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(ecosalon)   You cannot recycle pizza boxes. Well there's the green movement's problem right there   (ecosalon.com) divider line 171
    More: Asinine, Pizza box form factor, scrap metal, food contamination, styrofoam, cardboard, petroleum product, plastic bottle, Joan Crawford  
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12750 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Nov 2010 at 5:06 PM (3 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-11-23 06:18:52 PM
Tunacrab: SO MUCH WIN

Thats pretty much how I feel. To play off of the ever popular "security theatre" phrase, I would like to suggest the phrase "environmentalist theatre" to describe this situation.
 
2010-11-23 06:19:01 PM
If you have a food recycling program you can throw the boxes in there and they get composted. So yes, you can recycle pizza boxes.
 
2010-11-23 06:19:58 PM
Tunacrab: I wrote this about six months ago on the topic of recycling:

I don't recycle. More specifically, I refuse to. There, I said it. Settle down and take a breath. I know how you are probably feeling right now. When I've made this statement in the past to friends and acquaintances, they have responded with looks of disdain, bewilderment, and disgust. I refuse to recycle. I throw it all in the trash. The blue bin gets no use at my home. Glass, plastic, paper, whatever... If it is waste, I throw it away. In the trash. To be sent to a landfill. Why on earth would someone choose to not recycle? Everyone knows it is good for our environment! We're running out of landfills! Don't you know that plastic bottle you're throwing away is made from OIL? Witch! Heathen!

So why do I not recycle? The short answer: I'm actually a conservationist.

That's right. Recycling, in the curbside collection sense we have come to know, is bad for the planet. Recycling produces more waste, burns more fuel, and costs more money than simply throwing it all in the trash. I know this is a little hard to swallow, but please hear me out. Recycling has become so ubiquitous in our society, people rarely ever stop to question its efficacy. We're taught as children to Reduce, Reuse, and Recycle. Recycling has become fashionable. Celebrities preach it. Restaurants brag about it. Products tout their post consumer waste percentage. People discuss it with their neighbors, pat themselves on the back about what a good thing they are doing (and then continue to buy cheap disposable products and fructose water in oil-derived packages).

Let's go back a bit... "Reduce, Reuse, Recycle." We've all heard it. I know it was certainly pounded into my head in public school. The mantra has come to be synonymous with the conservationist movement. Notice the order. The "3Rs" mantra you have become so familiar with is actually a simplified version of what is known as the waste hierarchy. Prevention and minimization (Reduction) of waste is at the top of this hierarchy. They are most favored, and most important. Next comes reuse, and then recycling. After recycling comes energy recovery (incineration) and then disposal (landfills).

How did recycling become the poster child for conservationism, when in actuality it is just slightly better than incineration? Why does the "3Rs" logo look like recycling, with its cycling green arrows, when it is clearly the least favored option? Why are we putting such an emphasis on this empty gesture when reduction and reuse are so much more important? Is recycling even a good thing in all cases? In the case of curbside pickup, I say no.

Say your city once had 50 garbage trucks, before they adopted recycling. Everything went in the trash bin, and once a week a truck would come on your route and empty it for you. From there, your trash would be loaded onto a larger truck and moved a short distance to the regional landfill and forgotten. This used to be the end of the line. No more process, no more trucking, nothing. Your trash went to a spot on the outskirts of the city to sit there and slowly decompose. Natural recycling, if you will.

Now let's look at the same city, with a typical curbside recycling program. Because there are now twice the routes, the city (your taxes) had to buy 50 more expensive, diesel burning trucks. These plastic and metal contraption had to be manufactured, using fuel and creating waste in the process. The plastic bins your recyclables are picked up in had to be made as well (more fuel and waste). These trucks and bins have a limited service life, and will eventually be replaced (more fuel and waste). Because there are now twice as many trucks, your city is burning twice as much diesel on collection routes, moving around these very heavy trucks that are carrying little more than empty volumes of air (your recyclables). Now, instead of being hauled to the outskirts of town, your trash may be trucked hundreds of miles to the nearest recycling facility (fuel, waste, I think you are getting the picture). Then, finally, ...


That's ridiculous.

By that I mean both that you expect me to read that whole goddamn thing, and the idea that you can't simultaneously reduce, reuse, and recycle, which is as far as I got.

I do all three in spades.
 
2010-11-23 06:20:31 PM
My waste hauler specifically lists pizza boxes as DO recycle, so, uh, hmmm.

As for bottle caps: stop tightening them back onto the bottle, people! The recycle truck doesn't need to be hauling around a load full of your air. Throw the stupid caps in the trash. /pet peeve
 
2010-11-23 06:20:38 PM
unyon: What kills me is that they don't take scrap metal, the single easiest thing to both sort and recycle. If I'm going to be spending time sorting and recycling specialty items, it should be by sorting glass by quality to improve the cost and not metals.

Most people don't really have "scrap metal" in any appreciable quantity.

/Sell your own scrap, it's not hard, and you get money.
//My dad strips down copper wire that he gets through various contacts in local industry
///Not like a farker would get it, by raiding an unoccupied suburb.
 
2010-11-23 06:20:51 PM
Tunacrab: Say your city once had 50 garbage trucks, before they adopted recycling. Everything went in the trash bin, and once a week a truck would come on your route and empty it for you. From there, your trash would be loaded onto a larger truck and moved a short distance to the regional landfill and forgotten. This used to be the end of the line. No more process, no more trucking, nothing. Your trash went to a spot on the outskirts of the city to sit there and slowly decompose. Natural recycling, if you will.

This is the biggest problem with your argument. This hasn't been the case in, say, 200 years. Maybe longer. The "slowly" word you use is a bit of an understatement. While a good amount of trash exposed to the sun and the elements will, indeed, decompose relatively quickly, on the order of a couple of years, most trash isn't exposed, it's covered with more trash. And that trash accumulates too fast for it to decompose before there is more laid on top.
 
2010-11-23 06:22:08 PM
I suppose I also support the recycling of batteries and other hazardous materials. Unlike paper, those things can do serious damage if left to rot in a landfill.

/obvious
 
2010-11-23 06:22:28 PM
StreetlightInTheGhetto: That's ridiculous.

By that I mean both that you expect me to read that whole goddamn thing, and the idea that you can't simultaneously reduce, reuse, and recycle, which is as far as I got.

I do all three in spades.


Yet you were compelled to quote the whole thing.
 
2010-11-23 06:22:52 PM
Check your local gov's website for the do's and don'tsLA recyclables (new window)
 
2010-11-23 06:22:59 PM
kvinesknows: Tunacrab: I wrote this about six months ago on the topic of recycling:

that comment


and this one

Tunacrab: I don't recycle. More specifically, I refuse to.


seem to say the opposite


Really? So criticism of recycling somehow does not fall under the greater topic of recycling?
 
2010-11-23 06:25:13 PM
Tunacrab: kvinesknows: Tunacrab: I wrote this about six months ago on the topic of recycling:

that comment


and this one

Tunacrab: I don't recycle. More specifically, I refuse to.


seem to say the opposite

Really? So criticism of recycling somehow does not fall under the greater topic of recycling?


Something went over your head there.
 
2010-11-23 06:27:16 PM
I burn mine. I get pizza delivered maybe once every few months. I use them to light fires in my stove. I burn 100% natural, free range, organic local hardwoods in my stove.
 
2010-11-23 06:27:27 PM
Who the hell uses the bigger bin for anything but more garbage space anyways? Have fun with the poop train from my sons diaper genie dude.
 
2010-11-23 06:28:38 PM
StreetlightInTheGhetto: That's ridiculous.

By that I mean both that you expect me to read that whole goddamn thing, and the idea that you can't simultaneously reduce, reuse, and recycle, which is as far as I got.

I do all three in spades.


Good for you. Seriously. No sarcasm intended.

The point is that most people don't do all three. Most people don't really put much emphasis on reduction and reuse. Recycling enables people to justify their wasteful habits, while ignoring the more important conservation tenets. Calling attention to the inefficiencies of recycling may enlighten a few. I'm not completely against recycling... Sometimes it is a good idea, although in the curbside recycling sense, it is not.
 
2010-11-23 06:29:46 PM
Great Justice: Tunacrab: SO MUCH WIN

Thats pretty much how I feel. To play off of the ever popular "security theatre" phrase, I would like to suggest the phrase "environmentalist theatre" to describe this situation.


I like it.
 
2010-11-23 06:31:03 PM
Panty Sniffer: Tunacrab: kvinesknows: Tunacrab: I wrote this about six months ago on the topic of recycling:

that comment


and this one

Tunacrab: I don't recycle. More specifically, I refuse to.


seem to say the opposite

Really? So criticism of recycling somehow does not fall under the greater topic of recycling?

Something went over your head there.


panty sniffer gets it
 
2010-11-23 06:32:28 PM
Panty Sniffer: Tunacrab: kvinesknows: Tunacrab: I wrote this about six months ago on the topic of recycling:

that comment


and this one

Tunacrab: I don't recycle. More specifically, I refuse to.


seem to say the opposite

Really? So criticism of recycling somehow does not fall under the greater topic of recycling?

Something went over your head there.


Ha! I get it. Feeling a but sheepish for not catching that one. I guess I do recycle sometimes.
 
2010-11-23 06:33:58 PM
Barakku: It works, as long as you have...you know, certain types of people in your neighborhood. Poor people are the best recyclers (or better, reusers). Some cities are retarded and you can't leave out stuff like that (metal, reusable trash) for other people to take.


I've found that salvagers of that sort will seek it out. My neighborhood is a labyrinth, and solidly middle-class. I have no idea how they found my stuff - I had never seen them or their car before. Informant at the roll-off rental place, maybe?
 
2010-11-23 06:34:15 PM
So I guess the past several years i've been using my recycle bin as a trash bin?

I always fill bags with empty soda cans, wine and gatorade bottles. I'm more likely to make the effort if I can do it in one trip.
 
2010-11-23 06:38:02 PM
BigNumber12: Barakku: It works, as long as you have...you know, certain types of people in your neighborhood. Poor people are the best recyclers (or better, reusers). Some cities are retarded and you can't leave out stuff like that (metal, reusable trash) for other people to take.


I've found that salvagers of that sort will seek it out. My neighborhood is a labyrinth, and solidly middle-class. I have no idea how they found my stuff - I had never seen them or their car before. Informant at the roll-off rental place, maybe?


They've actually evolved a metal detecting organ.
 
2010-11-23 06:39:25 PM
timujin: Tunacrab: Say your city once had 50 garbage trucks, before they adopted recycling. Everything went in the trash bin, and once a week a truck would come on your route and empty it for you. From there, your trash would be loaded onto a larger truck and moved a short distance to the regional landfill and forgotten. This used to be the end of the line. No more process, no more trucking, nothing. Your trash went to a spot on the outskirts of the city to sit there and slowly decompose. Natural recycling, if you will.

This is the biggest problem with your argument. This hasn't been the case in, say, 200 years. Maybe longer. The "slowly" word you use is a bit of an understatement. While a good amount of trash exposed to the sun and the elements will, indeed, decompose relatively quickly, on the order of a couple of years, most trash isn't exposed, it's covered with more trash. And that trash accumulates too fast for it to decompose before there is more laid on top.


I see your point. You are right, although I don't think it takes that much away from the argument. Just letting it sit there doesn't bother me a bit. It is still better than curbside recycling.
 
2010-11-23 06:46:06 PM
talldarknstinky: I burn mine. I get pizza delivered maybe once every few months. I use them to light fires in my stove. I burn 100% natural, free range, organic local hardwoods in my stove.

Yep. The woodstove makers say you shouldn't, but I never use more than a half a box or so, torn into a few playing card size chunks for starting.
 
2010-11-23 06:46:10 PM
Derek313: I shift manage babysit at a Hungry Howies, so I am getting a kick...

Cool, maybe you can tell me how you sell so many pizzas with sauce that has absolutely no taste.

/makes Pizza Hut taste like caviar
 
2010-11-23 06:46:19 PM
Tunacrab: timujin: Tunacrab: Say your city once had 50 garbage trucks, before they adopted recycling. Everything went in the trash bin, and once a week a truck would come on your route and empty it for you. From there, your trash would be loaded onto a larger truck and moved a short distance to the regional landfill and forgotten. This used to be the end of the line. No more process, no more trucking, nothing. Your trash went to a spot on the outskirts of the city to sit there and slowly decompose. Natural recycling, if you will.

This is the biggest problem with your argument. This hasn't been the case in, say, 200 years. Maybe longer. The "slowly" word you use is a bit of an understatement. While a good amount of trash exposed to the sun and the elements will, indeed, decompose relatively quickly, on the order of a couple of years, most trash isn't exposed, it's covered with more trash. And that trash accumulates too fast for it to decompose before there is more laid on top.

I see your point. You are right, although I don't think it takes that much away from the argument. Just letting it sit there doesn't bother me a bit. It is still better than curbside recycling.


They're not making more land, you know, it will run out eventually. We can keep building on top of landfills, but that presents its own litany of issues.

Recycling (and, yes, along with reducing and reusing) does keep material out of the landfills. This alone is reason enough for me to do it.

I know it's not as energy efficient as just dumping the trash into a giant hole, but then that's not as efficient as carrying it out to my back yard in a wheelbarrow and dumping it there.

I used to live in south Florida and the only geographical features taller than a few feet down there are the gigantic dirt mounds surrounding the landfills.

There's a lot of trash out there we can't do anything with, I'm going to continue to do what I can about the rest.
 
2010-11-23 06:46:26 PM
When in doubt, throw it in the recycle bin.

The worst that can happen is somebody at the recycle plant then throws it into the trash.

BFD
 
2010-11-23 06:51:20 PM
Tunacrab: I wrote this about six months ago on the topic of recycling...

www.w3bbo.com

Just to pick one nonsense assertion:

Say your city once had 50 garbage trucks, before they adopted recycling. Everything went in the trash bin, and once a week a truck would come on your route and empty it for you. . . . Now let's look at the same city, with a typical curbside recycling program. Because there are now twice the routes, the city (your taxes) had to buy 50 more expensive, diesel burning trucks. . .

. . . and can get rid of many of the garbage trucks, because suddenly there's not as much landfill-bound trash anymore, and thus, no need for a full 50-truck fleet of garbage trucks. (Don't worry, we'll recycle the extra garbage trucks by selling them to another town that needs them.)
 
2010-11-23 06:52:24 PM
 
2010-11-23 06:53:29 PM
I've been printing pizza boxes for 13 years, and some of them get a "corrugated recycles" stamp on the bottom. oops.
 
2010-11-23 07:00:07 PM
Uzzah: . . . and can get rid of many of the garbage trucks, because suddenly there's not as much landfill-bound trash anymore, and thus, no need for a full 50-truck fleet of garbage trucks. (Don't worry, we'll recycle the extra garbage trucks by selling them to another town that needs them.)

Just because less is going into the garbage does not reduce the number or houses needing garbage pickup. The same trucks are on the same routes, stopping at the same houses, on the same schedule. Maybe you could ever-so-slightly increase efficiency by adding more stops on a route because the crews are working a little faster due to the reduced volume, although i don't think the impact is as great as you believe it is.

Selling the trucks to a neighboring city would be reuse, BTW. Any if your theory is correct, they wouldn't need them anyway.
 
2010-11-23 07:01:39 PM
dletter: Derek313: I shift manage babysit at a Hungry Howies, so I am getting a kick...

Cool, maybe you can tell me how you sell so many pizzas with sauce that has absolutely no taste.

/makes Pizza Hut taste like caviar


Surely you can't be serious?
 
2010-11-23 07:04:09 PM
If put your packing peanuts or other styrofoam up on Freecycle or on Craigslist; eBay sellers will pick them up and reuse them as packing material.
 
2010-11-23 07:05:27 PM
unyon: What kills me is that they don't take scrap metal

they do in my city
 
2010-11-23 07:07:31 PM
kvinesknows: Tunacrab: I wrote this about six months ago on the topic of recycling:

that comment


and this one

Tunacrab: I don't recycle. More specifically, I refuse to.


seem to say the opposite


hilarious!
 
2010-11-23 07:10:17 PM
Tunacrab:

Perhaps a different perspective is in order for you. Consider the fact that the landfill is unlikely to ever be rid of its contents. As a society that generates trash, that means landfills will consume more and more area. What does a society do with a dank soup of waste that does nothing? We can't exactly get rid of it, if we could, they wouldn't exist in the first place.

Recycling has multiple uses. Also, your viewpoint regarding the trucks, while true, neglected to consider that your involvement in the process is moot if your neighbors recycle. The truck is already going by, take use of it and make it slightly less inefficient by giving it a higher density of people along its route. Ya, it sucks that your neighbors are pretty much undermining what you are trying to do to curb pollution, but unfortunatly some things - even smart things that may help - get totally lost on the common clay of the land. you know, morons.

If your neighbors are with you, and the truck doesn't make rounds there, more power to you. But one person not participating won't really help matters unless they get their 'section' to do the same. Otherwise you end up neither saving (much) gas for the trucks, nor reducing the landfill issue, then neither side is happy.
 
2010-11-23 07:11:09 PM
Tunacrab: Uzzah: . . . and can get rid of many of the garbage trucks, because suddenly there's not as much landfill-bound trash anymore, and thus, no need for a full 50-truck fleet of garbage trucks. (Don't worry, we'll recycle the extra garbage trucks by selling them to another town that needs them.)

Just because less is going into the garbage does not reduce the number or houses needing garbage pickup. The same trucks are on the same routes, stopping at the same houses, on the same schedule. Maybe you could ever-so-slightly increase efficiency by adding more stops on a route because the crews are working a little faster due to the reduced volume, although i don't think the impact is as great as you believe it is.

Selling the trucks to a neighboring city would be reuse, BTW. Any if your theory is correct, they wouldn't need them anyway.


Recycling and garbage trucks come once every week in the summer months, once every two weeks in the winter. (Edmonton Canada) I could easily make due with once a month in winter, and once every two weeks in the summer.
If it wasn't for dealing with discarded meat bits, once a month all year round would be fine by me.

Meanwhile, a couple of my neighbours looks like they're clearing out the entire house every week. How do people generate 7 full garbage bags every week?
 
2010-11-23 07:20:01 PM
We have a green box composting program that takes household food waste and will allow us to recycle pizza boxes and coffee grinds.. as a physicist thats about all i need it for :)

Seriously with a alternating blue box - plastic , black box - board and paper each week and the green bin for composting my family house is down to a half bag of garbage a week...
 
2010-11-23 07:31:38 PM
Wisdomsage: Consider the fact that the landfill is unlikely to ever be rid of its contents. As a society that generates trash, that means landfills will consume more and more area.

earthfirst.com
http://videosift.com/video/Idiocracy-the-great-Garbage-Avalanche-of-2505 (new window)
 
2010-11-23 07:33:47 PM
Up here in good old Canada, half of that list is actually recyclable. Suck it, you silly Americans you.

/at least, it is my my area
 
2010-11-23 07:35:06 PM
Wisdomsage: Tunacrab:

Perhaps a different perspective is in order for you. Consider the fact that the landfill is unlikely to ever be rid of its contents. As a society that generates trash, that means landfills will consume more and more area. What does a society do with a dank soup of waste that does nothing? We can't exactly get rid of it, if we could, they wouldn't exist in the first place.


I don't know, with all the resources locked up in those landfills i'm surprised we're not strip mining the things yet
 
2010-11-23 07:51:41 PM
Remember that they only recycle cats if they a stamped 1 or 2 on the bottom.

www.ecosalon.com

And these things are right out.

sfscuba.com
 
2010-11-23 08:01:09 PM
If the goal of the green movement is to make everyone want to choke the shiat out of them, they are doing a great job.

Just remember, the patron saint of greens is Adolph Hitler. Loved him some puppies, humans not so much. Same with secular greens. Both sick in the head.
 
2010-11-23 08:08:33 PM
stucka: I haven't been able to find a reliable way of finding places to dispose of old medications; ran into that at a relative's place last week, after calling a couple pharmacies and the police station (some take the prescriptions, then incinerate them).

I must be the reason frogs are developing opposable thumbs, but, hey, I tried.


The farking toilet, if it's good enough for corporations, it's good enough for us!
 
2010-11-23 08:11:17 PM
Uh, why does everybody think they can throw plastic bags in the recycling bins?

Yep, a lot of people around here use the recycling bins as garbage bins too. Sometimes they're too damn lazy to even put the stuff IN the bins, and leave it out outside in the plastic bags. Gee, thanks for caring.
 
2010-11-23 08:20:53 PM
cryinoutloud: Uh, why does everybody think they can throw plastic bags in the recycling bins?

Because lots of them have the little recycling symbols on them..
 
2010-11-23 08:29:28 PM
cryinoutloud: Uh, why does everybody think they can throw plastic bags in the recycling bins?

They're recyclable here.
 
2010-11-23 08:29:55 PM
My community actually does take bottle caps, but the damn things stick to the side of my recycling bin so I actually have a separate bin for bottle caps, cat food can lids and all the other small recyclables that tend to stick. I dump them on top of the regular recycling on collection day so they're less likely to stick to the bottom/sides of the bin.

/csb
//or ocd, take your pick
 
2010-11-23 08:33:18 PM
It all comes down to energy consumption. Most of the time it turns out that using the cheapest possible single-use disposable plates and discarding them after each use is the most cost efficient method to accomplish eating a meal. It uses less energy than recycling plastic plates, it uses less than heating water in order to run your dishwasher to clean conventional plates. Until overcrowded landfills cause waste disposal to become more expensive than the energy required to heat water (or until some sort of renewable energy causes heating water to become cheaper due to not having to buy petroleum to run water heaters), recycling and reusing won't be cost effective.

That being what it is, I still can't bring myself to throw away plates every meal. I'm way more into reusing than recycling. Except for like... aluminum and glass.
 
2010-11-23 08:40:53 PM
Recycling is a pain I'm just to lazy. If someone wants to make money off my garbage then more power to them but I'm not helping them do it. I feel better when I take three garbage cans to the street and poof their empty when I get home it's MAGIC
 
2010-11-23 08:56:12 PM
Styrofoam has been recyclable for years, so why doesn't anybody accept it?
 
2010-11-23 09:00:57 PM
Tunacrab: Because there are now twice the routes, the city (your taxes) had to buy 50 more expensive, diesel burning trucks.

You're really trying to reach with this logic. That idea would work swimmingly if each truck had an unlimited storage area, and didn't have to make return trips to unload.

Example (on a much smaller scale):

You have one truck and one route, your truck carries 100 loads, and in your route, with everything thrown away, you have 1000 loads to pick up.

So in a day, you'll have 10 separate returns to the drop off point in all of your routes.

Then lets look at the recycling route added on. You have 500 loads of recycling and 500 loads of trash, and two 100 load capacity trucks to do it. Now each truck will be able to service the same number of homes in half the time, and each rig will require half as many return trips to the home base, reducing the total mileage to service the same number of homes by 50 miles.

So not only have you reduced the number of diesel consumed, by reducing round trips, but also reduced the wear on your vehicles by more than half. Of course in reality, the vehicles would service a larger area and more customers - but the amount of fuel consumed per load wouldn't increase one bit, and depending on routing and distance to the drop off, it would likely decrease
 
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