Last time I checked, people died in war.

I especially like the part where they have nice arrows pointing to the reporters saying "Saeed with camera" etc. but no arrows pointing out the "Terrorist with AK-47."

calbert: at least this isn't as trolltastic as yesterday's 800 plus comments that got pulled

I was wondering what this was a follow-up to, having not been around for a few days.

And since when did Fark pull threads for being trolltastic? I remember a few threads being pulled for NSFWness, but not trolling.

I'm sure someone is going to call the leaker a traitor or secret jihadist. How long till someone blames Obama?

"Sounds like propaganda to me," a Central Command official said. Unfortunately, propaganda can also turn out to be true."

Rumsfeld said the majority of the "war on terror"/Exercise in M.I.C. profitability is mostly propaganda.

You fascist war profiteering farks.

KingOfTheFrogs: I especially like the part where they have nice arrows pointing to the reporters saying "Saeed with camera" etc. but no arrows pointing out the "Terrorist with AK-47."

clusterfrak: I'm sure someone is going to call the leaker a traitor or secret jihadist. How long till someone blames Obama?

Negative one days. Did you mess the aforementioned trollerrific thread yesterday?

KingOfTheFrogs: I especially like the part where they have nice arrows pointing to the reporters saying "Saeed with camera" etc. but no arrows pointing out the "Terrorist with AK-47."

Because there weren't any? Unless you're calling the military liars, because that's what they said, too (eventually.)

Does it bother anyone else that if the photographer wasn't employed by Reuters this would probably never have seen the light of day?

That's purely an assumption on my part.

KingOfTheFrogs: I especially like the part where they have nice arrows pointing to the reporters saying "Saeed with camera" etc. but no arrows pointing out the "Terrorist with AK-47."

I lol'd about that myself.

You're in the middle of war-zone, during a time of an upswing in violence. There's a wide-scale battle going on.

You see a group of men congregated in a courtyard with objects in their hands. The objects look similar to weapons.

You call your base and are informed that there are no friendly units in that courtyard/area. You know there's a group of friendly soldiers heading that way.

One of the men points an object toward where the friendlies will be coming from.

So you destroy the potential threat before your fellow-troops arrive. Why risk casualties on your side when you can safely eliminate the threat from the air?

A van arrives and starts to collect the fallen and potentially gather Intel/weapons. This is a common practice for enemy forces.

So you destroy the van.

Styro Foam: clusterfrak: I'm sure someone is going to call the leaker a traitor or secret jihadist. How long till someone blames Obama?

Negative one days. Did you mess the aforementioned trollerrific thread yesterday?

Yeah kinda got stuck in the Golden Girls porn and Sandra Bullock Nazi butt sex threads.

Yesterdays thread upset me because it seemed the majority of Farkers were more upset at the trolleriffic headline, than what was shown on the video.

BMFPitt: KingOfTheFrogs: I especially like the part where they have nice arrows pointing to the reporters saying "Saeed with camera" etc. but no arrows pointing out the "Terrorist with AK-47."

Because there weren't any? Unless you're calling the military liars, because that's what they said, too (eventually.)

The reporters may have been unarmed, but some of the other guys walking around him had weapons.

Spirit Hammer: KingOfTheFrogs: I especially like the part where they have nice arrows pointing to the reporters saying "Saeed with camera" etc. but no arrows pointing out the "Terrorist with AK-47."

I lol'd about that myself.

Is this sarcasm or are you being serious? If you are serious can you point out the terrorist with the AK-47? Not trolling, I'm just not seeing it in the photo.

netweavr: You're not sure the people are hostile forces, so you don't fire until you are. in the middle of war-zone, during a time of an upswing in violence. There's a wide-scale battle going on.

You see a group of men congregated in a courtyard with objects in their hands. The objects look similar to weapons.

You call your base and are informed that there are no friendly units in that courtyard/area. You know there's a group of friendly soldiers heading that way.

One of the men points an object toward where the friendlies will be coming from.

So you destroy the potential threat before your fellow-troops arrive. Why risk casualties on your side when you can safely eliminate the threat from the air?

A van arrives and starts to collect the fallen and potentially gather Intel/weapons. This is a common practice for enemy forces.

So you destroy the van.

Fixed that for you.

netweavr 2010-04-06 12:41:12 PM


/hot

netweavr: You're in the middle of war-zone, during a time of an upswing in violence. There's a wide-scale battle going on.

You see a group of men congregated in a courtyard with objects in their hands. The objects look similar to weapons.

You call your base and are informed that there are no friendly units in that courtyard/area. You know there's a group of friendly soldiers heading that way.

One of the men points an object toward where the friendlies will be coming from.

So you destroy the potential threat before your fellow-troops arrive. Why risk casualties on your side when you can safely eliminate the threat from the air?

A van arrives and starts to collect the fallen and potentially gather Intel/weapons. This is a common practice for enemy forces.

So you destroy the van.

I didn't really care too much about the apaches attacking the civilians or militants, whoever they were. Stuff DOES happen in a war zone where you only have seconds to make decisions.

What did piss me off however, is the blatant lying by the commanders instead of just coming out and telling the truth. That and the whole not giving the kids the best care they could've received.

The most farked up part for me is that 20-odd apparently innocent people died for the crime of being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

But the second most farked-up thing is the cavalier attitude of the pilots. They sound like a couple of guys playing Call of Duty. If that audio feed is real...it's really disturbing. You just killed two dozen people. It's not a farking game.

And I'm very sure that everyone commenting here has been in a real battle where shiat really matters and you live or die by your actions. Bunch of armchair generals in here. Personally, I'm amazed at the level of restraint by the guys in the helo. They followed rules of engagement to a T.

Hell, I would bet $1000 that every one of you has shot up someone in an FPS that was a friendly, too.

I'm a bleeding heart liberal and yadda yadda yadda, I don't think we should still be there. But that's home politics. This is soldiers fighting a war they were sent to fight.

I watched the whole video, and I don't see anything improper with it. It's sad that innocent people died, and there's probably plenty in the Pentagons actions to find fault with, but those helicopter pilots were doing their job and doing a good job of it. It's a video of what happens in war.

Some soldiers called in that they were taking fire from location x, air support flew there and saw guys with objects slung over their shoulders which they identified as guns. Were they all guns? No, which is nicely highlighted on the video. Thanks.

The pilots called in for, and received, permission to attack. Their audio commentary is exactly what I would expect from Apache pilots killing what they thought were bad guys.

War sucks. The end.

impaler: When hearing people describe the contents of the video, I expected something like a "Running Man" Bakersfield massacre. Instead I saw footage of people that looked like they may be holding weapons in an area where there was supposed small arms fire.

This is why it's nearly impossible to wage a war against urban guerrilla warfare.

Misidentify bad-guys as friendlies, you lose.
Misidentify friendlies as bad-guys, you lose.

It depends what country you are. Indiscriminate killing is performed by other countries not even concerned about collateral damage or this kind of incident and they "win". When you are a country like the USA, no matter what you do is scrutinized and held up to an impossible standard. We cannot possibly win another war because the qualifications of winning are not simply the elimination of the opposition.

ElMariachi: The most farked up part for me is that 20-odd apparently innocent people died for the crime of being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

But the second most farked-up thing is the cavalier attitude of the pilots. They sound like a couple of guys playing Call of Duty. If that audio feed is real...it's really disturbing. You just killed two dozen people. It's not a farking game.

Ever had an adrenaline rush? That stuff happens when you get into a situation like that.

You'd think something could pop out a scope of some sort to zoom in and be like, "Oh, that's not an RPG, that's a camera."

netweavr: You see a group of men congregated in a courtyard with objects in their hands. The objects look similar to weapons.

I didn't know there were 14" long RPG Launchers.

Even in the fuzzy video I could tell the guy was carrying a camera with a long lens.

No one in that group was carrying anything any longer than the camera lens. Not a single rifle was visible. Nothing but deadly shoulder straps.

The issue isn't the guns. the issue is this is just another day at the office for our troops.

They act like it is no big deal. They are basically looking for any excuse to shoot. this is the standard operating procedure. That is what makes this significant. They are begging the guy rolling in the street to simply reach for a gun so they can finish the job. Which is kind of interesting considering they just shoot everyone anyway when the van pulls up.

Lets not even discuss them open firing on the makeshift ambulance that arrives to try to pick up the wounded.

This is really disgusting.

You might be able to justify the original shooting guys looked like they were carrying or a few had weapons OK I'll give you that. But how on Earth can anyone justify them blasting the shiat out of the van / ambulance that arrives afterward and no one is holding weapons.

Lesson for today: Dont bring a camera to a gunfight...

Savoir-Faire

They followed rules of engagement to a T.

Yep, verbally begging for the guy to pick up a 'weapon' (read: camera).

Reporting that the van is picking up 'weapons and wounded.'

To a f*cking T.

wow, watching that video made me a bit sick.

Kyosuke: netweavr: You see a group of men congregated in a courtyard with objects in their hands. The objects look similar to weapons.

I didn't know there were 14" long RPG Launchers.

Even in the fuzzy video I could tell the guy was carrying a camera with a long lens.

No one in that group was carrying anything any longer than the camera lens. Not a single rifle was visible. Nothing but deadly shoulder straps.

You have 3 seconds to decide in a War zone. Decide wrong and you're dead. You've been up 20+ hours.

I'm not going to blame the soldiers here at all.

ignite ice: You'd think something could pop out a scope of some sort to zoom in and be like, "Oh, that's not an RPG, that's a camera."

Other than the fact that we got to see the video from the comfort of our chairs staring heavily at the screen, whereas the Apache gunner is vibrating around in his seat staring at a screen that probably doesn't have the resolution of our computer screen...due to him being in a freakin helicopter and all....

joness0154: I didn't really care too much about the apaches attacking the civilians or militants, whoever they were. Stuff DOES happen in a war zone where you only have seconds to make decisions.

What did piss me off however, is the blatant lying by the commanders instead of just coming out and telling the truth. That and the whole not giving the kids the best care they could've received.

Yeah, I'm not happy about the way it was swept under the rug. The military could have just said "some reporters went undercover in a war-zone and didn't tell US Troops. They died."

netweavr

Decide wrong and you're dead.

I buy that for troops on the ground.

I don't buy it for Apache pilots that are roughly a mile away - count the seconds between the vibration of the gun firing and the rounds hitting the ground. You don't even need the audio.

I'm not as worried about the incident as I am about the attempt to cover it up. The government has far too easy of a time removing accountability from itself.

Regarding reporters in war zones, I find it tragic they are sometimes killed, but...

"They bought their tickets. They knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash!"

The only "war crime" in this footage is those responsible for bringing the children to the fight. As for the "rescue vehicle" it was not a red cresent vehicle and thus has no special immunity. Do we expect the enemy to quit shooting when our medics run out to save our wounded in battle? No.
Curious how the captioning disappears from 14:44 to bout 15:05 yet they seem to have captioned everything else, hmmm. Much ado about nothing, war is hell get over it. Dont recall this miuch out rage for the beheading videos which showed civilians head sawed off with a knife but then againit wasnt the evil american millitary doing it so its not news right? Hanging out with terrorist means you are probably a terrorist and need shot. No crime on tape here.

netweavr: You have 3 seconds to decide in a War zone. Decide wrong and you're dead. You've been up 20+ hours.

Took much longer than 3 seconds for them to call in for permission to engage and for that permission to arrive.

Kyosuke: netweavr: You have 3 seconds to decide in a War zone. Decide wrong and you're dead. You've been up 20+ hours.

Took much longer than 3 seconds for them to call in for permission to engage and for that permission to arrive.

Yep, by the book and they did nothing wrong.

netweavr: You have 3 seconds to decide in a War zone. Decide wrong and you're dead. You've been up 20+ hours.

I'm not going to blame the soldiers here at all.

Watch the video and see how many 3 second intervals these pilots had to get it right.