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(The Pulse)   Hospital decides to lead by example by hiring only healthy people, will employ only vegetarians with low cholesterol, blood pressure and body fat index. Just kidding, they're singling out those evil smokers   (chattanoogapulse.com) divider line 331
    More: Asinine, drug tests, nicotine, cholesterol, vegetarians, kidding, memorial, Memorial Hospital  
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6458 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Jan 2010 at 1:09 AM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2010-01-19 11:20:00 PM  
Sounds like a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.
 
2010-01-19 11:27:59 PM  
lajimi: Sounds like a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.

The Americans with Disabilities Act classifies addiction as a handicap.

so, good luck with all that Memorial.
 
amo [TotalFark]
2010-01-19 11:28:17 PM  
lajimi: Sounds like a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.

I wouldn't expect it to go anywhere. Currently, smokers aren't a legally protected class. Personally, however, I have an objection to any employer who would regulate my legal, off-the-clock activities.
 
2010-01-19 11:28:29 PM  
I certainly don't want to be treated in the non-smoking hospital.

Every freakin' EMT, nurse, or surgeon I've ever met was a chain smoker.
 
amo [TotalFark]
2010-01-19 11:28:53 PM  
Gecko Gingrich: lajimi: Sounds like a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.

The Americans with Disabilities Act classifies addiction as a handicap.

so, good luck with all that Memorial.


Ooooh, I hadn't thought of that. This could get very interesting!
 
2010-01-19 11:47:50 PM  
amo: Gecko Gingrich: lajimi: Sounds like a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.

The Americans with Disabilities Act classifies addiction as a handicap.

so, good luck with all that Memorial.

Ooooh, I hadn't thought of that. This could get very interesting!


Actually, the hospital is in pretty good shape as long as they're forbidding the action of smoking as opposed to not hiring people with nicotine abuse/dependence.

For example, smokers who meet criteria for abuse continue to meet DSM-IV criteria for up to 12 months after smoking cessation.
 
2010-01-20 12:16:57 AM  
amo: Personally, however, I have an objection to any employer who would regulate my legal, off-the-clock activities.

You mean like commercial airline pilots and drinking alcohol?
 
2010-01-20 12:17:48 AM  
Who the hell thinks vegetarians are somehow healthier than everyone else? When did that piece of dog crap get accepted as conventional wisdom? All the vegetarians are I know are sickly chicks who eat nothing but pasta and cheesy poofs, don't exercise and can't even crap properly.
 
2010-01-20 12:53:57 AM  
Somacandra: Who the hell thinks vegetarians are somehow healthier than everyone else? When did that piece of dog crap get accepted as conventional wisdom? All the vegetarians are I know are sickly chicks who eat nothing but pasta and cheesy poofs, don't exercise and can't even crap properly.

This.

A friend of mine decided on day he would be vegan. And he ran with it.

For a year and a half.

The thing is he didn't do it right. You know, making sure he got the right proteins by really watching his diet and all that non-hippie, i'm-actually-gonna-think-this-through noise.

He f*cked up his health pretty good.

Meanwhile, I eat steak and wear a leather belt and eat bacon and eggs for breakfast and laugh and laugh ...
 
2010-01-20 12:54:49 AM  
Goddamnit. "One day."
 
2010-01-20 01:01:25 AM  
Rustico: amo: Personally, however, I have an objection to any employer who would regulate my legal, off-the-clock activities.

You mean like commercial airline pilots and drinking alcohol?


No, it's really nothing like that at all. Not even close.
 
2010-01-20 01:15:07 AM  
Vegetarians are typically low in iron.

/Just sayin'.
//High in cobalaimin, though, with all the fish and cream they eat.
///Yes, I do mean that as an innuendo, just sayin', 'cept not, go vegan, motherfarkers.
 
2010-01-20 01:18:52 AM  
This could really drive up long-term pension costs.

/no one lives forever
//not even non-smokers
 
2010-01-20 01:19:13 AM  
Last I heard, heart disease kills more people every year than smoking. So, why are they not attacking the bigger cause? Smokers are right out, but 5'8", 340 lbs is fine? It's ironic because smokers actually tax the health care services far less on average than non-smoking fatties.
 
2010-01-20 01:20:34 AM  
Gecko Gingrich: lajimi: Sounds like a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.

The Americans with Disabilities Act classifies addiction as a handicap.


Interesting, I wonder where the line is drawn. Could an alcoholic employee fired for being drunk on the job demand protection under the act since their alcoholism could be classified as an addiction?
 
2010-01-20 01:20:46 AM  
bimalc: Actually, the hospital is in pretty good shape as long as they're forbidding the action of smoking as opposed to not hiring people with nicotine abuse/dependence.

FTFA: As part of the pre-employment drug screen, they will be looking for nicotine. If a prospective employee tests positive for nicotine, the offer of employment will be rescinded. Even nicotine gum or the patch would make a potential employee ineligible.
 
2010-01-20 01:21:04 AM  
Vegetarians? So they want employees with horrible bones?
 
2010-01-20 01:21:52 AM  
This has happened before and will happen again.

/No, not that really, really awesome scifi series. Stupidity.
 
2010-01-20 01:22:29 AM  
Ringshadow: Vegetarians? So they want employees with horrible bones?

They're less likely to stage a coup against upper management, and easier to destroy if they do. That's my theory.
 
2010-01-20 01:23:23 AM  
INDEX THAT BODY FAT, AND MAKE IT SNAPPY- er FLABBY
 
2010-01-20 01:25:11 AM  
untaken_name: Last I heard, heart disease kills more people every year than smoking. So, why are they not attacking the bigger cause? Smokers are right out, but 5'8", 340 lbs is fine? It's ironic because smokers actually tax the health care services far less on average than non-smoking fatties.

I agree with the point you are intending to make, but since smoking is a major factor for heart disease, you might wish to reword your argument.
 
2010-01-20 01:25:38 AM  
Rustico: amo: Personally, however, I have an objection to any employer who would regulate my legal, off-the-clock activities.

You mean like commercial airline pilots and drinking alcohol?


Are commercial airline pilots not allowed to drink away from work? I did not know that. That is insane.
 
2010-01-20 01:25:55 AM  
The increasingly common error being made in modern culture, in regards to smoking, is that we're targeting the person and not the activity. Somewhere along the line, the perfectly reasonable attitude "smoking is bad" became the grotesquely unreasonable attitude "smokers are bad". It's a worrying trend.
 
2010-01-20 01:27:09 AM  
Jesus, we're becoming such a nation of coonts.

But, hey, at least you know which hospital not to go to. You can go to the hospital with the bottom of the barrel, yet smoke free employees, or the hospital with the good doctors and nurses who smoke.
 
M-G
2010-01-20 01:27:47 AM  
untaken_name: Last I heard, heart disease kills more people every year than smoking.

Smoking is a huge risk factor for heart disease. So many of those who die from heart disease could be considered to have died from smoking.

I do however, always wonder about the number of obese women walking around in scrubs in every medical center...
 
2010-01-20 01:27:59 AM  
southparkstudios.mtvnimages.com
!
 
2010-01-20 01:28:34 AM  
I like the idea of not having smokers work in hospitals. The stench of a hospital is bad enough already.
 
2010-01-20 01:29:45 AM  
AuntNotAnt: Vegetarians are typically low in iron.

/Just sayin'.
//High in cobalaimin, though, with all the fish and cream they eat.
///Yes, I do mean that as an innuendo, just sayin', 'cept not, go vegan, motherfarkers.


Vegetarians who use cast iron cookware do not have iron issues.

Just saying.

And vegetarians with proper diet do not have bone issues. Ovo-lacto is the healthiest way to eat.
 
2010-01-20 01:30:05 AM  
untaken_name: Last I heard, heart disease kills more people every year than smoking. So, why are they not attacking the bigger cause? Smokers are right out, but 5'8", 340 lbs is fine? It's ironic because smokers actually tax the health care services far less on average than non-smoking fatties.

Do you know what else causes heart disease? (Yeah, smoking is just for lung cancer and emphysema.

I am not a smoker though and I think this is kind of ridiculous. though I think if it is a private hospital then they should be able to do what they want. Smokers should not be a protected group and I don't think they are or there wouldn't be laws almost everywhere about where you can and can't smoke. Imagine if there were gay free zones? Or "black"out areas. Well there are plenty of places smoking isn't allowed.
 
2010-01-20 01:31:04 AM  
Somacandra: Who the hell thinks vegetarians are somehow healthier than everyone else? When did that piece of dog crap get accepted as conventional wisdom? All the vegetarians are I know are sickly chicks who eat nothing but pasta and cheesy poofs, don't exercise and can't even crap properly.

THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS! In fact, most (if not all) of the vegetarians I know suffer from some sort of debilitating health problem (or two).
 
2010-01-20 01:31:45 AM  
Can they still smoke weed?

If not...

RUMSFELD!!!
 
2010-01-20 01:32:36 AM  
Cozret: untaken_name: Last I heard, heart disease kills more people every year than smoking. So, why are they not attacking the bigger cause? Smokers are right out, but 5'8", 340 lbs is fine? It's ironic because smokers actually tax the health care services far less on average than non-smoking fatties.

I agree with the point you are intending to make, but since smoking is a major factor for heart disease, you might wish to reword your argument.


Smoking isn't the ONLY factor, nor even the only major factor.
Besides, they didn't enact the ban as a way to fight heart disease. Also, I can't seem to find any comparisons in heart disease/death rates between non-smoking obese people and smoking non-obese people, which would be nice to compare.
 
2010-01-20 01:32:57 AM  
And I thought fascism was only for governments...
 
2010-01-20 01:33:15 AM  
srhp29: Rustico: amo: Personally, however, I have an objection to any employer who would regulate my legal, off-the-clock activities.

You mean like commercial airline pilots and drinking alcohol?

Are commercial airline pilots not allowed to drink away from work? I did not know that. That is insane.


I doubt if they're specifically forbidden from drinking off the clock. They're just forbidden from being drunk while on the clock.
 
2010-01-20 01:33:23 AM  
neilbradley: Somacandra: Who the hell thinks vegetarians are somehow healthier than everyone else? When did that piece of dog crap get accepted as conventional wisdom? All the vegetarians are I know are sickly chicks who eat nothing but pasta and cheesy poofs, don't exercise and can't even crap properly.

THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS THIS! In fact, most (if not all) of the vegetarians I know suffer from some sort of debilitating health problem (or two).


It doesn't pay to be an idiot and try to be a vegetarian. But this is true for any sort of dietary practice, isn't it? I mean, there is dumb-assery aplenty no matter what you stick in your pie hole, right?
 
2010-01-20 01:35:17 AM  
untaken_name: Last I heard, heart disease kills more people every year than smoking. So, why are they not attacking the bigger cause? Smokers are right out, but 5'8", 340 lbs is fine? It's ironic because smokers actually tax the health care services far less on average than non-smoking fatties.

The incredible decrease we've seen in cancer rates are mostly due to smokers having already died off, and fewer new people taking up the habit.
 
2010-01-20 01:35:44 AM  
I'm usually in the anti-smoking camp, but this is just stupid. Unless the behavior is affecting the work then the employer should have no right to discriminate.

If they want to set an example why not offer an incentive for its employees to quit smoking.
 
2010-01-20 01:37:32 AM  
Why do doctors drink so much?

Because it gives them something to do while they're smoking.

/old joke
//try the veal
 
2010-01-20 01:39:20 AM  
I really hope more people will take up smoking, and those that do would smoke more. More air for me once cancer takes care of you idiotic morans.
 
2010-01-20 01:41:23 AM  
Of course they are picking on smokers. It's the only PC group to treat as outcasts these days.

Besides if the fatties got mad, they would sit on them.
 
2010-01-20 01:41:47 AM  
I forgot to add that the insertion of smoking as a "major factor" in heart disease could be true, but since most of the sites I saw that talked about that also threw around the 'hundreds of thousands dead from second-hand smoke' BS, I don't know how much I trust them.
I will concede that it's a major factor only because I don't have the time or inclination to dig through the data myself. I am certainly willing to believe that my smoking may increase my chances for heart disease, but I am hard-pressed to believe that second-hand smoke is any sort of factor at all, given the concentrations of it OSHA determined would be necessary to create a hazard. I doubt anyone has EVER been exposed to that level of second-hand smoke, ever.
As the numbers of non-smokers who contract lung cancer keeps rising, even with all the smoking bans everywhere, I think it might be time to start looking at something else in the environment, something that smokers and non-smokers have in common: pollution. Car exhaust is far worse for you than cigarette smoke, and there are far more drivers than smokers, since a lot of smokers are also drivers. I'm simply tired of the demonizing of cigarettes, since that tends to have the effect of stopping people from looking any further for solutions to the cancer epidemic. "Oh, it's all smokers' fault." Well, once there aren't any more smokers, who is next in line to receive the blame? (Since we know that heart disease isn't going anywhere)
 
2010-01-20 01:42:30 AM  
Self_Manifesto: And I thought fascism was only for governments...

Governments and companies. It's not fascism without both.
 
2010-01-20 01:43:01 AM  
If you're a smoker, do NOT go to this hospital. If you're not good enough to work there, then they're not good enough to take your money when you get sick.
 
2010-01-20 01:44:06 AM  
Somewhere along the line, the perfectly reasonable attitude "smoking is bad" became the grotesquely unreasonable attitude "smokers are bad". It's a worrying trend.


A bad person is a person who does bad things. I haven't known a smoker yet who hasn't through their activity of smoking adversely affected the health of some combination of relatives, children, pets, and the general public. Many will even go so far as to deny that second hand smoke is harmful at all. If there were a smoker that only smoked in say, the desert, or the middle of the ocean, in solitude, then I could probably go along with you. I haven't known one of those.
 
2010-01-20 01:46:18 AM  
Seriously, this hospital is quite likely to win on any discrimination suits.

Iowa Health Systems, being pretty much Iowa Methodist Medical Center and Iowa Lutheran Hospital, in Des Moines instituted a no smoking policy for all employees almost two years ago. This included new hires and current employees. They gave current employees 18 months to quit and subsidized help for them to quit. However, after 18 months, if any employee was still using tobacco in any form, they were fired. So far, there has been a lot of grumbling, but no law suits.

Twenty to thirteen years ago, I handled all their workers comp claims. After a few years of that, I was literally begging them to tighten up their hiring practices for housekeeping staff and nurses aides, i.e. stop hiring people along the lines of 5'2", 350 lbs, as they were just back, knee and repetitive motion injuries waiting to happen. Invariably, when they did get injured and were off work for six months or so, even if they didn't gain 20-30 lbs. while off work, they were still too deconditioned to go through effective physical therapy to enable them to ever return to work. After a while and several huge pay-offs, Iowa Health finally got the message.
 
2010-01-20 01:47:54 AM  
Sxooter: If you're a smoker, do NOT go to this hospital. If you're not good enough to work there, then they're not good enough to take your money when you get sick.

Yeah but they are good enough to not be hypocrites like smoking drs.
 
2010-01-20 01:48:45 AM  
Enigmamf: untaken_name: Last I heard, heart disease kills more people every year than smoking. So, why are they not attacking the bigger cause? Smokers are right out, but 5'8", 340 lbs is fine? It's ironic because smokers actually tax the health care services far less on average than non-smoking fatties.

The incredible decrease we've seen in cancer rates are mostly due to smokers having already died off, and fewer new people taking up the habit.


Incredible decrease? You mean the 1% decrease between 1991 and 1998? That includes a 10% decrease in colo-rectal cancer. The rate of lung cancer dropped 1.6%. Also, men accounted for most of that, because the female mortality rate due to lung cancer actually increased during that period. Breast cancer dropped more than lung cancer during that period, also. I don't think you can lay the overall decline in cancer at the feet of dead smokers. *Maybe* the lung cancer drop, but since it's rather small, and seems consistent with most other cancer rate drops, I'd chalk it up to better detection and treatment, just like the non-smoking-related cancers. But then, I don't enjoy scapegoating classes of people, so YMMV.
 
2010-01-20 01:49:11 AM  
ipeeintheshower: Somewhere along the line, the perfectly reasonable attitude "smoking is bad" became the grotesquely unreasonable attitude "smokers are bad". It's a worrying trend.


A bad person is a person who does bad things. I haven't known a smoker yet who hasn't through their activity of smoking adversely affected the health of some combination of relatives, children, pets, and the general public. Many will even go so far as to deny that second hand smoke is harmful at all. If there were a smoker that only smoked in say, the desert, or the middle of the ocean, in solitude, then I could probably go along with you. I haven't known one of those.


Did cigarettes kill your mother and rape your father?
 
2010-01-20 01:49:56 AM  
amo: lajimi: Sounds like a discrimination lawsuit waiting to happen.

I wouldn't expect it to go anywhere. Currently, smokers aren't a legally protected class. Personally, however, I have an objection to any employer who would regulate my legal, off-the-clock activities.


Yep, that's bang on. One can't just alledge a disability based upon any factor, such as "addiction." Under US federal statute/case law, there are enumerated heads that a claimant would have to fit into. Smoking does not currently qualify.

Also, employers can make choices in who they hire based upon bona fide job requirements. Typically, this is based upon an inability to perform the job description: for example, there is nothing discriminatory about not hiring a severely obese person to be a fitness instructor. I believe there are a few cases where smoking has been used as a rationale for an increase in co-payments or insurance premiums, but not as a job requirement, so that's novel ground.

In any event, I think legally the hospital is on fairly solid ground...of course, I didn't bother reading the article, though.
 
2010-01-20 01:50:20 AM  
untaken_name: I doubt anyone has EVER been exposed to that level of second-hand smoke, ever.

My non-smoking Grand-Mother lived in the haze of my Grand-Fathers cigs for around 50 years.

While he of course died young (77) from the non-filtered Luckys, she chugged along till the age of 83.

No lung cancer. Just old.

Second hand smoke clearly seems to have extended her life.
 
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