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(Independent)   "In reality, the heaven you think you're headed to - a reunion with your relatives in the light - is a very recent invention, only a little older than Goldman Sachs."   (independent.co.uk) divider line 306
    More: Obvious, Jehovah, Goldman Sachs, realization, heaven, St. Peter, Koran, afterlife, scientific explanations  
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16893 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Apr 2010 at 3:03 AM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-04-21 07:07:38 AM
CheeseEatingBulldog: Ah so as Hercules and Zeus are well written about they must be based on true people?

And show me documents of this Jezus..you know of nazereth, please show me.


good rebuttal, at least from a rhetorical point of view.

i dont know the origins of the greek heroes and gods. but, clearly, some of them most likely lived, consider the siege of troy, achilles hector agamemnon etc...
 
2010-04-21 07:12:24 AM
So from the article, it seems Joseph Smith is responsible for the family oriented heaven. Nice. I guess Southpark was onto something when only the Mormons were in heaven. And I find it interesting that someone said that the other versions of heaven sounded like hell and everyone else was in hell in that episode.
 
2010-04-21 07:14:00 AM
WFern: Mija: If they believe in nothing and their belief system isn't a religion then why do fundamentalist atheists feel compelled to push their anti-belief? It would be comical if it wasn't so very sad.

Only the fool says their is no God.

The fact that you don't understand the difference between nihilism and atheism tells me you're remarkably uneducated.


I could have told you that just from the simple their/they're/there screwup performed at the end of their statement.
 
2010-04-21 07:17:32 AM
Life is not the thing. Consciousness is the thing.

Life is a process, like fire or the oxidation of iron. There are no unselfish acts of kindness in nature except those we humans perform. However, consciousness, self awareness this is something altogether different. There is a continuity within us. There is a connection to all life that has ever been. A very real, physical connection contained within our genes. I feel genuine sorrow for those of you mired in shortsighted materialism, hopeless determinism and the sad disconnection of existential angst. There is so much more in the universe than you can taste, touch, smell, hear or feel. Time only appears linear. Your self, your self awareness does not define you. It is what separates you from God.

Heaven is not a place ... it is a state of being beyond the understanding of the 4Kg of gray matter we use to encompass creation.
 
2010-04-21 07:19:52 AM
Retinue: There are no unselfish acts of kindness in nature except those we humans perform.

Are you sure?
Link (new window)
 
2010-04-21 07:24:06 AM
CheeseEatingBulldog: Father_Jack: CheeseEatingBulldog: Baryogenesis:
Fuller: And there IS a liberation in seeing beyond childhood myths.

Here's the problem. You may have found liberation but others won't. How would you feel if a Christian came up to you and said "believe in Christ and you will be saved" ? He can assert that all he wants and it won't mean much to you. The same is true of your statement.

Show me emperical evidence of
a) existence of christ
b) that believing in christ will get me saved
c) saved from what
d) saved from who (I thought god was all loving, so why the need to be saved)?

actually, not to defend the believers in the invisible man, but its pretty clear to most that someone named jesus did exist. i mean, all the mythology had to start from some real event. The bible is pretty good actually at being based loosely in historical events. There were cities sodom and gomorrah for example, that were destroyed in earthquakes. the case for this is pretty strong archaeologically.

so, the people of the day explained the events around them and wove a tale of morality around it, and eventually this stuff got codified by the church as one of the canons in the bible when they decided which books to make the bible out of in the early centuries of the church after rome adopted xtianity.

see, i think what people need to do more of is read the history of the church as a political, historical, and ultimately, HUMAN institution. its as holy as the DMV(except at least the DMV arent child rapists).

When you read about how the roman administrators regarded jesus (he came and went without much fanfare, but had a great post mortem PR team spreading his teachings), how the church came about (disciples travelling the mediterranean), why it survived (roman slaves liked the idea of the afterlife just like the muzzies do now) and then thrived (hint: constantine gave the church a lot of VC funding), one gradually begins to see that the xtianity is a remarkable human institution because of its history.

But how ANYONE could believe it speaks for ANYTHING claiming to be holy or divine, or that ANYONE could ever take it literally (just the number of translations and editings alone should preclude that preposterous notion), is, to use the articles words, on horse dope.

Ah so as Hercules and Zeus are well written about they must be based on true people?

And show me documents of this Jezus..you know of nazereth, please show me.


Uh, not to feed the atheist retard troll, but there is plenty of evidence out there for the existence of Jesus of Nazareth. Only the most foolish of people claim that he didn't exist. His divinity is what the question is.
 
2010-04-21 07:24:45 AM
The issue shouldn't be theism vs atheism. Believe whatever you want. Someone doesn't agree with your worldview? Big farking deal. The important thing is to not be a dick about it.
 
2010-04-21 07:27:18 AM
CheeseEatingBulldog: That may be the case but Atheist ask one to accept reality, Christians ask one to accept absolute batshiat insane crazy zombie fairy tales in order to be saved from an all loving bearded sky wizZard that actually show his love unless you do as his plagarised list of ten things you are not allowed to do.

There is a difference.


I laughed. Well done.
 
2010-04-21 07:27:39 AM
i224.photobucket.com
 
2010-04-21 07:33:04 AM
So this (pops) isn't for real?
 
2010-04-21 07:34:00 AM
The Billdozer:
Uh, not to feed the atheist retard troll, but there is plenty of evidence out there for the existence of Jesus of Nazareth. Only the most foolish of people claim that he didn't exist. His divinity is what the question is.


Actually Billdozer... most of what constitutes evidence of Christ's existence is retcon. The census that was taken when he was born? The timing is off. There are few records from that time of the Roman empire that survive, and what few there are make not mention of Jesus, or anyone like Jesus. (Unless, of course, you'd like to turn Jesus into an amalgam of several historical figures.)

Lack of proof of existence is not proof of non-existence, obviously. I'd just like to state that conclusive proof of existence just isn't there. (Thus the importance of faith.)
 
2010-04-21 07:41:18 AM
Oh, and my take on the hereafter is that human existence is a genetic algorithm. We live in a multiverse, and every decision we make, and every action we take alters our flow through the infinite possibilities.

When we die, we hit a giant GOTO statement and start life over again. Things like Déjà vu are echos from that past existence. Our souls is shaped by how we live life. Our memories, self, etc, though, that all goes to the recycle bin.
 
2010-04-21 07:41:56 AM
i.imgur.com

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?"

-Epicurus

Epicurus's book the Art of Living: Link (new window)
 
2010-04-21 07:42:20 AM

Article is full of Fail.

"King Antiochus got fed up. He invaded and tried to wipe out the Jewish religion entirely, replacing it with worship of Zeus. ... Many young men fled into the hills of Palestine to stage a guerrilla assault - now remembered as the Hanukkah story. ... One of the young fighters - known to history only as Daniel - announced that the martyred Jews would receive a great reward. 'Many of those who sleep in the dust shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt'"

The quoted Daniel lived around 600 BC. He was not one of the Jewish fighters who resisted Antiochus around 70 AD.


"Jesus warned 'there is no marriage in heaven'. You didn't join your relatives. It was you and God and eternal prayer."

Ummm, no. Jesus never said you didn't join your relatives in heaven, nor did he say it was just you, God, and eternal prayer. Jesus actually said very little about heaven.
 
2010-04-21 07:44:48 AM
The Billdozer:

Uh, not to feed the atheist retard troll, but there is plenty of evidence out there for the existence of Jesus of Nazareth. Only the most foolish of people claim that he didn't exist. His divinity is what the question is.


As Evil Twin Skippy stated, there is little to no evidence of Jezus of Nazareth. There were many "Jezus" figures as the time and most if not all "references" to him have been found to be very dubious or outright fake.

So once again, point me to this "proof".
 
2010-04-21 07:48:01 AM
Juniper Jupiter: That author needs to fark the hell off. That belief is all I have to keep getting up out of bed and not downing a chasing a bottle of Tylenol PMs with a bottle of Stoli. Thursday will be four years that my little sister died, and she had a firm belief in Christianity, but she was the ultra-rare non-judgemental Christian. Despite my Atheism, when she died, I switched slightly just so I could imagine her in Heaven. She was just like our Grandmothers.

/I still miss her.
//I'm probably the only Atheist on this planet that believes there is a Heaven if just for that.
///Seriously, why did that guy write that? Just to get in my craw, that's why!


Let her go. Life is a story, you were part of hers and she a part of yours. You will feel much better once you accept her death and start retelling her story, and incorporate her value system into yours. The question of an afterlife is completely irrelevant.

She would want it that way.

/not atheist, or christian, or anything
/realist
 
2010-04-21 07:51:06 AM
Xenomech: Article is full of Fail.

Dude, anyone with more than a GED or a single semester of junior college level history and philosophy already glanced at the article, scoffed at what was clearly either a poorly slapped-together troll article or the rantings of an under educated simpleton and moved on. Calling it "Fail" is kind. I don't even think Christopher Hitchens would sign off on that, with or without a fifth of Scotch in him.
 
2010-04-21 07:52:04 AM
Man On Pink Corner: Juniper Jupiter: That author needs to fark the hell off. That belief is all I have to keep getting up out of bed and not downing a chasing a bottle of Tylenol PMs with a bottle of Stoli. Thursday will be four years that my little sister died, and she had a firm belief in Christianity, but she was the ultra-rare non-judgemental Christian. Despite my Atheism, when she died, I switched slightly just so I could imagine her in Heaven. She was just like our Grandmothers.

That sucks, sorry. :( How did she die?


Webster's Condensed/Cliff Notes version: She collapsed at a trailhead and basically died in front of me, but not officially until after she was in the ER ten minutes later. The hour before that was a little hectic, as she worked herself into a panic attack that got out of hand. It wasn't warm enough and we hadn't biked too fast or hard that day. And the "basically died in front of me" was as I was on the phone with the 911 operator, her pupil were already fixed, staring up blanking at me. It's definitely an image that's burned in my retinas. I can't imagine what it would be like if she had died in a car wreck or during deployment, and I certainly don't envy folks who have loved ones in those situations, but....damn.

/The coroner told me that it was respiratory arrest, probably due to her meds as well...won't go into that, sorry
//Surprisingly, I'm still here, but the heaven belief and Hubby helps. And no, I don't take meds of any kind or get drunk.
///Hubby really does help. His love is immensely indescribable
 
2010-04-21 07:52:27 AM
"Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones." - Marcus Aurelius
 
2010-04-21 07:53:58 AM
With respect to god, I prefer to be ignorant and apathetic.

I don't know and I don't care.
 
2010-04-21 07:54:35 AM
Just remember: you can't spell "BIBLE" without L-I-E.
 
2010-04-21 07:59:18 AM
HAMMERTOE: Just remember: you can't spell "BIBLE" without L-I-E.

Can't spell LIFE or LESBIAN without L-I-E either. Your point?
 
2010-04-21 08:02:53 AM
Retinue: There are no unselfish acts of kindness in nature except those we humans perform.

Are you sure?


Yes, acts of altruism in the lower orders are selfish in that they are intended solely for the propagation of the gene. Hence, a spider allowing its hatchlings to eat its body serves this purpose. It is not the individual which matters ... only the gene.

There can be no truly unselfish acts of kindness without free will just as there can be no good and no evil.
 
2010-04-21 08:09:53 AM
Know this, God loved the people of Earth so much, that He was willing to sacrifice himself in the form of His Son, that anyone who believe in Him and this payment for you should not die and be separated from God forever, but have everlasting extra-dimensional life that goes beyond the mere five that you currently occupy. He didn't pay a personal visit to condemn you and the rest of the world, but that the whole of the peoples of the Earth through Him could be salvaged and spared from permanent destruction.

"Know this, that in my Father's trans-dimensional home mansion there are MANY rooms (that means room for you and everyone else); if it wasn't a fact I wouldn't have even bothered bringing it up!" -- Jesus/Yeshua, [the modern Fark translation]

You can walk away from this good news if you want; that is the power of free will. Just remember that all decisions have consequences-- if you fail to choose you still have made a choice.

Personally, I *like* this good news, and I hope you will accept it also. If you want to rationalize it away based solely on what you can see and feel and study, that's fine, but I hope you're right about the Cosmos being all there ever was, because if you are wrong, there could be hell to pay.
 
2010-04-21 08:14:28 AM
Hindmost: I try to avoid my relatives while they are alive, so I'm not sure what would compel me to hang out with them for all eternity when we are all dead. And I hate bloody harps anyway.

yep, depending on who your relatives are that could be heaven or hell.
 
2010-04-21 08:17:15 AM
Retinue: Retinue: There are no unselfish acts of kindness in nature except those we humans perform.

Are you sure?

Yes, acts of altruism in the lower orders are selfish in that they are intended solely for the propagation of the gene. Hence, a spider allowing its hatchlings to eat its body serves this purpose. It is not the individual which matters ... only the gene.

There can be no truly unselfish acts of kindness without free will just as there can be no good and no evil.


And a human doing something unselfish cannot be seen as progressing the human gene? Ie human survival on a race scale?


Sorry but your argument can be turned against you.

To add to that one could state that any good deed done by a human serves that human by giving him a 'good feeling' ie a selfish thing.
 
2010-04-21 08:28:17 AM
Defiant Bajoran: Know this, God loved the people of Earth so much, that He was willing to sacrifice himself in the form of His Son, that anyone who believe in Him and this payment for you should not die and be separated from God forever, but have everlasting extra-dimensional life that goes beyond the mere five that you currently occupy. He didn't pay a personal visit to condemn you and the rest of the world, but that the whole of the peoples of the Earth through Him could be salvaged and spared from permanent destruction.


I never understood this, so this great son of god..all powerful..came down and basically gave up. Just let himself be killed...wow what a great role model. And for what? Original sin? That sin of the apple in the garden that never existed..with the talking snake? The sin that god knew would happen? He sacraficed himself for us, because he put a tree and talking snake in a garden he knew we would abuse. Yeah that sounds perfectly all loving.

Sounds like a dick to me.
 
2010-04-21 08:37:20 AM
Barryogenisis: The history shows clearly that heaven is a result not of divine inspiration but of human fantasy, and thus, is a fiction. One of the major arguments of atheism is that religion and its major components are fictions. The fact that Heaven isn't real, as its history shows, but instead an intellectual fabrication, specifically created to fill a direct political need during the 2nd century bce (which, btw, was about when the Torah was written) implicitly supports that atheist claim. That you would find it incomprehensible that someone would point this out is what really boggles the mind.
 
2010-04-21 08:42:42 AM
CheeseEatingBulldog: because he put a tree and talking snake in a garden he knew we would abuse. Yeah that sounds perfectly all loving.

There's no such thing as choice or freedom if you have nothing to choose. No one twisted their arms, and the serpent was all talk. Pity Adam chose the woman over God, but that's history. You think God was being a dick for creating free choice? At least He was kind enough to offer a personal solution at his own expense; He could have just said "well, that ended badly; fark you!" and that would have been the end of it, He'd still be God, and you'd be doomed.

Or you can be one with the Universe, or you can be in oblivion and your shell become worm food and your existence meaningless. Whatever. You're gonna die no matter what, and nothing can ever change that. What's wrong with the idea of a God who doesn't want that to be the end, and was willing to fix the problem Himself?
 
2010-04-21 08:43:51 AM
Defiant Bajoran: It can make you feel nice to believe things contrary to the evidence that exists on the subject, but it isn't honest. If you possessed integrity, you wouldn't be able to justify believing in a god that is so clearly a human fabrication. You'll learn more about your god reading Plato's Republic, written 200 years before the Torah, than you will from reading the folk-stories of the Yahweh cult.
 
2010-04-21 08:44:50 AM
This thread has become a debate on mythology. Surreal.

Am I the only one amazed that human beings who have managed to walk on the moon are still engaging in such silly debates? "My fable is right!" "No, MY fable is right!" "You're all wrong, MY fable is right!!"

Admittedly, I have my share of questions about religion. (If there's a god why doesn't he just show his face and end the debate, what kind of cruel god would subject children to be born into lives of poverty and starvation, why would a being capable of creating an entire universe need to create tiny puppets to tell it how super it is, to name a few.)

But since no debate among humans beings will ever result in a definitive answer, I fail to see the point in bouncing quotes and arguments off each other. Maybe it's just pursuit of the cheap thrill of wearing someone down in an argument--if you babble enough and the other person gets sick of the debate, you win and are proven right?
 
2010-04-21 08:46:12 AM
CheeseEatingBulldog: Defiant Bajoran: Know this, God loved the people of Earth so much, that He was willing to sacrifice himself in the form of His Son, that anyone who believe in Him and this payment for you should not die and be separated from God forever, but have everlasting extra-dimensional life that goes beyond the mere five that you currently occupy. He didn't pay a personal visit to condemn you and the rest of the world, but that the whole of the peoples of the Earth through Him could be salvaged and spared from permanent destruction.


I never understood this, so this great son of god..all powerful..came down and basically gave up. Just let himself be killed...wow what a great role model. And for what? Original sin? That sin of the apple in the garden that never existed..with the talking snake? The sin that god knew would happen? He sacraficed himself for us, because he put a tree and talking snake in a garden he knew we would abuse. Yeah that sounds perfectly all loving.

Sounds like a dick to me.


I've thought this for years. Glad someone else noticed. The universe and life in general makes more sense if you realize the person in charge is a real jerk.
 
2010-04-21 08:46:27 AM
FTA: The Greeks believed this. The Zoroastrians believed that. The Jews believed summut' else. And apparently, suicide bombers believe there's hundred's of thousands of libidinous virgins desperate for these guys to blow themselves straight into the kingdom of cum.

It's all totally made up bullshiat.

For you and me both, this is what the afterlife looks like: it's down six, or, up in a puff.

For all you bags of chemicals suffering through your delusions of grandeur, that's as complicated as it's going to get.

Life's a biatch. AND, you're still gonna' die.
 
2010-04-21 08:52:18 AM
thespindrifter: But that's his whole point; God knew they would choose the apple. He made them to choose the apple. All things are the result of god's plan; that is the modern interpretation of god accepted by Jews and Christians alike. Adam and Eve didn't have a choice if your god is as omnipotent and omniscient as you think he is. Of course, for the original writers of that story, god wasn't omnipotent, just a creator who couldn't even keep snakes out of his garden (the serpent, after all, was not god's creation in the story); that's why the story of innocent human disobedience made sense to them. If everything is created with a unique purpose and destiny by god, then how can there be free-will? You may feel comfortable jumping through semantic hoops to argue how so, but I prefer the simplicity of the obvious; there can't.
 
2010-04-21 08:54:12 AM
I had no idea that Goldman Sachs was about 3,300 years old!
 
2010-04-21 08:54:48 AM
Heron: how can there be free-will? You may feel comfortable jumping through semantic hoops to argue how so, but I prefer the simplicity of the obvious; there can't.

hunternuttall.com

"I reject your reality, and substitute my own!"
 
2010-04-21 08:57:50 AM
165BC, patented by the ancient Jews. Until then, heaven - shamayim - was the home of God and his angels. Occasionally God descended from it to give orders and indulge in a little light smiting, but there was a strict no-dead-people door policy. Humans didn't get in, and they didn't expect to. The best you could hope for was for your bones to be buried with your people in a shared tomb and for your story to carry on through your descendants. It was a realistic, humanistic approach to death. You go, but your people live on.

Yeah this is utterly wrong.
 
2010-04-21 08:59:04 AM
This author is a douchebag.

What's wrong with believing in a wonderful place where we go when we leave this mortal coil? I'm not talking about the human perversion of Heaven (72 virgins, lady being banned from Heaven by the Mormons, etc) - but just the comforting belief that we don't need to be scared - that we will be reunited with those we love who left us too early, etc.

I hope the author goes to Heaven when he dies. Just so God can chuckle at him...
 
2010-04-21 09:07:15 AM
The article was interesting until about half-way through, when the author got all preachy and self-righteous. Atheism and theism have at least one thing in common: blowhards.

/That rough-shod, incomplete tromp through the 'history of heaven' stole two minutes from my life that I'll never get back
 
2010-04-21 09:07:18 AM
thespindrifter: "I reject your reality, and substitute my own!"

I embrace any reality with Monica Bellucci:
2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2010-04-21 09:10:38 AM
maskedloser: Atheism and theism Various groups of humans have at least one thing in common: blowhards.

 
2010-04-21 09:32:53 AM
Xenomech: "Jesus warned 'there is no marriage in heaven'. You didn't join your relatives. It was you and God and eternal prayer."


Ummm, no. Jesus never said you didn't join your relatives in heaven, nor did he say it was just you, God, and eternal prayer. Jesus actually said very little about heaven.


Yeah, I'm no bible scholar, nor want to be, but I do believe the part where Jesus says there is no marriage was in response to what happens if a brother is married and dies and his brother takes over his marriage, as was the custom in the day. The question was, who is married to who when everyone is dead and meets up in heaven. Why would his answer have been "there is no marriage in heaven" if the real answer is, "you don't meet up with your relatives"?
 
2010-04-21 09:41:17 AM
Overfiend: This author is a douchebag.

What's wrong with believing in a wonderful place where we go when we leave this mortal coil? I'm not talking about the human perversion of Heaven (72 virgins, lady being banned from Heaven by the Mormons, etc) - but just the comforting belief that we don't need to be scared - that we will be reunited with those we love who left us too early, etc.

I hope the author goes to Heaven when he dies. Just so God can chuckle at him...


What's wrong with believing in Santa Clause as an adult? Having large chunks of the population believe in, and adjust their lives to accomodate fairy tales can have consequences.
 
2010-04-21 09:41:36 AM
trappedspirit: Xenomech: "Jesus warned 'there is no marriage in heaven'. You didn't join your relatives. It was you and God and eternal prayer."


Ummm, no. Jesus never said you didn't join your relatives in heaven, nor did he say it was just you, God, and eternal prayer. Jesus actually said very little about heaven.

Yeah, I'm no bible scholar, nor want to be, but I do believe the part where Jesus says there is no marriage was in response to what happens if a brother is married and dies and his brother takes over his marriage, as was the custom in the day. The question was, who is married to who when everyone is dead and meets up in heaven. Why would his answer have been "there is no marriage in heaven" if the real answer is, "you don't meet up with your relatives"?


A more pressing question is how one deals with relatives and loved ones who end up in hell for all eternity whilst you sit in heaven for eternity. Does god change you to not know, as living for eternity in heaven, whilst knowing your loved ones are being burned and tortured for ever isn't exactly heaven now is it?
 
2010-04-21 09:42:29 AM
Father_Jack: actually, not to defend the believers in the invisible man, but its pretty clear to most that someone named jesus did exist. i mean, all the mythology had to start from some real event.

That's a pretty big assumption. But Christianity does seem to be about the only religion with a holy book that does not include make-believe locations. It's bad enough when you have demons flying around, people mating with angels, bulls lighting on fire, sticks turning into snakes, bushes that wont diaf, manna raining from the sky, rocks with running water, and fish belly vacations. Fortunately in my heaven I finally get to meet Paul Bunyan.
 
2010-04-21 09:42:29 AM
MaxxLarge: FTA: "Jesus warned 'there is no marriage in heaven'. You didn't join your relatives. It was you and God and eternal prayer. It was paradise, but not as we know it."

Ouch. Sounds more like hell to me.

Good thing they're both fairy tales.


Someone, I think someone on Fark, pointed out that the eternally-praising-god version of heaven is a lot like North Korea.
 
2010-04-21 09:44:11 AM
Life after death is EXACTLY like life before conception.
 
2010-04-21 09:45:07 AM
Juniper Jupiter: Man On Pink Corner: Juniper Jupiter: That author needs to fark the hell off. That belief is all I have to keep getting up out of bed and not downing a chasing a bottle of Tylenol PMs with a bottle of Stoli. Thursday will be four years that my little sister died, and she had a firm belief in Christianity, but she was the ultra-rare non-judgemental Christian. Despite my Atheism, when she died, I switched slightly just so I could imagine her in Heaven. She was just like our Grandmothers.

That sucks, sorry. :( How did she die?

Webster's Condensed/Cliff Notes version: She collapsed at a trailhead and basically died in front of me, but not officially until after she was in the ER ten minutes later. The hour before that was a little hectic, as she worked herself into a panic attack that got out of hand. It wasn't warm enough and we hadn't biked too fast or hard that day. And the "basically died in front of me" was as I was on the phone with the 911 operator, her pupil were already fixed, staring up blanking at me. It's definitely an image that's burned in my retinas. I can't imagine what it would be like if she had died in a car wreck or during deployment, and I certainly don't envy folks who have loved ones in those situations, but....damn.

/The coroner told me that it was respiratory arrest, probably due to her meds as well...won't go into that, sorry
//Surprisingly, I'm still here, but the heaven belief and Hubby helps. And no, I don't take meds of any kind or get drunk.
///Hubby really does help. His love is immensely indescribable


Your dead sister does logically validate an argument from positive consequences. If it did, you'd be a jerk for not imagining that cancer was cured while you were at it.
 
2010-04-21 09:48:24 AM
So some people have a dream that there is a place that is all good and no evil....let them have that! Geez, we go to the movies or read a book to step into another reality, why not have an imagine in our minds about what the "perfect life" is, and maybe try to mimic it in our own lives?
 
2010-04-21 09:54:46 AM
prodigalOne: So some people have a dream that there is a place that is all good and no evil....let them have that! Geez, we go to the movies or read a book to step into another reality, why not have an imagine in our minds about what the "perfect life" is, and maybe try to mimic it in our own lives?

Ignorance is something that should be fought against.
 
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