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(Some Guy)   Its hard to miss the screeching 180° turn by pro Israeli pundits on Turkey   (ipsnews.net) divider line 184
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13476 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Jun 2010 at 11:33 AM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-06-24 09:14:57 AM
 
2010-06-24 09:32:16 AM
I read that as "American Genocide" and wondered why a bunch of people over there cared about Native Americans, you know, Injuns.
 
2010-06-24 09:35:47 AM
New 'Axis of Evil' to be announced as "Anyone except USA and Israel" in 5....4....3....
 
2010-06-24 09:42:15 AM
Turkey has been steadily moving away from a secular society and trying to position itself as the head of ME arab states (as Iran has been doing, and yes I realize neither is arab).

People may be doing a 180 becasue of Israel, but their relationship to israel is a symptom of the above.
 
2010-06-24 09:46:26 AM
Party Boy: Next to it (TF) is another article on this

Suddenly, the Israel lobby discovers a genocide
I once tried to blow the whistle on the Israel lobby's denial of the Armenian Genocide -- and I had to leave my job (new window)


I have thought for a long time that the Israeli lobby's refusal to recognize the armenian genocide as a bargaining chip with turkey was BS.
 
2010-06-24 11:36:12 AM
Our elite commandos botched a crowd control operation, killed 9 of their citizens and now they're pissed at us!!!! This is soooo unfair!
 
2010-06-24 11:36:57 AM
Neo-Conservatives Lead Charge Against Turkey, Pudding
 
2010-06-24 11:36:59 AM
liam76: Party Boy: Next to it (TF) is another article on this

Suddenly, the Israel lobby discovers a genocide
I once tried to blow the whistle on the Israel lobby's denial of the Armenian Genocide -- and I had to leave my job (new window)

I have thought for a long time that the Israeli lobby's refusal to recognize the armenian genocide as a bargaining chip with turkey was BS.


It's only genocide if you slaughter Jews.
 
2010-06-24 11:38:37 AM
OMG. Jim Lobe goes green!
 
2010-06-24 11:39:01 AM
liam76: Turkey has been steadily moving away from a secular society

Want to know how I know you're an idiot? The only Western country more rabidly secular than Turkey is France.
 
2010-06-24 11:39:41 AM
Turkey is a NATO country. At least for a while.
 
2010-06-24 11:40:12 AM
The United States should seriously consider suspending military cooperation with Turkey

Well, except we need Incirlik. We could simplify things by GTFO Iraq.
 
2010-06-24 11:40:26 AM
AmazingRuss: liam76: Party Boy: Next to it (TF) is another article on this

Suddenly, the Israel lobby discovers a genocide
I once tried to blow the whistle on the Israel lobby's denial of the Armenian Genocide -- and I had to leave my job (new window)

I have thought for a long time that the Israeli lobby's refusal to recognize the armenian genocide as a bargaining chip with turkey was BS.

It's only genocide if you slaughter Jews.


Right there in the Jewish holy book is a description of the original genocide. As the Jews came out of the desert from Egypt they killed every man, woman, child, AND animal that God told them to. They didn't fark around. They even killed the animals.
 
2010-06-24 11:40:29 AM
No wonder. They've been taking too many liberties lately.
img85.imageshack.us
 
2010-06-24 11:40:55 AM
Have any of you actually been to turkey lately? Its slowly dissolving into heavily drinking and hookah smoking version of Iran. Its only a matter of time before the alcohol goes too. The weird hairy women Turkish porn industry is already getting a rusty axe to the back of its head.

www.sexplay.cc
 
2010-06-24 11:41:00 AM
Neoconservatives belong in an unmarked mass grave.
 
2010-06-24 11:41:52 AM
Murkanen, that has been the case until recently, but I think he's right in his assessment that they're moving away from that. There's an Islamic-affiliated party in power in Government and they had some very newsworthy purges of top-level military officials a few months back that were suspected of plotting a coup, in the true Turkish form of keeping the government secular.

- R
 
2010-06-24 11:42:00 AM
liam76: Turkey has been steadily moving away from a secular society and trying to position itself as the head of ME arab states (as Iran has been doing, and yes I realize neither is arab).

People may be doing a 180 becasue of Israel, but their relationship to israel is a symptom of the above.


You're reading way to much into the results of one election. So they have a religious PM and ruling party this time around. Does that mean America was moving in the direction of an evangelical society when we elected Bush, a born again Christian, twice?

Turkey's society still remains open and it isn't like they're suddenly adopting sharia or some shiat up there. Their leadership is definitely pushing a policy of engagement with the Muslim world (like the Turkey and Brazil agreement with Iran to do uranium trading), but that's different from claiming they're no longer secular.

Everyone goes through little cycles of social change, we have various religion motivated legislation crop up in America from time to time and it shouldn't be worrisome when other countries do it. I'd wait for the big shoes to start dropping like liquor bans and heavy discrimination against non-Muslims before I panicked.

/every time a turkish government gets too religious, their very secular military removes the government
//plus I'd rather have Turkey as the leader of the Islamic world than any other option
/the entire Middle East was pretty chill when the Ottomans were running in
 
2010-06-24 11:42:03 AM
Neo-Conservatives Lead Charge Against Turkey

1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2010-06-24 11:42:22 AM
vudukungfu: I read that as "American Genocide" and wondered why a bunch of people over there cared about Native Americans, you know, Injuns.

Feathers. Not dots....
 
2010-06-24 11:43:04 AM
Murkanen: The only Western country more rabidly secular than Turkey is France.

I find your statement to be hyperbolic, your hair is a bird
 
2010-06-24 11:44:06 AM
CygnusDarius: Neo-Conservatives Lead Charge Against Turkey

Look at the size of those breasts! Also that woman has large mammaries.
 
2010-06-24 11:44:32 AM
CygnusDarius: Neo-Conservatives Lead Charge Against Turkey

holy, has she got a license for those things?
 
2010-06-24 11:45:18 AM
moops: Neoconservatives belong in an unmarked mass grave.

Goddamned nest of vipers.


www.hammer-graveyard.org.uk
 
2010-06-24 11:47:10 AM
Maybe, you know, Israel can learn to chill, and actually be friendly with a country rather than openly exploitative? I understand, a country must look out for its interests, but it doesn't mean they have to make every single issue the 'most important thing in the world', it seems too much like a crazy girlfriend threatening to break up with you over every little trivial thing, and Israel- you ain't hot enough to get away with that.
 
2010-06-24 11:47:40 AM
i have a very hard time believing rush limbaugh will ever oppose turkey
 
2010-06-24 11:49:39 AM
CygnusDarius: Neo-Conservatives Lead Charge Against Turkey

oh btw, Thanks for the mammories
 
2010-06-24 11:50:19 AM
Daniel Pipes, the controversial director of the Likudist Middle East Forum (MEF), echoed JINSA's call for ousting Ankara from NATO and urged Washington to provide direct support for Turkey's opposition parties in an article published by the National Review Online.

If Daniel Pipes hates you, you're doing something right.

Secondly, interfering with local politics is the reason a lot of countries in that region hate us. Hell our removal of the Persian government, installation of the Shah and support of him was the direct farking cause of everything Iran is today. No way that can go wrong again, right? Seriously, how would we feel if say China started providing direct support to a political party to help them get elected? I'd at least never vote for that party and be screaming at the Justice Department to do something about it.

Third, Israel has absolutely no motivation to make other countries hate us or get us to embark on a policy that leaves Israel as our only ally in the Middle East, thus forcing us to rely on them for logistics support and basing in the region. I mean they gain nothing by that. *sarcasm off*
 
2010-06-24 11:50:53 AM
To top it off, they're trying to play it like they now have some moral high ground over Turkey.

They didn't give an airborne shiat about Armenians as long as there was something in it for them. Israel has a price.
 
2010-06-24 11:52:18 AM
Party Boy: Next to it (TF) is another article on this

Suddenly, the Israel lobby discovers a genocide
I once tried to blow the whistle on the Israel lobby's denial of the Armenian Genocide -- and I had to leave my job (new window)


I'm not sure I see subby's 180 turn from the neo conservative pundits, but this article was interesting and appalling.
 
2010-06-24 11:57:07 AM
too bad we do not give our Foreign Military Funds slated for Israel to Turkey.
 
2010-06-24 12:00:00 PM
one of Ripley's Bad Guys: too bad we do not give our Foreign Military Funds slated for Israel to Turkey.

They'd just use it to persecute some Kurds. Neither one should get a dime.
 
2010-06-24 12:01:29 PM
subby: "Its hard to miss the screeching 180° turn by pro Israeli pundits on Turkey"


It's equally hard to miss the screeching 180° turn by Turkey, from ally to antagonist.

Would you keep going out for beers with your college buddy after he seduced your wife and got you fired from your job?
 
2010-06-24 12:01:43 PM
DarnoKonrad: one of Ripley's Bad Guys: too bad we do not give our Foreign Military Funds slated for Israel to Turkey.

They'd just use it to persecute some Kurds. Neither one should get a dime.


i don't think fighting the PKK counts as "persecuting some kurds." maybe in the same way that we are persecuting al qaeda, or the russians cruelly persecuted their german houseguests in 1944.
 
2010-06-24 12:02:18 PM
The article quotes Victor Davis Hanson.

If you are gentile, how do you go from being a classics professor in Fresno to a senior fellow of the Hoover Institute at Stanford?
You cozy up to snakes the neo conservatives. Being an israel firster has done wonders for his career and that of John Bolton.
 
2010-06-24 12:02:58 PM
lajaunie: The weird hairy women Turkish porn industry is already getting a rusty axe to the back of its head.

That's more than a little disturbing; the last thing anyone needs right now is a hairy, Turkish axe wound.
 
2010-06-24 12:03:11 PM
DavidVincent: CygnusDarius: Neo-Conservatives Lead Charge Against Turkey

oh btw, Thanks for the mammories


+1

/I'd glaze it.
 
2010-06-24 12:03:44 PM
spmkk: Would you keep going out for beers with your college buddy after he seduced your wife

That's a funny way to say your wife is a whore.
 
2010-06-24 12:04:30 PM
there was a really good article in last week's Economist about changes in the relations between Turkey and Israel.

Ewwww, I read the Economist.
 
2010-06-24 12:06:09 PM
Also, am I the only one that seems to notice Israel is seemingly being ran by scores of Otto von Bismarck clones?
www.iwise.comwww.iwise.comwww.iwise.comwww.iwise.comwww.iwise.com
/in chorus
//"Israel shall be unified through blood and iron!"
///Otto von Bismarck (new window), he's worth reading up on, surprisingly effective and unsubtle tactician- gave chillingly accurate prediction about ww1.
 
2010-06-24 12:06:24 PM
Sygerrik: DarnoKonrad: one of Ripley's Bad Guys: too bad we do not give our Foreign Military Funds slated for Israel to Turkey.

They'd just use it to persecute some Kurds. Neither one should get a dime.

i don't think fighting the PKK counts as "persecuting some kurds." maybe in the same way that we are persecuting al qaeda, or the russians cruelly persecuted their german houseguests in 1944.




They used to go to jail for merely speaking the language. You're analogies are shiat.
 
2010-06-24 12:15:11 PM
DarnoKonrad: Sygerrik: DarnoKonrad: one of Ripley's Bad Guys: too bad we do not give our Foreign Military Funds slated for Israel to Turkey.

They'd just use it to persecute some Kurds. Neither one should get a dime.

i don't think fighting the PKK counts as "persecuting some kurds." maybe in the same way that we are persecuting al qaeda, or the russians cruelly persecuted their german houseguests in 1944.



They used to go to jail for merely speaking the language. You're analogies are shiat.


m'y analog'ies are prett'y accur'ate actual'ly. the most expensive aspect of the ongoing conflict is undoubtedly the military one. if we sen'd turkey foreign military funds, what % will be spent kicking over innocent kurdish children's sand castles and what % will go to stopping the PKK and other terrorist groups?

regardless of what used to happen, right now turkey is dealing with a severely problematic insurgency. as much as we may deplore the suppression of the kurds (which has eased up since turkey elected a president that was, you know, partially kurdish), the majority of turkish kurds elect to remain there instead of forming a new nation or going to kurdistan in iraq.

the issue is actually kind of complex, but while the PKK are not representative of kurds as a whole, they are undoubtedly a terrorist organization deserving of the swiftest military action.
 
2010-06-24 12:15:56 PM
Murkanen: liam76: Turkey has been steadily moving away from a secular society

Want to know how I know you're an idiot? The only Western country more rabidly secular than Turkey is France.


Know how I know you don't know a single damn thing about what's been going on in Turkish politics and society for the last, oh, 20 years?
 
2010-06-24 12:16:55 PM
Sygerrik:
the issue is actually kind of complex, but while the PKK are not representative of kurds as a whole, they are undoubtedly a terrorist organization deserving of the swiftest military action.


Well, then it is important for the US and Israel to stop arming and training the Kurd insurgency in Iran, Iraq and Turkey.
 
2010-06-24 12:17:45 PM
I like how they're trying to turn Brazil into a potentially-evil country, too. Lula's visit to Tehran was more a result of his popularity getting to his head--I mean come on, the guy's an idiot. He's basically bizarro George W. Bush.
 
2010-06-24 12:17:57 PM
ha-ha-guy: Daniel Pipes, the controversial director of the Likudist Middle East Forum (MEF), echoed JINSA's call for ousting Ankara from NATO and urged Washington to provide direct support for Turkey's opposition parties in an article published by the National Review Online.

If Daniel Pipes hates you, you're doing something right.

Secondly, interfering with local politics is the reason a lot of countries in that region hate us. Hell our removal of the Persian government, installation of the Shah and support of him was the direct farking cause of everything Iran is today.


Another goddam idiot.
 
2010-06-24 12:19:15 PM
The US communists were like that with the Nazis as well.

First they were anti-Nazi, then when Hitler signed the treaty with Stalin, suddenly the US communists were all in favor of the Nazis. Then, when Hitler invaded the Soviet Union, the US communists all went back to being anti-Nazi. Well, not enough to want to fight the Nazis personally, but willing to demand that the US fight them.
 
2010-06-24 12:22:35 PM
Sygerrik: the issue is actually kind of complex,

Aren't they all? Especially when the good Kurds and the bad Kurds are merely distinctions between the Turkey and Iraq border -- as well as their relative amounts of sovereignty.

We can spit hairs on this issue, but Turkey has a history of mistreating those people -- not as raw as the Palestinian deal, but analogous enough. What do you expect in a nation that criminalizes insulting Turkishness?

Nothing I'd equate with our fight with Al Qaeda -- as I said Kurds for a reason, and not the PKK -- but the Kurds in general are the targets of retribution against the PKK.
 
2010-06-24 12:30:12 PM
whammer: The US communists were like that with the Nazis as well.

First they were anti-Nazi, then when Hitler signed the treaty with Stalin, suddenly the US communists were all in favor of the Nazis. Then, when Hitler invaded the Soviet Union, the US communists all went back to being anti-Nazi. Well, not enough to want to fight the Nazis personally, but willing to demand that the US fight them.


Give me the traditional bed-rock consistent hatred fomented by American racists. Politics is too wishy-washy. Deep limbic fear and hatred of difference is what you can build a movement on.

That's why I'm a Republican.
 
2010-06-24 12:32:15 PM
spmkk: Would you keep going out for beers with your college buddy after he seduced your wife and got you fired from your job?

Hell, if he did that, I'd not only go out for beers with him, I'd buy!
 
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