There has been a great drying out across Alaska, Canada, and Eurasia. There has also been an increase in methane and CO2 release from tundra and Arctic lakes, as well as a reduction in the number of lakes in Northern Canada (by at least 900).

It could happen. Runaway is one of the things nature does, like genetic runaways which result in the spread of a beneficial gene to the whole population--or the extinction of a population.

But the greenhouse effect is believed to be irreversible now any way thanks to the failure of carbon emission reductions through: taxes, cap and trade or meaningful reductions in industrial, agricultural, land use or deforestation emissions. The only thing that leaves is peak oil, peak natural gas, peak coal, peak biomass and peak whatzit, plus massive increases in the number of nuclear power plants for terrorists and Homer Simpsons to blow up.

Gigatonnes of natural methane and CO2 release from the Arctic are not going to help but they are probably not going to overwhelm the 30 gigatonnes of CO2 (or 8 plus tonnes of carbon) that humans release each year.

For that you need to overwhelm the rain forest, soils, and the corals, bony fish, and plus a lot of other carbon sinks, such as planckton. Well, actually there aren't a lot of other carbon sinks. Once you blow those out, the oceans die.
 
2010-12-06 08:57:14 PM  
And just in case you just want to stay in the thread and mash your keyboard instead of reading a link:

Skeptic Argument vs What the Science Says

1 "It's the sun" The sun's output has barely changed since 1970 and is irrelevant to recent global warming.
2 "Climate's changed before" Climate reacts to whatever forces it to change at the time; humans are now the dominant forcing.
3 "There is no consensus" 97% of climate experts agree humans are causing global warming.
4 "It's cooling" The last decade 2000-2009 was the hottest on record.
5 "Models are unreliable" Models successfully reproduce temperatures since 1900 globally, by land, in the air and the ocean.
6 "Temp record is unreliable" The warming trend is the same in rural and urban areas, measured by thermometers and satellites.
7 "It hasn't warmed since 1998" 2005 was the hottest year globally, and 2009 the second hottest.
8 "Ice age predicted in the 70s" The vast majority of climate papers in the 1970s predicted warming.
9 "Antarctica is gaining ice" Satellites measure Antarctica losing land ice at an accelerating rate.
10 "CO2 lags temperature" Recent CO2 increase has caused recent warming without any time lag.
11 "We're heading into an ice age" Worry about global warming impacts in the next 100 years, not an ice age in over 10,000 years.
12 "It's not bad" Negative impacts of global warming on agriculture, health & environment far outweigh any positives.
13 "1934 - hottest year on record" 1934 was one of the hottest years in the US, not globally.
14 "Al Gore got it wrong" Al Gore book is quite accurate, and far more accurate than contrarian books.
15 "It's freaking cold!" A local cold day has nothing to do with the long-term trend of increasing global temperatures.
16 "It's cosmic rays" Cosmic rays show no trend over the last 30 years & have had little impact on recent global warming.
17 "Hurricanes aren't linked to global warming" There is increasing evidence that hurricanes are getting stronger due to global warming.
18 "Hockey stick is broken" Recent studies agree that recent global temperatures are unprecedented in the last 1000 years.
19 "'Climategate' CRU emails suggest conspiracy" Several investigations have cleared scientists of any wrongdoing in the media-hyped email incident.
20 "Arctic icemelt is a natural cycle" Thick arctic sea ice is undergoing a rapid retreat.
21 "Sea level rise is exaggerated" A variety of different measurements find steadily rising sea levels over the past century.
22 "It's Urban Heat Island effect" Urban and rural regions show the same warming trend.
23 "Mars is warming" Mars is not warming globally.
24 "It's a 1500 year cycle" Ancient natural cycles are irrelevant for attributing recent global warming to humans.
25 "Water vapor is the most powerful greenhouse gas" Rising CO2 increases atmospheric water vapor, which makes global warming much worse.
26 "Human CO2 is a tiny % of CO2 emissions" The natural cycle adds and removes CO2 to keep a balance; humans add extra CO2 without removing any.
27 "Oceans are cooling" The most recent ocean measurements show consistent warming.
28 "Greenland was green" Other parts of the earth got colder when Greenland got warmer.
29 "CO2 effect is weak" The strong CO2 effect has been observed by many different measurements.
30 "Climate sensitivity is low" Net positive feedback is confirmed by many different lines of evidence.
31 "Other planets are warming" Mars and Jupiter are not warming, and anyway the sun has recently been cooling slightly.
32 "Extreme weather isn't caused by global warming" Extreme weather events are being made more frequent and worse by global warming.
33 "There's no empirical evidence" There are multiple lines of direct observations that humans are causing global warming.
34 "Glaciers are growing" Most glaciers are retreating, posing a serious problem for millions who rely on glaciers for water.
35 "It cooled mid-century" Mid-century cooling involved aerosols and is irrelevant for recent global warming.
36 "We're coming out of the Little Ice Age" The sun was warming up then, but the sun hasn't been warming since 1970.
37 "IPCC is alarmist" The IPCC summarizes the recent research by leading scientific experts.
38 "It warmed before 1940 when CO2 was low" Early 20th century warming is due to several causes, including rising CO2.
39 "Satellites show no warming in the troposphere" The most recent satellite data show that the earth as a whole is warming.
40 "Polar bear numbers are increasing" Polar bears are in danger of extinction as well as many other species.
41 "There's no correlation between CO2 and temperature" There is long-term correlation between CO2 and global temperature; other effects are short-term.
42 "Greenland is gaining ice" Greenland on the whole is losing ice, as confirmed by satellite measurement.
43 "Mt. Kilimanjaro's ice loss is due to land use" Most glaciers are in rapid retreat worldwide, notwithstanding a few complicated cases.
44 "CO2 is not a pollutant" Excess CO2 emissions will lead to hotter conditions that will stress and even kill crops.
45 "Animals and plants can adapt to global warming" Global warming will cause mass extinctions of species that cannot adapt on short time scales.
46 "CO2 was higher in the past" When CO2 was higher in the past, the sun was cooler.
47 "Medieval Warm Period was warmer" Globally averaged temperature now is higher than global temperature in medieval times.
48 "CO2 limits will harm the economy" Various economic estimates find the net economic impact of a price on carbon will be minor.
49 "Ocean acidification isn't serious" Past history shows that when CO2 rises quickly, there was mass extinctions of coral reefs.
50 "Scientists can't even predict weather" Weather and climate are different; climate predictions do not need weather detail.
51 "There's no tropospheric hot spot" We see a clear "short-term hot spot" - there's various evidence for a "long-term hot spot".
52 "2009-2010 winter saw record cold spells" A cold day in Chicago in winter has nothing to do with the trend of global warming.
53 "Arctic sea ice has recovered" Thick arctic sea ice is in rapid retreat.
54 "2nd law of thermodynamics contradicts greenhouse theory" The 2nd law of thermodynamics is consistent with the greenhouse effect which is directly observed.
55 "It's Pacific Decadal Oscillation" The PDO shows no trend, and therefore the PDO is not responsible for the trend of global warming.
56 "Neptune is warming" And the sun is cooling.
57 "It's the ocean" The oceans are warming and moreover are becoming more acidic, threatening the food chain.
58 "Jupiter is warming" Jupiter is not warming, and anyway the sun is cooling.
59 "Greenland ice sheet won't collapse" When Greenland was 3 to 5 degrees C warmer than today, a large portion of the Ice Sheet melted.
60 "Volcanoes emit more CO2 than humans" Humans emit 100 times more CO2 than volcanoes.
61 "CO2 effect is saturated" Direct measurements find that rising CO2 is trapping more heat.
62 "It's El Niño" El Nino has no trend and so is not responsible for the trend of global warming.
63 "Pluto is warming" And the sun has been recently cooling.
64 "CO2 measurements are suspect" CO2 levels are measured by hundreds of stations across the globe, all reporting the same trend.
65 "It's aerosols" Aerosols have been masking global warming, which would be worse otherwise.
66 "Solar Cycle Length proves its the sun" The sun has not warmed since 1970 and so cannot be driving global warming.
67 "It's not happening" Recent global warming is occurring and is due to humans.
68 "IPCC were wrong about Himalayan glaciers" Glaciers are in rapid retreat worldwide, despite 1 error in 1 paragraph in a 1000 page IPCC report.
69 "CO2 has a short residence time" Excess CO2 from human emissions has a long residence time of over 100 years
70 "500 scientists refute the consensus" Around 97% of climate experts agree that humans are causing global warming.
71 "It's microsite influences" Microsite influences on temperature changes are minimal; good and bad sites show the same trend.
72 "Sea level rise predictions are exaggerated" Sea level rise is now increasing faster than predicted due to unexpectedly rapid ice melting.
73 "Dropped stations introduce warming bias" If the dropped stations had been kept, the temperature would actually be slightly higher.
74 "Less than half of published scientists endorse global warming" Around 97% of climate experts agree that humans are causing global warming.
75 "Humans are too insignificant to affect global climate" Humans are small but powerful, and human CO2 emissions are causing global warming.
76 "Greenhouse effect has been falsified" The greenhouse effect is standard physics and confirmed by observations.
77 "It's a climate regime shift" There is no evidence that climate has chaotic "regimes" on a long-term basis.
78 "It's not us" Multiple sets of independent observations find a human fingerprint on climate change.
79 "The science isn't settled" That human CO2 is causing global warming is known with high certainty & confirmed by observations.
80 "Mike's Nature trick to 'hide the decline'" Phil Jones was quoted out of context, and nothing was hidden.
81 "It's land use" Land use plays a minor role in climate change, although carbon sequestration may help to mitigate.
82 "Phil Jones says no global warming since 1995" Phil Jones was misquoted.
83 "Humidity is falling" Multiple lines of independent evidence indicate humidity is rising and provides positive feedback.
84 "It's methane" Methane plays a minor role in global warming but could get much worse if permafrost starts to melt.
85 "Hansen's 1988 prediction was wrong" Jim Hansen had several possible scenarios; his mid-level scenario B was right.
86 "Lindzen and Choi find low climate sensitivity" Lindzen and Choi's paper is viewed as unacceptably flawed by other climatologists.
87 "IPCC overestimate temperature rise" Monckton used the IPCC equation in an inappropriate manner.
88 "CO2 is coming from the ocean" The ocean is absorbing massive amounts of CO2, and is becoming more acidic as a result.
89 "CO2 is not increasing" CO2 is increasing rapidly, and is reaching levels not seen on the earth for millions of years.
90 "Naomi Oreskes' study on consensus was flawed" Benny Peiser, the Oreskes critic, retracted his criticism.
91 "Ice isn't melting" Ice is melting at an accelerating rate at both poles and in glaciers all over the world.
92 "It's albedo" Albedo change in the Arctic, due to receding ice, is increasing global warming.
93 "Record snowfall disproves global warming" Warming leads to increased evaporation and precipitation, which falls as increased snow in winter.
94 "IPCC were wrong about Amazon rainforests" The IPCC statement on Amazon rainforests was correct, and was incorrectly reported in some media.
95 "Springs aren't advancing" Hundreds of flowers across the UK are flowering earlier now than any time in 250 years.
96 "CO2 is not the only driver of climate" CO2 is the main driver of climate change.
97 "Over 31,000 scientists signed the OISM Petition Project" The 'OISM petition' was signed by only a few climatologists.
98 "It's too hard" Scientific studies have determined that current technology is sufficient to reduce greenhouse gas emissions enough to avoid dangerous climate change.
99 "The IPCC consensus is phoney" Ironically, it's those who are mispresenting Hulme's paper that are the ones being misleading.
100 "Ice Sheet losses are overestimated" A number of independent measurements find extensive ice loss from Antarctica and Greenland.
101 "The sun is getting hotter" The sun has just had the deepest solar minimum in 100 years.
102 "Solar cycles cause global warming" Over recent decades, the sun has been slightly cooling & is irrelevant to recent global warming.
103 "Tree-rings diverge from temperature after 1960" This is a detail that is complex, local, and irrelevant to the observed global warming trend.
104 "A drop in volcanic activity caused warming" Volcanoes have had no warming effect in recent global warming - if anything, a cooling effect.
105 "Climate is chaotic and cannot be predicted" Weather is chaotic but climate is driven by Earth's energy imbalance, which is more predictable.
106 "It's waste heat" Greenhouse warming is adding 100 times more heat to the climate than waste heat.
107 "Water levels correlate with sunspots" This detail is irrelevant to the observation of global warming caused by humans.
108 "Mauna Loa is a volcano" The global trend is calculated from hundreds of CO2 measuring stations and confirmed by satellites.
109 "CO2 emissions do not correlate with CO2 concentration" That humans are causing the rise in atmospheric CO2 is confirmed by multiple isotopic analyses.
110 "Breathing contributes to CO2 buildup" By breathing out, we are simply returning to the air the same CO2 that was there to begin with.
111 "Trenberth can't account for the lack of warming" Trenberth is talking about the details of energy flow, not whether global warming is happening.
112 "Water vapor in the stratosphere stopped global warming" This possibility just means that future global warming could be even worse.
113 "Warming causes CO2 rise" Recent warming is due to rising CO2.
114 "It's ozone" Ozone has only a small effect.
115 "Global temperatures dropped sharply in 2007" But global temperatures rose sharply in 2009, to the second hottest level.
116 "Scientists retracted claim that sea levels are rising" The Siddall 2009 paper was retracted because its predicted sea level rise was too low.
117 "CO2 was higher in the late Ordovician" The sun was much cooler during the Ordovician.
118 "Southern sea ice is increasing" Antarctic sea ice has grown in recent decades despite the Southern Ocean warming at the same time.
119 "Antarctica is too cold to lose ice" Glaciers are sliding faster into the ocean because ice shelves are thinning due to warming oceans.
120 "DMI show cooling Arctic" While summer maximums have showed little trend, the annual average Arctic temperature has risen sharply in recent decades.
121 "It's CFCs" CFCs contribute at a small level.
122 "Melting ice isn't warming the Arctic" Melting ice leads to more sunlight being absorbed by water, thus heating the Arctic.
123 "It's global brightening" This is a complex aerosol effect with unclear temperature significance.
124 "Positive feedback means runaway warming" Positive feedback won't lead to runaway warming; diminishing returns on feedback cycles limit the amplification.
125 "Greenland has only lost a tiny fraction of its ice mass" Greenland's ice loss is accelerating & will add metres of sea level rise in upcoming centuries.
126 "Satellite error inflated Great Lakes temperatures" Temperature errors in the Great Lakes region are not used in any global temperature records.
127 "It's satellite microwave transmissions" Satellite transmissions are extremely small and irrelevant.
128 "Royal Society embraces skepticism" The Royal Society still strongly state that human activity is the dominant cause of global warming.
129 "We didn't have global warming during the Industrial Revolution" CO2 emissions were much smaller 100 years ago.
130 "It's only a few degrees" A few degrees of global warming has a huge impact on ice sheets, sea levels and other aspects of climate.
131 "CO2 only causes 35% of global warming" On top of CO2 warming, other pollutants such as methane and black carbon cause additional warming 65% as much as CO2.

Copyright 2010 www.skepticalscience.com
 
2010-12-06 08:57:26 PM  
iamdonovan: whidbey: stirfrybry: /peer reviewed, so STFU and read it

Citations needed.

Also: Sorry, but one vague paper doesn't discount the easily available science which clearly shows that Antarctica is gaining sea ice but losing land ice at an accelerating rate which has implications for sea level rise.

I don't see how the link you provided does anything to rebut the abstract posted by stirfrybry. IIRC, much of the ice loss from Antarctica is concentrated in the Antarctic Peninsula (AP) and West Antarctic Ice Sheet (WAIS), which is consistent with increased warming there. On the other hand, despite stirfrybry's ignorant crowing, the paper he provides is not a refutation of the original paper, but rather an improvement, that still shows a statistically significant warming trend in AP/WAIS.


I wonder what undersea volcanoes might have to do with that localized warming? (new window)
 
2010-12-06 08:59:58 PM  
DesertDemonWY: I wonder what undersea volcanoes might have to do with that localized warming? (new window)

I wonder if it's possible for you to just accept what the overwhelming majority of science has published on the subject without posting some link as a means to make unfounded speculations...

I'm doubting it is.
 
2010-12-06 09:07:41 PM  
whidbey: I wonder if it's possible for you to just accept what the overwhelming majority of science has published on the subject without posting some link as a means to make unfounded speculations...

I'm doubting it is.


Yes, because pointing out a "major volcano" in the same area that some warming is occurring is "unfounded speculation"
 
2010-12-06 09:19:31 PM  
stirfrybry: Read this whibdey, if you can comprehend it

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/12/01/skeptic-paper-accepted-on-antarctica-rebu t s-steig-et-al/

learn some stats so you can understand how you warmers are being duped by faulty methods.

/peer reviewed, so STFU and read it


There is some comedy gold in the comments in one of the linked pages - scroll down to March 5 2009 at 2:52 pm (new window)

One guy posts his correspondence with Nature, including this gem: "...the paper by Steig et al. cannot be considered to be a work of science until my questions have been answered..."

The bit below that about the climatological mean is hilarious.

I hope he's not still waiting for a reply.

/my reply here is not an endorsement of your position, just a comment related to the link you provided (and somehow managed to insert spaces into)
 
2010-12-06 09:23:54 PM  
stirfrybry: Read this whibdey, if you can comprehend it

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/12/01/skeptic-paper-accepted-on-antarctica-rebu t s-steig-et-al/

learn some stats so you can understand how you warmers are being duped by faulty methods.

/peer reviewed, so STFU and read it


Peer reviewed, so its got extra bandwaggony goodness.
 
2010-12-06 09:24:01 PM  
rmoody: And just in case you just want to stay in the thread and mash your keyboard instead of reading a link:

Skeptic Argument vs What the Science Says

tl; dr.

I'll just leave this here:
img152.imageshack.us
 
2010-12-06 09:29:22 PM  
amquelbettamin: rmoody: And just in case you just want to stay in the thread and mash your keyboard instead of reading a link:

Skeptic Argument vs What the Science Says

tl; dr.

I'll just leave this here:


Good jorb. Please explain why Venus is hotter than Mercury.
 
2010-12-06 09:42:44 PM  
whidbey: I read your link. It's vague and uninteresting, and I provided a link that more than addresses the point.

Also, pro-tip: using the term "warmer" in a climate change discussion doesn't bode much for your credibility, it just outs you as a troll.


How is that any different than using the term "denier"?

There may be lots of DERP in the opposition, but if that opposition keeps climatologists fact-checking and opening up the source data for review that's fine by me. Unchallenged science is not necessarily a good thing, IMHO.

/just saying
//pops the popcorn
 
2010-12-06 10:06:25 PM  
HighZoolander: amquelbettamin: rmoody: And just in case you just want to stay in the thread and mash your keyboard instead of reading a link:

Skeptic Argument vs What the Science Says

tl; dr.

I'll just leave this here:

Good jorb. Please explain why Venus is hotter than Mercury.


I don't know, Venal warming?
 
2010-12-06 10:10:23 PM  
DesertDemonWY: whidbey: I wonder if it's possible for you to just accept what the overwhelming majority of science has published on the subject without posting some link as a means to make unfounded speculations...

I'm doubting it is.

Yes, because pointing out a "major volcano" in the same area that some warming is occurring is "unfounded speculation"


Yeah it is. I'm glad we agree.

Or wait. You're still clinging to that bit of guesswork. My bad.

Gleeman: How is that any different than using the term "denier"?



Because "deniers" are the minority.

The troll who used the term earlier wants you to believe that those of us who understand the science and the nature of the crisis are the ones akin to the Flat-Earthers.

There may be lots of DERP in the opposition, but if that opposition keeps climatologists fact-checking and opening up the source data for review that's fine by me. Unchallenged science is not necessarily a good thing, IMHO.

Skepticism is fine. Outright fear and loathing of science is unacceptable.
 
2010-12-06 10:25:20 PM  
Gleeman: There may be lots of DERP in the opposition, but if that opposition keeps climatologists fact-checking and opening up the source data for review that's fine by me. Unchallenged science is not necessarily a good thing, IMHO.

Deniers challenge climatologists like a toddler challenges the UFC grand champion. There is a significant difference between challenging current scientific theories with equally well-considered methodology, and exercising your high-school level science education to fling handful after handful of your own shiat against the entire scientific community in the hopes that something eventually sticks. You cannot impose honesty and rigor on the scientific community by doing the exact opposite and then doing a victory dance every time the media notices you.
 
2010-12-06 10:26:38 PM  
amquelbettamin: HighZoolander: amquelbettamin: rmoody: And just in case you just want to stay in the thread and mash your keyboard instead of reading a link:

Skeptic Argument vs What the Science Says

tl; dr.

I'll just leave this here:

Good jorb. Please explain why Venus is hotter than Mercury.

I don't know, Venal warming?


you're getting warmer... What caused Venal warming?
 
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