penthesilea: It would never be allowed in the US. The program could be dramatically successful and yet it would be seen as being Soft On Crime.

Think of the lost revenue in fines and prison taxes!

The horror!

This isn't anywhere near as crazy as it sounds, in fact, it improves relations between police and the community immensely.

It works best in small communities though, the larger a city gets the more impersonal human interaction becomes.

penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

It would never be allowed in the US. The program could be dramatically successful and yet it would be seen as being Soft On Crime.

Some criminals aren't human and don't deserve help.

sboyle1020: Some criminals aren't human and don't deserve help.

That's why we have elections.

DeadZone: sboyle1020: Some criminals aren't human and don't deserve help.

That's why we have elections.

And political appointments.

DeadZone: sboyle1020: Some criminals aren't human and don't deserve help.

That's why we have elections.

What does Japanese porn consumption have to do with this?

The best way to fight crime is to foster a culture where crime is deeply and truly culturally shameful. Even dirt-poor countries where crime is shameful have quite low levels of crime.

On the flipside, cultures where a criminal/gangster/hooligal mentality is tolerated (or even celebrated) will have high crime rates. Even if they are relatively well-off countries with little need to turn to crime to simply survive.

In the light of that - this seems like a good idea.

/theory pulled out of ass
//based on general observation from world travels
///would rather be in a Vietnamese slum than an American ghetto, for example

penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

It would never be allowed in the US. The program could be dramatically successful and yet it would be seen as being Soft On Crime.

I'm reminded of how people got all bent out of shape when Tony Soprano would have lunch with the FBI guys and talk about terrorists and baseball and what not. They couldn't handle the concept that everything can be defined in black and white terms, 100% good or 100% evil.

a big focus on reducing crime rather than just arresting criminals

That's just crazy talk! Without real crime, how would police and politicians be able to justify ridiculous budgets and laws?

That's because most crimes in NZ are nuisance crimes primarily centered around the theft of tea. The officers provide the "criminals" with their daily tea fix and - VOILA! - no more crimes.

penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

It would never be allowed in the US. The program could be dramatically successful and yet it would be seen as being Soft On Crime.

Agrees completely!

Make Tea, Not War!

Melgania: ///would rather be in a Vietnamese slum than an American ghetto, for example

Rio De Janeiro alone has about 700 slums to choose from!

To stop crime just print enough money for everyone, afterall, it is just a printing press.

sboyle1020: penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

It would never be allowed in the US. The program could be dramatically successful and yet it would be seen as being Soft On Crime.

Some criminals aren't human and don't deserve help.

But assuming that of all criminals is, indeed, the problem. Yes, there are a small minority who will simply steal, fight, even kill "for the lulz." For that small minority, a hard line is required - but to then apply that same hard line to everybody is a damn mistake. We've removed critical thinking and measured responses and, for the most part, replaced them with mandatory sentencing and brutal escalation.

I could see how tea with constables would inhibit sheep farking.

This is absurd. Everybody knows you cannot simply talk it through in Mordor.

DeaH: Make Tea, Not War!


Agree... for now.

FormlessOne: But assuming that of all criminals is, indeed, the problem. Yes, there are a small minority who will simply steal, fight, even kill "for the lulz." For that small minority, a hard line is required - but to then apply that same hard line to everybody is a damn mistake. We've removed critical thinking and measured responses and, for the most part, replaced them with mandatory sentencing and brutal escalation.

Exactly, so who's to determine those worth "saving" and those that are a lost cause? Apply it to only "petty" crimes and not those that involve children or murder? Wouldn't be worth it to evaluate on a case by case basis because of the population and crime rates. Not saying that's right, but it's the way it is and unfortunately will stay.

It wouldn't work in the US, because black people don't drink tea.

/the racism! It burns us!

grinderman

It wouldn't work in the US, because black people don't drink tea.

They work it out.

penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

You almost got it right... If you humanize cops, you realize they're just doing their job (keeping people safe from your happy arse) and not just part of a big conspiracy to ruin your day.

Don't kid yourself, it's because of the increased A.I.D.S. presence.

"I'm a Derek. Derek's don't run."

MBooda: They work it out.

Dumbest. Conference. Ever.

but hey, any excuse for a drink, right?

This works in all areas. Whenever I end up working with someone who is a real jackass and tries to treat me like crap...I take them to lunch. Suddenly they're my buddy.

Pay the Man: I could see how tea with constables would inhibit sheep farking.

Came for sheep farking reference. Leaving satisfied.

/Otherwise, my comment would have been: I'm sure the sheep are breathing easier.

Really a dumb business model.

Melgania: The best way to fight crime is to foster a culture where crime is deeply and truly culturally shameful. Even dirt-poor countries where crime is shameful have quite low levels of crime.

Singapore isn't a dirt-poor country, but I admire how they handle low-level crime like littering and vandalism...

/ Caning FTW...

unimpressed.

/hot

sboyle1020: Exactly, so who's to determine those worth "saving" and those that are a lost cause?

No silver bullet for that. It involves a combination of smart legislation, a strong community and cooperative law enforcement personnel. And it still won't be perfect. This was the main reason why juries of people were supposed to be a good idea.

The reason why this won't work in the U.S. is because we have this twisted double standard where citizen imperfection is celebrated while political failure is not tolerated. People can fark up and piss on society all they want, but any politician seen as "soft on crime" is voted out office after the first homicide is publicized -- even if piles of hard data indicated the approach actually reduced crime. The only viable solution in such a dysfunctional system is indiscriminate cruelty.

No wonder our local politicians are so corrupt. No one with a heart and something to lose would bother with being treated in such an absurd manner.

It's called "Community Oriented Policing"

Move along nothing to see here.

/When it's been parodied in movies you would think more people would have heard of it.
//Then again the movie was Police Academy 3...

DiarrheaVanFrank: unimpressed.

/hot

Damn you!

Sobrrr: penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems.

You almost got it right... If you humanize cops, you realize they're just doing their job



All this talk of who is and isn't human... The urge to No True Scotsman out of it is strong, but all people are just as human as you are. The spectrum of life encompasses "the full catastrophe," from the best to the worst (however you choose to define those).

tukatz: "Why hello! I'm here to talk about your recent arson. Do you have any crumpets?"

Over in one.

On another note: attempting to solve (and hopefully succeeding in solving) problems actually works.

Take note, Washington D. C.!

Well what do you expect... putting hardened criminals in fabulous situations is bound to confuse them...and fabulize them.

penthesilea: Sobrrr: penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

You almost got it right... If you humanize cops, you realize they're just doing their job (keeping people safe from your happy arse) and not just part of a big conspiracy to ruin your day.

Good point. Increased communication would foster trust and cooperation on both sides.

Wow, it never occurred to me. Humanize Mohamed Atta, he's just a guy who was into expediting urban renewal.

Sobrrr: You almost got it right... If you humanize cops, you realize they're just doing their job (keeping people safe from your happy arse) and not just part of a big conspiracy to ruin your day.

Even humans are prone to the quota system conspiracy, but it's just a conspiracy that human cops have quotas.

Where is your "happy" in that?

MBooda: penthesilea: Sobrrr: penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

You almost got it right... If you humanize cops, you realize they're just doing their job (keeping people safe from your happy arse) and not just part of a big conspiracy to ruin your day.

Good point. Increased communication would foster trust and cooperation on both sides.

Wow, it never occurred to me. Humanize Mohamed Atta, he's just a guy who was into expediting urban renewal.

No, he was a very religious man who couldn't handle the fact that foreigners defiled one of his religion's holy sites by building a military base on it; and feeling powerless, struck back at them in what he considered to be the only way left open to him.

It wasn't inhuman to him, or to many others who share his religious views. But it's much easier for us to paint him as a monster than to try to understand what led him to do what he did.

/not saying he was right, just saying that nothing is as simple as good and evil.

what a cop having "tea" with a criminal might look like:



/hot like Number Six

sboyle1020: Some criminals aren't human and don't deserve help.

They're all human, by any sane definition.

But what you most likely actually mean is that some criminals can't be rehabilitated, which is true.

However, treating all criminals as if they were part of that group ensures that many who could be rehabilitated aren't going to be.

sboyle1020: penthesilea: If you humanize criminals then they just become people with problems. Problems can be worked on and solved. Sounds reasonable.

It would never be allowed in the US. The program could be dramatically successful and yet it would be seen as being Soft On Crime.

Some criminals aren't human and don't deserve help.

Bullshiat. The moment you start talking about who is and is not human, you open doors for all sorts of twisted stuff. Even the worst criminals, who are thoroughly evil, are still human. What you don't want to face is that we are all capable of being as bad as them.

It works best in small communities though, the larger a city gets the more impersonal human interaction becomes.

Perhaps when you first step off the train but after you've lived there a bit you realize, any city is a series of connected villages.
At least that's how Boston, New York and Baltimore work. Not sure about further west but I suspect it's the case.

Jlop985: What you don't want to face is that we are all capable of being as bad as them.

Of course we're capable of it, we just don't do it. And those that do, don't deserve to be part of society and be catered to in an attempt to rehab them.

Tea is a marvelous drink; everyone loves a nice cup of tea. It breaks through the barriers of class and status, from the worker in the factory canteen to Her Majesty the Queen. Everyone loves a nice cup of tea.

/Drink tea for the love of God
Drink tea, put the kettle on