Took them long enough.

I still wouldn't buy a non japanese-made car...

Anyone else think the headline below is related at all??

doobliebop: I still wouldn't buy a non japanese-made car...

10 bux says you have.

That Honda you have is most likely either Canadian or Mexican.

TyrantII: doobliebop: I still wouldn't buy a non japanese-made car...

10 bux says you have.

That Honda you have is most likely either Canadian or Mexican.

Or Ohioan.

/used to live in Cbus, Honda has huge operations nearby in Marysville

Well, the bar got set pretty low. All you have to do is sell cars that aren't cybernetic runaway chariots of death.

My dad retired from Chrysler. Thank FSM they were bought out by Fiat, and I never have to have another one.

Still won't buy from 'em...

Robo Beat: Or Ohioan.

Mine's Ohioan, except for the transmission, which was made in Japan. And has been replaced twice and serviced a half-dozen times.

On the other hand, Honda has paid for all this without complaint, even 80,000 miles AFTER the end of the original warranty.

So, make of that anecdote what you will.

Ford, sure I could see. GM - eeh, they still are lying out their butts about the Volt. However, I have no understanding how Chrysler is still even in existence.

I would still rather risk my life driving a toyota, then sit in an American car, which I'm almost certain will crap out on me around 100k miles....

If I'm going to die, at least I'm going to die in style.

I am pissed they discontinued Saturn. Damn fine cars.

The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

raygundan: Robo Beat: Or Ohioan.

Mine's Ohioan, except for the transmission, which was made in Japan. And has been replaced twice and serviced a half-dozen times.

On the other hand, Honda has paid for all this without complaint, even 80,000 miles AFTER the end of the original warranty.

So, make of that anecdote what you will.

Well, even the most statistically reliable models of car are going to have a few duds here and there. Your story is more a reflection of their warranty policy than the design or build quality of their cars.

/Used to drive a Citroën, so I know about reliability
//or rather the lack thereof

crab66: The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

If you make junk for thirty years, it takes a lot of good cars to change perceptions. Detroit dig this hole for itself.

Big Three: "We've lied to you many times before about taking quality seriously but we really mean it this time."
The market: "Whatever. We'll see."

The other side of the coin is that the reputation you get for making good cars for thirty years can erode quickly when you start making bad cars, as Toyota is discovering.

quokka70:Detroit dig dug this hole for itself.

Oops.

sgnilward: crab66: The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

Well, if Detroit could build anything other than a full sized truck with even decent quality I might have some sympathy. But until they actually innovate and start showing some leadership instead of playing catch up, I say fark'em.


The same whiny bullshiat from a bunch of people that have probably not driven an American brand in over a decade.

You are too busy selling out America like the farking traitors that you are.

crab66: sgnilward: crab66: The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

Well, if Detroit could build anything other than a full sized truck with even decent quality I might have some sympathy. But until they actually innovate and start showing some leadership instead of playing catch up, I say fark'em.


The same whiny bullshiat from a bunch of people that have probably not driven an American brand in over a decade.

You are too busy selling out America like the farking traitors that you are.

My Honda and Toyota were both built in America.

How long have you hated America anyway?

PowerSlacker: My Honda and Toyota were both built in America.


And the profits go overseas.

How long have you hated America?


Buy American or move to Asia. We don't want you.

crab66: PowerSlacker: My Honda and Toyota were both built in America.


And the profits go overseas.

How long have you hated America?


Buy American or move to Asia. We don't want you.

The Big Three cynically exploited this kind of patriotism for years. They know that some consumers consider it a duty to avoid buying cars of foreign brands and so decided to cheat those Americans by foisting inferior products on them.

(I think I've just been trolled.)

AmazingRuss: Well, the bar got set pretty low. All you have to do is sell cars that aren't cybernetic runaway chariots of death.not put your foot on the wrong farking pedal

FTFY

crab66 The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

The childish, stubborn refusal to acknowledge that it exists because of the behavior of the automakers' histories is even sadder.

quokka70

quokka70:Detroit dig dug this hole for itself.

Oops.


I quoted that because the strikethrough wouldn't transfer and we would have "dig dug", which was a pretty decent game.

crab66: And the profits go overseas.

How long have you hated America?

You know that anyone in the US can get a part of that 'overseas' profits by buying Toyota stock (TM) on the New York Stock Exchange.

Funny enough, more of my Toyota Tacoma was built in the US (90%) than my Ford Ranger (73%), which the rest comes from Canada and Mexico.

That Ranger is the biggest POS I could have ever bought and has inspired me to say never again to domestic bullshiat cars. Speaking of the Ranger, why the fark hasn't Ford updated anything other than sheet metal on that truck in 13 years?

Not surprising since the only thing Toyota had going for it was bulletproof quality. Other than that, their cars are transportation appliances.

/which suits 95% of today's "drivers" just fine
//get the fark outta the left lane, slather asses

TyrantII: doobliebop: I still wouldn't buy a non japanese-made car...

10 bux says you have.

That Honda you have is most likely either Canadian or Mexican.

Might wanna check yer facts there, Bubba.

crab66: sgnilward: crab66: The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

Well, if Detroit could build anything other than a full sized truck with even decent quality I might have some sympathy. But until they actually innovate and start showing some leadership instead of playing catch up, I say fark'em.


The same whiny bullshiat from a bunch of people that have probably not driven an American brand in over a decade.
You are too busy selling out America like the farking traitors that you are.

Boo-farking-hoo. You wanna spend half your annual salary on a piece of shiat, go ahead.

I would buy a Ford, maybe some GM vehicles, but no farking way would I buy a Chrysler at this point (even though I own one now that has been pretty decent). If Ford would bring the AWD turbo Escort to America, and it had good quality, I'd consider it. That's the car I drive.

/Subaru WRX FTW
//70k and only a burned out light bulb on my boost gage, that's it.

MrSteve007: Ford, sure I could see. GM - eeh, they still are lying out their butts about the Volt. However, I have no understanding how Chrysler is still even in existence.

This, this, and this. Well, I don't really give a carp about the Volt, but GM's digging itself out of the hole in terms of quality and fuel efficiency. But Chrysler has no one product that appeals to today's consumers -- after all this time they still don't have a hybrid! I don't see any reason they should exist right now, besides as a massive welfare payout.

doobliebop: I still wouldn't buy a non japanese-made designed car...

FTFY

I could never stand the american car dealership. Everyone I have dealt with came off as the stereotypical sleazy car salesman. I bought my Subaru from a dealership that also sold GMC and Pontiac. They were extremely high pressure and I had to haggle with them for a week. It was like they priced the car(it was used) in a way that you had to haggle so you didn't get screwed, but they made you think you were getting a smoking deal. I went with a friend to buy his at another dealership and it was very painless. Same way with my Honda. I was in and out of the dealership in about 90 min and that included the test drive. I was never witness to Saturn dealerships, but I've heard it was about as pleasant as car buying can be.

kelphead: I could never stand the american car dealership. Everyone I have dealt with came off as the stereotypical sleazy car salesman. I bought my Subaru from a dealership that also sold GMC and Pontiac. They were extremely high pressure and I had to haggle with them for a week. It was like they priced the car(it was used) in a way that you had to haggle so you didn't get screwed, but they made you think you were getting a smoking deal. I went with a friend to buy his at another dealership and it was very painless. Same way with my Honda. I was in and out of the dealership in about 90 min and that included the test drive. I was never witness to Saturn dealerships, but I've heard it was about as pleasant as car buying can be.

When I got out of school and got my first real job, I had my heart set on a Corrola. The Toyota dealership I went to was the most high-pressure, mind-game-playing douchnozzles I've ever met..
// Ended up buying a Chevy Prizm (same car), with more options, for over 2.5k less...

The article makes it sound more like the Asian rivals closed the gap through bad press, and the US automakers did squat.

sgnilward: crab66: The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

Well, if Detroit could build anything other than a full sized truck with even decent quality I might have some sympathy. But until they actually innovate and start showing some leadership instead of playing catch up, I say fark'em.

Sat in (or test drove) a 2010 lacrosse? I'm interested in what car in its class is it playing "catch up" to? The baked-potato on wheels, AKA the Avalon? Haaaar...

And the Fusion and the Malibu aren't really playing "follow the leader" with the Camry either

Subby, I think I see what you did there...

/had to squint
//Supplies!

Splinshints: The childish, stubborn refusal to acknowledge that it exists because of the behavior of the automakers' histories is even sadder.

I have been no fan of the big 2.5's cars. But ignore the difference in quality that Ford and to a lesser extent GM is foolish.

I think that part of the perception gap is that people don't look at cars constantly. The Malibu of 5-6 years ago is a completely different car than the Malibu of today. And the Ford Fusion is leagues better than the old Taurus. People don't notice things like this until it time to buy a car.

This is actually bad news.. now they will:
1. Jack up their prices
2. Take advantage of their customers again and not pay attention to quality, again.
3. Now some damn bean counter will be in charge of designing the cars, again.

quokka70:
Buy American or move to Asia. We don't want you.

The Big Three cynically exploited this kind of patriotism for years. They know that some consumers consider it a duty to avoid buying cars of foreign brands and so decided to cheat those Americans by foisting inferior products on them.

(I think I've just been trolled.)

The sad thing is most the Japanese brand cars are made in the US, while their US rivals are lucky to be assembled in the country and their parts are pretty much universally foreign made. There are far more Mexican made Fords, GMs, and Chryslers than US made ones.

crab66: sgnilward: crab66: The rabid hate for American cars is sad.

Well, if Detroit could build anything other than a full sized truck with even decent quality I might have some sympathy. But until they actually innovate and start showing some leadership instead of playing catch up, I say fark'em.


The same whiny bullshiat from a bunch of people that have probably not driven an American brand in over a decade.

You are too busy selling out America like the farking traitors that you are.

Damn the traitorous haters! Damn them to HELL!

Funk Brothers: Now this is interesting, ever since Japanese automakers moved some of their production facilities to the United States, quality has decline while American automakers moved some of their production facilities outside the United States, quality has increased.

My only conclusion is that American workers produce crappy cars no matter the automotive brand. I blame the unions.

My 1997 Toyota Corolla was made in the U.S. (probably at the now-closed NUMMI plant in Fremont, CA), and it's still going strong today.

I'm sure none of this has anything to do with the Toyota complaints being unvarifiable and attributed to driver error in all of the cases either. Nope, surely this isn't a scam by the American auto makers to push a narrative, not at all.

Or to back a growing trend against the due to the bailouts. Nope, not at all.

"I have no understanding how Chrysler is still even in existence"

Yes, it's obvious you have no understanding. I've had almost 10 years of good service out of my Grand Caravan, I'm looking at getting a Nitro due to the 4x4 feature, yet it's smaller than my 2500 Ram. The only thing making me hesitate buying another car is the fact my Grand Caravan and Ram run so well, I don't really need one.

tallguywithglasseson: MrSteve007: I have no understanding how Chrysler is still even in existence

Chrysler Town & Country, Jeep Grand Cherokee, Dodge Charger, Caravan, Ram

Yup. minivans and Jeep. I gotta give them credit: I see a ton of clapped-out, first-gen Dodge/Chrysler minivans still on the roads around here.

quokka70: If you make junk for thirty years, it takes a lot of good cars to change perceptions. Detroit dig this hole for itself.

Thirty? Try sixty. If you ever see an American car from the 50's or 60's that hasn't been restored, look at the panel gaps; they're vast and horrid. I spent some time looking at an early Mustang a couple years ago, and if someone were to import a car that badly built from Korea today, no one would buy it.

tallguywithglasseson: Chrysler Town & Country, Jeep Grand Cherokee, Dodge Charger, Caravan, Ram

Aren't the Town & Country and the Caravan the same vehicle? My brother has an '03. 40,000 miles on it, and it's already on a second transmission. It rattles, the power windows quit working occasionally and has the style of a dustbuster.

Dodge Charger? The bloated 4-door musclecar wannabe? At least you could have said the Challenger.

The only thing worthwhile to save from that steaming pile of a company is Jeep, and mostly just for the Wrangler and their Gladiator concept truck. The Compass is a travesty to the brand.

/currently owns 2 new Toyotas, 2 older Fords, 1 new Honda, a '52 Dodge, two '48 Willys (aka, Jeep)

raygundan: Robo Beat: Or Ohioan.

Mine's Ohioan, except for the transmission, which was made in Japan. And has been replaced twice and serviced a half-dozen times.

On the other hand, Honda has paid for all this without complaint, even 80,000 miles AFTER the end of the original warranty.

So, make of that anecdote what you will.

Automatic transmission? Honda autos are notoriously terrible. From both the performance and reliability angles. Ive heard that they have a secret program for them. If you get one that starts having trouble during the warranty, or close to it, they extend the warranty on the trans virtually forever as long as the rest of the car is being kept up well. Similar to what you described. They know they are shiat.