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(Some Guy)   Teacher: What are you doing with a six-inch knife in school? Pupil: It's my religion. Teacher: My mistake, carry on   (swns.com) divider line 210
    More: Stupid, Sikh students, Sikhs, stickers, religious education, teachers, More4 News  
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14337 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Nov 2010 at 10:22 AM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-11-15 12:00:26 PM  
wage0048: Pattonism?

Pattonism requires that you wear a matching pair of Ivory handled .45 Colt revolvers. .45 colt != .45 ACP.
 
2010-11-15 12:00:52 PM  
I was not at all familiar with this religion and fortunately have learned a lot from the above posts.

I, however, do not think a weapon - ceremonial/religious or otherwise should be allowed. Zero tolerance is just that, zero tolerance. (Although Millennium makes a good point about exceptions forcing us to challenge this policy)

There seems to be no real debate that Sikhs are peaceful and the Kirpan would never be used for violence - by the wearer.

If a Sikh was attacked by a violent student, however, the Kirpan could be used against the wearer.

To me, it just makes sense not to have any weapon unecessarily available.

Sharp or not, it looks like it could cause bodily harm.
 
2010-11-15 12:01:56 PM  
stewmadness: hazeleyedwolff: I thought carrying a knife with a blade over 2.5 inches was a felony in schools and federal buildings.

Dude, Muslims are a protected class and have special rights. They can honor kill, suicide bomb, and preach piety and kindness all at once.


i18.photobucket.com

"Protected Classes" do NOT work that way!"
 
2010-11-15 12:02:26 PM  
EnochEmery: stewmadness: hazeleyedwolff: I thought carrying a knife with a blade over 2.5 inches was a felony in schools and federal buildings.

Dude, Muslims Christianstm are a protected class and have special rights. They can honor kill, suicide bomb, and preach piety and kindness all at once.

FTFY


Ah yes, the 'blinders' approach. The next time you get body scanned or a pat down at the airport just remember it was Jesus that inspired those wacky Saudis.
 
2010-11-15 12:02:54 PM  
As long as students still face expulsion and/or criminal charges for daring to sneak a butter knife in with their lunch, I'm fine with this.

/There is no religious exception for peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, you felonious terrorist bastard childs.
 
2010-11-15 12:07:04 PM  
Being a country boy, I always carried a knife of some kind. Back then, having a knife wasn't an automatic expulsion, or even worthy of suspension. It was generally confiscated and given back at the end of the year.

Now, if you are a boy scout toting your trusty Barlow to school, you might find yourself expelled, as well as arrested.
 
2010-11-15 12:07:57 PM  
BioStormX: Ah, England. Where even school children are allowed to carry more dangerous weapons that police officers.

Kids in school today carry G36s? Awesome, is it too late to do a few more GCSEs?

Millennium: If your government hadn't recently given serious consideration to mandating plastic pint glasses, you might have a leg to stand on.

You know how I know you've been reading the Daily Mail? The Designing Out Crime initiative doesn't mandate a damn thing.
 
2010-11-15 12:09:44 PM  
I throw the BS card, what country is this in? Not mentioned in article.
 
2010-11-15 12:10:02 PM  
Strik3r: Ryan2065: Strik3r: Fluorescent Testicle: Minor observation:

The Farkers who are currently claiming that "Well, since water pistols and plastic butter knives are considered to be grounds for expulsion, then kirpans should be as well"... Seem to be the same Farkers who biatch the loudest whenever a child is expelled for carrying a water pistol or a plastic butter knife.


ABSOLUTELY !!!!

EVERYONE should follow the SAME RULES!!! What concept!!!!

Stupid rules need to be changed. I do think banning toy weapons and such is a bit silly, but ya gotta be consistent.

You are in favor of zero tolerance rules?


No. Try reading ALL of my post next time. You must have missed the part where I said stupid rules need to be changed.

I AM in favor of ALL people (regardless of their religion) following the SAME rules.


But the whole point of different religions is following different rules. Whether it is dietary restrictions, permitted clothing, etc what distinguishes one faith from another is that they aren't allowed to follow all the same rules.

In order to be tolerant of multiple religions, you must be able and willing to deal with different standards. That is the whole point.
 
2010-11-15 12:10:51 PM  
Farking Canuck: DrMcNinja: Stepqhen: This is where you are wrong, I am pretty sure most Farkers don't have a problem with individuals and their religion, they have problems when people try to jam their religion down the throats of the entire school.

You're either new here, or you haven't been paying attention.

Wrong. Farker's primary issues with religion are the attempts to get it into law, grade schools and other public places.

If people did not try and push their religion into places it does not belong it would not even be discussed on Fark (except to mock the occasional extreme religious stupidity).



PanicMan: I remember a past article about the same issue. The student was allowed to carry the knife, but only if it was wired shut to the scabbard.

The versions I recall have a rivet through knife such that it cannot be removed from the scabbard.

A real knife should not be allowed.


Either way, I don't care. This really doesn't ping my outrage meter at all. But then again I carry a pocket knife of some kind on me at all times.
 
2010-11-15 12:13:15 PM  
pennygirl: Sharp or not, it looks like it could cause bodily harm.

So can my dick, but my teacher never made me leave it at home.
 
2010-11-15 12:19:16 PM  
And a rosary would make an efficient & deadly garrote. BAN ALL CATHOLICS FROM SCHOOL!
 
2010-11-15 12:24:45 PM  
jso2897: Yogimus: Strik3r: Fark Me with a Chainsaw: SO if I have a religion that mandates me to bring a .45 Colt 1911 everywhere I go, that's cool right?


Holy Order of The Gun ????

The gospel of Samuel Colt, and his prophet, John Moses Browning.

The true sacred icon of the Coltist faith is the 1860 Army model.
This guy is a f**king heretic.


The Remington 1858 New Model Army is a better gun: It's stronger, and you can keep spare cylinders loaded for a "quick reload" capability: You just drop the loading lever, pull out the cylinder pin, take out the fired cylinder and pop in a new one, push the cylinder pin back in, loading lever up, and away you go.

With the Colt, you can't do that.
 
2010-11-15 12:27:35 PM  
Ikahoshi:

Make friends with a people and you don't fear them anymore.


If only more people would do that.
 
2010-11-15 12:28:19 PM  
BolloxReader: Strik3r: Ryan2065: Strik3r: Fluorescent Testicle:


But the whole point of different religions is following different rules. Whether it is dietary restrictions, permitted clothing, etc what distinguishes one faith from another is that they aren't allowed to follow all the same rules.

In order to be tolerant of multiple religions, you must be able and willing to deal with different standards. That is the whole point.


WRONG.. Rules CANNOT be fair if they are not equally applied to everyone. Schools should be non-secular institutions of LEARNING. The ONLY place for religion is schools in under a coarse of study.

Let's create special rules for man, then....
And a completely different set for women.....
And another set of rules for short people...


Religion should NEVER dictate to secular schools. Let the religions have their OWN schools and keep the religion OUT of the public schools.

/that being said, I do recognize that this report is about a situation in a school in Europe.
 
Xai
2010-11-15 12:29:00 PM  
Hmm, 0 stabbings using a kirpan on record...

Perhaps they have some common sense after all.
 
2010-11-15 12:30:41 PM  
Strik3r: The ONLY place for religion is schools in under a coarse course of study.

 
2010-11-15 12:37:31 PM  
shivashakti: We're talking Sikhs here. They're not Muslims. They're not terrorists. They're pretty damned peaceful.

I don't know, Sikh Co-worker gave another co-worker a black eye for messing with his hair at the bar once.
 
2010-11-15 12:48:20 PM  
Crosshair: shivashakti: We're talking Sikhs here. They're not Muslims. They're not terrorists. They're pretty damned peaceful.

I don't know, Sikh Co-worker gave another co-worker a black eye for messing with his hair at the bar once.


A Sikh once bit my sister.
 
2010-11-15 12:49:24 PM  
dittybopper: Ikahoshi:

Make friends with a people and you don't fear them anymore.

If only more people would do that.


Unless that friend comes from Iran and is adamant about warning you of the dangers islam poses in his country and to others. How women are butchered and enslaved in he name of islam but the outside world only get snipets of the reality and believes them to be isolated when they are rampant. Then what?
 
2010-11-15 12:51:50 PM  
Strik3r: Religion should NEVER dictate to secular schools. Let the religions have their OWN schools and keep the religion OUT of the public schools.

There is a big difference between separating church and state and being a religiophobic douchebag. Religion should not be preached in secular schools, but why does it matter to you if one student carries a kirpan (or wears a hijab, or wears a cross pendant, or orders a kosher lunch)? Does it really affect anybody?

/Athiest, before I get "Accused" of following one religion or another.
//I just choose to not be an asshole about it.
///All zero tolerance policies should be abolished regardless.
 
2010-11-15 12:52:11 PM  
I took a butterfly knife to school in my senior year (1990) as a prop for a street gang version of Shakespeare.

Could have been expelled. Wasn't.
 
2010-11-15 12:53:35 PM  
Millennium: The Jami Turman Fan Club: ChrisSuperstar: Maybe in some kind of theocracy, but we don't live in theocracies.

England, motherfarker. Do you live in it?

Just because Americans are pussies whose little snowflakes faint if somebody brings a switchblade comb to school doesn't mean that the British have the same issue.

If your government hadn't recently given serious consideration to mandating plastic pint glasses, you might have a leg to stand on.

The problem isn't kirpans. The problem is all these stupid "no tolerance" rules.

I'm not quite sure I agree. Zero-tolerance rules are a good theory, but we need to start focusing them on the actual problems: what people do, not what they have.


I was just going to say the same thing! I mean, in the UK, "Health and safety" has led to festivals being canceled (it might snow, and then you might fall down) and people being fined for putting vegetable peels in the trash (one might fall out, and then the garbage men might slip or be exposed to "toxic waste" or some such nonsense.) In fact, most of the ridiculous articles we've read recently have been about the UK implementing some sort of over-the-top, nanny-state regulations. If anything, Britain's got way more problems then we Americans in this regard. Nice try, though, I guess.
 
2010-11-15 12:56:30 PM  
Xai: Hmm, 0 stabbings using a kirpan on record...

Perhaps they have some common sense after all.


Zero?
 
2010-11-15 12:58:43 PM  
Fluorescent Testicle: Strik3r: Religion should NEVER dictate to secular schools. Let the religions have their OWN schools and keep the religion OUT of the public schools.

There is a big difference between separating church and state and being a religiophobic douchebag. Religion should not be preached in secular schools, but why does it matter to you if one student carries a kirpan (or wears a hijab, or wears a cross pendant, or orders a kosher lunch)? Does it really affect anybody?

/Athiest, before I get "Accused" of following one religion or another.
//I just choose to not be an asshole about it.
///All zero tolerance policies should be abolished regardless.


Applying a rule equally to everyone does NOT equate to Zero Tolerance.

If toy weapons aren't allowed in school, dull metal ones should be equally as unacceptable.

I'm not religiophobic. I just think all people should have the opportunity to learn free from the imposition of religion. Let the religious teach religion. Keep it out of the public schools unless it's an object course of study on the subject.
 
2010-11-15 01:08:57 PM  
Somacandra:
It bothers me that even many Sikhs (new window) are referring to the Amrit Sanchar as a "baptism." Why adopt such Christian language? I'm not going to walk into a church and ask to hold an Amrit Sanchar (new window). I don't understand why anyone would suggest that what goes on in a gurdwara is a "Baptism." The sacred amrit is imbibed in Sikhism, not just sprinkled on them. The religious context is completely different. Not all Sikhs want to be in the Khalsa.


They use it because it's the closest english word, and they're communicating with people not trained in their faith and would actually, y'know, want them to understand basically what the purpose of the ceremony is.

The same reason Sunni will usually refer to the pillars of 'prayer', 'fasting' and 'alms' rather than salah, sawm, and zakat. Very few of the people they're talking to would have any farking clue what they were saying if they intentionally relied on vocabulary from a tongue that almost no one outside their religion speaks. If you say 'baptism' we get that it's a ritual cleansing meant to induct you into some part of the religion, if you say "Amrit Sanchar" all we hear is that you're an insular dick who is making no effort to bridge the cultural gap to the rest of the country... not really a wise decision if you're actually seeking acceptance.

Basically, the word is used because many religious people are essentially reasonable folk who would actually like to get on with their neighbors and possess social skills, not bloody klingon/elf cosplayers at comicon.
 
2010-11-15 01:09:43 PM  
But can he get a job at Disney?
 
2010-11-15 01:15:09 PM  
cig-mkr: I throw the BS card, what country is this in? Not mentioned in article.

It's in the U.K. If you google the name of the school district you'll find that out.
 
2010-11-15 01:18:28 PM  
Joe Blowme: dittybopper: Ikahoshi:

Make friends with a people and you don't fear them anymore.

If only more people would do that.

Unless that friend comes from Iran and is adamant about warning you of the dangers islam poses in his country and to others. How women are butchered and enslaved in he name of islam but the outside world only get snipets of the reality and believes them to be isolated when they are rampant. Then what?


Fap. Fapping makes everything alright.
 
2010-11-15 01:19:46 PM  
During the summer of 97 I was TDY in Fairford England. I had plastic handled locking blade pocket knife between 1 and 2 inches. It was some sort of promotional giveaway thing. When I got off the MAC flight and was met by customs, I was told if that knife is ever seen on me out in public I'd be arrested. I didn't know they were so strict on such laws at the time. I honestly don't see how this knife carried by children is any better.
 
2010-11-15 01:23:44 PM  
evilsearat: But can he get a job at Disney?

Sure!

1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2010-11-15 01:27:02 PM  
You all know the kirpan isn't even sharp, right? It's a billet of metal at best. It couldn't cut butter.
 
2010-11-15 01:39:14 PM  
www.neaca.com
My religion says I have to carry this.
So just back off.
 
2010-11-15 01:45:20 PM  
Just wanted to say, I'm down with the Sikhs.

/Rock the gurudwara
 
2010-11-15 01:45:41 PM  
Here in the Toronto area they put some kind of rivet through the knife/sheath so it can't be pulled out.

The one thing I will say about this is that there was a stabbing in my town recently where a young sikh used a kirpan to do the stabbing and actually there was a good deal of outrage about it in the Sikh community. I guess it's some kind of crazy sin in their religion to use that knife in that way.
 
2010-11-15 01:48:56 PM  
Somacandra: It bothers me that even many Sikhs (new window) are referring to the Amrit Sanchar as a "baptism." Why adopt such Christian language? I'm not going to walk into a church and ask to hold an Amrit Sanchar (new window). I don't understand why anyone would suggest that what goes on in a gurdwara is a "Baptism." The sacred amrit is imbibed in Sikhism, not just sprinkled on them. The religious context is completely different. Not all Sikhs want to be in the Khalsa.

I'm with you on the cultural dilution thing.

But why should it matter if the magic water is sprinkled, imbibed, or shot out of a Super Soaker? It's still magical dihydrogen monoxide either way, right? Surely it can get its god cooties on you through any form of contact? Or like, reach out and grab you from across the room with tentacles of magic water?
 
2010-11-15 01:52:05 PM  
Strik3r: Religion should NEVER dictate to secular schools. Let the religions have their OWN schools and keep the religion OUT of the public schools.

I'm with you on the first part.

But experience has taught me that the second part is just going to lead to segregation and to the crazies becoming more crazy and isolated. Isolation breeds dehumanization. We don't want that, and I'm willing to make reasonable compromises on the first part if they get the crazies out and learning that other people are people too.
 
2010-11-15 01:54:09 PM  
dittybopper: Joe Blowme: dittybopper: Ikahoshi:

Make friends with a people and you don't fear them anymore.

If only more people would do that.

Unless that friend comes from Iran and is adamant about warning you of the dangers islam poses in his country and to others. How women are butchered and enslaved in he name of islam but the outside world only get snipets of the reality and believes them to be isolated when they are rampant. Then what?

Fap. Fapping makes everything alright.


That would get your hand chopped off. Then no more fapping?
 
2010-11-15 01:57:48 PM  
fushigi: Somacandra: It bothers me that even many Sikhs (new window) are referring to the Amrit Sanchar as a "baptism." Why adopt such Christian language? I'm not going to walk into a church and ask to hold an Amrit Sanchar (new window). I don't understand why anyone would suggest that what goes on in a gurdwara is a "Baptism." The sacred amrit is imbibed in Sikhism, not just sprinkled on them. The religious context is completely different. Not all Sikhs want to be in the Khalsa.

I'm with you on the cultural dilution thing.

But why should it matter if the magic water is sprinkled, imbibed, or shot out of a Super Soaker? It's still magical dihydrogen monoxide either way, right? Surely it can get its god cooties on you through any form of contact? Or like, reach out and grab you from across the room with tentacles of magic water?


I thought the EPA banned dihydrogen monoxide. I know i signed the petition.
 
2010-11-15 02:00:55 PM  
Joe Blowme: I thought the EPA banned dihydrogen monoxide. I know i signed the petition.

I blame corporate interest groups. Those damn corporations want to keep guzzling up dihydrogen monoxide and dumping it back into the environment.
 
2010-11-15 02:18:32 PM  
Joe Blowme: dittybopper: Joe Blowme: dittybopper: Ikahoshi:

Make friends with a people and you don't fear them anymore.

If only more people would do that.

Unless that friend comes from Iran and is adamant about warning you of the dangers islam poses in his country and to others. How women are butchered and enslaved in he name of islam but the outside world only get snipets of the reality and believes them to be isolated when they are rampant. Then what?

Fap. Fapping makes everything alright.

That would get your hand chopped off. Then no more fapping?


That's why it's good to learn Yoga:

slave1.jokeroo.com
 
2010-11-15 02:22:05 PM  
As an Asatruar that also has a religious mandate to go about armed at all times... I'm kinda ok with this.
 
2010-11-15 02:26:00 PM  
jso2897: Yogimus: Strik3r: Fark Me with a Chainsaw: SO if I have a religion that mandates me to bring a .45 Colt 1911 everywhere I go, that's cool right?


Holy Order of The Gun ????

The gospel of Samuel Colt, and his prophet, John Moses Browning.

The true sacred icon of the Coltist faith is the 1860 Army model.
This guy is a f**king heretic.


I know it's not an 1860 but how's this?
i140.photobucket.com
 
2010-11-15 02:29:48 PM  
Jim_Callahan: The same reason Sunni will usually refer to the pillars of 'prayer', 'fasting' and 'alms' rather than salah, sawm, and zakat.

In my religion, the pillars are "Owa", "Tana", and "Siam". You have to repeat them over and over until you receive enlightenment.
 
2010-11-15 02:34:09 PM  
dittybopper: Jim_Callahan: The same reason Sunni will usually refer to the pillars of 'prayer', 'fasting' and 'alms' rather than salah, sawm, and zakat.

In my religion, the pillars are "Owa", "Tana", and "Siam". You have to repeat them over and over until you receive enlightenment.


Sounds like my grandfathers "how to speak genuine Irish" lessons... which consisted of trying to say "whale" "oil" "beef" "hooked" fast enough to have the dulcet tones of Erin rolling off your tongue.
 
2010-11-15 02:36:31 PM  
lh4.ggpht.com

Sees your kirpan and raises you a lirpa.
 
2010-11-15 02:51:00 PM  
Rules need to be universal, you can't grant special privileges to one group over another. Either relax the rule for everyone, or ban the knives, only justifiable options.
 
2010-11-15 02:54:17 PM  
Rohasman: dittybopper: Jim_Callahan: The same reason Sunni will usually refer to the pillars of 'prayer', 'fasting' and 'alms' rather than salah, sawm, and zakat.

In my religion, the pillars are "Owa", "Tana", and "Siam". You have to repeat them over and over until you receive enlightenment.

Sounds like my grandfathers "how to speak genuine Irish" lessons... which consisted of trying to say "whale" "oil" "beef" "hooked" fast enough to have the dulcet tones of Erin rolling off your tongue.


There is a really great series of videos that can teach you how to speak Irish.
 
2010-11-15 03:14:54 PM  
dittybopper: Joe Blowme: dittybopper: Joe Blowme: dittybopper: Ikahoshi:

Make friends with a people and you don't fear them anymore.

If only more people would do that.

Unless that friend comes from Iran and is adamant about warning you of the dangers islam poses in his country and to others. How women are butchered and enslaved in he name of islam but the outside world only get snipets of the reality and believes them to be isolated when they are rampant. Then what?

Fap. Fapping makes everything alright.

That would get your hand chopped off. Then no more fapping?

That's why it's good to learn Yoga:


Is it wrong to be appalled and jealous at the same time?
 
2010-11-15 03:27:05 PM  
Fark Me with a Chainsaw: SO if I have a religion that mandates me to bring a .45 Colt 1911 everywhere I go, that's cool right?

i289.photobucket.com

What about if my religion requires me to just bring Colt 45?

It gets you there quicker. Wherever there is.

/hot
 
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