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(USA Today)   College campuses are adding more and more "green majors" to their rosters, opening up a career path for those who can't hack the rigor of liberal arts   (usatoday.com) divider line 343
    More: Interesting, arts, uc berkeley, Department of Energy, big and small, Arizona State University, higher education, surge, sustainability  
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4175 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Dec 2009 at 9:49 AM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2009-12-28 10:19:54 AM
ne2d: while the students at UC Berkeley are learning how to harangue people on internet forums about "sustainability."

Couldn't get in, huh?
 
2009-12-28 10:20:53 AM
Subby has a degree in Communications/Phys Ed.
 
2009-12-28 10:20:53 AM
No mention of sustainable agriculture programs? Pish-posh, I say.
 
2009-12-28 10:21:08 AM
Bob16: RembrandtQEinstein: There are two kinds of degrees:

Real ones that require math, and fake ones that don't. The fake ones are a big waste of time and money, just sit home and read books. Even if you plan on a non-math grad school your education will be better if you choose a math heavy undergrad vs a party major.

^One of the dumbest posts you'll ever run across.

I'm a magna cum laude graduate with a technical (heavy math) degree.

Technical degrees are almost completely worthless in the job market and teach you nothing about how to think. Basically they involve a lot of rote memorization.

The best courses i tool were English Lit where you actually had to use your brain to figure out the important lessons great writers were trying to teach you.


Yeah, i agree. These 'technical' degrees kind of tie your brain into a knot and make you loose your originality.
 
2009-12-28 10:21:33 AM
The Icelander: WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

And if it weren't for philosophy majors who'd serve our fries?


In general I agree with the sentiment, but I must admit, I found my token philosphy class both interesting and useful when I was in school for my chemical engineering degree. I got lucky enough to enroll in a class that was heavy into reasoning. Scientific method was poorly conveyed in my classes, this helped make up for it.

At least *I think* it helped me, therefore it did.
 
2009-12-28 10:21:49 AM
sboyle1020: Not An Alt: Here is another example of why college is for suckers. I never finished college and I make six figures. Take that, suckers!

So you made an attempt, failed and become a plumber troll lying about his income from his mother's basement. NTTAWWT...


FTFY.
 
2009-12-28 10:23:25 AM
A society with a balance of hard sciences and the arts is a healthy society. You need that balance,, so everybody just STFU and get over it.
 
2009-12-28 10:24:48 AM
Not An Alt: Here is another example of why college is for suckers. I never finished college and I make six figures. Take that, suckers!

You don't count the period and the pennies when counting the 'figures' in your salary.
 
2009-12-28 10:24:50 AM
smeegle: A society with a balance of hard sciences and the arts is a healthy society. You need that balance,, so everybody just STFU and get over it.


If everybody just STFU why would we be on Fark?
 
2009-12-28 10:27:13 AM
Yeah, stupid lazy MIT students who opt to take an extra minor in addition to their major. Those guys are useless and I am obviously much smarter.
 
2009-12-28 10:27:27 AM
I failed Quantitative Methods for Business. Twice.
 
2009-12-28 10:28:12 AM
WFern: never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures?

Well, one out of three ain't bad. ;-)

/At my engineering school, green was well-established as the color of engineering, because of St. Patrick being the patron saint of engineering, with pranks going back to the '50s involving green paint.
 
2009-12-28 10:28:17 AM
It's fine, as long as people understand what "green" jobs really are: Contraction management. Every imaginable "green" job or career is really about powering down, lowering expectations, and preparing for a future of scarcity and deprivation. Sustainability is stagnation, conservation is the practice of ever more thinly slicing a static or shrinking supply. These are not growth industries, folks. They are shrinkage industries.
 
2009-12-28 10:29:06 AM
rastjr: If everybody just STFU why would we be on Fark?

Good point,,, carry on.
 
2009-12-28 10:30:27 AM
FrancoFile: This thread needs more CzarAngelus.

No. No it doesn't.

I never did hear - what happened to that guy anyway? Did he decide that Fark was beneath his obvious superior intelligence? Or did he get banninated for being a dick?
 
2009-12-28 10:30:32 AM
Yeah, I'm sure the energy sciences degree at MIT is a real snooze. Not like Subby's rigorous certification in using Microsoft Office 2008 courtesy of DeVry Technical Institute.
 
2009-12-28 10:31:00 AM
It's a fact that number of graduates in technical fields is increasing, but that the percentage as well as total number of U.S. citizens graduating in those fields is decreasing.

So for whatever reason, more and more students are opting for non-technical fields. Most people in technical fields are foreign born.

The U.S. Federal government is projecting that they will have to make a major recruitment effort to compete to fill tech jobs, particularly for jobs which require you to be a U.S. citizen, increasing in time over the forseeable future. Even next year, huge chunks of funding are going into this, and it's projected to grow.

Some agencies are even now offering programs such as PAID internships, PAID tuition and expenses, and guaranteed jobs when you graduate. (Previously these kind of programs had pretty much been limited to the military.)

This probably reads like an advertisement but it's one of my pet peeves. I work in government recruiting and I see the country going down the tubes because too many kids are too short-sighted and get a degree in what they see as "fun" or "easy". Can't be bothered to ask themselves if there are actually going to be JOBS in those fields, I guess.
 
2009-12-28 10:31:58 AM
canyoneer: It's fine, as long as people understand what "green" jobs really are: Contraction management. Every imaginable "green" job or career is really about powering down, lowering expectations, and preparing for a future of scarcity and deprivation. Sustainability is stagnation, conservation is the practice of ever more thinly slicing a static or shrinking supply. These are not growth industries, folks. They are shrinkage industries.

given an eventual shrinkage of fossil fuel supplies, isn't that wise?
 
2009-12-28 10:32:12 AM
Atomic Jonb: The Icelander: WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

And if it weren't for philosophy majors who'd serve our fries?

In general I agree with the sentiment, but I must admit, I found my token philosphy class both interesting and useful when I was in school for my chemical engineering degree. I got lucky enough to enroll in a class that was heavy into reasoning. Scientific method was poorly conveyed in my classes, this helped make up for it.

At least *I think* it helped me, therefore it did.


I loved the Philosophy classes we were required to take. Probably my favorite classes in college. Well that and stat classes, cuz I'm a nerd. The Theology classes on the other hand were awful. Damn Jesuit institution.
 
2009-12-28 10:32:13 AM
Atomic Jonb: The Icelander: WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

And if it weren't for philosophy majors who'd serve our fries?

In general I agree with the sentiment, but I must admit, I found my token philosphy class both interesting and useful when I was in school for my chemical engineering degree. I got lucky enough to enroll in a class that was heavy into reasoning. Scientific method was poorly conveyed in my classes, this helped make up for it.

At least *I think* it helped me, therefore it did.


I took lots of liberal arts courses as an undergrad in additional to my technical coursework. Music, philosophy, classics, architecture, art history... It exposes you to other lines of thought and creativity in the world. This makes you a better human being and generally better at solving problems than your peers who spent years on a single track in a basement lab and complained about those weak liberal arts majors.

I can safely say I'm a better, happier human for getting a well rounded education. And, there were much prettier girls in those classes.
 
2009-12-28 10:32:20 AM
canyoneer: It's fine, as long as people understand what "green" jobs really are: Contraction management. Every imaginable "green" job or career is really about powering down, lowering expectations, and preparing for a future of scarcity and deprivation. Sustainability is stagnation, conservation is the practice of ever more thinly slicing a static or shrinking supply. These are not growth industries, folks. They are shrinkage industries.

Our shields can't repel failure of this magnitude.
 
2009-12-28 10:33:17 AM
WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

Indeed, they have not, though it's also worth noting that neither attorneys nor teachers stop at a liberal-arts degree: attorneys have entire schools dedicated to the further studies they must perform, and while teaching doesn't tend to have dedicated schools there are nevertheless further classes teachers usually need to take to get certified. Likewise, few politicians get into their business without further study. Most spend at least some time as attorneys, judges, and the like, which imply the legal studies above. Even those who don't go into law tend strongly to come from other professions requiring advanced education: actors becoming President are rare things indeed.

The contempt for liberal arts degrees seems to come from the way they've been abused. They've collectively become a catch-all for people who don't really know what they want to do, drift through college, and come out without actually wanting to do any of the things that they studied, but without much else in the way of skills. They treated their education as an end in itself -something you just sort of do- without using it as a tool to learn how to do something they actually wanted to do.

There are plenty of people who get liberal arts degrees and use them in ways that not only keep them gainfully employed, but personally satisfied with what they are doing and the difference they make. These are not the people who Fark targets with the 'liberal-arts major' stereotype. The ones targeted are those who, frankly, took these majors for no real reason.
 
2009-12-28 10:34:28 AM
tassimau: Yeah, i agree. These 'technical' degrees kind of tie your brain into a knot and make you loose your originality.

Not just originality but creativity too.
 
2009-12-28 10:36:31 AM
WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

I guess we can't all be basement dwelling IT gurus.


My undergrad degree was in English and was pretty damn easy if you ask me. I busted my ass in law school, but in undergrad, not so much. Anyone busting his ass for a liberal arts degree is doing it wrong.
 
2009-12-28 10:37:29 AM
fireclown: "given an eventual shrinkage of fossil fuel supplies, isn't that wise?"

Of course. I'm just pointing out the obvious that seems to be missed by many.

The illustration accompanying the article is, well, illustrative. Here's the caption:

"Arizona State University graduate student Lana Idriss harvests campus-grown foods to be served at campus dining facilities."

IOW, Lana Idriss is learning the skill set of a Medieval peasant. Pull weeds, water crops, spread poop, hope there is enough food for all, repeat.
 
2009-12-28 10:37:59 AM
WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

I guess we can't all be basement dwelling IT gurus.


I think we could do with less attorneys, especially the ones who decide to become politicians. Instead of starting out with a political overhauling of the health care system, why don't we do a practice run on the legal system first?
 
2009-12-28 10:38:34 AM
consciousNOT: WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

I guess we can't all be basement dwelling IT gurus.

Teachers aren't failures.


Those who can't, teach.
 
2009-12-28 10:40:05 AM
Ok, when I went to school, we had people that majored in agriculture. Are they green or not?
 
2009-12-28 10:40:51 AM
Roja Herring: Those who can't teach, teach gym.
 
2009-12-28 10:41:55 AM
cherryl taggart: Ok, when I went to school, we had people that majored in agriculture. Are they green or not?

Depends on if they pocket mulch.
 
2009-12-28 10:42:27 AM
>> WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts.

It always seemed pretty straight forward to me. Liberal arts involve the Humanities which emphasize the connection between all people and the need for compassion. Thats very bad news if you want a mean-spirited conservative population.
 
2009-12-28 10:43:47 AM
fireclown: canyoneer: It's fine, as long as people understand what "green" jobs really are: Contraction management. Every imaginable "green" job or career is really about powering down, lowering expectations, and preparing for a future of scarcity and deprivation. Sustainability is stagnation, conservation is the practice of ever more thinly slicing a static or shrinking supply. These are not growth industries, folks. They are shrinkage industries.

given an eventual shrinkage of fossil fuel supplies, isn't that wise?


Learning how to use resources more efficiently, instead of with the technologies we invented 100 years ago, is a growth industry.
 
2009-12-28 10:45:10 AM
Roja Herring: Those who can't, teach.

Those who can do neither get MBAs.

/MBA student
 
2009-12-28 10:45:56 AM
some attorney: WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts. Attorneys, politicians, and teachers are failures? You might not think they're always likeable, but let's not pretend they haven't busted their asses.

I guess we can't all be basement dwelling IT gurus.

My undergrad degree was in English and was pretty damn easy if you ask me. I busted my ass in law school, but in undergrad, not so much. Anyone busting his ass for a liberal arts degree is doing it wrong.



Well, I worked hard for mine.
 
2009-12-28 10:48:37 AM
Bob16: tassimau: Yeah, i agree. These 'technical' degrees kind of tie your brain into a knot and make you loose your originality.

Not just originality but creativity too.


They are taught poorly as well. Who is really going to understand lifetimes of work of geniuses in 4 - 8 years? The best you can hope for is some 'human tape recorders' to absorb it without much real understanding. Just cripple your mind and the rest of your life and you can be a human tape recorder too.

The egos in those fields are also just insufferable. I remember people saying that a professor was great because most of his students failed out. I laughed and told them I could be the best professor in the world then. How hard is to NOT teach something?
 
2009-12-28 10:48:51 AM
fireclown: Roja Herring: Those who can't, teach.

Those who can do neither get MBAs.


They give those out in boxes of cornflakes.
 
2009-12-28 10:48:52 AM
M.S. in Airline Management...so getting a kick out of the "green" things...while i burn as much Jet-A (Kerosene for all you foreign folks)... oh maybe JP-8 for the military guys....ahhhh the smell of burning dinosaurs makes me all tingly inside
 
2009-12-28 10:48:59 AM
This is a post where I tell you how much better my degree is than your degree, and it is the only degree worth having.

\nuclear engineer
\\also writes folk music
\\\balance is important people
 
2009-12-28 10:49:07 AM
Bob16: >> WFern: I've never understood the Fark hate for liberal arts.

It always seemed pretty straight forward to me. Liberal arts involve the Humanities which emphasize the connection between all people and the need for compassion. Thats very bad news if you want a mean-spirited conservative population.


Yeah. Either that, or many FARKers are engineers and computer programmers who look down on the liberal arts as lacking in technical skill or applicability to real life. Which is what they always talk about in these threads.

But your "Karl Rove is programming you to worship the DEBBIL!!!!1!1" version works too.
 
2009-12-28 10:49:35 AM
Stupid tag must be on a coffee break.
 
2009-12-28 10:50:10 AM
fireclown: Roja Herring: Those who can't, teach.

Those who can do neither get MBAs.

/MBA student


My MBA in Finance was such a joke. The teacher's knew that we all needed a B or better to get tuition reimbursement from our employers. So basically if you showed up you'd get a B. The only hard part is that every class had a group assignment/project, so there was a lot time spent out of class and on weekends.
 
2009-12-28 10:50:18 AM
Well... at least they're in school.
 
2009-12-28 10:50:32 AM
sboyle1020: Finance. Even if you hate it. Probably the most "transferable" degree. Unless you have a burning desire to major in something else, just take Finance.

I had a bunch of friends in school that were finance majors or business majors, with me being an English major.

I'm the only one out of my group who is actually working in a field related to my major, and I'm making more than any of them.

Liking what you do counts for a lot, both in terms of quality of life and in terms of how hard you'll work.
 
2009-12-28 10:50:54 AM
LIBERAL arts!

See that sh*t?

LIBERAL!

Must mean something about learning stuff, liberally. In American America, Liberal eats you.
 
2009-12-28 10:51:11 AM
kagemaru026: theres nothing i hate more than green majors.

they show up in your unit and make a shjtton of changes, hoping one will be substantial enough to get him promoted to Lt Col.


*Ba-dum-psssssh!!!*
/I see what you did there
 
2009-12-28 10:52:04 AM
Swampthing in Korea: You see, the scientists generally research the stuff and the engineers generally design and build it.

Or, more commonly, you have a MechE come up with an idea and who figures out how to actually commercialize it. My buddy invented the Vegawatt, he was just on NPR on Sunday talking about it. It filters and cleanly burns used food oil to provide energy to the restaurant it's connected to.
 
2009-12-28 10:52:18 AM
Bob16: They give those out in boxes of cornflakes.

Executive-edition boxes of cornflakes, yes.
 
2009-12-28 10:53:34 AM
fireclown: Executive-edition boxes of cornflakes, yes.

Shotglass Cornflakes.

Good name for a band with a random violence complex.
 
2009-12-28 10:54:32 AM
cryinoutloud: Learning how to use resources more efficiently, instead of with the technologies we invented 100 years ago, is a growth industry.

Already being done. Using resources more efficiently means cost savings to those that use or develop the resource. And what technology is being used that was invented 100 years ago? Economy of scale and the technology behind it have greatly increased our effeciency in using these natural resources over the past 100 years. Not too many folks packing ore off the moutainside with pack mules anymore.
 
2009-12-28 10:54:49 AM
Jubeebee: sboyle1020: Finance. Even if you hate it. Probably the most "transferable" degree. Unless you have a burning desire to major in something else, just take Finance.

I had a bunch of friends in school that were finance majors or business majors, with me being an English major.

I'm the only one out of my group who is actually working in a field related to my major, and I'm making more than any of them.

Liking what you do counts for a lot, both in terms of quality of life and in terms of how hard you'll work.


So they were business majors but don't work in business?
 
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