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(Lileks.com)   "I haven't written much about the 'Roadmap to Peace' for the same reason I wouldn't write much about attempts to crossbreed a llama with a vacuum cleaner: I don't think it's going to work."   (lileks.com) divider line 452
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6866 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Jun 2003 at 10:07 PM (12 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2003-06-13 01:06:38 AM  
solve it with what nukes?
 
2003-06-13 01:07:09 AM  
Also, I think that the leaders of groups like Hamas are motivated by more than their political and social goals. It's a well known fact that terrorists enjoy certain benefits that they otherwise would not have access to. Just look at Northern Ireland. There have been documented cases of people willingly joining and fighting with the IRA just to get free drinks and toasts at their local pub. However, catholicism shuns suicide.

Unfortunately, some popular interpretations of Islam don't seem to share the same value of one's own life. So instead of drinks and toasts, it's rediculous promises of sex and bliss in the afterlife.

The whole thing is just one big freakin' mess. Sometimes I wonder if the human race was engineered by a greater power to completely destroy itself.
 
2003-06-13 01:07:58 AM  
http://electronicintifada.net/new.shtml

Link from Kilgore's profile.

Fair and balanced...
 
2003-06-13 01:09:10 AM  
James Robbins (NRO):

In response to al Rantsi's attempted removal, Hamas mounted a suicide attack on a busload of Israeli noncombatants in West Jerusalem, killing at least 16 and wounding nearly 100 more. Within an hour, Israel mounted a second strike at a Hamas leadership node, otherwise known as military commander Massoud al Titi, who was martyred along with several of his henchmen.

In both Israeli attacks some bystanders were also killed and wounded. This led Hamas Founder Sheikh Ahmad Yasin to maintain that "every person in Israel is now a target, because Israel does not show consideration for any military or civilian." Now a target when was then? Hamas has not been particularly scrupulous in its targeting choices, measuring success primarily by way of body count. The Israelis on the other hand have for some time been utilizing a strategy co-pioneered by the United States, namely taking the war to those who are directing it and attempting to spare innocent lives to the extent possible. Yasin's claim that Israel does not distinguish between military (or terrorist) and civilian is belied by the pinpoint nature of the attacks. Yes, they may result in the unintentional deaths of noncombatants, but that can be said of practically any military operation, including those conducted by the United States. The terrorists on the other hand need not worry about causing unintentional deaths because every person they kill is within their target group.
 
2003-06-13 01:10:50 AM  
MagnificentBastard, yeah, I've noticed that before too.

I can't make up my mind whether Kilgore is an Arab, Muslim, Nazi, or Marxist, because he definitely seems to be a one issue voter if you know what I mean.
 
2003-06-13 01:11:25 AM  
I think the biggest problem with that whole area is that the the people as a whole havent really progressed past the 12th century yet due to their resources (oil) they have 20th century money. And that is a horrible combination.
 
2003-06-13 01:11:33 AM  
Correct. It isn't illegal [to build settlements in occupied territory] under international law, it's illegal under Israeli law, and within their own borders.

I don't know about Israeli law, but it is definitely against the Geneva Conventions to do so.
 
2003-06-13 01:11:56 AM  
"You were the one alluding to the allegation that there were no Jews in the ME before '48"

there were jews, but not in significant numbers to justify your reversed analogy.
 
2003-06-13 01:13:04 AM  
but I was referring to Morticianbaby's ridiculous claims.

Okay, the Palis have been digging around the Haram area building new mosques and digging with backhoes in some of the richest archaelogical strata in the world. And they do this will absolutely NO archaelogical observers. Trust me, the archaelogical community is WAY more distressed about the Pali record on artifacts than the "so-called" plunder of Iraq's National Museum.
 
2003-06-13 01:13:51 AM  
There were almost no Arabs there either.
 
2003-06-13 01:13:51 AM  
BBrackmonkey, I'd just say he is yet to be put under the spell of the massive and unholy Zion Master Sorcerer and his arsenal of trickery that puts Skeletor to shame.

We salute you, our half inflated dark lord.

Hoi.
 
2003-06-13 01:14:10 AM  
Here's the deal. It's very simple:

"Palestine," as a sovereign nation, has never existed. In fact, the "Palestinians" do not exist. The following quote spells it all out:

(Way back on March 31, 1977, the Dutch newspaper Trouw published an interview with Palestine Liberation Organization executive committee member Zahir Muhsein.)

Here's what he said:

"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism."

The Palestinians are, AT BEST, an Arab minority group. Before the creation of Israel, no one gave a rats ass about "them" and they would not have a state today even WITHOUT the existence of Israel.

This is, entirely, about Arab anti-semitism, and it always has been. The Palestinian cause is just a prop used by other Arab countries to fight Israel and their Western allies.

End of story. Period. The end.

/lowers blast shield and resumes humming Wagner's "Ride of the Valkyries"
 
2003-06-13 01:14:49 AM  
ARRRRGGGHHHULKSMASH:

I assume by "the people" you mean the Arabe people.
 
2003-06-13 01:14:53 AM  
i can't believe israel hasn't lit off a nuke on the arabs yet.

the arabs will never figure it out that they cannot and will not beat the jews. it's as easy as that.
 
2003-06-13 01:15:27 AM  
"I can't make up my mind whether Kilgore is an Arab, Muslim, Nazi, or Marxist, because he definitely seems to be a one issue voter if you know what I mean"

Yeah because eveybody who disagrees with Isreal or sympathizes with the Palestinians is a Nazi, an Islamic Fundamentalist who wants to kill all westerners, or a Communist. Are you guys going to ever get over that stupid tactic?
 
2003-06-13 01:15:36 AM  
Now that it's been brought up, Kilgore, just for the record, what ARE you? And is there any chance of you going off to be a human shield somewhere far away where there is no internet access?

/obnoxious but hard to resist comment
 
2003-06-13 01:15:37 AM  
ARRR- for real. And even with vast amounts of oil only the teeny tiny countries like Kuwait, Qatar, Bahrain, and UAE actually enjoy decent living standards. It would basically be just an extension of the African shiathole if they didn't have all those hydro-carbon deposits.
 
2003-06-13 01:17:30 AM  
Kilgore

Reversed analogy? WTF are you talking about? Are you denying that Jews were tossed out of Arab lands in the same number as "Pals" were from the state of Israel? And since those Jews were "from the hood" do you think they just disappeared instead of settling within Israel?

What perfidy are you engaging in???
 
2003-06-13 01:17:48 AM  
Antialias, the Zionist-circle-jerk ritual is the only way for the Zion Master Sorceror summon the spirits of evil and cause the Arab nations to become technologically and socially backwards and economically stagnant.

and then when our powers combine, we bring out CAPTAIN ZIONIST! (He's a hero! gonna take the Arabs down to zero! blah blah, fighting on Israel's side)

as for Kilgore.

He's more like an ogre. Running around under bridges and whining at Israel.

RF
 
2003-06-13 01:18:20 AM  
you know what they say about assumption
 
2003-06-13 01:18:33 AM  
The United States will not allow Israel to be destroyed. The Arab nations will not allow the Palestenians to be destroyed. Perhaps there can be some compromise?
 
2003-06-13 01:18:40 AM  
Yeah Kilgore, for real, are you a Nazi, Commie, Arab, or Muslim? I'm dying to know. And why would I ever think of pigeonholing you into one of these groups? Well gee, you link to the Electronic Intifada in your profile.

So out with it, which one of those groups do you belong to?
 
2003-06-13 01:19:19 AM  
The United States will not allow Israel to be destroyed. The Arab nations will not allow the Palestenians to be destroyed. Perhaps there can be some compromise?

Destruction for some, Tiny American flags for others
 
2003-06-13 01:19:41 AM  
I can't make up my mind whether Kilgore is an Arab, Muslim, Nazi, or Marxist, because he definitely seems to be a one issue voter if you know what I mean.

I'm going to go with undergraduate pseudo-intellectual looking to get involved with an unpopular stance to be an "activist".
 
2003-06-13 01:20:39 AM  
Grendl123

"Asshat, the Temple Mount is INSIDE THE CAPITAL OF ISRAEL. Tell Bush he can't visit the Capital building, because if he does it will cause trouble, and see what happens."

No, but I'll tell him this:

Don't visit a strip joint cause it will cause trouble.
Don't hang out in a Synagogue and talk about jesus cause it will cause trouble.
Don't go to an abortion clinic and spout off, cause it will cause trouble.

Don't do it, even if those things are INSIDE THE CAPITAL OF THE USA, CAUSE IT WILL CAUSE TROUBLE ASSHAT. Have some freakin respect for other people.
 
2003-06-13 01:20:47 AM  
Over 40% of Israeli Jews are sephardic. Sephardic means spanish, but Sephardic Jews havent lived in Spain since the 15th century (aka the Inquisition) and since then (and for many sephardim, for centuries before) they lived in Arab countries. There are almost no Jews left in Arab countries, and most were not killed in the Holocaust.

Where do you think they all went????

And why did they go?
 
2003-06-13 01:20:56 AM  
"Now that it's been brought up, Kilgore, just for the record, what ARE you? And is there any chance of you going off to be a human shield somewhere far away where there is no internet access?"

I'm a progressive, liberal, American who believes that all people should have basic human rights, but it's pointless considering you seem to consider liberalism as pure evil.
 
2003-06-13 01:21:08 AM  
RobbieFal, time to activate our SUPER ZION POWERS!!!

Form of.......... ACCOUNTANT!

Shape of.......... DREIDLE!!
 
2003-06-13 01:21:17 AM  
i think about the only comprimise they understand is genocide.
 
2003-06-13 01:22:10 AM  
or, AAAARRRRRGGGGHHHH HULK SMAH
 
2003-06-13 01:22:36 AM  
Kilgore40:

Yes, we have stated several times in this thread our intentions to drive the liberals into the sea. Jihad!
 
2003-06-13 01:23:59 AM  
Kilgore40, you could have shortened that a bunch and just said "Yeah, I'm a commie".

Frostalicious, perhaps the Palestinians should have a little more respect for Jews just visiting their holy shrines and not launch a round of suicide bombings and shootings because of it.
 
2003-06-13 01:24:07 AM  
Yeah, pretty late in the post. And I was going to ask someone to point out a nation, past or present, that has specifically forbade religion, and how that nation distinguished itself in terms of violence.<br><br>Seems to me that the problem is not one of a single nation with warring religions, but two independent nations with warring religions... except that the Palestine Authority refuses to let anyone define it as a nation - if they did that, they'd lose their whining martyr status and people would complain alot more about the suicide bombers.<br><br>/rant
 
2003-06-13 01:24:28 AM  
Activating my SUPER ZION POWERS!!!

Form of.......... LAWYER!

Shape of.......... DOLLAR SIGN!!

*flies around and sues*
 
2003-06-13 01:24:29 AM  
Linuxthess: "If there is room in Israel for a million Arab citizens, there is surely room in Palestine for a few hundred thousand Jews. It is time we began to say so."

Let's be fair about this, though: that would presupposes that the few hundred thousand jews would be palestinian citizens, not israelis. Unless they accept the fact that they are under the jurisdiction of the Palestinian Authority (and later the Palestinian govt.) as citizens of Palestine, then they are illegal settlers, a failing and very costly attempt at ethnic cleansing.
 
2003-06-13 01:24:37 AM  
basic human rights

Is it a basic human right to live in a Jew-free land? Because the Palis are fighting for that, didn't you know.

Palestine is to be the place of no jews. What a liberal victory for human rights that will be.
 
2003-06-13 01:25:12 AM  
i can't believe israel hasn't lit off a nuke on the arabs yet.

the arabs will never figure it out that they cannot and will not beat the jews. it's as easy as that.


I wouldn't bet on that. Pakistan has had nuclear capability for some time now and they the missile technology to deliver them. Iran is working to join the nuke club as well. Furthermore, the endless conflict is destroying Israel's economy. They can't keep this up forever and the Arabs know it.
 
2003-06-13 01:25:25 AM  
freakin tab button and space bar happy thumb html disabled grumble grumble...
 
2003-06-13 01:25:57 AM  
Kilgore40, so you're a progressive liberal who thinks that everyone should have civil rights?

I can definitely see why you sympathize with Hamas and Islamic Jihad then, since they embody those qualities so well.
 
2003-06-13 01:26:27 AM  
Kilgore says "Yeah because eveybody who disagrees with Isreal or sympathizes with the Palestinians is a Nazi, an Islamic Fundamentalist who wants to kill all westerners, or a Communist."

"...a Nazi" -- no, but if one lies about the history of the area or denies the facts of population in regards to the Jews, it certainly is not Righteous Gentiles the person is identifying with ...

"Are you guys going to ever get over that stupid tactic?" --
not a stupid tactic if it hits close to the mark

"..Islamic Fundamentalist" -- see above..no longer fundie but Islamo-fascist..especially when defending Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Al Asqa, etc. Oh, and reading bin Laden's fatwa or reading the translations of the Friday screeches at mosques, what non-muslims are not outright and "righteously" killed, dhimmitude is their "rightful" place.

"..a Communist" -- not real red-baiting, but it was significant at the so-called "anti-war" marches, organized by Stalinist ANSWER and Maoist NION, that anti-Semitism was quite the rage
 
2003-06-13 01:26:58 AM  
Well children, I hope you have learned an important lesson today. Never present facts and reason when communicating with an aroused Zionist troll. They always respond with strawman arguements and red herrings disguised as historical fallacies.
 
2003-06-13 01:28:54 AM  
Archie_Steel, see that would sound like a good idea, having the settlers just become citizens of Palestine, but I think they'd rather move away very quickly if that happened, for obvious reasons.
 
2003-06-13 01:29:05 AM  
It won't work, nothing will work, the whole situation is farked, there's no hope, no peace, no peace, there's nothing anyone can do -

Oh, wait. You know what would work? If the Palestinian Authority cracked down on the terrorists within their borders (or stopped supporting them, for beginners), like they keep promising and promising and promising, THAT might work!

Back to our scheduled program:
http://www.zombo.com

Who got boobies?
 
2003-06-13 01:29:29 AM  
Is it a basic human right to live in a Jew-free land? Because the Palis are fighting for that, didn't you know.

Actually, that is not what they're fighting for. They're fighting to end an illegal occupation that has robbed an entire generation of its future. Meanwhile, Israel fuels the radicalization of the palestinian street with collateral damage from targeted assassinations, economic terrorism and continuing illegal settlements.
 
2003-06-13 01:30:16 AM  
'nuff said


[image from mediaservice.photoisland.com too old to be available]
 
2003-06-13 01:30:23 AM  
Kilgore40
Well children, I hope you have learned an important lesson today. Never present facts and reason when communicating with an aroused Zionist troll. They always respond with strawman arguements and red herrings disguised as historical fallacies.


Wait a minute? There's a Zionist troll too? To compliment the Zionist Master Sorcerer? ....This is remarkable.

In all seriousness what the fark are you talking about Kilgore40? No one is buying it, and we will still drive the liberal infidels into the sea.
 
2003-06-13 01:30:47 AM  
Kilgore, you're alright.
 
2003-06-13 01:31:28 AM  
Kilgore40, you know what's funny? You always use that term "Zionist" like its some sort of insult. Like normal people would be offended at being labeled a Zionist.
 
2003-06-13 01:31:58 AM  
Unless they accept the fact that they are under the jurisdiction of the Palestinian Authority (and later the Palestinian govt.) then they are illegal settlers, a failing and very costly attempt at ethnic cleansing.


Unless the blacks in the American South accept the fact that they are under the jurisdiction of the Confederacy (and later the Jim Crow), then they are fugitive negroes, a failing and very costly attempt at suberverting white culture.

/apples and apples

The Palestinian Authority is a racist entity. Its goal is Judenrein. It would be fine IF jews could live there as Palestinian Jews, but they would be killed by roving gangs of racist thugs. How is that fair?
 
2003-06-13 01:32:16 AM  
bbcrackmonkey "Archie_Steel, see that would sound like a good idea, having the settlers just become citizens of Palestine, but I think they'd rather move away very quickly if that happened, for obvious reasons."

So you're in opposition to MorticianBaby, who says that palestinians want to have a jew-free land - it seems rather that most jewish settlers would refuse to live in a free Palestine.
 
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