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(Washington Post)   Bill O'Reilly pulls a Trent Lott. In other news, this is the 500,000th link   (washingtonpost.com ) divider line
    More: Dumbass  
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555 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Apr 2003 at 9:34 AM (13 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



1025 Comments   (+0 »)
   

Archived thread
 
2003-04-15 09:34:48 AM  
w00t! Congratulations guys!
 
2003-04-15 09:35:42 AM  
Having read damn near all of them, I'm surprised my head hasn't exploded yet
 
2003-04-15 09:37:19 AM  
WOW! Good going,Drew&Co.
 
2003-04-15 09:37:22 AM  
yay!!!
 
2003-04-15 09:38:02 AM  
Yeah 500,000th! Yeah wooohoooo.

So what do we win?
 
2003-04-15 09:38:29 AM  
500,000 links...and YOOOOOOU were THEEEEERRRRRE...
 
2003-04-15 09:38:47 AM  
eh, his comment is only funny cause it had a high probability of being true.
 
2003-04-15 09:38:50 AM  
Bill O'Reilly said something ill-considered, intemperate, insensitive and idiotic?

Noooooooooooo.........
 
2003-04-15 09:39:06 AM  
Half a mill? Way to go, now Im off to steal Drews hubcaps while yall celebrate.
 
2003-04-15 09:39:22 AM  
500,000 of continued crap links
 
2003-04-15 09:39:22 AM  
five hundred thousand....does that count all the re-posts? because if it does...THIS IS A FALSE CELEBRATION!
 
2003-04-15 09:39:22 AM  
huh?
 
2003-04-15 09:39:28 AM  
O'Reilly with tEh fake lesbians ?
[image from media.washingtonpost.com too old to be available]
 
2003-04-15 09:39:36 AM  
GO DREW!

/hopping on 'Verbally Masturbate Drew' bandwagon
 
2003-04-15 09:40:00 AM  
w00t! Lots of articles! w00t! Long live Fark!

And O'Reilly's a jackass.
/flamebait
 
2003-04-15 09:40:01 AM  
"Bill has been wonderful to these boys. He puts his money where his mouth is."

If an infinite amount of mouth needs an infinite amount of money...
 
2003-04-15 09:40:26 AM  
Who steals hubcaps anymore...for that matter, what are hubcaps?
 
2003-04-15 09:41:12 AM  
B.O'R. is a real douchbag.

that is all.
 
2003-04-15 09:41:15 AM  
Bill should know only black comedians are allowed to make jokes like that.
 
2003-04-15 09:41:15 AM  
Fair and Balanced Tires!
 
2003-04-15 09:41:16 AM  
woohoo!
 
2003-04-15 09:41:22 AM  
We wouldn't have those problems if Strom Thurmond was president!
 
2003-04-15 09:41:28 AM  
I want .046% of the credit.
 
2003-04-15 09:41:47 AM  
I submitted the 500,000th link with a much funnier headline.

/had to be done
 
2003-04-15 09:42:08 AM  
"Does anyone know where the Best Men are? I hope they're not in the parking lot stealing our hubcaps."

Ha that's funny! Good grief people get a sense of humor for christ sake!!
 
2003-04-15 09:42:15 AM  
Somebody should have gone out and snatched ol' Bill's hubcaps at that point. Then mail him pictures from time to time showing the hubcaps visiting various exotic locations around the world.
 
2003-04-15 09:42:19 AM  
Why has that woman stolen Jane Jetson's collar?
 
2003-04-15 09:42:24 AM  
w000000000000t!

O'Reilly's got a pin up of the Bush daughters on his bathroom wall..

Or was that Uday Hussein?
 
2003-04-15 09:42:47 AM  
"Bill has been wonderful to these boys. He puts his money where his mouth is."

Where's that? Satan's cock? Eww, gross!
 
2003-04-15 09:43:12 AM  
an elitist, bigoted conservative? when did this happen? I thought they were "compassionate conservatives" now?
 
2003-04-15 09:43:18 AM  
awww... I was really hoping It would be a Boobies Link
 
2003-04-15 09:43:25 AM  
I will tell this story to my grand-kids.
 
2003-04-15 09:43:35 AM  
Kittens will be extinct long before the 500,000th boobie link.
 
Rat
2003-04-15 09:44:04 AM  
Just doing my part for this historical event...wow, 500,000 links...

/gonna read the article now
 
2003-04-15 09:44:04 AM  
It won't show up for me for some reason. What'd he say?
 
2003-04-15 09:44:06 AM  
Not surprising.
 
2003-04-15 09:44:13 AM  
04-15-03 09:42:15 AM InternetSecurityGuard

That would have been funny.
And depending on the locations,
it could have been really funny.
 
2003-04-15 09:44:17 AM  
500,000.

Great job, FARK.

Thank you.
 
ACF
2003-04-15 09:44:43 AM  
Did Robert Bryd laugh?
 
2003-04-15 09:45:24 AM  
five hundred thousand....does that count all the re-posts? because if it does...THIS IS A FALSE CELEBRATION!

A fictitious celebration, for a fictitious website, run by fictitious admins that post articles about fictitious right wing asshole newscasters? Shame on you, Drew Curtis, SHAME ON YOU!
 
2003-04-15 09:46:35 AM  
people are too sensetive. PC conversation is uniformly boring.
 
2003-04-15 09:46:52 AM  
ok, it's 240,000 minus all the Left-Eye and Vibrating Broom posts.

i won't tell my grandchildren about fark, i think. who's bill o'reilly? in the spirit of post 500K, i guess i could read the article, but...naah.
 
2003-04-15 09:47:11 AM  
04-15-03 09:45:24 AM Alto_reed_on_a_tenor_sax

Drew Curtis doesnt exist.
This is an illuminati conspiracy,
didnt you read the Protocals for the Elders of Zion?
 
2003-04-15 09:47:18 AM  
YEAH! This was my link! My third, fark's half a mil.
 
2003-04-15 09:47:21 AM  
If you read further down the page you'll see that Ray Charles is going to perform at the Correspondent's Dinner this year.

You know what the last words out of Bush's handler's mouths will be...
 
2003-04-15 09:47:54 AM  
Did anybody else read further down about Larry King and his wife shopping for underwear at Victoria's Secret? Ugh.
 
2003-04-15 09:47:57 AM  
I liked all the links except for number 398,736 that was a total waste of my time.
 
2003-04-15 09:48:18 AM  
Let's see... Everybody here thinks Rodney King needs to be beaten to death and what a funny joke about a group of black kids stealing hubcaps. Nope, no racsists here.
 
2003-04-15 09:48:19 AM  
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Apr2003/pipc10042003.html
 
2003-04-15 09:49:10 AM  
500,000 links and not a single one of them submitted by me. Fark it.
 
2003-04-15 09:49:16 AM  
I thought they were having soda and pie in this thread.
(sigh)
 
2003-04-15 09:49:18 AM  
Congrat's Drew.

As for Bill O'Reilly... he made a joke get over it.... I would have laughed at it. Maybe these people need a sense of humor...
 
2003-04-15 09:49:46 AM  
I think the guy meant the kids were stealing hubcaps because they are called the "Best Men." Not because they are a bunch of inner city kids.
 
2003-04-15 09:49:51 AM  
wat yo go fark! way to go bill! truth hurts these people, you know? sad we can't say anything like that, but all other races are at the mercy of the vulgar and undeducated ebonicons. right? i will watch the factor even more religiously now.
 
2003-04-15 09:50:13 AM  
great job folks!

Anyone who thinks what Bill said was insensitive should pull the lump of coal out of their butt, unless they are black.
 
2003-04-15 09:50:20 AM  
Exactly Rasputin. Enough with this hypersensitive bullshiat.
 
2003-04-15 09:50:23 AM  
O'Reilly said something stupid, there's a shocker. You mean there's some doubt that Republicans have problems with racism?

I'm more concerned that this woman thinks every black person in America is in drug treatment. And that she's in Congress. And that every member of the Republican party VOTED on the RECORD that they AGREE with her.

ObDrewLove: Fark rocks, Totalfark rocks, 500000 and counting! Fark on!
 
2003-04-15 09:50:40 AM  
I'd hardly say donating $40k *per year* to the inner-city kids' program makes someone a racist when they make one dumb joke once off the cuff. Besides, last I checked, people that steal stuff off cars (including my fog lights) are of all different races. ;)
 
2003-04-15 09:51:16 AM  
Farkingwaitaminute! Is that 500,000 Fark or TotalFark farklinks? Mefarkingthinks it is a TotalFark farkcount. How many farklinks have been on Fark?
 
2003-04-15 09:51:23 AM  
I would think that O'Reilly would have known that only liberals are allowed to use off color humor.

This is a non-story.
 
2003-04-15 09:51:32 AM  
White guys should not do Chris Rock.

Nubian, please.
 
2003-04-15 09:51:37 AM  
B.O'R.ing
 
2003-04-15 09:51:41 AM  
Malinois: "Don't forget NOT to wave." Hehe.
 
2003-04-15 09:52:03 AM  
I posted in the 500,000th thread!
 
2003-04-15 09:52:12 AM  
It's politically incorrect for a white person to make a joke about a minority.

But it is alright for a minority to make a joke about a white person. Double standards anyone?
 
2003-04-15 09:52:19 AM  
You guys are hilarious. Trent Lott didnt say anything out of order, and now, neither did Bill O'Reilly? Yeah, its nice when those in power just SLIGHTLY put they're feet on the necks of the minority, its really funny, then, isn't it?

For christ's sake, I hope you idiots are just
 
2003-04-15 09:52:19 AM  
First off, GO DREW!!!1 We are unworthy of walking where you spit.

Secondly. OMG!! Bill O'Reily said something stupid? I'm shocked. We hold our media figures to such a high level of moral rectitude. He has shamed Fox News!

Seriously, it's a shame that the monumental 500,000 article would be such a non-issue. The comment wasn't even that offensive.
 
2003-04-15 09:52:37 AM  
if a legistator made that comment, o'reilly would be calling for his resgination.

funny how he tried to spin his comment by talking about the money raised for charity. in his no-spin zone, he'd probably say making donations to charity does not entitle you to be a racist.

but we all know o'reilly is a pompous asshat; the ellsworth toohey of our times. i'm glad he's around to make fun of.
 
2003-04-15 09:52:44 AM  
My link to Congresswoman Barbara Cubin's website was broken and dropped out of my previous post.
 
2003-04-15 09:53:08 AM  
Mangomango: How do you know it was a group of Black kids that were going to Lip Sync?? All it said was Inner City kids..

How racist of you to think only little black kids could lip Sync to the Four Tops.. fark you bigot.
 
2003-04-15 09:53:10 AM  
Don't you need our addresses to mail us our free t-shirts?
 
2003-04-15 09:53:58 AM  
White people are minorities too!
 
2003-04-15 09:54:20 AM  
Gee,

Thanks all, just on the day I went Total Fark. GWF

/Paranoid
Hey wait is this an illuminati plot? Does 500000/76?
 
2003-04-15 09:54:33 AM  
if drew just had a penny for every link posted on FARK...well, he'd be bare-assed poor.

Congrats! FARK Ueber Alles!
 
2003-04-15 09:54:43 AM  
You guys/gals are cracking me up this morning.
 
2003-04-15 09:55:07 AM  
Just another indication that if you give a conservative enough rope he'll eventually try to string a minority up with it.
 
2003-04-15 09:55:28 AM  
Well, if the title bar says it's true, it must be 500,000. Speaking of bars... Bill needs to stop hitting them so hard.
 
2003-04-15 09:56:04 AM  
My record for submissions. 1 in 500,000. Pathetic. Now if the mods picked good links, I'd probably be up to 2.
 
2003-04-15 09:56:45 AM  
Oh, big deal. B O'R makes off-color joke, everyone cries. Lighten up people, it wasn't that bad.
 
2003-04-15 09:56:55 AM  
OMG WTF 500,000th link?? Incredible!!!

Oh, shiat my taxes are due
 
2003-04-15 09:56:58 AM  
i don't know. o'reilly makes a piss-poor joke and the pile-on begins. jesse jackson talks about hymietown and runs for president. everybody lighten up.
 
2003-04-15 09:57:14 AM  
Jesus, O'Reilly is an idiot. I hate that guy.
 
2003-04-15 09:57:42 AM  
While I TOTALLY agree that this is a non-story. I think the thing I find most amusing is, if someone from the other side of the fence made a similar comment, O'Reilly would've been all over the story. So it's only a non-story if it's someone from "our side" making the comment. If the person is from "their side" then it's time to be hypersensitive.


"let the flag of hypocrisy fly high"
/south park

(500,000th link on Fark and 100th episode of SP in the same week....I don't know about you, but I'm looking over my shoulder for those horesmen.)
 
2003-04-15 09:57:44 AM  
04-15-03 09:56:11 AM MacG

Jeez man, just lie when you fill out that farker.
 
2003-04-15 09:58:30 AM  
I'm with you Rtkane 1 in 500,000....

Drew, can we get a break down of how many boobies links we've had? I would guess at least 50,000 or so.
 
2003-04-15 09:58:59 AM  
04-15-03 09:47:18 AM Whamdangler
YEAH! This was my link! My third, fark's half a mil.

How'd you know to put the "In other news, this is the 500,000th link" on it?
 
2003-04-15 09:59:07 AM  
I guess everyone was upset that Bill called them stupid. Cuz smart niglets would've been stealing the stereos.

/runs
 
2003-04-15 09:59:16 AM  
Half-a-million?!?!? Woohoo! To celebrate, maybe Drew should buy all a beer. How much money is there is the Fark beer fund?
 
2003-04-15 10:00:44 AM  
Not the best place for a joke like that , but I am not going to crucify the guy..

Now if he said "Well another year another 40k for these ghetto trash to spend on crank." then i would lean towards the racist side.
 
2003-04-15 10:00:50 AM  
Recockulous, tell me you heard what Cubin said. I was flipping thru the channels the other day and on CSPAN the House was doing nothing but arguing over "word retraction" or something of that nature. Cubin was in the middle of it, but they didn't say what she said.
 
2003-04-15 10:00:55 AM  
Does it make the news when a black man makes fun of a white man?
 
2003-04-15 10:01:19 AM  
He presents himself as an untalented gas bag who don't cotton to conflicting opinions, but he still should have known better.

Regardless, it was pretty funny; it wasn't entirely a racist joke--I'd say it's about 90% washed up band and 10% "they're black, you know."

The joke would work with Vanilla Ice, Men at Work, etc.

The Four Tops used to be rockin', though.
 
2003-04-15 10:01:51 AM  
Dr. Freud, table for 1..............

Seriously though, $800,000 is more money than any other "stars" are raising for petty theives.

/race baits
 
2003-04-15 10:01:57 AM  
It is sad that we have to be so PC. Still, O'Really is an opinionated asshole and opinionated assholes should not be allowed to maintain a public presence.

So in my opinion. . .


Never mind.
 
2003-04-15 10:02:01 AM  
racist -

1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition, 2000
 
2003-04-15 10:02:23 AM  
1) Get a sense of humor
2) Everyone (as in the press)wants to stab at O-Reily because he makes so many lefters look stupid on TV
3) Carlos the commedian made a great point, quit being so freakin oversensitive and have fun with your life
4) I'm getting sick and tired of the "conservative guy said something racist if you think about it in a certain way" when assholes Like Mike Moore (moore as in more cheesburgers for my fat ass)say things like "9/11 woulnd't have happened if the passengers were all black"
 
2003-04-15 10:02:24 AM  
Bonzy20

It doesn't make the news, it makes it onto BET's comedy shows.
 
2003-04-15 10:03:13 AM  
I have 0.000002% of the submissions.
 
2003-04-15 10:03:19 AM  
meep
 
2003-04-15 10:03:31 AM  
and i always thought Bill O'Reilly was one of Australia's greatest ever bowlers..
 
2003-04-15 10:04:08 AM  
Finally the world will see the Bill O'Reilly for the Mean-Spirited Bastard he really is.
 
2003-04-15 10:05:16 AM  
Actually - I don't like that definition much. The problem with Bill's comment, particularly in that venue, is that it implies racial superiority.
 
2003-04-15 10:05:34 AM  
"Next, on Russell Simmons Def Political Commentary..."
 
2003-04-15 10:05:57 AM  
Please. No rioting. It's only a HALF million.

(congrats!)
 
2003-04-15 10:07:12 AM  
Why wasn't 500,000 a boobie link?

At least a bad boobie link.
 
2003-04-15 10:07:23 AM  
Cubin's Remarks

After noting that her sons, ages 25 and 30, "are blond-haired and blue-eyed," she said: "One amendment today said we could not sell guns to anybody under drug treatment. So does that mean that if you go into a black community you can't sell any guns to any black person?"

Thanks for bringing that up Recockulous, I had wanted to check that out.
 
2003-04-15 10:07:25 AM  
Yeah, zipf, race accounts for differences in human character, as in, stealing hubcaps, while good whitey holds a function for the poor little negroes.

I think that constitutes a racist sentiment.
 
2003-04-15 10:07:30 AM  
Stealing hubcaps? I hope that was at least followed up with, "I've got nuthin'".
 
2003-04-15 10:08:13 AM  
Gis for 500,000
 
2003-04-15 10:08:17 AM  
How far right do you have to be to consider Bill O'Reily a leftist?
 
2003-04-15 10:08:53 AM  
Please do not waste your time reading this post. You have been warned as I have nothing to say.

Dammit - I wanna riot! I always miss out on good anarchy.

Congrats! Good job Farkers & Farkettes - AND Admins and Mods. Keep it up!
 
2003-04-15 10:09:13 AM  
"While the kids are watching Dion singin' about the stars
The Belmonts are out on the parking lot, stealing hubcaps off of cars"
 
2003-04-15 10:09:45 AM  
What happened to the 500,00Boobies about Colin Powel takes coke?
 
2003-04-15 10:09:50 AM  
500,000th link unless you subtract repeats...
 
2003-04-15 10:10:03 AM  
WOW Larry King bought 6 pair of mesh thongs from Victoria's Secret. (bottom of Washington Post page) This newspaper is full of all kinds of important news.

Anyway, on the Factor last night O'Reilly said all kinds of good things about the Best Men. I'm sure we'll see tonight if he actually said that when the viewer mail segment of his show comes up.
 
2003-04-15 10:10:29 AM  
First time the boobies ever got me.
 
2003-04-15 10:11:31 AM  
Yotta,

You're a god amongst men.
 
2003-04-15 10:11:40 AM  
keep pretending racism doesnt exist, yall
 
2003-04-15 10:12:10 AM  
BTW: That article cracked my ass up. Should insensitive, stereotypical comments inspire shock anymore? People are stupid and say stupid, careless things that, given a second to think prior to speaking, probably would not have bee said. Let's rise above these comments (not forgive) and rejoice half a million. Wow.
 
2003-04-15 10:12:34 AM  
Farkingwaitaminute! Is that 500,000 Fark or TotalFark farklinks? Mefarkingthinks it is a TotalFark farkcount. How many farklinks have been on Fark?

500,000 submissions. 43,675 approved.

(So yeah, it's a TotalFark count.)
 
2003-04-15 10:13:10 AM  
C,mon people...if the best men at your wedding didn't try to steal your hubcaps or otherwise deface your car, your best men are nerds.
 
2003-04-15 10:13:14 AM  
Oh yeah, that is so funny because:

1. It's funny because it picks on children.
2. It's funny because it targets the disadvantaged.
3. It is funny because it just points out the differences between those with white skin and colored people.
4. It is funny 'cause it's true.
5. It is funny because - what else would Bill say when surrounded by minorities?

/sarcasm
 
2003-04-15 10:13:51 AM  
So if you like Bill, it's funny. If you hate Bill, it's racist.

Case closed.

There is nothing else to say about this.

It's over.

Can we have more boobies now?
 
2003-04-15 10:13:53 AM  
Ah, Drew, Mike and Mme.Mersault. Next Jeff'll make an appearance. This is definitely not a good thread to make an arsehole of myself on, so I'm off.
 
2003-04-15 10:14:34 AM  
Can the 500,001st link be a story about Bill O'Reilly getting caught stealing hubcaps?

Or a photoshop contest on that theme?

Or maybe just a great SFW boobies link?

And how many hours of work time has been spent on Fark's 500,000th link?

Did I cover all the bases? Should? I? have? used? more? question? marks???
 
2003-04-15 10:14:49 AM  
What, and there's threads where it is?
 
2003-04-15 10:14:50 AM  
Bill O'Reilly
27 matches, 144 wickets at 22.59
 
2003-04-15 10:14:52 AM  
Congrats on the 1/2 mil!
 
2003-04-15 10:14:53 AM  
Bill O'Reilly is as big a jackass as Michael Moore, and this is a pretty stupid thing to get all bent out of shape because of.
 
2003-04-15 10:15:45 AM  
Just so you guys all know, 62% of Democrats supported the Civil Rights act vs 92% of Republicans.

Who're the racists?
 
2003-04-15 10:16:33 AM  
3,484,502 total comments. (Including deleted troll posts. No, we never cleaned any old stuff out.)
 
2003-04-15 10:16:49 AM  
GooberMcFly. I didn't. I assume a mod added it. I submitted the "B.O. pulls a T.R." part and that URL.
 
2003-04-15 10:17:09 AM  
Best men steal hubcaps and put white shoe polish on your car windows and tie cans to the tailpipe and put fish in your radiator on your wedding day. It was a quip about best men and wedding days -- not about inner-city (black) kids. Even O'Reilly has more sense than that. I'm sure that after he said it, he realized that it could be misconstrued. (Kind of like the time I made an "I'm with stupid T-shirt" joke about a friend of mine whose kid was having serious trouble in school. Open mouth, insert foot. Didn't mean it that way at all. The sad/frustrating thing is that I WISH O'Reilly HAD meant the quip as an inner-city jab. The world would be a better place if O'Reilly were off the air. He needs to do something unambiguously inappropriate that will get him canned from all media. Sadly, this was ambiguous. Try again, Bill!
 
2003-04-15 10:18:55 AM  
if I had a nickel for every.. I'd have $25,000.
 
2003-04-15 10:19:44 AM  
BO'R is nothing but a more obnoxious version of Morton Downey Jr.
 
2003-04-15 10:19:56 AM  
For the last time, the terms "Republican" and "Democrat" had different connotations way back when.

I'm sure there are racist Democrats, but for god sake, don't bastardize history.
 
2003-04-15 10:20:06 AM  
KEEP IT ON TOPIC

And why isn't there a war thread tyoday? You go away for one long weekend...
 
2003-04-15 10:20:32 AM  
04-15-03 10:14:49 AM Mike
What, and there's threads where it is?


Advanced FARKing technique number #274 - Hiding in a crowd.
The best place to be an evil trolling moron is on threads where you're going to be the least of their problems. c.f. any thread where Goatman makes an appearance.

Advanced FARKing technique number #212 - US nightime.
Even Drew needs to close his eyes occasionally.
 
2003-04-15 10:21:30 AM  
Rumbleminz: For decades the South was controlled by Democrats. I'd dare to say a few are racist. They aren't all progressive. In fact, I'll go so far as to say that most Democrats who are racist are black.
 
2003-04-15 10:22:50 AM  
2) Everyone (as in the press)wants to stab at O-Reily because he makes so many lefters look stupid on TV

I think liberals dislike him because he provides a very narrow point of view, grossly simplifying complex issues. When he's called to task on his viewpoints, he uses practiced fallacious rhetoric. The fact that his audience is oblivious to his gross distortions and manipulations is all the more frustrating.

"when assholes Like Mike Moore (moore as in more cheesburgers for my fat ass)"

Wow. Good one.
 
2003-04-15 10:24:26 AM  
 
2003-04-15 10:24:48 AM  
Oh, good. Now we get to watch the thread degenerate into a flamewar.
 
2003-04-15 10:26:14 AM  
Strom Thurmond was a Democrat back in those days. On many issues like states rights, civil rights, taxes, and more the two parties completely switch stances over time. Comparing the parties from that long ago is completely pointless.
 
2003-04-15 10:26:42 AM  
Can someone post a link to the story in here? I can't open anything from the main site. Thanks!
 
2003-04-15 10:27:02 AM  
I love the way Daryll Hammond does O'Reily on SNL.

O'Reily:"Bellafonte, gimme somethng crazy!"

Harry Bellafonte: "Osama Bin Laden is an Uncle Tom."

O'Reily:"Sweet God, i don't even know who thats offensive to, but i love it! Ya watcha hahdba!"
 
2003-04-15 10:27:38 AM  
Stupid joke, a non-story.
Im not from NY but does inner city kids means Black, Puertorican (sp?), Italian, Asian, Irish, or just poor run of the mill white kids. Just wondering which group he supposedly pissed off.
 
2003-04-15 10:29:24 AM  
Logweasel--

I don't know, I've seen him debate some things pretty in-depth and still beat the living hell out of liberal. 95% of the time O'Reilly is right and it's the liberal who hasn't done the research or in-depth analyses before making an idiot out of themselves.
 
2003-04-15 10:29:49 AM  
IHateEverything:

Hate to nitpick, but he's not doing O'Reily, he's doing Chris Matthews, that Hardball guy.
 
2003-04-15 10:30:19 AM  
Ass.
 
2003-04-15 10:30:27 AM  
wooo! Half amill. O'Reilly sucks a dead Levittownian's dick.
 
2003-04-15 10:30:52 AM  
04-15-03 10:05:16 AM Zipf
Actually - I don't like that definition much. The problem with Bill's comment, particularly in that venue, is that it implies racial superiority.

I must have missed where he mentioned race at all. Can you point it out, please?
 
2003-04-15 10:31:03 AM  
500k links, and none of em mine.. im wonderin who i have to slob on to get something posted here..

sheesh.
 
2003-04-15 10:31:06 AM  
Rumbleminz: For decades the South was controlled by Democrats. I'd dare to say a few are racist. They aren't all progressive. In fact, I'll go so far as to say that most Democrats who are racist are black


Strom Thurmond was a Dem when he ran under his segregationist ticket . Lott was a Democrat too. Man I'd swear they just switched sides to make "thier" party look better.
 
2003-04-15 10:31:12 AM  
Recockulous: Ms. Cubin sounds alot scarier than Lott or O'Reilly. Thanks for the link.
 
2003-04-15 10:31:37 AM  
Rumbleminz: For the last time, the terms "Republican" and "Democrat" had different connotations way back when.


So if FDR were alive today he'd be a Republican?
 
2003-04-15 10:31:39 AM  
Thanks Drew

For providing 500,000 times for people to slack off at work.

If it weren't for fark my head would have exploded
 
2003-04-15 10:32:20 AM  
Congratulations Drew and team! How fitting the 500th link would include bigotry and Larry King's spring thong spree! Weeeeeee!
 
2003-04-15 10:32:51 AM  
I have one thing to add to this thread:

That is all.
 
2003-04-15 10:33:15 AM  
Maybe everyone who has ever been a best man at a wedding is pissed, except me, I didnt steal any hubcaps.
 
2003-04-15 10:33:18 AM  
The only place I have ever had my hubcaps stolen was in the parking lot of Second Baptist Church in Houston. This is probably the whitest church in America.
 
2003-04-15 10:33:24 AM  
No, Jjorsett, he'd be a man in a wheelchair.
 
2003-04-15 10:33:40 AM  
Well, that was inevitable.
 
2003-04-15 10:33:49 AM  
Daryll Hammond is doing Chris Matthews.
 
2003-04-15 10:33:57 AM  
Well, that was supposed to be a picture of a tin of Spotted Dick, but a blank space has a nice sense of irony...
 
2003-04-15 10:34:42 AM  
the little morons probably already had his hubcaps, and were looking through his wife's purse at the time...
 
2003-04-15 10:35:06 AM  
Shouldn't # 500,000 have been a BOOBIES link?!

Guess we'll have to wait for 1,000,000 eh?

Congratulations, Drew!
 
2003-04-15 10:36:03 AM  
Bleh, it wants to use cross-domain cookies.. no work for me
 
2003-04-15 10:36:05 AM  
LOL.... half the comments are "Woot Woot! 500,000th comment!!" and the other half are "I didn't read the article, but he makes a racist comment and I still hate Bill O'Reilly! Woot! Woot!"

I don't know what's dumber.... the whole 'buzz' about an absolutely non-issue line or the fact that this was only posted because it was the 500,000 link submitted (note: not the 500,000th ever posted on Fark itself).

FTR, since so many can't get past their blind hatred to read the article (and to burst your miniscule bubbles of misrepresentation and assumption): The line was "Does anyone know where the Best Men are? I hope they're not in the parking lot stealing our hubcaps." No race is mentioned, and let's face it, crime is high in the areas where this charity is targeted towards. It was a dumb quip, but certainly undeserving of even a mention, let alone the attention you guys are giving it.
 
2003-04-15 10:36:37 AM  
M4GNiFiC4N7 7 0N H0|2584CK
 
2003-04-15 10:37:30 AM  
RobW:- I'm getting sick of seeing you thrusting your spotted dick in front of our eyes at every opportunity.
 
2003-04-15 10:38:03 AM  
A fitting 500,000th link, it is a leftist half-truth story.
 
2003-04-15 10:38:47 AM  
04-15-03 10:13:14 AM Zipf
Oh yeah, that is so funny because:

1. It's funny because it picks on children.
2. It's funny because it targets the disadvantaged.
3. It is funny because it just points out the differences between those with white skin and colored people.
4. It is funny 'cause it's true.
5. It is funny because - what else would Bill say when surrounded by minorities?

/sarcasm


Let's assume for the moment that minorities were the target of this joke, which is disputable. Most humor is at someone's expense. So tell me now why stereotypical humor is acceptable when it is being performed by someone a member of the stereotyped group. Chris Rock or Eddie Murphy could pull this line off and get peals of laughter. Bill O'Reilly says it and gets looks of horror. That double standard speaks volumes about the sincerity of those who profess a desire for racial equality.
 
2003-04-15 10:39:51 AM  
See Nixon: "Southern Strategy"

Up until a few generations ago the Democrats were a party which represented two distinct groups, the Northern and Western liberal Constitutionalists, and the Southern "dixiecrat" (as they later called themselves) Federalists.

During the Truman electoral process he refused to remove the civil rights plank from his agenda, causing the schism between the two groups.

A large chunk of Southern Democrats formed the "States Rights" party, and decades after Strom's failure in the presidential bid they were wooed by Nixon, as part of his "Southern Strategy."

To this day, members of the States Rights party, including individuals like Trent Lott, have their own agenda within the Republican party.

Along with the "Radical Right" of Reagan years, they comrpise a major camp within the Republican party, along with the current Neo-conservatives, Fiscal Conservatives, etc.

Let's not pretend that either party is clean, but as of right now the Republican party is the place where not only Religious Fundamentalists, but also the institutional racists reside.
 
2003-04-15 10:40:32 AM  
Whamdangler: I suppose this would be a good time to bring up the fact that you have four links posted, not three. <=
 
2003-04-15 10:40:47 AM  
ATTENTION IDIOTS: ASKING WHITE PEOPLE TO STOP BEING RACIST ALL DAMN DAY IS NOT A DOUBLE STANDARD
 
2003-04-15 10:40:53 AM  
Having never actually watched his damned show, I really can't comment on it. But from reading the Dan Savage's response to being on the show, I'd believe any statement that claims O'Reilly is an ass-hat
 
2003-04-15 10:40:56 AM  
that bad Chris Rock

Man, that needs some narrowing down.
 
2003-04-15 10:41:10 AM  
Congrats on the 500k mark, Drew. :) As for O'Reilly, so he a scumbag. In other news, water is wet. But the real travesty here is the taking of that picture of him and the two nasty biatches sitting next to him. Shouldn't there be some sort of statute prohibiting that much ugly being packed into such a small area? And speaking of his fugly companions, if I didn't already have such a low opinion of O'Reilly, I certainly would after seeing the company that he keeps, i.e. the wives of the current and a former drug czar. Why doesn't he just invite Tipper Gore and Adolf Hitler to his table and see if he can amass enough evil in one location to destroy the world once and for all?
 
2003-04-15 10:41:12 AM  
Hurrah! Grats on half a mill! Thanks for lots of laughing and learning! Great place ya have here.

And, yeah, Larry King buying pastel thongs was hard to choke down breakfast to! Oy!
 
2003-04-15 10:41:56 AM  
I guess the real story here is the 500,000th link, and none of mine have ever been posted.

Congratulation Drew and everyone.

I wonder if you could maybe do a rough estimate of how many work hours have been wasted.
 
2003-04-15 10:42:04 AM  
That should have been:-

Anybody remember that bad Chris Rock movie

Man, that needs some narrowing down.
 
2003-04-15 10:42:10 AM  
A quick question on his show. Does he like to burn strawmen?
 
2003-04-15 10:42:55 AM  
How many were boobies links?
 
2003-04-15 10:43:01 AM  
As a long time farker, 500,000 links boggles the mind compared to when it was about 30 links a week.

In addition to Drew's head, I'm surprised any of the fark servers (forums.fark.com especially) haven't exploded yet.
 
2003-04-15 10:43:34 AM  
Half a million. That's something.

As for the comment, meh. I thought it was kind of amusing. I remember being a kid that age and having kids that age as my friends. Many of them stole stuff. Even the "good kids" were punks. And this was true of all races, as I lived in a pretty integrated small town.

As Chris Rock says, "You can boo me, but you know I'm right."
 
2003-04-15 10:44:26 AM  
Sorry Jjorsett, I was set to explain it until a bee the size of a softball came into my apartment.

I think NathanAllen covered it pretty well, but FDR would most likely fit under today's standard of "Democrat." The big shift came with civil rights legislation.
 
2003-04-15 10:45:26 AM  

Wow, that's "news". Damn, the left is so pathetic now the best it can do is constantly play the race card. Good thing O'Reilly didn't pull a Robert Byrd and join the KKK...




Dems = Hypocrites

 
2003-04-15 10:47:52 AM  
1. It's clearly a joke with race connotations. Think of his generation for pete's sake. I'm only in my late twenties and I can think of at least half a dozen jokes about black children and stealing. If you'v never heard one, good for you, it must be fantastic to reside in a world where random strangers don't pollute your air with their racist comments.

2. The reason he appears so suave and dominating over the "liberals" on his show is because it's his freaking show. I'm not saying there aren't many idiotic liberals, but what makes you think the producers of the show are going to select them, after all it isn't a news show whose main premise is "O'reily bashes the liberal, conservatives around the nation laugh."

3. Should be be strung up for making an off-color off-the-cuff remark? No, but people shouldn't pretend it didn't happen, or that it wasn't a racist remark.
 
2003-04-15 10:48:11 AM  
Does anyone else wonder where Dro In The Wind is?
 
2003-04-15 10:48:25 AM  
So I guess going out protesting the war (or whaling, or globalization, or...) and destroying property is OK, but suddenly there are limits to free speech if your cause is not Liberal. Hmph...

O'Reilly should have known not to say anything that can be construed as racial. Only black comedians can do that! Sheesh!
 
2003-04-15 10:50:09 AM  
Now let's all start submitting every link in sight so that we can get to 1 million as quickly as possible.
 
2003-04-15 10:50:27 AM  
Where are the stats on how many time France surrendered?
 
2003-04-15 10:50:58 AM  
Wow, half a million links...that's really something.

You put that Jonas Salk to shame with his "vaccine"....what about that dude who invented the airbag? his mom was probably so proud...until she heard about fark's 500,000th link...now she's ashamed of him for not doing something important with his life.
 
2003-04-15 10:51:57 AM  
Oh people....Loosen up! Thats funny as hell!
 
2003-04-15 10:52:30 AM  
LesserEvil, Bill said what he said because he thought it would be funny to make a joke about the stereotype of black kids stealing hub caps. No race was mentioned, but do you honestly think he would make the joke if the Best Men were suburban white kids? 'No race was mentioned' - that's the lamest possible excuse.
 
2003-04-15 10:53:05 AM  
Man, I wish all racist bigots like O'Reilly would donate $60,000 ANNUALLY to programs benefiting the people they are racist against. Wow, that would pretty much take care of the problem. Plus, idiots like Robert Fisk would be bankrupt after giving all their money to the ADL (remember kids, according to Robert Fisk, Jews run the media and the government).

Please, this is the most retarted non-issue post I have seen (and that includes all ones from tabloids).

A) O'Reilly was referencing the tradition of Best Men defacing the car during a wedding.

B) He donated $60,000 to a cause that completely contradicts his supposedly racist views

If you want to hate O'Reilly, do it because he is a pompous windbag who always insists he is right (to be fair, sometimes he is). Don't try use illegitimate character assisination to prove your viewpoint.
 
2003-04-15 10:54:05 AM  
token comment.
 
2003-04-15 10:54:16 AM  
Actually FDR would be a Socialist Tyrant, but a benevolant one, kinda like Tito.

The New Deal and SSA are straight out of Socialist doctrine, and sitting in the oval office for 3 elected terms (and going for his 4th at the time of his death) isn't just whistling Dixie.
 
2003-04-15 10:55:39 AM  
Advanced dumbass technique #1: Admitting to the sysadmin that you're a troll.
 
2003-04-15 10:56:28 AM  
NathanAllen: Think of his generation for pete's sake.

Clearly you have zero clue about his generation. Go back to your PS2 and continue with your education.
 
2003-04-15 10:57:14 AM  
Mike:- Just pullin' ya leg. (he says, momentarily nervous that his account suddenly won't work)
 
2003-04-15 10:58:20 AM  
Have you heard the one about the drunken Irishman?
 
2003-04-15 10:58:25 AM  
WTF??...ok everyone just click on this damned link...LOL

This Modern World
 
2003-04-15 10:59:03 AM  
Again - Jesus Christ was a liberal. They nailed him to a tree for it.
 
2003-04-15 10:59:06 AM  
Beowulf, that's over a year and a half, but the fact is this. People do things they don't believe in all the time, for tax breaks, to maintain an upstanding faade, because their publicist tells them to, etc. Don't pretend like this didn't have racial under/over tones. If you do, you're about as stupid as half the people in here.
 
2003-04-15 10:59:51 AM  
Rumbleminz said:
"For the last time, the terms "Republican" and "Democrat" had different connotations way back when."

That is absolute horse shiat.
 
2003-04-15 11:00:23 AM  
"A) O'Reilly was referencing the tradition of Best Men defacing the car during a wedding."

What color is the sky in your world?

Maybe the next time a racist says "Lets string that N... up!" you can claim they're just making a homage to Blazing Saddles.
 
2003-04-15 11:01:04 AM  
Half Million? Well la-dee-frickin'-da!

ph4rK 0\/\/Z j00!
 
2003-04-15 11:02:02 AM  
God God Almighty. Can't anybody crack a decent attractive and successful African-American joke in public anymore?
 
2003-04-15 11:02:23 AM  
NathanAllen: Your last post is the first one I disagree with. I think FDR did what he could to keep the US democratic, given the fact that countries all over the world were going communist or socialist. Sure, the programs are founded in socialism, but they were necessary. A pure capitalistic state just won't work, same as pure communism or anything else. I think he found the best combination given the depression and state of world politics. Also, there was nothing but tradition keeping him from staying in office as long as elected. The terms were limited after that, but there was good justification for keeping the same president in power for as long as the war went on.
 
2003-04-15 11:03:54 AM  
Whodat?: I have the "Well La Dee farkIN Da!" bumpersticker. Great responses from gas station guys, everytime.
 
2003-04-15 11:04:17 AM  
I fail to see how the rich elitest snobs at that dinner can tell Bill that he is wrong. The only reason they even support the charity is to make themselves look good, they dont really give a damn about those kids.... farking rich a$s wankers is all they are. THEY are the problem with this world, not some guy making an "insensitive" joke... hell.... 90% of the photoshops here are worse than that joke. Fark those rich snobs.
 
2003-04-15 11:04:57 AM  
/flamebait x4
 
2003-04-15 11:05:08 AM  
And I just noticed another thing... at the top of this page I'm viewing right now, I see a banner ad for www.punkassgear.com, and the text above it says "shirts, babyt's, stickers and other sh!t"... no fark filter.. <=
 
2003-04-15 11:06:28 AM  
Should we get into O'Reilly's misogynistic tendancies too?
 
2003-04-15 11:07:51 AM  
Sno2dude: I totally agree.. I think Bill's comment was hilarious, and if I'd been there, I'm sure it was also perfectly timed. To quote Maynard: "Fark these dysfunctional, insecure actresses" (and politicians, et al)

/flood off
 
2003-04-15 11:08:07 AM  
See Nixon: "Southern Strategy"

Of course, Buchanan tells a different story.
 
2003-04-15 11:11:07 AM  
Impaler: Why not? We should also mention that he has a small weener.
 
2003-04-15 11:11:19 AM  
BeowulfSmith
If you are going to call something retarded, at least spell retarded correctly.

NathanAllen
Give me a farking break! There was no racial overtone whatsoever in his 'hubcap' comment. He was talking about teenage boys and making a JOKE. Nothing more. For the record Bill O. is an asshole.
 
2003-04-15 11:11:33 AM  
thats a big number
 
2003-04-15 11:12:08 AM  
Hey, Drew: Congrats! And an appropriate link it is, recounting mankind's unfathomable capacity for stupidity.

This calls for a retrospective--milestones, high/low points, personal favorites, misty photoshop-ped mammaries, etc.
 
2003-04-15 11:13:20 AM  
Damn...it's turning into farking Free Republic in this place.
 
2003-04-15 11:14:58 AM  
Bill O'Reilly=asshat
 
2003-04-15 11:15:20 AM  
Larry King's wife probably doesn't look too bad in a thong, actually... kinda got the milf thing goin' on.

http://www.uvsc.edu/relations/releases/larrynshawnking.jpg
 
2003-04-15 11:16:26 AM  
Drew's blue screen of death:

"You have now linked to everything on the internet. This has caused an unrecoverable error. You're farked."
 
2003-04-15 11:17:49 AM  
500,000 less the Left-Eye Lopez plane crash stories.
You poor total farkers.
 
2003-04-15 11:24:25 AM  
Nagasaki
Chris Rock or Eddie Murphy could pull this line off and get peals of laughter. Bill O'Reilly says it and gets looks of horror. That double standard speaks volumes about the sincerity of those who profess a desire for racial equality.
Self-deprecating humor is generally okay. Humor that targets others (children, minorities, etc) and plays on peoples' feelings of racial superiority may be branded as racist. Racism is so embedded in present-day thought, that "racial equality" is impossible - imagine meeting a black man and NOT noticing that he is black? What is possible is understanding and tolerance of our differences.
 
2003-04-15 11:25:31 AM  
MARK MY WORD, 1,000,000 FARK ACCOUNT ON MAY 5TH. WE NEED A BETTING LINK FOR THE 1,000,000 FARK ACCOUNT.
 
2003-04-15 11:26:12 AM  
That was a funny line. I would have laughed my ass off.
 
2003-04-15 11:28:19 AM  
happy 500000th farkers!
 
2003-04-15 11:28:57 AM  
Sorry if this has already been said, but wouldn't that shot of Bill with those two hags make an excellent photoshop contest?
 
U
2003-04-15 11:29:26 AM  
o'reilly is mo
 
2003-04-15 11:29:49 AM  
more like 100,000.....Fark account.

We're not close to 1 million.
 
2003-04-15 11:30:16 AM  
Boo farking hoo. If it had been a black man everyone would have howled.
 
2003-04-15 11:30:42 AM  
It's a sad day in America when an obnoxious, bellicose, arrogant, rich, white guy can't crack racist jokes about black kids to an audience full of obnoxious, bellicose, arrogant, rich, white people.
 
2003-04-15 11:30:48 AM  
Congrats, Drew, admins, mods.. THANKS.
 
2003-04-15 11:30:50 AM  
"Self-deprecating humor is generally okay. Humor that targets others (children, minorities, etc) and plays on peoples' feelings of racial superiority may be branded as racist."

Case in point: I'm an urban, northern white guy. Were I to be at a fundraiser in Virginia for poor little white children and made a reference to the children not showing up because they were busy brewing up moonshine, everyone would have a fit.

And rightly so. I'd be a prejudiced asshole. Just as O'Reilly is.
 
2003-04-15 11:31:24 AM  
What a non-story.. who filed this one, ex-KKK member Senator Boyd (D)?


AK
 
2003-04-15 11:32:58 AM  
Axisted

Your linked article was a very interesting read. However, whether Richard Nixon did or did not believe that African-Americans had a raw deal, it doesn't mean that having a man prone to public racist quips as Senate Majority Leader is necessarily a good idea. But, otherwise, it was an interesting read.
 
2003-04-15 11:34:56 AM  
AcornMan
HAHA!
 
2003-04-15 11:36:21 AM  
So, I late. I'm sure we all agreed on this. Was O'Riley a racist?
 
2003-04-15 11:36:31 AM  
My god like he was serious...making something out of nothing...At least he actually does good instead of just talking about it.
I mean really is there anybody you people like? Is there anything that you agree with? or is everyone else just stupid.
For the most part reading these forums is like going back to when i was 10 and arguing about which gi joe was better.
 
2003-04-15 11:37:21 AM  
500,000...spffy
 
2003-04-15 11:40:24 AM  
Don't say I never did anything for you, Macabre.

PS-I think we could solve a lot of the world's problems with some celebrity deathmatches. I'll suggest a few:

George W. Bush vs. Saddam Hussein
Rush Limbaugh vs. Michael Moore
Ari Fleisher vs. The Iraqi Minister of Information
Bill O'Reilly vs. Art Bell

Hopefully someone at Fox is reading this.
 
2003-04-15 11:40:54 AM  
Newport56, well, I think Lott's endorsement of Strom Thurmond's platform is implicitly an endorsement of racism, but Nixon's "southern strategy" may not have been.
 
2003-04-15 11:40:57 AM  
'No, we have it all covered.' " They spent $56 on "six mesh thongs.

Isn't this a self-contadictory statement?
 
2003-04-15 11:41:18 AM  
JOHNDX I stand corrected, 100,000 fark account, my apologies, and many thanks for the links you have previously provided.
 
2003-04-15 11:42:05 AM  
500,000, im impressed. Bill spoke at my brother's college graduation, he talked about getting drunk and falling in the Hudson River, it was kinda funny, but he is still an idiot.
 
2003-04-15 11:42:16 AM  
Okay, you can say I never did anything for you.

But I swear it worked in the scratchpad.
 
2003-04-15 11:43:06 AM  
C'mon. Some of Mr. O'Reilly's best friends are black--he loves
those people.
 
2003-04-15 11:43:44 AM  
Fox News is a bunch of Nazis and Bill O'Reilly is their Fuhrer.

Hopefully somebody at Fox will read this too!
 
2003-04-15 11:44:44 AM  
The argument that stereotypical humor is acceptable when it is being performed by someone a member of the stereotyped group (but not otherwise) fails to take into account that the audience in those cases is also usually predominately members of the stereotyped group.

Also, conservatives should give a listen to Chris Rock's 2 HBO concert shows. Rock is tough on the deadbeat blacks.

(PS. I borrowed Nagasaki's phrasing of the argument, but this post is in no way intending to single him out. I just thought his phrasing was eally good. That is all.)
 
2003-04-15 11:45:01 AM  
What more does the whiteman have to do to show the blackman that we are sorry for slavery?

How much longer must the whiteman practise reverse racism? Why must we continue to put down the whiteman just so the blackman can feel better about himself? How many more whitemen have to go without jobs because affrimitive action dictates that the jobs be given to the first blackman who applies?

Do we have to create a world where the blackman and only the blackman is in power? And must we reduce the whiteman to being their servants? Must the whiteman raise his children to feel horrible and ashamed about the color of their skin and the stigma that comes with it? Must the whiteman be reduced to an Uncle Tom, not only happy to be a servant to the blackman but actively praising him? Must the whiteman take all the punishment given to him by the blackman with only an "I deserve this."?

I do believe this is what the blackman desires. To turn the tables and make the whiteman his slave just as the whiteman made the blackman his slave. The blackman doesn't seek equality, he seeks revenge. Revenge for being taken from his friends and family in his native Africa. Revenge for being forced into a life of bondage. Revenge for being whipped repeatively while picking cotten under a blazing sun. Revenge for his new family being taken from him and sold like cattle. Revenge for being considered "worth only 3/5's of a whiteman.". Revenge for centuries of oppression and torment from the whiteman. The blackman will not rest until the vengeful spirit of Hannibal is satified that his desendents have made the people of Africa feared once more.

(I can't decide, is this satire, sarcasm, funny, or just plain tasteless? I don't really believe all this)
 
2003-04-15 11:46:12 AM  
I though it was 500,000th link about the O'reilly incident.
 
2003-04-15 11:47:18 AM  
O Reilly?

Smarter than you, funnier than you,is more informed tahn you, does more for the good of the world than you, is not a racist, is arrogant and sarcastic... generally, a better guy than most of you could possibly ever be. Did I mention smarter than you?

carry on bulbs
 
2003-04-15 11:50:31 AM  
This mulatto thought it sounded like a pretty funny quip--the same mulatto can't stand a good part of O'Reilly's politics. Call me an Uncle Tom if you must, but honkeys making jokes about negroes is fair game as far as I'm concerned. Just like most things in life, common sense lets us know when something is over-the-top or otherwise deliberately hurtful.

That said, it would be nice if the pro-war, rah-rah superpatriot crowd could afford the other side the same courtesy when their politics become fodder for jokes or political satire.

Hypersensitivity and self-righteous indignation are annoying no matter the practicioner...

/not meaning to relate everything to the war
 
2003-04-15 11:52:15 AM  
Cry cry piss cry FOX cry cry biatch cry NAZIS cry cry sniff FUHRER cry piss moan, cry cry whine.

awww poor little sensitive kitty.
 
2003-04-15 11:52:37 AM  
Axisted

Oh, I agree. It's just that Buchanan makes the argument that Lott was betrayed by Bush, et al. Since Lott was affiliated with Nixon, and this same Nixon used this Southern Strategy, does this earn him a free pass to run his yap in the manner he did? Buchanan would seem to agree with that statement, whereas I cannot. Besides, it's not like Lott was stabbed in the back here. I mean, he was only demoted to a mere United States Senator
 
2003-04-15 11:52:55 AM  
Emperor-Jay: All I could think about reading that was this guy...
 
2003-04-15 11:53:39 AM  
500k? NFW! Way too many reposts to claim that. It's more like 400k I'd say.
 
2003-04-15 11:54:11 AM  
And he said, "Ketchup!" Get it!? Ketchup!
 
2003-04-15 11:54:16 AM  
LintTempura
C'mon. Some of Mr. O'Reilly's best friends are black--he loves
those people.


For those of you who haven't been here, they love him too
 
2003-04-15 11:55:30 AM  
aack - the link didn't work!
 
2003-04-15 11:55:34 AM  
500k...sweet Fark...You'll always have a place in my heart.

I never did like Bill O'Reily, but the icing on the cake was the way he handled his interview with Jeremy Glick.
 
2003-04-15 11:56:20 AM  
Ummm, that was supposed to be Principal Blackman from "Strangers With Candy" *shrug*
 
2003-04-15 11:58:34 AM  
Bill represents everything that is vile and corrupt in America, If there are some conservatives with an open mind out there, who cannot understand why there is so much anti-american sentiment overseas, then look no further than Bill O'Reilly for the explanation.

Bill O'Reilly, preaches freedom and liberty trough blissfull ignorance.

Remember Morton Downey jr ?... Bill, you are next !
 
2003-04-15 11:59:26 AM  
Just for the record, Bill O'Reilly is nothing at all like Lott. I watch/listen his show all the time and he is not what they are trying to insinuate in the story. Can you say "hit piece?" I Knew you could.
 
2003-04-15 11:59:35 AM  
Does anybody remember seing him say that he thought that modern african americans were "better off" in america than they would be if they were still in Africa.

What's wrong with that? They are better off in America than Africa. Have you looked at what Africa is like?

As for O'Reilly's comment, it was actually pretty funny. And if someone with darker skin had said it, everyone else would have thought it was funny too. But if the tables were turned, and a black guy made a joke about a group of white boys, nobody would mind at all. Funny how so-called "racist and offensive comments" are accepted when made by minorities, but if a white person says anything like that it creates a firestorm of criticism and racist allegations.

By the way, for those biatching about all these "racist republicans", you may want to remember that for a very long time it was the Democratic party that was against freedoms for blacks, and the two Republican politicians most often linked to having racist views in the past (Lott and Thurmond) are former Democrats. The Dixiecrat platform that Thurmond ran his presidential campaign on was an offshoot of the Democratic party.
 
2003-04-15 12:00:07 PM  
BTW

That "Blacks are worth 3/5's of a whiteman" quote came from a first edition of the Constitution. It wasn't always the list of liberties and freedoms it is now.
 
2003-04-15 12:01:27 PM  
Honestly, comparing what O'Reilly said to saying, "String the n*@#$ up" is a completely specious and retarded argument to make (there I spelt [sic] it correctly, heh). Now, I checked the Best Men website and saw no reference to race, only social class. So, I would surmise that the organization is directed at the inner-city young men of the areas they are working in (the racial demographics of which would be different, depending on area). Okay, fine. Now, please point out to me the pattern of behavior O'Reilly has commited to back up your claims? That one comment can be construed in several ways and is thus too vague to indict him on its own. Maybe he is racist, I don't really know the man, but you'll have to provide a little more proof than his employment at Fox News to convince me of his guilt.
 
2003-04-15 12:01:43 PM  
Fink
O Reilly?

Smarter than you, funnier than you,is more informed tahn you, does more for the good of the world than you, is not a racist, is arrogant and sarcastic... generally, a better guy than most of you could possibly ever be. Did I mention smarter than you?

carry on bulbs


Jebus, why don't you just kiss his ass in private. It would save all of us an uncomfortable moment thinking of you and O'Reilly in your love nest.

Did you mock Al Gore for saying he invented the internet? What about Bill Clinton and the definitions of "is"? Micheal Moore for his speech at the Oscars?

Dish it out, can't take it???
 
2003-04-15 12:01:58 PM  
Once again underscoring what everyone already knows:

Bill is a broadcaster first and thinker 18th. Which is fine. It puts him in the same camp as Katie Couric, John Tesh and Regis. I'm sure he didn't intentionally slam the kids. He just said something without thinking.

But my point is: he pretty much says everything without thinking. The only difference between him and Rodney Dangerfield (and I love me some Rodney) is that Bill pretends to have well thought out political opinions.
 
2003-04-15 12:03:31 PM  
"you may want to remember that for a very long time it was the Democratic party that was against freedoms for blacks, and the two Republican politicians most often linked to having racist views in the past (Lott and Thurmond) are former Democrats"

Who switched sides in the 60s when they figured out what party better caters to racists. Or white racists, at least.
 
2003-04-15 12:04:18 PM  
Can I sell this moment to an antiques dealer for a lot of money in the future?
 
2003-04-15 12:05:15 PM  
O' Reilly is responsible for anti-american sentiment overseas? aha ha ha ha ahahhahahhahha, okay pal, if you insist. Maybe they really hate us because people like you open their mouths and baseless shiat comes flying out. Or is it because Monica Lewinsky is now hosting a reality show? I'd be tempted to hate a nation of idiots who make people celebrities for sucking dicks.
 
2003-04-15 12:06:16 PM  
Newport56 Oh, I agree. It's just that Buchanan makes the argument that Lott was betrayed by Bush, et al. Since Lott was affiliated with Nixon, and this same Nixon used this Southern Strategy, does this earn him a free pass to run his yap in the manner he did?

I don't think that's not what he's saying. He might be implying it, though. The Lott thing is really only tangential to Buchanan's criticsm of Bill Kristol's statement:

"Lott is really virtually the last of the products of Richard Nixon's 'Southern Strategy' to be in major positions of power in the Congress,"

He's not denying that Lott's statement was an endorsement of racism, but that Lott's connection to Nixon's Southern Strategy does not make the Southern Strategy racist by association, nor does it make the Rebublican party or the right-partisans racist, nor does it make State's Rights a racist concept. I'm glad he specifically mentioned that Nixon did not support the John Birch Society members.
 
2003-04-15 12:07:03 PM  
""Does anyone know where the Best Men are? I hope they're not in the parking lot stealing our hubcaps."


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!...cough cough....HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA!A!A!AA!!!!!!

Man, that Bill O'Reilly is one funny dude!

If Whoopi Goldberg had said the same thing, all you libs would be cracking up.

And congrats on .5 mil, FARK.
 
2003-04-15 12:07:28 PM  
I guess you don't have to show respect when you are writing checks. Probably stems from our judicial and electorial system.
 
2003-04-15 12:07:33 PM  
ZTigerX

What's wrong with that? They are better off in America than Africa. Have you looked at what Africa is like?

This has to be roughly the 5th dumbest post I've seen on FARK. What kind of farked up logic makes you think our slave-driving ancestors were doing blacks a favor by bringing them over as slave labor? It amazes me that after hundreds of years of exploitation and segregation, so many people believe that we as a society have zero obligations to the black community.
 
2003-04-15 12:10:45 PM  
I don't think that's not what he's saying.

Sorry for the triple negative. Should be: "I don't think that's what he's saying."
 
2003-04-15 12:10:45 PM  
You gotta love the part where O'Reilly says "no good deed goes unpunished."
 
2003-04-15 12:11:30 PM  
Yes ZipBeep, I mocked them all, and I voted for Clinton AND Gore. Now I mock you, actually I mock you most of the time, for your short sighted views on the way this planet works, and for your "I'm against everything" sillyness. James Dean? half the rebel you are hahahaha.

Next
 
2003-04-15 12:11:50 PM  
i've got nothing to say but wanted to be there where history was made.
see you on the 10^6th thread.
 
daz
2003-04-15 12:12:08 PM  
HOLY CRAP, OMG... HE SUGGESTED THAT INNER CITY KIDS MIGHT STEAL HUBCAPS! HOW OFFENSIVE!!! I MEAN, IT'S SO OVERTLY RACIST (even though he didn't mention anything about race).

I mean, we all know that hubcaps don't get stolen in the inner-city, that's just an urban myth that Rich Old White Guys tell, right?

Oh the humanity!
 
2003-04-15 12:12:15 PM  
Hint:

Clear your history.
Click on Fink's name.
Reload thread.
Don't read posts that have a blue name.
Rinse and repeat for other trolls.
 
2003-04-15 12:12:33 PM  
I didn't read all 200+ posts so maybe this has already been said but just in case it hadn't. No where in this story does it say they were black kids. All it said was they are inner city kids. You just assumed they were black because they were inner city. Who's being racist now?
 
2003-04-15 12:12:34 PM  
Incidentally, I hate O'Reilly and would love to see the bastard grilled, but I think this is being taken a bit too far. Sounds like it was more a slander at young boys than it was black people.
But if people wanna grill him, go ahead. We'll say it makes up for never getting to send his ass to the sun.

Oh, and why isn't there uproar over Wyoming Rep. Cubin, who said something a lot less ambiguous?
 
2003-04-15 12:13:28 PM  
"Does anyone know where the Best Men are? I hope they're not in the parking lot stealing our hubcaps."

Here is a revision for the Politically Correct Nazi's who jump to conclusions...

Does anyone know where the Best Men are? I hope they're not in the parking lot soaping the windows and tying beer cans to the car bumper. In case your still lost... I mean performing a harmless practical joke often performed by the best man."

Jeesh...
 
2003-04-15 12:13:32 PM  
"What's wrong with that? They are better off in America than Africa. Have you looked at what Africa is like?"

What would Africa look like if there hadn't been a practice of taking the best and the brightest and making them slaves? If you have any interest in archeaology and ancient history you would know that Africa was doing pretty damn good until slavery came along.
 
2003-04-15 12:13:59 PM  
Shortbusdriver

See my big post above. Be rational when you talk about "obligations to the black community". Try to treat blacks as equals without treating whites as inferiors.
 
2003-04-15 12:15:30 PM  
Since when does cracking a joke make you a racist? I'd hate to see some people's reaction to Def comedy jam.
 
2003-04-15 12:15:30 PM  
.5 mil what?

DONKEY!!
 
2003-04-15 12:15:32 PM  
500,000 links, and I have still failed to directly contribute a single American penny to the cause of Fark. Yes, I'm a free loader, so sue me.
 
2003-04-15 12:15:52 PM  
500,000 links is a whole shiatload of links. How many boobies links is that?
 
43%
2003-04-15 12:16:29 PM  
What would Africa look like if there hadn't been a practice of taking the best and the brightest and making them slaves? If you have any interest in archeaology and ancient history you would know that Africa was doing pretty damn good until slavery came along.


I failed my slavery test. Guess I wasnt't smart enough to be traded for a shiny new musket.
 
2003-04-15 12:16:31 PM  
Objectivist:

exact same time? Damn.
 
2003-04-15 12:17:16 PM  
What would Africa look like if there hadn't been a practice of taking the best and the brightest and making them slaves? If you have any interest in archeaology and ancient history you would know that Africa was doing pretty damn good until slavery came along.

Right and it was America that started that.
 
2003-04-15 12:17:55 PM  
Awww, I hurt the little GreyAliens feelings too... I'm sorry, here's a hug and a Bush is a Nazi tee-shirt for you.

Move along kids, nothing to see here
 
2003-04-15 12:19:09 PM  
04-15-03 12:05:15 PM Fink
I'd be tempted to hate a nation of idiots who make people celebrities for sucking dicks.

Whoa, hold on there, cowboy. If she (or he, whatever) were REALLY good, why not have someone be a celebrity for that? You gonna tell me that it makes MORE sense for someone to be a celebrity because they've got a nice ass, or big boobies?
Personally, I'd much rather give my props to someone with a demonstrable skill, over the ability to stand there and look good. But whatever.
 
2003-04-15 12:19:10 PM  
"Right and it was America that started that."

No, but we took advantage of and continued the practice. Makes us just as guilty as those who started it.
 
2003-04-15 12:19:13 PM  
We're good vroom! Donkey to you sir!
 
2003-04-15 12:20:38 PM  
What a coincidence!!

This is the 500,000th link and I saw someone say "donkey" in it for the 500,000th time and it was the 500,000th time it wasn't funny.

I can't believe it!
 
2003-04-15 12:21:38 PM  
What's that Fink?

I didn't make it past your name.
 
2003-04-15 12:22:59 PM  
The only thing that makes America unique when it comes to slavery is that we fought a war to end it. America needs to stop feeling guilty about slavery. It's still practiced today by some and was practiced all over the world for thousands of years. Only America founded a nation saying all men were created equal. Let's move on people!
 
2003-04-15 12:23:24 PM  
O'Reilly's radio show will be coming on shortly, should be interesting to hear what he has to say. It's not like news report have been wrong before.
 
2003-04-15 12:24:17 PM  
[flame]
At least during slavery blacks had jobs.
[/flame]
 
2003-04-15 12:24:47 PM  
Objectivist:

Donkey to you and yours this fine day.
.5 million links? that deserves a donkey of its very own.

TheGrayCat

No, but we took advantage of and continued the practice. Makes us just as guilty as those who started it.

what the hell is this crap? how are WE guilty? I refuse to accept responsibility for slavery seeing as that I have never contributed to slavery in any way. You want the blame, take it. Dont put that burden on my shoulders without explaining what I did wrong.
 
2003-04-15 12:25:29 PM  
GreyAlien

that's harsh. How many seconds till your called a racist?
 
2003-04-15 12:25:32 PM  
-I like Vin Diesel movies
-Thanks to GWB 300$ tax check , I got me a playstation2
-Why do those muslims hate the baby jesus so much ?
-A gun is the answer to everything.
-We should do something about those 7 jew bankers holed up in that switzerland vault controlling the worlds money supply.

/the mind of an O'Reilly fan
 
2003-04-15 12:25:37 PM  
So, am I to understand that there is no such thing as a white kid in the inner-city? That white kids don't steal hub caps?

I don't recall Bill O'Reilly saying anything about race in that line, but apparently, plenty of racists here have jumped to that conclusion.
 
2003-04-15 12:25:39 PM  
Well Lewis, if you want to "give props" and a teevee show to someone who is a known cocksucking talent, why not give it to Jenna? she's a black belt, a grand master... I mean if your supporting someones ability to gobble hog as a reason to be on teevee.
 
2003-04-15 12:28:20 PM  
Well said Vroom. I'm so sick of this crap. People should thank America for ending slavery and founding a country based on individual rights which is why there isn't slavery today. All this collectivism makes me sick. The bottom line is I've never owned slaves and no one in this country has been one.
 
2003-04-15 12:28:28 PM  
I would like to add my two cents for this landmark occasion, the 500,000th link on fark. Good Job!

Oh yeah, O'Reilly is a tool.
 
2003-04-15 12:28:40 PM  
RedMom58:

What figures?
 
2003-04-15 12:28:51 PM  
Anyone ever stop to think that maybe he said that because they are just TEENAGERS? Hell, if there were a group of teens somewhere around me or my car, I'd probably wonder where the fark they are as well...

I see where people are coming from, but this doesn't even seem close to what Lott said, and I still gave him the benefit of the doubt and assumed he said it because he was a dumbass who shouldn't think of things to say off the top of his head (or think for himself...to be honest).
 
2003-04-15 12:29:05 PM  
LesserEvil

Awesome point!!
 
2003-04-15 12:29:15 PM  
Emperor-Jay

See my big post above. Be rational when you talk about "obligations to the black community". Try to treat blacks as equals without treating whites as inferiors.

Did I say something irrational? Please point it out for me.

Do we have to create a world where the blackman and only the blackman is in power? And must we reduce the whiteman to being their servants?

Yeah emperor, don't let the black man get you down. You sound horribly oppressed. I don't think we need to hand over our stuff - I don't believe reparations for slavery are appropriate - but I do believe that there is a disparity in opportunity.
 
2003-04-15 12:30:07 PM  
04-15-03 12:21:38 PM GreyAlien

"What's that Fink?
I didn't make it past your name."

Of course you did, that's how you knew to direct this at me, unfortunately, genetics stepped in the way, and your tiny lil mass of grey matter had nothing more to offer.
 
2003-04-15 12:31:33 PM  
Actions speak louder than words. Bill wins.
 
2003-04-15 12:32:46 PM  
I'd be for reperations if it meant al sharpton and jesse jackson would disappear. The only problem for them is after reperations you still have to produce. I'm sure they will figure out some way to make everyone a victim.
 
2003-04-15 12:32:56 PM  
This has to be roughly the 5th dumbest post I've seen on FARK. What kind of farked up logic makes you think our slave-driving ancestors were doing blacks a favor by bringing them over as slave labor?

Would you do me a favor and READ THE farkING POST? It was in reference to a comment about modern African Americans being here instead of over in Africa. MODERN! It had absolutely nothing to do with slaves being brought over. It was a reference to the current state of blacks in this country versus those still in Africa. Are you saying the social/economic situation is better for black in Africa than in America today?
 
2003-04-15 12:32:58 PM  
Bill kicks ass. You know why? Because he doesn't give a shiat... and neither do I. People are so worried about what everyone says. Get the fark over yourselves. Who cares. The old cliche "Actions speak louder than words" is true. I get criticized for what I say all the time. But I will never change, and neither will Bill.

500 G's... nice.
 
2003-04-15 12:33:36 PM  
Bashturn
-Thanks to GWB 300$ tax check , I got me a playstation2

You're welcome.

If you were a rich millionaire like my family and friends, you'd get a lot bigger tax break but you're not so you'll take whatever pittance I give you.

And if you don't like Bill O'Reilly, too bad. He and Rush are part of my shadow government that rules your worthless life.
 
2003-04-15 12:33:42 PM  
04-15-03 12:25:39 PM Fink
Well Lewis, if you want to "give props" and a teevee show to someone who is a known cocksucking talent, why not give it to Jenna?

I dunno, I think there'd be charges of nepotism and FCC manipulation if Jenna Bush got her own TV show...
 
2003-04-15 12:36:25 PM  
TheGrayCat
Are you in here just trying to start a flame war? Certainly you don't use that amazing knowledge of history in other places...

Realize, white slaves were a not uncommon practice throughout the history of my ancestors (I'm white). Black slaves were often sold to slave traders by other tribes, or sometimes by their own tribe.
We kept slavery going, but I do not believe we were the same country to do so. Then slavery was abolished (technically).

And my God, if you're going to lay the blame for Africa's...downturn, at least blame anything that was happening recently, why don't you blame the Europeans for essentially taking over for awhile? That would be a much better argument IMO. But those still are not the only contributing factors...
 
2003-04-15 12:38:08 PM  
Lewis... farking priceless! Although I had not considered your "Jenna" as the host of a show, I must admit (after very little thought) that I would choose your "Jenna" for a bit of a rocket polish over the other Jenna.
 
2003-04-15 12:38:17 PM  
objectivist

thanking america for ending slavery? are you retarded? if i was raping your mother, then stopped, would you thank me?

the united states was the one of last developed nations to get rid of slavery. and that was only after a brutal civil war. problems continue to exist today because individuals like you never wanted the system to change.
 
2003-04-15 12:38:46 PM  
Ididntdoit:

I want .000002% of the credit.
 
2003-04-15 12:40:02 PM  
04-15-03 12:13:32 PM TheGrayCat
"What's wrong with that? They are better off in America than Africa. Have you looked at what Africa is like?"

What would Africa look like if there hadn't been a practice of taking the best and the brightest and making them slaves? If you have any interest in archeaology and ancient history you would know that Africa was doing pretty damn good until slavery came along.



Um, do you have any facts to support this statement? Was there some kind of test someone had to pass before they could qualify to be a slave? I was under the impression they just grabbed whoever was available. Also, i've never owned any slaves but if it was me I wouldn't want the most intelligent people as slaves. Seems like the smart ones would be more likely to try and revolt against the opression
Besides how smart do you gotta be to pick cotton or load hay or whatever it is they had them doing?
 
2003-04-15 12:40:43 PM  
I think "donkey" should go the way of the "have a nice refreshing Dr. Pepper" cliche...

Any seconds?
 
2003-04-15 12:41:39 PM  
04-15-03 12:33:42 PM Lewis

Jenna Bush's wetlands now open for public drilling.


/the onion
 
2003-04-15 12:41:50 PM  
S.A.T. = Slavery Aptitude Test
 
2003-04-15 12:42:28 PM  
These types of incidents always remind me of Howard Cosell when after many years of covering boxing, and then Monday Night football he made the quote "Look at that little monkey run" on a Monday night football game in reference to a black athlete. He had no racial intent in his heart when he said it, as he was known to often use the same phrase to refer to young white athletes as well as his grandchildren, but those who had a desire to see him off the air in the first place jumped on it as an example of racism. It's sad that we've come to a point where ones words can be twisted to mean something that they were never intended to, and ones deeds go ignored.

Oh, and congrates to Drew & crew on #500,000.
 
2003-04-15 12:42:46 PM  
"Realize, white slaves were a not uncommon practice throughout the history of my ancestors (I'm white). Black slaves were often sold to slave traders by other tribes, or sometimes by their own tribe.
We kept slavery going, but I do not believe we were the same country to do so. Then slavery was abolished (technically)."

I never said there weren't white slaves. I also never said that Africans had no part in the slave trade. I said that we (Americans) took advantage of slavery and used it to our advantage and Africa's disadvantage. And slavery hasn't been abolished by any stretch of the imagination.

"And my God, if you're going to lay the blame for Africa's...downturn, at least blame anything that was happening recently, why don't you blame the Europeans for essentially taking over for awhile? That would be a much better argument IMO. But those still are not the only contributing factors..."

Slavery was, and is, the biggest contributing factor.
 
2003-04-15 12:43:23 PM  
Gee. The Washington Pravda printing something bad about Bill? Whodathunk?
 
2003-04-15 12:43:26 PM  
K-jack

You lose all credibility when you accuse me of being for slavery. Yes you should thank America for ending slavery. Thousands of people died to end slavery. Probelms exist today because individuals like you view blacks as inferior and perputuate the myth that they don't have a chance in society because everyone is against them.
 
2003-04-15 12:43:41 PM  
Absolutben

apparently you've never heard of the "cradle of civilization." the dark ages ended in europe because of the knowledge transfer from africa due to the crusades and trade. egyptians were building pyramids and creating math while europeans lived in caves.

/oversimplification
 
2003-04-15 12:43:45 PM  
So for a few generations they took the smart people out of Africa, and after that everyone born was dumb and the continent couldn't recover? I doubt that was the idea anyway, they just wanted people that could do the work. You want to blame someone for Africa? Blame the European colonizing countries. They took over Africa, then when they left they did so for the most part without making much of an effort to leave behind strong countries capable of governing themselves, and the continent is still suffering from that today.
 
2003-04-15 12:43:53 PM  
Hey now.

If it wasn't for BOR, then we wouldn't be close to 500,000 links. Go Drew!
 
2003-04-15 12:44:39 PM  
K-jack:

You sir are retarded. put your "you are a racist" crap up, go home, and let the smart people have a conversation. Your name calling is not needed.
 
2003-04-15 12:44:52 PM  
Slavery was, and is, the biggest contributing factor.

Yeah it has nothing to do with tribalism and mysticism.
 
2003-04-15 12:45:03 PM  
I corrupted Jenna
 
2003-04-15 12:45:28 PM  
We so need to get the comments posted for the 500,000 link up to at least around a nice cool million. Or not. Actually I just wanted to say I posted in the 500K link.
/looking for any way to make an impact before I die
 
2003-04-15 12:45:33 PM  
Objectivist, You're half right, from my readings. Slavery was indentured servitude, but europeans morphed slavery from a servitude based on war and monetary obligations(war prisoners and debtees) to an economy that exploited a race of people BECAUSE of their race. Blacks were the only people who couldn't escape slavery, because their blackness gave them away. There were attempts at slavery with other races as well, but Blacks, however, 'stuck out like a sore thumb.' Also, slavery, after it was embraced by western europeans, was a much more harsh and brutal form of slavery than existed prior to western imperialism. The slave trade itself shows that, with conservative estimates of 10+ million slaves NOT making it from the African continent to the US/Caribbean. Also, you said we should stop feeling guilty about slavery. Dude, slavery's one of the biggest blemishes we have on our record. Need you be reminded that the civil rights movement was not even 50 years ago? There is a disproportionate amount of Blacks that have to struggle w/ poverty, and this stems from slavery and oppression. You're nave to think that in 40 years Black people will have an equal footing in American business or government, because Whites have, as a bloc, controlled the power base, and in my opinion, jokes like this, just feed the need to control that power structure.
 
2003-04-15 12:46:43 PM  
The Russians ended surfdom before the Americans ended slavery.

Slow-pokes.
 
2003-04-15 12:46:48 PM  
500,000 links. Way to go Farkers.
 
2003-04-15 12:47:03 PM  
the dark ages ended in europe because of the knowledge transfer from africa due to the crusades and trade. egyptians were building pyramids and creating math while europeans lived in caves.


Right the ideas of the Enelightenment came from Africa and that is why they are so advanced today.
 
2003-04-15 12:48:41 PM  
"I'm can't hear you"
"yes You can"
"No I can't"
" then how did you know I said something"

Children Children Children...."

Enough is enough. Off to the cafeteria. You all need a time out and some milk.

(muttering..."Damn slave trading honkies")
 
2003-04-15 12:48:59 PM  
Just so you all know, billions of years ago (a few months in our time) we aliens planted a single seed on your planet, from which every living creature grew. We are now waiting until you humans have evolved enough to be suitable for our needs. Soon we will harvest each and every one of you, and put you to work in our spice mines.

This is eminent for your race.
 
2003-04-15 12:49:14 PM  
Slavery has been abolished here. I should've been more clear.
And yes, I realize it was only "technically" ended after the Civil War...and there continued to be people who were pretty much in the same situation as before.

We did take advantage of the situation, but others did as well. Doesn't make it right... just means you should realize we have "company" that deserves to be recognized.
 
2003-04-15 12:49:25 PM  
GRAYCAT"What would Africa look like if there hadn't been a practice of taking the best and the brightest and making them slaves? If you have any interest in archeaology and ancient history you would know that Africa was doing pretty damn good until slavery came along."

um, slavery didnt "come along". Slavery was practiced by africans, when the europeans started trading with africa and exploring, having contact with africans, etc, they began to "get on board" (no pun intended). Europeans *did* inflate demand and make it more widespread than it had been, but to imply that slavery didnt exist until the europeans started messing around with africa is not true.
 
2003-04-15 12:49:43 PM  
Weemill:

there is a big difference between thinking they do not have an equal footing, and accepting any blame for somthing you did not do. I refuse to accept responsibilty for others actions. they did it, blame them. This is not an oversimplification. the idea that the sins of your fathers can be passed down to his children is a large load of crap, and that is exactly what you are doing if you want me to accept blame, or feel bad for slavery. the only difference is there does not have to be a distinct blood relation, just a shared nationality. that is a load of crap.
 
2003-04-15 12:49:44 PM  
The Gray Cat: Slavery was, and is, the biggest contributing factor

You know who most slaves were? People from small villages deep in the forest. The more modern, well-to-do, future of the country people in Africa went in and got them to sell to slave traders. The groups that would have gone on to govern the countries if it wasn't for European colonization weren't hit very hard at all
 
2003-04-15 12:50:22 PM  
04-15-03 12:48:41 PM Big_Bad_Dad
"You all need a time out and some milk."


I'd rather have a beer.

/Billy Madison
 
2003-04-15 12:50:31 PM  
"Um, do you have any facts to support this statement? Was there some kind of test someone had to pass before they could qualify to be a slave? I was under the impression they just grabbed whoever was available. Also, i've never owned any slaves but if it was me I wouldn't want the most intelligent people as slaves."

No, you would want really dumb people to, basically, run your plantation. I mean, it's only your living.
 
2003-04-15 12:50:49 PM  
Ivan don't serf
 
2003-04-15 12:51:29 PM  
Right the ideas of the Enelightenment came from Africa and that is why they are so advanced today.


ummm yes.

Mathematicians in the middle east are credited with the invention of the number "zero" which opened the door to all of advanced mathematics.

Coincidentally zero is the IQ of some of the people posting on this board
 
2003-04-15 12:51:29 PM  
objectivist

so when slavery was abolished, we all became equal, right? how about when brown v. board of education was handed down?

in this generation, tanks were needed to get a black man into college. segregationists still sit in congress. to believe that true equality of opportunity has magically materialized in the past 50-odd years is completely ignorant.
 
2003-04-15 12:51:31 PM  
Best Men. Wedding. Best Man farks up groom's car, including stealing hubcaps.
The left is just looking for shiat to pick at now.
 
2003-04-15 12:52:40 PM  
"Yeah it has nothing to do with tribalism and mysticism."

Not really, considering every civilization has its own versions of tribalism and mysticism.
 
2003-04-15 12:52:46 PM  
the dark ages ended in europe because of the knowledge transfer from africa due to the crusades and trade. egyptians were building pyramids and creating math while europeans lived in caves.

You cant trace any thing from the enlightenment directly to africa as far as I know. Philosophy, Arcatecture, Poetry, Music, anything. I could, perhaps, be wrong. I doubt it.
 
2003-04-15 12:53:52 PM  
04-15-03 12:50:49 PM Fink
Ivan don't serf


Ha ha.. no.. Ivan plays chess, hockey, and drinks.
IIvan kills Apollo Creed.
 
2003-04-15 12:54:13 PM  
GreyAlien-

"This is the 500,000th link and I saw someone say "donkey" in it for the 500,000th time and it was the 500,000th time it wasn't funny."

Come one GreyAlien- it was funny! HAHA! Yes, I say, HAHA! Type it with me now GreyAlien... LOL!

Oh yeah, and Fink is a genius too! Such clever posts. Really telling us how it is. Putting us in our place... so very clever. He gets a LOL! too. Uh yeah...
 
2003-04-15 12:54:55 PM  
Congrats Fark!
 
2003-04-15 12:54:56 PM  
"You cant trace any thing from the enlightenment directly to africa as far as I know. Philosophy, Arcatecture, Poetry, Music, anything. I could, perhaps, be wrong. I doubt it. "

Do a little research. You would find you are wrong.
 
2003-04-15 12:56:17 PM  
TheGrayCat :

got any examples?
 
2003-04-15 12:56:42 PM  
Weemill

No one is saying that slavery isn't a disgusting practice. My point is no one seems to recognize the context when discussing slavery. Some people act like America was the only country to practice it and never acknowledge that America was the only country to fight a war to end it. George Washington Carver and Fredrick Douglass weren't preaching victoomhood in late 1800's and early 1900's they cared and respected America and preached hardwork. Relaizing that the rattional businessmen will always hire the best workers and that the ones that don't will suffer. I find their stories so inspiring and courageous and now its a hundred years later and everyone is preaching victoomhood and reperations etc. I believe all men are equal and I don't think telling generation after generation of blacks that they need special favors to make it in this country is helping them at all. White condescention is worse than white racism. Shakedown artists like Jesse Jackson wouldn't have a job if blacks did succeed.
 
2003-04-15 12:57:48 PM  
Sonnyboy11 are you still mad about a previous spanking? I have yet to stand on your little pee pee today.
 
2003-04-15 12:58:50 PM  
Wow, what a huge leap to call that a racially motivated remark.

I think you're revealing a lot about yourself if you assume that quip was scandalous.
 
2003-04-15 12:58:52 PM  
Fink:

I got somthing for you.. ah there it is!

DONKEY!!!
 
2003-04-15 12:59:34 PM  
K-jack

that's not the point. Racism is practiced by people of all colors and will probabaly be practiced for a very long time. However it is not practiced by most people of either race and as long as government treats people as equals then that is fine.
 
2003-04-15 01:00:36 PM  
VROOM---
there is a big difference between thinking they do not have an equal footing, and accepting any blame for somthing you did not do. I refuse to accept responsibilty for others actions. they did it, blame them. This is not an oversimplification. the idea that the sins of your fathers can be passed down to his children is a large load of crap, and that is exactly what you are doing if you want me to accept blame, or feel bad for slavery. the only difference is there does not have to be a distinct blood relation, just a shared nationality. that is a load of crap.---

I'll raise a donke- err, drink to that!

Nice post vroom.

Yes, my ancestors on my mothers side were confederate slave owning bastards from missouri and mississippi. My fathers family was old skewl CA from 1849 and before that michigan and newyorkers who tried at bayonet point to kill my mothers ancestors.

Yes, white america had slaves. White america also rejected the practice as we westerners as a collective advanced and evolved in our thinking and in our morality, and we are continuing to advance in this direction. Times, people, and morality change.

Yes there is a lot of work to be done, noone's saying with a straight face that things are perfect or that true equality has been achieved. But we're on the way, undeniably, irrefutably headed in the right direction.

Saying that I should bear some blame for the actions of forefathers i've never met whose names i dont even know is absurd; its as ridiculous as saying the young Germans of today are responsible for the holocaust. Or saying that present day spain is literally responsible for the conquistadores brutal conquest (and subsequent unintentional depopulation through infectious diseases) of s.america and mexico.

No, we as a culture are not there yet, theres alot of hate and ignorance out there, but I think we as a society have done much of what can reasonably expect to be done to level the playing field and atone for previous wrongs.

Like vroom said,"there is a big difference between thinking they do not have an equal footing, and accepting any blame for somthing you did not do. I refuse to accept responsibilty for others actions. "

Bra-fvrkin'-vo.
 
2003-04-15 01:00:54 PM  
donkey?
 
2003-04-15 01:01:17 PM  
lol

lol!!

LOL!!!

ROFLMAO!!@@E^#$%~#@$#@^$$!@#

Aaah, I do feel better now.

PS-"eminent" should have been "imminent" in my last post. Give me a break, do you really think English is an alien's first language.
 
2003-04-15 01:01:25 PM  
So, in conclusion, "The O'Reilly Factor" would be better if someone randomly lept in front of the camera and screamed, "Donkey!"

Right?
 
2003-04-15 01:02:16 PM  
"Bill has been wonderful to these boys. He puts his money where his mouth is."

Where's that? Satan's cock? Eww, gross!


Now that's funny. Thanks Hagbardceline
 
2003-04-15 01:02:47 PM  
Not really, considering every civilization has its own versions of tribalism and mysticism.

Sure every culture has some elements but its the degree in which they're practiced that matters. Ideas change the course of history. They need to embrace reason and the rest will follow.
 
2003-04-15 01:03:27 PM  
WWWAAAHHHHOOOOO!!

Someone finally has the balls to say what everyone is thinking anyway!!!! GO BILL!!!!!
 
2003-04-15 01:03:36 PM  
500,000 and still kicking. Behold the power of Fark.
 
2003-04-15 01:04:48 PM  
04-15-03 11:24:25 AM Zipf
Self-deprecating humor is generally okay. Humor that targets others (children, minorities, etc) and plays on peoples' feelings of racial superiority may be branded as racist. Racism is so embedded in present-day thought, that "racial equality" is impossible - imagine meeting a black man and NOT noticing that he is black? What is possible is understanding and tolerance of our differences.

You may be right about present-day thought. However, I predict that in one hundred years, outwardly visible race politics will become irrelevant. There may still be pockets of racism in some backwater parts of the world, but those will be mere curiosities. With the development of the Internet, the cultures of the world are becoming homogenized, for better or worse. Interracial and homosexual relationships, once unthinkable, are commonplace, if not government-sanctioned. Once genetic screening is available at low cost, thoughtful parents will want to ensure the best possible traits for their children. Insurance companies will prefer those with genes that can be shown to have reduced risk for disease. Designer genes are "scary" in today's political climate, but I think that its scariness will wear off, and it will become standard. As much as the "people of color" may disagree, there is less real racism now than ever before. Look at us. We're picking apart a man who made a joke that can be interpreted as racist. We are not forcing blacks to the back of the bus or making them pick cotton or selling them. Currently, there is a great deal of political hay to be made of petty racism: jokes, affirmative action, etc. People like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton are still quite adept at making a living at racial polarization, but I do not believe that it will carry into the 22nd century.
 
2003-04-15 01:04:57 PM  
/me is waiting for the second enlightenment.

Who would think that the enlightened would still be settling their differences by throwing really fancy rocks at each other.
 
2003-04-15 01:05:25 PM  
Father Jack how good to see you!
 
2003-04-15 01:05:52 PM  
Father_Jack:

thankya sir.
 
2003-04-15 01:05:59 PM  
Vroomazoom: I would tend to agree.

However, slavery, Jim crow, sharecropping, etc., has instituted an inherent loathing for people of color. From blacks being viewed as criminals to monkeys, there is a negative view of everything black. Blacks are not on an equal footing because of this inherent mindview of many people, even amongst the black community.

I challenge everyone to have an open mind, and abolish all stereotypes about everyone else, because it is through these stereotypes and perceptions that racism continues to thrive.

Don't get me wrong here, or in my previous post. I don't often believe that white people, as a group, have some sort of 'white agenda,' (although i wouldn't doubt it for some)but i do believe that individual racism exists. Whether it is realized or not, i see it rear its head in reality all to often.

Whether its the japanese internment during wwII, improper arrest procedures on muslims within the past few years, racial profiling by cops, etc. racism does exist, and it's institutionalized. I wouldn't doubt many people here harbor racist p.o.v.'s, and have black,arabs,etc. as their best friends. Its this institutionalized racism that eats at the very fabric of the concept of America as a melting pot. "give us your tired your weary, as long as they're white." Also, i think race is important to many, b/c america doesn't have a nationist perspective. White, black, we're all mutts, and don't have much of a culture to cling to. and this, i believe helps to further discriminatory perspectives on both sides of the coin. I think blacks would like to have a little more opportunity to move up the social ladder, because whites, even poor, trailor living, hicks (read: kentuckian) have the opportunity to move up the social ladder. Its inner city blacks who have the hardest time moving up.

I hope my rant was readable, and i don't mind discussing this further by email. weemili at loyno dot edu

/rant
 
2003-04-15 01:06:15 PM  
How precious... this person is play acting that he/she is an Alien, isn't that cute. Okay, for the rest of the day, I'm gonna be a... Firetruck!!! yay wheeeee

wee woo wee wooo wee woo
 
2003-04-15 01:06:33 PM  
600,000 American died in the Civil War. Isn't that enough for reparations?
 
2003-04-15 01:06:37 PM  
I grew up with my parents telling me that I have to work twice as hard because I'm not white. Scarred me. Now I can't stop working hard. Damn them!
 
2003-04-15 01:06:59 PM  
Howdy vroom, objectivist, Father Jack.

Nice post vroom.
 
2003-04-15 01:08:44 PM  
Fink:

sorry that was not for you. you can keep it if you want, but if you could could you pass it over to GreyAlien for me? sorry bout that. my cut and paste skills are on par with a 2 year old.
 
2003-04-15 01:09:20 PM  
So, Do you want free shiat PopIcon88?
 
2003-04-15 01:09:44 PM  
Clearly, O'Riley is a thought-criminal. Only when he and his evil-thinking conservative breatheren are purged from our great society can we all be free.

And didn't we all just make our annual our reparations payment today...?
 
2003-04-15 01:10:10 PM  
or over instant messenger, since i'm at work and IM'ing is easier
 
2003-04-15 01:10:26 PM  
I've got enough from you Fink to last awhile Fink. Thanks.
 
2003-04-15 01:10:54 PM  
I challenge everyone to have an open mind, and abolish all stereotypes about everyone else

Does this include your perceptions that racism is still thriving?
 
2003-04-15 01:11:15 PM  
"600,000 American died in the Civil War. Isn't that enough for reparations?"

I thought the Civil War wasn't about slavery. That's what everyone here in NC screams whenever you mention the subject.
 
2003-04-15 01:11:38 PM  
Hey guys, I don't want to crap on your parade, but everyone should stop talking about slavery in the past tense. Slavery is still in common practice in Africa and Asia today. In fact, it is estimated that there are more slaves in bondage now than there have ever been throughout history.

Also, a few corrections. The Middle-East is in Asia not Africa. Also, the Egyptians were building those great pyramids with slave labor (oops).

You would do better to blame colonialism, rather than slavery, for the current situation in Africa right now. When England, France, Belgium, and others partitioned the various lands they took over, they did without regard to Ethnic or religious background, creating states like Nigeria with hundreds of ethnic groups and religions, many of who despise each other. Instant endless conflict. Yay.
 
2003-04-15 01:11:43 PM  
O'Reilly does worse than this on every show he's done. He's practically jumped outta his chair and biatch-slapped a few of his guests. This is a no-suprise non-issue...
 
2003-04-15 01:12:01 PM  
FINK---
How precious... this person is play acting that he/she is an Alien, isn't that cute. Okay, for the rest of the day, I'm gonna be a... Firetruck!!! yay wheeeee wee woo wee wooo wee woo---

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!

i just peed my pants. . .LMAO

crap i gotta meeting with a bunch marketing asshats in a while, and im gonna hafta do it with a big wetstain on my pants...

*nods to the locals* boys, nice to see you
 
2003-04-15 01:12:33 PM  
That's funny. My parents told me I only had to work half as hard in life because I'm white!
 
2003-04-15 01:13:06 PM  
How's it goin Bobert
 
2003-04-15 01:13:36 PM  
Vroom I have no use for a Donkey, I'll send it on down the road. Somebody will put it in some government funded, sensitivity trained, politically correct program and make it useless.
 
2003-04-15 01:13:48 PM  
If Chris Rock had said it, everyone would have laughed.

But Bill? No, he can't say that. Bill is white. Auto Racist Label.

Trent Lott, wasn't he in government? Bill? He just gives his opinion on a news channel.
 
2003-04-15 01:13:59 PM  
fink, can you be this fire truck? I like it.
 
2003-04-15 01:15:06 PM  
"Whether its the japanese internment during wwII, improper arrest procedures on muslims within the past few years, racial profiling by cops, etc. racism does exist, and it's institutionalized"

You forgot burning down the shop of a korean who opened a store in a black neighborhood.

I had a friend who got jumped by 3 black kids just because he was white. Didn't make the evening news though. Since only whites can be racist, it must not have been a hate crime.....

Phil Donahue says so.
 
2003-04-15 01:15:06 PM  
And when it's just a bunch of us white people on a bus, they pull out the hidden hours d'erves and cocktails, and play classical music.

/oldschool Eddie Murphy
 
2003-04-15 01:15:24 PM  
Vroomazoom:"TheGrayCat :

got any examples?"


I do:

Egyptian hieroglyphic script is recognized as one of the oldest written languages on Earth, predating anything in Eurpoe of similar complexity by several thousand years

These same people built a little engineering marvel I like to call the Pyramids, you may have heard of them.
 
2003-04-15 01:15:48 PM  
If people want to end racism they need to reject all this diversity crap and embrace individualism.
 
2003-04-15 01:16:35 PM  
K-jack Apparently you didn't read my post. I never said anything about Africans being stupid or less knowledgable. My post was in response to GreyAliens statement about the best and brightest of Africa being taken during slavery. I asked him what information he had to support this nothing more.
 
2003-04-15 01:16:55 PM  
"Also, the Egyptians were building those great pyramids with slave labor (oops). "

Actually, recent discoveries indicate that it wasn't slave labor used to build the pyramids. They've found a city for the workers, including housing units for families. Slaves wouldn't have had that luxury.
 
2003-04-15 01:16:59 PM  
I may have missed somthing, but it seems strange to me that the same people that rant that O'Riley is a poopyhead and should not say poopyhead things, are the same group of people that claim they are scared that the current administration is trying to reduce freedom of speech, and how bad it is, it seems like harmoniaesque, crap, double standard to me.
 
2003-04-15 01:17:01 PM  
 
2003-04-15 01:17:20 PM  
Mad Ogre

Nice post
 
2003-04-15 01:17:46 PM  
Sorry Pop, I wasn't implying anything.

eggshells = me walking on
 
2003-04-15 01:17:59 PM  
Hmm, my grasp of grammar is poor. Please mentally remove or add commas as necessary.

While I'm here, I also should point out that using Egypt as a shining example of Africa's past accomplishments is rather silly. They have long been racially and culturally seperate from most of the rest of Africa (due to invasions of various peoples) and had long held the "darker" Africans in contempt (and still do).

If you want a better example of the great civilizations of Africa, look to the Kush (granted, they took a lot from the Egyptians and others, but still they were very impressive), or the older Christian Kingdom of Ethiopia, one of the great naval powers of the world during the time of the Byzantine Empire (or even going back further, to the Biblical-era Ethiopian kingdom).
 
2003-04-15 01:19:03 PM  
I know I'm not racist. My distaste and contempt for my fellow humans transcends race, gender, and socioeconomic status. I'm an equal opportunity bastard.

(/funny)
 
2003-04-15 01:19:05 PM  
Objectivist:

But a group of individuals are harder to control, and dont' automatically polarize against eachother when it's convenient for our rulers. Which is why you can expect to see Jesse Jackson's and Abe Foxman's great-great-great grandchildren biatching about the same crap 200 years from now.
 
2003-04-15 01:20:07 PM  
Underwhelmed:

i was requesting a direct link between the enlightenment and africa. a language with a completely diffent base, and the piramids, wich offer no similarity to european arcitecture does not show a direct link, or causal effect. piramids were around in south america, and I guarantee they had no effect on european arcitecture during the enlightenment.
 
2003-04-15 01:20:59 PM  
Objectivist Did you even read my whole post? I have tried several times to throw off the notion that racism exists, and several more times, that notion has been brought to my attention, in harsher circumstances than Bill O'Reilly's quip. I have overheard, seen, and even fallen victim to racially motivated and biased statements. It gets harder to believe that racism doesn't exist when you're a victim of it. Ah, but there's the rub. White people, for the most part, do not fall victim to racism, but are the victimizers, and like i said in my previous post, in many times, they don't realize it. And with so many people who don't give a damn about what others think, I'm not surprised that they're not oftentimes introspective enough to realize their racist ways. Also, you mentioned a few blacks in the 1800's who believed in working hard. You apparently never read 'The Souls of Black folk,' by W.E.B. DuBois, or any other work of nonfiction literature by blacks during that era, or else you'd realize that there was GRAVE resentment towards whites about their treatment of blacks.
 
2003-04-15 01:21:48 PM  
Rockdrummer:

Late for a followup, but please explain to me how my comment was "absolute horseshiat." It was made in reference to the "switch" made by party members during the advent of civil rights legislation. The ideologies of political parties change quite often, a democrat in 1860 won't be the same as one in 1960, and both will differ from ones at present. At best, it's just a fruckin' name.
 
2003-04-15 01:22:02 PM  
but it seems strange to me that the same people that rant that O'Riley is a poopyhead and should not say poopyhead things, are the same group of people that claim they are scared that the current administration is trying to reduce freedom of speech, and how bad it is

Freedom of speech refers to governmental interference with your right to express yourself. O'Riley's right to say poopy head things is not in question. His legitimacy as a political correspondent might be.
 
2003-04-15 01:22:24 PM  
"current administration is trying to reduce freedom of speech, and how bad it is, it seems like harmoniaesque, crap, double standard to me."

You mean the same double standard Bill uses to scream at protestors to 'Shut up' while acting horrified when he's on the other side of the coin?
 
2003-04-15 01:24:21 PM  
Freedom of speech refers to governmental interference with your right to express yourself. O'Riley's right to say poopy head things is not in question. His legitimacy as a political correspondent might be

It's funny no one was saying this aboout Michael Moore.
 
2003-04-15 01:24:25 PM  
"600,000 American died in the Civil War. Isn't that enough for reparations?"

Even if the Civil War had been about slavery that's still irrelevant b/c 600k is a drop in the bucket compared to how many died in the middle passage alone.
 
2003-04-15 01:24:43 PM  
I am a white slave and it is important for you to know that I do not think I am owed anything. Sure, my plight is grim and my ancestors probably shouldn't have been lying around doin' shiat with their lives, but ya gotta let bygones be bygones. Focus on the positive: just like my forebears, I get to do a little drinking and dancing when the overlord's away, and I'm surrounded by some mighty fine women. 'Course, Monday rolls around all too soon and it's "yes Massa" this and "yes Massa" that all over again. But sheeit, that pride stuff's for my betters. Just gimme my NASCAR and my Bud and I'll be fine.
 
2003-04-15 01:25:16 PM  
Mr. Gumbopants

Are you saying it's OK to do if O'Riley does it?
 
2003-04-15 01:25:18 PM  
Gee, I'd like to learn more about "the great civilizations of Africa" but, what do you know, they didn't have a written language! Or an invention as sophisticated as the freaking wheel, for that matter.

I'm sick of all this PC historical revisionism that tries to equate backward savages with Europe during Renassaisance and Enlightenment.
 
2003-04-15 01:25:59 PM  
Anyone else notice that BOBERT's spelling has improved dramatically of late?

/observation.irrelevant
 
2003-04-15 01:26:23 PM  
O'Reilly rules and he destroys all who try to debate him.
 
2003-04-15 01:26:28 PM  
I think bringing up Clinton should invoke Godwin's law.

PS-It was TheGrayCat who said that, AbsolutBen.
 
2003-04-15 01:26:46 PM  
Say MrGumboPants, what exactly is wrong with O'Reilly's joke?
 
2003-04-15 01:26:48 PM  
White people, for the most part, do not fall victim to racism, but are the victimizers, and like i said in my previous post, in many times, they don't realize it

Well thanks to enlighten racists like you we now can realize it.
 
2003-04-15 01:27:13 PM  
objectivist

i don't claim that there are many per se racists out there. however, you forget the importance of perception. individuals are more comfortable with people they perceive to be like them. that creates the danger of maintaining a caste system in perpetuity because those in power are only comfortably sharing power with those they identify with. unfortunately, this seems to be human nature and applies to all groups. white males were reluctant to share power and access with blacks after slavery (see jim crow). they remained reluctant after brown (see segregationists).

i'm all for hard work. unfortunately when the system* dictates that no matter how hard you work, you won't benefit, you don't want to work as hard. as an objectivist, i'm sure you understand that. changing the rules of the game does not necessarily negate the reality of the system.

* by system i mean entire social/economic model, not just legal system.
 
2003-04-15 01:27:15 PM  
"It's funny no one was saying this aboout Michael Moore."

Yeah, right, no one said a THING about Michael Moore. No one mentioned him at all. No one ever questioned his abilities.

/sarcasm

Although I don't watch him, I'm sure Bill O'Riley had something to say about Moore on his program.
 
2003-04-15 01:27:16 PM  
What do ya say we make the next 500,000 boobies links?
 
2003-04-15 01:27:18 PM  
Father Jack,

Did I spell harmoniaesque right?
 
2003-04-15 01:28:02 PM  
TheGreyCat: Slavery was one of the causes of the Civil War. The reason why the states seceded was because they thought that Lincoln would ruin the South economically, possibly by freeing the slaves. I'm sure there's many other factors too like cultural and economics differences.
 
vid
2003-04-15 01:28:47 PM  
Okay, first of all let me say that I think Senator Lott's comment was, in fact, a racist remark. I know a lot of bigotted old men, and they all kind of speak in the same sort of round-about way when dissing the black man. It wasn't so much his words, but his cadence and inflection that had that familiar ring of "I'm talking about blacks without talking about blacks" that bigots frequently use.

That said, I am also almost positive that B O'R's comment was about groomsmen vandallizing cars. They were called the "Best Men" for fark's sake. It's not a particularilly clever joke, but then Bill's not a particularilly clever guy. When I read the article I was actually kind of puzzled about what the fuss was about until I read further and realized "oh... because the kids in the band happened to be black kids and people thought he meant they were theves because they were black. Huh... seems like kind of silly misunderstanding to me."

The guy raises a huge amount of money for inner city youth, and makes a joke which some people have chosen to belive had something to do with race (when it really, really didn't), and all the sudden he's made out to be David Duke or Senator Boyd. He may not be the sharpest knife in the drawer, but I've never seen him do or say anything to indicate that he has a problem with black people.

Chill, people. It was a joke about swiping the hubcaps off "just married" cars. Nothing more to see here.
 
2003-04-15 01:29:35 PM  
04-15-03 12:50:31 PM TheGrayCat
"Um, do you have any facts to support this statement? Was there some kind of test someone had to pass before they could qualify to be a slave? I was under the impression they just grabbed whoever was available. Also, i've never owned any slaves but if it was me I wouldn't want the most intelligent people as slaves."

No, you would want really dumb people to, basically, run your plantation. I mean, it's only your living.


Granted you wouldn't want Forrest Gump running your plantation but you wouldn't want Einstein doing it either.
 
2003-04-15 01:29:45 PM  
Father Jack:

i will say his spelling as impoved quite a bit. I think we owe it all to you. donkey to you sir.
 
2003-04-15 01:29:55 PM  
The unshakable fact is that you cannot cure racism with racism. To accept the diversity premise means to think in racial terms rather than in terms of individual character or merit. Taking jobs away from one group in order to compensate a second group to correct injustices caused by a third group who mistreated a fourth group at an earlier point in history (e.g., 1860) is absurd on the face of it. and does not promote justice, rather, it does the opposite. Singling out one group for special favors breeds justified resentment and fuels the prejudices of real racists. People are individuals they are not interchangeable ciphers in an amorphous collective.
 
2003-04-15 01:31:33 PM  
TheGrayCat, actually, I haven't read much of the new work they are doing. That being said, and having not read what you are referencing, merely having housing for families does not indicate whether slavery was used one way or another.

If you look at the way slaves have historically been treated, all over the world, quite a few cultures have allowed slaves to have families and housed the families together. Now, maybe there was more to the housing discovery (ie lavish housing or something). Also remember, when dealing with some cultures, the difference between peasant and slave was virtually nill. They could be killed at anytime, couldn't own property, and had no choice in their activities. Sounds like slavery to me. I suppose that if you could show the workers were sent back to their farms (or wherever) after the work had been completed, then you can make a claim for "workers" over "slaves".
 
2003-04-15 01:31:44 PM  
(e.g., 1860)

What about the 1960's?
 
2003-04-15 01:31:57 PM  
04-15-03 01:26:28 PM GreyAlien
I think bringing up Clinton should invoke Godwin's law.

PS-It was TheGrayCat who said that, AbsolutBen.

Oops, and me chastinsing someone for not reading a post and I screw up the name of the postee. I think I need more coffee.
 
2003-04-15 01:32:08 PM  
"Gee, I'd like to learn more about "the great civilizations of Africa" but, what do you know, they didn't have a written language! Or an invention as sophisticated as the freaking wheel, for that matter. "

Glad to see you believe that heroes such as Nero & Caligula were "civilized". I guess we can discount hierogliphics as a written language while we're at it.
 
2003-04-15 01:33:05 PM  
Abdul, I had two posted today! A good day!
 
2003-04-15 01:33:35 PM  
i take credit for two of those links!
 
2003-04-15 01:34:06 PM  
Reparations are a way to take money from those who never owned slaves, and give it to people who never were slaves.

Forgot who said that, but it's right on.

And the civil war was about slavery. It was the defining difference between the N. and S., economically and socially. And even the framers knew it was a huge issue. Stude the Virginia Compromise and the Lincoln Douglas debates. Don't just know what they were, read them and understand the politics behind them. Also, study the evolution of states rights between 1830 and 1860. Then try and say it wasn't about slavery.
 
2003-04-15 01:34:42 PM  
04-15-03 12:56:42 PM Objectivist
No one is saying that slavery isn't a disgusting practice. My point is no one seems to recognize the context when discussing slavery. Some people act like America was the only country to practice it and never acknowledge that America was the only country to fight a war to end it.

04-15-03 01:06:33 PM Lucidavid
600,000 American died in the Civil War. Isn't that enough for reparations?

It seems that revisionist history is making its way into the mainstream again. Let us discuss the context of slavery as it pertains to the American Civil War.

North wavered on slavery - Carole E. Scott, professor emeritus of business administration at the State University of West Georgia (Atlanta Journal-Constitution)

Although he did not approve of slavery, President Lincoln considered blacks inferior to whites. Whites and blacks, he believed, could not coexist in equality. His pre-war solution to this problem was to return them to Africa.

In his first inaugural address, Lincoln assured the nation that he neither wished to nor had the power to abolish slavery.

In an 1862 letter to New York newspaper editor Horace Greeley, Lincoln wrote: "My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and it is not either to save or destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave, I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union."

According to some foreign observers, Lincoln's motivation for preserving the Union was financial. English writer Charles Dickens said, "The Northern onslaught upon slavery was no more than a piece of specious humbug designed to conceal its desire for economic control of the Southern states."

Just as eliminating slavery may not have been the North's prime motivation, the fact that late in the war, Confederate soldiers successfully petitioned their Congress and president to allow the enlistment in the army of slaves who would be promised their freedom suggests that preserving slavery may not have been the most important reason for the Southern states fighting for their independence.
 
2003-04-15 01:35:02 PM  
04-15-03 01:29:55 PM Objectivist


Well stated!!
 
2003-04-15 01:35:17 PM  
">Fink as a fire truck
 
2003-04-15 01:36:11 PM  
You bigots disgust me.

/Black man.
 
2003-04-15 01:36:27 PM  
"Granted you wouldn't want Forrest Gump running your plantation but you wouldn't want Einstein doing it either. "

Why not? You OWNED him. You could take advantage of his intelligence. And even if he thought of a way to escape, it would be difficult for him to get to a safe location, since he was black. He stood out. Blacks travelling alone would be questioned. Chances are he would be caught. If he got "too smart" you could simply sell him to another owner.
 
2003-04-15 01:36:42 PM  
fark fark fark!!!

fark html. fark it in the arse.

">

last try then i quit.
 
2003-04-15 01:37:16 PM  
The 1960s... awesome!!! The Kinks, The Seeds, The Sonics, Love, The Music Machine, ? and the Mysterions, mini skirts, Go-Go boots... the 60s were fabulous!!
 
2003-04-15 01:37:52 PM  
In other news:
Upon hearing O'Reilley's gaffe, a delighted Jesse Helms popped a stiffy.
 
2003-04-15 01:38:21 PM  
Oh yeah, happy 500,000th Fark
 
2003-04-15 01:38:44 PM  
Objectivist: "perputuate the myth that they don't have a chance in society because everyone is against them (African Americans)."

Right it's a myth that blacks are routinely discriminated against when applying for jobs, looking for housing, applying for loans, waving down cabs, or simply taking cell phones out of their pockets at night. I'll stop perputating (sic) that myth right away.
 
2003-04-15 01:39:06 PM  
Objectivist: You are fortunate enough not to have experienced real racism. If you think affirmative action even remotely compensates for the amount of jobs minorities are excluded from there's a lot you have to learn.
 
2003-04-15 01:39:26 PM  
THERE'S DROINTHEWIND!!!!!

And I bet he'd be surprised that we'll probably agree on many issues in this thread. But he'll still find a way to denounce me as a bigot in 3, 2, 1...
 
2003-04-15 01:39:27 PM  
DRO, go away you wierdo.

No one is intrested in your nonsense today.
 
2003-04-15 01:39:49 PM  
So now I'm racist? Geez.

I hate affirmative action, but the fact is, its the only levelling tool minorities have. And i, for one, am sick of the excuse that blacks are the predominate recipients of it. White women, my friend, have been, and are, the predominate minority recipients of affirmative action. So affirmative action debates are out of the window, IMHO. When will whites understand that White Priviledge isn't just a vague term, but actually exists. The Eddie Murphy SNL skit was a gross exaggeration of a harsh truth. Women hit the glass ceiling in their careers all the time. The white male, like i said, is the keeper of the power structure in the US. And until that power structure is shared by women and minorities, affirmative action should exist.
 
2003-04-15 01:39:54 PM  
"TheGrayCat, actually, I haven't read much of the new work they are doing. That being said, and having not read what you are referencing, merely having housing for families does not indicate whether slavery was used one way or another. "

This was a full city with markets and tradesman (i.e. tailors, cobblers, furniture makers, etc.). A slave wouldn't have money to buy shoes or furniture, it would have to be provided by his master. It also had a graveyard. Slaves weren't buried.
 
2003-04-15 01:40:06 PM  
I was gonna say something about the nihilarian lifestyle, but instead, I'll just congratulate the Fark bunch. Both the dictators and the paeions deserve a pat on the back.

(nihilarian, of which I am one, is a word; paeions may not be, I dont know)
 
2003-04-15 01:40:26 PM  
And what is a Dro, and how is it in the wind? And is it anything like something in the woodpile?

/just curious
 
2003-04-15 01:41:02 PM  
"Say MrGumboPants, what exactly is wrong with O'Reilly's joke?"

It is in bad taste to imply that the poor children you are ostensibly there to support are off stealing things. That, regardless of the race issue, is a stupid, dumb thing to say in front of a crowd of people. The racial element just aggravates it, considering the long and storied history between cultural conservatives and the civil rights movement.
 
2003-04-15 01:41:43 PM  
The Kinks, The Seeds, The Sonics, Love, The Music Machine, ? and the Mysterions, mini skirts, Go-Go boots... the 60s were fabulous!!

Of course I was referring to the civil rights movement, but don't forget about the Doors, they stand up well to the test of time.
 
2003-04-15 01:42:14 PM  
Fink as a fire truck?

i dont care if its not funny any more. i just want my link to work. WAAAAAAAAWAAAAAAAAA
 
2003-04-15 01:42:22 PM  
the dark ages ended in europe because of the knowledge transfer from africa due to the crusades and trade. egyptians were building pyramids and creating math while europeans lived in caves.

And the Galactica showed up with the rest of the Colonial convoy and we learned of our elders from the planet Cobalt....!

Remember when debating logical points of History with the Afrocentric: people of sub-Saharan Africa, at least those of primarily sub-Saharan African descent living in the United States, like to claim the culture of all of Africa (including what is now the Middle East) as theirs.

Thus anything the Egyptians, Arabs, etc. did at any time is their "property"...well that is what they would have you believe. So sub-Saharan Africans built the Pyramids, Cleopatra was of sub-Saharan African descent, the Greeks stole their civilization from sub-Saharan Africans, Algebra was invented by sub-Saharan Africans, etc.

Of course anyone who isn't trying to usurp historical relevance knows that is bullshiite. The Egyptians were a collection of peoples, primarily Caucasians, but also people of sub-Saharan African descent at times (it is also noteable that Ancient Egyptians didn't think in terms of race per se) and the Pyramids were not designed and built by sub-Saharan Africans. Cleopatra was the direct descendent of a Greek general that followed Alexander the Great. Speaking of the Greeks, they developed their own civilization thank you, though they were influenced through trade with the Egyptians at various times. For that matter the Greeks influenced the Egyptians as well. As for who invented Algebra--sorry that was the Arabs, who built on work by the Greeks, who invented Geometry. It was the English that gave us Calculus (blame them for your headaches).

--h
 
2003-04-15 01:42:59 PM  
Objectivist
Does this include your perceptions that racism is still thriving?

Racism thriving in America? NEVER!!

Just look at the composition of the government for proof.
 
2003-04-15 01:43:03 PM  
objectivist

you can't use the year slavery ended as your benchmark for equality. at best you can use 1954, if not 1964.

your argument has a logical flaw. an analogy: two runners, A & B, in a race. the rules dictate that runner A get beaten for the duration of the race. sometime during the race, the rules are changed so that runner A no longers has to suffer beatings. in one sense, you now have equality because the rules are the same for both runners. in another sense you don't because B gained a large lead because of the earlier rules. in this scenario, what is justice? what is fair? granted, over time, the relative distance between A and B shortens, but when does the gap become insignificant? i mean these as rhetorical questions, but they are all relevant in the discussion.
 
2003-04-15 01:43:15 PM  
Nagasaki

We could go back and forth all day quoting different individuals that said it was about slavery or it wasn't. I believe Lincoln thought it was wrong and wanted to end it. He also didn't want to lose the country in the process. Thomas Jefferson even thought slavery was wrong and wanted it put in the Declaration but many were against it because they knew Georgia and South Carolina wouldn't go for it. I think if America wasn't so young at the time slavery would have ended sooner but they viewed founding and keeping America together as more important.
 
2003-04-15 01:43:50 PM  
Objectivist

Does this include your perceptions that racism is still thriving?

I don't know how it's doing in So Cal., but it sure is hanging on here in Texas. For example, I've heard businessmen say that they won't hire hispanics. However, the impact of this kind of racism is, in my opinion, small. When this is the case, hispanics start their own businesses and are many times more successful. But that doesn't mean the racism doesn't exist, just that it's a much more mild form than many years ago, because at least the opportunities are now there for those willing to step out and grab them. My contention isn't that minorities shouldn't have to work, but that it shouldn't have to be any harder for them to succeed than for whities like me. However, I believe this is a matter of changing peoples' feelings about race, not about getting the government involved.

I absolutely agree with you that emphasis on diversity for the sake of diversity is a little ludicrous, and that the ideal is that each individual is respected for who they are without being lumped into any group. It happens all the time though, and not just to minorities - whether it's not hiring someone because they are black, openly gay, or because they dress like a punk, you're still making assumptions about the person that may or may not turn out to be true.
 
2003-04-15 01:45:19 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND

You bigots disgust me.


its funny because he is a bigot.
 
2003-04-15 01:46:01 PM  
Dro In The Wind: I have another question for you.

I went to high school with a white supremacist bastard from S. Africa whose family left after Aparteid ended because of the blacks taking control of the government. My question is this:

Who is more properly designated an African American? You, or the white supremacist bastard who has actually been to Africa. He was born there, after all. How many generations do you have to go back to find someone who has been to Africa, much less being born there?
 
2003-04-15 01:46:36 PM  
"And until that power structure is shared by women and minorities, affirmative action should exist."

Cool, so when I don't get a job because of my skin color you can come over and explian to the kids that they have to live on the street to make the world a better place for everyone but them.

Its not some nameless faceless program, its peoples lives that are affected.

The better candidate should get the job or its just another form of welfare.
 
2003-04-15 01:46:59 PM  
Vroom: Excellent post on Dro. I see you sold out and went Total Fark.

Trying to make up for that high Fark number?
 
2003-04-15 01:47:47 PM  
Kpar90 - You know I had to get me some of this. If we agree, that's great. I'm not in a position to denounce anyone as anything.

"What is Dro and how is it in the Wind?"

I guess you'd probably call it a "420" reference. Remember, I'm a liberal hippie.

Bobert - You can suck me sideways. You're no longer acknowledged.
 
2003-04-15 01:48:05 PM  
K-jack

I didn't say everything was equal in 1860. I used that year because slavery is what everyone is talking about and that is why people want reperations etc. I know there wasn't equality then but that doesn't negate the point of the post.
 
2003-04-15 01:48:24 PM  
K-jack :

your runner analogy is flawed. it asumes that the same 2 people are running. the people still "running" today are the same people that were beaten at the "begining of the race" that is not the case.
 
2003-04-15 01:48:48 PM  
In Australia, do black people call themselves African Australians?

In Africa, are they African Africans?

I've always wondered if this is strictly an American phenomenom.
 
2003-04-15 01:49:09 PM  
Objectivist: Don't forget about Virginia, who had more people than any other state if you counted slaves, but not if you didn't. Hence, the Virginia Compromise, a cornerstone of our constitution. Without pandering to the slave states, our constitution would not be what it is.

We're agreeing, but you left that part out...
 
2003-04-15 01:49:45 PM  
shut....up

I don't condone that type of action, at all. But you have to understand the circumstances. It is usually reactionary, and done by the poor, and sometimes ignorant. I don't classify joe bob pigfarker with thirston Jowles, III, rich guy who owns half the planet. That's the inherent flaw w/ a lot of racism, you take the worst examples(not you particularly) and claim an entire group of people are that way. The problem is that white people in power do this, and it doesn't allow for vertical mobility by minorities because of a negative stigma.
 
2003-04-15 01:49:48 PM  
Absolutben
I didn't read all 200+ posts so maybe this has already been said but just in case it hadn't. No where in this story does it say they were black kids. All it said was they are inner city kids. You just assumed they were black because they were inner city. Who's being racist now?


I SUPPOSE there could be white kids at an inner-city Washington (???) dinner. And I SUPPOSE that those kids could be doing an impression of the Four Tops. And I SUPPOSE Bill O'Reilly would have said the same thing had they been white kids. But I wouldn't bet on it. And neither would you.
 
2003-04-15 01:50:18 PM  
"Just look at the composition of the government for proof."

Bushes cabinet:
15 memebers.
7 minorities (including women)
8 whites
 
2003-04-15 01:50:25 PM  
"I'm not in a position to denounce anyone as anything."

I guess we'll just ignore the threads where you denounced me as a racist and a bigot. Thanks for the clarification.
 
2003-04-15 01:51:11 PM  
Kpar90:

i have had total fark for about a month. wanted to check it out. I dont have much use for it. I like to discuss articles, and all the fun discussions are on fark, not total fark.
 
2003-04-15 01:51:23 PM  
Kpar90 -"Dro, [who is truly the African-American]".

I don't care. Do you think Black people stay up at night worried about that kind of nonsense. Do me a favor and re-read your post. Do you see how juvenile that is? Just don't call us attractive and successful African-American.
 
2003-04-15 01:51:29 PM  
shut......up

So are student loans, but you don't complain then, when the welfare helps you out there.
 
2003-04-15 01:51:42 PM  
Does anyone else find it ironic that K-Jack, explained a logical flaw with an analogous argument?
 
2003-04-15 01:52:40 PM  
Shut........UP
"Just look at the composition of the government for proof."

Bushes cabinet:
15 memebers.
7 minorities (including women)
8 whites


That's a start, now figure in the members of Congress and the House of Representatives.
 
2003-04-15 01:52:41 PM  
04-15-03 01:48:48 PM GreyAlien


Are honkeys from South Africa that move here also called "African-Americans?"
 
2003-04-15 01:52:54 PM  
"Who is more properly designated an African American? You, or the white supremacist bastard who has actually been to Africa. He was born there, after all. How many generations do you have to go back to find someone who has been to Africa, much less being born there?"

Mmf. This is totally meaningless except in a really empty, rhetorical sense.

When we say 'African-Americans', we all *know* who we mean even if you pretend not to.

We don't mean:

1st generation African immigrants
Jamaican guys
Black guys from England


We do mean:

American descendents of african slaves.


Which is why it's a confusing term. We should call them Acre-and-Mule-ites or something.

By the way: this is why I'm largely in favor of refering to people as their skin color. I can't tell if you're from India or Pakistan, and I don't want to offend you, so I should be allowed to say 'Brown'. I also can't tell Koreans and Chinese apart, but 'Asian' refers to a shiatload of people that aren't really yellow.
 
2003-04-15 01:53:08 PM  
I'm not in a position to denounce anyone as anything

hahahaha.

you forgot "and im a bigot"
 
2003-04-15 01:53:47 PM  
"So are student loans"

I wasn't aware they had to pay back welfare.
 
2003-04-15 01:54:05 PM  
Hdhale

Let's make sure all historical accuracies or known

Remember when debating logical points of History with the Eurocentric:
people of America, at least those of primarily European descent living in the United States, like to claim the foundation of all of America was for all people. However it only applied to the white male.
 
2003-04-15 01:54:17 PM  
Bukharin:

are white people from the U.S. that move to africa "african americans"?
 
2003-04-15 01:54:18 PM  
PS-It's pretty lame to include women as minorities.
 
vid
2003-04-15 01:54:44 PM  
There is no question that it sucks to live with the kind of treatment blacks in America live with. I'll never forget the first time I saw a black man trying to hail a cab on a downtown street at night.

At the same time, there are many other minority groups (mainly immigrants or children of immigrants) in the US who face many of the same race discrimination issues, but manage to find success and prosperity.

When looking at the contrast between blacks in America and various immigrant minorities, one is left to conclude that the myriad programs which have been put in place in order to improve conditions for black Americans have actually been shockingly counterproductive.
 
2003-04-15 01:54:54 PM  
Racism thriving in America? NEVER!!

Just look at the composition of the government for proof.


We just ended what amounts to a race-based slavery system about 138 years ago. Official segregation ended about 38 years ago. The current generation under the age of 18 is less race concious, less prejudice, than any generation in American history. There is less prejudice in this country than in countries many years longer in existence than ours.

We are not perfect. We cannot guarantee purity of thought, because a system that would guarantee purity of thought would be so revolting to Americans so as to cause us to destroy it in search of liberty. Perhaps we ask for your patience in this matter, but I am not so inclined.

--h
 
2003-04-15 01:55:01 PM  
woo woo!
 
2003-04-15 01:55:04 PM  
Dro:

What's up with the "/black man" thing? What are you dividing into? Or is it a fill in the blank thing, like "rich man/poor man"?
 
2003-04-15 01:55:14 PM  
"That's a start, now figure in the members of Congress and the House of Representatives"

Umm, those are ELECTED. Or do you want a quota system for democraticaly elected representatives?
 
2003-04-15 01:55:15 PM  
Vroomazoom
your runner analogy is flawed. it asumes that the same 2 people are running. the people still "running" today are the same people that were beaten at the "begining of the race" that is not the case.

Do you fail to see how wealth, financial stability, and education levels are highly correlated from one generation to the next and how this is a major factor in one's ability to run this "race"?

Do you believe that the impediments to running were not removed in 1860, but that real progress in civil rights was only made between 1955 and 1965, approximately 40 years ago?
 
2003-04-15 01:55:21 PM  
04-15-03 01:51:23 PM DROxINxTHExWIND

What I find juvenile is when black people insist on being called African American despite never having been there, or why they have to make up some BS festival of the harvest that just so happens to coincide with Christmas in order to drum up support for their "heritage." Either you have it or you don't. No need to invent Kwanzaa, or go around demanding reparations despite the fact that you were never a slave.

/speaking in broad terms, not specifically about you, but if you come on her and post "/Black man" you should be prepared to defend black people. I'll defend all Texans, after all.
 
2003-04-15 01:55:26 PM  
Shortbusdriver

I think their will always be some predjudices in this world. I think that to expect it to never exist is unrealistic. People have to make value judgements to live and some people will be irrational and make judgements on skin color or gender or sexual preference etc. What I reject is the notion that it is impossible to be black in America and succeed and that Affirmative Action and diversity will just lead to more racism, the only difference is that it might be practiced against a different group. that's why I think these guys like Jesse Jackson are racist. They're not against racism. They're just against racism practiced by whites.
 
2003-04-15 01:55:40 PM  
"Bushes cabinet:
15 memebers.
7 minorities (including women)
8 whites"

Why are you including women in the minorities? Since we make up 51% of the population, I don't see how we are a minority. Are you just trying to up the number?
 
2003-04-15 01:56:07 PM  
"I wasn't aware they had to pay back welfare."

It's the low interest that's welfare, not the cash itself.
 
2003-04-15 01:56:27 PM  
How about pell grants, then, shut.......up.
Financial Aid is a form of welfare, cut and dry.
 
2003-04-15 01:56:29 PM  
Look, how cute, Dro is trying to participate in a grown-up conversation.

Don't be discouraged Dro, You will be making sense in no time.

/Doesn't actualy belive Dro will ever make sense.
 
2003-04-15 01:57:07 PM  
Vroomazoom - "You forget, I'm a bigot".

I didn't forget you are a bigot. I'm just acting like an adult. If you'd like to label and call names find someone else. ou know what you are.
 
2003-04-15 01:57:14 PM  
Here's a game for all you white bashers:

Black Man 2
 
2003-04-15 01:57:19 PM  
There should never be reparations for slavery. Why? Because I'd have to pay in part and my family wasn't even in this country at the time. Screw you Jesse Jackson. I'm not white. I come from an ex-British colony. My country was pretty farking raped of resources, but the cure is not to biatch about it. You want to fight for equal footing. Go right ahead. I don't discriminate and never will. However, if you want me to pay up for something I literally had no part in, you can kiss my @ss.

BTW, I don't realize the significance of the discussion about contributions originating from Africa. What does that prove? That they were more enlightened? Wrong. Fact remains we all have ancestors that were exploited and others that did exploit others. Nobody's family tree is clean so get off your high horse. All that matters is how YOU behave. If you don't discriminate or exploit others (oh and that includes discrimination against whites too though it is not as widespread), then you have no reason to feel shame or guilt.

BTW, the concept of the number zero originated in the Indian subcontinent and was carried over to Europe via the Middle Eastern countries. Oh, and for the person above that doesn't realize it, the Middle East is in Asia.
 
2003-04-15 01:57:46 PM  
"Since we make up 51% of the population, I don't see how we are a minority. Are you just trying to up the number?"

Ahhh, good to know you don't claim women have suffered from the evils of white men.

Good then you can stop biatching about glass ceilings and all-boys clubs.
 
2003-04-15 01:58:40 PM  
Weemill: "When will whites understand that White Priviledge isn't just a vague term, but actually exists."

Finally, after only 500000 links an intelligent comment is made on fark.
 
2003-04-15 01:59:12 PM  
Dro says "I'm just acting like an adult."

I say you need acting lessons.
 
2003-04-15 01:59:23 PM  
Maybe it is just me, but I don't get the uproar over what was obviously intended to be a JOKE. The only similarity to the whole T. Lott thing is race and that is all. T. Lott's comments were stating that he believed the USA would be better if old man Strom had been elected(implying that segregation is good), which is not a JOKE in any way and he was punished accordingly.
For those of you with reading comprehension issues, I did not say that the joke was a good joke or in good taste, with today's racial climate it was obviously in very bad taste. However, like the article states, he puts his money where his mouth is and supports inner city kids with more money than some farkers will earn in a life time.
/that is all, move along and remove your skivies for Naomi!
 
2003-04-15 01:59:38 PM  
"Ahhh, good to know you don't claim women have suffered from the evils of white men.

Good then you can stop biatching about glass ceilings and all-boys clubs."

No, since gender discrimination has nothing to do with the number of women there are in the country.

Try again.
 
2003-04-15 01:59:57 PM  
objectivist

yes, it does negate the point of your post. you say that slavery is too far removed from the present to justify affirmative action (you did say jobs). however, you can't base that argument on the end of slavery. at the very least you have to base it on the 1954 brown decision. there are many reasons to oppose programs such as affirmative action, saying we are too far removed from the cause of the perceived underlying problems is not one of them.
 
2003-04-15 02:00:47 PM  
Franky17:

I do agree with you, I just dont think that analogy is fair. It has 2 people running, and an anonymous 3 party doing the beating. that is not what happened.
 
2003-04-15 02:00:58 PM  
Objectivist:

Do you really believe that Jefferson was against slavery? Throughout his life he owned HUNDREDS of slaves! As for Lincoln, I thinks its pretty obvious that he coopeted the slavery issue to try to help imbue the north with a feeling of moral justification. It's a common trick that's used to keep fighting spirits up(see Gulf War I & II)
 
2003-04-15 02:00:59 PM  
Mr GumboPants: You are completely evading the question. Many black people insist that Africa is part of their heritage. So some black guy from England is the same as some black guy from the US. Neither are African. And since when does a continent define ones identity? I'm not European-American. I'm American. If black people want to be African, they are welcome to move there. They are also welcome to stay, but why use such a devisive term? THey aren't trying to invoke their heritage, they're trying to set themselves apart. And while they are not always mutually exclusive, they are trying to make them so. You can be black and an American. You are no less who you are than if you demand that you are still in some sense African.

Again, a white supremacist from S. Africa is more African-American that almost any black person I know.
 
2003-04-15 02:01:56 PM  
TheGrayCat,

you have been led into a dilemma. its a shame your poor debate skills will dilute your reasonable position.
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:02:47 PM  
There's a very powerful social stratum in our society. Even I, being in the most "powerful" group, young white male, can recognise the unfairness of our society.

It's not just against blacks, but they are surely discriminated against. Sure, reparations is a terrible idea, the very name alone obviously does nothing more than drag up the spectre of past grudges, and inflict them on a present people for a new reason.

But our country is unfair, and we are blind to it because people only see their own class, the people they associate with, and not the millions in poverty. How many people who can afford a computer and net access are going to spend much of their time in an impovershed slum?

Sure, not every black person in the United States is poor. Not every white person makes 95k a year, but you have to look at the trends. African americans, relative to population, are 3 times as likely to be impovershed. Inner city populations vastly outstrip employment, single mothers head 50% of poor families. Poverty and unfairness in our state don't fall on individuals, they fall on environments and situations. We have arguably abolished a caste system of slavery, but we still have a class system very much in force, and it is reinforced every day by our individualism and the fact that we mingle only in our own class, by and large.
 
2003-04-15 02:03:17 PM  
Objectivist
The unshakable fact is that you cannot cure racism with racism. To accept the diversity premise means to think in racial terms rather than in terms of individual character or merit.

True. But nobody is suggesting that. What you have misunderstood Objectivist that:

1. In the present-day, social racial differentiation is unavoidable - have you ever met a Mexican man, and then forgot he was Mexican? Studies show people will discriminate unfavorably toward people with black-sounding names.

2. Racial differentiation does not have to be bad or racist.

Taking jobs away from one group in order to compensate a second group to correct injustices caused by a third group... Singling out one group for special favors breeds justified resentment and fuels the prejudices of real racists.

Failure to correct for racism will encourage the worldview that racism is correct. One of the most important points is that racism is inexorably tied to superiority. Racists are racists. Your idea of "justified resentment" is a red-herring. Without affirmative action, the racists would still hold their views as justified because there would be no policy to counter it.

People are individuals they are not interchangeable ciphers in an amorphous collective.

WTF?
 
2003-04-15 02:03:50 PM  
"No, since gender discrimination has nothing to do with the number of women there are in the country.
Try again."

Don't be that stupid. Minorities in this case, and in terms of the discussion, has been non-whites. white women do not make up 51% of the population.
 
2003-04-15 02:03:52 PM  
As a side note - why does the U. Mich (a public school, I believe) have to defend it's desire to generate a "diverse" student body by giving points to people of different ethnicities (it also weights people from under-represented parts of the state differently, also in the name of diversity) but it doesn't have to defend how it weights peoples applications based on whether their parents went to school there and if their parents are likely to donate money to the school.
 
2003-04-15 02:04:42 PM  
the fact that late in the war, Confederate soldiers successfully petitioned their Congress and president to allow the enlistment in the army of slaves who would be promised their freedom suggests that preserving slavery may not have been the most important reason for the Southern states fighting for their independence.

My ass. All it suggested was the south was desperate, which they were. Besides, it says freeing slaves to fight in the war, not ending slavery. Slavery would still be there. No, the civil war was not fought to end slavery - the North wasn't the aggressor. It was fought to ensure slavery would persist.
 
2003-04-15 02:05:00 PM  
Actually, term designations aren't really important, IMHO. And insofar as Kwanzaa is concerned, I'm not really sure how many of my 'African-American' friends partake in that festival. I, for one, do not subscribe to the notion that we have to tie ourselves back to our long forgotten roots in Africa, and i know lots of people who follow the same premise. African-American, black, whatever, just treat us equally, and there'd be no need for racial resentmen either way. But that'd take too much introspection on the part of both sides of the issue, to realize, maybe race isn't as important a factor after all, and maybe i'm not THAT oppressed after all. But people are always going to perceive that blacks are somehow dangerous, or violent, or ignorant. Just like people are always going to assume that boys should know more about science, while leaving girls out in the cold in our classrooms. Granted, America has come a long way, but look at the content of these posts. They're all so filled w/ conjecture and stereotypes by 'educated' whites and others, that it'll be a long time coming before equality is found.
 
2003-04-15 02:05:02 PM  
So are student loans, but you don't complain then, when the welfare helps you out there.

I don't know about you but I have to pay my student loan back..
 
2003-04-15 02:05:45 PM  
"When will whites understand that White Priviledge isn't just a vague term, but actually exists."

But only if you know the secret handshake. Itw why all white have jobs and make 200k a year.

/people get dumber and dumber.
 
2003-04-15 02:06:13 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND :

if your going to quote me, cut and paste. you dont need to lie about what i said to make a point. You come in here and state that you dont like bigots, then let us know your race. the implicit reason that can be deduced from that action is that your race has some effect on either your right to make that statement, or the way it "should" be percieved. I personally dont care what race you are, your statements should hold the exact same weight, and anyone should have the exact same right to say anything. any deviation from this is wrong, and a deviation from this along racial lines is racist. if you are racist, you are a bigot. your statment emplies that you sir, are a bigot.

if you could quote anything that i have said that could emply that i am a bigot, please, let me know, otherwise drop your name calling and discuss like a rational person.
 
2003-04-15 02:06:15 PM  
K-jack

You missed the point of the post which is you can't fight racism with racism. You keep harping over the year. The point of that post is that shifting discrimination from one group to another is not the answer. the basis is not that we are too removed from the cause. the basis is racism is racism.
 
2003-04-15 02:06:52 PM  
Kpar90 - "[you can defend Black people, I'd defend Texans]."

First, there is a reason that we would need to "invent" a culture. It's called SLAVERY. OUR rich heritage was stolen. The reason you know that Great-Grandma Moses came to America from the caves of Europe in 1700 is because your Great Grandmother was not torn from her land to live as a slave. She came over herself because she needed to run from the EUROPEAN White oppressors.

As far as drumming up support for a holiday, if you don't believe in it, don't celebrate. Grow up.
 
2003-04-15 02:07:52 PM  
04-15-03 01:54:17 PM Vroomazoom
Bukharin:
are white people from the U.S. that move to africa "african americans"?


I'm not sure,
but those North American-South Africans should be lynched.
They are thieves and liars.
I bet they rape their fathers too.
 
2003-04-15 02:08:23 PM  
Vroomazoom
are white people from the U.S. that move to africa "african americans"?

No, they're American Africans.


Shut........UP
Umm, those are ELECTED.

What are you trying to say? That popular elections where the majority of the winners are white doesn't reflect racism in the population. Mmmmkay.


Ahhh, good to know you don't claim women have suffered from the evils of white men.

The issue was racism, and you included women in your list of minorities in Bush's cabinet. Maybe you should just admit that you were wrong instead of trying to change the subject.
 
2003-04-15 02:08:29 PM  
Thomas Jefferson even thought slavery was wrong and wanted it put in the Declaration but many were against it because they knew Georgia and South Carolina wouldn't go for it.

This is 3/5 true.
 
2003-04-15 02:08:58 PM  
Franky17:

to use race to determine anything, or as a factor in determaning anything is racist. you should have to defend being racist.
 
2003-04-15 02:09:07 PM  
OUR rich heritage was stolen

huh?
 
2003-04-15 02:09:46 PM  
Looks like a few people are willing to assume bigotry on the basis of skin color--ironic.

Before one of you throws the racist accusation my way, I was wondering if you could identify a society/civilization that is/was perfectly equal in the treatment of its citizens. And while you're at it, since America sucks so badly, name me the countries that have adopted the reparation theory for injustices that occurred 150 years ago? I mean, really, America must seriously blow to be so out of touch with a sentiment that's obviously sweeping the world, right?

I'm waiting to be dazzled by your facts.
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:09:47 PM  
Shut........UP
"When will whites understand that White Priviledge isn't just a vague term, but actually exists."

But only if you know the secret handshake. Itw why all white have jobs and make 200k a year.


Well, the average white family doesn't make that much, but the average african american family only makes about 64% that of the average white family. Average hispanic family makes 66%. (Numbers taken from U.S. Bureau of the Census, 2001)
 
2003-04-15 02:10:11 PM  
Do people get it yet that Bill O'Reilly is a Ku Klux Klown?
 
2003-04-15 02:10:28 PM  
I as a handicapped person am very offended that I am treated differently. We still are forced to use different toilets, water fountains, we have different access entrances to buildings, even our parking is segregated, It is time that these injustices be addressed, before stereotypes are further entrenched.

/not actually handicapped (no purpose to this post)
 
2003-04-15 02:10:55 PM  
GreyAlien:

that was a joke. in the english language i dont think there is any specific inherant differnece between "african american", or "american african".
 
2003-04-15 02:10:56 PM  
KPAR
--I'll defend all Texans, after all.--

No, really?
 
2003-04-15 02:11:31 PM  
I'd read it, just as soon as they turn off the farking "jump through this hoop, and we'll let you read it" app...

I hate links to crappy sites like the post!
 
2003-04-15 02:11:54 PM  
Vroomazoom

Awesome post earlier. Until people stop viewing race as their identity it will never end.
 
2003-04-15 02:12:31 PM  
Bobert:

hahaha.
 
2003-04-15 02:12:40 PM  
"What are you trying to say? That popular elections where the majority of the winners are white doesn't reflect racism in the population. Mmmmkay."

No more than women voting for a female candidate or hispanic politicains getting elected where the majority of the population is hispanic or balcks getting elected where the majority of the popualation is black.

"The issue was racism"

The issue was discrimination by one group against another. Your the one who is wrong.
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:13:01 PM  
Also from the Census Bureau, in 2000, 22.1 percent of blacks are in poverty. 21.2 percent of hispanics are in poverty. 10% of asians and pacific islanders are in poverty. 7.5 percent of whites are in poverty.


22.1% vs 7.5%, is a pretty big seperation.
 
2003-04-15 02:13:29 PM  
"TheGrayCat,

you have been led into a dilemma. its a shame your poor debate skills will dilute your reasonable position"

How is it a dilemma? Discrimination has little to do with numbers. Blacks outnumbered whites in South Africa, was there no discrimination there? Discrimination has to do with who holds the power and makes the laws.

Are women now equal to men in the realm of power. No. Why? Because a certain amount of gender discrimination still exists. Don't get me wrong, I'm a hell of a lot better off than a 35-year-old woman of 1945, but I still make 81 cents for every dollar than a man in my same position would make. That isn't fair, and it won't be fair until I make the same amount that a man in my position would.

To say that no gender discrimination exists and never existed simply because there slightly more women than men is faulty.
 
2003-04-15 02:13:30 PM  
Well, the average white family doesn't make that much, but the average african american family only makes about 64% that of the average white family. Average hispanic family makes 66%. (Numbers taken from U.S. Bureau of the Census, 2001

As usual don't address the cause.
 
2003-04-15 02:13:54 PM  
04-15-03 01:17:46 PM Fink
Sorry Pop, I wasn't implying anything.

eggshells = me walking on


My bad. I guess I'm being too sensitive. Part of growing up non-white.
 
2003-04-15 02:14:15 PM  
Well, we all know pacific islanders are slackers.
 
2003-04-15 02:14:24 PM  
Ummm, I was joking, too.


Shut........UP
"Just look at the composition of the government for proof."

Bushes cabinet:
15 memebers.
7 minorities (including women)
8 whites


Ten minutes later...

Minorities in this case, and in terms of the discussion, has been non-whites.

Make up your mind, douchie.
 
2003-04-15 02:15:33 PM  
Objectivist:

Black 'culture', as Dro tried to put it, was destroyed. It was destroyed by slave owners. The languages, the religion, everything, was destroyed by slave owners. Slaves couldn't even keep their names. This is what he means by Rich culture stolen.
 
2003-04-15 02:15:42 PM  
Bonzy20
Does it make the news when a black man makes fun of a white man?

you just don't get it huh? maybe you should be sold as a slave. enlighten you a little.

what's the black man gonna say? 'where are those cracker kids? I hope they didn't get lost driving their parents cars in from the suburbs' ... ?

the joke not only implied that the inner city kids were poor, but that they were of the character to steal in order to survive -- on top of that it was implied that what they consider important enough to steal is something of little value to rich white people 'our hubcaps' ...

the joke may not have stemmed from a specific vicious racist feeling, but it certainly came from a feeling of superiority, via a generalized image of inferiority, which is just as despicable imho.

the propagation of stereotypes begets the propagation of stereotypes.
 
2003-04-15 02:16:12 PM  
Remy writes:

Let's make sure all historical accuracies or known

Remember when debating logical points of History with the Eurocentric:
people of America, at least those of primarily European descent living in the United States, like to claim the foundation of all of America was for all people. However it only applied to the white male.


America, or at least the original "13 Colonies" was colonized by criminals, castoffs, religious zealots, opportunists, adventure seekers, slaves, endentured servants, and some common folk most of whom thought they might have a better life here than in Europe. Overwhelmingly those that came here were from northern Europe, primarily England and Scotland.

The United States, as we think of the country that came from the 13 Colonies was founded by aristocrats, idealists, philosophers, opportunists, and adventure seekers. The people who were at its idealogical core were the bleeding heart liberals of their day--people who actually had the gall to think that you could rule a large country without the remnants of a feudal aristocracy in place to keep everything "in check". They were not perfect--they were men of their time. But they continue in inspire people even today to think more inclusively, to be more free. So I refuse to put them on trial for not being "black enough" or "female enough" or whatever. To do so misses the point of the radicalness of their thoughts in their time.

--h
 
2003-04-15 02:16:30 PM  
600,000 American died in the Civil War. Isn't that enough for reparations?


You're joking. Right?
 
2003-04-15 02:16:53 PM  
Zipf :
Failure to correct for racism will encourage the worldview that racism is correct. One of the most important points is that racism is inexorably tied to superiority. Racists are racists. Your idea of "justified resentment" is a red-herring. Without affirmative action, the racists would still hold their views as justified because there would be no policy to counter it.


An easier way to fix the problem is remove race from things like college applications, e.g. no names, only the socail security number, etc. By bringing race in as a factor (and sometimes as a deciding factor), you are saying that someone else deserves to lose out so that we can correct a social injustice. The problem is that you are discriminating against an innocent person from on top of your horse. What right do you have to decide that one form of discrimination is superior to another? Would you give up your job or some other opportunity you may have had in order to push up a less fortunate person? If yes, do so. If not, shut the fark up. Either discrimination is right or it is wrong. You have to choose one and apply it uniformly to everybody. Affirmative action is sheer stupidity. The true unequalizing factor in society is income. Rich people almost always get a better education because the price tag is not an issue. Affirmative action says that a middle-class black person is still more disadvantaged than a dirt poor white person. Can't buy that logic. In all honesty I could feasible buy the argument that poor people should be given extra consideration because a financially disadvantaged person with for example a 1300 on the SATs might be a harder worker than a rich person with a 1400(just because the rich person probably received a better highschool education). No question of race at all. Oh and the people who are poor would actually get the help they need.
/2 cents
 
2003-04-15 02:16:56 PM  
My family came to the US from Sicily in the 20s, do I owe anybody money?

Please, from this point on, refer to me as an "Italian American" but only if you insist on being called "African American"or "Asian American" or whatever else you need to be called to feel exclusive.

For the rest of you "Americans" who's family's came here in search of a better life and wanted to be Americans, or were brought here as indentured servants or slaves and realize that they are infinitely better off in this country and have more opportunity to succeed than anywhere else in the world... you can refer to me as "American"

Baseball have been veddy veddy goo to me!
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:17:03 PM  
Themeaningoflifeisnot Before one of you throws the racist accusation my way, I was wondering if you could identify a society/civilization that is/was perfectly equal in the treatment of its citizens. And while you're at it, since America sucks so badly, name me the countries that have adopted the reparation theory for injustices that occurred 150 years ago?


Perhaps I am alone in this, but it seems more painful to me that a country as rich and powerful and munificent as ours is still so gripped by clearly stratified class lines.

Heck, we have the highest infant mortality rate of any industrialized nation, because one in six children under 18 is in poverty. And that number has barely wiggled in the last 40 years, so we're not making great strides against it.
 
2003-04-15 02:18:32 PM  
Shut........UP
"The issue was racism"

The issue was discrimination by one group against another. Your the one who is wrong.


Right. Come on, I know you can do better than that.
 
2003-04-15 02:18:40 PM  
Kpar90

The reason why many black people do not want to be associated with America speaks to the larger issues. To many blacks America is a place that pities or despises them and where virtually all institutions are controlled by whites. It is a place where people have been systematically kept disenfranchised for so long that even if the opportunities exist or not the percpetion is that they don't. As a result, many blacks don't see America as being thier country, just where they happen to live.
 
2003-04-15 02:18:57 PM  
I'm a "Texan Connecticut-ite"
 
2003-04-15 02:19:04 PM  
"Don't be that stupid. Minorities in this case, and in terms of the discussion, has been non-whites. white women do not make up 51% of the population."

Then why did you include ALL of the women in Bush's cabinet under the heading "minorities"
 
2003-04-15 02:19:20 PM  
Vroomazoom
to use race to determine anything, or as a factor in determaning anything is racist. you should have to defend being racist.

I am very comfortable with the use of race along with income and geographic location to generate a diverse student body (I know, I know all black people and all poor people don't think alike, I know). In fact I would feel cheated if I went to a college whose student body didn't reflect the ethnic and geographical make up of the nation. Furthermore, I am happy to accept that I didn't get into some schools because they already had a white trombone player from NJ. That's fine.

I'm pissed that I didn't get into to schools because Tommy Warbuck's daddy built them a library.

I'll defend affirmative action in the short term - it is certainly needed to even the playing field. Should it exist forever? No.
 
2003-04-15 02:19:22 PM  
Hear Hear, Nagasaki.
 
2003-04-15 02:20:28 PM  
"Right. Come on, I know you can do better than that."

Considering thats what you came up, it wouldn't be hard.
 
2003-04-15 02:22:10 PM  
---Are women now equal to men in the realm of power. No. Why? Because a certain amount of gender discrimination still exists. Don't get me wrong, I'm a hell of a lot better off than a 35-year-old woman of 1945, but I still make 81 cents for every dollar than a man in my same position would make. That isn't fair, and it won't be fair until I make the same amount that a man in my position would. ---

"there are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics"

This is one statistic that's always pissed me off. I'm sure its true, but not just because of the reasons you think.

Every job i've ever had the women have made the same as the men. The women MBAs at my company and the developers on my team earn the same as I do.

This statistic is skewed because women take time out of their careers to have children, and thus lose time on their careers. Your early and mid twenties are your prime income earning, job skill accumulating years, and they are alos your prime child years. One of these has to suffer accordingly.

My wife for example when she went back to work after having our daughter had lost her tenure eventhough she was a "fifth year" teacher and wouldve made more had she stayed on and never had a kid. Her colleagues, some male, some female, who'd not taken time off for families, made more money even though some of them were less qualified or had fewer years experience. Was that sexism?

Yes, sexism exists in the work place, and we all know its not all equal. But before you point your finger and see a causal relationship based purely on discrimination, take other factors into consideration. Its not all evil white men you know.

Most 35 year old women I know who've had children make less than 35 year old men because they were out of the work force for 5 years or so being moms. And the ones that weren't. . guess what? they earn the same as men do.

come back to planet earth moon unit, its not as bad down here as you think.
 
2003-04-15 02:22:14 PM  
Whats wrong with reparations? The US has made attempts at repaying those we have wronged in the past. Both Native Americans and wrongly imprisoned Japanese Americans received payments. Besides, I dont think anyone got their 40 acres and a mule, so wed actually just be paying an old debt.

And Shut........UP, we do have a secret handshake. We learned it the same day we were taught how to use the ellipses and the jokey close tag. You must have been absent that day.
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:22:34 PM  
Objectivist
G2V
Well, the average white family doesn't make that much, but the average african american family only makes about 64% that of the average white family. Average hispanic family makes 66%. (Numbers taken from U.S. Bureau of the Census, 2001

As usual don't address the cause.


The average african american family is not in the top 20% of the income earning population, who's wages have risen over 50% in the past 30 years. The second 20% has only risen 28%, then 21%, then 18%, then 11%. As you go down the list, you encounter more minorities.

The rich get richer, while the poor remain trapped in poverty. Since many poor people are forced into cheap inner city regions, where jobs are scarce, they find difficulty raising enough money to move above the poverty line. If they don't have a car, they certainly have no hope of communting to the suburbs where the employment is. And of course there's always the spectre of discrimination. We can admit women get short changed when it comes to working salaries, but not other races. Why is that?

People that think anyone can get rich continue to believe in a delusion, that's very very rare.
 
2003-04-15 02:22:48 PM  
G2V:

I agree. Now, what about an answer to my question? I'm interested in a specific response from someone because it seems America is just an easy target for a criticism that's applicable to every society throughout human history.
 
2003-04-15 02:23:00 PM  
Themeaningoflifeisnot
0 and 0, as far as i know. But the fact remains is this: Just because America is(was, since patriots I&II/Homeland Security Bills) the greatest nation, doesn't mean we should sit with our thumbs up our asses. There's a lot of REAL racial issues that need to be dealt w/ because, as Objectivist put it, "People are individuals they are not interchangeable ciphers in an amorphous collective."

Or should blacks and other minorities accept their place as the poorest and least paid, while the majority lives it up (more than other minorities, on the average)? Ah, how we yearn for our Victory Gin.....
 
2003-04-15 02:23:18 PM  
GreyAlien:

sorry, defensive. my bad. i laugh now. hahaha
 
2003-04-15 02:23:38 PM  
Here is my argument supporting affirmative action:

Affirmative action is using racism to stop racism.

Using racism to stop racism is like waging war to stop wars.

Waging war to stop wars is patriotic and American.

Therefore, it is un-American and unpatriotic to be against affirmative action.
 
2003-04-15 02:23:43 PM  


 
2003-04-15 02:23:53 PM  
Vroomazoom - Man, call me whatever. Damn.

Kpar90 - "A White man from S. Africa is more African-American than any black guy."

And an Albino is more white that any White guy. What is your point? You're really starting to sound ignorant. Just stop while you have an ounce of credibility.

I don't give a fark if you call me an African-American or not. No one that I know does give a fark. Why do you care so much? If there are Black people who want to be called African-American, shiat, if they want to be called Nat-Turner-Americans, they have every right to do so.
 
2003-04-15 02:24:12 PM  
country that treats all its people the same.
Cuba?
 
2003-04-15 02:24:23 PM  


 
2003-04-15 02:24:31 PM  
Though no fan of O'Reilly, I'm going with the people who say this was a joke about Best Men defacing the car of the Just Married couple. I think the only bigots involved are the people on this thread that think it was funny based on the thought that it WAS about black people.
 
2003-04-15 02:25:26 PM  
Franky17 thinks one's race,along with income and geographic location determines the content of one's mind.

What could be more racist than that?
 
2003-04-15 02:25:29 PM  
Axisted: One of the funniest posts ever. Good job.

Dro: Whether or not I grow up has nothing to do with the fact that "African" Americans made up Kwanzaa. Next you'll be wanting federal holiday recognition for it.

Impaler: That's an interesting twist on the cause of the war, and I have to admit it is right on. Puts the blame more on the South for defending slavery than the North for fighting to end it. I suspect the truth is somewhere in between, since it was a fight to end slavery on the North's side too. But as far as the origins of the war, not the result, your version is as accurate as a bunch of people can be 140 years later.

RE: Student Loans: I know some financiers that make a KILLING loaning money to students. It's not welfare, it's just part of capitalism--they just get you for school, not for financing a business.
 
2003-04-15 02:26:53 PM  
Hdhale

I will grant that colonials idealogy of all white men being equal was liberal at the time. However, that doesn't make it good, merely a step in the right direction. The discrepency between stated goals and actual intents of the revolution only highlight the fact that revolution was in fact economic based. The wealthy colonials shook off the oppressive economics of being a colony and were able to keep more of the money they made.
 
2003-04-15 02:27:02 PM  
This does not rise to the level of a "trent lott", and i don't think o'reilly is a hard core racist. He is, however, a hard core asshat.
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:27:47 PM  
Themeaningoflifeisnot

I agree. Now, what about an answer to my question? I'm interested in a specific response from someone because it seems America is just an easy target for a criticism that's applicable to every society throughout human history.


America isn't an easy target. Our poor are much better off than the poor elsewhere, and we do make strides, even if they have not historically been effective, to appeal to equality.

So I cannot name another country, though bear in mind one may exist.

At any rate, does that constitute an excuse to allow it to remain in this one?
 
2003-04-15 02:28:09 PM  
Father_Jack:

great post on sexism. donkey to you sir.
 
2003-04-15 02:30:19 PM  
Objectivist
Franky17 thinks one's race,along with income and geographic location determines the content of one's mind.

What could be more racist than that?


Did you even READ my post? Evidently not. Let me re-post a very important line from it where I state that I DO NOT believe that:

(I know, I know all black people and all poor people don't think alike, I know).

Or did you just really want to call someone racist?
 
2003-04-15 02:30:25 PM  
Severian,
What are you trying to say?
Spit it out, man!
 
2003-04-15 02:30:28 PM  
Themeaningoflifeisnot
There is no perfect society. I sometimes get sick of hearing other countries complain about the United States' race problem when they each have their own to be dealing with. Even in countries where everyone looks similar due to long periods of not allowing immigration and having a pretty homogenous makeup, they will then fight about religion or something. People always break themselves into disputing groups and one group will usually gain the upper hand and lord it over all the other groups. I think the reason the US gets targeted is because we are so vocal about our ideal of everyone being welcome to become a part of the American dream, and as humans we don't always live up to that ideal. But I really do think that most people still believe in it and want it to be true; unfortunately, it's often the few who don't who are usually in power...
 
2003-04-15 02:30:48 PM  
04-15-03 01:43:50 PM Shortbusdriver
Objectivist

Does this include your perceptions that racism is still thriving?

I don't know how it's doing in So Cal., but it sure is hanging on here in Texas. For example, I've heard businessmen say that they won't hire hispanics.


Other businessmen hire illegal aliens that will do the work below minimum wage. It can be argued that this discriminates against whites, who are disproportionately unable to find work.
 
2003-04-15 02:31:04 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND:

thats it? If I can call you a bigot, I think that Bobert should be able to call you a bigot as well.
 
2003-04-15 02:31:40 PM  
CommieSquirrel

Lets remove the "Do you have any relatives who have attended this institution" line too, lets see who's going to be calling for daddy's boy to get in. The problem, commie, is that the opportunity, let me repeat that...OPPORTUNITY for minorities is far less than for white, specifically white males. Affirmative action levels this off, although it would be nice if socioeconomic factors played more a role in enrollment than just financial aid, IMHO(with regard to race).
 
2003-04-15 02:32:03 PM  
Weemill:

Yes, there are a lot of real racial issues that need to be dealt with in the here-and-now. How you think that positive social change will come more quickly by handing today's "white power structure" the bill for injustices hundreds of years ago is beyond me. Indeed, unless you specifically identify those present day descendants of slave owners who still profit from a long ago abandoned practice, any reparations taken from the general tax fund will come at the expense of white people (or their ancestors) who immigrated here after slavery or at the expense of black people and other minorities who had nothing to do with running the slavery institution. If you are honest, you will admit that such a solution would not be fair and, certainly, would not encourage people to work harder on other more current minority rights issues--like redistricting and inner city school aid.
 
2003-04-15 02:32:30 PM  
From the thread:

"white males were reluctant to share power and access with blacks after slavery"

"The white male, like i said, is the keeper of the power structure in the US."

"Even I, being in the most "powerful" group, young white male, can recognise the unfairness of our society"

and others.

As you can see (maybe you can't) the argument included "male" in terms of discrimination against other groups.

simple enough for you or did I use to bigga wurdz?
 
2003-04-15 02:32:31 PM  
Talk about a thread gone astray.
Here's my 2 cents.
My ancestors came here from Ireland in the 1790's to escape British oppresion. One as an indentured servant.Later ancestors fought in the Civil War as part of the Pennsylvania regiments. One died.Who owes me money and why do I owe anyone else?And what about France,Spain,Portugal and England?(oops, already covered the Brits)These countries introduced and maintained slavery to North America before the US was established. Isn't there some culbability there? Oh yeah, let's not forget the West African slave traders. 'course we've got to let the Liberians off the hook I quess.
 
2003-04-15 02:33:16 PM  
G2V,
you are a moron if you think there are many great jobs in the suburbs. suburbs have houses and grocery stores and banks, not flourishing industry or businesses. suburbs are storage for people that work in a city and can afford the drive.
 
2003-04-15 02:33:19 PM  
If it was a brown guy saying that with an "al-" in front of his name, O'Rielly would be demanding an arrest.

/end reference to sami al-arian
 
2003-04-15 02:33:30 PM  
Urbn

Though no fan of O'Reilly, I'm going with the people who say this was a joke about Best Men defacing the car of the Just Married couple. I think the only bigots involved are the people on this thread that think it was funny based on the thought that it WAS about black people.


There's a difference between defacing a car and stealing the hubcaps. That's the whole joke dude. Notice the difference? Notice the subtle differentiation between what one group of people might be expected to do in a situation and what another might be expected to do? Get the joke? .... How 'bout now?
 
2003-04-15 02:34:15 PM  
Granted, O'Reilly can be a bit overbearing at times (some would consider that an understatement), but I have met the man. I work in car rental, and O'Reilly has the highest level account (reserved for CEO's, Entertainers, and the like), which lets him pretty much get any type of vehicle he wants up to a Volvo or Jaguar. When I asked him what kind of vehicle he wanted he said he just needed something to get around in, a Camry would be fine. He may be a windbag, but pompous he's not.
 
2003-04-15 02:35:16 PM  
OPPORTUNITY for minorities is far less than for white, specifically white males. Affirmative action levels this off

Even if that is true it is still wrong it doesn't level the playing field for the people on the other side getting discriminated against. People need to start treating people as individuals not groups.
 
2003-04-15 02:35:53 PM  
btw, congrats Drew on 500k...keep on farking everyone
 
2003-04-15 02:36:37 PM  
Kpar90 - "Next you'll be wanting federal holiday recognition for Kwanzaa."

And you wonder why I called you a bigot. Contrary to what you believe all of us don't celebrate Kwanzaa, so we won't be wanting anything of the sort. AND YOU'RE SO CLOUDED WITH HATE THAT YOU'D PROTEST ANOTHER DAY OFF OF WORK!?! You're credibility is now gone. All of it.
 
2003-04-15 02:36:53 PM  
 
2003-04-15 02:37:50 PM  
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:39:19 PM  
Shut........UP
As you can see (maybe you can't) the argument included "male" in terms of discrimination against other groups.

I'm not sure what your point is. Sorry if you're going to attack me now with some witty retort, but race isn't the sole discriminating factor. Gender, ethnicity, wealth are all pretty important too =D

Bobert

G2V,
you are a moron if you think there are many great jobs in the suburbs. suburbs have houses and grocery stores and banks, not flourishing industry or businesses. suburbs are storage for people that work in a city and can afford the drive.


Thanks, not only did your wonderfully stinging comment force me to spend many moments soul searching, but it also pointed out that many of the people working in the city are more wealthy (who tend to be less minorities) people outside of the city. The people in the city have access to almost NO jobs. Those grocery stores and corner shops are better than no employment at all. There's a reason why the simpsons poke fun at the stereotypical indian quik-e-mart owner.

You can check unemployment rates easily enough, see if it is higher in urban areas than rural, inner city than suburbia.
 
2003-04-15 02:39:44 PM  
Shut........UP
"Just look at the composition of the government for proof."

Bushes cabinet:
15 memebers.
7 minorities (including women)
8 whites


Ten minutes later...

Minorities in this case, and in terms of the discussion, has been non-whites.

If you can't just admit this obvious contradiction, then there is no point trying to have a discussion with you.

Have fun feeling superior.
 
G2V
2003-04-15 02:39:57 PM  
Dratted tags of evil.
 
2003-04-15 02:40:28 PM  
"No need to invent Kwanzaa..."

Just to keep things fair, Christmas is a made-up holiday, too. It was implemented to compete with the pagan festival of Saturnalia.

To drive the point home: Please cite chapter-and-verse of where in the Bible it commands the celebration of Christmas, or better yet, when you're supposed to do so.
 
2003-04-15 02:40:45 PM  
As someone who steals hubcaps for a living I am offeneded by the comparison between me and a buch of school children who have nothing better to do with there time than parade arround for O'Riley acting like the Four tops.
 
2003-04-15 02:40:51 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND:

on a more serious note, could you explain why you felt that mentioning your race was necessary on the post, or how you felt it added to the worth or legitimacy of you comment? and if you can do that, could you explain how that is not racist? the other option that should be considered, is the idea that bobert first brought up, and you attacked him for in a previous thread. Bobert stated that you will drop your race and then attack everyone who disagrees with you, as a racist. that still seems like a possibility, but i tend to think your just a bigot, who views race as a determining factor for the worth of individual statements.

you could also address misquoting me to make me look racist. that would be good. I can only guess that every point in this will be ignored, or you will just look at one point, or one group of words, or you will misquote me again, or say that I am a waste of time. But you should come up with some way to avoid answering my questions.
 
2003-04-15 02:41:08 PM  
Themeaningoflifeisnot: I never said i was in agreement w/ reparations. Look, I'm not a big fan of Al Sharpton, nor of Jesse Jackson (at least not nowadays), but I think it needs to be understood that when a predominate black figure comes out saying something, the entirety of the Black population doesn't necessarily agree. I think it's a fool idea to try to pay slave descendants, though i think, if companies can be traces, governments should charge those companies and funnel the money to the Smithsonian for something worthwhile (or any other just cause), but IMHO, its unrealistic and not a viable alternative. Should someone be able to rape my sister b/c her great great grandfather raped his great great grandmother? No, I'm not saying the sins of the father fall to the child, but realize that the relationship between father and son is not so far removed that descriminatory practices exist. And insofar as terms like 'hard core racist' go, you're either a racist or you're not. I think o'reilly may not have meant what he said as a racial quip, now that i've heard the whole hubcaps thing(thanks for the enlightenment), but i do believe that racism is a beast that needs to be tackled and immediately. (and by racism i mean all descrimination, please excuse my halfbluntness)
 
2003-04-15 02:41:25 PM  
Vroomazoom -
DROxINxTHExWIND:

thats it? If I can call you a bigot, I think that Bobert should be able to call you a bigot as well.

Do you see how ridiculous this comment is. Read it for me again. Come on, how old are you? Ok, tag, I'm it.
 
2003-04-15 02:41:47 PM  
Dro: But black people are the ones today who are worried about defining people by what continent they "came from." I'll ignore the internal bias of blacks who are lighter skinned v. blacks who are darker skinned, which would go along with your albino analogy, which is off the mark. Are you now telling me that the push to be called "african-American" is gone? Maybe you don't care so much about it, but millions of others do.

Remy & Weemill: Then shouldn't they be trying to get their heritage back instead of makig up new holidays that are not a part of any history? Also, tell me that Colin Powell isn't proud to be an American. Or any of the thousands of black servicemen that are in the military and in Iraq right now.
 
2003-04-15 02:42:06 PM  
Here is my argument supporting affirmative action:

Ok. Here's mine against it.

Affirmative action is using racism to stop racism.

Affirmative action undermines the concept of the individual and the rights that are attributed to the individual by granting special status to a group of individuals at the expense of another. It undermines the concept of merit for *all* individuals concerned.
 
2003-04-15 02:42:54 PM  
Wyczar
It's not a fair comparison to equate the African version of slavery to that in America. The African versions typically allowed for marriage, ownership of property, buying of freedom etc. The American version also included enormous loss life in acquiring slaves, relocation to an environment where they did not speak the language and suppression of culture.
 
2003-04-15 02:43:28 PM  
Weemill:

Well said. I think I can agree with you.
 
2003-04-15 02:43:30 PM  
Not directed at you G2V
 
2003-04-15 02:43:48 PM  
Axisted

That's what I've been saying but I don't think they get it.