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(Yahoo)   Pope benedict may become the first Pope since the middle ages to be forced to resign in disgrace as it is revealed he was warned about another priest who molested over 200 children, but took no action   (news.yahoo.com ) divider line
    More: Sick, Pope Benedict XVI, Vatican, statute of limitations, juvenile detention centers, sexual dysfunction, archdiocese, Jeff Anderson, congregations  
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23828 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Mar 2010 at 1:13 PM (6 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-03-25 07:59:24 PM  
Pics or it didn't happen.
 
2010-03-25 08:09:04 PM  

TheBigJerk: Donald_McRonald:

The disconnect is the root cause. Priests can be celibate simply because they believe and it doesn't cause problems. Priests can be gay and okay. The problem is that the same guilt and shame and weird Oedipal undertones and fear of sex most often drive a faithful little goob to become a part of the church. The kid in seminary school signed his life to church service for a reason; maybe he was gay and wanted god to "cure him, maybe he was pushed into it by a mother who held him too much (or not enough) and sends him to the church rather than let him be a normal man, maybe he just read too much Apostle Paul and along with a flinching fear of godly wrath thinks all sex is evil. In the end it doesn't matter, he's unable to handle sex like an adult for the same reason he's putting on the collar and the same cocktail that psychology says makes a pedophile is the best cocktail to make a priest.

And so it goes...


So you think that all Catholic priests are socially awkward and unable to handle sex at an adult level? It can't possibly be that they have a faith in God? It can't possibly be because they want to serve their faith? You think all those kids in seminary are virgins? You don't think that widowed men become priests later in life? Normal priests struggle with normal sexual urges their entire careers. They do not suddenly decide to prey on children. That is an entirely different condition and is not forced upon one by abstinence.

If you go a month or a few years without sex, are you touching children? I've gone several years in my adult life (after losing my virginity) without having sex. I struggled with it and I never touched a child. Nor did I ever have a desire to.

There are pedophiles and there are priests, not all pedophiles are priests and lack of sex, no matter how much you like it, is not going to cause someone to rape a child unless they are already predisposed to raping children.

Not all homosexuals gravitate to children out of shame either. Yes, Apostle Paul was a freak, not everyone in the clergy is trying to emulate or agree with Paul.
 
2010-03-25 08:25:56 PM  

mediablitz: At what point do Catholics finally admit their "religion" is a sham?


How about we pick a day on which the Catholics, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Pagans, Pastafarians, Jedis, and *farking everyone else* all admit that their religion is a sham?

I think that December 22, 2012 would be a good day. That gives a fair chance for everyone to have their rapture, apocalypse, or whatever else first. After that's all finished, the rest of us can have a big party on the 22nd and then get on with our lives.

Seriously, folks. Zoom in on a few Hubble deep-field images and then try to convince yourself that any of our past religious leaders knew what the fark they were talking about.
 
2010-03-25 08:37:05 PM  
Could someone please explain how the Catholic church does not meet any country's legal definition of a criminal organization?
 
2010-03-25 08:45:57 PM  

thornhill: Bill Maher made a good point on his show last Friday.

Had the head of any other organization turned the blind-eye to hundreds of children being molested, he would have been arrested by now, or at least, forced out of his job.


Do you think Maher was the first to say this?

Have you never, not even for a second, thought this yourself?

Despite this being said by almost anyone who has had any interest in the catholic church has been saying since the scandal started?

Love 'Mercan TV
 
2010-03-25 08:57:14 PM  
There's really only one practical reason to become a "celibate" catholic priest. You are a pedophile and don't want to have to explain ten times a day why a handsome fella like yourself isn't married...or even partnered.
 
2010-03-25 08:59:20 PM  

scalpod: MobiusStripJoint: I'm starting to think organized religion is all bullsh*t. Wait, I already knew that.

You should try disorganized religion, it's every bit as much bullsh*t but only half as infuriating.


That was funny!! Wait, no it wasn't.
 
2010-03-25 09:05:27 PM  
350+ comments, and nobody's posted this? (NSFW language)

Link
 
2010-03-25 09:11:53 PM  
They should get the pope drunk and drop him off at a gay bar. He'd be soaking his ass in that holy water.
 
2010-03-25 09:46:52 PM  
If you're an ex Catholic (atheist, deist, apathist, etc.) perhaps it's now time to finally declare 'Actus formalis defectionis ab Ecclesia catholica'. There's even an Irish site that helps you through it.

Alternatively they should call up the Battle Pope to clean house.
 
2010-03-25 09:50:38 PM  

Trivia Jockey: That would be hilarious. I think it would put a dent in that whole "infallible" theory, huh?


Catholics don't believe Popes are infallible. They believe they're infallible only whilst writing Church Doctrine. Otherwise, they are humans who make mistakes like the rest of us.
 
2010-03-25 10:24:17 PM  
Yes to the "celibacy brings in sexually messed-up people" theory.

Here's my anecdotal datum: my ex BF's brother wanted to join the church. Why? Because he disliked women and didn't want to be around them. He was also very disturbed and offended when we joked about Frodo and Sam being gay.

\I really hope that guy turned around and embraced an adult sexuality, whichever way it swings
\\or joined a monastery
 
2010-03-25 10:40:02 PM  

MobiusStripJoint: scalpod: MobiusStripJoint: I'm starting to think organized religion is all bullsh*t. Wait, I already knew that.

You should try disorganized religion, it's every bit as much bullsh*t but only half as infuriating.

That was funny!! Wait, no it wasn't.


Your put-down sure was though. I'll consider myself sufficiently chastised. Oh wait, no I won't.
 
2010-03-25 10:56:35 PM  

Jster422: For the Pope to defend the institution of the Church through tolerance of sin against children is anathema to the very concept of God, and Heaven.

For the Pope to take these steps, then it can only be concluded that he lacks even the barest rudiments of faith in God.


No, I think what it MAY show is that when you create a high religious office and sanctify it, the person holding that office may be blinded by pride, may think that he neednt apologize for grievous errors in judgment, and may think that the institution that elevated him is more important than innocents harmed in its name.

popes don't have a hotline to Jesus.

That statements by the Catholic Church regardign these abuses have been weak.

Jesus said it would be better for those who harm children to have a millstone tied around their necks and sink to the bottom of the sea. What about the people who look the other way, what happens to them???
 
2010-03-25 11:00:54 PM  

gadian: TheBigJerk: Donald_McRonald:

The disconnect is the root cause. Priests can be celibate simply because they believe and it doesn't cause problems. Priests can be gay and okay. The problem is that the same guilt and shame and weird Oedipal undertones and fear of sex most often drive a faithful little goob to become a part of the church. The kid in seminary school signed his life to church service for a reason; maybe he was gay and wanted god to "cure him, maybe he was pushed into it by a mother who held him too much (or not enough) and sends him to the church rather than let him be a normal man, maybe he just read too much Apostle Paul and along with a flinching fear of godly wrath thinks all sex is evil. In the end it doesn't matter, he's unable to handle sex like an adult for the same reason he's putting on the collar and the same cocktail that psychology says makes a pedophile is the best cocktail to make a priest.

And so it goes...

So you think that all Catholic priests are socially awkward and unable to handle sex at an adult level? It can't possibly be that they have a faith in God? It can't possibly be because they want to serve their faith? You think all those kids in seminary are virgins? You don't think that widowed men become priests later in life? Normal priests struggle with normal sexual urges their entire careers. They do not suddenly decide to prey on children. That is an entirely different condition and is not forced upon one by abstinence.

If you go a month or a few years without sex, are you touching children? I've gone several years in my adult life (after losing my virginity) without having sex. I struggled with it and I never touched a child. Nor did I ever have a desire to.

There are pedophiles and there are priests, not all pedophiles are priests and lack of sex, no matter how much you like it, is not going to cause someone to rape a child unless they are already predisposed to raping children.

Not all homosexuals gravitate to children out of shame either. Yes, Apostle Paul was a freak, not everyone in the clergy is trying to emulate or agree with Paul.


Thank you.
 
2010-03-25 11:24:06 PM  

BaBaBoosh:

Funny thing is I don't believe all the religious aspects of the Catholic Church, but definitely believe in the whole mindset of a close tight-knit community and doing good deeds. I like the fact that Catholics stress the idea of earning your way rather than only just praying about it(which they do too I guess) which I think is a waste of time.


I was raised as a Catholic and always felt the same way. Even from a young age I knew I was just playing along with the woo-woo parts. Ended up a boring-ass atheist that still tries to do right by my friends, family, and community. Go fig :)
 
2010-03-25 11:24:42 PM  

mediablitz: The sooner this "religion" disappears the better.

At what point do Catholics finally admit their "religion" is a sham?


You first.
 
2010-03-25 11:46:43 PM  

scalpod: MobiusStripJoint: scalpod: MobiusStripJoint: I'm starting to think organized religion is all bullsh*t. Wait, I already knew that.

You should try disorganized religion, it's every bit as much bullsh*t but only half as infuriating.

That was funny!! Wait, no it wasn't.

Your put-down sure was though. I'll consider myself sufficiently chastised. Oh wait, no I won't.


"disorganized religion"...hee hee
 
2010-03-26 12:21:24 AM  
To further clarify Papal Infallibility:

The Pope, when speaking ex cathedra, is infallible when making a pronouncement about Church teaching that is not already clear in Church teaching. In other words, he can't wake up tomorrow and say "Hey, I never liked the Gospel of Luke...let us get rid of it." Nor can he say "I never liked Confirmation...lets get rid of it." Those are already part of the teachings of the Church.

The points that have been declared since Vatican I both had to do with the identity of Mary the Mother of Jesus. It was not clear from Scripture or Tradition what happened to her body at death...but carrying out the argument that Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit and that Mary had no sin, they figured "ehh, she went to heaven body and soul because she had no sin." Really doesnt make a hill of beans difference.

As for laws on child rapists...the internal laws were there. They just chose not to follow them.
 
2010-03-26 03:20:55 AM  
You guys don't even want to know what the Dalai Lama has been up too......
 
2010-03-26 09:39:45 AM  

vernonFL: Trivia Jockey: That would be hilarious. I think it would put a dent in that whole "infallible" theory, huh?

The Pope is infallible in matters dealing with the rules of the Catholic Church. He is NOT infallible in every single thing he does.


Who says he's infallible? He says?

That's a side trip. He's a felon, aiding and abetting.

I've been infallible so far today.
 
2010-03-26 09:42:33 AM  

mynameismark: vernonFL: Its not enough the the Pope was a Nazi. He was a child molester enabler too.


He also goes to Africa to tell people not to use condoms.

He is human filth. Catholicism is a cancer.


Religion = Superstition + $$$$$

All you need to know.
 
2010-03-26 10:10:27 AM  

Jster422: gshepnyc: LavenderWolf: december: the Pope should call on all guilty priests to come forward to their congregations and admit what they have done, and then turn themselves over to authorities. Anything less than that is an unforgivable attempt to evade justice, both in the eyes of the law and in the eyes of their God.

all those who know of any abuses committed are guilty as well as long as they don't come forward, and they too should be punished by the law for their complicity.

Right.


Imagine I know somebody who is kinda sleazy and hangs around a church. I'm not a churchgoer myself, but I don't hate those that do. So in the course of hanging out with him, he lets slip something about the childrape he gets up to when he's trusted with the Sunday schoolers. So I'm concerned for my friend there getting caught, so I finance a move for him to go across the country to work in a different church with different children. Further, I intimidate and bribe the victims into silence.

Except my theoretical actions above in response to it aren't what I did, because I don't associate with pedophiles. Those actions above are exactly what the pope, and the whole catholic church, have done en masse and continue to do today.

You're right, by not coming forward and demanding that all the pedos in his church come out and go to the authorities, he is remiss in his most basic duties as a human being.

I know this is an unpopular position, but I don't believe anyone has an obligation to destroy themselves, no matter what they've done. That's the slipperiest slope of them all. So, no, the pope should not have demanded the pedos come out and go to authorities but he DID have an obligation to get rid of them when they were caught. If he had only done THAT much, just think of how much better off so many kids would be.

His worst crime is not that he didn't do everything. It's that he didn't do anything.

If ever Anyone had an obligation to do the right thing at any cost - even if that cost would mean their own suffering or even destruction on earth - then it must certainly be the Pope.

If ever anyone had not just cause, but every possible reasonable expectation to believe that an infinite amount of pain on earth was preferable to allowing the suffering of the innocent - then it must be the Pope.

If ever anyone could be relied upon to choose the Ideal over the Mundane, to do 'the right thing' without having to hesitate to wonder about how the press would deal with it, or how enrollment and tithing might decline, it must be the Pope.

I can be forgiven my doubts, my hedging, my lazy decline into sin - because for me to have less than perfect faith is completely forgivable. But the Pope?

For the Pope to defend the institution of the Church through tolerance of sin against children is anathema to the very concept of God, and Heaven.

For the Pope to take these steps, then it can only be concluded that he lacks even the barest rudiments of faith in God.


I imagine the reality of being pope has as much to do with god as the reality of being president has to do with patriotism.
 
2010-03-26 10:14:14 AM  
I'm going to trick the Pope into dividing by Zero. That'll show him!
 
2010-03-26 10:27:38 AM  

redsquid: gshepnyc- What a gray cheerless life. A little inappropriateness is always appreciated, gay or straight. If you can't see that, I feel bad for you. As I feel sorry for anyone who that concerned about the "scorn" of other people. Your one and only life is not mortgaged to other people's ideas of "appropriate".

And if a dick joke on Fark bothered you, well, I would say the Internet is not going to be your friend.

When 'scorn' turns into getting dragged behind a pick-up truck, lynched, thrown in an oven, denied legal rights enjoyed by others, denied jobs and services, denied legal and police protection, or any thing that leads to death, violence, ostracism, or being a second class citizen, the inappropriateness that reinforces these attitudes is not appreciated. being born and raised in Florida by a southern family I do not appreciate the inappropriateness that leads to people assuming I'm an ignorant bigot, a sexist, etc. When you are in a comfortable position it is easy to excuse the inappropriate behavior of your fellows. When that inappropriate behavior will be scrutinized and used to judge your group as a whole, it becomes a much touchier issue. It also has to do with setting. Acting up around your own people is acceptable but acting up around strangers is not. Pants hanging off your ass are OK hanging out on the corner but they are not going to get you very far in a job interview or a court date.


Sorry that other people's harmless behavior bothers you so much. It also seems like you are blaming other people for your (or others') ignorance. Maybe I am misreading.

For myself, I'm a pretty regular guy. Jeans and t-shirt by day, occasional tux at night. But other people being more outlandish, gay or straight, male or female, doesn't bother me because I am comfortable with myself and because I am a fully formed adult who knows the difference between what can and cannot cause harm.
 
2010-03-26 10:32:08 AM  
These people don't care what's said about them as long as the money keeps coming in.
 
2010-03-26 10:37:32 AM  
The Vatican issued a strong defense of its handling of the Murphy case. The Vatican newspaper L'Osservatore Romano said there was no cover-up and denounced what it said was a "clear and despicable intention" to strike at Benedict "at any cost."

... so you saying they made all of it up?

Farkin' a**holes.
 
2010-03-26 10:43:05 AM  

gshepnyc: Jster422: gshepnyc: LavenderWolf: december:

I imagine the reality of being pope has as much to do with god as the reality of being president has to do with patriotism.


I agree, which is pretty much the most damning indictment of the Catholic organization that I can imagine.
 
2010-03-26 10:46:53 AM  

Jster422: gshepnyc: Jster422: gshepnyc: LavenderWolf: december:

I imagine the reality of being pope has as much to do with god as the reality of being president has to do with patriotism.

I agree, which is pretty much the most damning indictment of the Catholic organization that I can imagine.


I'm not a Christian so maybe I have no room to offer suggestions, but the problem stems in part from the very existence of and adherence to a hierarchy where one shouldn't exist. Church should be entirely local. It's too much a part of people's families for it to be managed like a multinational corporation.
 
2010-03-26 11:01:44 AM  

Catholic Church =

automatoncity.com

 
2010-03-26 11:42:53 AM  

gadian: TheBigJerk: Yes, Apostle Paul was a freak, not everyone in the clergy is trying to emulate or agree with Paul.


Paul IS the Church. He took Christianity in an entirely different direction from that taught by Jesus and James, essentially Romanizing it. If you are Christian, you are by definition emulating Paul.
 
2010-03-26 12:41:25 PM  
Roman Catholic scholars point out that the apostle Paul did not command celibacy. Catholic scholars, writing in the Roman Catholic Encyclopedic Dictionary of the Bible, say: "Most, if not all the apostles had been married, as Peter certainly was."

In evidence of Peter's marriage, this Catholic book cites two texts: Matthew 8:14 and 1 Corinthians 9:5. The first speaks of Peter's "mother-in-law." In the second Paul says: "Have we not . . . the right to take a Christian woman round with us, like all the other apostles and the brothers of the Lord and Cephas?"-The Catholic Jerusalem Bible.

As indicated in this Bible verse, who had wives? "The other apostles." "The brothers of the Lord." "Cephas...or apostle Peter". And Paul said Peter was married!

The Bible did not command celibacy for the priests in Israel, nor for the overseers in the Christian congregation. Thus, the Roman Catholic Encyclopedic Dictionary of the Bible, referring to the Bible writings of Jesus' apostles, says: "St. Paul makes it quite clear that no Christian is obliged to practice v. [virginity]." It adds: "Celibacy of the clergy is nowhere demanded or even supposed in the NT [New Testament]."

Now, did the celibacy requirement increase the likelyhood of these priests abusing these children . . . thats anyones guess . . . all I'm saying is no "scriptural" bases for it.

So they bring this grief on themselves.
 
2010-03-26 01:12:15 PM  

sea_monkey: Roman Catholic scholars point out that the apostle Paul did not command celibacy. Catholic scholars, writing in the Roman Catholic Encyclopedic Dictionary of the Bible, say: "Most, if not all the apostles had been married, as Peter certainly was."

In evidence of Peter's marriage, this Catholic book cites two texts: Matthew 8:14 and 1 Corinthians 9:5. The first speaks of Peter's "mother-in-law." In the second Paul says: "Have we not . . . the right to take a Christian woman round with us, like all the other apostles and the brothers of the Lord and Cephas?"-The Catholic Jerusalem Bible.

As indicated in this Bible verse, who had wives? "The other apostles." "The brothers of the Lord." "Cephas...or apostle Peter". And Paul said Peter was married!

The Bible did not command celibacy for the priests in Israel, nor for the overseers in the Christian congregation. Thus, the Roman Catholic Encyclopedic Dictionary of the Bible, referring to the Bible writings of Jesus' apostles, says: "St. Paul makes it quite clear that no Christian is obliged to practice v. [virginity]." It adds: "Celibacy of the clergy is nowhere demanded or even supposed in the NT [New Testament]."

Now, did the celibacy requirement increase the likelyhood of these priests abusing these children . . . thats anyones guess . . . all I'm saying is no "scriptural" bases for it.

So they bring this grief on themselves.


My theory, and I'm not scientician, is that the command to be celibate arrests and retards normal sexual mental development at a juvenile stage. A lot of priests start down the path to priesthood fairly young. So, their sexuality has stopped at a comfort zone that involves teens and pre-teens - which would be acceptable if the person himself was the same age. Mentally and emotionally their sexual growth was stopped before it became fully adult whereas their bodies, of course, DID become adult.
 
2010-03-26 01:27:19 PM  

WrestlerManager: gadian: TheBigJerk: Yes, Apostle Paul was a freak, not everyone in the clergy is trying to emulate or agree with Paul.

Paul IS the Church. He took Christianity in an entirely different direction from that taught by Jesus and James, essentially Romanizing it. If you are Christian Catholic, you are by definition emulating Paul.


FTFY. Christianity is farking huge. Not even remotely all Christianity practiced today is Pauline Christianity.
 
2010-03-26 02:01:26 PM  

WrestlerManager: gadian: TheBigJerk: Yes, Apostle Paul was a freak, not everyone in the clergy is trying to emulate or agree with Paul.

Paul IS the Church. He took Christianity in an entirely different direction from that taught by Jesus and James, essentially Romanizing it. If you are Christian, you are by definition emulating Paul.


images1.fanpop.com
 
2010-03-26 04:37:53 PM  
Why would he be disgraced by this? So far the Catholics have shown nothing but approval for their child-raping priests. After all, if they didn't approve, they would have quit giving them money by now.

This makes me wonder why lay Catholics aren't being brought up on charges of aiding and abetting a felony, since they're providing financial and other support to a group that is known to condone the rape of children.
 
2010-03-26 05:36:06 PM  
How is it not a grave sin for a priest to have sex with a little boy in confessional? F@#k the Catholic Church. F$%k religion.

Without God, you are finally free to be good.
 
2010-03-28 02:11:48 AM  

sea_monkey: WrestlerManager: gadian: TheBigJerk: Yes, Apostle Paul was a freak, not everyone in the clergy is trying to emulate or agree with Paul.

Paul IS the Church. He took Christianity in an entirely different direction from that taught by Jesus and James, essentially Romanizing it. If you are Christian, you are by definition emulating Paul.


Citation needed? Really?

How about the books of Romans, I and II Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, I and II Thessalonians, I and II Timothy, Titus, Philemon, and Hebrews? Those do anything for ya?
 
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